7 Games That Punish You for Being Nice

[@MichaelVine92]

I'm presuming that Jane isn't in this video because she didn't understand the concept of being nice in a game and always chooses the evil option.

[@joenesvick7043]

I was wondering where she was

[@cincaicincai7847]

She shouldnt be in any video.. she shouldve do some writing instead of presenting.. too expressive imo

[@quanruicorre]

​@@cincaicincai7847 grow up

[@Folicanis]

​@@cincaicincai7847This is the dumbest opinion I've ever heard

[@KaladinVegapunk]

Honestly just playing those dumpster fire life is strange games are punishment alone hahaha..the absolute laziest, jankiest developers that make Bethesda games seem polished with suuuper bad writing and characters. The first game was one of the only big games with a main gay character which was awesome but that can't excuse the other awful 99%, let alone Chloe being one of the most obnoxious characters in gaming haha. Adam from YMS has some legendary playthroughs of those dumpster fires

[@sonofpears4691]

I can’t believe you didn’t include papers please. The entire point of that game is that constantly you are confronted with doing your job, or doing the right thing, you have to turn away good people whilst also having to let in people who are so obviously horrible.

[@h0pesheart]

Commentor's Edition, let's go!

[@powerfulshammy]

They also forgot the Aperture Desk Job where you get jailed for being nice and following orders of your robot boss which is better than Glados right 😂

[@VeryPeeved]

To be fair, there are a decent number of times you are rewarded for doing something good.

[@OneLilSpark]

I thought doing good things was one of the ways to get the best ending in papers please

[@sonofpears4691]

@@OneLilSpark if you mean the terroism ending then sure you do get the ending for doing the right thing but you are still penalised by the game everytime you help them

[@sterling7]

I love it when games give you the options of "cruel and heartless" or "kind, but stupid", and then expect you to feel admonished for the result... of their failing to give you a better, and sometimes obvious, option.

[@averywhitaker3513]

Imagine that circumstance in the trolley problem. Theres another track with no one tied to it, but the person who put you in the situation keeps telling you that you just have to pick one of the other tracks.

[@BenjaminYocum]

The funny thing is that I usually agree with the heartless or cruel option considering the circumstances. Sometimes people talk too much/want to do too much/feel too much.

[@taylor3950]

Yeah, was there really no “sick family stays in quarantine”

[@wyvernhattori1811]

​@@taylor3950This ☝️ I hate that the game wants to "teach" you that not all is good and well and easy decision, that the world is more nuanced, not black and white. But then they give you exactly two options: black and white.

[@ravenanne1734]

​@@taylor3950 especially when they think it's a punishment from the gods.... And sometimes the gods let people survive the disease... So by killing them preemptively you might be denying a god

[@psycholuigiman]

Suspicious Beggar from Bloodborne was honestly so suspicious that I think most people could tell right away that the "nice' thing to do was to not send him to the chapel. For God's sake, you literally catch him red handed and eating people when you first meet him.

[@beesforbreakfast]

“Your sins against humanity cannot be forgiven! Judgment upon thee!” froths my character; a chewed umbilical cord hanging from their mouth, chugging morphine in wretched half-pint gulps and visibly ripped to the tits on prostitute’s blood

[@drake713]

Yeah, send everyone with their wits about them over, last I checked cannibalism wasn't it

[@mami3790]

I havent played much Bloodborne but why doesn't the incense ward him off since he's a 'monster'?

[@psycholuigiman]

@@mami3790 Put simply, the incense probably only wards off the monsters who have lost their minds. Ya know, cuz wild animals will run from unpleasant smells, but a human will put up with it if it means they might get something. Also, Suspicious Beggar technically hangs out right outside the front door, rather than inside. I've always presumed he somehow lures other NPCs out of the chapel before killing them.

[@warp302]

​@psycholuigiman only plated a small amount of bloodborne but couldn't you send the begger to the clinic instead and if so what happens

[@zulubunsen9067]

9:02 Mike's "I'm a complex, three-dimentional character" dance had me in tears, he's been on a roll recently.

[@mattball8622]

I love that he couldn't even say the line without laughing. Big Tim Curry SPAAAYCE energy.

[@Daktangle]

On the plus side in Bloodborne, if you have unlocked Iosefka's Clinic, you can send the begger there instead, where he isn't a problem anymore!

[@SolaScientia]

Or pick a fight with him where you find him. That's what I did. I knew he'd kill everyone if I sent him to the Chapel, but I also didn't really want to send him to the Clinic. I smacked him with my saw cleaver and while I knew he'd transformed, I was not expecting...that. At that point in the game he took me about 4 attempts to kill. Worth it for the blood echoes though.

[@metalsiren6338]

@@SolaScientia I always get him from behind and visceral. Fun fact, he's extremely weak to slow poison, so you can cheese him in the small corridor near him with poison knives. Otherwise, oil and molotovs for the win. Works the same for the chalice dungeons versions, but you gotta keep moving because he will close distances in seconds.

[@Ahrpigi]

Going there does make him a little blue, though...

[@SolaScientia]

@@metalsiren6338 I ran out of poison knives the first time I fought him. It wasn't too bad though.

[@metalsiren6338]

@@SolaScientia Sometimes that's happened to me, too. His beast form is very erratic and makes aiming a pain.

[@Akldog04]

You really should have mentioned that moment in until Dawn where while playing as Matt, you’ll find a flare gun your girlfriend demands. If you give it to her, and decide to try to save her later you die automatically! You either have to refuse to give her the flaregun, for seemingly no reason, or refuse to save her when she would probably die.

[@myounakami]

I was wondering if anyone else would mention this one; there's also some added bs for him where even if you don't give Emily the fare gun, he'll waste the shot early on for _whatever_ reason if you don't argue with her about going to the Fire Tower.

[@mistahl5350]

Yeah, if you play him as good boyfriend (read as agreeing with everything Emily says to or demands of Matt) the entire time, he is guaranteed to die.

[@katier9725]

AKA not so much "good boyfriend" (TM) and more like "total doormat".

[@sofieschuurman3746]

@@katier9725well his name is matt for a reason

[@averynaiveoddish7052]

@@mistahl5350 it's not being a good boyfriend it's letting emily step all over you, that choice is showing whether or not you're gonna have matt let her go

[@emeraldaly7646]

The beggar doesn't stay inside the Chapel, because as the Chapel Dweller says, "the incense wards off the beasts." Clever clue to his true nature.

[@technodude458]

that and the bodies

[@JaelinBezel]

What a terrible thing to say about beggars

[@CalvinSmart-tq5hd]

​@@JaelinBezel he would beat up another beggar if hes not given moneylike the other beggar did to him

[@nightsong81]

Considering that Prof. X loves helping psychic teens with issues both develop their gifts and work through their trauma, I'm pretty sure he'd jump at the chance to get Alex on the team. Or at least into the school.

[@beesforbreakfast]

“If I can get just ONE emotionally vulnerable teenage psionic to graduation without them burning the world down, I can finally retire. Hm? ‘Without projecting my own creepy psychosexual issues onto them’ you say? Listen buddy, I’m a PROFESSOR.”

[@nightsong81]

@@beesforbreakfast lol nice

[@videogamefan101]

Well, I'm sure he'd roll at the chance. Since he's wheelchair bound.

[@MediaWhorz]

I honestly found LiS's True Colors to be pretty clear. It's a question of whether the emotions are letting the character build and move forward. Gabe's girlfriend was moving through the stages of grief, but Alex interrupted that, causing her to emotionally detach, but it was the inverse with the sheriff. His fear was paralyzing him, and he couldn't move forward because of it.

[@palmagius]

agreed but with somewhat different reasoning. when i played through the game the first time, i didnt take away the anger because alex had no right of taking it since it came internally. there wasnt any external force that forced anger onto her, it derived from herself after facing loss. as for pike, that fear came from an external force. by a company forcing that fear onto him to make him compliant.

[@woodpecker8116]

Taking away feelings is just wrong no matter what.

[@FelisImpurrator]

​@@woodpecker8116Why? At least the other comments have actual reasoning.

[@poshboy4749]

​@@palmagiusHer boyfriend dying wasn't external?

[@pastaman68]

​@@poshboy4749grief is an internal process that you have to go through and overcome to be stronger

[@HariGtt]

Kreia is an excellent moral compass that did nothing wrong. Well, except all the murdering and stuff. And the training of several Sith that did more killing and stuff. Oh, and the lying to the exile. Ok, maybe Kreia should not be your moral compass.

[@willieoelkers5568]

And all the pseudo-Nietzchian buzzwording.

[@ka-mai]

She's an astonishingly bad teacher. Like, almost everything she says is some kind of stupid and/or nihilistic bs.

[@hannarchy6554]

The point that always stuck with me, and I'm surprised they didn't mention, is that while yes Kreia absolutely rakes you over the coals for being nice and tells you "you might do more damage with an open hand than with a clenched fist", if you're mean to the guy... she absolutely rakes you over the coals for it and interrogates your petty cruelty. And maybe I'm a "compulsive people pleaser" who "automatically seeks approval from everybody in a position of power over her" and has a "desperate lack of internal self-worth" but it always upset me that there was no way to do something she approved of in that situation. I just want to make her proud of me :(

[@Lavarpsu10]

@@hannarchy6554 Lost influence: Kreia.

[@khamjaninja.]

@@hannarchy6554 You want her approval? Kreia would _severely_ disapprove of that. I think Kreia is an interesting case. She's not Light Side or Dark Side - she wants to do away with both. She despises the Force because of its pattern of balancing Light and Dark, which drives conflict that constantly upturns the galaxy. Jedi and Sith continually rising against each other, leading to great wars and destruction, and when the victors arise in triumph, nobody thinks of the cost. *Spoilers for KOTOR 2* If there's a theme to KOTOR 2, that's it - questioning whether the Force is actually a beneficial thing. The Mandalorian Wars began because the Mandalorians invaded the Republic, with implied influence from the Sith. That led to Revan and his faction of Jedi breaking away from the Council to fight the Mandalorians. Which segued into a civil war between Revan's faction and the Council, which led to the events of KOTOR 1. Which leads to the setup of KOTOR 2, where the galaxy is in disarray from generations of war, rogue bands of Sith roam around killing people, the Republic is disintegrating, and millions - perhaps billions - are dead and millions or billions of refugees are struggling to survive. Whether the Light Side or the Dark Side triumph, the outcome is generations of suffering and destruction among the masses of people who suffer and die offscreen. The main character is an ex-general from Revan's faction who walked away into exile after ordering the planet-cidal event that won the war. She was the one who defeated the Mandalorians, but she couldn't accept the cost. She is the embodiment of Kreia's argument - she detached from the Force after witnessing the destruction she herself had carried out, because of the Force influenced her. Influenced her indirectly, perhaps. Indirectly, the Force maintains this seesaw of Light and Dark that drives this continual cycle of violence and destruction. I think KOTOR 2 is unique in that it's the only Star Wars plot that questions the fundamental morality in the Star Wars universe - the Force. (caveat, I haven't read all the Expanded Universe and whatnot, because dude - who has the time?) It's not standard "Light = good/Dark = evil". Or the supposedly more nuanced "Dark = maybe not that bad?/Light = IMO da Jedi are evil". Fundamentally, is it a positive thing that this Force exists that drives Light/Dark conflict? And I think that's a valid question. Morality in the Star Wars universe might be fundamentally flawed.

[@Jonathon_Hennessey]

In the original Dark Souls you meet a character named Lautrec. If you release him from his cell, he gives you a sunlight medal as thanks. When you come back from ringing both bells of awakening, he's murdered the firekeeper at Firelink Shrine and taken her soul. You do have the option to invade his world in Anor Londo and kill him in retaliation however.

[@metalsiren6338]

Oh yeah, Lautrec is the worst. I know a lot of people kick him off the ledge in Firelink for his ring and humanity when they get the chance because they don't want to have to go through all that. I don't even think doing that even counts as a sin to Oswald.

[@Ahrpigi]

Losing Firelink is such a pain in the ass, Lautrec is going over the cliff every single time.

[@kuyagab4444]

​@@Ahrpigithis is further incentivised by the fact that he always drops the Ring of Favor and Protection (a very nice early game item)

[@gdclemo]

There's also Yurt the Silent Chief in Demon's Souls, who you free from a cage in Upper Latria but who goes on to kill most of the NPCs in the Nexus - seems like this is a recurring theme in Fromsoft games.

[@rissaarei5336]

I don't think that counts. I didn't release him, but he still got out and now I'm without Firelink. The Dead Sea has nothing on how salty I feel about that fact.

[@moonlight2870]

In the first life is strange you can warn Victoria that Nathan is a creep. If you do she goes to talk with the actual villain and ends up getting captured.

[@NehnBellanaris]

Andy, you forgot the other consequence for doing that Witcher mission. If you do it after the Crones give it to you, and you free the spirit, then there's the added consequence is that the Baron's wife is turned into a monster. However, if you do the mission BEFORE the Crones give it to you, and you still free the spirit, then they'll drive the Baron's wife insane instead. So either way, there's an added consequence to freeing the spirit.

[@Eadwulf_Skald]

She's driven insane with several of the options though, not sure how limited the monster option is.

[@tjrogerson7623]

IMO the main consequence is if you save the kids and the Baron's wife gets turned into a monster, you have to kill her and the baron later hangs himself. Which leaves his lieutenant in charge, who is quite possibly the WORST man for the job as he ramps taxes through the roof and regularly brutalizes the populace for his own amusement leaving the place poorer and more desolate then it already was. And it was pretty poor and desolate. Whereas if you kill the spirit and let the kids die, she goes insane, the baron takes her to a holy man and eventually returns to rule the land and things get better. Or as better as they get in Witcher. If however like me you want to be that stubborn bastard who refuses to let ANYBODY die and must save everyone, there is a trick. Instead of waiting until the crone's tell you to go kill the spirit, if you find the spirit BEFORE going to the crone's village and free it, then the game treats the baron's wife as if the kids had died and she goes insane, but later on when you go to the orphanage, they're all there and alive. Oh and the whole bit about the village getting destroyed? Yeah not really a downside. Turns out they all made deals with the crones and regularly send kids to them to be eaten and do other nasty deeds in exchange for the crone's favors.

[@Lavarpsu10]

Ok but with Kreia if you do the mean thing in that encounter on Nar Shaada, it still turns out bad and she still criticizes you for it! The beggar then goes away empty-handed and is the one who does the mugging/killing of someone else rather than being the one assaulted. Kreia is all about "I'm-the-center-of-the-universe-and-you're-all-idiots" Ayn Rand superiority, not a cohesive moral framework.

[@KaleFelbrave]

It's almost like it's her job to beTreya you... oh wait... OHHHHH! 😂 yeah, she seems to play the devil's advocate for your actions. Never happy with your decisions.

[@centerflag982]

Gotta say, I never looked at Kreia from that angle before... the Randist angle makes a ton of sense - and frankly doesn't reflect too well on Avellone given she's his all-but-explicitly acknowledged author mouthpiece

[@AndrewsYoutube]

When I saw Mei Wong from 'Fallout 3' in the intro, I thought for sure Tenpenny Tower and the 'truce' you can work out with Roy Phillips and his ghouls would be on this list. That one is a real kick in the pants if you do the 'morally correct' option and you don't know what happens later.

[@tubensalat1453]

Is she connected to Tenpenny Tower? Since I didn't like the people there I once sided with the ghouls to kill everyone, but then reverted to an earlier save. Just left the situation as it was every other time. Not my business. And I don't like to remove traders from games.

[@DFloyd84]

@@tubensalat1453 Mei Wong used to "work" for Alistair Tenpenny but managed to escape and get to Rivet City, where Harkness is keeping her safe.

[@tubensalat1453]

@@DFloyd84 Ah. I only remember giving her money for a gun.

[@AndrewsYoutube]

@@tubensalat1453 : Nah. Mei is just an escaped slave you can encounter in Rivet City. But when I saw her in the video, I thought 'Fallout 3' and thought "I know which quest they are going to cover. 😏". That was, until I didn't see 'Fallout 3' in the spoiler list. That Tenpenny/ghouls quest got me the first time I played. I was so mad, I reloaded an old save.

[@tubensalat1453]

@@AndrewsKZbin I looked up the quest; understandable that you were not happy with the "truce". ;)

[@BURGATRON]

In Dragon Age, if you give your spare change to an elf beggar, the next time you pass through, more elves come asking for change. And if you still oblige them, even more after that. At some point, there was a whole mob of them asking for change. Had to tell them to go away because I was running out of money

[@clothar23]

You can also just call them out on their bs lie. Like did you even examine the reply choices in DA or do you just click the the first one and call it a day ?

[@BURGATRON]

@@clothar23I was doing a goody two shoes playthrough. My character didn't accept any shady quests, didn't steal, doesn't make out with Morrigan in the end. Because of the first two, I was always low on cash for equipment. Hence why I had no money to give the elf beggars. I really did want to see what happened if you just kept giving to them though.

[@Baeraad]

Having played a City Elf who felt inclined to share his new wealth with his former peeps, I can report that they do *eventually* go away if you keep paying them. Takes a while, though. 😅

[@joenesvick7043]

They stop after the third time. By that time in the game, I have a lot, and that's before the mods giving me even more money

[@clothar23]

@@BURGATRON How are you out of money even without doing by your opinion the shady quests ? Just selling the gear you loot off enemies is enough to see you through. Not to mention the plethora of perfectly legit quests and their ample rewards. Just the Chanter's boards alone offer enough to keep anyone going. There's also the infinite money glitch if you're really that hopeless.

[@Ottertone]

I just played a quest in Dragon's Dogma where you have to evict a family from a home. You can choose to evict them or you can pay their rent and they stay. Clearly, you would imagine letting them stay would be a kindness, but later in the game that area of the city is destroyed and the mom and dad die to leave the child sad and angry at you, the player, for not forcing them out of their home (or something). Kicking them out saves their lives! Crazy!

[@Death2all546]

I can understand the unintended consequence of helping them stay in their house causing them to die when that part of the city gets destroyed. Unintended consequences happen often. What bothers me is the child being angry at the player specifically instead of whatever destroyed the city. The only way that makes sense is from the perspective of knowing it’s a video game and the only thing that could have saved them from the scripted destruction of their home is the player picking the quest option to kick them out.

[@gothicbutterfly013]

Its because the option that lets them stay involves buying the labd the house is on yourself, because the whole reason thier landlord wants them out is to sell the land.

[@lisah-p8474]

The city is destroyed in a dragon/monster based cataclysm but everybody knows it's YOUR fault because you're the chosen one or whatever. They even send soldiers to come arrest you. How this actual child is so well versed in the intricacies of this situation is beyond me.

[@gothicbutterfly013]

@lisah-p8474 I mean, everyone's blaming you because the crazy Duke who rules the city is blaming you and ordering his guards to attack you on sight after he himself nearly died trying to kill you. And considering the population thinks he killed the previous dragon and he's claiming you made a deal with it to cause this disaster and make him suddenly super old, its not entirely unreasonable for them to believe his claims when they dont have the same information we do.

[@MidnightLost01]

Funny enough, if you lash out at the begger, Kreia will lecture you about needlessly lashing out at people too.

[@sporf_sporf]

Which makes way more sense than her berating for charity. Her reasoning on charity makes no sense.

[@MinorityMan121]

​@sporf_sporf It makes perfect sense if you pay attention to her lessons. You're not helping the begger by giving him money, you made him a target. The entire time she is trying to show you that just helping ppl without thinking about how they will survive after you're gone is selfish. You're only satisfying your morals without causing any helpful lasting good. Like finding him a job.

[@anarchodin]

@@MinorityMan121 When a game actively sets you up to think of a character as a moral guide to prepare a twist that involves them being an unrepentant mass murderer and then has the temerity to suggest that they were right ... I kinda don't think the moral reasoning of either the character or the developer is worth deep analysis.

[@nicholasfarrell5981]

And then he mugs the guy who mugs him in the Charity version of the encounter.

[@Awesomesufff]

Kreia is an enlightened centrist idiot

[@robertparker8118]

'Geez, someone got up on the Sith side of the bed.' Peak Oxbox right here

[@jacksonskinner7879]

You forgot that time in Dracula Unleashed where you stop to help that lady in an alley, but it turns out she's the Beaufa Lady and kills you.

[@FelisImpurrator]

Now that is an ancient reference. I read a guide on that game once. *Bloofer Lady, though. Actual historical term.

[@Fenizrael]

Beaufa Deez Nuts!

[@kilyaded7332]

Beaufa deez nuts

[@moonlight2870]

Beaufa deez nuts

[@chrismanuel9768]

Beaufa Lady? You mean Lady Beaufa? Cuz she la- beaufa -dies nuts on yo face?

[@Lawrence_Talbot]

Kreia took “give a man a fish… teach a man to fish” to a whole new level.

[@SirStanleytheStumbler]

To be fair she also goes off if you kill everyone you see for no reason

[@druman890]

@@SirStanleytheStumbler Pretty sure she is programmed to contradict every choice you make. Her whole purpose is to make you second-guess everything you do.

[@SirStanleytheStumbler]

@@druman890 because her lessons are grey

[@Sandrock999999999]

@@druman890there are a few choices that she actually does praise you for, they are just not conventional choices, and thus difficult to find. For example, if you are rolling a dark sider, you get a certain berserker as a party member. When you do, she teaches you to tap into his rage and use it for your own power, giving you an ability. You can, however, chose to deny that ability after the lesson. She asks why and you are given a bunch of options, from goody two shoes to murder hobo to everything in between. But if you tell her "i cannot rely on others for my power, I will find my own way." (Or something to that effect) she tells you you passed the lesson. The problem isn't she is designed to contradict you, but that she contradicts the conventional lessons taught to jedi/sith. She is also a cranky old woman who is difficult to please…

[@davidmcgill1000]

@@SirStanleytheStumbler Yep. Unlike the jedi and the sith, she is a true neutral. She wants balance in the force.

[@MisterYankou]

The ability to sense feelings it would actually be really useful to the X-Men because you could suss out someone's motivations.

[@beesforbreakfast]

A job, in X-Men stories, that could typically be done just as well by a sticker printer jammed on the “huge racist” setting

[@beesforbreakfast]

Or indeed by Empath, who’s been around since (I think) 1984 or so, and who nobody really remembers or uses, because he’s got a robust suite of feelings-powers and is STILL absolutely rubbish

[@chrismanuel9768]

No. Only feelings. You can be scared, angry, content, happy, or horny for a whole lot of reasons. Mystique shows up and puts a gun to my head I'm not gonna register as scared if you know what I'm saying.

[@MisterYankou]

@@chrismanuel9768 but if someone registers an emotion in response to something, then that can still be useful intel.

[@electricspider2267]

Facebook would really like to know how you feel about these [marketable-item-name-plural]

[@dorianwiesner4477]

And if you save the orphans, not only do you kill the villagers, but also Anna, which leads to Phillip hanging himself.

[@MarkDeSade100]

This happened to me. 😅Later I realized that I should have figured out who the spirit in the tree really is, because the game gives you the clues to do so. I had actually read a book that mentioned it earlier in the game, then forgot about it because there are 1000 things to do in The Witcher 3.

[@ShadowJCreed]

Yeah then if you let the crones eat the orphans you spare Anna's life but she's been brought to insanity after losing them and the Baron helps bring her to a healer in a distance place. Strangely that seems like the good ending compared to her being transformed into a waterhag, dying after being cured and having the Baron kill himself. If you free the spirit before even meeting the Crones you also get the orphans die and Anna lives ending

[@Subject_1Alpha]

You could just say fuck the kids all together and go to the tree before you meet the crones and free it without the promise of freeing the children. This way the horse is free to wreak havoc on the crones and Anna is saved.

[@EmperorSeth]

This one's really a case of no right answer since you have to pick who you end up saving. A bunch of dead orphans isn't exactly a good ending, either. A better example might be the one where you help a sad ghost escape being imprisoned in a tower. Except, whoops, she's actually a plague monster and you freeing her gets a lot of people killed. I started paying a lot more attention on quests after that one.

[@ShadowJCreed]

@@EmperorSeth that quest is also a bit of a similar case since if you don't set her free from the tower you bring her former lover to the tower to help break the curse. He has to kiss her to break it, (the scene is a bit gross especially since they emphasis her long wraith tongue) the kiss purifies her from being a pesta to becoming a regular spirit that can finally pass on but at the same time he dies immediately from the kiss. But I guess one guy dying is better then a plague wraith being free to roam the world

[@NMN]

I ran into the Blood Fever quest before talking to Phoibe, but I started playing Odyssey midway through the Lockdown, and "*cough cough* We are hardly sick, we will be fine I promise" hit kinda different, sorry about your family and everything but /walks away to stabbing sounds. I'd love to see the Ubisoft telemetry over time for this mission.

[@jessetorres8738]

I'm surprised you guys left the Infamous games off the list. There are times where you can be a hero yet the game & environment still punishes you for your decision.

[@deadersurvival4716]

I'd imagine they got left off the list because that's the point of the game. It's an assassin sim, effectively. While you can take a body, it makes your life easier. By your logic, not killing random NPCs in the Hitman games counts.

[@Gamer88334]

To be fair, they make sure you know about the consequences before you make your decision most of the time. Also, the first 2 games eventually rewarded you for being good by having NPCs to fight alongside you. They did very little damage, but they could stunlock enemies.

[@robtaber5687]

​@@deadersurvival4716Infamous is the superhero-ish games with Cole and his electric powers and Delsin with his copycat powers. The only assassin Sim happens when you make the evil quest choices, and even then it is rare when you need to assassinate someone.

[@deadersurvival4716]

@@robtaber5687 My dude, I've never played Infamous. I've only ever seen clips of it, ON THIS CHANNEL. And even I know it's a stealth game. Superhero and stealth do not go together.

[@EmperorSeth]

@@deadersurvival4716 Did you mean Dishonored? They are similarly named.

[@HyperKunoichi]

While the game itself doesn't do much to actively punish you for it, the ending of the "Origin of the Gray Prince" quest in Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion still feels like a punch in the gut after everything you go through to complete it. You get asked by Agronak gro-Malog, the Grand Champion of the Arena (and the final boss of the Arena questline as a whole), to find proof of his ancestry, believing that he might be descended from a noble of some kind. Turns out, his father was indeed a noble...and also a vampire. And since vampires have a tendency to be treated as one of the most evil things a person can become within the setting, the champ didn't take that news very well. Man is so devastated by the news that he completely loses all will to fight back if, after completing said quest, you challenge him for his title, and literally all he does is stand there and literally BEG YOU to kill him. It's so bad that it even counts as murdering an innocent civilian in order to kick off the Dark Brotherhood questline, though there are thankfully no other repercussions from killing him in this manner. Either way, kinda sours the mood for anyone who (like me) had been expecting the final battle of the Arena questline to be an epic duel to the death.

[@seanwang6143]

I actually like that quest line from a role-playing perspective. It's fun to imagine that the Dark Brotherhood chooses you for induction because they realize how powerful of a killer you are after defeating the Grey Prince

[@electricspider2267]

I havent played that game in an embarrasing number of years, but still that quest is like a core memory. That and the pincushion full of arrows blabbing about the end of world crap in the city of Anvil

[@persephoneunderground845]

​@electricspider2267 such a good quest. I think I stopped doing it or lied to him in future playthroughs after I found out the ending because I wanted a real Grand Champion battle. It was kinder to let him die not knowing, in a real fight, and didn't make me feel like a fraud in the Arena. It's a great RP moment for my evil characters to tell him and feel all clever and manipulative when I was playing full evil though!

[@Professional_Ghost]

That quest in Fallout 3 I'll never forget. The one where you persuade the residents of Tenpenny Tower to let the ghouls living in the metro tunnels move in. Then you come back a week or so later to find they've all been murdered by the leader of the ghoul group and fed to a large pack of feral ghouls.

[@TeraunceFoaloke]

There is a good end to that option if you stealthily assassinate the Ghouls' Leader right after the ghouls move in.

[@Airlord3670]

That scene from KOTOR II has always stuck with me. Especially when I reloaded a save and didn’t give the beggar money, and Kreia gives a different speech and the cutscene shows the beggar getting so desperate he robs someone instead. So I tried to take the game’s message about balance to heart and wasn’t pure Sith or Jedi, making decisions based on the situation and my feelings at the time. The result? I didn’t actually hit the pre-requisites for a prestige class by the end of the game because you needed to be either so Jedi or Sith before you can. Feel like maybe there’s some gameplay/story issues there…

[@MrKiall1982]

KOTOR II is, in my mind, one of the greatest examples of a game's ambitions being far greater than the time/budget it needed/deserved. Alpha Protocol is the same and not shockingly from the same developer.

[@ryangale3757]

@@MrKiall1982 Ah, thanks for the reminder, I do love me some Alpha Protocol, but dang, does it feel like it's missing something. Have always felt like it was just too short for the ambition it had, which is a shame cause on paper, man, what a game.

[@Airlord3670]

@@MrKiall1982 Honestly, watching the Last Jedi gave me the same vibes of somebody really wanting to actually explore and subvert the established binary nature of the Star Wars good vs evil narrative… and not quite pulling it off. I appreciate the attempts though.

[@centerflag982]

@@MrKiall1982 Obsidian failing to set realistic ambitions and then failing to meet their ambitions when reality comes knocking? Nooo, never

[@Maceman486]

Vampyre is another great example. If you choose not to feed on any of the npc's you can have dialogue with you are consistently underleveled as you progress and are forced to do a lot of side quests and tedious doctoring to have a chance.

[@thelordaethereal]

Why is the Irina/Hyetta questline from Elden Ring not on this list? Irina's death and you inheriting the Frenzied Flame seem like pretty harsh punishments for trying to help.

[@Mgtowhonesty]

just for perspective, if alex's powers are strong enough, she could in theory, depower the hulk by preventing him from getting angry or auto transform him back to banner or prevent the hulk entirely by seeing in real time the anger threshold it takes to trigger the transformation. she wouldn't make a good X-man i guess but an absolutely crucial avenger. Edit: it takes literally no effort to annoy people too stupid to see the point of a comment. Its pathetic

[@insaincaldo]

Not a good x-man huh? like people messing with other peoples minds are not among the strongest. But also Mantis

[@Mgtowhonesty]

@@insaincaldo i dont care. Im quoting what was expressed in the video

[@insaincaldo]

@@Mgtowhonesty If you don't wanna interact with people on the internet, put nothing on the internet. Also that is not how quoting works.

[@Mgtowhonesty]

@@insaincaldo then watch the video, he said she would make a bad x man. Stop whining at me because i quoted it

[@insaincaldo]

@@Mgtowhonesty That is what I'm explaining to you, you did not. You keep using words you clearly do not understand.

[@ryproar11]

The blood sickness spreads across all of the map later too. You can hear random citizens coughing abd occasionally find dead folk in their homes and fields. Second play through i walked away. Nothing happened after that.

[@Tuaron]

I can't believe we don't even get an excerpt of this disco vampire screenplay. That's what I get for being nice and giving this video a thumbs-up early on.

[@emeguta8651]

Whenever a punishment video comes up, I always think of Dragon Age 2. That game was so depressing.

[@Icam_here]

i remember agonizing over taking Charlotte's anger in Lis True colors or not and instantly regretted it when i did. it felt like the nice think to do because her rage was so powerful and dangerous but seeing how numb it made her i had to use real world time rewinding powers (loading back to before that moment) to change that decision which i normally don't like to do.

[@Psalm23_4]

Alex should have read Terry Pratchett's discworld books, especially the Tiffany Aching ones. If she is gonna take away pain, she cant let it touch her. Be the center of the see-saw. Balance.

[@STRAKAZulu]

“Give Kreia a hand… because she needs one!” Been taking lessons from Ellen, I see.

[@Mustafa_9628]

I knew charlotte had to deal with her own grief and anger when i played LIS TC I just knew it 😅 And the best ending is when you take the cop’s fear from corporate which enables you to take it down Now I have seen this one I know I’m a better judgment person than I realized 😂

[@Nymphonomicon]

I thank the internet for giving me this quote: "Cool Fact: In Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords, Darth Sion is described as always being in indescribable pain. This is NOT because his entire body is a mortal wound and he is only kept alive because of the Dark Side of the Force and his own anger, but because he is Scottish."

[@armelior4610]

If you're going with characters dissing you for good deeds : "Morrigan dispproves" And if you choose to support the honorable, non-fratricidal dwarf future king he will doom his entire race in the long run according to the ending (because he's also a pig-headed traditionalist) - just one of many choices that could be in this list in DA origins

[@centerflag982]

Yeah Bhelen may be a(n indirect) murderer but he's also an absolute visionary for his struggling (to be hilariously optimistic) people

[@nicholasfarrell5981]

Slight nitpick on the Morrowind entry. The Amulet of Shadows grants you Chameleon, an effect that makes it easier for you to stay hidden when in stealth mode. Granted, 100% Chameleon is effectively "Invisibility but more bester" since it doesn't turn off when you perform any non-moving action, and the Amulet of Shadows' magic stacks with the Ring of Surroundings that Larrius Varro gives you after you perform an extrajudicial execution on some Camonna Tong thugs in Balmora to give you that 100% Chameleon.

[@joenesvick7043]

When Kreia says I shouldn't trust any of my companions, I straight out tell her: "actually if there's anyone I don't trust, it's you"

[@shinigamimiroku3723]

And IIRC, she's absolutely fine with that. 😂

[@G00N3R7883]

Dark Pictures - Devil In Me Spoiler Warning. There's a scene towards the end of the game where some of the player characters are hiding from the killer in a guest house. (In my playthough I had Jamie and Kate). Upon entering the guest house you'll meet a dog. Shortly afterwards it seems that the killer is close, so the characters hide in a room, with the dog. As the killer is searching around, the dog starts to growl. Jamie, the playable character for this scene, is holding a broken bottle near the dog's neck. I immediately knew what would happen, and decided "I am not killing the dog". Obviously, after ignoring the prompt, the dog barked and alerted the killer to our location. I was expecting the dog to attack the killer, allowing us to escape. But instead, the killer swung his axe directly into the top of Jamie's head, killing her. Kate and the dog escaped. I did later get an achievement for saving the dog, and as Jamie was generally annoying, I considered it to be a worthwhile trade, but still, I made the "good" choice and got punished by losing one of the playable characters.

[@MunchKING]

In Galactic Civilizations 2, you often have opportunities that frame themselves as moral quandaries. However the rewards structure is usually Evil: Massive buff in exchange for a small penalty (Usually to population), Neutral Small reward, and Good: Massive penelties for small or no reward. Once you research a tech to define your civ's morality though, Good gets a bunch of Diplomacy and Culture buffs, while Evil gets a bunch of War/agression buffs. And these opprotunities stop showing up. So it really does feel like some really powerful alien was judging your morality, like Q or something.

[@dansmith1661]

You can also bribe the galaxy into believing you are the other sense of morality if you switch. It costs more, but those Evil guy buffs made the early game so much better.

[@desertrose4days]

You could've done like 3 sections on the Bloody Baron for the witcher. Setting the spirit free after meeting the hags ends with him hanging himself. I still remember being shocked when the quest ended.

[@caramelvictim193]

I have no sympathy for him 😂 classic example of wait, my actions have consequences???? :0

[@studentjohn]

Can i just say I am 100% here for Andy's Blood Fever screenplay - when does it drop?

[@garymacalister]

There is the section in Elden Ring where you give Boc the Larval tear so he can become human again, only to realise that when he tried to use it it actually overpowers him and he dies. Sad times...

[@Ecroose]

A game that was really interesting with its morality mechanic was Soul Sacrifice. In it, you play a sorcerer whose job is "murder in the name of justice" where your targets are giant monsters that were people who have succumbed to desire and made monkeys paw wishes on a magic chalice. After you beat the monster down it reverys back to a person who starts begging for their life. At that point you have a choice. Save? Or Sacrifice? Saving a person is you forgiving them of their crimes, turning them into an ally to battle with you. But Sacrificing upholds the code and delivers justice for all the people they killed and destruction wrought.

[@JohannesP93]

As Morrowind came up in the spoiler-crawl i had a suspicion. And i was not wrong and happy you covered that quest. Since this i had the quote "No good deed goes unpunished" embedded in my head ...

[@listerofsmeg884]

With the first one, I didn't take away her negative feelings. Partly because the way the game was going, that seemed the right choice. And partly because I heard Captain Kirk in Star Trek V in my head.

[@OptimusSledge]

Plus the Original Series episode "The Enemy Within," where Kirk is split into a "good" version and an "evil" version, and the moral of the show is realising that Kirk needs both "sides" of himself to be a good captain.

[@listerofsmeg884]

@@OptimusSledge not seen much of the OS. But 'i don't want my pain taken away, I need my pain' instantly resonated

[@DEEJAYWAL]

Interestingly enough, in another TOS episode, Requiem For Methuselah, Kirk takes the opposite viewpoint. When the android "girl of the week" dies, Kirk takes it pretty hard, saying "I wish I could forget" before falling asleep. Spock then mindmelds with him and says "Forget". I'd have thought that if there was any woman he'd want to forget because of the pain it would be Edith Keeler. In her case he had to actively make the decision to let her die, rather than have it be an unintended consequence of his actions like this one.

[@Hauke-ph5ui]

The Whispering Hillock quest is actually very, very obvious. At this point everyone who explored a bit and payed attention to the books and the lore should have figured out that this spirit is actually the mother of the crones and way, way worse than her daughters. Not to mention that even in this imprisoned state the spirit already killed dozens if not hundreds of people. Everyone who pays even a little bit of attention should have figured out by then that saving the children is the wrong choice and in all honesty - if the people at risk in the swamp village would be adults 99 % of the people who made the wrong choice here wouldn't even think a second about freeing the spirit. Not to mention that the destruction of the village is just the beginning of the spirit's rampage. You should have chosen the quest A Tower full of Mice instead because it is much harder to figure out what the good decision is in that quest.

[@srbu8650]

Tower of mice was a real head spinner....I think in my first run I had brought the ghost to her boyfriend and then she ate him or something and I was so confused.....it was kind of hilarious......is there any good ending to that quest?

[@ryangale3757]

Good lord, Mike is on FIRE in this one, don't know I've laughed so much at his jokes yet, top tier performance Mr. Channell. And also, Blood Fever is 100% a great name for a vampire movie set in the disco era, I agree with Andy, somebody get on that!

[@mikaelthomas1138]

15:51 Mike's got the look of a dude who just binged Morrowind for 100+ hours. We're here for you brother. Also here's a tip: grab the Boots of Blinding Speed from the NPC outside of Caldera, and the amulet in Tel Fyr which resists enough magic for you to still be able to see. It makes the long walks much easier. Also Creeper.

[@SolaScientia]

Ah yes, the Suspicious Beggar in Bloodborne. I knew what he would do if I sent him to the Chapel. I also decided that I didn't want to send him to the Clinic either. Instead I decided to pick a fight with him in the Forbidden Woods. He's totally killable at the point in the game, but it's a bit of a tough fight and the run back to him can be annoying. I wish Luke had picked a fight with him the first time just so we could have seen his reaction to a giant electric beast. He's not exactly huddled among those bodies. You interrupted him mid-meal. Also, I wonder whose Bloodborne capture that is. Whoever it is wisely started a new game so as not to ruin their current one (they also probably did a speed run to get to that point in the game without changing clothes or really leveling up). They also didn't talk with the false Iosefka since that option isn't listed there when talking to the Suspicious Beggar. The other "nice" thing is if you send anyone to Iosefka's Clinic. She's replaced with an imposter who experiments on anyone you send and turns them into the celestial beings (blue aliens).

[@umbraestragis]

I'm curious as to why the beggar doesn't try to eat the player as well. Is there any explaination given in-game?

[@SolaScientia]

@@umbraestragis Nope. He just attacks everyone who's at the Chapel.

[@umbraestragis]

@@SolaScientia Are there any other safe havens besides the Chapel and Clinic? Or is there any lore related to him to be found in the game world? Either via NPCs or on a dead body? Maybe those bodies he was eating when we found him?

[@SolaScientia]

@@umbraestragis The Chapel is the only safe haven. The Clinic isn't safe. An imposter takes over and will experiment on anyone you send there. The Suspicious Begger has no real lore but it is his family he was eating. Most of it is from dialogue, I believe. He's acting sketchy when you find him, which should be the first clue that he's sus.

[@SolaScientia]

@@umbraestragis Somehow missed this one way back. Whoops. No, there are no other safe havens to send anyone to. There isn't really any lore related to him. He's just some NPC that you really shouldn't send anywhere except the Clinic to the false Iosefka. I'm not sure how we learn it (I think if we opt to send him to the Chapel we maybe find out from him), but we know the bodies he's eating are likely his family.

[@hoodiegal]

The Morrowind one made me think of the quest in Oblivion where you are asked with retrieving a ring from the bottom of a well, but oops, the quest giver forgot to mention it's cursed and weighs you down, putting you at risk of drowning before you can resurface. Unless you're an argonian, who can breathe underwater. In which case, it's a very silly quest.

[@lucyana1599]

This reminds me of the part in Fallout 3 where you find a tower full of people who are quite well off, as far as post apocalypse living goes, and there’s some ghouls who want to move in - you can convince all the humans and all the ghouls to all live together in the tower and share it peacefully! Which they do for about three days, until they murder all the humans and stuff them in a closet. Great

[@notthedroidsyourelookingfo4026]

The "Amulet of Shadows" is one of the most powerful items in Morrowind, that you'll probably get in basically every playthrough. Nothing else gives you 80% chameleon, not even close. So I'm very happy it got a mention :)

[@scp2539]

15:30 this is one of the first things I do when starting a new run. that shadow amulet is really nice and I can stack it with a couple of other items to get 100% easily so I just run around stealing everything without getting caught

[@tubensalat1453]

I didn't see it as a punishment either.

[@Konpekikaminari]

Bloodborne takes "no good deed goes unpunished" to it's literal extreme

[@midnights2631]

It really does

[@redinmolator]

The only winning move is to just not involve yourself with anyone in Yharnam. Gascoigne's girls taught me that.

[@alexandersmit4256]

@@redinmolator The quest that punishes you for doing the right thing, the wrong thing, nothing, or anything.

[@umbraestragis]

@@alexandersmit4256 The quest is more a punishment than a quest.

[@alexandersmit4256]

@@umbraestragis From: "I see you, there, trying to make our world a bit less depressing. Stop that right now."

[@The13thRonin]

The Assassin's Creed game is literally modern society in a nutshell. Everyone doing extreme evil because it made themselves feel good for three whole seconds and they didn't even rub two neurons together to contemplate the consequences.

[@PlehAP]

Kreia's point was also undermined by the way she chastizes you for choosing the Dark Side option to be cruel to the beggar, with no other options the game provides to avoid her self righteous lecturing. This is the part of the game where she admonishes whatever you do, which makes the lesson feel a tad bit more contrived than is probably necessary.

[@TheKabukimann]

In life is strange true colors I thought she was gonna attempt to take her own life when you take her rage, because you take what drives her in that moment and what keeps her alive after that loss.

[@MrLutocm]

There’s also yurt the silent chief in demon’s souls. If you let him out of his cage he slowly starts murdering all the other npcs.

[@1QueasyCrow]

Idk the lost tales of Greece ‘One really really bad day’ is an entire quest line that follows this theme in AC Odyssey

[@VulpesObscura]

Pathologic, the House of the Living quest in the Bachelor route where Dankovsky can agree to collect money and food for a safe house (rather than running off with it, what kind of doctor would do that after all) only to end up broke and starving and having wasted an entire day when he discovers the house is already infected with the Sand Pest. Or the Filthy Little Toad quest in the Haruspex route, where Artemy can choose NOT to kill a child, which leaves him defenseless and without one of the extremely rare and valuable items that can actually cure the plague. Or The Messenger quest, in the Changeling route, where Clara attempts to use her miracle powers to heal a child only to end up killing them instead. Ahhh Pathologic, where your own survival is the real horror.

[@daanthedoctor]

hell yes I was hoping someone would bring up pathologic in the comments, I was expecting it in the video but I guess it's not that popular

[@VulpesObscura]

@@daanthedoctor yeah it's a real shame too, because Pathologic 2 is honestly one of the most beautiful games I've ever played and it kinda just slipped under almost everybodies radar.

[@dootdootington386]

I want to say theres another quest with a well in Oblivion, but they give you a curse weighted ring to drown you when you jump in. Dont remember why you were supposed to go down there, but do remember i was an argonian. So i couldnt drown.

[@willieoelkers5568]

It was one of the Mage Guild recommendation quests, and the guy who sent you was secretly a necromancer trying to get you killed.

[@davidmcgill1000]

You only had to take the ring from the body in the well, not return with it. You had to do this because the quest giver was a bit of a dick and gave that quest to the guy in the well.

[@killertruth186]

150lbs to be exact (I was originally off by 100).

[@NovaStarbolt]

Sounds like one of the mage's guilds questline to get a letter of recommendation to join the guild. Turns out the the head mage at that specific guildhall was secretly a necromancer and only gave you that ring fetch quest to kill you for your soul. Thankfully the second in charge thinks something is up and gives you some scrolls to help you out. Still kinda sad to see the body of the last guy he sent on the quest is still floating around in the well.

[@daviddaugherty2816]

For some reason, I could've sworn that was Morrowind and seriously thought that was the one they were doing.

[@DerekIcelord]

Worth mentioning on the Kreia scene, there's a mirror of it if you chase the beggar off. She's not berating you for your choice so much as wanting you to consider your actions on the grand scale.

[@gowzahr]

So many questions. Is it about vampires at the height of the disco craze or is it set in more modern times and just features a group of vampires that were turned during the height of the disco craze and are struggling to give up disco in a world that has largely forgotten it?

[@Mindflood18]

Sending any of the NPCs to Iosefka's Clinic seems like the nice thing to do if you don't know what happens to them...

[@CivilWarMan]

Cyberpunk 2077 is a prime example of a game that punishes you for being nice. And a game that punishes you for being mean. And a game that punishes you for being neutral.

[@umbraestragis]

A masochist's wet dream then?

[@aramanon]

Every Star Wars game with Moral Choice but particularly Force Unleashed where the options are to be nice, get a stupid braid and a hessian dress while being angsty or take every shortcut and get to wear high-fashion black cloaks and fly around throwing force lightning

[@LadyMiir]

For Witcher 3, I always kill the spirit in the tree. I have no idea how many *other* villages that spirit ran off to rampage through, and a handful of kids versus untold number of people, well. No-brainer, really. Plus, I don't trust creepy tree-spirits that hang out with werewolves. Another Witcher 3 quest that fits this topic is Towerful of Mice, the Keira Metz quest on Fyke Isle. (SPOILER) Think you're being nice, bringing Annabelle's bones to her lover? Guess what, you've unleashed yet another plague on this land that's already being ravaged by the Catriona Plague and trampled across by warring armies. Well done, hero.

[@stevenking9612]

The amulet of shadows you get from killing the mostly invisible guy in Morrowind is pretty much broken. NPC's cannot see you when it's activated so you lets you steal and murder with impunity unlike standard invisibilty which ends once you take an action. Between this amulet and the Ring of Toxic cloud I murdered every guard in Vivec and cleaned out every treasury I wanted.

[@Chris_Sizemore]

You know there is this one part in Red Dead Redemption 2 where Strauss asks you to help him collect on outstanding loans. Seemed like the right thing to do at the time...

[@abbigamertv]

The game “Thirsty Suitors” (I swear it isn’t as dirty as it sounds) def caught me off guard when I was punished for being nice. One of the first fights you do in the game you go against a couple who are arguing and if you select certain dialogue choices in between attacks you can help them stay together. Only to immediately find out that by keeping them together you’re basically helping out a cult. (BTW I’m not 100% sure if you can break them up instead cause I’m still on my first playthrough of the game so I don’t know what all the other options are yet, but based on the game’s mechanics I’d say you probably can)

[@All-Fur-Coat_No-Trousers]

Tried to replay RDR2 as a bad guy for the sake of variety. I couldn't be mean to the people at camp cause their responses were too upsetting 😂

[@Gamer88334]

Except for Micah, right? I’m nice to everyone except him.

[@All-Fur-Coat_No-Trousers]

@@Gamer88334 yea, Micah is a lost cause and good manners are wasted on him

[@cassiopeiawarrener9654]

Pathologic has an infamous quest on Bachelor's Story, Day 2. With a plague about to hit the town, you offer to help set up a shelter and get food and medical supplies for it. It turns out, if you do this quest, it's already too late, and you'll probably have wasted all of your items and money. You're now starving, broke and vulnerable in a game that's already ruthless and only going to get harder.

[@heroshadow42]

The Bear's Black Heart is a game about being punished for being nice, but it's also about punishing those who punish your niceness.

[@LorelaiIrvingCh]

The Awakened fate ultimatum would fit right in here. the first option has you choosing between heal 5 near-dead angels or trying to fight the enemy commander immediately to prevent further deaths. choosing to heal the angels means 14 angels get killed by the enemy commander. (note that you have to fight the commander anyways but still.). This kind of choice is prevalent throughout all chapters of the game where the "angelic" option always leads to losing more than you saved.

[@jazmintorres2422]

Maybe it's not as well known but what about the prisoner you come across in Dragon Age Awakening, you let him out of his cage and he spreads the blight to nearby villages

[@katier9725]

I remember one instance in Command and Conquer: Renegade where Havoc can find a Nod soldier flailing around on the ground and shouting for help. Go figure, it's an ambush. But if you're savvy and realise it's an ambush, thus just shoot the guy, you get chewed out by your superior because the very obviously faking an injury enemy is marked as a civilian. This might have been patched later but it was at least in the initial release.

[@OkamiSatsujin]

Assassin's Creed Origin's has a side quest where if you help this man who's been abducted by this woman claiming to be his wife, mofo's try and jump you in the dark as you have to wait until night to meet the woman who's claiming to be his wife. In fact, she's called her brothers on him and she's upset because he didn't want to be together with her. You get caught up in this and end up cutting down her brothers and leaving her crying.

[@OptimusSledge]

And the downside to that is...?

[@Gamer88334]

Sounds more like you’re making her face the consequences of her decision to try to force someone who doesn’t want to be with her, to be with her.

[@notacult420]

I genuinely feel like sekiro could be counted for this because after procuring the Sakura and the stone, should you return to ashina castle, you must work your way back through it, but now it’s full of brutally tough shinobi. When you return to where you previously fought genichiro, you find your dad, Owl, and you must choose between honoring the iron code or protecting your master. Should you show compassion and decide to protect your master, you must now murder your dad. (He’s brutally difficult btw)

[@midnights2631]

No good goes unpunished in Bloodborne. The sisters who die is the one that always breaks my heart.

[@atjatkatkaktark]

Grief is complicated simply taking away the anger denies the ability to work through thing when they aren't even halfway through the process, and shouldn't be considered an act of kindness.

[@taer7097]

As a person who’s dealt with lost at a early age I knew the right thing would be to let Charlotte feel those feelings of anger Life is strange is a great therapeutic game if you’ve been through some Shit in life

[@anon_y_mousse]

If you defended that family in AC: Odyssey, but after killing the guys trying to kill them you just killed the family, would that alter whether the island got the disease? If so, how many of the family would you need to kill to save the island? Like could you get away with just killing the parents and letting the kids live?

[@TheIMMORTALKAHNHD]

omg I was just telling my dad this the other day. First time playing Witcher 3 when it was released like a decade ago. Guy pays you to stop a destructive dragon or beast and you when you investigate its not NEARLY the issue he said it was at all albeit annoying . Now upon return for payment you can CHOOSE not to say anything much and give him no details take the coin, you can give him lies or you can tell the truth with details like Geralt usually does. Tell this guy truth and he refuses to pay you original amount regardless of all you did bc its not the threat he thought it was. Thats when i learned honestly in world of Witcher isnt always good policy lol. I reloaded the mission, did the job and took my dragon slaying pay ass offered. When someone's lifes on the line and they take the job, ya pay what ya offered and change original terms of deal cuz YOU got details wrong.

[@davidmcgill1000]

There were so many quests where Geralt was given the option of either teaching a lesson to a terrible person out of spite, or profiting from their misfortune. Rarely is the good option in favor of humans.

[@TheIMMORTALKAHNHD]

@@davidmcgill1000 True but it was more shocking for me as a player. I hadn't really encountered that scenario in a game before and It set the tone for story building in a way that landed well. I had to come to the conclusions you stated above pretty quickly which lead to deep immersion. It was my game of the year at the time lol.

[@Chibimano]

Don’t forget to mention that the Plague spreads to Athens, regardless of Alexios/Kassandra’s choice in the quest. Making us all feel stupid.

[@richardjohnston2895]

I don’t think anyone’s mentioned yet that to get the best outcome for Alastair in Dragon Age Origins (and why wouldn’t you want to get the snarky little so-and-so to be the best king) you have to rub his face in how dreadful his sister (his one family member he knows) actually is so that he toughens up . (There are of course many other quests with only bad outcomes in it, but this is low key one of the subtler nasty ones)

[@jamesherb4384]

the funny thing about that is, she isn't even his sister. the person he thought was his mother wasn't actually his mother.

[@UnusualPete]

This is why I like racing games. They're simple, just point a to point b and no decisions with possibly cataclysmic consequences 😂

[@radiofreedom947]

I get punished for being nice in Dead by Daylight, I'll be fine hiding and repairing generators, but when I go to save someone who's been hooked by the killer that's when I tend to get into trouble.

[@Peachrocks5]

Yeah because unhooking tells the killer immediately where half the survivors are and one of these people are wounded. Makes tunnelling or at least finding another player to hook insanely easy if the killer chooses to.

[@cyanimation1605]

What's worse about Kreia is how she'll also criticize you for NOT helping the beggar. *EVEN IF YOU LEAVE HER ON THE SHIP YOU'LL LOSE FAVOR WITH HER NO MATTER WHAT YOU DO IN THIS UNSKIPPABLE CUTSCENE.*

[@tevura3943]

True Colors is such an overlooked gem of a game. Glad to see it make a list feature.

[@michaelbashford2733]

Being able to see people's feelings is a pointless power as all you need to do is log into social media and everyone will tell you how they're feeling at every waking moment.

[@Rookie643]

In the first Life is Strange game, if you are nice to Victoria Chase and warn her that her boyfriend is dangerous, she confronts him, and then gets kidnapped and murdered. However, if you are rude to her she blows you off and lives.

[@thequester8271]

Actually, Victoria goes to tell the teacher, who is the ACTUAL bad guy, who then kidnaps and murders her because she knows too much. Also, Nathan was just her friend.

[@Rookie643]

@@thequester8271 you’re right! Admittedly I haven’t played in awhile so much memory is hazy

[@dsroxas3412]

Although she does die there, she's actually the only character in the game, except for Max and David who survive the game no matter what you choose. If you sacrifice Chloe, there is no reason for her to be in danger anyway and if you sacrifice Arcadia Bay she won the photography contest and thus is in NY or smth for the photography exhibition. The timeline in which she dies expires anyway

[@claratalbot7613]

What about helping Father Gascoigne's children in Bloodborne? The first one asks u to find her mother, who went out to find her father but left her music box, which u take with u. Upon defeating Gascoigne, u realize he has accidentally killed his wife & if u choose to give the little girl the pendent & tell her about Odin's Chapel, she will get eaten by a pig. Still later on, u realize that her older sister had been on her way to save her & two would have survived the night had u not tried to be a hero

[@RileySteptoe]

Don't forget Hollow Knight. Talking to the NPC Cloth (Spoilers BTW) in the second area, defeating many enemies that are forcing her to stay underground. Then in the traitor lord fight, she helps and can deal damage. She gets killed at the end of the fight, in the most heartbreaking way.

[@aliasjones6381]

It was sad, but in a good way. She was working on being brave for her (dead?) Partner, and succeeded by the end with your help. The bugs of Hollow Knight have different priorities, some honor over life. Of course I'd rather she live, but not a bad ending.

[@CeliriaRose]

Except Cloth’s death is actually the good ending for the character. Her whole arc was about her wanting to be brave. In that moment against the traitor lord but she’s proud to have given her life. However if she lives she does so a dejected coward living with her regrets.

[@jacopobertolotti5025]

In Dragon Dogma there is a poor family that is being evicted and thrown in the street. You can help the greedy (and very rich) landlord evict them, or you can buy the house and have them live there. Problem is, if you help them, they will die (well, the parents will die, leaving a child orphan behind) when the house is swallowed by a giant hole. If you evict them they will hate you, but will live.