16 REASONS TO BAN MAXX "C"

[@gaymare6236]

Breaking News: Konami has announced that Maxx "C" will be the first card you're allowed to have 4 copies of in your deck

[@joanaguayoplanell4912]

And also at 6 copies because Mulchtummy is now legal and Maxx C has STILL survived.

[@Finalslashes]

Make it nine and ur right on the money

[@IC-23]

@@gaymare6236 OCG: Make that 14 Baby! Unlimited card draw

[@djwh1te0ut68]

On the subject of OCG players all loving Maxx C, I watched an interview with multiple OCG players and when asked if they had to pick a single format to play and stick with it, a majority of the players said "The format that doesnt have maxx c in it"

[@TheMasterBlaze]

The recent Japan Division winner of the Master Duel WCS said in an interview with Farfa that he doesn't like Maxx "C" at all.

[@rescuerex7031]

SO then why is it still legal in the OCG if OCG players prefer a format without the MAXX "C"?

[@twinkiesmaster69]

@@rescuerex7031 konami

[@NickersonGeneral]

@@rescuerex7031 Probably the for the same reason Mystic Mine, Halq, and Firewall Dragon were legal for multiple formats despite TCG players complaining vehementy about them all.

[@secretlyaslug2325]

​@@twinkiesmaster69 thank you for playing YuGiOh Master Duel

[@benhunt25]

I really just need the sound clip of “The Japanese are not a monolith”. It’s just an inherently funny sound bite that also comes up way more than it has any right to

[@incapablecreditor8117]

The Japanese are a monolith because I am going to stack them on top of each other like a large Jenga tower.

[@RealKingChief]

@@incapablecreditor8117 Is this a Junji Ito manga?

[@tobysmith2081]

​@@incapablecreditor8117 let's get em

[@daedalus5253]

The Japanese are, as a matter of fact, not any type of lith. Although some might be, idk, they‘re not a monolith, after all.

[@phantom_mist1726]

I know what you mean. People act like they just agree on absolutely every single topic at all times. They are people too lol that’s definitely a good sound clip

[@Kurinth]

lets not forget, pot of prosperity, which is at 1, stops you from drawing cards the turn it is used and halves the damage your opponent takes that turn, to let you dig 6 for a single card, but maxx c is still at 3

[@thorscape3879]

Pot of Duality, a card that lets you dig three deep for a singe card and and locks you out of special summons was semi-limited for the better part of a year in MD. In the OCG, the land of the roach, Pot of Prosperity is semi-limited and Pot of Desires is semi-limited. Why do these cards with massive penalties that require a specific style of deck building to work effectively to go +1 get semi-limited but the card that goes +2 at minimum stays untouched forever? Why do the cards that specifically counter it, Crossout Designator and Called by the Grave, get special hate from the OCG just so you can have Ash 4, 5, and 6? Why? What makes the roach so special?

[@kauanjos3199]

But prosperity in a bo1 always felt super sacky, you legit can search almost everything with the drawing 6 effect, it was being abused so much by floodgate decks

[@thorscape3879]

@@kauanjos3199 1) Prosperity does not draw 6. It adds 1. 2) Let's pretend Prosperity is saccy. How is drawing at minimum 3 against the supermajority of decks not more saccy? Prosperity requires you to nuke your extra deck toolbox to get those saccy cards you hate. Maxx "C" requires that you put three in your deck and nothing more. If you hate the floodgates then ban the floodgates. The drawbacks of Prosperity for going hand neutral are extremely well balanced. Any broken card you get from Prosperity is not the fault of Prosperity. It is the fault of the broken card for being broken.

[@kauanjos3199]

@@thorscape3879 i know prosperity doesn't draw 6 bro. What do you think i am? Stupid? It was just a typo

[@antiheartless45]

Maxx C is highly used because the best decks of the format are combo decks that special summon like crazy so unless they are going to nuke all the best strategies keep Maxx C in the game

[@tonberry2670]

If a deck needs cards like Maxx C to function, then it's not rogue, it's bad

[@fangspecter2232]

this i agree with, i run synchrons and by their nature i never need maxx c, i only have ash and called by the grave simply to counter maxx c, you CAN make decks that don't need that pest, its just that people rely on it too much

[@jollytcg]

Agreed 👍 rogue decks shouldn't need a broken card to make them playable

[@sr_pallmeto4542]

based

[@FGj-xj7rd]

Lmao. True.

[@Rivarham]

I agree with this too. It brings "some" variety, but most of them try to turbo really toxic decks (and badly made too)

[@aeneas6377]

I'd like to expand on something you only briefly mentioned: Master Duel is a best of 1 format. In the OCG, it's highly unlikely that all three possible games in a match will be decided solely by Maxx "C". In Master Duel however, this is a very real possibility and makes the already pretty unforgiving ranking system all the more frustrating. In an environment where you need at least 2 consecutive wins to rank up (as opposed to a more standard points system) losing means having to "regrind" that victory. Losing just because your opponent opened Maxx "C" makes that endeavor all the more infuriating since it can: - immediately lose you the game on turn 1 - make a possible comeback impossible - handloop you for 1/2 if your Maxx "C" and Ash/Called By get negated meaning that climbing the ranks becomes a constant luckfest. Overall it's just not healthy in a Bo1 format, especially Master Duel's

[@ich3730]

But thats just because MD is broken tho. YGO is DESIGNED as a best of 3 experience, cant blame Maxx C for being played in a way thats not intended.

[@12thLevelSithLord]

​@@ich3730 Maxx C isn't a person, who cares if it gets blamed. It has no feelings to hurt. If they're going to make a variant format based on the existing card game, they should curate the card pool to make the game work with the changes they've made to the format. If there are cards that are only fine because of YGO normally being best of 3, get rid of the shit that's broken in best of 1.

[@FakeHeroFang]

BO1, plus around a 50-60% chance for at least one player to start the game with Maxx C if both players are on a 40 card deck makes it really frustrating. It happens just often enough that you cannot ignore it, and you have to prepare for it even if the counters to Maxx C would otherwise see little play, like Joe pointed out. It's basically an extra coin flip on every game to decide whether you get to play real Yugioh or the Maxx C minigame. Very cool indeed

[@HardlegGaming]

Excellent point! There's many great arguments like this for banning Maxx C, that I couldn't fit into the video simply because there's no argument against it. I hope I never have to make a follow-up video to this, but if I do this will go in there.

[@FakeHeroFang]

@@TheClown-0 According to hypergeometric calc, a player has around a 30% chance to open with a 3 of in a 5 card hand from a 40 card deck. How is that even possible?

[@YouTubeEnthusiast]

This video is almost a year old and Maxx "C" still hasn't even been semi-limited. I cannot stand this awful card!!

[@deathrotor]

3:29 those options should say : option 1: Let your opponent win (let them draw by you summoning) option 2: Let your opponent win (end turn to deny draws)

[@MrAlexjmercer]

Best summary

[@JustSomeGuyLass]

Konami could fix Max C with an errata and actually make it healthy for the game. Here's how Activate if the only cards you control are "C" cards; during either player's turn: You can discard 1 card and send this card from your hand or field to the Graveyard; this turn, each time your opponent Special Summons a monster(s), immediately draw 1 card, but keep those cards revealed for the rest of this turn. You cannot activate the effects of cards drawn by this card effect, except for "C" cards, this turn. You can only use 1 "Maxx "C"" per turn.

[@KoriKeiji]

I…I don’t know why I watched a 23 minute video on a point I already agreed with before even watching it. Love you Joe

[@enlongjones2394]

Because Joe is a fun guy to listen to.

[@HardlegGaming]

:D

[@dhanyl2725]

Personally, it's because I want to stroke my own ego since deep down I know konami ain't touching that busted shit

[@sloppyjoe5263]

​@@dhanyl2725 Maxx c in the long run will probably hurt md player count by quite a bit.

[@thedootlord]

Because of the subconscious decision to make him succeed and give him views

[@djkates1916]

21:14 I'd like to draw a bit of extra attention to this point. Maxx "C" *does not fit in the modern format.* It is one of many cards that was designed at a time when the game was significantly different from what it is now. At the time of its release, players really did have the viable option to play decks that did little to no Special Summoning, which is why Maxx "C" was mainly a Side Deck card for a while. That was then; this is now. There have been several other cards that were not at all problematic when they released, only for later changes in the game to break them. Just a few examples: - The Tyrant Neptune was at best a gimmick card for much of its existence. Eventually, it became viable for it to copy some truly heinous things, and the card has since earned a ban. - Smoke Grenade of the Thief was effectively unplayable for years. Eventually, it became possible to consistently access and trigger it multiple times over the course of a combo, earning it a ban. - Grinder Golem was pretty much useless from the time of its release up to the release of the first wave of Link Monsters. When that happened, it instantly became a 1-card build-a-board combo, and rightly earned a ban. Notice something about those three examples? *They all got banned.* Not only that, but I've never seen any serious argument for any of them to come back.

[@DeviousHands]

Tyrant Neptune - ban nightengale instead is an argument I've heard, but still, due to it limiting design space the ban on it makes more sense

[@SerechII]

My boy grinder golem, the only time I played it was with inferno tempest on the PSP ygo games lol I'll always remember him fondly o7

[@xCorvus7x]

@@SerechII Grinder Golem suits that combo so well, one wonders whether this was the play for which it was designed.

[@djkates1916]

@@xCorvus7x Funnily enough, since Grinder Golem was an anime card (although it was called Torch Golem in the anime, mirroring its Japanese name), we know *exactly* what play it was designed for... and said play wouldn't work IRL. In the anime, Torch Golem (which didn't have the downside of preventing its user from Normal Summoning that turn) was used to provide Tribute bait for Yubel; since anime Yubel (unlike the IRL card) also redirected damage when it attacked, it was then able to ram into the Torch Golem for lethal damage.

[@xCorvus7x]

@@djkates1916 ha, I guess that counts

[@Cimoooooooo]

6:20 This had me rolling 😂😂😂😂😂

[@charlesfort6602]

#BanMaxxC

[@ryuhayabusa6651]

Hahaha yea that was hilarious. It is good to know cimooo himself watches hardlegs goofy but exceptional content 🤘 let me clarify, the goofy part is excptional and much loved too ❣️

[@chaosbug7]

It's always a treat to see Goblin Mode Joe. In all seriousness, this is a well thought out and valid explanation as to why Maxx "C" is not a healthy solution to keep decks in check as the game has evolved to where advantage is everything, and most decks worth their salt can go off with a single card. Maxx 'C' is a volatile card that only offers the illusion of choice & will often put the one who drew it first in an advantageous position.

[@pringerx5768]

BugLover: "Where's the hard data!?" MD Devs: "I gotchu fam" *adds card usage stats and win rate straight into the game* I was not expecting that haha

[@GoldenNovaYugioh]

Came For The Objectively True Analysis Stayed For The Amazing Presentation Cried In Joy For Goblin Joe

[@HardlegGaming]

o7

[@Vexxus0]

Same o7

[@Moonslight7658]

​@@HardlegGaming What's the name of the music in 00:48?

[@leafninja-fox5713]

It's crazy to see Hardleg STILL responding to comments till this day- I have nothing but respect for this man. I want the bug banned too. I just come back to this video every few months to enjoy how well done this video was made. It surprises me people still find excuses without reasonable evidence to at least a majority of the counter arguments in the video.

[@HardlegGaming]

I always take time to go through the newest comments of all my videos and respond. It's just that in most videos the response is "thanks!" or "

[@TheGuyWhoIsSitting]

The fact maxx c doesn’t have a bundle is hilarious to me. A ton of other staples do, but you better give Konami that sweet 90 UR dust.

[@chroniclej2439]

If it ever got one then we would know for sure the bug isn’t leaving. Konami wouldn’t give up free $

[@TheGuyWhoIsSitting]

@@chroniclej2439 the recently hit Lightning Storm in the TCG. There’s always a chance. Even if they just put it to 1, you only get your 20 dust bonus when something is moved to forbidden. And you get 0 dust for guaranteed cards too.

[@pockit5107]

It did have a bundle it's just not in the store anymore.

[@lloydbagby8355]

I made the chance I got

[@SamTheFable]

Ironically, Rhongo Bongo is one of the cards that immediately wins the Maxx C challenge as soon as it hits the board.

[@dhanyl2725]

And other kinds of floodgate plays. Yes I'm saying maxx c encourages floodgate style plays

[@randomdeliveryguy]

@@dhanyl2725 True. Only reason I play bagooska is to pass on it because of that shit.

[@four-en-tee]

@@randomdeliveryguy That's the thing though, Maxx "C" defenders like the idea that it slows down the game. Maybe if Konami hit all the busted floodgates in this game and it actually encouraged more attrition-based styles of deck building, I could agree with that. Like, Bagooska is whatever. That may as well be the modern day Swords of Revealing Light. But passing on fucking Skill Drain and shit like that? Fucking end me. That's not attrition, that's indefinite stalling.

[@rosem325]

Can confirm, this is how Six Samurai outed maxx C before gossip shadow ban . Just make Rhongo. Your 15 draws don’t matter you can’t do anything

[@ignacioperez5479]

​@@four-en-teeif you ban every floodgate, then combo/solitary decks would be ramping, forcing for a massive ban or unban the floodgates

[@helixier6629]

15:24 farfa litterally interviewed the #1 world condender for the worlds tournament from the recent master duel event and he said he doesnt like Maxx C

[@cryoforceyeet8893]

He also plays in the OCG and he dislikes it even there

[@dhanyl2725]

​@@cryoforceyeet8893 I've stumbled upon a japanese tweet that basically said, "We already have maxx c, why are these other hand traps here?"

[@xCorvus7x]

@@dhanyl2725 To be fair, that is a rather silly take. Much of Maxx C's value is in the handtraps it lets you draw, with which you can end your opponent's turn prematurely _and_ have a full hand to combo off on your turn.

[@dhanyl2725]

@@xCorvus7x What it probably meant was that why is that necessary? Why should maxx c be anymore unfair than it already is?

[@xCorvus7x]

@@dhanyl2725 Okay, that also makes sense, since the turn one player cannot play through Maxx C hoping to OTK (and at some point you'll have drawn so many cards that you can just brute-force your way through your opponent's board, even if you don't have any boardbreakers).

[@thegreataggron]

Ok, the gremlinleg segment had me dying of laughter

[@Sealbinder]

This is the second video about why Maxx C is problematic. His first video convinced me it was a problem. The third video will have Hardleg invite a Maxx C defender on so he can shake them by the collar for 30 minutes asking why they dont understand. I would watch it.

[@HardlegGaming]

lol

[@SproingBoing]

Master Duel, the only TCG adjacent format that lets you play a 32 card deck

[@BirbRawor]

get ready for Bystials which will make it atleast 29 card deck

[@OizenX]

Somtimes its a 31 card deck if you include crossout on the list, or even lower if you add ghost belle

[@ich3730]

You dont know how good you have it, back in the day decks where 80% staples and 20% chaos package xD

[@NickersonGeneral]

@@ich3730 I remember a day when you'd get a metagame dot come article written about your sick rogue zombie deck because you were running a chaos deck with 3 pyramid turtles and a vampire lord lol

[@SproingBoing]

@@ich3730 I remember when the Solar Flare Dragon lock was near unbeatable with some decent negation traps and Battery Man Beatdown was a legitimate strategy during playground format. And for the most part these were competent decks that our impromtu "Yu-Gi-Oh Club" could assemble with what limited money we had individually or card trading. It sucked lol

[@sr_pallmeto4542]

Every survey I completed I said "Pls ban maxx C" in the aditional notes on the last page.

[@sloppyjoe5263]

Keep it up buddy, you are doing god's work😅, i am also doing the same

[@Shad_216]

I don’t think it’s getting banned any quicker than it already is with all the outcry. MD is literally it’s own format with its own banlist. Just play the format where it’s already banned instead of begging and pleading for a single card that only lets you draw from top deck

[@slayinderp7501]

For the point of Midrange decks that just get shut down by Maxx C, YES. Some decks can manage giving their opponent 1, maybe 2 draws because of a normal+some specials, but other decks absolutely NEED to special in order to accomplish even a baseline strat. Example: Galaxy-Eyes. Deck that wants to punch you very very hard. If I'm going 1st, my best bet is to end on Photon Lord, maybe with an Astral Kuriboh under it, but that's definitely going to use 1-2 specials on the way there plus another in making him. That's 3 draws off of making ONE negate+pop. I'm not being punished for combo-ing, I'm being punished for playing a deck that's """"gimmick"""" is countered by one card.

[@fangspecter2232]

another example are synchrons, by nature they tend to spam, and because Ash is one of the counters, they activate it on the junk synchron and absolutely shut you down, couple that with synchron decks typically not having many traps and you got yourself a pretty hard shut down and an angry surrender

[@PyrotheFlareon]

As a Gunkan Suship player, it's basically the same here. The main deck monsters are basically useless if left on the field and rely heavily on special summoning to make even one of their big three monsters. With Maxx C as it is, I tend to get hit by either it or Ash Blossom, which pretty much shuts down whatever momentum I had. Admittedly, Suships aren't as strong as Galaxy-Eyes with about the same number of special summons, which just makes them get hit harder and makes recovery all the more difficult, if I survive the turn.

[@randomprotag9329]

plus as well control decks which SS 2+ times get really hurt by max c. in order to get back to equal ground on a draw 2 max c the control deck has to make two 2 for 1 trades before the resource grind win condition can actually start

[@driftwisp2797]

@@randomprotag9329 Because the people who advocate for C aren't the ones who play "fair" resource grind control decks. They're the ones who summon one big monster then set four flood gates. Two or three draws means a lot if those are cards you need to negate, but means nothing if those are cards that can't do anything because of TCBOO and Skill Drain.

[@randomprotag9329]

@@driftwisp2797 Dont give the decks credit of being resource grind control decks. if those decks were actually that, they be just as hurt. its the stun players who care less since as long as its not an out they dont care

[@SkyReaperOne]

Here. Saw Farfa's take on this vid, decided to drop in here and play it at 0.25 speed and drop this comment for engagement. This is just how much I agree with you about the whole thing. Maxx C needs to die.

[@polecats6922]

it's worth mentioning in the ocg sprite was a complete menace cause it could effectively search max c

[@NickersonGeneral]

Maxx C Defenders: We need Maxx C in the game to punish combo decks Nibiru, Sphere Mode, Evenly Matched, Dark Ruler no More, Forbidden Droplet, Lightning Storm, and Raigeki: Um, hi?

[@KhanhNguyen-mh5ec]

Barron de fleur: *yawn*

[@will2fite34]

@@KhanhNguyen-mh5ec he did say droplet

[@KhanhNguyen-mh5ec]

@@will2fite34 You can respond to forbidden droplet with Barron the fleur

[@will2fite34]

@@KhanhNguyen-mh5ec not if you dump a monster as the cost

[@desmondbush8804]

​@@KhanhNguyen-mh5ecsounds like a bad player 🤣

[@natetheknight2809]

7:17 I straight up thought you were going to give us the Tony Stark “If you’re nothing without this card, then you shouldn’t have it.” 😂 Great video Joe! 💙

[@Paytonzane]

I was gonna say, that voice for the topics sounds very familiar, that's goddamn LAMP! Happy to see my favorite groups (Jello's friendgroup and Yugitubers) making a tangential connection lol. Okay had to come back and edit this; LAMP FUCKING KILLED IT IN THIS! God damn you bounced off him perfectly and the lightning round was fantastic.

[@AKImeru]

Maxx C is such a bonkers card that for a brief moment in Master Duel where Floo was running rampant people STILL RAN and STILL WON OFF it for the occasional non floo matchup you got.

[@dhanyl2725]

Thanks to maxx c, floo is pretty much my pet deck. If the daily mission doesn't make me special summon I usually try to go with floo

[@sussymaximo9014]

This is the best editing i've seen since i got into YGO. Keep it going my dude

[@HardlegGaming]

Thanks! Glad to see people appreciating the edits :)

[@ryuhayabusa6651]

This deserves definitely a thumbs up. Very well done! Liked Hahha even farfa is in the video 😂

[@GurrenPrime]

The thing I was thinking about wrt Maxx C supposedly nerfing combo decks is that, as the “Maxx C challenge” has proven, really crazy combo decks can counter it by forcing the opponent to deck out, so if anything Maxx C is forcing people to try finding crazier combos. So even if you don’t like the combo-heavy meta, Maxx C is just incentivizing it to get worse.

[@dhanyl2725]

Either that or just straight up floodgate. I remember when barrier statue was still legal before floo came, I played simorgh whose game plan is just link simorgh pass. I wanted to ss apex since I didn't know opponent's deck, but after maxx c resolves I opted to ss stormwinds instead and prayed it locked my opponent (it worked lol, sorry not sorry maxx c andy)

[@thekoboldintheattic8587]

Yeah, I can agree with the max C challenge, mostly because I’ve been able to do it with six Sam link spam, tho I still want Maxx C mostly because I really like it’s concept (though I am not opposed to it being toned down a bit)

[@Rahnonymous]

And even then, they can just surrender before you deck them out. Wasting both your time and braincells building a deck that counters ONE CARD

[@thekoboldintheattic8587]

@@Rahnonymous I still want to keep Maxx c, mostly because I like how it plays, mostly because my six Sam link spam deck can deal with it decently

[@Yozzoy]

I literally quit Master Duel because of Maxx C. Absolutely hate it with a passion.

[@rechtehaber]

there is a better use of your time

[@akiraishin7141]

I work full-time so I don't get much time with YGO, but I really feel like, yeah, I stopped playing because of it.

[@matija5748]

Honestly I'm thinking about quitting as well all because of maxx c

[@archaonwalde8993]

cry about it. i play master duel maxx c is not a problem really

[@kingpepega7919]

@@archaonwalde8993 Caught the floow player.

[@nightmarebananaful]

I tuned back into this video to see how/if it aged poorly. And it has not. It's still relevant as the day it was released over a year ago. And nothing proves that more to me than the fact I still see Joe down here replying to people well past the prime-interaction window of the video as well as the example arguments almost verbatim. Keep it up Joe, your videos will always attract my lurking-ass.

[@costelinha1867]

1. Keep summoning and let your opponent keep drawing 2. Don't special summon anything and end your turn. Notice how both of them would probably still give the Maxx C user a clear advantage, and essentially puts the Maxx C victim in a lose, lose situation. Specially in a game where a lot of decks LITERALLY REVOLVE AROUND FLOODING THE FIELD WITH POWERFUL MONSTERS BY SPECIAL SUMMONING EVERYTHING LIKE CRAZY IN ONE OR TWO TURNS!

[@f5673-t1h]

You wrote that sentence... and didn't even identify that "flooding the field" is the actual problem?

[@four-en-tee]

Repeat after me: """rogue""" decks (non-meta pet decks) need niche support that fills their gimmick and their gimmick alone in order to actually rise up the meta. If every deck can use Maxx "C", your pet deck doesn't have a net gain up the tier list. What it needs is a favorable meta that profits off of its niche. An example of an actual rogue deck like that is HEROs, which constantly dips in and out of the meta whenever aggro combo decks are more viable and Dark Law Absolute Zero pass is considered a good end board that format. Granted, it helps that HEROs get new support every other set that tries to spitball new ideas to innovate their strategy (and unlike Dark Magician, its sometimes pretty decent). And before I hear "HEROs aren't rogue because it always loses to [insert random non-meta deck here]", then i got news for you: every deck has a losing match up.

[@tootsie_]

Every internet argument video needs a "Goblin opinion lightning round"

[@NickersonGeneral]

A funny thing about the "Maxx C is needed to stop combo decks" argument is the sheer amount of people who blatantly pivoted once they looked at the master duel meta and noticed that Maxx C didn't do a damn thing to stop combo decks. Now suddenly the argument is "Look! Maxx C didn't change the meta at all. Therefore it's not broken". Bitch, the only people arguing Maxx C was gonna change the meta was it's defenders. The problem with Maxx C is and has always been that it wins games in an unfair and unfun way, regardless of what the best decks are in the format. A card doesn't need to fundamentally alter the fabric of reality before it can be considered too broken to be legal at 3 copies.

[@pockit5107]

And the hilarious part is that it is not in fact needed to stop combo decks. There are so many staples in the game that shut down combo decks. Opponent has too many monsters with disruption effects? Dark Ruler No More. Unbreakable tower? Kaijus

[@NickersonGeneral]

@@pockit5107 I've said it before and I'll say it again. The only people who defend Maxx C are people who are terrible at this game and want some braindead way to counter meta decks. If you truly want to deal with negate boards, learn to use hand traps, learn to use board breakers, learn how to bait out negates to effectively play through them. These are all things that take a little more finesse to pull off, but any competent rogue deck can handle it with a little practice. Yet if you talk to Maxx C defenders, they're pretty much ALL under the impression it's IMPOSSIBLE for rogue decks to compete going second without Maxx C in the game, which is probably because the "rogue" decks they're playing are badly made Blue-Eyes or Dark Magician decks.

[@hermitxIII]

@@pockit5107 And how do you draw those consistently, genius?

[@NickersonGeneral]

@@hermitxIII Look at the current meta. Are decks tending towards unbreakable towers? Might be worth your time investing in kaijus. Boards full of negates? Dark Ruler might be a staple. Both? Highly unlikely, but if that is the case, I guarantee you there are just as many people as you upset about this, and the banlist might get involved soon.

[@hermitxIII]

@@NickersonGeneral I understand your point and I don't entirely disagree, but in a BO1 format like MD you need to maindeck all of your going 2nd cards, so you can end up with a lot of bricks going 1st, or have no follow up going 2nd. Not to mention, in some formats no single board breaker is enough. Right now if you don't have an ash ready for branded fusion, branded players will probably outgrind you for example. Doesn't matter if they get hit with nibiru or evenly. They keep plusing every turn while you go minus trying to break their board in the first place.

[@jacobbowser1158]

"The Japanese are not a Monolith!" is pure gold and an argument I've had many a time with my weep friends and people who only "know" about "Japan" and "Japanese Culture" through the current Anime(s) they're watching.

[@rexusthevaliant6311]

This was incredibly entertaining

[@KingGladearYugioh]

Hey hardleg I really love what you did with this video and I honestly couldn’t put it into better words myself. Master duel as a BO1 format inherently coming out with a banlist very weak around both toxic floodgates and Maxx c being at 3 makes playing a game where your whole match is decided by either the bug or the coin toss. A very personable experience I hope many others have felt was during the world champ qualifiers where I found myself winning 75% of my games when I went first and didn’t get Maxx c out of the game playing RDA which is not a great deck but I love it to death and built it to play well against tear. I found myself thinking that whole time that if Maxx c didn’t exist sure going second might be weaker to a extent but it would force other tech choices that would help in those matchups as well. Cards like ash and crossout don’t really help in a Tearlament matchup as much as other cards plus the 3 slots for Maxx c. It really has put BO1 as a coin toss format with Maxx c as a secondary challenge plus not bricking. So much luck in a game where your deck building choices should not revolve around did I get lucky and did I win the coin toss. It may not be a great explanation of my feelings toward this bug but I hope it did some justice. I don’t know if Maxx c will be banned and maybe it could stay at 3 but it feels old and repetitive and makes me not to excited to play against Maxx c challenge most games. I find myself with a huge feeling of dread if I didn’t open gamma, ash or called by anytime I go first and see that red glow knowing I won’t get to play in this match without a high risk of just getting ripped apart. Anyway thank you so much for the amazing video hardleg and I hope you get the chance to enjoy a format of master duel where we’re not dealing with the bug!

[@ToddLawrence23]

Reminder that cards like Ash reward you for knowing your opponent's deck, maxx c rewards you for nothing, simple as that.

[@dhanyl2725]

Maxx c rewards you for playing a stronger deck than your opponent's :)

[@s.toctopusn248]

when you go second and your opponent start with pot of desire would you ash it? sure in long run you would ash according to the most represented deck to maximize you chance of winning, but if you don’t ash and then they just set 5 pass you will feel pain. But then again it is a feature of best of 1 of master duel.

[@ToddLawrence23]

@@dhanyl2725 Lmao what a cope, topdecking forbidden droplet with a maxx c makes you such a great player.

[@ToddLawrence23]

@@s.toctopusn248 Depends on how many handtraps I have, usually the first one it's a bait so I wait until I can effectively disrupt his combo.

[@s.toctopusn248]

@@ToddLawrence23 every modern deck have no choke point, hand trap math mech is just who have better hand. How about pandemic format, to play against any of the top deck you need at least 2 handtrap plus your starter just to win against 1 card combo and your opponent can have card like extender, call by fucking exchange.

[@C_Kiri]

You know what gets me about the specific argument about 'Rogue Decks needing Maxx C to compete'? Do they... do they actually play their own decks? In real games of Yugioh? Do they not notice the equal amount of times it gets played against them, and they just lose even harder than normal? Do they derive satisfaction from designing a deck with a specific nonstandard play pattern, and then winning with said deck because they did not use that play pattern and instead dropped the same roach everyone else uses on the board and their opponent scooped? Literally the arguments in favor of Maxx C do not reflect reality in a way I find... surreal and disturbing. The degree to which people are capable of lying to themselves almost scares me.

[@elin111]

That's how narrow tunnel visioned the Maxx C defenders are.

[@sloppyjoe5263]

​@@elin111 The harsh truth is most ocg players are very casual players and actually love random sacky nonsense in ygo. And there is no card in ygo that brings randomness better than Maxx c. They don't want to admit it, so they keep on giving strawman arguments like " it keeps combo decks in check". It's just stupid and sad at the same time. I am probably gonna quit md for good, way too burnt out playing a second coin toss in the form of Maxx c mini game.

[@booboolips6053]

Especially when you have to special summon a dozen times a turn just to be even slightly competitive.

[@EmperorXCIX]

Maxx is at a 87% use rate in master duel. That's insane. Ash is only 60%

[@driftwisp2797]

Is the usage rate including every duel in the game? Because if those 13% of non-C users are from games played before people owned C, it's even more crazy.

[@EmperorXCIX]

@@driftwisp2797 it's EVERY duel.

[@dudono1744]

There is also the .1% of crazy FTK decks to take in account. And the noobs also.

[@Jxstqn]

Hey man if I see tearlemanets or sprights where they set up 9 negates (I only have 6 cards in my hand) you best believe imma need more of my deck then usual

[@dudono1744]

@@Jxstqn The problem is that those decks can setup 9 negates.

[@blakejohnson1974]

The ban list was literally introduced to the game because there were a list of staple cards that made up almost half of your deck and were essentially no-brainers. And yet they just flood MD and OCG decks with the maxx c package. Complete nonsense.

[@alicethegrinsecatz6011]

I don't see any problem in cards like Delinquent Dou, Forceful Sentry, Confiscation, Yata-Garasu or Pot of Greed. The game would probably much healthier if we wouldn't have any ban list. *irony*

[@Lokisif34]

@@alicethegrinsecatz6011 I don't know if you are being serious or not. There are several cards that draw you 2 with drawbacks and still get limited, greed does that for zero drawback. Forceful sentry can literally shutdown an entire deck if you put back the right piece, and give you info on your opponents hand allowing you to effectively counterplay any hand traps they have. Confiscation does the same only worse since graveyard effects and summoning are common. Delinquent is kind of funny one since there are decks that don't mind discarding, it still has the potential to end games turn 1. Imagine trying to beat one of these one card combo full negate board decks with 2 less cards. Also any tier 0 meta would just be 10x worse without a ban list.

[@alicethegrinsecatz6011]

@@Lokisif34 Read the last word of my comment, please! Just read it! It makes your comment completely obsolete.

[@Lokisif34]

@@alicethegrinsecatz6011 What part of your statement was ironic? No malice, more confusion

[@alicethegrinsecatz6011]

@@Lokisif34 The entire comment was irony: the expression of one's meaning by using language that normally signifies the opposite, typically for humorous or emphatic effect. In other words, downplaying the meaning of these cards is intentionally chosen to express the complete opposite.

[@andrewjoseph2749]

I haven't played Master Duel in about 18 months b/c of Maxx C. F that card, I want to play 8 different cards in my deck than Maxx C, Ash, and Called by the Grave... although the latter is still good for other cards.

[@Alotaro-the-Real]

Seen a lot of this and said a lot about it already in the patreon Server, still very good work! Mostly making sure to Comment for KZbin Engagement Math. Edit: Also, I might have missed it somewhere in the video itself but might be good to credit Lamp, and have a link to their stuff in the description, for the "Announcer Voice". Unless of course they said they didn't need/want to be.

[@siftheadsdude]

Tbh this is one of the best vids out there. I’m fine with people simply having a difference of opinion, but so many people literally believe stuff that isn’t true yet they still blab it. It’s nonsensically annoying lol

[@GothamCityCritics]

*gasp* Your goblin form has returned!

[@scottsocia7828]

I'd also like to add that those cards that counter max C also counter potential interruptions you opponent would use on your actual combos meaning your burned your counter before even getting to play the game.

[@Nelsonasdf]

This video made me cry, thank you hard leg for looking out for the people & for the game itself!

[@devtehdrhax866]

I remember i had a foolish thought back in the days thinking Maxx "C" keeps deadly combo decks in check Then i realized in less than 5 seconds that it ALSO made rogue deck suffer even more since they too can keep you in check....

[@JonBc14]

alright Hardleg Joe, you won me over. I really enjoy your charisma 😂

[@NerdySatyr]

Man I don't even play YGO anymore but this is some of the best content on YT. Thanks for the vids HardLeg!!

[@Mr.Qwayzar]

Im all for the BanMaxxC movement

[@Shad_216]

Going strong 1 year and some days, huh?

[@crowley12]

Maxx C Probably Hurt Rogue deck more than it help them

[@malareon]

If u have maxx "c" legal, than decks that lose to maxx "c" have to be more unfair to compensate. Hence why something like that block dragon deck with the power tool hand loop saw more play than something like salad did in the ocg.

[@saitougin7210]

This is legit one of the best youtube videos ever - in both its content (very good arguments) as well as in the way it is present (some parts are just extremely funny and entertaining - unlike Master Duel, because it has MaxxC not banned yet).

[@yazanabbadi4247]

This video is fantastic. I hate Maxx "C" and I will NEVER craft it nor play it in my deck cuz I despise the card. It is as you said in the video "it is poorly designed". I'm joining the campaign and will be tweeting and asking in the survey to ban it. Great logic leads to great results (as this video).

[@swlb2]

As someone just getting back into the YuGiOh scene... I feel like there are duels where you loose the coin toss and might as well conceed the game. I feel more times than not the opponet gets to summon some form of Omni negate, sometimes even a couple of them, after sitting and watching them take their 5min turn it finally gets to you.... you managed to push threw their negates, maybe Ash gets thrown out... you've had to waste 2 or 3 cards just to start your combo... Then they just Maxx "C" putting you even further behind in card advantage... sure Maxx "c" is a good way to keep an opponent's combos in check but when you don't draw one when you're going second it just acts as even more control for your opponent.. not to mention in master duel Ash, Maxx, Called by and Effect Veiler are Ultra Rares... You are almost forced to at least play a set of Maxx and Ash.. I dont want to use 180 UR dust on these things..

[@SirAthiro]

You know a card is hated when someone dedicates a twenty minute video to it.

[@MiyaoMeow588]

it could be worse imagine if he made a 3 hour video 🙃

[@VorseRaiderStrike]

boutta dedicate a 24 minute video to insect knight we can no longer ignore their unmatched battle prowess

[@phoenix5029]

To make matters worse, quite a few of his "debunks" feel too much like strawman arguments. He's not giving any of the counterarguments the time of day. He's just saying "you're wrong, here's why you're wrong, don't talk back", which doesn't make for a productive discussion...

[@KesslerVTuber]

@@phoenix5029 so basically Joe is just crying about Maxx c just to cry about it again?

[@DarkAuraLord]

@@phoenix5029 I remember when debunking was about correcting misinformation, and not trying to own people that have a different opinion than yours lmao

[@Tudsamfa]

I remember when I first got into yugioh, I was confused why Skill drain was hated, but royal decree and imperial order were fine(-ish). "Maybe you should play Dust Tornado or other trap cards that can destroy it?" What I failed to take into consideration is the game should never be a rock-paper-scissors between meta, stun and meta with enough concessions to beat stun. The meta has long been "special summon monsters from the extra deck", simply because they are always available. There is a choice between which ones to include, which one to summon, and decisions and risks to take. And unlike the choices of solemn cards and risks of gamble, all of the choices are fun, while main deck decisions often boil down to "did I draw the card I need". Playing decks that special summon from the extra deck as their win condition is fun to play and watch, stun is not. Even if the meta is toxic and any other deck sits on Bagooska to compete, that is still more fun than flipping a skill drain. It was time to let fussilier dragon go. And would you look at that, the same reason why yugioh is so monster focused and that is good, is the same reason that maxx c is bad: every fun strategy nowadays special summons from the extra deck, playing a non-special summoning strategy just to play around maxx c isn't. (This isnt a direct attack against stun or floo on ladder, I know this is mainly Konami's fault.)

[@AndresGonzalez-zu4um]

the thing is. monster , special sumons. and draw . so like unless there is a new mecanic that lets you like. LP summon or something stupid. max C is gonna be stronk

[@AndresGonzalez-zu4um]

like is like making an mtg deck that punishes people for playing any type of mana since people are planning to manny mana rocks

[@blahmaster6k]

This is the best and funniest video about Maxx C ever. Thanks Hardleg.

[@balakay5084]

"YOUR MOTHER LOSES TO MAX C" - Hardleg gaming 2023

[@ItsZorroDood]

They can't ban Maxx "C" because the card was designed by John Konami's granddaughter, and she would cry if they banned it.

[@Anaheylaatyahoo]

Here's one you can't debunk: I want to use it. ;p Oh shit, you actually did debunk it. LMAO.

[@BigPapaGanda]

I like Maxx-C. I am 100% ok with losing 10% of the matches because of the bug, I'm losing 60% of the matches I'm playing anyways. I can't wait for them to ban the bug, the Tears, and almost all of the floodgates (and I play all those trash cards)

[@thestoneskipper3377]

Liking and commenting to fuel the algorithm so this reaches as many people as possible. The Earth Insect cannot stay legal.

[@silverstein4697]

Your best masterpiece since bunzilla. I'll spread it as far and wide as I can.

[@michael_betts]

I basically only play master duel during events that have maxx c banned, if I become aware of them. I hate the deck building tax.

[@JJSquirtle]

Preach Mr. Hardleg! You have created a video I will find constant use for

[@warrockenjoyer2170]

It may just be me, but it feels like every time I draw Maxx C, it's when my opponent already special summons their end board turn 1, and when I use it, my opponent has Ash, Called By and or Crossout. Sometimes all at the same time

[@LunarWingCloud]

At first I thought this was gonna be in defense of Maxx "C" and I was like "oh boyyyy..." but I am glad people are forming systematic arguments why Maxx "C" really should not exist in today's game, it's so silly what it can do just by existing.

[@emred4653]

love the video especially the editing of lighting round

[@costelinha1867]

Maxx C Defenders: "Maxx C can be countered" Me: "Sure, do you know what else could be countered as well? THE DRAGON FUCKING RULERS! YET THAT DIDN'T STOP THEM FROM DOMINATING THE META BACK IN THE DAY, DID IT?!

[@TheAusar]

"The OCG has maxx C and is completely fine" - And so many of their players also hate the bug.

[@XoxoKawaiiGirl]

At this point you'd think they were being paid off to keep Maxx C in the game.

[@caligon5921]

I hate how many people have the mindset "complaining wont help". Complaining, in the end, is still criticism. EVERYTHING needs criticism. To improve, or to convey the community's opinions, be they valid, overreactions or otherwise. Complaining is good, there should always be more of that. Even if you like something, if there is a problem, it is perfectly healthy for you and even the developer/creator, to express it. Preferably constructively, of course, but even the bad can contain useful or valid information.

[@ChadKakashi]

Greatest yugioh video in existence. The lightning round was glorious.

[@matteoc83]

One of the worst part about maxx c is that if you activated it and the card resolves, if you opponent does at least some summons to do not end the turn on a empty board there is the not so low probability to draw another maxx c that you can activate in the next turn. The amount of advantage that resolving a maxx c give to you is insane, if your opponent does not play floo ofc.

[@dr4gonblitz]

Great vid I really hope Konami listens and makes their game better

[@Straven93]

They won't

[@ellachino4799]

hahahaha I remember when I thought Konami could do this. not dumping on you, I'm just so done with Konami's "balancing."

[@Alma-kz4zo]

This was better than I thought, well done, Joe! Here's hoping that someone at Konami can hear it.

[@Keldeo-gx]

they will never listen without fail

[@italianradio6148]

I'm down for whatever format involves more Goblin Joe videos.

[@olivoliv-cr8om]

I always thought of Maxx c as Upstart goblin + turn skip/winda Pot of greed + summon limit Etc It’s basically a floodgate attached to a draw spell

[@Z3i0]

Konami should make an event titled as No Maxx C, that will be spectacular!

[@Partypoopersgroup]

Every argument to not ban Maxx C feels almost like a flat earth argument. Like, its intuitive in the moment. 'You can't see the curve of the earth!' because we're small things standing on it shit. Its something that you can believe if you don't think about it or refuse to believe otherwise, despite how little it actually makes sense.

[@mikehobbes6600]

The bug is a win condition in it's own. Gives the illusion that dark magician or blue eyes decks are good, but in reality those decks sucks.

[@fangspecter2232]

eh....i'v faced some strong blue eyes decks, its just i rarely see them thanks to that damn bug....

[@troytheboy1985]

Gave a blue eyes player 20 cards and he bearly won I wish I just play floodgates but I don't stop when the wind statue gone but that game still annoys me.

[@andreobarros]

The only 'strong' blue eyes deck i ever faced was when the guy just drew the blue-eyes exodia. With d-shifter on my draw-phase, followed by dark-hole on his main phase, combo -ing off with prohibition naming ash, and finally the OTK spell. As for dark magician they can be ok sometimes. Depending on your hand, their full combo is kinda annoying having destruction protection for the entire board + some kind of followup/negation.

[@troytheboy1985]

@@andreobarros he had 20 cards i killed the normal blue eyes lines then he pen summoned and I was like isnt that some sh the deck wasn't better the fact the bug gave him so many cards and if I just turned ended it would of been a lost

[@Mernom]

It would say it's not that the Bug is poorly designed, it was just not future proofed. In the past, the value of 1 lost turn/a couple of draws was nowhere near as game ending as it is now. So taking or skipping the challenge was an actual choice. In today's game, it either needs a massive errata/remaster, or a ban.

[@jeanpitre5789]

Just needs a ban. Konami doesn't really errata anymore. They find its better to just replace cards with more modern versions of older cards, or archetype specific versions of those cards.

[@_Asleep_]

I'm really loving the video quality, and backgrounds 👀

[@ChrisPhelior]

People unironically defending a card that hogs 20% of almost every deck out there is actually kinda funny.

[@Shad_216]

I don’t even use the 1 Maxx C I have and I don’t have a problem with it fr. I win against more times than not and I always play HERO or Gimmick Puppet decks.

[@ChrisPhelior]

@@Shad_216 That's great for you, but why are you replying to a 9 month old comment?

[@commodore0648]

Let’s all leave Master Duel and play against ten random opponents on EDO Pro. We can test it out, show us how it works and hopefully…..we’ll have a little fun

[@GearGuardianGaming]

currently theres only about 11% as many players on MD as there were the first month. pretty sure most have gone on to either quit the game entirely or just not play on MD.

[@sloppyjoe5263]

​@@GearGuardianGaming what a surprise, Maxx c unlimited, being ur rarity, in a bo1 format that also lags about a year behind ocg card releases is making people quit in hordes, who would have thought.

[@misterghoul9457]

10:27 hardleg predicting the future where rhongo and bishbalkin are banned

[@Teixas666]

lets bereal Rhongo should have never been legal in MD as for bishbaalken i suspect the ban is preemptive for when they inevitably release Crimson dragon. otherwise they should have hit machu mech ot target the cause rather than the symptoms.

[@NickersonGeneral]

Yeah, I'm not sure I agree with Hardleg's analysis that maxx c was what enabled Rhongo to be legal. The vast majority of games I played against Rhongo Turbo decks, the issue was often more than it required a LONG combo to bring him out that was prone to bricking, highly vulnerable to interruption, and didn't have much wiggle room if it was unable to summon it's end boss. Maxx C certainly makes that more of a slaughter fest, but even without it a well time ash blossom could cripple the deck.

[@lie218]

I still wait for the first good Argument in the video even it's already over

[@GreyVictory1510]

I stand by my old take: make it so Maxx "C" can only be activated AFTER 5 special summons. Make it be an actual counter against heavy combo decks! Or ban it in MD.

[@donjuan6996]

A way to fix Master Duel is to shut it down.

[@antman7673]

That is a pretty objective list. Maxx C being either vanities emptiness or pot of greed, is just the pinnacle of the argument. After giving 3 card draws to the opponent, I cannot continue my turn by combos. Either effect or a combination of both is way too powerful.

[@Ahamkeira]

Really hope this does anything. Really really hope

[@shannoncrawford808]

It’s probably won’t

[@gerharddamm5933]

I really hope MD bans it (doubt it) and the OCG sees the light

[@GearGuardianGaming]

according to interviews, they have seen the light. its just far away and reflected off the eyes of a certain cockroach.

[@TheMemphisxlr8]

I expect someday Konami will unban Maxx "C" in the tcg, just because they can.

[@Ragnarok540]

If they want to kill the game, sure.

[@juancamacho8736]

Chaotic evil route

[@moorejim13]

Imagine someone sees this video at Konami and Unbanns Maxx C just to spite hardleg

[@alicepbg2042]

will literally stop playing.

[@hughjass2640]

Maxx C to 1, the most evil timeline.