1776 - "Cool, Considerate Men" (1972 Film Clip)

Not a Sondheim video, but I felt this was important to have on KZbin, especially in the current political climate. Enjoy the song that made Richard Nixon so angry he had his pal Jack Warner cut it out of the film behind the director's back.

[@Mousy677]

The look on the Courier's face when he arrives to discover that the Continental Congress has apparently turned into a ballet class absolutely cracks me up.

[@ripple-effect-mlp]

"General Washington, sir. I must report that I am deeply disturbed by my most recent journey to Philadelphia and back." "Why, boy? Did the British Crown already level Philadelphia without our foreknowledge?" "No, General, sir. The Congress was engaged...in a most disturbingly serene dance." "Dear God, we are doomed..."

[@Drod6969]

From the start of this villain song, Dickenson starts off smiling and becomes progressively more venomous and sinister until he is yelling his lines at the end

[@lilliedoubleyou3865]

Love the character but at the same time I cringe that the show felt the need to turn one of our founding fathers into an antagonist. He wasn’t for fighting but was still one of our Founding Fathers after all.

[@PhoenixFires]

Dickinson is misrepresented here. He was only a pacifist in that he believed the US should not strike first, but gladly joined the military and stopped contending the move for independence when Britain landed forces in America.

[@FrankSinatraTheSecond]

And he was a quaker

[@anoldradio]

Roaring “in a sane and lucid manner, we are cool!” At the end highlights the hypocrisy the song tries to display.

[@rickwrites2612]

​@@anoldradio yea, it's the only time his conservatives aren't the total opposite of modern conservatives.

[@waynemacfarland1546]

The look on that messenger boy's face when he shows up to deliver a message from George Washington, only to discover everyone in Congress singing and doing ballet is pure gold!

[@kiah9085]

POV you’re president Nixon and hate watching for the 8532 time

[@raebaer8580]

they don’t have youtube in hell

[@maddysdaddystevem563]

@@raebaer8580 Kennedy had Marilyn Monroe killed so she wouldn't spill the beans on their affair as she had threatened to do if he didn't leave his wife. The Clintons have suicided practically everyone they've ever met. Obama funded Iran in their mass murders and Biden, besides having to drop out of 2 presidential races for lying and plagiarism and said that he didn't want his kids going to an integrated school because it would be a racial jungle. Nixon is a saint compared to them.

[@rach4752]

I CACKLED

[@stellakowalski1]

lol🤣🤣🤣

[@ForgottenHonor0]

​@@raebaer8580The Devil has a special arrangement. 😈

[@beakedmonk3981]

When even the song sung by the antagonists is catchy, you know you've got a damn good musical on your hands.

[@ShabbatBox]

Incredible- was just reading a DePauw University article today about the history of this musical. It was released in 1969, in a deeply divided country, torn by the Vietnam War, Nixon, and mistrust of the government. Howard De Silva, who played Benjamin Franklin, performed with the rest of the cast in the White House and the next day was protesting outside the White House against the Vietnam War. Despite the intense divide, this musical attracted both sides, who yes, saw it through different lenses but also found the same hope in this act of America's foundation - the Declaration of Independence.

[@kennethwayne6857]

Talk about the show attracting both sides, it was also a hit in London.

[@dovbarleib3256]

Nixon got this particular song removed from the final release of this musical because of its insinuation that Conservative "rightwing" men were villainous. Most if not all of the other musical numbers in 1776 remained, but this one was cut out.

[@michaelray4033]

I just love Hancock throughout the whole thing: he just sits there smoking and reading; he's probably thinking: "Whatever guys."

[@oliverbrownlow5615]

That's David Ford, familiar to *Dark Shadows* fans as Maggie Evans' father, Sam Evans.

[@dkupke]

He’s used to watching these peacocks strut and preen and has long since stopped being impressed by it. He also appreciates that things are a lot further along than these men want to admit and they were already past the point of no return.

[@oliverbrownlow5615]

@@dkupke Hancock, as you may know, was one of the richest men in Colonial America himself -- the equal in every sense of the "Cool, Considerate Men."

[@dkupke]

@@oliverbrownlow5615 they address that in the number. And Hancock brushes them off and tells them things are a lot different than they appreciate. The very fact they were debating the viability of independence meant there was no going back.

[@AlyaaWNDL]

​@@dkupkeyea

[@MicheleHuffman-d8c]

I totally love this. These are the kind of movies that take your breath away.

[@toddposton869]

"I HAVE A NEW DISPATCH!.... Dear sir, We have been trying to reach you about your vehicle's factory warranty."

[@_somerandomguyontheinternet_]

Glad this was added back into the director’s cut! I get that it was considered too controversial for the theatrical release, but it’s too great to leave out.

[@thewkovacs316]

only controversial to nixon....who saw it as a critique of the modern right wing

[@_somerandomguyontheinternet_]

@@thewkovacs316 it’s a critique of conservatism and the role it plays in society.

[@oliverbrownlow5615]

It was not cut for being too controversial. It was *censored* at the request of President Richard M. Nixon.

[@Concetta20]

This will always be my favorite movie and musical. I’m also a big history buff and I really appreciate how the musical/movie of course takes liberties for creative storytelling purposes, they did capture the mood of the time, the uncertainty, the clashing perspectives, the idealism, the risks and actually quoting letters in the lyrics. It also forever cemented John Adams as my favorite founding father and HBO’s John Adams just deepened that favoritism. 😆

[@tremorsfan]

Apparently it was the “forever to the right” line that really set Nixon off.

[@jayo1212]

It's not even historically accurate! The "left" and the "right" were coined in the French Revolution.

[@riversong4997]

Anything that pissed off Nixon is all right in my book! 🤣

[@TehMomo_]

@@riversong4997 Nixon's snowflakery walked so Trump's could run...

[@thewkovacs316]

it was the line, "most men with nothing would rather protect the possibility of becoming rich, than face the reality of being poor"

[@lilliedoubleyou3865]

Do you think he was confused by the anachronism? 😂

[@dangelo1369]

Donald Madden ("John Dickinson") (1933-1983) had been a successful Broadway stage actor for years, and made a couple of appearances on TV. He was the only actor who didn't play the role in the original Broadway production. This was his first and only movie he ever made.

[@Johanna.EG.]

That's not entirely true. Betty Buckley was replaced by Blythe Danner in the movie, and John Collum was a replacement Rutledge on stage. Several other supporting actors were also not in the original cast. But bravo for producing a movie that, on the whole, retained the Broadway cast!

[@dangelo1369]

@@Johanna.EG. Correction; noted

[@dangelo1369]

@@Johanna.EG. A pity that such a talent as Virginia Vestoff died young and basically isn't well known nowadays.

[@senorsardonico6153]

Looks and sounds amazingly like Phil Hartman.

[@AethelredTheReady]

Martha Jefferson's actress isn't the same. Nor is Jefferson's. Nor Franklin's.

[@kt9166]

Wonderful, classic movie from one of the best plays ever written! I was fortunate enough to work in a theatre where it showed in 1972. I loved it so much that I recorded the movie on audio cassette and played that to death until the VHS and then the DVD arrived.

[@carldamacion3740]

When I was a kid I happened to turn the movie on while it was playing TV. It was in progress so I didn't know how much of movie I had missed. Turns out I hadn't missed anything because the song that was playing was when i had first flicked the channel was Sit down John. I bought the script in paperback and I learned the Sit-down John speech. After that first year I noticed that a local station would play this movie every fourth of July weekend, and like I would do during telecasts of West Side Story or the Sound of Music, I sat there with my tape recorder and recorded the musical numbers off the TV speakers as the movie was telecast. My favorite numbers were Sit down John, He plays the Violin and the Egg.

[@silvereagle2061]

The camera work here is just amazing.

[@FranciscoNieves-db8hi]

My guy what in the flying fuck are you talking about?

[@silvereagle2061]

@@FranciscoNieves-db8hi The camera as it slowly moved through the choregraphed dance number.

[@danielhalem5799]

Yes the camera work is incredible. Especially that steady cam one-shot of them dancing to the dispatch. Wonder how big the cameras were back then?

[@oliverbrownlow5615]

@@danielhalem5799 Fun fact: the Steadicam first became available in 1975, too late for use in this movie.

[@WillScarlet16]

“Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.” - John Steinbeck

[@kingbadmovie]

Amazing but slightly misleading, sadly.

[@kingbadmovie]

@colorado121 Capitalism currently has taken root in Russia. Your comment is outdated.

[@kingbadmovie]

@colorado121 So you are quoting yourself pre-1968 about something never happening in Russia that by 2021 had happened in Russia?

[@kingbadmovie]

@colorado121 Also you can't tell me to read your comment more carefully when you change it after the fact, sport.

[@WillScarlet16]

@colorado121 Clearly you know nothing about conditions in Tsarist Russia.

[@95DarkFire]

2:52 this part is just amazing. The drama of the oncoming invasion set against the phantomime of the rich men who don't care.

[@Lina-py5wm]

"Most men with nothing would rather protect the possibility of becoming rich than face the reality of being poor" Yeesh this has continued to age beautifully

[@dmiller2036]

When they dance during the dispatch its amazing

[@wyominghome4857]

I resisted watching this initially, because I thought the writing of the Declaration of Independence to be a peculiar choice for a musical. I have since come to realize how brilliant it is and what an insight into the times. My husband and I watch it every July 4th (and 2-3 times during the year) along with the six-part PBS documentary "Liberty! The American Revolution," which is also brilliant. They are tutorials on the founding of our country, and this is my favorite song in the film. Listen to John Hancock, one of the richest men in the colonies, when he says to John Dickinson, "Traitors to what? To the British Crown or the British half-crown? Fortunately there are not enough men of property in America to dictate policy". There are now.

[@kimlerner389]

Absolutely love "Liberty! The American Revolution"

[@jwolff5377]

I think times have changed and there are Enough men of property in America to dictate policy now, very sad.

[@kenleonard7739]

" But don't forget that most men with nothing would rather protect the possibility of becoming rich than face the reality of being poor. And that is why they will follow us!"

[@amandabearss797]

This line sadly runs through my head far to often when I look at the news. Also “to the right, forever to the right…”

[@Ele_Underscore]

@@amandabearss797 Same. I'm glad this art exists and am supremely proud of the acting in this scene which all goes to express the childish greed exhibited on the right

[@kenleonard7739]

@@amandabearss797 It's such a great statement about reality ...

[@themaybeso6117]

.

[@lilliedoubleyou3865]

Okay but what’s inherently wrong with that statement? The American way was to see prosperity as within reach.

[@marshmallowrockets]

Thank you so much for giving KZbin this scene when there isn’t any video of it.

[@mlbrooks4066]

This scene is in the DVD version. Nixon convinced the producer to eliminate it from the theatre version and to destroy the copy of this scene, but someone in the production company saved it and held onto it, to come up with it when the DVD came out Nixon was out of power.

[@potroastpig]

Bless the production staff member who chose not to destroy the clip - losing this would have been a travesty

[@MrGumby385]

Having played Dickinson twice, I can unbiasedly say this is the best song in the show. 😃

[@mlbrooks4066]

It's certainly one you can do the most with, but I love that it was not the first act closer - putting "Mama, Look Sharp," so sad and subdued, right after this and just before intermission, was a knockout choice.

[@MrGumby385]

@@mlbrooks4066 I played The Courier many years ago before playing Dickinson, so I agree with you 😀

[@jackbuckley7816]

Clever rhyming structure. I used to think the songs in this musical didn't hit the mark in a traditional sense, as the tunes & lyrics seemed rather clunky & not all that melodic. One critic referred to the movie as depicting "an off-key revolution". Upon repeated viewings over the years, however, I've come to appreciate & enjoy the songs & lyrics. The one I find the catchiest, the most melodically memorable, is "He Plays the Violin". It now would be difficult if not impossible for me to imagine "1776" without all its songs now, each having its own particular value to the plot, several of which are quite moving, off-key or not!

[@74umgrad]

Nice post. The song which says it all for me is "Molasses to Rum". It's the heart of the show, memorably sung in the film by John Cullum as Edward Rutledge. Cullum wasn't the original Rutledge on Broadway, but, as I recall, he sang more performances of it on Broadway than any other actor.

[@Dawg-Bone]

“We are COOL!” John Dickinson shouted

[@josephoconnor7148]

“Fortunately, there are not yet enough men of property in America to dictate policy.”

[@that0nerandomperson374]

Except that though there are few, they are the few whom make up some of those dictating policy. Darn...

[@janetplanet4595]

The line that follows explains Donald Trump

[@thevampirefrog06]

Ironically voting irl was limited to white men with property back then. Poor (also white) men didn't have the vote in most states until the 1820s.

[@Enterprise-D666]

“Well, perhaps not. But don't forget that most men with nothing would rather protect the possibility of becoming rich than face the reality of being poor. AND THAT IS WHY THEY WILL FOLLOW US….!”

[@dkupke]

Fun fact: the first advocate of a tax on inherited wealth-was Thomas Paine. He saw it as necessary to prevent a landed gentry from cropping up in the infant nation. The inheritance tax was repealed by a certain relatively recent president who is himself the product of inherited wealth.

[@nman625]

4:52 "... Don't forget that most men with nothing would rather protect the possibility of becoming rich than face the reality of being poor." I've been a life long Republican and nothing has shaken those GOP ideals I've had for so long. But this scene and this line really did. My mother always skipped this scene when I was growing up. I believe the reason given was that the song was too boring.

[@dangelo1369]

Actually it was taken out by Jack Warner himself at the behest of Richard Nixon who viewed it privately and was offended by this number "Cool, Considerate Men. It was restored with other scenes in later years.

[@boxman7044]

Also it isn’t a matter of partisan ideals it is rooted in both parties you clearly don’t understand the nature of American politics they are both snakes which we take the venom of be sure to choose the lesser of the evils friend. That’s why I vote out of necessity and of fear that inaction is what led us here first

[@kingbadmovie]

@@boxman7044 True, but I feel you missed the point. The platform of "cool conservative men" isn't confined to one political party, but rather the concept that if people voted in their best interest instead of anticipation of an "American dream" that they otherwise cannot hope to obtain, "conservative" ideals would never take hold in the common voting populace. Instead, most people want to keep lower taxes for the rich in perceived anticipation that they will one day be rich, rather than vote for higher taxes for the rich so the bus they ride to work might have AC in summer.

[@boxman7044]

@@kingbadmovie nonono read his comment again he specifically targets one political party I see them both for what they are they lie,cheat, and manipulate and it all really started with good ole Lyndon b Johnson and Nixon

[@kingbadmovie]

@colorado121 how would it describe socialism?

[@russelljaffe8901]

Paul Hecht played it on stage and was on the cast recording . He also Performed it at The White House in front of Nixon, Nixon wanted it cut then...Hecht was quoted as saying ... " I sang it with Brechtian vigor ..and dare I say Venom!" lol...Hecht sang it wonderfully on the cast recording..Donald Madden is great in the film...I would have loved to have seen Hecht in the role on film.

[@Zarastro54]

I prefer Madden to be honest. He has an almost livid arrogance to his performance.

[@toddposton869]

Interesting fact: This musical came out some four years before General Washington received his last promotion to six star general.

[@Mxyzptlksac]

As a kid, seeing the play I loved the dance and only to the right. Very clever

[@scottgarver5782]

The scene Nixon had removed from the film. This is the first time I've found it on KZbin in years !!!!

[@maestroclassico5801]

It is on the DVD extended/Director Cut

[@thenecessaryevil2634]

This is one of three songs Nixon wanted cut from the film 'Mother, look sharp' about a young boy soldier bleeding to death while his mother searches for him. The Vietnam War was still going on and conscription of college age boys was doubled that year, so not thoughts he wanted people to have. 'Sugar to rum' calls out the northern colonies hypocrisy about slavery. Sugar was grown in the south, but Rum was mostly made in northern factories (Portland, Maine/then still part of Massachusetts, was basically rum factories, warehouses and a lot ship building docks until a warning shot during the war of 1812 hit one and burned the city down.)

[@mariewoodruff1995]

6:38 to 43 appears to show one of the few times that Judge Wilson enjoyed being with Dickinson.

[@CurtisAmusements]

"Times Change, People Don't"...

[@mlbrooks4066]

Nixon hated this song. He found it too anti-conservative and detested the goose step. He convinced the producer to cut it and to destroy the clip, so it wasn't in the movie as presented in the theaters, but someone in the production company saved it and it was restored for the DVD.

[@J.B24]

This is my favorite number in the whole play.

[@thomasbaleno5822]

Got this Blu-Ray of this movie at Christmas. Loved the costumes!!!!

[@ScottAllenFinance]

The musical accompaniment in the last "to the right" section is so brilliant.. it's hard to describe in words how accurately it describes the perception of the modern right wing. Sherman Edwards' underrated as heck.

[@groovygirl23]

Genius. Brilliantly describes 1776, 1972 and 2022. "The more things change..."

[@LadyMoonsparrow]

Watching this in 2022! I saw the movie when it first came out and loved it. I knew this was in that movie because it was my favorite but later, watching it on tv I was amazed to see it had been cut. Later learned about Nixon not liking the song.. etc. It is perfect for our times. Cool Cool Conservative men-ruining peoples lives.

[@dangelo1369]

Some famous actors came out of this: William Daniels (John Adams); Howard DaSilva (Benjamin Franklin); Ken Howard (Thomas Jefferson) also, Howard Caine (Lewis Morris) played "Major Hochsteader" on Hogan's Heroes; John Cullum (Edward Rutledge) would go on to "Northern Exposure"; James Noble (Rev. John Witherspoon) from "Benson".

[@edwinhill9410]

Dasilva had been an established actor in Hollywood and on the stage in the 40s. But was blacklisted.I believe 1776 marked his return to the big screen in a role he is forever identified with. The best screen portrayal of Benjamin Franklin

[@Invictus13666]

@@edwinhill9410 well, you’re almost right. He was an actor...so you got that okay. And he was blacklisted, for a minute (but still worked steadily)...really, would a moment’s research be too much to ask before you vomit forth billshit?

[@paulnowak9030]

And Gwenyth Paltrow! Blythe Danner was pregnant with her during filming ;)

[@oliverbrownlow5615]

Howard da Silva was the Jud Fry in the original Broadway cast of Rodgers & Hammerstein's *Oklahoma!* (1943).

[@carolbrown5561]

@@Invictus13666 He was blacklisted from film for far too many years and only earned a living doing theatre (Where we, of the theatre do not blacklist!)

[@philippassanante3497]

So happy to see this song -- and this scene -- restored. I'm not sure why this song "agitated" Mr. Nixon as it did. It isn't disrespectful in any way. And it's a catchy tune. Thank you for sharing.

[@HistoryTeacherSteve]

Yes, it is disrespectful, and it's great. It's literally meant to be disrespectful of Nixon's Republican Party. And rightly so!

[@gerstelb]

The line about men with nothing preferring to protect the possibility of becoming rich rather than face the reality of being poor strikes pretty much at the heart of the modern right wing.

[@j.f.forests4506]

and that's why I just forwarded this to everyone I know!@@gerstelb

[@mlbrooks4066]

Nixon also got really ticked off at the goose step.

[@Stand_By_For_Mind_Control]

1:15 That dude sitting there massaging the end of his cane really looks like the 'bros before hos' meme dude.

[@paulc8205]

I love how Massachusetts (except Mr. Hancock), New Hampshire, Connecticut, Rhode Island, Delaware (except Mr. Read), New Jersey, Maryland and Virginia's delegates aren't seen in this scene. I feel like some of these guys we only see for this song lol! Great song though!! Love this movie!

[@mlbrooks4066]

The Maryland delegation was sent off to see the troops, to see if they really would fight.

[@manramen]

"Most men with nothing would rather protect the possibility of becoming rich than face the reality of being poor." True sir, until they realize that there was never a possibility, then they will do ANYTHING.

[@ronclark7570]

America to this day. The same failed logic that will end this country

[@DMCMT01]

Can someone explain to me why this screams Villian song I bloody love it!

[@dancingshiva7008]

Cause it is 😊 These dynamics are still very much alive and well in American politics.

[@pdes_]

Because that's what it was designed to be. The guy in the green coat is the play's antagonist. This is his, quote, 'villain' song.

[@kingbadmovie]

@@pdes_ Interesting the main antagonist is the Pennsylvanian loyalist and not the South Carolinian slaver.

[@sstuddert]

@@kingbadmovie The South Carolinian slaver is one of the reprehensible elements of the traditional way of life that the Pennsylvanian loyalist is trying to protect.

[@1940semochild]

@@kingbadmovie Always found that interesting about the movie.

[@katrose5179]

The song was originally called Cool, Conservative Men. Of course it made Nixon furious.

[@jakeg3126]

Because no one understood they were talking about the vote board on the wall anymore

[@Mathadar]

@@jakeg3126 Not just that, but the term used left and right for the song wasn't just for the board, but related to something that hadn't happened yet. The French Revolution. The anti-royalist revolutionaries seated themselves to the presiding officer’s left, while the more conservative, aristocratic supporters of the monarchy gathered to the right. So, indeed these conservatives, not to be confused with classical liberalism which would be considered more modern conservatism in the U.S., would go to the right, as they were not the anti-royalist revolutionaries like John Adams, Benjamin Franklin and company. So, they therefore gathered to the right, it matches with the song. Sorry to go on a long rant, but I have to explain this scene often to people.

[@jakeg3126]

@@Mathadar that is cool, I didn't hear that yet.

[@sosayweall_jpg]

@@Mathadar 'So, indeed these conservatives, not to be confused with classical liberalism which would be considered more modern conservatism in the U.S.' Im a little confused by this.. i understand the political left/right terminology didn't appear until the French Revolution, so the use of the term in this song is anachronistic (though that shouldn't be that big a problem) but the aforementioned statement trips me up. are you saying that the "cool considerate" conservative men of this song do not resemble the modern conservatives? Classical liberalism ideology applies both to modern conservatives as well as these folk, wouldn't you agree?

[@mlbrooks4066]

Dickinson calls them "cool, cool conservative men" at the beginning of the song. Lots to things made Nixon furious about this scene. The goose step dance sent him to the moon.

[@waltermlane9664]

Little did they know that eventually they would lose their money, property and whatever else once the King's armies marched over their homes.

[@mrblanche]

Cool, cool CONSERVATIVE men. Removed from the play for fear of reprisals from Nixon.

[@that0nerandomperson374]

Removed _at the request of_ Nixon. But yeah.

[@redbrian3655]

Removed from the movie, not the play.

[@mrblanche]

@@redbrian3655 Yes, that is correct.

[@kingbadmovie]

Back when presidents and artists had basic respect for one another. Not sure if that was a darker or lighter time.

[@that0nerandomperson374]

@@kingbadmovie I suspect you misunderstood hehe, the president Nixon here was doing the opposite of having basic respect for artists and their art by having the song and this entire scene removed from those old releases of the film. We only have this scene thanks to someone storing it away although it was not meant to be kept.

[@johnweber4577]

It’s amazing just how many people joined in the same minuet yesterday.

[@dovbarleib3256]

Trump trying to save what is right about America? The Left now, today, believes neither in a Creator nor in the Rights that He endowed. There is an Abyss separating John Adams from Bernie.

[@carldamacion3740]

"How'd you like to try and borrow a dollar from one of them?"

[@nickroberts1596]

Congress has always been rich people preening about how much money they have. Nothing’s changed in 248 years.

[@paulc8205]

Well, John Dickinson was wrong. John Adams is not seen as a traitor!

[@Tuliotrivinooficial]

John Dickinson never said that, this film is not historically correct.

[@paulc8205]

@@Tuliotrivinooficial I know lol. I'm talking in the context of the film. :)

[@johnweber4577]

@@TuliotrivinooficialYeah, as great as the movie is, it does character assassinate the genuinely pacifistic Quaker Dickinson.

[@marknewkirk4322]

Of course, the idea of a political "right" and "left" is anachronistic. The terms were coined in Paris almost a generation later than these events.

[@mlbrooks4066]

It's common, in stage productions of this show, for the dancers in this number to move only to the right. They look and move to the left here and there in this clip.

[@Ndsl710]

They are moving to their right

[@youtuuba]

Odd that multiple commenters claim there is "ballet" here. They are doing a "minuet"!

[@toobin8r]

The way they tease the first notes of the Star-Spangled Banner feels intentional

[@warblerab2955]

How would you like to try and borrow a dollar from one of them?

[@waltermlane9664]

Now it would be How would you like to try and be a member of one of Trump's country clubs?

[@MexicanNoEnglishFtw]

Did you all know that Nixon requested that this song be removed from the play due to it being critical against conservatism? It was only recently restored in this film after the producer, in his deathbed, said he regretted removing the song from the original play at the President's request.

[@geordi5054]

Then again it's quite understandable why it was removed. Why interject modern politics that polarize the audience on a piece meant to celebrate the creation America.

[@dragonfire7354]

@@geordi5054 Whilst it is true 1776 spends some time celebrating, it also spends a good amount of time questioning. This song, as well as Molasses to Rum are great examples of this. Also, to state the Landed Aristocracy were not interested in guarding their conservative interests in 1776 would be plainly incorrect. Whilst they wouldn't have used the term "to the right" (in the musical the attempt at justification, being that everyone in favor of independence in the room is on the left of the voting board.) to describe their beliefs, they would have shared many of the same sentiments as shared in this song. Edit: Clarification

[@coloradoing9172]

@@dragonfire7354 This scene is plainly incorrect in so many ways. First off, twisting Dickinson's character into an apathetic, rich 'conservative' who cares about nothing but preserving his own wealth and status - completely uncharacteristic of him. Dickinson was a progressivist quaker, he believed in equality, women's rights, and freed all his slaves. His opposition to independence was from his quaker belief that compromise was preferable to war, he fully supported independence after the rejection of the olive branch, abstaining from the vote unlike how this film portrays him. The writers twisted his character so as to blatantly attack conservatives. This piece completely ahistorical and unnecessary.

[@sosayweall_jpg]

@@coloradoing9172 with the main conflict being securing votes needed for a congressional measure, in this case adopting the declaration of independence, you need to amp up the drama. this dulls the complexity of real people into character representations and archetypes. Dickinson got the villain treatment here, yes, and it doesn't take into consideration those aspects of him. It would be a fair criticism if the point was to make a completely above the board historically accurate melodrama. but this is a broadway musical. you need heroes and villains and strife.

[@mlbrooks4066]

Not from the play, just from the film. I don't think Nixon ever saw the stage version. I worked in a production of the play in 1972 and this number was in there. Nixon convinced the producer of the film to remove this number and destroy the film, but someone in the production company saved it and got it back into the DVD version.

[@retept1104]

4:18 they totally just went to the left

[@crashvds777]

More important than ever now. ...also still better than Hamilton

[@kievmatwijcow4668]

yes very much better them hamiton

[@dangelo1369]

@@kievmatwijcow4668 Why? Because "Hamilton" doesn't match up with your generational expectations of what makes a musical? Then you must have absolutely hated "Jesus Christ Superstar" and "Oh! Calcutta!"

[@GeniTLK]

@@anirahtak2636 same here. i loved 1776 before hamilton, but i adore hamilton.

[@TimeandMonotony]

You can like both!

[@tanjakrone4147]

I agree! 1776 is great! I don't like Hamilton at all.

[@corvus1374]

The not-so-subtle goosestep.

[@admthrawnuru]

I mean, Major Hochstetter is there in a funny wig, so why not?

[@Donna-P]

"Facepalm" ...... it's a minuet ....

[@corvus1374]

@@Donna-P Right.

[@Mousy677]

a very different experience watching this after learning about dickinson's decades-long incredibly close friendship with charles thomson. (and about charles thomson's actual political views. suffice it to say that the real thomson would NOT have answered adams asking if he was on his side or dickinson's by taking a third option; he was very into independence.)

[@dashkostka9281]

POV: You just read Edmund Burke for a political philosophy class

[@Chipmunk216]

Burke was famously critical of the crown’s American policy, funnily enough.

[@ryanhadley2685]

one of my favorite songs from 1776 but for some reason this was cut out from the vhs and normal version

[@Taki_toad]

It was cut because Nixon told his buddy Jack Warner to cut it. He looked in a mirror and didn't like what he saw.

[@geordi5054]

@@Taki_toad Eh, at least back then the conservatives had the guts to cut it, no matter what its meaning was. If a scene like this was done today about the democrats, you can expect them to call it racist and have it boycotted by all the major publishers. Politics isn't a fair game, and the republicans have been playing too fair for too long. Today is the end result.

[@cromanticheer]

@@geordi5054 Lol, the mental gymnastics here. You came up with a bizarre hypothetical to try and say "the democrats are worse than Nixon!"

[@geordi5054]

@@cromanticheer Haha, did you really just say that? Watergate is child's play in today's political world. Just look at the ongoing trial with Hillary's attorney regarding her team lying to the FBI about the falsified Trump-Russia collusion, or the Hunter Biden laptop scandal. Nixon is remembered for Watergate, but he did a lot of good things that he doesn't get credit for. My comment simply pointed out that back then we had the guts and pull to play a dirty game, something that Democrats are constantly doing today.

[@madelinebitts2766]

@@geordi5054 A conservative president censored a film because it criticized his politics. You can make up all the fairy tales in your head you'd like about what *could* have happened but this is the fact of the matter, and one that needs repeating, apparently.

[@dale19532]

Sad commentary on our own times!

[@maestroclassico5801]

The next scene is where the dispatch boy sings "Momma Look Sharp". 2 contrasting scenes.

[@MasteringJohn]

As a song, I love it. The music and performances are all excellent. As a reflection of history, I think it's dreadfully unfair to Dickinson, and turns what was a conservative Quaker with a natural dislike for war and rather egalitarian notions on women's rights into a haphazardly projected strawman of mid-twentieth century Progressives' disdain for neoliberal Republicans. An unfortunate deformity in an otherwise excellent musical.

[@kimlerner389]

What great and prescient song!

[@jacobgarrity9055]

From 1776 to Hamilton the musical on Broadway today

[@milosantosuosso-ob2tl]

Hamilton made a reference to 1776 when Hamilton said “SIT DOWN JOHN YOU FAT MOTHERF*****”

[@lawrenceclemens8494]

What a great scene, what a showstopper it is. This scene's discovery (it was thought lost forever) was a great surprise to everyone. Studio head & producer Jack Warner cut it out of the film originally so it would not offend President Reagan and the conservative GOP party, shocking the film’s director and play's creators. It was thought permanently lost until an old Workprint was discovered in the studio archives..... the missing scene was intact. It was beautifully restored and put back into the new edition BLU-RAY, and so here it is today - a permanent part of the film, and always there whenever shown on TV. The director was said to be deliriously happy with its insertion to the film, as he considered this the best number. Moving ahead to Today, this sequence still has the force to comment upon the present, and the inaction of our President and Senate in these Coronavirus times. Note the lyrics "Never to exceed, Regulated speed - No matter what the need." Indeed, it seems prophetic.

[@karlaweidner4513]

Nixon was president in 1972, not Reagan.

[@admthrawnuru]

It is the best number, I love it. And I'm a conservative, so I find it odd Nixon would object... But then again he was a prickly jerk. Conservatism is the philosophy that change should be considered hard and resisted or at most implemented slowly, thus tends to favor the status quo. Consequently, the merit of that status quo is very relevant to the merits of conservatism. I would not have been a conservative in 1776, nor would many in the 1970s at least by their current philosophy, though I probably wouldn't have had the balls to be fully on board with Adams early on if I'm honest.

[@geordi5054]

If the need is to violate the civil rights of the population, I don't mind never exceeding regulated speed.

[@hudsony777]

I read that the editor who was tasked with removing the scene from the original negative did, but preserved the cut scene, rather than destroying it as ordered.

[@kevinwachs5905]

@@geordi5054, I believe that you are mistaken about the violation of civil rights. This group of conservatives were withholding their support for the struggle for the rights of Americans, rights that were violated by the Stamp Act, Townsend Act, Sugar Act and Tea Act, and the quartering of soldiers in private homes, etc. Furthermore, most of these cool, considerate, conservative congressmen were slaveholders. Their conservatism was not reluctance to trample civil rights; it was reluctance to endanger their personal, individual fortunes.

[@sstuddert]

This musical, hilariously, is apparently Ben Shapiro's favourite. I'm still unable to make sense of that.

[@yanivrubin4166]

Wait wot

[@sstuddert]

@@yanivrubin4166 Yeah. Exactly.

[@yanivrubin4166]

@@sstuddert wait this musical? Or this song?

[@sstuddert]

@@yanivrubin4166 The entire musical

[@yanivrubin4166]

@@sstuddert well, I mean, its still about *MURICA*

[@jburnaquatic]

This is my favorite song from the movie.

[@wolfrivergirl]

So good.

[@christineflowers9980]

I saw this movie for the first time in 1973, in the 6th grade. This is the scene and the song I loved the most. Somehow, 50 years later and given my political leanings, it makes sense. (But really, it’s a brilliant song.)

[@lucykeegan1160]

Who gave this a thumbs down?!?!?!?

[@chongqiu4225]

it's Nixon backs to life

[@kimwelch4652]

Cool Conservative men--listen to the words--not considerate. The song "ever to the right" was edited out of the original showing, but the political message was there.

[@paulacornelison243]

I have never seen this scene. It must have been cut out of the movie.

[@HCoons1975]

Still a powerful song and imagery.

[@amywilson3593]

Gerry Wilson remember this from my being in 1776 although I didn't do it though the film's samuel chase did

[@endersolo5332]

Sometimes I wish I could have seen Nixon's reaction to this

[@lailaplayz9908]

Bro why r they so colorful

[@Ubersaur]

"And that is why they will follow us to the right." 😳

[@HistoryMonarch1999]

Man I miss she movies and tv had more colorful clothing and setting instead of earthly colors and dirt roads of recent stuff in the same era

[@sampflugrath7601]

Correction: Sherman Edwards, not Sondheim.

[@AdmiralVonChaos]

In their defense I don’t want to think about how much a dollar would have been at that time, if the currency had existed yet lol.

[@maranocna2530]

A dollar back in 1776 would be around $36 in the 2024

[@presbyteriangirl9739]

Great song. I love this

[@presbyteriangirl9739]

The guy who starts the song is so good looking

[@Liz.ardman]

US government 2025 be like

[@robertmiskell8117]

I know it's meant to be an attack on conservatism, but I actually enjoy this a bit. I'm a monarchist, and this doesn't really phase me. It's healthy to have a bit of uncomfortable, satirical political imagery to help keep you humane, thoughtful, and humorous.

[@svenm7264]

Nixon had it cut from the command performance at the White House but even POTUS can't get scenes cut from films, the description has erred I daresay.

[@hipflipped]

The description is correct. it was actually cut from the movie and eventually restored for a home release. "Cool, Cool, Considerate Men" was cut from the film prior to its release and not included on the soundtrack recording nor on the first VHS tapes and laserdiscs. The Los Angeles Times stated "The song 'Cool, Cool, Considerate Men' depicts Revolutionary War-era conservatives as power-hungry wheedlers focused on maintaining wealth."[10] According to Jack L. Warner, the film's producer and a friend of President Richard Nixon, Nixon requested the song be removed. He apparently saw it as an insult, as it suggested the conservatives were hindering American independence as they danced a minuet singing the song that included the stanza,

[@svenm7264]

@@hipflipped It all depends what one means by conservative. The term is routinely applied to things it is not. For example, Southern Democrats who voted for the New Deal are relentlessly labeled "conservatives" in order to make certain people's narratives work.

[@THEZEKER1964]

I think the actor playing John Dickinson (Donald Madden) reminds me a lot of Phil Hartman.

[@waynemacfarland1546]

I guess everyone was just glad to finally get a break from John Adams for one.

[@animationfanatic2133]

More relevant every year, the cool, considerate men will all hold us back

[@jakeg3126]

I don’t know what party you are attacking there. I think your calling out Republicans but they aren’t cool with Democrats making fentanyl the #1 killer of people in their 20s and 30s and inflation being out the butt. However they are and were being considerate to people by doing the exact opposite. They also were more considerate when they were trying to allow us to not wear masks.

[@orapronobis1040]

How'd you like to try and borrow a dollar from one of them?

[@AtomicFreedom]

Nixon was such a creature. I believe he is more of a meme than the other more recent presidents

[@WolfhawkWildThings]

Almost makes me wonder if this couldn't be a cut scene from the Hogwarts series the way they all wave their sticks around.

[@GroovyShelly]

The song Nixon called Jack Warner about - and demanded it be cut from the film.

[@chasingdopamine616]

“How’d you like to try and borrow a dollar from one of them?” what a button

[@SavageArmitage]

WE ARE COOL!