Hi! Good to hear from you. I too used to fly my F-16 on a 2200mah then on a 2600mah. Now I am flying with a 3200mah 475g 50C Spektrum lipo but I have to say they are not good, voltage sags so much. Glad to hear you are having fun with your F-16, its my favourite EDF so far. I too need more practice with landings, I keep slamming the nose gear down too hard. Have fun! Best regards!

Hi, just the stock 4mm bullets. On some other edfs I use MP Jet 3.5mm which are superior.

Yes of course it is possible. A battery doesn't care how many consumers (motors in this case) it is powering. All you have to do is match the battery max discharge rate with the max load. In this case the max load of one fan at 6s (22.2V nominal) is 108A, so 3 fans would have a peak draw of 324A. Now you need to pick the right battery. Usually the lightest/smallest battery that can handle such a high current would be a high discharge lipo (lithium polymer) battery. LiPO4 or lithium ion would have to be much bigger and heavier to cope with such high currents. The best Lipo batteries can usually cope with a 30C (30 times capacity) discharge rate without getting damaged. So to work out capacity needed to sustain 324A at 30C, divide 324/30 = 10.8Ah. So you would need a 10.8Ah capacity 6s (6 in series) lipo battery. To find out the best battery brands which actually deliver the promised discharge rate, check out MCSGUY battery testing thread on rcgroup. I have myself tested one battery from his thread, the Admiral 5Ah (or 5000mah) 6s 50C lipo. I can confirm it is capable of 30C discharge without sagging too much therefore maintaining good thrust of the fans. So in this case, because they don't make an Admiral 10Ah 50C battery, in this case you would be best to buy two Admiral 5000mah 50C 6s batteries and wire them in parallel. Another excellent brand according to the MCSGUY is SMC racing. Their batteries may be even more powerful and have even less voltage sag than Admiral. Again you may have to buy two 6s batteries of around 5000mah and wire them in parallel to obtain a 10Ah capacity needed to run three 80mm 6 fans like the ones above. The 90mm fans draw a bit more current so if you want to use 90mm instead you may be better off getting two 6000mah 6s batteries. Although I think the 5000mah Admiral would survive as the discharge rate of three 90mm fans would only be at around 35C.

your response exceeded my expectations!! thank you so much for taking the time to help me! @@r00kiepilot

The video is for a 90mm 6s. For a 70mm 6s edf usually peak ampere is 70A to 80A. Depends on manufacturer. Latest FMS 70mm Pro fan requires around 85A peak.

Hello! Which airframe is it? Definitely measure A/V/W with fresh battery so you have data about what’s going on. I suspect its the battery V sagging. Also make sure you calibrate max throttle on your esc I have been caught out by this before. FMS 12 blade fans have quite high losses when installed, could be as much as 25% depending on airframe so it could be that. Might be worth testing the fan outside the airframe. I wouldn’t change timing to high, my unit was pulling over 80A on low timing. A 80A esc would help in terms of reliability but I doubt it will give more thrust. Good luck I hope you find out what’s limiting the thrust.

Hi @@r00kiepilot ! Thanks for your fast answer. My jet is the original FMS Avanti V1 (red). I´ll check the throttle calibration. I also thought about that but forgot to mention it. The lipo pack is an Ovonic 3300 70C that is new. I´ll need to check with the powermeter, but I think it hast enough current. I can try also a 6000 100C from Ovonic with just a couple of weeks but on the flat, because it doesn´t fit in the fuse. Or maybe a new Ovonic 5200 100C thats fits OK.... I´ll let you know if something goes better or not. The positive side of changing the ESC to some of the ones I have would be also the thrust reverse option in case I go to fly on a paved street. But I don´t think I´ll do that... Have a nice evening!

Hi @@r00kiepilot again! :) Now I come trough RCGroups... :P I have now a second hand Freewing F-16 as yours (?) with the 3048 2300KV 6S edf. I was thinking to order an XFly 2000KV that may have a bit more punch than the FMS or the newer Freewing 2210KV that fits 1:1 in the fuse without changing anything. But now I´m thinking if putting the XFly may have more punch but needs adaption. It seems to have the same geometry as the FMS...

I have forgotten the timing you said@@r00kiepilot ! I´ll need to test that when I rebuild my crashed Avanti :S... So it has less amps on higher timing? I though that would be the other way round. But it may depend on the motor? Cool, maybe that could give me a bit more thrust. I tried to measure current with my powermeter (XT60 connectors) but with adaptors it didn´t work, just on the smaller 64mm 6S fan. Thank you!!

But maybe better with a Wemotec fan or similar...

I haven't, too many fans lol. I have 2 FMS 80's and 2 XRP 80's. I think they are similar efficiency to the Freewing. This is a 70mm bird though. Might be a bit too restricted for 80mm fans, although people on rcgroups have tried it.

It looks like these Wemotec fans have lower installed loss in restricted ducts, compared to Chinese fans.

Yes not too bad. Around 24% installed loss. The best I have seen is 15% loss in FW 90mm F-22 and 70mm F-16

OK @@r00kiepilot nice to know! That isn´t so much. A friend has that F-16 too but I think the older one. The newer v3 seems to have a much powerfull motor/edf, or am I wrong? Cheers from Bavaria! PS: where are you from?

Thanks, the landing was a bit rough I stalled a bit high. But definitely high alpha landings are the way to go to preserve the gear on grass. Before I learned how to do that I bent a few gears too. Grass is harsh on these tiny wheels and gears.

@@r00kiepilot oh yeah, I can imagine... but it requires a looot of skills :P

So indeed, mine is the newer as you supposed :D with the metallic spinner

Thanks for subscribing! Here is a more recent test of the newest FMS 70mm Pro version. 2.6kg thrust kzbin.info/www/bejne/mpq2dYF4fZeCb5o

OK @@r00kiepilot ! Super nice :D :) Thanks for your comment and fast answer :)

I prefer the FMS, the Xrp gives a little more thrust at higher amps. The Xrp motor is actually lower KV than the FMS despite Xrp claiming 2200kV (I tested both swapping their rotors over). A better upgrade might be to put the Xrp rotor on the FMS motor for even higher thrust.

12 blades

Kg

Hi, I wouldn’t get the stock Powerfun fan and motor. The motors are not very good. Only the powerfun rotor is good because it is more efficient than FMS and Freewing 70mm 12 blade rotors. It is good for this application, going to 8s with the Freewing/Eflite 70mm fan motor because it reduces the load a lot compared to the FMS 12 blade rotor. Get the SMC Racing HV 3600mah battery if they deliver to your area. Good price and absolutely the best performer. 2nd to that Dinogy Graphene lipos if you can find them. HK graphenes used to be excellent, not sure if they still are.

@@r00kiepilot I mean that I will make own plane which edf is the best around 70 dollars and which battery should I get with it, thx

@@r00kiepilot if you don't that is ok 😁

@@r00kiepilot also would U suggest flysky F.S-i6X 2.4GHz 10CH AFHDS 2A RC Transmitter with F.S-iA10b

This is on 6s

peak current is 44A, rating is 4s. I fly on a tiny 1300mah 65C battery, but to be on the safe side you may want to use a 2200mah 4s lipo

Just the stock Freewing 40A 4s esc which came with the plane (Freewing F-22 64mm)

Peak amp draw only 71A. 2.9kg thrust for the same amp draw as a 70mm fan.

@@r00kiepilot 👍Sounds sweet too!

Hi again, what is the motor KV?

ductedfan 80 mm xfly

120 amp speed controller and 5200 mAh 70C battery

please guide me🙏🏻

Hi, you bought the Xfly 80mm fan? First step, read the user manual for your ESC and go through the full throttle calibration procedure. If you still only get 2400g thrust, step 2 get an amp meter and volt meter and measure peak amps and volts when you first hit full throttle. If your amps and volts are close to mine in the video, step 3 measure thrust on different scales your scales could be inaccurate. However if your amps are lower, lets say under 100A, and your peak volts are under 22.8V then your battery is probably too weak.

I never tried it. The older motor 1850kV could handle 8s, have a look at Eflite video here m.kzbin.info/www/bejne/i4CwfZJ3esiSmK8

@@r00kiepilot I knew about the older 18650KV. I'm tempted to use this 1900KV on Freewing SU35 with 7S set up. But worried motor might not handle 7S

WOw! @@r00kiepilot I have the Avanti v1 with that old motor 1850 kv.... I´l watch that video xD

Apologies I have to re-do this test. The ESC was not calibrated to full throttle properly. Thrust at all timings should be a lot higher.

Hi, yes this is the 3280 2100kv motor. I think I need to re-do this test, at some point this esc went out of calibration and wasn't going full throttle.

Apologies, in this test ai didn’t calibrate the ESC properly, the max thrust of the stock fan is much higher at 4.25kg, please see my latest test. But I agree with you this F-22 has lower than 1:1 T/W ratio. Its a very heavy model. I haven’t flown mine yet, I am waiting for batteries. I am going to use the new SMC 4400mah 6s HV which should weigh only 605g and get the weight down a bit. Also should have a bit more punch.

@@r00kiepilot 4400 would be reduced flight time too right

Hi, yes its the 3060 1900kV FMS Predator motor. But make sure you get the latest version its the one with the metallic nose cone. I got the first FMS Pro version with the 3060 1900kV motor and that one is a bit weaker than the latest motor. Theres probably not many of the old ones floating around anyway, you can recognise them by the black plastic spinner on the fan.

@@r00kiepilot on the video is the new one with the metal spinner?

Thanks for your comment. Its a lot weaker, but that was what I was hoping for, I wanted a lower power setup so I can use 4000mah batteries. The stock Freewing 1900kv 9b inrunner did 4.25kg thrust at I think it was 125A

Thanks! I need to re-do this test I didn't calibrate my esc to full throttle duh! :) I think it will produce a lot more thrust. The heat was ok, it got warm but not too bad. My IR meter broke I need to by a new one so I can measure motor temperature.

@@r00kiepilot 6s or 12s?

Thanks! I hope to test it in the F-18 soon. Just need to cycle my Admiral 5000mah battery

Thanks! all the best to you too! Have fun out there

It will run on a 4s battery of course, but the thrust would be much lower. Which model are you putting it in? On 4s it will only consume around 480W and around 900g installed thrust. The model would have to be very light around 1kg all up weight for it to be fun on 4s

@@r00kiepilot it will hopefully go in the jetworks f 18

@@johnwalsh1879 You will be very disappointed on 4s. FMS 70mm 1900kV fan is really meant for 6s. If you want to go 4s get the FMS 64mm 3150kv fan on 4s. 1250g thrust only 45A, only 135g.

@@r00kiepilot I'm actually swapping it fo a 70mm 4s FMS not going through all the hassle of buying a new ESC / 6s battery and charger

This is my own custom extra light setup (HET 2W30 with PowerFun rotor, CS10 V3 fan housing). But I am sure the stock 6s inrunner (high performance) is just as good. Don’t get the outrunner, it is so lackluster literally 600g thrust less at same amps as inrunner. I put a Eflite Thunderbirds AR636 with AS3X in mine makes it more stable. You can just buy any AR636 and the usb cable and download the SRM file for the Thunderbirds onto it, then you will have identical programming to the Eflite Thunderbird F-16.

@@r00kiepilot I have a couple of questions regarding the 64mm F22. I got mine today and I don't like the fact that the ailerons are combined to one lead to the receiver. Are you flying your F22 completely without flaperons? I hope they used a Y-Splitter in the fuselage somewhere and did not sother the servo leads together. Anyways my second question is, do you know whether the aileron servos are glued into the main wings? I need to get one out to adjust the servohorn bc. one side does not center at the same time as the other side. If there were 2 separate leads I could simply resenter each servo individually... Tomorror I will try to open the fuselage bc. I really want seperate aileron leads.

@@xXRapToRiXxGamer Servos are glued into the wing on the F-22 and the F-16. You can use a screwdriver from the side and dent the foam a bit to undo the screw to remove the horn. They glued it with some really strong silicone glue impossible to remove without damaging the wing. Unless you can find come kind of L-shaped razor to reach under the servo. All the glue is under the servo. You can easily split the ailerons and elevators on the 64mm F-22, they are both wired into the same plug, just cut one set of wires and crimp or solder a new plug. I did this, have each servo split out to do flapperons and tailerons.

I really like practicing high alpha. It helps a lot for landings too. If you haven’t got one already try the 70mm F-16 next, either Freewing of FMS/Eflite (Thunderbirds). I would say they fly even better than the little F-22 and they are definitely more stable in high alpha. I even managed to get my F-16 to tail-sit for a second and do a almost vertical 180 turn (by accident, no skill lol)

This is the 'old' version. There is a new version, look out for the metallic spinner and the FMS logo on the fan housing. According to FMS that newest one produces 2.7kg on the bench. Someone on rcg tested it, it pulls around 85A. So if your batteries can take it, that would be a good fan to go for it seems. I went the other way on my F-16, lost lots of weight, removed blue box etc. HET 2W30 (130g), CS10 shroud, PowerFun rotor (low load), puts out 2.2kg trust same as the old FMS fan above but only weighs 190g vs 240g. Before repairs etc it weighed around 1.8kg with 1.9kg installed thrust, with a 3300mah 6s battery.

​@@r00kiepilotI'm confused now. The title says V2 but you said it is an old one. Does it mean the new one is V3???

What is the exhaust diameter on the Sirius? I used a thrust cone reducing to 72mm diameter for the F-16 which is around 100% FSA. Also I cheated a bit. I moved the Xfly motor and rotor into a FMS 80mm shroud. Xfly motor is only 32mm diameter but the made the shroud for 36mm motors, strange. But the rotor hub is 34mm. FMS shroud is for 32mm motors so has higher FSA so probably a bit higher thrust. These high blade count fans usually don’t like much less than 100% fsa exhaust area to max out their static thrust. However if more dynamic thrust is needed for max top speed then its ok to lose a bit of static thrust as long as efflux is higher in flight.

@@r00kiepilot the Sirius diameter Exhaust is 75mm. The BAE hawk 2100kv / 2.9kg of thrust has a 72mm exhaust and L39 2100kv / 3kg thrust has a 66mm exhaust. Both the intakes and cheater intakes on the hawk and L39 are much bigger than the Sirius. Would you say the length of the exhaust has anything to do with it? End of stator to exit of exhaust for Sirius 27cm whilst the L39 is 24cm.

The Viper must have very good ducting, it is a sport jet after all. Most of the scale jets I tried so far have installed thrust around 0.85 of fan-only thrust. This is the best figure I found, some have even less as low as 0.6

@@r00kiepilot I noted down your FMS 2100 motor 3.5kg thrust and put it against my installed thrust on my BAE Hawk and also have it installed in the L39. Was 2.9kg and 3kg respectively. For 1.82kg and 2.24kg jets these things are awesome with that motor in.