4 or 5 String: Discussion with George Martin

In this video, George Martin talks us through the differences between four- and five-string double basses and why the five-string variety has become more popular in recent years. We learn how the playing experience of a five-string instrument has changed due to advances in set-up, and we take a look at a recently-converted instrument to understand how this is achieved.
#kontrabas #contrabas #kontrabasso #contrebasse #contrabbasso #contrabajo #cello #violin #viola #luthier #orchestra #contrabass #woodworking #bassporn #doublebass

[@pelleandersson1261]

Very clear explanation ! My 5-string-aversion isn't that intense any more after listening to this fantastic educator.

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

Wow it's now mellow with that strong sounding B string

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

These 5 String Basses went under a lot of updates.

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

Pelle Andersson you'll have quite alot of fun w/ the 5 String Upright Bass. The 5 String Upright Bass is also becoming more popular these days because Thomas & George Martin cleverly solved its playability problem by fine tuning its setup.

[@pelleandersson1261]

@@RockStarOscarStern634 Yes, "cleverly solved playability". Making the neck narrower by stopping the lowest string sideways.

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

@@pelleandersson1261 A set of D'addario Helicore Orchestral Bass Strings (3/4 Size Medium Tension) plus a matching Low B should be a good match for the 5 String Upright Bass. Helicore Orchestral Bass Strings are easier to bow because they're just a little bit thinner, plus they have a clear sound & short break in time. Helicore Strings are named after a Helix Structure because their core is a Steel-Rope. The Steel-Rope core makes the Helicore strings sound very much like Gut Strings, unlike Gut Strings Helicore Strings are resistant to temperature changes & project more.

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

The same is true for 5 (& more) String Violins/Violas/Cellos etc. The reason extended range instruments are way easier to play than they used to be is because over the years the construction has been refined.

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

You can also tune it in Fifths with a set of Red Mitchell 5ths Tuned Spirocore Strings or Obligato 5ths Tuning Strings plus an Obligato (or Passione) High E Solo String.

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

5 String Basses have a slightly bigger neck and smaller string spacing which makes it feel nice in your hands.

[@fragallo1188]

Amazing description, well made video. All clear, all good. Thank you

[@ThomasGeorgeViolinMakers]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

I think alot of companies who make 5 String Upright Basses really need to use the same setup you use so that it's comfortable to play.

[@willb1157]

All those basses look like so big to me, I play a French (Viennese?) style instrument, and it has plenty of Power. Not a great orchestral bass though, which must be a large percentage of your clientele. I like High C 5 strings too. Thank you for the great series on the conversion. Here in Australia there are not many makers, and to be honest many of the few that are, well, are not really. I have had to learn to be my own luthier. That's not the fun it sounds. lol!

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

The 5 String Upright Bass is becoming more comfortable to play because by bringing the strings further away from the body, it becomes really fun.

[@Aaron-Qman]

Great insightful video. Are there even practice mutes for 5+ strings?

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

They're working on that

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

Thomas & George Martin Violin Makers The 6 String Double Bass is coming back. You can also tune the Double Bass in Fifths and for a 5 String Double Bass that is C, G, D, A, E like a 5 String Violin but 2 Octaves Lower.

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

So by making the neck & fingerboard only a bit bigger, using a tighter string spacing, & bringing the strings further away from the body of the Bass (w/ taller bridge & steeper neck angle), the 5 String Upright Bass will sit comfortably in the hands of alot of Bassists.

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

As it turns out that extra effort really makes a big difference. Edward Bailey makes his 5 String Basses that way too.

[@nukes27]

I exclusively play 5 string bass guitars. I suck at upright! My Kay has been for sale for almost two years...

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

That's no longer the case Thomas & George Martin have cleverly solved its playability problem by improving its setup

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

@UCIEUJeaurM90rjc6VjUQNUA Basses with 7 String do exist & they're cool too. One of the biggest reasons 5 (& more) String Upright Basses are becoming more popular is because over the years the construction has been refined to make it feel more familiar. Having the B String hang off the side allows you to use almost a Standard 4 String Fingerboard.

[@Symphing12]

How would you suggest trying to make a 5-string intended for solo playing in Viennese Tuning (F, A, D F#, A)? Would size be a difficulty?

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

Oscar Stern here You can use an F Sharp Solo String (Tuned own a half step, or the way it is), A Orchestral String, D Orchestral String, G Orchestral String (Tuned Down a half step to F Sharp), A Solo String.

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

Here are the reccomended Strings (all Medium Tension made by D'addario) Helicore Solo F# (Tuned down a Half Step) Helicore Orchestral A Helicore Orchestral D Helicore Orchestral G (Tuned down a Half Step) Helicore Solo A

[@jamesgiles4061]

My older Viennese fiver has only a 25 mm overstand, yet plays comfortably in part due to a cantilevered fingerboard that affords better spacing. Spot on with the B string overhang bit - no use wasting that fingerboard real estate .

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

5 String Upright Basses are becoming more popular these days due to improvements in their setup

[@edwincancelii2917]

For the 5 string upright basses in general, the upright bass pickup should be added to the low B string, or possibly the low F sharp string for the regular fourth tuned bass, the low C string or possibly the low F string for the fifth tuned upright basses for jazz, rockabilly, salsa, Latin jazz, country music or even Brazilian jazz.

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

A 6 String Double Bass has a Low B and high C and it does have a fun range which makes it fun for song covers. The 6 String Bass tuned in Fifths would be F C G D A E and it's an Octave below a 6 String Cello, 2 Octaves below a 6 String Violin. A 9 String Double Bass is tuned in Fifths 2 Octaves below a 9 String Violin but with a High B.

[@edwincancelii2917]

CircuitsAndStrings 2 Mr Stern awesome.

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

@@edwincancelii2917 The tighter string spacing facilitates reaching all the strings, & getting the right bowing angles has been facilitated with having the right curvature in the bridge. With a 5 String Double Bass you can also tune it in 5ths with a set of Pirastro Obbligato 5ths Tuned Double Bass Strings plus an Obbligato High E Solo String (from Thomastik) which will allow you to play Cello pieces/arrangents an Octave lower throughout, as well as Violin & Viola pieces 2 Octaves lower throughout. These strings are Nylon Wound in Metal which is going to greatly greatly reduce the amount of tension on the top.

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

@@edwincancelii2917 The biggest advantage of having a tighter spacing is that reaching all the strings is easier, plus the neck sits more comfortably in your hands.

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

@UCIEUJeaurM90rjc6VjUQNUA It's very beautiful. You can also tune it in 5ths with Obligato 5ths Tuning Strings plus a High E Solo (C, G, D, A, E) to enhance the range. 5ths Tuning is great for playing repertoire that was originally not written for Bass.

[@ThomasGeorgeViolinMakers]

Thank you for your comment!

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

@@ThomasGeorgeViolinMakers 5 String Basses are becoming way more popular these days after alot of updates. Interestingly I found a 6 String Upright Bass which has a Low B & High C, & I find it ideal for playing the Brahms Cello sonata in E Minor (the Solo Cello part) down an Octave. The 5 String Bass eliminates the need to use that extension for lower notes. Interestingly enough a 5 String Double Bass can be tuned in Fifths thanks to Pirastro Obligato 5ths Tuning Strings plus an Obligato High E Solo String.

[@Deyan_Velikov]

great design thinking!

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

This is quite a clever design that alot of lutheirs really need to learn how to make.

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

The 5 String Upright Bass is great for an Unplugged Jam

[@bobogus7559]

5:40 Or better yet, two five string basses, one tuned BEADG and the other tuned EADGC.

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

Or even better a 7 String Upright tuned BEADGCF w/ a super easy to play setup

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

@UCIEUJeaurM90rjc6VjUQNUA There's a good reason why every 4 String player should upgrade to a 5 String Bass. The 5 String Double Bass solves all the intonation problems caused by releasing & re-closing the E extension Clamps. It's also easier to finger lower notes on a lower string than on the extension. Having the 5th String tuned to Low B allows all the strings to be tuned in Fourths, the finger patterns for every scale will be the same, & it allows you to hit the Low B for any pieces that call for it. There are 6 String Double Basses too that have a Low B String on the bottom, & a High C String on top that plays Open Middle C which is why it's actually called a "Middle C String". They're working on 5ths Tuned Strings for 7 String Bass (High to Low: High E Solo, A, D, G, Low C, Low F, Super Low Bb a whole step below Low C on an Octobass) so it can be tuned like a 7 String Violin but 2 Octaves lower.

[@ThomasGeorgeViolinMakers]

Thank you for watching and your comment

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

@@ThomasGeorgeViolinMakers Having the B String hang off the side of the Fingerboard gives it more room to vibrate so that it dosen't hit the fingerboard when it's played. Also the bridge has just enough curvature to facilitate changing bow angles.

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

Bringing the strings out further away from the body also makes it project more.

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

2:29 Alright the neck on a 5 String Bass is only a bit bigger which allows it to feel more comfortable.

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

Thomas & George Martin Violin Makers Playing a Double Bass with 5 (or more) Strings is way easier because the set-up has been refined over the years.

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

@UCIEUJeaurM90rjc6VjUQNUA A 5 String Electric Bass has a narrower string spacing & it's easier to play with a Pick. With a 5 String Upright Bass, it's easier to get around by playing seated cause it makes it easier to look down the Bass.

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

@UCIEUJeaurM90rjc6VjUQNUA The 5 String Bass sounds alot more in tune than having a C extension because it's easier to finger notes on a Lower String, & also the intonation is much better. Updating this 4 String Bass into a 5 String allowed us to get rid of that C extension which we don't need anymore.

[@DiAsNaIaRcL123]

Well how about playing it?!?!

[@ThomasGeorgeViolinMakers]

Check our other videos to hear how our basses sound! George's videos handle the technical side of things, and Tom's videos are where you can watch them being played :)

[@PainofRazeration]

I can't believe he didn't play a single fucking note.

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

Actually he did hit that Low B at 6:54, listen carefully it just growls.

[@alecrisser12]

Five strings, HA that's child's play Talk to me when your bass has six strings.

[@Pensivata]

5 string basses should be illegal. Period. The 4 string is hard enough FFS.

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

That's no longer the case they've improved its playability & now it's fully functional

[@alecrisser12]

Your accent is the one they do when people try to sound British.

[@Muzikman127]

Lol, that's true. "Estuary English" is what you're looking for btw 👍

[@brianswanson9881]

blah blah blah. Name the stings and the notes they play!

[@RockStarOscarStern634]

He mentioned it already, the top 4 are in E Standard plus a Low B on the bottom. The Tuning is pretty Bass-ic B Standard Tuning for 5 String Bass which is B0, E1, A1, D2, & G2. I like using D'addario Helicore 3/4 Size Medium Tension Orchestral Double Bass Strings plus a matching Low B because they're just a tad bit thinner to facilitate good bowing technique.

[@Muzikman127]

I mean... it's an advert for basses, not strings. If you buy one, you can string and tune it however the hell you want lol Here it's in standard 4th tuning with a low B tho (like he said in the video...)