3 Mistakes I See Every Average Climber Make

[@EmilAbrahamsson]

WIN a 1-on-1 Training Chat with Me & Crimpd+ For LIFE by Logging My NEW Workouts! Download Now ▶︎ Apple: l.linklyhq.com/l/1uBiS // Android: l.linklyhq.com/l/1uBiT Time for the second part in this series, where we'll talk about some workouts you can do to improve from V5 all the way to V8 (and beyond). Hope it helps!

[@kristofferschmarr]

Can we get a quick explanation on how to log these workouts? I've never used Crimpd before (or any training app). How will you select your winner? Thanks for the motivation. I've been plateaued for 12 years. Maybe I'll finally break through! @emil when I search your name in the app only a finger workout shows.

[@adb.909]

Made a list of all the drills: - Campus bouldering (matches or no matching ways) - Deep lock offs: Lock off one and keep bumping the other until fully extended. Second time with opposite hand. - Weighted pullups: Find 2rm. Do 5 sets of 3 with 3min b/w sets at 0.9rm - Dyno training: Keep eliminating holds - Max hangs: 7 sec hang. 2min rest. Add weight till failure -> 1rm. Do 10s hang at 0.9rm for 6 sets with 2min b/w sets

[@olavtennfjord6869]

Legend🙌🙌

[@EmilAbrahamsson]

[@robk5745]

Honestly, a perfect program!

[@alecharwood3478]

Thank you. Thank you very much.

[@ClimbingStuff]

I'm definitely gonna try out Exercise #4

[@EmilAbrahamsson]

Haha to be fair in your case it might be best to stop dyno training all together... ... and start DYNO SENDING!!!!

[@javadragon7475]

Rainbow Rocket when?

[@indy1515]

sick burn@@EmilAbrahamsson

[@JoeJoe-wv6de]

No

[@tylervoyer74]

Goofy man

[@davidbecker54]

That slo-mo of your left bicep jiggling @7:18 though 😆

[@masonwhyte564]

this feels so backwards to me, growing up as primarily a lead climber and watching the bouldering scene, where many people allow their strength to carry them to V5 and then never progress past that because of a lack of technique. i’ve always thought technique is so much more important than strength but isn’t as flashy so it gets neglected

[@maximedelmas]

7:16 the twitches in the left biceps are crazy!

[@RimshotKiller]

21:00 A Nikken in the wild, performung the greeting-dance of his people.

[@MrKobohobo]

Thanks for the video!

[@dCHOZEN]

“No matter how much technique an ant has, it will never defeat an elephant.” Strength is not everything but definitely an important component.

[@davidhelman3045]

Instead of winning an online coaching session, can we just pay for your services lol, I'm at that V7-V8 level and this type of advice is great, thanks Emil!

[@climbagote6195]

At 7:17 Emil's bicep is wobbling like crazy but what really interests me is that his whole left arm is doing it too so its not just from the impact of catching the dyno. Could this be some form of reflex to stay on the wall like how if your car is out of control on ice or water or something you're meant to brake intermittently and make a kind of juddering motion? (This is probably complete waffle but its quite a cool idea anyway)

[@khalidkhurshed9077]

Thanks!

[@MrWill830]

Lmao Nikken guest appearance at 20:59

[@chaozzah]

I always thought climbers actually did proper pull ups a lot more than other disciplines, because we're used to the shoulder shrug and engaging the scapula for a healthy range of motion. I also greatly prefer the hangboard to a bar. 50 kg is sick though, I can do 25 on a good day :D

[@peaelle42]

actually what about contact strength? you can't crimp on slopers. and i've always wondered what i can do with my palms.

[@wenkeli1409]

I'm also trying to improve my slopers, I've found that shoulder strength matters a lot, and I've heard wrist strength is important. I think I'm gonna try that lattice heavy roller thing and see how that goes.

[@JPsk8core]

I started doing something more or less similar to this 3 weeks ago and already feel some effects. I would add to this routine a bit of intensive stretching for back and hips, many people in my level (6c-7a) have big issues with hip flexibility. Lucky me, I only have to train finger strength, a bit of core and coordination to get myself to flow well at 7a level

[@jimbrannlund4677]

I'll get back to you when I can do one unweighted pull-up, haha.

[@Sophia-zk3pq]

Hi, how should climbers incorporate these exercises into their climbing regime? Should I do them before or after and how many times a week? Thank you!!

[@GMDXyilopan]

I started climbing as a weak 11 yo kid. everyone were telling me for years to focus a lot on my technique and to care less about my upper body strength. After 4 years of following this bs i started to lack my pulling power a lot. I did my first V8 and hit a terrible plateau. I finally started doing weighted pullups and it helped a lot. Went from a +25kg chin-up to +37 in 5 months and it changed everything (still not good enough tbh) Pulling power is so stupidly underrated. This video is literally the only one i've ever seen that doesnt ignore the importance of it... Thank you so much for this

[@prodbyskogs4435]

Chin up? I hope you meant pull-up, not sure chin ups really translate to climbing.

[@gingobingo1567]

@@prodbyskogs4435 Chin-ups do translate as well, because it still strengthens ur pull muscles in the back. Although, pullups translates better.

[@meagherman1013]

@@prodbyskogs4435 Stronger biceps, lats and forearms don't translate to climbing? Chin ups are a fine alternative to pull ups

[@samchu5335]

@@prodbyskogs4435i think chin ups will help with bicep intensive moves. as a climber i mostly focus on pull ups but do chin ups too (just to get the best of both worlds)

[@NikfangZ]

They told you that cause it's not recommended for 11 year olds to use heavy weights

[@ComputerManDanMiller]

I would say definitely be a little careful with your elbows, this is a lot of heavy pulling if you add it all on at once. Campus + dynamic + those lock offs + weighted pullups are all going to blast your elbows so pay attention to your body and dont overdo it!!

[@EmilAbrahamsson]

Very good point!

[@Hopesfallout]

I agree, it's super important to be careful whenever you add a lot of weight and volume to certain types of movements. I became a much stronger climber in a short amount of time after I had introduced weighted pull-ups into my training. I improved my finger strength simultaneously and overall was able to send drastically more hard boulders in every training session while feeling great - until I ruptured my distal biceps tendon and was completely out for 4 months. Now, 1 year after surgery I'm roughly back to where I was but I'll certainly be very careful whenever I increase volume, intensity, or frequency. Injury is just not worth it.

[@paulvolt2963]

​@@Hopesfallout I wonder if it's worth it. Janja Garnbret does 0 pullups training or fingerboarding, similiar with Adam. I think intelligent training on the wall beats it all. You train pullups, you get better at pullups movement. Train climbing movement - then you get better at it. Do we really need all those tricks and devices to isolate movement which is not climbing and confuse our body?? (with fingerboard, pull-up bar)

[@Hopesfallout]

@@paulvolt2963I think it completely depends on your climbing history and athletic background. Plenty of elite athletes don't train pull-ups or fingers specifically, but most of them have been climbing since they were kids, they've built the necessary strength over decades, often during puberty when strength builds very easily. Most ppl don't have that background xD I think for most ppl who start training as adults it's worth it to hangboard as soon as possible and to be able to do at least 10 pull-ups.

[@loniousmonk]

@@paulvolt2963 Makes a lot of sense to me. I think the one thing about a fingerboard though is it’s a cheap thing you can buy for at home, so you can do something climbing-esque on the days where you for whatever reason can’t train actual climbing

[@solomonreinman7452]

Love this. Not a lot of content on KZbin for climbers in the V5-V8 range. I already practice a lot of this stuff and it's great to see it reinforced and learn different details and nuances to implement. Excellent work!

[@Chalkdust81]

+50kg is a hell of a weighted pull-up for a V5 climber! 💪

[@flip_lange]

definitely not a limiting factor for him I would say lol

[@JosDehaes]

@@flip_langeAgree, I also thought he could probably benefit more from technique training 😀

[@Jaydan]

for real.. bro does NOT need to train weighted pull ups

[@Bobbin925]

Yes it was amazing that his max hang strength was so weak comparatively to his weighted pull ups

[@DragonSlayerBrick]

I am V4 and +60kg weighted pullups and I weigh 65kg lol

[@OliverBatchelor]

Every other climbing teacher: "focus on technique and don't worry about strength early on" Emil: "strength is all that matters, just do four hours of one arm weighted campus dynos every day" I don't know if this is meant to be a giant troll to deliberately go against every other piece of advice I've heard or a legitimate opinion. For every climber who good at slow, controlled static climbing there's a teenage boy who muscles his way through every problem and spends most of the time practising dynos.

[@jenssie1997]

as a beginner climber I love the little series on how to improve through the grades! I was wondering if you have tips for reflection. For example, you give william feedback after every dynamic attempt on how to stick the move. I noticed when climbing myself I find it alot harder to spot these things while on the wall.

[@EmilAbrahamsson]

Haha it could probably be a video on it's own, but I'll do my best. 1. Film yourself! Atleast every now and then. Compare the video, does it look the way it feels? 2. Can you find one small thing that helps you improve? It could be just comparing how you grip a hold or how you push with a foot or how "aggressive" mentality you have towards sticking the move. Anything really works, if you manage to find one detail per boulder, you'll learn 30-50 new things every session! It doesn't have to be anything major or the thing that makes you stick a move, really just something that helps you get closer even just slightly. These two are probably the biggest things you can do. Hope it helps!

[@jenssie1997]

@@EmilAbrahamsson awesome, thanks for the advice and quick reply!

[@danmclenaghan1350]

A wild Erik Karlsson climbing appeared at 20:15 😂

[@dantelaw7759]

Needed this home-truth, thank you! After years of smugly climbing harder than those who are stronger than me, ultimately over time those climbers who worked on their technique now climb harder than me, as I did not work on my strength meanwhile. Finally humbling myself and starting my first official training plan in two weeks!

[@yaakovcohen1512]

This video is so high quality man, really well put together, great job. What you are doing here is simply amazing. Truely inspiring.

[@erikwesselius9971]

With the campussing exercise, please note, that some beginning climbers try it and I've noticed they'll usually injure their shoulders or elbows because they lack some strength. (I work at a bouldering gym and seen this happen an insane amount of times) So maybe show people as well what good campus technique is? Edit I forgot the part that these are for v5 - v8 climbers. But since I forgot, maybe others did as well, so please keep that in mind!

[@flowrida1138]

Loved the Nikken cameo!! And yes Emil… also the content 🚀 Such a refreshing perspective for me as a mainly static route climber. And boy am I hyped to some proper training blocks now during the coming months 🦍

[@giorgiogrosso5466]

Obviously during the gym filming part

[@MidasCat]

Me: alright let’s see these exercises! :3 First exercise: Campusing boulders My weak ass who can’t even do 1 move without using my feet: QwQ

[@JrMinnimastr1]

v5 climber has stronger fingers than me (~v9) .... story of my life xD

[@424-i7r]

I love how it cuts from the tranquil deep lock off section directly into the 100 kg pullup attempt lmao

[@kaspernordlund6828]

I would love to add to this wonderful regiment; that once in a while you should do a session where you climb normally, but then when you get fatigued you gradually climb easier and easier routes, until you physically can't climb ANYTHING in the gym. This will force you to focus on how EXACTLY every part of your body aids your climbing and will strengthen your intuition for using these different parts of your entire body in harder climbs.

[@salmonch1ld]

informative and I'll definitely be trying these exercises. Your student was pretty cool and his feedback well thought out.

[@Mike-oz4cv]

I disagree. I know way too many climbers who are much weaker than myself but climb much harder grades (especially in lead climbing). Simply because they have the flexibility, body awareness and trust in their feet to do most of the heavy lifting with their legs. It’s amazing how much difference even tiny changes in Center Of Gravity can make. Not to mention clipping and resting efficiently.

[@joshjenkinson1929]

Great video about the realities of climbing. There’s too many videos that put forward the idea that technique is everything. They’ve never helped me one bit because I’m already trying all the usual things. It’s obvious that when pulling yourself up a wall on difficult holds that finger strength and upper body power to weight ratio are by far the most important attributes.

[@EmilAbrahamsson]

Certainly, and thanks. Arguably, there's a lot of things to learn to be able to do a coordination dyno, slab, or corner pressing for instance. But for outdoors and more "regular" climbs, finger strength and body power will be more in demand than knowing exactly how to perform a dropknee.

[@SH-bw9nw]

Agreed! This was so validating to hear. I always argue with my partner that I simply am not capable of doing certain climbs because I lack the finger strength. He often insists I can compensate with technique, but in 99% of the cases that is not true. It's frustrating when I know what my own body is capable of but other people don't believe me.

[@La0bouchere]

@@SH-bw9nw Yeah, you can compensate for upper body strength with technique a bit, but you really can't compensate for finger strength if you already have the right beta.

[@makafuniruni]

Gotta love Nikkens photobomb 20:59😄

[@jummers88]

Counter argument Dave Graham with two knee pads.

[@Ptitviaud1337]

Good one.

[@zachsmith7426]

lol i dont make any of these mistakes

[@jtg4208]

New climber here, you great thanks for all your guidance. Great coaching.

[@jonnes__4657]

🗽 Unfortunately we have no extra weights to load in my gym. 🤔 .

[@Gullshunter]

35kg is 70% of 50kg, not 90%. Did you meant 45kg? Good video btw!

[@EmilAbrahamsson]

90% of bw + added weight!

[@Gullshunter]

@@EmilAbrahamsson indeed!

[@David_Friberg]

Great video, thanks! On the topic discussed in a few other comments, injury prevention when ramping up pulling strength exercises, I've found that proactively exercising "reverse tyler twist" with a flexbar (resistance in rotation) helps a lot to prevent golfer's elbow tendonitis (common for climbers ramping up volume in pulling exercises). It may not help against total elbow/biceps tendon rupture, but naturally you should avoid pushing training volume that far.

[@PulseCodeMusic]

Good stuff although I've sworn off finger boarding. I have injured pulley tendons multiple times now, if not always on the board itself, always at a time when I'm finger-boarding regularly. I like climbing too much to risk it.

[@kim98677]

Me Watching this knowing damn well i wont do any of it and instead just keep throwing myself at the wall as i slowly claw my way up another V5🤡

[@BramHeerebout]

Slow down with the humble brag there Kimmy. I am having fun at V3/V4 wishing I was at your level. I'm just kidding (about the brag, not the level), I actually like your comment. I'm lying here loving this video and thinking these are some very useful exercises I could actually see myself doing. But then again, in practice, will I really? Maybe. I want to be better but I also just want to have fun doing boulders. Your comment reflects that thought for me. Thank you for speaking up too!

[@MightTower]

Nice video and hi Nikken 😂

[@EmilAbrahamsson]

There's a hidden Eric in there as well haha (but he's blurry and only there for a second)

[@MightTower]

@@EmilAbrahamsson Missed him at first but now I found him after you mentioned him. That's nice but the content is even better, I like those explanations of training possibilities.

[@felixhermes1223]

Emil, your channel has become my favourite climbing channel over the past months. This is awesome content. Thanks, i appreciate your dedication and work!

[@iMaDeMoN2012]

If you are not already in shape, dyno problems ARE dangerous. You WILL injury yourself. Your tendons and muscles are not ready. A beginner should avoid dyno problems at their project grade level. You can still train dyno movements by creating your own problems on boulders a grade or two below your project level. Edit: I should have just waited. He addressed my exact concern 5 seconds after I paused (7:35) the video to write this comment.

[@holtcrawford549]

And then Nikken at 21:03 😂

[@cranberryJOOSE]

This guy is definitely stronger than the average V5 climber, and probably just needs to work on climbing technique more than strength. But good video never the less! :D

[@uzituchi]

"Ya"

[@User_UCiZsDb]

3:54 lol so funny, 매드락 ㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋ

[@nguyr]

19:48 I also find the hangboard jugs are easier to pullup than a bar. As you pull up on a bar your wrist bends and you have to spend some power to keep them in position. On a hangboard your wrist is supported for the whole motion.

[@theogmufasa3143]

anyone have a good idea on how to organize this in your schedule? I’m used to weightlifting and having like a push, pull, leg routine. Is there something like that I can do with this?

[@MirKoTrio]

I find that pullups on the campus board hit your biceps more than pullups on the bar, this could be due to the closer grip so if you are bicep dominant you could find them easier? Dunno

[@eriksabo8102]

21:05 - 90% of 50kg is supposed to be 45kg (not 35) or am I missing something? :)

[@aviduke]

If you're going to climb dynamically, do a ton of stabilisation, strength and mobility to ensure your body can tolerate the additional force generated

[@gonzalocordova5934]

Yeah

[@jayknot88]

So good!!!! I'm quite excited to dive further into my climbing potential.

[@ericlin158]

What's up @Nikken! @21:02

[@Painsoreal]

If you are campusing somebody's project in front of them, it is better =)

[@heyitsconnor1]

Do not do these exercises unless you’ve been climbing for at least 1 1/2

[@fredericdejoze8546]

I tried your workouts and they where very nice. I'm gonna integrate them in my training on a regular basis 🙂

[@javadragon7475]

21:01 Hello there.

[@eliotrocks1]

Great video!! You gave me some of this advice in person which was very special!! Cheers

[@אורירונן]

21:01 Nikken!!😂🥳

[@AlexKadeby]

Thank you! I will try this while I am working on getting my first 7A.

[@gratengelsker7614]

8:57 Why would we do eight sets if the purpose is just to find our max?

[@liamhilhorst752]

Not being strong enough isn't really a mistake is it😂?

[@sebastiangeschonke9756]

90% of 50kg is 45kg. Your bro trained 70%

[@mateuszczekaa2638]

I'd love to know why 2 minutes rest in finger exercise. Many people say 3-5 minutes rest is best for finger strength workout including Hooper's Beta. I realy like Crimped and I tried few of their workouts but I feel strange with this 2 minutes rest conception. And thanks a lot for your content! : ))

[@Crimpd]

We chose 2 minutes rest as it's sufficient time for most people to try hard again and makes the workout not overly long, but if you need more time between sets then definitely take it. The goal here is near-max effort, so as long as you are doing that then you're getting the intended stimulus.

[@mateuszczekaa2638]

@Crpimd Thank you for your answer. I will remember it. ; ) If I may make a suggestion, it would be great if the app had a feature to set break lengths other than the default.

[@gloogloo6244]

Är första kilppet vid början från skrapan vid medis?

[@qwertiedota]

7:13 his bicep shaking in slow mo

[@TroutMaskReplicaa]

Emil, how long do you keep your finger nails?

[@RockClimberAlex]

21:04 90% of 50kg is not 35kg according to my math.

[@verticalvoyager706]

When do you recommend programming the weighted pull ups and the max hangs? I've been doing max hangs before my bouldering sessions, but never know when to fit in the pull ups (and am not sure if my max hangs are in the right spot either)!

[@dylanstoecker4101]

I do them on a more general conditioning day where multiple large muscle groups are targeted. I generally do these before other shoulder exercises etc because they are hard to do (for me) if I’ve done presses, IYTs, etc beforehand. I do weighted pull ups on a specific day because they really exhaust my shoulders and I know my climbing session quality would suffer because of it. You could do them the same day you do max hangs, but always do the hangs first. You want your finger training to always be the highest quality as possible. Doing max hangs before bouldering is fine as long as you can achieve the goals for your bouldering session at the intended effort level desired. I.e if the goal was to try limit moves, it may not be wise to work your fingers that aggressively before hand.

[@Jovi_97]

Weighted pullups.. I think this requires that I can do a single pull up, without weights, to begin with.

[@lachlansullivan-carey9070]

So your max is your body weight get up to 2 reps of that!

[@hugoperuzzo4376]

do you plan on making videos like this for V8 + climbers? Do not get me wrong I am going to use those exercise because they are very interesting but I'd love to hear some more crispy tips or exercise for hardest projects. Thanks !

[@EmilAbrahamsson]

Oh yes. Next video is precisely that, I'll be talking about what I think you should do at V8 and above :-)

[@Eyllexx]

YES new video 😁🔥

[@die_hertz]

Shouldn't 90% of a 50 kg max weighted pull-up be calculated using bodyweight? Though the difference will be 5 kg max if his weight is in between 50 and 100 kilos

[@FlipExxxx]

I think it should be calculated of the total weight. 50 kg + lets say 100 kg body weight = 150 kg. 90% of that is 135 kg, which means he should add 35 kg weight (which is exactly what he did)

[@die_hertz]

@@FlipExxxx the only issue is his weight is not 100kg.

[@rossayoung]

Great tips. Thanks for sharing

[@nap_time_]

i love these types of videos so much they're so helpful. Thank you!!

[@jakubkrett3537]

21:03 90% of 50kg is 45kg, not 35kg. So should u use 70% of your rm or 90%?

[@EmilAbrahamsson]

90% of total weight :-) BW+added

[@upsidedowna8103]

Should these be done on separate days?

[@RupertMumphrey]

Just recently got into rock climbing and did my first outdoor climb (that wasn’t a boulder) today in Buena Vista. I was able to do a 5.9 with a couple falls(with some 5.7s and a 5.8, learned I hate slab climbing). I will try some of these drills and see if it helps. Thanks for the advice.

[@NinjahPigeon]

first what do i win

[@EmilAbrahamsson]

Very solid effort but third unfortunately. You have my undying love for being an early squad member though, if that counts?

[@NinjahPigeon]

Tragic, yes your undying love will suffice, great video as always :)@@EmilAbrahamsson

[@paulvolt2963]

I wonder if it's worth it. Janja Garnbret does 0 pullups training or fingerboarding, similiar with Adam. I think intelligent training on the wall beats it all. You train pullups, you get better at pullups movement. Train climbing movement - then you get better at it. Do we really need all those tricks and devices to isolate movement which is not climbing and confuse our body?? (with fingerboard, pull-up bar)

[@hjxflavor]

the v5 climber seems very strong

[@rafaelestevez855]

if i had to take a shot this v5 climber says yea i would be on the floor in 2 min

[@rafaelestevez855]

176 yeahs said in a video is crazy

[@logansharrott7267]

Nikkan in the background!!

[@Muaahaa]

I tend to think of good technique as the movements and positions where you'll expend the least energy (while completing the climb, ofc). Helps keep away dogmatic feelings about different styles, but it doesn't really instruct you as to how to approach any single climb.

[@drewjarrell2667]

How often and when to do these exercises?

[@Wijkert]

Love this video, love the series. However, this is the first title of one of your videos I actively dislike. I think it's not necessarily the clickbaity nature of the title, it's more the negative phrasing.

[@EmilAbrahamsson]

Oh interesting, I appreciate the feedback. Which part of it feels negative to you? Just all of it or any specific words?

[@Wijkert]

@@EmilAbrahamsson I think it is twofold: instead of something positive like "these tips can help you improve", you said something negative "most of you are doing something wrong". The other part is claiming that every everage climber you see makes these mistakes, which is a black and white statement that can't be true. In fact the person that you used as an example in this video did the flowy campus boulder excersize much better than expected. If he is doing that pretty well, how can every everage climber you see (including him) be making these mistakes?

[@marilynsparks5931]

Power vs. Technique is the basis for a bet that a friend and I have going on. He has only been climbing for a year and hasn't fully developed technique yet but he's really strong. I've been climbing for 10 years and I like to think I've got pretty good technique. However I don't have a lot of strength. We're both trying to flash a 7a+ first and the loser has to buy the other's steak. I'm very excited to start building more power because it's something I've always meant to do but never had this fun motivation before.

[@imxd9698]

when do you progress weight on the hangboard? if 90% of my max is say like 50lbs or whatever, when do I start going to 55, 60, 65lbs, etc.?

[@drkwrk5229]

To gain more fingerstrengt, i climb crimp grips, to gain upperbody strengt i just climb everything but usually most things requiring larger arm movements and hip movement. To gain leg strengt i lift with my legs. Climbing is training.

[@AllegraClimbingPsychologist]

LOOOOL the green boulder at Moumo with the move I couldn't do hit hard 🤣 What do you think about using momentum while campusing? I can't do campus boulders unless I use a lot of swing (V6 female climber here). Lovely videoseries!

[@EmilAbrahamsson]

For sure use momentum! In many cases I would say that’s even better, as learning how the swing affects your position will GREATLY help you with dynamic movements -> you’ll be more comfortable with dynamic movements -> you’ll build the power through doing them more often

[@thestereokid6073]

I love it.

[@robk5745]

I’ve just started climbing and am more at a v3 level but these training plans are super helpful for me. Will just leave out the hang-board stuff till my joints and tendons are more used to climbing

[@simonrobbins815]

Great video Emil. I have relatively weak fingers for my weight and find that indoor bouldering grades are almost no guide whatsoever for whether I'll be able to do any given problem. I can do some V7s and still get spat off some V3s. Good technique is great but as you say, it is no substitute for finger strength or power.