Gracias , por tu clases en inglés.

This is like 10+ episodes of Tea With BVP

Thank you!

Very insightful conversation. Thanks!

Incredible interview! This helped me to understand the AIM and it is more clear to me. I love how humble Audrey is and so willing to share her passion with others through passing on the torch of language learning/teaching!

When people think they are learning grammar, they are not really. Firstly they are learning grammar through the L2. *Can you acquire language by studying L2 grammar in L1? If not, then it is not the grammar.* Secondly, the rules that people learn don't come close to explaining the true depth, complexity and structure of the language and grammar alone conveys no meaning whatsover. The grammar people learn is incredibly cursory, and it is likely simply the fact that students are experience correctly formed input. These people would benefit more from reading something meaningful and using a dictionary every now and then. I am a language teacher. I avoid grammar. My students progress as well or better than their peers who get a huge dose of grammar. My students enjoy and are motivated by the classes, the grammar students treat the language as a subject that they might as well just dismiss like a boring subject. I teach in a school setting, not individually motivated students. My students don't ask for English classes.

Perhaps you will find this experiment interesting. Can a young adult in one year learn English to a near native C1 if the starting level was A1 ? Yes, most can do it if the conditions are right. And it's well documented. Here is the complete story. I had spent 7 years learning English the conventional way (grammar, translation), some in school, and some as an individual hobby. And even though I did well in school, realistically, my final level was barely a beginner. (A1-A2, as was confirmed by the lowest TOEFL score possible) This was before the Internet, so my choices for CI were non-existent. At that time, I understood rudimentary English grammar (explicitly) as a set of rules in my native language (Slavic). Then, as a 19 year old I was a part of this experiment. I was placed in a US MILITARY academy with very strict guidelines. Foreign students were only allowed to use English. Native language (Slavic) WAS NOT ALLOWED, it was an absolute 100% immersion environment 24/7. (Kinda similar to Middlebury Language school or French Foreign Legion approach) And even though I was already an adult, I learned a second language to a near native level within a year. I could physically feel the development of a second language. After 3 months, I was thinking in L2 full time, I had near native listening comprehension in 6 months. And obviously I wasn't studying a second language exclusively, I was learning science, engineering, humanities, doing sports. I was having a rich learning experience while acquiring a second language at a rate that seemed magical. There are very important conditions that allow adults to learn on par with immigrant kids. One condition, really. Temporarily abstain from native language and dedicate all the remaining time to a second language. Regarding the deliberate study of GRAMMAR. Nobody was teaching me any of that. Well, I had a tutor for a few sessions, but then a school decided to forgo tutoring because our progress was too fast to keep track of. Yes, our progress, because there were 5 of us. And we all exhibited remarkable rates of improvement. We were separated to different battalions (dorms), and we weren't allowed to communicate. As far as EXPLICIT knowledge of L2 grammar, I FORGOT everything I knew as a beginner. I ACQUIRED grammar the same way native speakers do, and I was reasonably grammatically correct. A grammatically correct sentence SOUNDS right, incorrect sounds funny. I don't know much of the textbook grammar explanations. That being said, studying English (L2) grammar ENTIRELY in English when a student is progressing beyond A1-A2 could be a USEFUL tool, though not entirely necessary. In many countries, children learn Native (L1) Grammar in school. I studied my L1 Grammar and forgot absolutely everything soon after graduation. Studying L1 Grammar never changed the way I spoke L1. It was a totally useless academic endeavor. So, I have a conflicted opinion on this. Studying L2 grammar (or vocabulary) using native language is extremely INEFFICIENT. Conclusion: The goal for any beginner should be to reach a level where they can progress in L2 monolingually, i.e., without using L1 in the process of learning.

Does this self-regulation idea apply to young language learners?

We need to influence political decisions in the US to promote the significance of English worldwide. For starters, all US immigration processes should include English testing. Immigrants with higher English proficiency should have preferential treatment. Many countries do it for their languages, but US immigration is language agnostic. Even Citizenship doesn't require a dedicated English test. For example, in Germany even spouses of German citizens need to pass a fairly difficult language test just to become a permanent resident. Here we have Democrats vs Republicans standoff. Democrats calculated that those immigrants who don't speak English always vote Democrat. But for some reason Republicans before Trump were ignorant of this.

My understanding of this conversation: Define the transformation, clarify the steps to get there, set boundaries about the style of interacting with the client. What’s the spice? Also, love hearing the cat in the background.

Perhaps you will find this experiment interesting. Can a young adult in one year learn English to a near native C1 if the starting level was A1 ? Yes, most can do it if the conditions are right. And it's well documented. Here is the complete story. I had spent 7 years learning English the conventional way (grammar, translation), some in school, and some as an individual hobby. And even though I did well in school, realistically, my final level was barely a beginner. (A1-A2, as was confirmed by the lowest TOEFL score possible) This was before the Internet, so my choices for Comprehensible Input were non-existent. At that time, I understood basic English grammar (explicitly) as a set of rules in my native language (Slavic). Then, as a 19 year old I was a part of this experiment. I was placed in a US MILITARY academy with very strict guidelines. Foreign students were only allowed to use English. Native language (Slavic) WAS NOT ALLOWED, it was an absolute 100% immersion environment 24/7. (Kinda similar to Middlebury Language school or French Foreign Legion approach) And even though I was already an adult, I learned a second language to a near native level within a year. I could physically feel the development of a second language. After 3 months, I was thinking in L2 full time, I had near native listening comprehension in 6 months. And obviously I wasn't studying a second language exclusively, I was learning science, engineering, humanities, doing sports. I was having a rich learning experience while acquiring a second language at a rate that seemed magical. There are very important conditions that allow adults to learn on par with immigrant kids. One condition, really. Temporarily abstain from native language and dedicate all the remaining time to a second language. Regarding the deliberate study of GRAMMAR. Nobody was teaching me any of that. Well, I had a tutor for a few sessions, but then a school decided to forgo tutoring because our progress was too fast to keep track of. Yes, our progress, because there were 5 of us. And we all exhibited remarkable rates of improvement. We were separated to different battalions (dorms), and we weren't allowed to communicate. As far as EXPLICIT knowledge of L2 grammar, I FORGOT everything I knew as a beginner. I ACQUIRED grammar the same way native speakers do, and I was reasonably grammatically correct. A grammatically correct sentence SOUNDS right, incorrect sounds funny. I don't know much of the textbook grammar explanations. That being said, studying English (L2) grammar ENTIRELY in English when a student is progressing beyond A1-A2 could be a USEFUL tool, though not entirely necessary. In many countries, children learn Native (L1) Grammar in school. I studied my L1 Grammar and forgot absolutely everything soon after graduation. Studying L1 Grammar never changed the way I spoke L1. It was a totally useless academic endeavor. So, I have a conflicted opinion on this. Studying L2 grammar (or vocabulary) using native language is extremely INEFFICIENT. Conclusion: The goal for any beginner should be to reach a level where they can progress in L2 monolingually, i.e., without using L1 in the process of learning.

We need to be aware of the 2 distinctly DIFFERENT ways for EXPLICIT learning of L2 Grammar. You can explicitly learn L2 Grammar through explanations in L1. That's mostly a waste of time, it has almost NO carry over to Implicit L2 knowledge. On the other hand Explicitly learning L2 Grammar using ONLY L2 (monolingually) has substantially more carry over to Implicit knowledge.

"you don't need to teach everybody". Appreciated this talk, especially the LIB comparison hahah

Can't understand all of these approaches :😮😢

I was listening but now have found here and can watch all of you 😊

Clear solution + roadmap + accountability = success!

Such a lovely success story, nice.

Making things "fast" will keep a pet's attention. Making things "relevant" will keep an adult's attention. Making me quickly write an email to a vet about my fake elephant will ....

Thank you so much for this eye opener

Great goals!

I respectfully disagree. The reason second language learners have some difficulty when they finally get to use their language skills in the real world is because they don't learn it in a communicative context. In my classroom, everyday I start the class with a conversation about my students lives, what did you do last night at the weekend what is your favourite free time activity where are you going at the weekend where will you spend the summer what is your favourite shop etc. And at every opportunity I ask students to share their knowledge, experience and opinions. I am an oddity in this respect in the school where I work because I don't trust the exercises and my colleagues do little else but work with the course books.

Your webinars are so underrated. I'm learning so much from them. Thank you for sharing.

Absolutely.

Hey, where is the video with Paul Nation? Can't find it on this channel

Excelente contenido, como siempre. Gracias por este espacio, es invaluable.

Lots of great takeaways. Thank you guys for the insightful interview with Sheila.

does the explicit and implicate way of learning apply to technically complex sports, knowing the techniques then knowing when to apply it?

I stumbled upon this episode and i enjoyed every minute of it 😊

Nice content ! You say 25 USD, but by scanning your QR code, the price on the website is 149 USD.

Anybody who tries it and tests it themselves will see how effective comprehensible input is particularly as compared to formal study

I didn't choose English teaching to become rich, but I will.

I've been explaining that I'm much more of a facilitator for years. Who doesn't like being vindicated? I often compare the process to training for a race. Imagine you're going to swim 100M Free. Does it make sense to always train to 100M during the practice sprints? No. You need to do 150M and 200M sprints *at least* so that you can build the endurance to maintain, as much as possible, peak racing speed during that 100M. You're going to go to conferences, meet people, talk about your background, education, career, insights, opinions, etc. Well then, just talk about exactly those things! When learners get it and say something like, "Yeah, I went to this event and I felt really comfortable talking to people, I even asked questions, etc. so now I get that this practice is really helping me." I always interfect with, "What practice? You're not practicing. This is life." It's not rocket science, but it's a hard sell because the educational system has primed people differently. I act as a conduit of experience, wisdom, and ideas between relatively high-level professionals so that they're not wasting time acquiring English through something like rote memorization, but it sounds "woo-woo" or vaguely esoteric.

Could you please explain the differences between accent, pronunciation and intelligibility?

As a language teacher, BVP is my go to for how I should be setting myself up. I am on my third book of his. His explanations of how acquistion functions are in line with my expectations and experiences in the field. Unfortunately in a school setting teaching English in a Spanish speaking country I am 1 teacher in about 30 and I am the only teacher to question existing methodology, to bring a scientific approach to the profession and I am not understood by my bosses nor my colleagues who think grammar and the cloze and exam practice is king. I treat the job as a conversation between myself and my students giving them opportunities to meaningfully exercise the language they need to acquire based on their current competence levels.

Dear Bill, within World Language Education at CUNY Queens, you're our hero. I think that you and what you are doing is enough ❤ you are helping generations of learners

While listening to you guys i started wondering what would be a good parallel analogy... How about baby minding and child tuition... Sure you can trust a branded service, with young, unexperienced minders - and your kids are safe but not particularly "growing". But it's a safe bet. Or, you can hand pick a tutor who is gonna offer your child a fantastically valuable experience. Let's focus on who wants the best for their English and future opportunities. Not who just wants to go through the motions for English-Language guilt.....😂

She gave it to John and I," is incorrect because "I" is a subject pronoun, and in this sentence, it is used as an object. In English grammar, the pronoun "I" is used when it is the subject of a verb (e.g., "I went to the store"), while "me" is used when it is the object of a verb or preposition (e.g., "She gave it to me"). The truth is, language is complex and evolving. While "John and I went" is considered standard in formal English, "John and me went" is common in casual speech and some dialects. Prescriptive grammar rules, like those from Robert Lowth, who thought pronouns should follow Latin rules, often don't reflect how people actually speak. Many linguists argue that "John and me went" is perfectly valid in informal contexts. Many people were corrected as children to say "John and I" instead of "John and me" when used as a subject. This has led to overcorrecting and using "I" even when "me" is correct as an object. The pronoun I is often perceived as more formal or proper than "me," leading people to use it incorrectly in an attempt to sound more sophisticated. While prescriptive grammarians like Robert Lowth have influenced English grammar rules, actual language use is shaped by how people speak and write in real life. Both "John and I" and "John and me" reflect this ongoing interaction between prescriptive rules and natural language evolution. In fact, many of the grammatical constructions Lowth criticized were not widely considered incorrect before his influential work popularized these prescriptive rules.

This woman dates men for their pension. Trash.

I have a pension, you don't have to die alone.

When a student appears to learn from grammar it is an illusion. They are acquiring by reading the grammar explanation in the target language or by hearing it in the target language. If they studied the second language grammar in their own language they would acquire no language. The truth is that any mistakes or errors that creep into a language acquirers' skill base are usually as a result of poor pedagogical methods. If student is presented with a mistake in a sentence or an inapproriate choice and they choose the wrong one, they learn at best nothing, at worst, the wrong answer.

I always tell me learners: I am not your teacher, I am the most advanced learner that can help you interact with.

I've been teaching languages without a textbook for 25 years, and I don't intend to use one ever.

love

Rest in peace.

Thank you all so much for this. It was a really great reminder of my roots in language teaching, which drew heavily on Krashen's theories. Looking forward to getting back to those roots and creating more effective ways to provide meaningful input. The input I received from Bill VanPatten has set me on a course to the revamp I've been needing.

I’m not even halfway to the end, and yet I had to stop to leave a comment: What a rich, elucidating talk. Thank you so much for offering such a quality show for free.🙌🏻🌹👌

🎉🎉

I agree with this, and I would like to add that there is a missing step at the end of identifying needs and current gaps. It is that you are the bridge to that solution, Us teachers love our analogies, like IKEA furniture!, but imagine if you discover with your student that they need a certain size, length and shape of screwdriver - the risk is that you have equipped the student with a specified problem and even solution, but they can now take your discovery to "inform" a cheaper teacher what they what they want them to do. They know the exact screwdriver to look for on Amazon etc Luckily teachers are not commodities like a screwdriver! But we even do this ALL the time with skilled professionals. We call expensive builders, plumbers, mechanics and then take their solution/approach to tell a cheaper workmen to work to our spec. Which is a good analogy, what can the skilled tradesman say to convince you that going cheaper is a false economy. What can you say to show students that the solution is only half the discussion, that a cheap solution is a false economy even when the plan is the same? I think maybe it is about how you truly understand their problem and that their problem is going to evolve and if the less specialised cheaper teacher can't roll with the evolution (they are only following orders after all!) the result is eventual dissatisfaction and the original problem remains. This makes me think we are selling a path not a plan.

It’s less about the niche but more about learning yourself

Hi Michael I'm proving exceptionally thick here I guess. But I spent a lot of time this morning on trying to find something that wasn't happening. And I watched Building a Pronunciation Course, which was good. Thank you. Ok. So you talked about the podcast as something you guys are doing, eg with Gemma and Robin, but it's not public till later. Is that right? So it gets put up later and I can listen to it. Up till now I haven't been a great podcast listener - there's already so much to do! 😀 - but there's some great stuff to listen to so I'll just have to upskill on that. Ok. That's all clear now. Thank you. But .... what did you mean when you said If you would like to join the pronunciation discussion, ? That link just goes to calendar, doesn't it. Thanks for your patience. Grateful for the help. Best regards Sue