"also the uhh ...guess bit of a skill difference."
@snugglebunny184014 күн бұрын
Not really fair to criticize the winner of the match, but two points I noticed on Eric's part - 1) A fair amount of unnecessary charging your Irregs in the marshes with missile capable troops 2) That horde of rabble was completely wasted! Of course they're terrible at actually fighting and should overall be held in reserve, but they can zoc from open into marsh, flank threat, fend off lights, or at least be close enough to *look like* they could do those things. It was a huge quantity of points to leave off the board.
@Rosedelio14 күн бұрын
Yeah, charging with the archers did help the irregs survive a little longer. If they had managed to survive the various CTs, the envelopment by the irregs might have been enough to win since the mobs weren't there to guard the flanks.
@rp583615 күн бұрын
Just started watching your content and was wondering if you take challenges via KZbin? I have 1000 plus hours invested in each FoG 2 ancients and medieval :)
@Rosedelio15 күн бұрын
Sure, set up a mirror match in the multiplayer lobby and I'll see about joining
@snugglebunny184029 күн бұрын
Am indeed curious about the mirror. Here, the mass of orcs was definitely a terrible choice, as were the massed archers. That said, the elven units are balanced as part of an exclusively elven army, where their expense ensures a very small army. As allies, the individual elven units are probably somewhat undercosted, but there was no way to reconcile the two when putting the mod together.
@l.s.909529 күн бұрын
The Massed Archers were meant to help counter a Ithilien Ranger horde or as support for assaulting the forest...but yeah, they were mostly bad in this fight :D Though maybe it could be worth to bring some of them together with the Haradrim Archers as ranged attacks can at least hurt the Elven Elites (in contrast to most other Mordorite units). Bringing so many Regular Orcs on the other hand...I have no defence for this, it was a just terrible choice indeed. Roleplay and bad decision making got the better of me when picking my army :D
@Rosedelio29 күн бұрын
I guess the other option would be to remove the option to have elves/dwarves as allies and vice versa, but that'd be very limiting. Kinda reminds me of my recent TDC army, where the Swiss are better as allied units than a main army
@l.s.909529 күн бұрын
@@Rosedelio I think it's not so much a "having Elves as allies"-problem and more a "larger battle sizes make Elites more worthwhile to get"-situation. Spam-reliant army list imo just get less and less effective the larger the battle becomes.
@Rosedelio28 күн бұрын
@@l.s.9095 Maybe, though I think the narrowness from the forest and mountains helped too, since it made the battlefield smaller
@l.s.909528 күн бұрын
@@Rosedelio Certainly yes.
@l.s.909529 күн бұрын
Yeah, Mordor-player here, this battle certainly wasn't my brightest moment :D I think I pretty much lost it from the start with my troop selection and deployment. To break it down it a bit before I watch the video (maybe I will spot more stuff afterwards): 1. My assumption was that Gondor would stay back in the forest, giving me time to develop an attack and choose the engagement...since this never happened...bad things followed. It was really unclever to think that this would play out like this. 2. Shouldn't have gone for the Mumakils or this many Orcs. They're to ineffective in this matchup. More lights and mid-tier units would be the right call imo. Also the Nazgul and maybe some cav. 3. Should have given more thought on how to counter the Elves. I approached this like a smaller battle where taking the Elves would certainly mean, I could get some flanks in (because of lacking support units), but in a battle this large, this issue was not as pronounced. I was really not expecting to see the Noldor appear and had no answer for that! 4. Should have deployed in a wider formation. (Like Rosedelio did in the mirror.) 5. I originally deployed the Mumakils and their support against the pass since I thought it would be so heavily defended that any attack was futile anyway. The idea was to swing most of them around to the main battle, while the more expensive Gondor troops would need to stay in the pass...now once I saw the Militia Spears I figured that these might be some easy points to grab and send to Mumakils after them. It kind of worked but with the rest of the battle went so badly that I doubt it was worth it. 6. Losing two generals on the Haradrim Guard and Mumakils was also a pretty big micro mistake. They did basically nothing to change this particular combat and were badly needed in other places. Anyhow, that’s all for now. May add more points later. The game was still very fun, thanks to Rosedelio! And well played of cause!
@Rosedelio29 күн бұрын
One Mumakil would have been useful since it was still cheaper than the Noldor knights. I was a little worried when I saw how much those spears were costing me in rout percent, but the Elves did their job very well.
@l.s.909529 күн бұрын
@@Rosedelio Yeah, maybe it would have helped but I kind of doubt I would have gotten it to right place at the right time without some Elven Archers unit obliterating it beforehand.
@Rosedelio28 күн бұрын
@@l.s.9095 That's fair. Besides the knights, they're only good against the archers, but that also means putting them in line of fire.
@JuliusGeezer447Ай бұрын
Thanks for the fun games Rosie and ggwp. Not sure about the evil Dwarves though!
@JuliusGeezer447Ай бұрын
I have asked a bit too much from my poor orcs!
@RosedelioАй бұрын
Yep, they just couldn't hold on long enough
@imeantherearethedarktownsy5210Ай бұрын
first view I'm a real rosedeliohead
@thomaslynch165Ай бұрын
Super close match
@georgekilgore9294Ай бұрын
Hey dude! Been watching your Germany games for a while now. I love how you always use War Wagons, but I have no reason why because I'm a noob. What do you like about them?
@RosedelioАй бұрын
War Wagons have moving obstacles with them, which make them the perfect counter to cav, especially knights and horse archers. As long as they stay steady at least. Even if they do get disrupted, they'll be immune to flank charges. Gunpowder also causes a cohesion check malus at 1-2 tiles shooting Only 50% melee and range though, which doesn't make them that great at fighting melee infantry or shooting ranged infantry. Their shooting is effectively useless at long range. They're also slow at 9 AP instead of 10. Overall, they've got their uses against cav focused armies to help protect the crossbows on the advance.
@antalbencsik4345Ай бұрын
*Smashes the whole enemy left wing in one turn and just says stoically.* - Yea, guess it helps. :D
@RosedelioАй бұрын
A battle isn't won until the game says so! :P
@vanengelgom2 ай бұрын
A very close battle 😊
@snugglebunny18402 ай бұрын
Great game. I was curious to see this match, as most of your opponents this season were players who are clearly good, but not at your level. Nosy's been the king for going on 7 years now...
@Rosedelio2 ай бұрын
Yep, Nosy is definitely very skilled. I was hoping to make this a closer match, but the early mistake with my deployment cost me.
@l.s.90952 ай бұрын
Nicely done! Though - tbh - I would have expected an even clearer victory from the Germans in this matchup. Do you think the Swiss Keil was worth it in the end?
@Rosedelio2 ай бұрын
@@l.s.9095 I think if I manoeuvred the Swiss better to protect the crossbows, it wouldn't have gotten so close. Getting two pikes instead of the keil might have been better as well
@l.s.90952 ай бұрын
@@Rosedelio I think the def. Spears did a well enough job and if the Swiss would have taken their place, his shooting would a have been a lot more painful (in terms of value damage inflicted). Keeping them second line/ on the flank was probably the right choice in my opinion. Pikes - I would assume - have a decent chance of disrupting on impact (at least if they stay without general) vs. his impact foot. Instead I wondered if more MaA might have been even more effective.
@Rosedelio2 ай бұрын
@@l.s.9095 I didn't want to get the raw spears because of the almughavar impact, but armored spears and Halberdiers would have been useful. I still wanted at least some better infantry since I wasn't sure how the shoot-out would go and wanted something that could charge into melee (Halberdiers could have fulfilled that role, thinking about it) I didn't want to get the (prefer to fight on foot) MaA cause of points inefficiency along with the marsh/ bits of rough ground and horse archery.
@snugglebunny18402 ай бұрын
Tough matchup for the Catalans given the terrain; their army is squishy and pew pew, and it just couldn't make much of an impression on your mass of heavies, your losses largely coming from the fringes of your army. I think harvey did well overall, but the failure to autodrop your isolated MAA was baffling, that undoubtedly cost him those two cav units for quite a few turns. I don't think that would have changed the ultimate result, but it would have been closer.
@Rosedelio2 ай бұрын
@@snugglebunny1840 Yep, he took advantage of the marsh and bits of rough ground, but I had enough to shoot back. Got worryingly close once the almughavars got in. And yeah, the cav getting drawn away from the main battle helped me here
@snugglebunny18402 ай бұрын
FYI title's off on this one, should be Catalan not French
@Rosedelio2 ай бұрын
Thanks, it's fixed now
@snugglebunny18403 ай бұрын
bah, fucking time limit strikes again, I think you woulda had it in one turn.
@thomaslynch1653 ай бұрын
Haven't the Hebrew people dealt with enough....
@Rosedelio3 ай бұрын
@@thomaslynch165 Time to see what they did to the Egyptians in the mirror
@imeantherearethedarktownsy52103 ай бұрын
nice battle!
@peaceplayinsumgames4 ай бұрын
ASMR'ing me to sleep
@Rosedelio4 ай бұрын
Lo-fi orc battles to relax to
@snugglebunny18404 ай бұрын
Definitely tough for the unavoidably awful hillmen list, but a few things could have narrowed the margin. Len should have used the skirms more like javelinmen to use ammo to greatest effect, and they could have worked with the axes on the flanks to keep your wargs and skirms off, to force a more head on confrontation; shooting should have been saved for your mounted and lights, and axes are fine against most things, but not impact foot in the open; in this match they should have been saved for flank or forest work, or the points spent on more impact foot.
@Icewox4 ай бұрын
Nice battle! Surprising that your knights managed to punch a hole through the enemy mid; that seemed to decide the outcome.
@Rosedelio4 ай бұрын
Thanks! Yep, it was fortunate that the longbows quickly collapsed to the knights before they could get counter charged.
@snugglebunny18404 ай бұрын
Thanks for the balance feedback! I think Gondor/Arnor should be in a better place in 1.3
@thomaslynch1654 ай бұрын
A very tight battle
@Rosedelio4 ай бұрын
Yep, a very narrow mountain pass. It required good micro more than macro
@thomaslynch1654 ай бұрын
I cannot be associated with you anymore
@Rosedelio4 ай бұрын
Je suis désolé
@thomaslynch1654 ай бұрын
I am just so glad you aren't playing the french
@Rosedelio4 ай бұрын
That side of the mirror posts in a few hours
@rokema27824 ай бұрын
nice vids
@snugglebunny18404 ай бұрын
Micro yes, but also macro. I shudder to see the number of points futiley chasing after your crappy armored cavalry to your left, massive profit for you.
@Rosedelio4 ай бұрын
Yeah, eventually the spears got back into the main battle, but by then it was too late
@AdminFromHell4 ай бұрын
Oh, that was you... Ouch :D
@thomaslynch1654 ай бұрын
Randy he was just a noobie :, (
@thomaslynch1654 ай бұрын
How do they get the maps for these tournaments? Are they approved by the people running the tournaments?
@Rosedelio4 ай бұрын
For community tournaments, it's just whatever random map the game gives. Most tournaments allow players to reroll a map if it doesn't seem suitable for battle. Official tournaments generate a map for everyone involved and can't be rerolled. I'm not sure if the maps are approved of beforehand.
@menedian4 ай бұрын
Great example of a passive player allowing themselves to be defeated in detail!
@snugglebunny18405 ай бұрын
Thanks for these, very helpful. This matchup appears to be overall balanced, or at least close enough.
@thomaslynch1655 ай бұрын
At the 12:00 minute mark could you explain why you positioned the Dunleading Skirmishers to the right side.
@Rosedelio5 ай бұрын
I wanted to try to get the Uruk Guards and Trolls to start charging the lights towards the hill, or at least harass them as they maneuvered away.
@thomaslynch1655 ай бұрын
Only real fans are here
@snugglebunny18405 ай бұрын
omfg that opening general death on your elephant, clearly you have angered the fog gods
@Rosedelio5 ай бұрын
That alone wouldn't have been so bad, but the fact that the cohesion tests disrupted both of my elephants, my only good units, ruined any chance I had at winning the battle. The gods were truly unhappy that day.
@snugglebunny18405 ай бұрын
@@Rosedelio Yeah, I guess the only lesson to apply would be to maybe try to use subgens for that shit, so you don't get the massive wide CT, but it was still pretty unfortunate, I thought your plan was looking solid until then.
@thomaslynch1655 ай бұрын
Excited to see you using this cavalry
@Rayan-mz2co5 ай бұрын
Rare sight of you losing😮 Well, gotta take more lights next time
@Rosedelio5 ай бұрын
Yeah, more lights and focusing on the rough ground would have been the better approach.
@MrChelomo5 ай бұрын
Hi! I've been watching some of your battles. I learned a lot about the game and like your calm voice, and you're a very consistent narrator. I would ask for one improvement, when a battle is part of a tournament, would it be possible to include that in the video title along with what stage it is? It would help to watch videos and progress through the tournament at a glance. Thanks for considering it and keep on rocking!
@Rosedelio5 ай бұрын
Thanks! Yeah, I can make a note of which games are tournament games in the title.
@jorgepedro84315 ай бұрын
After taking numerous lessons (as depicted in our other videos), finally I managed to win once with competent vs competent armies.
@cmur0785 ай бұрын
This is how I was expecting my Ptolemaic match to go, but my opponent pulled it back fairly well, so I actually ended up scoring better as the Meroitic side. My final ranking though is about as good as you, while I'm a pretty average player, so my next match should be fun... I see you didn't bother with artillery? We both did, but I'm not sure how much it's needed. Worked out pretty well for me, made both his elephants pretty useless, he managed to frag one of mine for a couple of turns, but it still got into contact before teh end of the match anyway. I suppose pikes and stuff can cope with elephants pretty well already.
@Rosedelio5 ай бұрын
Next round will be interesting given how of an advantage the Romans have in the match-up. I wanted to advance and didn't want to be slowed down by the artillery, so I didn't get it. Yeah, elephants are scary on impact for raw pikes and mediums, but if they survive, they can win the melee pretty well.
@wikeradd3805 ай бұрын
I have just recently discovered you and i have to say, your videos are really enjoyable to watch. Keep up the good work !
@snugglebunny18405 ай бұрын
man first round always feels so bad
@Rosedelio5 ай бұрын
Yeah, I can only hope they continue on with the tournament
@snugglebunny18405 ай бұрын
Thanks again - I will add explanations of mod-specific mechanics to the faction descriptions in 1.1 Are the Dwarves okay, or should they also have additional Light Spear Impact? It would cost 3 points.
@Rosedelio5 ай бұрын
I think Dreddradish and I were more hesitant on committing the Dwarven units because they were down on impact and had the possibility of collapsing before flank threats came in. Light Spear might help them since they're meant to be a "small but elite" army like the Elves. I've only used them in this mirror against the orcs though, not against any armies of Men. Also, yes, adding the mod-specific mechanics to the factions that use them will be very useful.
@Changdao16445 ай бұрын
I think that they need the light spear impact. Otherwise impacts against orcs are too risky, and go against their win condition of breaking through before being surrounded.
@snugglebunny18405 ай бұрын
@@Changdao1644 I have added it in 1.1, along with mechanics descriptions for those armies that need them.
@cmur0785 ай бұрын
I played Dale vs. Dwarves there recently. Dwarves lost both matches, but I didn't think they were that underpowered. I got crushed playing as them, but I'm not very good, and it felt fair enough. I won narrowly as Dale, but my opponent got a fairly unlucky general death + a couple of cohesion drops on his stronger wing, so I was rolling them up from both sides, and it was still close at the end.
@snugglebunny18405 ай бұрын
@@cmur078 Thanks. We will see how they do with the added Light Spear in 1.1, which is releasing soon.
@snugglebunny18405 ай бұрын
Thanks for uploading, this sort of thing is quite helpful. Overall I was pretty pleased with how this played, but let me know if you have any balance thoughts, I am putting finishing touches on 1.1
@Rosedelio5 ай бұрын
The other side of the mirror comes out on Wednesday. Now that I've played another match, I can see how high quality alone isn't enough to decide the match. Though, the Dwarves also aren't as good as Elves at surviving impact. Definitely tense moments in the race between breaking orcs or flanking elves/dwarves. I'm not sure about any balance considerations yet.
@snugglebunny18405 ай бұрын
WHY JORGITO?? Never fight uphill me boys, never fight uphill. Wow, that was a big mistake.
@Rosedelio5 ай бұрын
Yeah, the slope was too steep for anything good to happen from charging up. It would have been better to wait until his cav pushed around to a flanking position before committing them.
@jorgepedro84315 ай бұрын
Because I was desperate...
@stuckupcurlyguy6 ай бұрын
I did not think of disembarking near the rough to use your wagon as medium infantry - that worked nicely.
@Rosedelio6 ай бұрын
Yep, disembarking the War Wagons is the Poles best option when it comes to taking with terrain
@stuckupcurlyguy6 ай бұрын
@@Rosedelio I've considered recording my games to review/learn from them. Can you share which software you use to put these videos together?
@Rosedelio6 ай бұрын
@@stuckupcurlyguy So, to record my screen I use the screen record feature from nVidia GeForce Experience. As for the small editing/compiling, I use Shotcut. I believe that's the same setup as SnuggleBunny's.
@snugglebunny18406 ай бұрын
Just played this mirror against Lennard! Agreed that the horde of Scandi Foot is better than investing much in MAA. The long range shooting was an appalling waste of time and ammo; really the scandis should only be shooting in the approach at close range, esp if they have arty support, or (most importantly) when lancers/strelzy come into close range and are in the way of an advance. This isn't really limited to the Scandi Foot though - I just think Mixed Foot should (almost) never, ever shoot beyond range 2, with the sole exception of if they are supporting close fires from other units and one more shot might cause a critical check, etc etc, and it makes me sad whenever I see it happen.
@stuckupcurlyguy6 ай бұрын
I thought you were screwed with all the medium foot bearing down on you but the skillful knight micro was too satisfying.
@Rosedelio6 ай бұрын
Thanks! Yeah, I was worried that I would lose because of my mistake advancing on the right, but fighting down the steep hill helped negate the disorder a lot