33. The Triangle Method

[@coreygrua3271]

It is always delightful to find a master in his craft who is willing to share his years of experience with others. Graham Blackburn is just such a master. Thank you sir.

[@gjbmunc]

Wow, thank you!

[@MelvinGrified]

Hello, how is everything going over there. I'm Melvin and I want us to talk it's very important.

[@jimfromri]

I see so many woodworkers struggle with complicated numbering or letting systems to keep their work pieces and joints organized. I am eternally grateful to an instructor who 25 years ago taught me the triangle system. So easy and so effective. Thank you for teaching this valuable system.

[@gjbmunc]

You're welcome!

[@dalehunter80]

You can also draw different amount of lines underneath the triangle base to Keep similar pieces in separate groups. Like a underscore tally system.

[@ianpearse4480]

Very good advice. Cheers.

[@gjbmunc]

Thanks !

[@ericd7975]

Excellent. I have been a wood worker for 50+ years and have just learnt something new . So simple, so easy, so valuable. Thank you. I just subscribed. Looking forward to more great videos and tips 😀

[@gjbmunc]

Glad it was helpful!

[@MelvinGrified]

Hello, how is everything going over there. I'm Melvin and I want us to talk it's very important.

[@carlmclelland7624]

WHY are such effective shortcuts always so simple, and WHY... didn't I think of that?! At 75, I'm still not too old to learn a new trick! Graham, you've earned my subscription....

[@gjbmunc]

Thanks!

[@johnbesharian9965]

The way I put it is, "The day I get 'Too Old' to learn something new, is the day I might as well pack it in". (I'm exactly the same age as Robert Zimmerman. You know him as Bob Dylan.)

[@motsy15]

Thank you for sharing There is NO teacher like experience

[@gjbmunc]

You are welcome!

[@roman_le]

Thank you Graham. Marking is utterly necessarily. One day I've twisted the workbench frame style while gluing. It was quite frustrating to re-mortise it for the rails.

[@gjbmunc]

Glad it was helpful!

[@morefiction3264]

Received your books just now. Traditional Woodworking Handtools and Furniture Design and Construction. Looking forward to reading them, collecting my tools, and designing and building furniture. Thank you for all your instruction.

[@gjbmunc]

Awesome, thank you!

[@fiftysomething7199]

The ease and simplicity of the method, make it brilliant.

[@gjbmunc]

I guess that's why people have been usimg this method for so long!

[@jarheadlife]

His books are well worth finding and learning such a treasure!!

[@gjbmunc]

Thank you!

[@jarheadlife]

@@gjbmunc had the pleasure of meeting you in Columbus Ohio at the wood workers show 15 years ago or so! You signed my books!!

[@robertbruun4062]

What a joy watching and learning from a master like you. Thank you! 🙌🙌

[@gjbmunc]

My pleasure!

[@arkansasboy45]

This method is a sure fire way of keeping everything referencing correctly.

[@gjbmunc]

It sure helps me!

[@BazzMann48]

The triangle method is simpler and foolproof compared to numbering each joint. I used a lot of dowels, some of which wouldn't line up because I had switched sides unintentionally. So, thank you, an old dog, can learn new tricks, especially when explained so simply. Thank you.

[@gjbmunc]

You're welcome!

[@Dr.CandanEsin]

What a clean and orderly shop. Admiring!

[@gjbmunc]

Thank you!

[@thedolphin5428]

Shipwrights say: "You can never have too many clamps". Graham says: "You can never have too many planes". 😂 😂 😂

[@gjbmunc]

That's why they invented multi-planes.

[@johnbesharian9965]

As I always say: "It's impossible to have too many tools; too much material or supplies, nor quite enough room to put it all in and, of course, too much money to afford it all".

[@Erik_The_Viking]

I use this for glue ups - this way I get the grain direction and patterns correct. Definitely saves some silly and embarrassing mistakes.

[@gjbmunc]

Yep!

[@johnbesharian9965]

The way I put it is: "Oops is not our favorite word".

[@DraganIlich-r1s]

Simple yet Useful.Thank you.

[@gjbmunc]

Glad it was helpful!

[@ikust007]

Thank you very much for transmitting your knowledge

[@gjbmunc]

Thank you!

[@Isabel-belsai]

Thanks!

[@gjbmunc]

No problem!

[@LChalifoux]

Thanks for another great video, Graham! As an absolute beginner, I'm certain I would have messed up even a simple assembly if I didn't know how to mark my pieces with triangles. Now I just have to remember to plane my surfaces *before* I lay out and mark them, so I don't inevitably erase my marks. Although in my experience, a mistake is often the best teacher....

[@gjbmunc]

True!!!

[@MelvinGrified]

Hello, how is everything going over there. I'm Melvin and I want us to talk it's very important.

[@darrensmall4313]

Haven't seen that method before. Very simple and seems to get the job done. Thank you for the video and your time.

[@gjbmunc]

You're very welcome!

[@MelvinGrified]

Hello, how is everything going over there. I'm Melvin and I want us to talk it's very important.

[@byhammerandhand]

Been using this most of my woodworking career. Saves a lot of headaches -- pick up a piece and you know exactly where it goes. If you are doing multiple things, e.g., sides on a cabinet, make the common lines double, triple, etc.

[@gjbmunc]

Great!

[@AncoraImparoPiper]

As a newbie woodworker, I've made the types of mistakes you mention just a few days ago when I put together a frame for a door. Just 5 pieces but in an instant, the inside face ended up on the outside, the top on the bottom. Well it is just one of my practice pieces but I wish I had seen this video before I started on that door frame. I've got one more frame to go so I'll definitely mark it out as you demonstrated. Thank you.

[@gjbmunc]

Glad to help, good luck!

[@MelvinGrified]

Hello, how is everything going over there. I'm Melvin and I want us to talk it's very important.

[@Alex-bo4je]

I think you have forgotten more about woodworking than I will ever learn. Love your expertise.

[@gjbmunc]

Wow, thanks

[@wseejattan]

Thank you , from an amateur woodworker.

[@gjbmunc]

Thank you too!

[@MCsCreations]

Thanks a bunch for the tip, Graham! 😊 Stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊

[@gjbmunc]

Thanks, you too!

[@glennlopez6772]

As a senior craftsman, it's a responsibility to consider the beginners! There are other ways to mark the top surfaced but this way, the top and bottom are clear to see! The word triangle, sounded like something "tech", but it's straight! From a senior citizen, keep up the good work! Thanks for the video!

[@gjbmunc]

You're very welcome!

[@dyderich]

This is so much easier than what I have been doing. I've seen you use the triangle method before but didn't truly understand till now how it works. Thank you again for sharing your experience.

[@gjbmunc]

Glad it helped!

[@markbenoit9070]

Awesome ty! Next question... What are all those items on the top shelf behind you?

[@gjbmunc]

Various rabbet, moulding, and special-purpose planes.

[@bluemerlin271]

I think we all know the frustration from having the pieces misaligned 😁. This is a great way keep track of things! 👍 Thanks

[@gjbmunc]

You are so welcome!

[@davidbalmforth699]

Thanks for the great traditional methods! We all today rely on fancy machines and we don't know how even to use a plane (or even sharpen it...). You are English, right? But you have been in CA for a while? Very slight mid-atlantic accent!! Keep up the good work please.

[@gjbmunc]

Born in London, grew up in Europe, been in the US for a long time now.

[@steveyoung4343]

Exceedingly useful. Thank you.

[@gjbmunc]

Glad it was helpful!

[@pitsnipe5559]

Learned my lesson the hard way. Was building a maple bookcase and cut a miter for two right side pieces instead of one left and one right. Now, I mark my pieces.

[@gjbmunc]

Good idea!

[@trackie1957]

So simple and so valuable.

[@gjbmunc]

Great!

[@joe23521]

Thank you for the great content! One observation, could you please check your audio tracks when editing? I think you're using the camera mic audio as opposed to the wireless mic audio. Thanks!

[@gjbmunc]

Yes, there was a problem with this in some earlier episodes. We're trying to be more careful now.

[@tuffymartinez]

Thank You Graham... I will "Tri" to "Angle" my brain in the wise way of marking my work..... TM

[@gjbmunc]

Great!

[@dagda825]

Brilliant! I've been using a different method until today. Thank you!

[@gjbmunc]

You're very welcome!

[@cowboyyoga]

Thank you! What a great simple idea! I will put it to use right away! )))

[@gjbmunc]

You are so welcome!

[@geoffbrodie2112]

Put masking tape on first and draw on the tape. Easier to remove the triangle when no longer required

[@gjbmunc]

Good idea, especially if you're working with finished surfaces.

[@edwardjoelmichaels2543]

Thank you for taking the time to do these videos. Your method of teaching and explaining make it easier for me to understand things. I'm looking forward to more videos and purchasing your book series!

[@gjbmunc]

Glad it was helpful!

[@MelvinGrified]

Hello, how is everything going over there. I'm Melvin and I want us to talk it's very important.

[@TheMopangbend]

Great tip. I have several finished examples of mistakes because I thought I could remember, mostly grain mis matches. Putting this method to work!

[@gjbmunc]

Great, hope it helps!

[@BenjaminMellor]

I will say that I was introduced to your channel because of Rex Krueger. I will also say that I have used the triangle method before when I decided to glue a bunch of 2x4's together to create a tabletop. My current project is a chessboard. The woods I've used so far are walnut and douglas fir. Since I'm going to join the squares together using bamboo skewers, wood glue, and clamps, I decided to start work on a jig to help with that. Since I don't care which piece attaches to another, I will only scribble the bottom. I will be sure to make the scribbled side face down.

[@gjbmunc]

Sounds good; and thanks to Rex .

[@transmundanium]

Absolutely! I used the triangle method on a glue-up last night.

[@gjbmunc]

Wonderful!

[@athmostafa2462]

Thanks for sharing 😊 , waiting for more.👍

[@gjbmunc]

More to come!

[@athmostafa2462]

@@gjbmunc Thanks, I really appreciated 👍.

[@marcmalet4306]

Tellement bien expliqué avec le souci de pédagogie bienveillante .Congratulations Graham for sharing clearly this method.

[@gjbmunc]

Merci bien!

[@timwells3056]

That’s just brilliant. I’ve never seen this !!

[@gjbmunc]

Thanks!

[@petervandermolen4089]

super simple and super relevant. 6 minutes of skill and wisdom

[@gjbmunc]

Thank you!

[@leonlowenstadter9223]

Oh, wow! Thatˋs called "carpenter triangle" in Germany. Every apprentice learns it quite at the beginning. Thanks for sharing!

[@gjbmunc]

You're very welcome!

[@thormusique]

This is a great tip, thank you!

[@gjbmunc]

You're so welcome!

[@KamauBeno]

Excellent approach, thank you!!

[@gjbmunc]

Thank you!

[@perrymoser3014]

Just brilliant, simplicity is key!

[@gjbmunc]

Glad you like it.

[@jurikristjouw]

That is so briliantly deceivingly simple, you won't think of it... no more weird drawings for me to do the same. Thanx

[@gjbmunc]

You're very welcome.

[@MrOlaboss]

Thank you for your lessons! Very appreciated. I am one of your virtual apprentices.

[@gjbmunc]

You're very welcome!

[@thedolphin5428]

A good system, no doubt. A downside is when pre-sanding before final assembly might be necessary. I've always marked with a fine felt pen, dots or numbers, in hidden parts. On boats, P=port, S=starboard, F=fwd, A=aft, M=midship. So my code is PF1, or SA2, etc.

[@gjbmunc]

Sounds like a good system - that's the main thing.

[@thedolphin5428]

@@gjbmunc What's more, you workshop woodies have the fortune of perfectly symmetrical products! We poor bloody shipwrights rarely have two matching parts ... and, they're always curved and/or twisted!! I envy your lot!!!

[@johnbesharian9965]

@@thedolphin5428, Ahh yes. In your asymmetrical wood working world, the days of "Iron Men and Wooden Ships" is still alive. "Good on ya', mate", as our Aussie friends would say.

[@michaelbradford4444]

Simple and effective...I like it !

[@gjbmunc]

Glad you like it!

[@michaelbradford4444]

@@gjbmunc I forget a lot of good tips but I'm not gonna forget this one.Ty

[@מעייןהמלבלבתחייםםםם]

Good video!!! For darker wood i am using blue type

[@gjbmunc]

Good choice!

[@davidcampbell2845]

Excellent tutorial.

[@gjbmunc]

Glad you liked it!

[@frankagee3157]

Have long used the triangle method. It seems geometry and woodwork are almost synonymous in a lot of ways. Great big Thanks for this wonderful video.

[@gjbmunc]

Thanks!

[@1deerndingo]

Simple but essential advice.

[@gjbmunc]

Thanks!

[@jobophoto]

Great! Used it two pieces but never seen it extended to more. Great tip, thanks.

[@gjbmunc]

Very welcome!

[@ArchEdge]

Thanks Graham. I did know about the Triangle Method for laying out parallel pieces, but had never seen it used on frames and panels. And yes - i have glued a dovetailed piece in upside-down before :( it did fit, but not well..

[@gjbmunc]

Now you know!!

[@TomBuskey]

Before I learned the triangle method I did my 1st dovetailed box. The dovetails were as perfect as I'd like. But I had the grooves on the outside! Triangles have made things easier

[@SteifWood]

hahaha, that's a classic. We all been there

[@gjbmunc]

Glad to hear it.

[@Notrelad69]

Ótima maneira de marcar as peças, obrigado pela dica.🇧🇷

[@gjbmunc]

Thank you!

[@michaeldavila2325]

I've always use a similar method of marking, by using two lines fairly close together with one line broader than the other. Also marking the ends helps as well. Always enjoy your presentations 😊

[@gjbmunc]

Thanks for sharing!

[@dpmeyer4867]

Thanks for the info

[@henryskinner1092]

I see how this works. Fantastic! When I was in the Navy, I learned the kiss method. Keep it simple stupid. You are correct it is easier. Thank you Sir.

[@gjbmunc]

You're welcome!

[@TheLucidscreamz]

great tip good fellow , whats that top shelf filled with?

[@gjbmunc]

A variety of moulding planes, special-purpose planes, and rabbet planes.

[@kathrynnewton8721]

Excellent! Simple but profound! I’m returning to England this year. could I do an apprenticeship with you please?

[@gjbmunc]

I give regular classes throughout the summer which you can see if you go to Airbnb Experiences, Woodstock, NY. Check that out and we can talk again about something much cheaper and longer term. Feel free to call.

[@johnbesharian9965]

@@gjbmunc, You, sir, are not only a master craftsman and author, but a gentleman as well. (Our legacy is much more than the things we leave behind, but and more importantly, the knowledge we instill in others who will follow us. Thank you for your apparent willingness to do so so readily.)

[@MrKen-wy5dk]

In your first example you put the two boards together to mark the triangle. Did you freehand the triangle in the last example? I would like to have seen how you marked multiple boards.

[@gjbmunc]

Yes, it works fine if it's not actually the same triangle, but simply the top bit, nd the side bits, etc.

[@richardcolling8088]

Thanks Graham. Is there something similar for marking pieces in angled joints like dovetails?

[@gjbmunc]

I would mark the top edges in this case.

[@richardcolling8088]

@@gjbmunc thanks, do you number/letter your joints?

[@giuseppebevilacqua2034]

Well done Master

[@gjbmunc]

Thank you.

[@debluetailfly]

If you had multiple panels in a frame, such as your last example, how would you identify each one? There could also be doors with 2 or more rows of panels.

[@gjbmunc]

Another method would be to use numbers in a set ordeer.

[@5StoryWoodWorks]

Thank you for another great episode. I have used the face and reference side system and found it confusing. I do use triangles but not to the extent you have shown. Will from now on though. I enjoy your videos so very much.

[@ricos1497]

Face and reference is for planing and getting four sides square (if required). Use it in conjunction with the triangle method, because they indicate different things. It's perfectly possible that your reference face and edge might be on the outside of a piece of wood (say the left side of the left hand piece in the frame example of the video), which wouldn't have any triangle marking on it. The face and edge references are for marking your joinery off of when using a square. Triangles are for ordering your pieces. Hope that makes sense, and apologies if I'm telling you something you already know!

[@5StoryWoodWorks]

@@ricos1497 Very good explanation. I guess I get confused when guys like Matt Estlea use the face method without an explanation, or I've missed the explanation. KZbin can cause information saturation which is one of many reasons I enjoy Mr. Blackburn's videos so much. Thank you for your comment, I love when woodworking can be a positive sharing of information.

[@gjbmunc]

Thank you!

[@gjbmunc]

Sure. I'm just trying to keep it simple to start with

[@gjbmunc]

Thank you so much!

[@diannecleveland123]

How much sanding to get the pencil out of the grain of the wood ?

[@gjbmunc]

Probably lots, but firstly I only used a pencil to make the guage lines clearer for the video and secondly the pencil marks will in any case be hidden by the shoulders of the tenon.

[@futureoftheearth8100]

O my first occupation... Joiner curver... 20 years ago... Man right you are.. Salute from Ukraine

[@gjbmunc]

Very welcome!

[@fariborzhessabi5273]

Thanks God bless you 👍🙏👏👏👏

[@gjbmunc]

You're very welcome.

[@dylankertis4170]

I can not find out why there is an x on some of the old tools that I get I have an x on a spokeshave, and a scrub plane that I got just wondering if you have know why they are there?

[@gjbmunc]

Maybe an owner's mark in a busy shop...

[@dylankertis4170]

Thank you for the response and I really appreciate your informative videos

[@johnbesharian9965]

@@gjbmunc, Even quicker than the owner's initials (which could be duplicated with a new apprentice or employee) and an admonition of, "Hands off my 'X's'!".

[@yuliyabryant4052]

This is simply genius.

[@gjbmunc]

Too kind!

[@glencrandall7051]

Good review.🙂🙂

[@gjbmunc]

Thank you 🙂

[@christopherharrison6724]

This could have saved me a lot of trouble over the start of my woodworking journey.

[@gjbmunc]

Never too late...

[@marcusoakes9502]

How do you mark the sides of a drawer you are dove tailing?

[@gjbmunc]

Use the triangle method on the tops of each drawer.

[@mattedwards4533]

I think all of us woodworker have screwed up by installing a piece of our project in the wrong location? You have the remedy to get it right, Thanks!

[@gjbmunc]

You're welcome!

[@jimhyslop]

I'm curious why you put the marks on the face side. My instinct would have been to put them on the back side, so they aren't visible if you have problems erasing them.

[@gjbmunc]

Habbit, I guess. The back side often gets covered with other pieces and sometimes is not finished so it would be harder to see. And in any case I frequently use light pencil of even chalk.

[@raol635]

Thank you

[@gjbmunc]

You're welcome

[@kylefoster3092]

Are there any other methods other than the triangle method?

[@gjbmunc]

Of course; I'm just trying tostart with the basics.

[@jsmxwll]

The triangle method completely changed my experience with making things. I'd used a mix of arrows and hatches across joins before learning the cabinet maker's triangle. I have since added my own variant of the french triangle to my toolkit for more complex projects where the triangles can sometimes become less readable. I mostly use the triangle method and reference marks for my reference face and edge. Do you ever use the french triangle or marking systems for more complex projects?

[@gjbmunc]

Of course, when necessary.

[@craigmackenzie3983]

I will adopt the triangle marking method today. I have made screw ups by losing track of moulding shapes and getting the right tenon in the wrong mortise, then its start again and the whole day can be ruined.

[@gjbmunc]

Great! good luck!

[@mattmcgrane8975]

Graham, what about when you have four vertical legs? Do you lay out on the front of the legs or the tops?

[@gjbmunc]

Tops would work for as long as they remain visible, otherwise a triangle on the front two faces and and a triangle on the bacl two faces additionally marked B (for back).

[@mattmcgrane8975]

@@gjbmunc Thank you for that.

[@anthonyseiver7000]

It's the best part of woodworking, to notice just as a glue has set-up that you've glued a board the wrong way. Actually, it's the worst. Thanks for the tips.

[@gjbmunc]

You're welcome!

[@Offshoreorganbuilder]

Good idea: thanks!

[@gjbmunc]

My pleasure!

[@timdoyon1964]

I’ve learned a lot of bad ways to mark boards over the years. Finally I find a good one… I mean, this is game changer! Thank you so much for sharing your wealth of knowledge with us all!

[@gjbmunc]

You're so welcome!

[@MelvinGrified]

Hello, how is everything going over there. I'm Melvin and I want us to talk it's very important.

[@hanssenden4410]

When you are marking more frames with the same size, please mark them subsequently A, B, C,......

[@gjbmunc]

Exactly - or with numbers.

[@ibrhemahmed170]

[@gjbmunc]

Happy Easter to you, too!

[@bongie6821]

I intend to start a wood work shop, a small business, is a lunch box ideal for such business, eg metabo dh330

[@gjbmunc]

Sure, especially for production (as opposed to one-of-a-kind pieces).

[@timbarry5080]

It always hurts when I see someone hang an old bucking or felling saw out in the weather on the side of their shop

[@gjbmunc]

A man after my own heart! I rescued this saw from a fleamarket, gave it a new handle and sharpened it here and there and then gave it a coat of weather shellac so it wouldn't rust any more. I touched up a few teeth and have actually used it it a few times when I couldn't be bothered to get out the chain saw. I have to tell you it hurts even more to use it, but I regard it with a great deal of respect as the tool that cut down so much of our forests, especially the redwoods in California where I live half the time.

[@timbarry5080]

@@gjbmunc haha. Yes. They are tough to use. Those and axes making using a chainsaw seem like a holiday.. Those men really worked hard. Maybe that's why people died so young in the old days :0).. thanks for responding with such nice words. As I write this I am letting the molten wax harden that I just poured into the cavity I bored in the bottom of the handle of my finish hammer. (For lubricating hinge screws and finish nails) .. a trick showed to me by a Vietnam vet who was a Carpenter that went through a full apprenticeship as a young man. He saw that I had the same exact hammer as him, but he bought his new. I got mine at a flea market or something. It was amazing to see all the wear that he actually did himself to the old Vaughn.. He pointed to a hole in the bottom of his and asked if I knew what it was for.. I did not. I soon bought some bees wax and did the same to mine.. have a beautiful day.. and btw you have an awesome shop

[@StrumHollow]

How would that work for multiple pieces.....say, a batch of cabinet doors? Colored pencils??

[@gjbmunc]

Maybe add a number for each set?

[@StrumHollow]

@@gjbmunc Just what I thought after writing. Great minds think alike ;)

[@mercoid]

I’m going to make a triangle mark when constructing pieces from now on

[@gjbmunc]

Great!

[@towerdave4836]

Also, anyone else picking up the pieces knows which way to assemble them!

[@gjbmunc]

So true!

[@dormindont1]

полезное видео спасибо

[@gjbmunc]

спасибо

[@nicholasschrader9161]

no saw dust just a studio

[@gjbmunc]

Oh, there's sawdust from time to time - I sweep up a lot!