9mm or .380 ACP with Lena Miculek

[@jackieeastom8758]

I’m 63,and the very first pistol I ever bought was a llama.380 automatic. At that time in the late 70s there was never any question about the stopping power of a 380 auto! It would put holes in what it needed to put holes in and functioned just fine!

[@josephwilliams1915]

A lot of people always argue the point of penetration and stuff like that. Even if you're wearing armor, a 22lr can still break your ribs. If you put eneough rounds on target, you can still damage and pacify the threat.

[@markhamersly1664]

Putting holes somewhere is not the point; the POINT is STOPPING a violent attack as quickly as possible. For that, the 380 just doesn't cut it. See the video from Wilson Combat with Mas Ayoob entitled "Is .380 enough?" and the brand new USCCA video that says that nothing below .38 SP is a defensive caliber, and the .38 SP is still questionable. Stick with .380 if you want, to me that's just irrational behavior. Hammer

[@debrathompson2987]

@@markhamersly1664 It doesn't sound like you understand how difficult it is for some people (mostly women) to control and manipulate a gun. Some of us women are petite with tiny hands, and after fifty might have all kinds of issues like arthritis which legitimately make it difficult to EVER get comfortable with a gun over .380. So, which is better for these women, who are in the MOST need of protection....a .380 that they can shoot well or no gun at all? Do you guys who say this just not believe that this could be a real issue for many people?

[@markhamersly1664]

@@debrathompson2987 Ma'am, I taught a class today, a private lesson to a woman who's been beaten to within an inch of her life, by her ex-husband-twice! She was scared of the recoil of a 9mm, and against my recommendation, she bought a .380. She did not shoot it well, and FINALLY listened to me when I said that since 9mm handguns fire from a locked breech, and the .380 is held in battery by only a spring, that the 9mm HAS LESS FELT RECOIL than the .380 does! She shot a 9mm S&W Shield and was AMAZED; I WAS RIGHT! She bought a 9mm Shield Plus, and today shot it for the first time and shot BETTER than she ever had before. Next Thursday, we'll be adding it to her CA prrmit to Carry a Concealed Weapon. She is also 83 years old, and she has severe arthritis in her hands. Hammer 42+ year Firearms Instructor USAF SSgt; US Army CW4/SrAviator INS/ICE/CBP, ret.

[@MDformernavalperson]

@@markhamersly1664 Read Greg Ellifritz' review of thousands of results from shootings. His data show there is very little difference in effectiveness between .380, 38 spcl, 9mm and 40 S&W. With that data in mind, I cannot agree that "the .380 just doesn't cut it".

[@TimDocHarper]

Great video, Ms Miculek. I had an old Sargent Major in Viet Nam that everyone gave grief because he carried an old WWII .30 caliber carbine. He said he did it because it was light, easy to carry and "... trust me, Sir, it may not kill 'em -- but I guarantee they won't be in the second wave." Hard to argue with common sense...

[@Eddie87Grant]

That's a great way to put it and the irony is I just picked up a .380 yesterday.

[@bobsmith-ji2uh]

Aren’t a .380 and 9mm both 30 caliber?

[@CeltKnight]

@@bobsmith-ji2uh .355" actually, but yeah, same caliber. .380 is 9x17mm and 9mm Parabellum/Luger is 9x19mm, so the first difference is that the latter has a case 2mm longer than the former. Considerably more power available BUT at the expense of needing a locked breech (there are exceptions), more recoil, etc. Please forgive the oversimplification.

[@bobsmith-ji2uh]

@@CeltKnight I forgive you.

[@Paladin1873]

@@bobsmith-ji2uh They are both .355" diameter (9mm).

[@OregonPacificRailroad]

I've never been prouder to be a Sig owner than to see this program and how it focuses on women in such an intelligent and comprehensive way to get them into shooting and self defense. Nobody has ever done this before and after seeing it done, I can't believe this wasn't thought of years ago. Whoever is responsible for this program and approving it, deserves a huge gold star. And they couldn't have picked a better ambassador. Sig and Lena...job well done!

[@Thinkeroutsidethebox]

Smh dont make everything gender or race centric. Good grief.

[@zjay9918]

They used Lena not because she is a Woman or an advocate for female shooters or even get them interested in shooting. The used Lena because she is the fastest most competitive shooter I have ever seen. No joke this chick will smoke you if you fuck with her.

[@dmcmaster3544]

Gender Politics? Seriously? Because Lena is making the point that women might prefer a lighter smaller weapon as an option for carry, this somehow is political, or meant for a comment section for Cross-dressing?@@chinmonmon

[@DM-kv9kj]

she just some dimbo woman, doesn't know anything!

[@Anthony-tb6er]

Why even bring this up? You perpetuate the problem.

[@mattspriggs5945]

Perfect presentation! I like them all - 10mm, 45 ACP right down to a 22 short! .380 is a favorite due to all the reasons she mentioned.

[@walternash3360]

In a very small pistol, I am more accurate with both the initial and follow-up shots with 380 rather than 9mm. Ms. Miculek has a really nice, relaxed and wonderfully slightly quirky delivery. Great video.

[@ChristopherThirkell]

Hi Lena, I think what you could have mentioned without causing confusion, is that a .380 is in fact also a 9mm. In Europe where the metric system is used it is called a 9mm Corto in Italy (as in Italian manufactured Berettas) and a 9mm Kurz in Germany (as in German manufactured Walther PPK's) which means 9mm Short in the respective languages. The .380 is 9X17mm and the traditional 9mm Parabellum cartridge(or 9mm Luger) as developed by Georg Luger is a 9x19mm cartridge. Both have the same bullet diameter but slightly different case lengths. Of course I realize you know this, but the explanation may have helped someone new to firearms who picks up a Walther PPK, sees Cal. 9mm Kurz on the slide and is told it is a.380

[@JeffersonFirearmsLLC]

As someone who helps new shooters on a regular basis, I can tell you that throwing out the tidbit of a .380 being a 9mm is confusing. All of a sudden you need to go much further into depth and explain a lot more information that will get lost in the confusion than if you just leave the explanation short and sweet like Ms. Miculek does in this video.

[@PaulHarris-sl1ct]

9mm is .354 inches. Almost 10% less than the.380. you can chamber a 9mm in a .380 but not the other way. That is if you have the headroom.

[@whiteeagle58]

@@PaulHarris-sl1ct You have that backwards. The 9mm is longer than a 380 so you can chamber a 380 in a 9mm pistol because the 380 is shorter, but you can't chamber a 9mm which is longer in a 380 pistol because the chamber is shorter. .380 is the decimal equivalent to the metric 9mm.

[@PaulHarris-sl1ct]

@@ChristopherThirkell 9 mm is not .380 inches. 9 mm is .354 inches a diameter reduction of about 10%. Try chambering a .380 in a 9mm weapon.

[@PaulHarris-sl1ct]

@whiteeagle58 you are talking headroom. The .380 is over half a millimeter fatter than 9mm.

[@taofledermaus]

Another big factor is which type of ammo is more available. Buying a gun that uses a difficult-to-find or more expensive ammo type means you're less likely to get as much training on it.

[@scottswastesystemsllc9798]

Both of these rounds are everywhere!

[@cajunstacker1376]

I'm not sure which one you think is harder to find or more expensive. Where I live both are easy to find and I don't see a difference in price.

[@matdrat]

I've switched from 9mm to .380 a year ago and have had no trouble feeding my P365-380 and Beretta 84BB. Just bought a thousand round of ball ammo for the roughly the same price as 9mm, $299.

[@callaseter4811]

.380 is significantly more expensive ammo . Always has been here.

[@B_R_]

I understand this concept, however, we're talking about $.10-$.12/per round difference between the two, or roughly $5 more for a 50rd box of 380. I think for most people, that's not as significant a difference as it's being made out to be, given the potentially life saving, more manageable recoil that is gained for the extra $5. Not everyone is looking for the absolute cheapest route for self defense, and could easily manage that extra $5 in their self defense budget. There are many new gun owners who think current ammo prices are a great deal, compared to 2 years ago when they bought their first gun, and ammo was $1.00/rd if you could find any. They are unaware of the pre covid prices and aren't salty about where things are now.

[@tobylopez445]

I am 75yrs old and I have owned many Guns in my life, but now I own and carry a Sig P365/380 for this very same reason that she is giving. I can put a lot of rounds down range quickly and I can keep a good group while doing so! PS you are so sweet and Beautiful and I know that Dad is really Proud of his wonderful daughter, I know I would be super proud. Blessing and Happy New Year to you and your family'

[@VikingVic76]

Matters not the caliber you use if your shot placement is impeccable. If you're Flawless with a 22 LR but struggles with calibers larger, then carry the 22 and Rock On. Like Lena said any gun is better than no gun, and most bad guys take off as soon as someone starts shooting at them. Lena made some great points and I always like her videos. Keep up the great work!

[@mountaintruth1deeds533]

Yep a 22 will tear it up, eye, kneecap, groin and placement controlled easily .

[@Theylive4213]

"Flawless" is a long shot so to speak under a high stress situation. Average individual in the dark with shakey hands with rounds being fired back at you with a moving target. You would be lucky to get any kind of hit with 15 rounds and not get hit yourself. To many think they are commandos because you have a plastic gun with a few mags, when in fact most would fall on their face against a trained and prepared opponent. I train once a week and consider it not enough. Most go to simply target shoot a few times a year and call it a day.

[@VikingVic76]

@mountaintruth1deeds533 Good point, a couple rounds to the pelvic bowl, and 98% of attackers are involuntarily going to the ground regardless of their training or skills.

[@Scorch1028]

Shot placement is definitely important. That being said, according to the FBI, the majority of all defensive shootings occur within 10 feet. Most untrained people can't miss the torso of the perp they're shooting at within 10 feet or less of distance.

[@HalfCrazy520]

@@Scorch1028 Police MISS 70% of their shots within 10 feet... This is why they use high capacity 9mm pistols. More chances to hit something and 9mm is deemed "effective enough".

[@ralphcardinal2688]

Nice review and thank you for being kind to both calibers. They both work and are both popular for any number of reasons. I have 4 different 380's, several .45's, and other assorted calibers. I'm 75 years and the .380 works well for me.

[@jeffreylocke8808]

John M. Browning invented the 380 Auto. If I am correct that is all you need to know.

[@jessekuhns339]

lt started world war 1

[@bannedbycommieyoutube5time920]

@@jessekuhns339 I think it was the 32ACP

[@Phych0path]

@@bannedbycommieyoutube5time920 it was .32 short

[@nylesfrench3568]

Well Said

[@crisibarra6850]

😂😂😂

[@jackpippenstock1104]

Excellent video; thank you for making it. I really like and appreciate your delivery for being jovial, knowledge, relaxed, respectful, and very honest. You are a chip off the ol' block. 👍

[@_oly_241]

Nice video.... My personal reasons for prefering the .380 for daily CCW: 1) tends to weigh noticeably less 2) significantly less recoil, hence better target acquisition. 3) Does the job but less inclined to over penatrate in a self-defense situation .

[@504Trey]

Having no gun is better than having 380

[@gregb6469]

@@504Trey-- What an asinine statement! ANY gun is better than no gun when one is being attacked.

[@Mike_Webb78]

@@504TreyAnother wannabe tough guy aren’t you?

[@504Trey]

@Mike_Webb78 I'm tougher than your pathetic 380 that's for sure 🤣🤣🤣💀

[@franklanese63]

I just purchased p365 - 380 the gun is fantastic and I am recoil sensitive,I have very bad and strength from arthritis and that gun shoots like there’s no tomorrow.The gun is awesome congratulations sig.and nice video Thank you.

[@moriel-bareli]

How would you compare it to a .22 regarding recoil?

[@ilike2watch66]

@@moriel-bareli. It has more recoil than a .22 but not a lot. If you’re still looking into 380s I would recommend either the Ruger security 380 or the shield EZ. Both have even less recoil than the sig 380 and they have the new EZ rack spring making them easier to rack the slide

[@dennisl4000]

Nice video and for the sake of discussion I would offer some food for thought. Comparing the Hornady Critical Defense load performance, the 9mm 115gr load had 13.1" of penetration with .50" of expansion as compared to the .380 90gr load had 13.2" of penetration with .52" of expansion per the Lucky Gunner site. And given the gun and ballistics for each load, the .380 generates approximately 40% less recoil. Also the slide manipulation is much easier on the .380. This is not intended to state that these are the best loads per class but an interesting comparison.

[@seanwhite304]

Hornady 90g XTP is my go too for 380 . Its designed to be expand by 60% so it can have deeper penetration.. I'd like to try out the Federal HST for 380 . HST , Critical Duty , Gold Dot and V-Crow are my go too for 9mm .. I thought the Critical defense was designed for barrels under 4" and Duty was designed for 4" or more .. My 9mm PCC shoot the Hornady 147g XTP the most reliable . I've always had extremely good luck with XTPs

[@DavidLLambertmobile]

In short, I'd say the 9x19mm 124gr +P is far better than most .380acp or 9x18mm loads. 9mm rounds feed, cycle much better than most factory 🏭. .380acp is not bad for back-up guns, 2nd guns but for a main defense gun its not a +. The exception might be if you have dexterity, recoil issues, age, medical issues. I'd add a decent, well made J frame .38spl +P would be better than a .380acp pocket gun that might jam, not cycle.

[@chrismontgomery3658]

Distance is also a key factor.

[@livebaitlarry5783]

@@seanwhite304 i saw a test video here somewhere and federal hst doesnt do well in .380. i cant remember who tested it but a search will bring it up. anyway, for .380 id go with the hornady xtp.

[@briangc1972]

The .380 round ball has been proven to be effective by decades of police use in Europe. Too much hype and worry about penetration depth and expansion channels just to get you to part with your money.

[@gregoryfranklin5108]

I used to carry a 45 but it is too heavy and recoil is an issue . I also carried a 357 that is only marginally more controllable, plus is a disadvantage if shooting after dark . I now have a 1911 380 and am much more comfortable in all categories. My hands are very arthritic as well so of course a recoil friendly firearm is important for that ax well . Very good video !

[@504Trey]

Having no gun is better than having 380

[@gregoryfranklin5108]

@@504Trey good luck with that approach to self defense. 380 is a preferred choice for gangbusters and other criminal types because they can be obtained cheep and do the job . Check out the number of people killed by 380 . It is astounding . Professional killers still use 22 autos .

[@Lawlzinator]

@@504Trey douche chiiiiill

[@darinmiller2405]

Is it the Browning

[@gregoryfranklin5108]

@@darinmiller2405 yes it is the Browning . It is a Gem .

[@gregb6469]

Good points about the advantages of .380 (reduced recoil making for quicker and more accurate follow-up shots). Since in the vast majority of self-defense situations the greater ballistic performance of 9mm won't be needed, the only advantage of 9mm over .380 is that 9mm ammo is less usually expensive.

[@snakeman48]

The .380 ACP and the 9mm use the same bullet diameter, .355". The .380 ACP is derived from a shorten 9mm case. The Germans coined it the 9mm Kurz. Kurz in German translates to short in English. As Lena says; the .380 ACP is a lighter bullet (90gr) vs the 9mm (115gr). She's spot on with her information in this video. Back in the day before polymer frames, I carried a Walther PPK/S in 9mm Kurz. The thing is a tank.

[@Gieszkanne]

"The .380 ACP is derived from a shorten 9mm case." Wrong the 380 has a different case. Its cylindrical 9mm is conical.

[@CJ4S147]

Agreed if the bullet is the same diameter then the case/brass itself must be thinner for the overall cartridge diameter to be smaller.

[@Grave187RIP13]

My opa carried his PPK from the war (you can guess which side) all the way to his grave.

[@HK-ou2ir]

​@@Gieszkannenot just the case. The bullets are extremely close in diameter but SAAMI shows drawings where the two are not EXACT. I don't know the history but perhaps snakeman was referring to the 9x18 Makarov. Again, still not identical. I might be wrong but the drawings don't look like they have exact same dimensions. Thanks for insight.

[@Gieszkanne]

@@HK-ou2ir No 380 and 9mm have both a .355 diameter. 9x19 Makarov is .365 which is 9.3 mm

[@toobalicious]

There's a lot of talking here, but the nugget (at 3:54) "...a gun is so much better than no gun..." is something that should be remembered. I hope many people really get this message.

[@Anthony-tb6er]

We already know that, we’re comparing two calibers. Nobody wants to hear about how it’s better than no gun, that’s not the damn question.

[@PaulChristianJenkinsJD]

Lena is an F-ing PRO. Seriously, I've learned more from her than any other KZbin channel.

[@kansasgardener5844]

A down to earth discussion about the 380. Your video was refreshing. Thank you.

[@timsherman8701]

Lena is a great communicator and educator

[@58landman]

I carry a .380 during the warm months and a .45 ACP in the colder months when perps/peeps are usually wearing heavier clothing. And, in practice I always aim for the upper chest-throat or face. I never feel under gunned with the .380.

[@DIXONSIDER00]

It will be extremely hard for you to claim self defense with a head shot. Just remember that

[@58landman]

@@DIXONSIDER00 You might be right but I think that it would depend upon other things such as the degree of violence that is being repelled and how close the perp is, etc. But head shots are not that difficult, if you practice. I'm not sure that any jury would care where a bullet landed in a violent thug who is trying to kill an armed victim.

[@reiniergarcia]

You are.

[@58landman]

@@reiniergarcia You are, what?

[@spikedaniels1528]

@@58landmanBe sure the jury will note shot placement.

[@cdalton3169]

Spot ON, Lena! I carry a .380 G42 quite often. People forget that rounds on target matter! I can empty the mag in a target before you can get two rounds off from a larger caliber. Today’s modern ammunition makes the venerable .380 quite the game changer. One does not need to have 20 rounds and a spare mag for personal carry - unless you want it. I opt for light weight, max concealability. The .380 does it well with Underwood ammo…

[@justinwells8265]

The 380 is perfectly adequate in my opinion, but if you’re wanting to push the 380 to underwood ammo power levels, why not just go to a 9mm?

[@BJBDF]

I call bullshit on you getting off an entire mag before I get 2 rounds off on any of my larger caliber guns.

[@hoffmanxgunnar]

@@justinwells8265 I think she does Underwood, the same way I do you want to get as much power out of a small of gun as possible Underwood plus P has almost the same ballistics as a 9 but it’s coming out of a smaller more concealable gun that’s got way less recoil

[@thatoneguywithahugethang]

​@BJBDF I have a g42 and a g26 and I will admit I can infact empty my g42 with a pyramid trigger MUCH FASTER AND MORE ACCURATELY than the g26. But yeah old buddy my be exaggerating the numbers a bit. DPS goes to 380 automatically based on the size of the cartridge alone. The cycle rate is naturally faster than a larger caliber slimpy because the movement needed to rechamber another round is infact smaller.

[@thatoneguywithahugethang]

​@@justinwells8265fire rate and accuracy is better with 380

[@brianthomas8858]

Love this!!! Great approach and very informative. It’s about time people stop putting the 380 down and see the benefits. Thank you

[@longgone9869]

The problem isn’t the 380 round. The problem is usually the gun from which the round is shot. They are usually less reliable than a larger pistol because of lighter primer strikes. As she mentioned in the video, the 380 has less velocity which is usually further degraded by the shorter barrel length from which the 380 is normally shot. Thirdly, the shorter the barrel the less inherent accuracy the pistol will have. Also the shorter barrel will allow more powder to be burnt after the bullet exits the barrel making for a larger flash at night. While the Sig p320 is the exception, I found, as the 9mm is usually shot from a larger gun, the extra little bit of weight of the larger gun nullifies much of the difference in recoil🤷🏼‍♂️

[@John_Redcorn_]

Or just learn to shoot 9mm. Usually small 380 “pocket guns” are harder to shoot anyways.

[@HuhWhydough]

It's just like the hate towards the 40 s&w. Even though it's just a shorter 10mm. Marginal difference between a 380 and a 9. No reason to hate on what someone wants to carry. It's their choice.

[@familyman3573]

I picked up a P365-380 a few weeks ago and let me tell you, it is a s-o-f-t recoiling pistol. The grip and fire control modules are the same as the 9mm version. In fact, the slide is very slightly narrower than the 9mm version (by something like 1/16 inch) and the .380 version weighs less due to lightening cuts in the slide and barrel. What’s nice is that the recoil spring is lighter in poundage than the 9mm version, making racking the slide noticeably easier. FWIW, the .380 version is also coming with an optic cut as factory standard.

[@moriel-bareli]

How would you compare it to a .22 recoil wise?

[@bloppysloppy2283]

I bought a Sig P238 .308 back in 2019. It was the first carry gun I ever bought. I bought the gun because I liked the feel of it and it's easy concealability. I didn't do much research. Now I probably would have gotten a 9MM because the ammo is much less expensive and you can get small concealable 9MM's. Live and learn. I still like my .380 though.

[@csipawpaw7921]

The Lehigh Xtreme Cavitator has the potential to breathe new life into the 32acp and 380acp due to its ability to obtain adequately penetrate while at the same time creating a long wide wound channel, without over-penetration. This allows an individual to carry small light recoiling pistols without sacrificing effectiveness. I know Underwood offers outstanding loadings with this projectile.

[@macriggland6526]

.380 ball doesn't over penetrate anyways, homie.

[@jorgejefferson8251]

I was a police detective many moons ago and had to investigate a shooting during which one drug boy was shot by another drug boy who fled the scene. The one who got shot was a big fat guy who got hit 7 times in the upper torso. When I arrived at the hospital to interview him, he was still on a gurney breathing normally with no hint of distress while waiting to be wheeled into an operating room. When I start to ask him questions, he proceeds to curse me out big time while telling me that he doesn't talk to police. After the surgery, I come to find out he was shot with .380 ammo. At that time I would sometimes carry a very nice Sig P-230 pistol off-duty, but after investigating that shooting I quickly retired it in favor of something with a little more spice.

[@steveellis3014]

I went from 45 to 9mm for the same reasons of going to 380 vs 9mm. I’ve gotten older and find the recoil of the 45 is a little more than I enjoy any more. I find that I enjoy shooting the 9mm more, plus the ammo is cheaper!

[@Skank_and_Gutterboy]

Me too, I went with the 365XL 9mm.

[@pcrealty]

Thank you, excellent presentation. As a retired police officer, I transitioned to the 380's, however proficient on 9 mm & 38 calibers. Even better is the installation of a red dot optics on the semi-automatics which facilitates shooting to the target.

[@catman928]

Well they shoot the same size bullet. The length of the cartridge is different. Bullet diameter is .355 in both.

[@user-zv2eu1vj4l]

.380 vice 9mm The projectile diameter is the same in both loads: 0.353-0.355 (in.)/ 9mm. It is the projectile weight that vary greatly. I use a 100-grain hard cast lead projectile .380 (9x17mm) load that exits the muzzle at 1150 feet per second (fps) in a larger-frame Betetta 80X. I use a 9mm 115-grain hollow point at 1295 fps in a 9x19mm load in a Browning P35. _ Moreover, I choose a 124-grain 9mm hollowpoint 9x23mm load at 1600 fps from a 6-inch 1911. Finally, I use a 158-grain hollowpoint .357 Magnum (9x33) 1600 fps load in a 4.2-inch 8-shot Magnum revolver. ALL of these projectiles are “9mm.” On occasion, I use a 158-grain hard cast lead flat point projectile at 1200 fps from a .38 Special (9x29mm) load in a 6-shot 4-inch medium frame revolver. Yes, this is also technically a “9mm.”

[@dr.omar.insights2000]

Thanks for info. May I ask if shooting without ear protection would favor 380 instead of other calibers fot CCW. THANKS AGAIN ​@@user-zv2eu1vj4l

[@alexanderren1097]

Great video! One additional pro for .380 is that there’s no micro 9mm on the market that’s as small as the smallest .380s. If carriabilty is your biggest criteria, say if you live if FL or somewhere else that’s ridiculously hot and you find yourself wearing gym shorts and tank tops regularly, then there’s no 9mm out there that beats out a Keltec P3AT, Ruger LCP, LCP II, LCP Max, or similar .380 for size and weight. Don’t get me wrong, 9mm is a great round and there are plenty of good pistols chambered for it. But .380 on you is INFINITELY better that 9mm, .45ACP, or any other bigger round that’s sitting at home.

[@Keet619]

Thank you for this Lena, very informative. I hope that my wife will watch it without bias. You are a brilliant advocate for extolling the virtues of .380 (9mm KURZ) to smaller women. I really love the content that you and your Dad produce!

[@walkerb1734]

I used to carry the Sig P365 9mm but have moved more toward my .380 Colt Pocketlite simply because I am MUCH more accurate with it. With the right (+P) ammo I never question it’s lethality.

[@inoname99]

Lena, good to see you. (she is a Champion shooter) the 9mm Born 1906, 380 Born 1908. the argument began in 1909. Ballistics have improve greatly for both calibers. Listen to Lena.

[@docgsreloading7985]

Thanks Lena for the great video, you're awesome! I love to watch you compete and tear-up stages! We got my wife a Smith and Wesson M&P EZ in 380 ACP (it fit her hands better than the Sig 365 series) and it's perfect for her. Even though she's very petite, she's also very athletic and even then just couldn't handle a 9mm carry gun with the shorter barrel and more recoil. She had a problem not only with accuracy, but also with stove-piping and failure to feed because she was absorbing too much recoil and not allowing the gun to use the recoil to cycle--it wasn't fun for her to go to the range. She shot the 380 very accurately, and with many more (accurate) rounds on target. Plus, with the technology today of projectile design and engineering, the 380 now has about equal the stopping power as a 9mm or even the new (fad) of 30 Super Carry. Now I feel much better that she has a gun she can now carry all the time, and not just occasionally. She also now looks forward to going to the range and actually has fun!

[@hafcanadiana318]

I agree, it's a helpful video and well done. I got my 83 year old wife a S&W EZ 380 early in 2021, for her self defense when we're RVing and I'm not at camp, also because of its easy racking and potentially less recoil. I personally had my eye on a popular small Sig 380 model (P238) because a previous sales encounter years prior revealed its diminutive size, but mostly its ease of racking over any other gun they demoed. Much to my disappointment, before I could buy one last year, that Sig was discontinued and none were to be found. Instead I went with a Sig 365 9mm because of its size. I ordered it online assuming it would rack as easy as the little 380 I'd been shown before, or the wife's larger S&W. At my age and with some disabilities, racking a pistol ain't the piece of cake that younger salespeople demonstrate. Much to my chagrin, upon delivery of the 365 I discovered it didn't rack anywhere near as easily as the discontinued Sig 380 or my wife's gun! Nor was feeding rounds into the magazines a task for those with uncalloused hands and reduced dexterity. I had to research and order an UpLula loader. Of course to top that off, not long after I bought my 9mm, they came out with a 380 version! Aaarrrgghhh! So now we also have to deal with two different calibers rather than just 380, a slight hassle I was trying to avoid when we started out looking at pistols. At least my Sig is smaller than the wife's and is easier to conceal. But I'm still unhappy with Sig. Plus I've found that Sig overall isn't as "pleasing" a company as S&W; they seem to push aggressive gun use philosophies and profit over safety, whereas S&W seems more safety and satisfied customer oriented. That's just my take over the last year of emails from the two companies, and things I've read in the news media; other Sig owners may have a different impression.

[@dennischerone6780]

I'm an old fart and I have a S&W 380 EZ. For the simple reason that I can operate it properly without fumbling.

[@kylewhite8434]

I was looking at the the same gun for my girlfriend! She likes it because it's easy to rack the slide.

[@cacinaz8802]

Also note that the .380 ACP is a subsonic round whereas the 9mm usually is not. This means you don't need to ask the bad guy to hold still while you put hearing protection in.

[@MrSmith-zy2bp]

I have read or saw reviews about how much recoil the 9mm P365 has. I was leaning to 380, because it's such a small pistol and have large hands. Rented a 9mm P365 at a range. The recoil was about the same, slightly less than my USP 45, in other words, not bad at all. So, I definitely recommend renting one before you decide on the caliber for a P365.

[@kd4784]

Also another thing to consider especially if you’re practicing on a regular basis with your concealed carry is the cost and availability of .380 vs 9mm ammunition, this is why I chose the 9mm. I can always work on recoil control by trying different grip, type of gun hold, arm/elbow position, and stance when practicing.

[@tonyv8925]

Just a tidbit of trivia...the .380 is actually a 9 x 17mm cartridge, a true 9mm bullet. Consider also, the .380 is mainly a 7 to 10 yard round and a 9mm Luger is 7 to 25 yards (or longer) with a little more power (kinetic energy). Standard ball ammunition for .380acp is 95gr full metal jacket, the 9mm Luger is 115gr full metal jacket. Specialty ammunition can increase performance accordingly, such as making a .380 perform like a 9mm. Thank you Lena for this video.

[@CannibalWarthog]

This women is making her daddy really proud.

[@swiftbear]

*Woman, there is only 1 of her.

[@dougdarby3564]

Do you mean woman?

[@timnewmyer780]

Well said! You really explained the differences in 9mm and .380 ACP in a clear concise manner!

[@fltangerine3]

thanks for this! I just went to try two different 9mm and a .380. I had previously tried a .38special and no way was that working I am a 62 petite woman have shot guns before but way back in the day used to have a 357 no more of that now! I like the analogy that you used and helped me make my decision that a 380 would be better for me than a 9mm and I agree too much recoil will make you lose aim if you don't have enough control, thanks

[@UnkaDon]

Brilliant video. I have a 380 I can shoot all day accurately. If one has adopted the 1-2-3 shoting technique, I would imagine the sacrifice of a hundred feet per second is more than made up by competent shot placement.

[@raphael2amartinez]

Lena knows how to explain things in an easy-to-understand manner. Thank you for posting these great videos. Sig Sauer is a fantastic firearm.

[@miriamhall3953]

I bought a 0.380 Smith a& Wesson M&P Easy Slide 2 years ago at Academy. I was going to buy a 9mm but they only had one easy slide in stock and it was the .380 (I bought the display model because it was the only one literally in stock.) I have not bought ammunition in a while but the last few times I did, I had to get to the store when they opened. The ammo would sell out in 20-30 minutes. In the beginning there was a limit on all ammunition but later on just the 9mm. Long story short, 9 mm can be harder to get in a shortage because it is probably the most popular size whereas 0.380 is easier to find. For me as a woman, I prefer less recoil so am happy with the 0.380 and am glad I got it rather than the 9mm. It is a lot better than a 22.

[@billearnshaw1074]

Chose a 380, with lighter grain, but leaves a 2 inch cavity at higher velocity. What is really interesting to me, is my admiration for a female that can defend herself. Well Done Ms Lena.

[@RichardFreundlich]

Great explanation but one thing was omitted. What's the diff. in cost for 9mm vs. .380 ammo. The .380 is smaller in size/weight with less recoil, but the ammo seems to be more expensive? Less grains. Smaller case. One might think it would cost less, but I've not found that to be the case. Why? Thank you.

[@frankd.5554]

Economy of scale, 9mm is much more widely produced then the 380

[@AT-wj5sw]

Supply and demand dictate these price differences

[@briangreen550]

@@AT-wj5sw 380 has always been more expensive even before the micro war between firearms manufacturers. Now that there is micro 9mm with excellent capacity I don’t believe the 380 serves a purpose. Recoil has been better managed by firearms manufacturers on 9mm vs 380. In today’s world I don’t see any value in the 380. Why pay more for less energy & velocity? Just my two cents.

[@SnerMerNer]

@@briangreen550 easier to conceal if you pocket carry

[@briangreen550]

@@SnerMerNer you can pocket carry a 9mm these days. I started carrying the Sig Sauer P238 in my pocket about 10 years ago as it was much more concealable than most 9mm out there but now you can carry the P938 which is almost the same size. Now you have so many versions of the Sig P365 which is much higher capacity. I just think it’s lost what made it unique to other calibers. Plus it’s more expensive & less effective than the 9mm. Whatever pocket firearm you can find in 380 you can certainly find in 9mm & in some cases more rounds. Some still love the 380 though. Just my opinion.

[@SLO4SpeedBump]

The .380 projectile is the exact same circumference as the 9 mm but is shorter bullet which makes the weight of the projectile lighter. The brass casing of the .380 is also shorter then the 9 mm casing. The down side of the .380's is the muzzle velocity compared to the 9 mm muzzle velocity. Most .380 bullets have a velocity of 980 fps with some manufactures increasing the muzzle velocity to 1020 to 1100 fps to improve penetration but defeats it's purpose The .380 hand guns are easier to control but do not have enough stopping power wanted in a home defense firearm. The 9 mm is more efficient as a home defense firearm because it has the muzzle velocity to penetrate deep enough to damage vital organs and incapacitate (stop) a criminal. Practice is the key to good self protection. Thanks for the great video.

[@book3100]

.380 is pretty useful. It's good for self defense, especially with hollow point. I have one myself. Good carry piece. Tho the .380 haters i always say, "try standing in front of it" They never do.

[@TomieT1965]

I always tell them let’s have a contest. You shoot at me with your.45 ACP and I will shoot at you with my .380. 7 yards one shot each. I go First!

[@slimjim7411]

Well it's different when some meth junky thinks you stole his cookies and has a knife. There is no substitute for horsepower, but a pistol you will carry daily beats a cannon you leave at home half the time. Nobody wants to get shot by anything even a .22lr but when someone is amped up and made enough to charge at someone holding a gun, the gun better be up to the task of stopping them. So the .380 good for muggings bad for crazy druggies.

[@timothygormley1305]

Look at how she handles the weapon...perfect safety and professionalism. She doesn't flag the camera. Finger never on trigger unless ready to engage. Just perfect.

[@phil4986]

I carry a small concealable 9mm with my concealed carry license onboard. But I would love to own a Beretta Cheetah 380 in blued steel. The finish on that gun was incredible. Whatever works for you to carry and train with. You have to have it on you to help you save your life.

[@AndrewLiss]

I have a P365 in 9MM and and a P238 in 380 ACP. Both are great carry options, I use my P238 in summer or wearing light clothes.

[@celebritydesigner]

Thank you for this informative presentation! I've often wondered the pros and cons. I have the P365SAS chambered in 9mm. I might get the 380 version as my next gun and have some fun comparing at the range. Thanks again!

[@normkaraevans8343]

My wife just sold her .380 to get the 9mm after shooting mine. She didn't think there was that much difference between them. Just a FYI. Don't fall for the scam that replied to you about a give away. These scammers are on all the sites now.

[@DesertAZ]

Great review. Thanks. I prefer the 380 to get on target quicker.

[@withbravado1548]

380s can be a real pleasure to fire. The Glock 42 and S&W EZ are so light shooting, and the Ruger LPC2 with the extended magazine is very shootable. Love your video! I need to check out that Sig 380

[@golfhound]

If you love the .380 round, then also try a Walther PPK. Excellent CC and recoil control. Great for Women too as it will fit easily in purses. Men can stuff it comfortably in a pair of Jeans front pocket or comfortably at the ankle.

[@kansasgardener5844]

Just purchased the S&W ez and love it.

[@jamesdietz6899]

What body belt were you wearing under the white blouse? My wife carries the Sig P238, and she is looking for something like that. Thanks! And, do more instructional videos like this!

[@bobbyscott8024]

Great explanation! The bottom line is it has to fit you! And btw, ''A gun is better than no gun''........so true!

[@kitchenratt]

Great video! For me, I just can’t imagine any violent scenario where I’d wished I had a smaller gun.

[@miloinaz]

Great video. I shared it with my wife. Now she's happier with her M&P 380. You showing placement and speed are important for her. Thank you!

[@jhustler1992]

I prefer 9MM over .380 because of the cost per round, but 9MM is more lethal and more effective in a self defense situation. I just bought the P365 (standard). Looking forward to shooting it at the range. I love how easy it is to conceal. You get ten rounds in a double stacked magazine, with the Siglite night sights too. It actually is also fairly comfortable to hold too. I was never one to like sub or micro compact guns for that reason alone, but Sig never disappoints. If anyone was to ask me what my favorite overall Sig pistol would be, it is the P226. I can't wait to try the P320 subcompact as well.

[@maxcoatlhunter4322]

One question Sr, can you explain why you believe the 9MM is more lethal in a self defense situation?

[@danielberry2]

Perfect explanation of a topic that so many people are being shamed into using a tool that they can’t use. Bullets on target, you need no other reason. The Miculek’s stands proud.

[@danw7156]

If you have both a .380 and a 9mm, be careful to not mix up the ammo. I’ve seen several folks at the range load .380 into a 9mm. It will fire, but you have to clear the empty case with a stick or something.

[@the_weed_in_your_garden9319]

FALSE. I have done it myself and .380 will fire in a 9mm pistol. The slide needs to be manually engaged as .380 is not powerful enough to reject the case. A stick is NOT necessary

[@jimgoodwin542]

So great. Trying to get my wife into shooting and her hearing this from you is far better then hearing it from me. Super excited about the Rose product line and what it has to offer. Thank you

[@novembers]

I use a Sig P238 .380. It fits great in my hand and I shoot on target EVERY time. I tried the 365 9mm but the thing just popped my arm right up in the air which caused me to take more time to quickly get my site back on target. I wanted the 365 because of the larger capacity of rounds but it didn't work. I have not tried the 365 .380, which I will do next.

[@hafcanadiana318]

Let us know how that goes. I was going to get a P238, but they canned that nice little 380 for some reason before I could buy one. I got the 365 9mm thinking it would be similar... but it's not - harder to rack, & more recoil of course. And the 380 version wasn't offered until just after I bought the 9. A S&W EZ 380, if offered in a smaller model than my wife's, would be my better CC choice.

[@davidcreely693]

Thank you. Personally, I carry my Taurus Spectrum in 0.380 in my pocket while wearing light summer clothing. It is the absolute minimum. If I’m wearing jeans (all my belts are “heavy duty”, it’s IWB all-metal 9mm all the time. It’s just my preference. I really wish I could open carry my revolver, but that discussion is for another day. Please keep up your good work!

[@normkaraevans8343]

If someone is looking at doing a lot of range time, the 9mm will be less $$. The .380 is around $.20 more per round, and that can add up fast.

[@normkaraevans8343]

@SIG SAUER, INC > Hey SIG you should block these spammers on your site...

[@anamericancitizen2971]

*A good tip, some gun ranges have something called ladies day where its much cheaper to rent a lane on one day (like 1/4 of the normal price) and they also allow ladies to rent the guns for free, you just have to buy the ammo or bring your own ammo. Its an awesome deal, you can try different guns for free, you can buy a box of 50 shells and try many guns in that caliber. The gun range I use offers this. See if you can hunt something like this down in your area, its worth it.*

[@nickiealtieri-enochs1914]

Love my P938 micro 9mm for daily carry, but now I'm going to have to try out the .380 for another option. Great video girl 💯💗👍🏼

[@nikeishar3055]

My EDC as well. And, I love it.

[@joe5080]

My EDC as well!!

[@micronious5747]

Mine, too…and I bought one for each of my girls!(-:

[@garyp1672]

My EDC as well, hard to find a comparable all steel firearm, and small size and reliability of the Sig 938

[@michaelsweaney3890]

The Sig P238 is an absolute dream. Built like a tank, incredibly reliable. Almost no recoil. Fun to shoot. Best trigger on any gun I own. My summer carry gun. 🎯🔫

[@LP-gs3xj]

I have both plus an Sig 10mm. 10mm I use when traveling CC in my RV. 2:54 tells it all, shot placement is the biggest determinant. If you miss what you’re shooting at the caliber is a moot point.

[@argoshikan]

I have a p365 in 380, just because it is cool. I hope they bring out the 380 in the xl as well, much better gun than the EZ.

[@JaronActual]

This! I've been asking for this for months. I've tried the EZ and it just doesn't handle or shoot well for me. Put .380 in a full XL frame. Longer handle for better grip and control. The longer 3.7" barrel would be quite beneficial to .380 ballistics and the longer slide would soak up more recoil.

[@timsharkey1993]

I like and use both. The .380 in a micro-sized pistol in a pocket holster is perfect for our sweltering Midwestern summers. When cooler weather prevails I like a subcompact 9 mm in a Kydex IWB holster under a shirt.

[@Jleitte]

Great video! The cost factor would keep me from purchasing a .380 over the 9mm.

[@DavidLLambertmobile]

That's true but in facts there are way more +s to using a 9x19mm +P for home security, ccw than a .380acp round. There are many excellent choices in 9mm, 9mm +P rather than .380acp, 2022.

[@gsb5w291]

I do feel after shooting .380 in multiple platforms that the recoil of .380 acp can very from very snappy to feeling like shooting a .22. For example the Ruger LCP has more felt recoil than my M&P shield in 9mm. The M&P in .380 EZ has very light felt recoil. I’ve yet to shoot the 365 model in .380 but would love to see you shoot both side by side for another video.

[@BrianCave]

Thanks for reading people that gun size matters for recoil. It’s basically a ratio of cartridge power over gun weight. Higher power cartridge OR lighter gun equals higher felt recoil. A 1911 will usually have less felt recoil than a subcompact 380 by a good margin because those tiny 380 Guns are featherweights. My taurus TCP-738 had the highest felt recoil of any pistol I owned, way beyond polymer 40 S&W or 45acp 1911’s.

[@dcsomething6460]

I honestly feel like 9mm is too snappy. I can't hit the broad side of a barn with it. Literally no problems using .45 though.

[@D.Howerton]

Nice presentation, Lena. I checked the price of Sig Sauer pistols and suffered sticker shock. I bought a new Bersa Thunder .380 for about $175 a long time ago. Today they are selling for $324. I've taken mine to a gun range a bunch of times with no problem with malfunctions. It's also simple to disassemble and clean. I also checked the price of .380 and 9mm ammo. Depending on the type of bullet (FMJ, hollow point, etc.) 9mm is generally a little less expensive than .380. Either caliber would be okay for personal protection.

[@BG-vq9fd]

I didn't learn anything new, but I think you did an excellent job of explaining to a novice.

[@briantaylor9475]

Except she called a cartridge a bullet. That is very unprofessional. A bullet is one of four components of a cartridge.

[@42istheanswer23]

SOLID advice. Doesn't matter how big the bullet, if you don't feel comfortable with it and leave it at home-doesn't matter

[@alfredgrandellsr3650]

Thank you Lena! I appreciate the information. I carry both the .380 and the 9 MM.

[@DavidLLambertmobile]

I owned a Talo ed Ruger LCP ll .380 in 2018. It was light, easy to ccw but the gun was poorly made, not very good. I added a Ruger 7rd extended magazine too. I used potent Underwood Leigh Defense non lead(copper) .380acp rounds. I'd buy a new SIG P365 or Walther model PPK .380acp but 9mm +P is way better than .380 for ccw, home security.

[@Steven-js8yk]

Love you Lena, you are such a good teacher!! I really feel comfortable and confident whenever I get to listen to you breaking stuff down so it's easy to learn.

[@timbennett8412]

Great video & insights. I’ve found that most of the 9mm vs 380 conversations are too testosterone fueled. The 380 is just a 9mm short. The general argument being that 380 ammo cannot meet FBI minimum penetration/expansion requirements. You either get good penetration with little expansion or vice versa. That is, until Federal 380 Hydra Shock Deep released in 2020. At the time of release, the only 380 round that met both FBI requirements. I have both P365 versions, carry & like each. Although I can handle the snappiness of 9mm, the 380 is a dream to shoot. More rounds on target, quicker & paired with the right ammo.

[@OldBadger1]

Good that I don't work in the FBI and don't shoot at gel 😅

[@504Trey]

Having no gun is better than having 380

[@timbennett8412]

@@504Trey maybe ease up on that testosterone a bit there bud. Making you say silly things, like you are superman or something.

[@BlueDogTabby]

This is one of the most pleasant talks on caliber choice I’ve heard…nicely done!

[@jamesmorrison7847]

My first civilian gun was a .380 bodyguard. But, with my big hands it was difficult to grip. My Sig P365 with the 12 round mag fits my hand better and is more accurate for me.

[@celebritydesigner]

I had the Bodyguard and I couldn't easily turn that darned safety off! It was a miserable gun in my opinion. One of only 2 guns I've ever sold...and I hate to sell any gun! Love my P365SAS 9mm. I also really like my Glock 42 .380.

[@JohnnyOnion-jz7tf]

same problem here. I had a smaller poly 380 but my damned mugs kept dropping the mag every other shot. lol. The gun was just too compact. Swapped to a larger Beretta cheetah 13+1 that fills up my hand a lot better. And feels like a real gun, lol

[@tlan77]

What a tremendous asset to new gun owners, to the community in general, and to the SigSauer organization. Lena’s training videos for the SigSauer Rose P365-380 are outstanding - for any new gun owner of either gender. If you haven’t seen them, take a look.

[@nailgunsniper]

A great, in-a-nutshell explanation! Any word on Sig producing a P365 in .30 super carry?

[@neilreid9005]

Outstanding presentation by a credentialed world class shooter. My wife carries a 365; an excellent firearm. Thank you.

[@contacttimbre]

Great explanation. It really does come down to the user. If they can get more shots on target with a .380 go with it. The FBI has plenty of tests to prove 9mm has enough stopping power. Giving up some velocity and stopping force for accuracy is an acceptable trade off

[@lynheydt3304]

I will never come close to have the experience and knowledge that both you and your dad possess. For many years I watched many of your families videos always great. I personally think when it comes to choosing a firearm to carry for self protection get something you feel comfortable with and can shoot the best. One thing for sure shoot placement is key no matter what caliber you decide on.

[@Minu2s]

Forgot to mention price difference of ammo. .380 ammo is usually more expensive compared to 9mm making it more costly to train with. Smaller bullet, more expensive! .380 is not as popular a round compared to 9mm, thus also making it harder to find during a ammo shortage.

[@DavidLLambertmobile]

Correct, most gun makers use 124gr 9mm to R&D new firearms, test pistols. 9mm or 9x19mm is a much better choice for regular defense or ccw than .380acp . Is the .380 bad? No. You can buy a 2nd gun, back up or if you are hurt, have medical problems, carry a .380acp like the M&P EZ series or a P365.

[@chslaw]

My wife recently attended a ROSE presentation that you made and appreciated your expertise. Also, thanks for this informative video. Along those same lines, I recently rewatched "Why Ballistics Gel Works and Caliber Arguments are Dumb" posted by Chris Baker and Lucky Gunner Ammo. If you shoot better with .380 versus 9mm, then commit to it and train with it. Pistol rounds will usually require multiple hits as compared to say a rifle round or 00 buck coming out of a shotgun. Use whatever is best for you.

[@velvetjones1856]

Wife shoots a S&W 380 EZ. All aspects of the pistol are perfect for her - the slide is easy to rack (softer spring and the ears for gripping) and the magazine has the helpers to ease in loading.90 gr ammo is great for her.

[@Opa_Plays]

When I open carry (Arizona) it's my SW .686p (.357 x 7) so I can handle recoil, but that's with 3 pounds of stainless steel. Concealed carry is my PK380, because concealed is slower on the draw and I need to be accurate and first out the barrel. I can one hand it repeatedly from any position I'm in.

[@PaulVox01]

I'm sure I won't get to reply but when will the 380 365 be approved and on the Mass Compliant list? Love the 9mm 365 but wife wants the 380 for her carry...

[@jonathanshiflet5450]

Interestingly, a study of 1,700 shootings showed all calibers from .380 and up had the same level of failure (~20% of the time the shots impacted but didn't stop the threat), but the .380 succeeded in stopping the threat more than any other caliber! The working hypothesis is accurate shot-placement is more important than caliber once you get to the .380.

[@fatbubba1964]

It's a easy decision, get 1 of each, I did

[@theepicgamerultimate4831]

I think the way to decide is which caliber gun combination you can shoot accurately under duress is the best choice. Back in my law days at the 1 to 3 yard line we had draw our duty weapon from a holster and fire 2 shots with the gun pressed against our hip for maximum weapon retention. However we never did it for off duty weapons. I decided to do it on my own. Never had a problem with either my S&W model 10 revolver or my Glock 22 gen4 in 40 cal. However when tried it with my Glock 43 and Glock 26 both guns failed to feed the second shot, why because the 1 second time limit forces most people to get a less than optimal grip when under duress. With my S&W 642, my Glock 42 and my Sig P250 subcompact in 9mm I have no problems at all.

[@crossdrawjohn821]

Thanks Lena

[@victormayer8519]

Love her grip... keeps great recoil control with that finger over the front trigger guard.

[@EricFialkowski]

I suffer carpal tunnel and tennis elbow. (Get a desk job they said. You won't get hurt they said...) When both flair up at the same time, I often switch to a 380. My friends tease me but then I ask what they're carrying and most go silent. Better to have anything than nothing. 👍

[@mcjohnson87124ify]

Thank you for your video, it is nice that a lady gave her professional opinion and information. Just bought a bersa 380 for my wife, and a 380 Makarov for my self. I really enjoy the feel of the 380 how it fits in the hand how it fires not to teeter on everybody's opinions or recommendation but again when purchasing a firearm it's what feels good for yourself yes be informed of the many wonderful firearms out there from AR-15s to 30 odd 6 to a Colt 45 they're all good what do you feel happy with and excited