2017 NEC - Switch - Neutral Connections [404.2] (14min:30sec)

[@i_am_macgyver84]

What I like most about this video is it brings up things I've been using as examples for a bunch of years now. I've worked with so many people that would bring up the updated code and how every switch needs a neutral. But those people never read past the main code and read the exceptions.

[@lovelygirl4561]

I agree / put the neutral in every switch box

[@igmusimba]

12min mark (put the neutral in every switch). I am sold. Most of my house wiring is already this way and putting in my smart switches was a breeze. I have 3 switches with no neutral and will have to damage the drywall to put a neutral in. All my head end outlets are now AFCI/GFCI (not just new bedroom as stated in the new 2005 NEC code). Plan for the future (neutral in every switch is the best idea).

[@lklucas70]

So by saying that we should go ahead and give the customer the extra wire at the start of a rough in to avoid an extra cost to them later is the same as me telling the car dealer I want the better tires and other options so I dont have to pay him for that later. The point of following the code is for safety. When did it turn in to doing it because of the "what ifs" .

[@TomCee53]

The key is that the chance of wiring using the ground is almost a certainty if a neutral doesn’t already exist.

[@bladnasternaster8607]

For the sake of simplicity, I would say just bring a neutral to every switch, not only because of the reasons you mentioned within this presentation, but also so that there can be no dispute because of the clarity. As also mentioned, its just easier to get it taken care of the first time through. I may have been on the fence at one time, but the last job I was on set me firmly in this mindset.

[@johnkimes1968]

Money

[@TomCee53]

Money is always a factor, but the likelihood of electronic switches in new construction makes it a no-brainer.

[@PhilipHousel]

I really appreciate these discussion panels. I enjoy learning not just what but why things should be done. Mike Holt has done well teaching the importance of the EGC.

[@russrockino-rr0864]

This should only be an issue in Residential Remodel and commercial/ industrial where you can't access existing MC Cable. Dead end Threeways in new residential can have 14-4 ran to them before wall cover. Switch loops in Commercial TI's can have EMT or 3 wire MC ran from overhead JB's down to the switch boxes. We as modern electricians, do not spider wire any more in Residential new construction, so neutrals are normally brought to each switch box any way. With the exception of the dead end 3 way, which can be ran with 14-4 if necessary. Thanks, Russ

[@Nahum17good]

I also agree with the neutral at every switch box. Another issue is, if an neutral is fished in later, what circuit is the neutral coming from?

[@MikeHoltNEC]

Good point...

[@bergdaniel6998]

Which is why it is just easier to run power to the switch first, instead of running power to the light and running a switch-leg down to the switch.

[@courant37]

Berg Daniel this is what I do anyway regardless. Power first hits the switch box first before heading to the fixtures via the switch.

[@Jeff-xy7fv]

Exactly! I hate switch loops, and I never use that wiring method in the first place, so these are all non-issues to me.

[@1stMBT]

100% agreed and been doing that way since the dimmable switch became a thing also with title 24??? I don't understand why we have to think about neutral in the box???it should be there always even if you don't have to.

[@5_fun_facts123]

Copy that.

[@samueltaylor4989]

Works with a single switch but not with 3 way and 4 way switches. You would need 4 wire cable or two lines or other means.

[@fitzdrew]

Mike - First of all, thank you for all your videos. Secondly - At 13:30 you say that oc sensors aren't going to be controlling receptacles. However, a lot of the newer energy codes require certain receptacles to be automatically switched/half switched/etc., and in this case I have used oc sensors on receptacles in the past. Thanks again, Mike.

[@walterbrown8694]

For decades ( I was doing electrical wiring in heavy industry in Harvey Illinois in the early '50s ) my standard practice was to run safety ground conductor to every fixture ("Yoke") in a circuit. Simple practice, and eliminates lots of "jaw boning" about whether ground conductors are required. All the cable in common use these days has either the bare copper conductor or one with green insulation. Have never used "de-rated" ground conductors - In conduits, ALL conductors were same gauge.

[@TomCee53]

Interesting, and I think it’s a good idea. FYI, there are motion sensors which use a voltage drop power supply. This does not require a neutral connection, but I’ve found that it does require at least 15 real watts to allow the required current to activate the switch. LED bulbs do not work reliably in this case.

[@MikeHoltNEC]

Please provide a 'link' to such a product. I'm not aware of this.

[@jeffreystroman2811]

Yeah, people will be putting current on a grounding conductor for next 15-20 years as new smartphone controls come out, many times I've "wished" a wall switch had a neutral.

[@metame3803]

At approximately 10:00 Brian states that he is ready to get on board with requiring neutrals in all switch boxes. I think the code requiring neutrals for the *future* *potential* implementation of occupancy sensors has the NEC overstepping its mission to ensure safe installations and instead has it regulating design, which it is not supposed to do. What if my design doesn't include occupancy sensors? Sure, it makes Lutron happy because it greases the skids for them to sell their products down the road, but it doesn't make me happy as a homeowner/buyer/builder trying to get/build a house for a reasonable price. I fail to see why a homebuilder/homeowner should have to put $$$ into extra infrastructure to appease a future owner's design tastes or the market expansion aspirations of lighting controls manufacturers. It's hard to see the argument that *all* switch boxes need a neutral for an occupancy sensor. Switches controlling a receptacle don't need an occupancy sensor. Switches controlling outdoor lighting don't need occupancy sensors. Furnace/boiler shutoff switches don't need occupancy sensors. I'm sure there are other examples. I am sure these guys all mean well. Mike Holt has done a lot for the education of electrical contractors. But it's exactly these kind of weak justifications and the waving away of cost increases as minor inconveniences as shown in this video which lead to unsustainable housing prices. "It will cost the homeowner less to do it now while the walls are open than it will in the future when they're closed". Well, that's only true if the homeowner in question actually wants the feature you're talking about. If they don't want it, then you've driven their present costs up unnecessarily. Does making everybody spend extra money now to save money for a few people in the future (people who likely did not pay the initial cost) just because they might want to install occupancy sensors seem fair or reasonable to you? It doesn't to me. 14/3 is expensive; 14/4 is expensive and hard to find. Other NEC rules that limit the number of current carrying conductors through bored framing holes means that in order to run 14/4 everywhere, a lot more holes are going to have to be drilled. And this neglects box fill issues all these extra conductors cause. So it's not just the extra cost for 14/4, it's the extra labor to drill all those holes and the challenges of doing so and not interfering with all the other trades or causing other design challenges. Is this really about safety? Is this really about saving energy? Or is it about increasing Lutron's bottom line?

[@MikeHoltNEC]

I totally get where you are coming from...

[@metame3803]

Mike, that's good. I am sure you do, for there are many in the industry who think along the same lines so I know you have heard it before. But who is standing up to the pressure of the manufacturers? Who on the Code Making Panel differentiates Necessity from Marketing? We get sold a bill of goods in the name of Safety and we're too dumb to see that it is more marketing than need.

[@chazman4461]

Metame, I agree 100% with you. I try to wire every lighting circuit with a neutral in the switch box either way. Just the way I was taught. However, most people I have come across have been hard to sell on smart devices due to cost and such, and sometimes its just not feasible to do this. This is the stuff that makes people wonder about the actual goal of the code panel and who they are looking out for. Are they looking out for Lutron, the board that enforces energy saving measures, or safety, or everyone's best interests?

[@jeffreystroman2811]

MetaMe thank you for taking the time to state that position so articulate, I was thinking it was a reasonable requirement, until I read your comment, thanks

[@richh9904]

Ground wire will be abused.

[@jimmccullough3831]

Excellent! Great Thinkers!

[@MikeHoltNEC]

Thank you kindly!

[@jolyonwelsh9834]

I normally use the black wire in the NM 12-3 cable as the common wire in a 3 way/ 4 way switch loop because the common terminal on a 3 way switch is always black.

[@musicalgear1024]

I feed switches first always. And when wiring 3 and 4 ways I use my first box to do all of the work. I run the feed in, possibly feed out, the switch leg, and the 3 conductor to this box. Simple quick and easy AND easy for trouble shooting down the road. So once this first switch is completed, the remaining are simple as 123. Occupancy sensors are even more simple. They are not used to switch the lights off really, but to switch them on. So the use of anything other than single pole occupancy sensors is really useless. I have used 5 to 7 of them on one large area where people can enter from a wide variety of places within that area and I use the singles along with contactors when needed to combine the circuits. . It works like a charm and there is never a need for a neutral inside the switching or occupancy sensor boxes in any case. The neutrals are ran between lights, into the panel, and a couple into the contactor box. So other than trouble shooting a poorly wired building or house, I really see no need in any "code" for such a thing.

[@MikeHoltNEC]

Thanks for your comment, I understand where you are coming from. The video discusses the reason for this rule starting at kzbin.info/www/bejne/lZ_SXnhuj7SenLMm56s. - Ryan Carlson

[@schatzemanly6749]

I don't like pulling power through the light fixture then to the switch. I bring power to the switch box first, thereby, I have my neutral there!

[@ronbonick4265]

also if EMF is really the issue then make a rule No panel boxes in the house, install in the garage or outside .. also security screws in the main panel cover - cause some kid might take dads screwdriver and take the cover off and get killed .. Ya can't stop stupid.- I can sit here and come up with a 100 rules that all sound good but in the end its all about price increases and profit. here's another rule and if you live in the mountains you'll understand - No more NM / romex cable used where mice are able to get to the wires They sharpen their teeth on the cables and cause safety issues . For now on houses need to be in conduit or swa . cause mice and cause fires .. thats more realistic then tamper proof outlets .oh all plug cords need to be twist lock cause some kid can easily pull the plug half out and touch or put their tongue in the cord pins .. I mean the other day I had a college educated woman ask me how tall and 8 ft ladder is .... Seriously. I say let the stupid in life eliminate the gene pool

[@chrisgabriele2500]

What is the name of that book on switching, they refer to in the beginning of the clip?

[@261Pro]

Good one Mike.. as an apprentice I was asked that question about the 5 story building lol.. when I heard pull chain I couldn't believe It was that easy ha ha ..

[@MikeHoltNEC]

Lol... welcome to the electrical industry. Be sure to watch all of my videos, read all of my free stuff, and when you are ready to get licensed, give me office a call and they will get you to the next level.

[@261Pro]

@@MikeHoltNEC the videos and content has helped me in many cases already.. I did my first NEV test around my new pool..

[@MikeHoltNEC]

@@261Pro What did you learn? I'm coming out with a new Pool Bonding Video in two or three weeks. It will really blow you away.

[@261Pro]

@@MikeHoltNEC I learned that I had fractions of a millivolt in the beginning of the test .. I clipped on to the grounding electrode conductor and walked my yard .. the closer I got to the pool the less voltage I had .. I wet the pavers in all different locations and got zero volts as I got further away I would get a reading close to my baseline volts

[@evoezepeda]

Thanks so much for the amazing knowledge

[@MikeHoltNEC]

You are most welcome.

[@steveurbach3093]

4 cond NM cable has been on my wishlist for over a decade just for those instances of 3 + 4 way switches. I turned down Handyman work, because there was no Neutral in a box where the owner wanted to add an electronic control. (I've also done that long Bit thru the wall thing :( )

[@MikeHoltNEC]

They make four conductor NM cable. Wish no more.

[@jolyonwelsh9834]

Some occupancy sensors don't need the neutral conductor. They get their power in series through the device itself.

[@jolyonwelsh9834]

Mike Holt No. No device of which I am aware uses the EGC to get its power for obvious reasons of creating objectional currents. But having a neutral at every switch location makes a lot of sense I always try to provide a neutral conductor at every switch location any way.

[@grunthostheflatulent269]

So, how Gently does one tell their client how they must to spend 3x more for 14-3 and 14-4 romex? Plus box size wirefill -- regardless if the N is in use equates to 2 wires; 1 wire, 1 wirenut. Another cost.

[@whommee]

I agree Mike,, trouble is the public for a large portion just looks at bottom line and wanting a pretty house CHEAP,, and not caring how it is put together .

[@tjhall1468]

You just say it’s a code that most people will never take full advantage of the concept of this. Most people aren’t going to go spend another $30 plus for occupancy sensors versus a $2 or less switch.

[@samueltaylor4989]

Tell them it’s not an option, it’s code and it is safer. If they tell you go against it, tell them get someone else.

[@tms2568]

I agree..feed to one of the switches first instead of dropping everything out of the light. Why have a bunch of splices up in the ceiling that are more difficult to access and subject to potential rising heat from the light fixture. Feed a switch and the need for a neutral may also be satisfied.

[@OldMockingbird]

TMS that’s common so we are fine right? Lol

[@Espiritiv]

Mike, You CAN use occupancy sensors to control receptacles now!

[@MikeHoltNEC]

Of course, always could. Why do you ask? Did you think otherwise?

[@Espiritiv]

@@MikeHoltNEC I believe i heard you mention you didnt need to have a neutral for light switches that control receptacles. Maybe you were stating its not required... but maybe it should be

[@MikeHoltNEC]

I would have never made that statement, since it violates the NEC.

[@Espiritiv]

@@MikeHoltNEC Thanks for clarifying. I was referring to this statement. kzbin.info/www/bejne/lZ_SXnhuj7SenLM

[@robertbowser2601]

Hello I'm in iec Chesapeake and the question everyone once to know is what's the point of the ground and neutral at the main panel

[@MikeHoltNEC]

Watch kzbin.info/www/bejne/fYCVdGOqfJubpas and kzbin.info/www/bejne/o6HKcol7abqqfNk

[@brotheradam]

all we need is a supplier to make a 4 wire and ground for travellers... so we can do it from the get go...

[@MikeHoltNEC]

They make this.

[@NipkowDisk]

I wish I knew what the title of the book was on switching, that was mentioned in the first part of the video- I'd like to snag a copy of it if possible.

[@sinmoreno101]

im gonna piggyback on this comment, if the book warrants you mentioning it in the beginning im expecting a title lol overall as a budding apprentice this is informative

[@OldMockingbird]

5:30 very good point

[@dalenassar9152]

c'mon...people are worried about E-Fields in charged switch wires--as for the effect on data rate, I just don't see enough ill-effect.

[@MikeHoltNEC]

Just because you don't see any ill-effects, doesn't mean that others don't. I used to think the same; I'm sure EMF does impact some humans more than others.

[@deskriptarip7680]

What good is the neutral gonna be on the switch leg common side of 3 way switches without the constant hot common? So lets say somehow they only have the neutral on the switch leg side but not the where the constant feed common side is? Does that mean soon theyre gonna require a constant hot and neutral in every switch box?

[@vidupload4578]

Yep... get ready to run 14/4 or 14/2/2 for every switch circuit. Copper industry must have lobbied hard here.

[@Ed-uu9eo]

Hi Mike, so we have this rule where neutral isn't required to be in the same raceway/cable with travelers and switch legs, 404.2(A) Ex. A, then you show this graphic at 1:28. But then, that would go against the rule 404.2(C) ...where 3-way and 4-way switches are visible in a room, only one of the switches requires a neutral. So at least one of the switches has to have a neutral if it's in that scenario, otherwise, each of those require a neutral. Correct? I know the graphic isn't going against the code because it's utilizing raceways, but that's not the point that is being made in that graphic. Is it possible that exemption A is only stating that the neutral CAN be in another cable/raceway? Also. 7:30 graphic shows the hall not requiring a neutral at the switch but the code lists "hallways" as one of the places that do require neutral. Also not sure why garage bathroom is exempt from the rule either.

[@MikeHoltNEC]

I don't understand what you think is wrong with the graphic/video. Please watch it again and if you feel I have made an error, let me know.

[@Ed-uu9eo]

@@MikeHoltNEC Watched it multiple times actually and still confused. I feel like there's a contradictory in the rule. Graphic at 1:28 shows no neutral required in the any of the switches in that 3-way. What I don't get is how come this rule "neutral isn't required to be in the same raceway/cable with travelers and switch legs" allows you to NOT put a neutral in any of your switches whether it'd be raceway or cable. Cause that's what I got from that graphic.

[@MikeHoltNEC]

@@Ed-uu9eo This video is about 404.2(A) Ex, not 404.2(C).

[@ronbonick4265]

I disagree with making the public purchase the wire whether it's needed or not.. Why ? because we have enough rules and codes crammed down our throats..and to force someone to purchase isn't American. How about this rule - If you don't have a neutral you can't have a switch that requires it... and if we are having emf issues and the wiring has been wrong all these years then someone needs to be held accountable for not knowing this from the beginning .. If its a health issue then someone needs to correct it and go thru every house in America and correct it.. Just like AFCI's- they were forced on the public before the breaker was perfected and are known for nuisance tripping - and who has to pay for new breakers now ?? the companies should be held accountable.. I keep seeing all the so called extra safety equipment installed in home yet the price of house insurance isn't going down .. If its safer then it was years ago - that means theres less chance of fires or death then the prices need to drop.. If they really want safety then just make the main a AFCI / GFCI and call it good , but noooooo spend $1000+ on stupid breakers ... Someones laughing all the way to the bank..

[@billybassman21]

The problem is people buy these switches and put them on the grounding conductor because there is no neutral, so it is a safety measure for the greater good of society.

[@johnkimes1968]

@@billybassman21 Then that's the person who did it's problem. Probably the homeowner.

[@shaun7156]

I'm confused about something in the 2017 edition. In Art. 404.2 (C) and (C)(5) it says that a grounded conductor shall not be required where a switch controls a receptacle load. Am I reading something wrong? Because you need a neutral at that receptacle.

[@MikeHoltNEC]

What is the rule about? Switch boxes, not receptacle boxes. So no need to have a neutral in a switch box if the switch controls a receptacle. Nothing in the rule is related to any wiring in the receptacle box.

[@shaun7156]

@@MikeHoltNEC ok, so you run the feed to the receptacle first, is that right?

[@MikeHoltNEC]

@@shaun7156 The NEC does not require a neutral in a switch box, if the switch controls the a receptacle. How an electrician accomplishes this is beyond the scope of the NEC.

[@shaun7156]

@@MikeHoltNEC Thank you.

[@AngelA-zr9xm]

What is the book that has all codes with images, showing that example of code and image at the same time to understand and have a better idea of it. For example this video above.

[@MikeHoltNEC]

Understanding the National Electrical Code - www.mikeholt.com/product-category-list.php?id=1

[@instastagerage447]

I've put in 100s of occupancy sensors without the need of a grounded conductor.

[@keithviglucci8306]

Would it be a violation to use 2 cables of 2 conductor and reidentify with tape instead of using 4 conductor?

[@MikeHoltNEC]

I don't understand the question. But the white wire can't be used as the 'hot' wire, see 200.6.

[@keithviglucci8306]

@@MikeHoltNEC if one did not have 14/4 on hand could he run 2 14/2 cables and reidentify with colored tape?

[@keithviglucci8306]

@@MikeHoltNEC mike just re read your comment and I looked at the book 200.7 so I understand thanks

[@MikeHoltNEC]

@@keithviglucci8306 I know know when you need 14/2 or the applicaiton.

[@whommee]

I am seeing more and more reason to just go ahead and run emt on all residential structures . period.

[@gregberban9273]

Don't you think that would be hard to compete with contractors that are running pipe

[@tjhall1468]

100% disagree!!

[@diyEVguy]

@MikeHoltNEC: The NEC 2017 states: 90.1 Purpose. (A) Practical Safeguarding. The purpose of this Code is the practical safeguarding of persons and property from hazards arising from the use of electricity. [...] Next, the NEC 2017 404.2(C) informational note states: "The provision for a (future) grounded conductor is to complete a circuit path for electronic lighting control devices." So the primary purpose for adding the requirement of a neutral conductor at switches seems (to me at least) *convenience* (for optional future occupancy sensor install etc), possibly at the cost of confusion due to this change (e.g. "What is this neutral wire doing here!?"; "Where to buy NM14/4 cable!?", etc), and *secondarily* safety. Should article 90.1 be updated to reflect this added purpose?

[@MikeHoltNEC]

Watch this again, it's not convenience, it's to keep the EGC from serving as a circuit conductor. Which is dangerous and has shocked many people, including me. If you install one and you touch the ground wire on the device and the EGC, you'll understand. I think the video shows this with a meter.

[@diyEVguy]

@@MikeHoltNEC Agree. However it could be argued that it is the responsibility of the individual to refrain from using the EGC as a current return path when no appropriate grounded conductor is available, for example by *not* installing the occupancy sensor, or by adding a GC. In practice, probably often, this will go wrong, so the utility of 404.2(C) is clear for those cases. I am just being cautious regarding the hidden cost of additional rules, so I play the devil's advocate.

[@mikemartinez937]

Hey Mike I got a question for you so does lightning protection on a house actually work or is it just a myth in should I go with a bunch of search petaters all over the place because this one house has over $50000 worth of damage over the last 12 years and so now they forking out another foul $100 for all the search for tenders when I told him about a secondary lightning protection and someone told him that it didn't work so I want to know your opinion on thanks

[@MikeHoltNEC]

I have lightning protection on my home.

[@bestsnowboarderuknow]

What about no neutral in a switch j box that's only turning on a garbage disposal?

[@MikeHoltNEC]

Rule applies to switches to lighting in rooms only.

[@arnehelland6015]

ive started running 14/4 romex for 3 and 4way wiring.

[@arnehelland6015]

why do people say that, with led lights i can wire a whole house with 2 lighting circuits, excluding bathrooms.

[@arnehelland6015]

with the new energy codes they limit lighting load in houses, besides i work time and material so i dont know how you equate going above and beyond code. each rm is a seperate 20 amp circuit , but in over 25yrs ive only seen commercial lighting on 20amp circuits. so you are mixing business practices with sound electrical practices. at 15 dollars a complete recess led setup thats not cost prohibitive. in my state 15amp seperat lighting and smoke/co2 circuits is the normal, running 20 amp lighting circuits unnecessarily is ripping off customers because of the amount of wire lighting eats up.

[@arnehelland6015]

with the new energy codes they limit lighting load in houses, besides i work time and material so i dont know how you equate going above and beyond code. each rm is a seperate 20 amp circuit , but in over 25yrs ive only seen commercial lighting on 20amp circuits. so you are mixing business practices with sound electrical practices. at 15 dollars a complete recess led setup thats not cost prohibitive. in my state 15amp seperat lighting and smoke/co2 circuits is the normal, running 20 amp lighting circuits unnecessarily is ripping off customers because of the amount of wire lighting eats up.

[@mikegillean1730]

Avg $, 14-3, 26 cents. 14-4, 46 cents foot

[@grunthostheflatulent269]

^^ You're trying to figure out the math whilst sporting those Pink Sunglasses, aren't you? Most of the time, the old boys quoting this job back at the the CAD desk depends on that 15-50% markup on materials - with little regard to appending codes - before tendering a bid. The Additional waste / expense only to *anticipate* the client's potential future requirements *IS AN EXTRA.*

[@leodyfdiazjr994]

In IEC world wherein the voltage to ground is 220 volts, is the above video presentation stills apply or we just need to use a 2-Pole switch?

[@MikeHoltNEC]

This only applies when the National Electrical Code of the US is applicable.

[@leodyfdiazjr994]

Share us your thoughts technically.....like our country Manila follows both NEC n IEC....

[@MikeHoltNEC]

If you are wiring per the NEC and have a 120V light controlled by a wall switch, then a neutral is required in the box for future use.

[@ztd0501]

And I’m assume you can’t use a neutral from a different circuit.

[@MikeHoltNEC]

Of course not.

[@valentinmilla3405]

Hello! I would like to know how can i size the EGC from the generator to the ATS. Do i have to use table 250.102(C)(1) or the 250.122. Thanks!

[@MikeHoltNEC]

250.122, based on the overcurrent protection device on the generator.

[@valentinmilla3405]

MikeHoltNEC thanks! Does it matter if it is a separately derived system or not?

[@MikeHoltNEC]

Nope.

[@alainlareau1733]

Hi Guys , #1 I would be very pleased if article 100 set definition for switch leg and switched feed which are two distinct things, and I am so tired of having workers call a feed a switch leg.. #2 very often in economy apartments there is no center ceiling fixture and a device controls a split receptacle on the other side of a dwelling room. Chance is high the occupant or whomever will at some point install a motion sensor device there to control the tabletop lamp stand. Hey if wiring method brings power to the switch first no problem, but if a bona fide switch leg is employed and installer understands not 404.2 we got an issue. Moreover the way things are going, people will come home from work and want to use their smart phone to activate all kinds of jun, ,well ,, enough said

[@bowhunter7887]

But where do you stop planning for what might happen later. And.....exactly how many oc sensors do you actually put in houses. Is it neutral or grounded wire.

[@jjuve3]

I am looking for a neutral nterruption protector or sensor, what do you suggest?.

[@MikeHoltNEC]

No clue.

[@jolyonwelsh9834]

Do they make 3way occupancy sensor switches?

[@MrDragonlarry]

Yes they do and they work great for stairwells.

[@angelag529]

do you have the new book 2017 questions for master license ?

[@MikeHoltNEC]

Please give my office a call 352.360.2620 for information on our Exam Preparation products.

[@alkebulan8426]

how can i get a soft copy of the NEC on my computer?

[@MikeHoltNEC]

Visit NFPA.org

[@alkebulan8426]

@@MikeHoltNEC thanks much, I need it!

[@lenny2472]

One thing is, there are a lot of motion detectors that don't require neutral conductor, in fact the most popular occupancy sensors don't need a neutral conductor

[@crissd8283]

These switches that you speak often require a hot and a ground (EGC) according to their instalation manual. However, the code doesn't want manufacturs to do this because it puts a small amount of current on the ground EGC which is undesireable. The code is seeking to change manufacturing and wiring standards at the same time.

[@Junkboy888]

smart home and smart home wiring should not be a standard for ever home built in the future. Next you need to add garages with roofs that open for flying cars.

[@marec321123]

still that old men online who dont actually understand anything about electric

[@--JohnDoe]

I vote neutrals in all switch boxes. Make it easy to do right.

[@johnkimes1968]

Customers don't want to spend their money on it

[@marec321123]

reading a book and not understanding what is about is really bad

[@kefrenferrer6777]

Industry rules NEC not fire department.

[@assho8649]

PUBLIC INPUT: no, not a requirement, that should be optional!!!!!! NO NEUTRAL!!!!

[@JeanClaudVanDabb]

Its hard to understand mike half of the time bc it sounds like hes trying to speed rap lol slow down turbo

[@MikeHoltNEC]

I'm sorry, especially for people that English is not their first language. Please watch the video a few more times.

[@vidupload4578]

Wow, what a comment on the part of the channel authors: just because Sergio has a non-Anglo-Saxon name, the automatic assumption is that English is not his first language. That viewpoint kind of goes with the rest of the underlying ideology espoused by this organization.... It's almost 2020, and this country still runs on racist stereotypes.

[@assho8649]

fug that,,, Its not my job to predict future switches , no neutral in my switches... if they want one they can hire me or they can get one.

[@danserrano2251]

You Are A True Buttock

[@mightyoffice5092]

"Neutral required at every switch" : This cradle to grave government intrusion is garbage. In older homes all the switches in the house are back fed, if you need a neutral at the box you explain to the customers what is required by code and give them options and a quote to meet their desires. If they say yes that's great you do the job "PER CODE". You cut the drywall or plaster or drill holes through block what ever it takes to do the job right, it might be a $400 job or a $1000 job, who cares it's up to the home owner. Who are you to say the electrician might drill a hole through the wall and therefore we need to add more codes, if your to unskilled to know how to do things right become an inspector and leave the code alone. What a stupid reason to change the code, you need to have a good "service electrician" on your panel, who is a craftsman. When I find a so called electrician using the ground as a neutral I inform the home owner to file a complaint with the ROC turn the company in and get rid of the hacks who care less about the code. These are the same people who bury splices in walls or under insulation, who do not concern themselves with what is safe for the people using or living in the building. The code is not for them they will not follow it unless it suites them at the moment, but it for us how have made the choice to do what is right before we put on our tools or look at the difficulty of a job. DO NOT CHANGE OR ADD TO THE CODE BECAUSE IDIOTS DO NOT DO WHAT IS RIGHT, AND PLAINLY WRITEN IN THE CODE!

[@assho8649]

thank you

[@assho8649]

that's what I say, if they want something dontake it a file. requirement you stupid book worms money grabbers..

[@assho8649]

thats how this country has come to shits because of rewriting the codes and adding regulations leaving poor Joe broke as Fuk

[@ralphnabozny8494]

nobody likes buying 3 wire

[@kefrenferrer6777]

Code comitte has pased a line betwem security and freedom of design and industry interests. Or is just excess of paranoia.

[@assho8649]

Money down the bucket🤕🤕🤕👎👎 by putting a neutral..