About Prydwen Tier List For 2.5... | Honkai Star Rail 2.5 Tier List

[@GachaSmack07]

huge apology for scuffed mic. I've been testing different settings trying to hide my breathing and my super hyped energy moments from affecting the vids and clearly this setting is cooked xD so back to the drawing board. One day grandpa smack will figure it out.

[@SM-oc4rc]

You mean the ASMR wasn't wasn't intentional?!

[@gedemartha9534]

It's okay Granpa Smack, always felt the hype everytime the mic muffles the voice

[@lifelessgamingmy]

I thought my ears was scuffed. No wonder.

[@RogerNbr]

love these longer videos bro keep it up

[@itsjustdroid]

You good Smack my brother. If you turn your threshold up a bit more on your compressor it wont kick in as often; It will let you get a bit louder like you normally do without it trying to kick in so often or heavy. 👍🏽 Again much love, awesome video, keep up the great work.

[@PrydwenGG]

Glad to hear you're liking the changes we did this time and also thank you for the further feedback! Videos like that help us improve the tier list as the more POV the better!

[@WalledQazi]

Prydwen when are you creating tier lists for genshin? I really can't find any website which is as professional as yours for tier lists, so, really hopping to see those!

[@JakeTran141]

Gacha smack agreeing with Prydwen? What timeline are we in

[@Twentizz]

1000 years in future 😅

[@antivenom68]

The one thats two steps ahead

[@gedemartha9534]

We have branched off the imaginary tree

[@AC-ut3nk]

Good timeline

[@DarlingOhayoMilwin]

Timeline where Mr beast got cancelled and Nikocado Avocado became thin

[@hafidzmursyidi4429]

0 quantum units in tier 0 except Jade for PF. Truly mono quantum of all times

[@Doflaminguard]

Theres no Quantum weak bosses for a while now.

[@Ilikegames804]

@@DoflaminguardAin’t that why we run SW in the Mono quantum team?

[@valk5041]

Back in my days mono quantum was projected to become the best team of all time 💀

[@ryuki9788]

@@hafidzmursyidi4429 nobody will believe me when I say the CN community ranks Seele at the top beside Feixiao while the others are below them.

[@ahmedmubarak751]

We just need a better quantum dps than seele . She just fell off hard .

[@alexzee4356]

Yunli is more versatile than smack think imo. She can work with robin and even hanya,march, she also work with topaz and now with moze. Sure its nice to have huo huo or tingyun. But hey she works just fine without them in my experience.

[@unlimitedpower4783]

Also works really well with Lynx because of the additional taunt value from her skill 😭

[@LucasGomes-ng2go]

​@@unlimitedpower4783only at e0s0 though. If you have her cone, Lynx makes her taunt value go from 70 something to 80 something, so its not really worth it

[@FeverSensei]

Agree with pretty much everything but the Aventurine takes bro is the go to on both ratio and feixiao FUA he adds debuffs makes the team unkillable and with investment does solid dmg for a sustain, he’s also best sustain for Acheron teams he is not going anywhere even when lingsha comes out

[@iphantomivess]

im honestly surprised he said huohuo is bis with ratio over aventurine, like... did i miss something?

[@XX-br5bn]

​@@iphantomivess he said that in the IPC team, you either need aventurine SLC or E1 Topaz with her signature for Ratio's follow up to proc

[@iphantomivess]

@@XX-br5bn yeah it is, but he also said huohuo is bis for ratio. i dont have topaz or aventurines lc, but i can't think of any scenario where huohuo is better than aventurine in ratio's team or any fua team that isnt yunli...

[@zephronic1062]

Also why is Huohuo the best on Acheron teams ? I'm just curious because I thought she can't benefit from the energy regeneration ​@@iphantomivess

[@iphantomivess]

@@zephronic1062 she isnt, she provides nothing to acheron besides the atk buff, aventurine is better thanks to his debuff. imo, i have both at e0s0 and i prefer aventurine just bcs he feels more comfortable + sp positive

[@tintedplot96]

Bluds take on yunli and aventurine were probably his worse takes this time around

[@nervous-exe]

as someone who loves black swan and has spent the past week building and testing her, and then one random 10 pull gave me TWO MORE BLACK SWANS HAHAHA I'm super happy to hear you say that, she's one of my favourite designs and ult animations hands down. I'm using her without Kafka, as more classic nihility debuffer I suppose? But yeah LOVE her and it felt GREAT to hear you say that, esp after ppl saying she is low value so THANK YOU!!!

[@jammed_yam]

yes its good that you chose black swan by herself and not kafka by herself LOL

[@Syx.0]

YOU TOOK MY BLACKSWAN

[@gharbisyassine7576]

No, yunli deserves her Tier , we tried her since her release in both nodes , even in private server in 2.5 and she still demolishes dhil and jinglue , with a 2 cost team . Just accept it , not that hard though

[@aidanwillette4852]

I disagree that Tingyun is BIS for Yunli tbh, in all of my testing Jiaoqiu+Robin outperforms Tingyun+Robin in Yunli teams with Huohuo. Tingyun's buffs have too much overlap with Robin whereas that 50% vuln just slaps and is more significant than the extra ults. Not to mention a big benefit of Yunli over other top DPS is her ability to be played comfortably in sustainless comps and Tingyun is just too squishy for that.

[@soranamae]

Finally someone else who realizes this. Yunli has to be the most underrated character in game right now (especially if you get E1S1 where she becomes like twice as good). She makes no sustain almost as comfortable as break teams and Ive just started playing her with Pela as 4th slot instead of sustain in most fights (I dont have JQ). She no sustains every single floor of current MoC with near 100% consistency atm, without the risk of anyone ever dying if you time your parry/taunt well. The gap between Yunli and all of my 1.x hypercarries is insane, she has been one of my biggest account upgrades alongside Fu Xuan, Ruan Mei and Firefly.

[@vickdinvick5485]

beforehand i decide to play a game, everytime he says "i was right" or "i told u so" or "i was the one telling this" or any variations of the sort, i had to drink. Now i am typing this from hospital, send prayers!!

[@donewastingtime7939]

Said it once long ago: The thing about sustains is that outside of sustaining, whatever they give extra is just a bonus that doesn't make or break account compared to dedicated supports. Hence how Huohuo, way better unit than Luocha, has around same clear time in DoT team (team that wants her the most) as him. Hell, sometimes she even had worse clear time depending on endgame's current turbulence. Why? Because sustain is hardly a huge boost compared to something like RM in that team or Swan herself.

[@LucasGomes-ng2go]

I would agree if QPQ Gallagher did not exist. Bro simply enables Robin to be permanently on ult even with no FUA in the team.

[@fiddlybiddly]

100% incorrect about yunli, girly is goated and no you do not need tingyun and huohuo I run yunli with topaz and robin and before I got huohuo I was rocking luocha, with this comp I was 3 starring apoc, pf and moc. In short get your facts right about the child Also no one is running sparkle with yunli most people are running robin

[@LucasGomes-ng2go]

sadly I am no one, I run Sparkle bcs no Robin. Luckily I have Sparkle's LC, but the crit dmg buff is very negligible since I already get like 260CD on ult with Yunli before Sparkle

[@fiddlybiddly]

@@LucasGomes-ng2go my prayers go out to you brother that you get her

[@LucasGomes-ng2go]

​@TerraTheWise in a vacuum, yes. But her strongest team is Robin, Topaz and Huohuo, for 2 reasons. #1 Robin is BIs for FUA so that's a no brainer, #2 Topaz is the best battery for Robin, and although her damage in a vacuum is low, when you factor Robin and all the turns Numy takes during Concerto and practically every time Yunli gets hit, it adds up a lot. Putting Huohuo on the table, giving energy to everybody(if you have s5 shared feeling its a fuck ton of energy) and gaining a ton of energy every time Yunli activates her passive, so she's ulting way more frequently, and its the perfect Robin battery. The individual pieces are not much alone, but all of them together are the perfect team to maximize Robin

[@Jiii8777]

I ran yunli w JQ (another heavily doomposted unit) moze and pela and two cycled aventurine side. Not a single harmony unit. Swear these guide makers never think outside the box and always stick to shilling popular units

[@whole.milk__]

Don't necessarily disagree with your opinion on sustains here, but just wanted to raise a point some others might relate to. Many of us are in fact still using characters like Fuxuan as our 'first pick' in some teams because we (mostly f2ps) don't have the currency to pull for 4 sustain characters. Many of us might have pulled for Luocha and Fuxuan in the early days, and if they've continued to do their job sustaining (and for FX, the 12% crit rate is genuinely nice), we'd get more account value using our currency on new limited Harmonies or DPSes. While new sustains like Aventurine, HH, are super good for sure, the boost they give compared to adding a Ruan Mei, Robin, Acheron, Firefly etc. to your account is not close. The point on Gallagher is fair though - there are in fact comps where Gallagher is 'better' than Fuxuan/Luocha, but for some accounts, their relics etc. a FX with crit rate buff could potentially be a better option if not against Fire weak enemies/less value from QPQ abuse. I think overall my point is the "gap" between the T0 and T1 DPSes are much larger than the gap between sustains in terms of what they add to your team, as sustains' role is simply much simpler and less demanding.

[@Haze4743]

This fella gets it

[@AnimeIsFire]

I use Fu Xuan for my Feixiao team since my Gallagher is used on my FF team, and I don't have aventurine. And Fu Xuan does a great job buffing and sustaining, Smack was kinda off on the point that people don't use her on any of these teams.

[@Blizzard098]

I use Fu Xuan on Firefly team she does amazing job and when I get Acheron get e2 I will swap Adventuring to Fu Xuan. ​@@AnimeIsFire

[@Vahnatai]

100% agreed on that last sentence. The argument for Fu Xuan and Luocha is that they do the thing the sustain is trying to do just as well as the other premium sustains, if not better, hence them being so comfortable. FX teams are *tanky*, right. And yea, they do not have the same offensive potential as Huohuo or Aventurine, but I could just as well spend those pulls on grabbing important eidolons/signature LCs and get tons of offensive potential that way. Hell, if I really really cared about offensive potential I'd be running sustainless anyway. There is no doubt in anyone's mind that Aventurine/Huohuo/Gallagher are amazing and do provide more team value than FX/Luocha, but when it comes to their performance *as sustainers*, Luocha and FX hold up perfectly fine.

[@maxhochman7543]

Nice to see not everyone giving up on Fu Xuan. I skipped Huohuo and Aventurine (hes my least favorite character in the game, absolutely despise him) so Fu Xuan is my only limited sustain until Lingsha comes. My Gallagher also is barely built. I agree with everything youre saying. I think people are downplaying Fu Xuan far more than she deserves (admittedly mine is E1, but even without I still think shes a “Apex” level sustain), she is a FAR better unit than anyone in the tiers below her. I have had zero issue clearing any content in the game since pulling her and ive only seen her get one shot in high G&G if my blessing luck was trash. Her offensive buffs are underrated as well, especially if you dont have good crit relics on your dps.

[@kebabenjoyer1]

Yunli is not gonna drop lil bro. Hoolay is gonna be on the next MOC and he has like 200+ speed so he'll be attacking frequently along with the adds. Not to mention he has physical weakness. So Yunli will be eating good.

[@senioralexander0]

Yeah I know! He saying current meta is catered to her when it is not really, but after hoolay and other new enemies she will be. And his *easy nerf* is literally changing big part of the game which will need not only her but few others as well, with same logic firefly is so easy to nerf just make all enemies invulnerable to break easy

[@mahimraihan2235]

I play Clara and always use her. Believe me he has a point. I hit my head when they put low frequency attacking enemies. Mine deals 80k to one enemy with tingyun,sparkle. Total 175k per ultimate stack. There's the gorilla, the puppets. And it won't take them much to make more.​@@senioralexander0

[@mahimraihan2235]

​@@senioralexander0I now don't use Clara anymore without old enemies like Kafka /geopard.

[@senioralexander0]

@@mahimraihan2235 yeah I know right now it’s not counter attack meta at all, but I hope after hoolay we will get more enemies like him

[@masashiyeo]

@@mahimraihan2235 Feel sad for her that I only use Clara for MOC stage 12 part 1, she somehow managed to save my Feixiao team for Aventurine so props to her.

[@Borovski213]

Like I said before, i'll only agree on new character tier list after a patch or 2 when there is no buff and enemy lineup advantage

[@catbiba7444]

Leak spoilers below ↓ Feixiao has the lowest cost 0 cycles in the next 2 MoCs and clears the wind-weak side extremely comfortably. Memory Turbulence favors break.

[@kingsimba9513]

@@catbiba7444 today I learned that beta testers are time travelers and are able to test out not-yet-released MOC cycles in the future.

[@sense6472]

me when i asked

[@bem3760]

​@@catbiba7444 hoolay right? That fucks weak to single target damage dealer who doing big amount of damage. Guess who's that?

[@danusorn8655]

I feel like Bailu vs Aventurine would be at least a little bit better than Lynx

[@MinKiu410]

Gotta agree that Ratio premium team is quite expensive. I still use Ratio SW TY HH. SW alone gives enough Debuffs for Ratio even as SW E0S0 , she performs really good for Ratio

[@Lagoon4296]

I dunno about the logic of bumping Fu Xuan down a tier because she is the third pick for the meta teams. Just because there are other characters that work better for the meta teams doesn't mean she doesn't perform at a tier 0.5 level. Not being the best pick for meta teams definitely keeps her out of T0. But she is still way stronger than all the other sustains not in tier 0.5 and above that it honestly feels like a severe underestimation of her potential to drop her to tier 1. You can slot her into any of the meta teams and she will makes it an easy clear regardless, just very slightly slower than the meta pick (it might not even make a difference of a single turn). Yes, she isn't being utilized by people who have Adventurine, HH, and Gallager at the top level. She is instead being used by those that don't have them, and her performance is very comparable. In fact, looking at the MoC stats on Prydwen, as of 11/09/2024 with a sample size of 15974 players, Adventurine is sitting at 7.69 turns on average to clear MoC 12, Gallager is at 7.71 turns, Fu Xuan is at 7.75 turns, and HH is at 8.09 turns (It mentions that it excludes limited 5* E1+ characters, so they are all E0). Take from that what you will. I think Fu Xuan is easily the most underrated sustainer in the game.

[@Maralagidyne]

Regarding Feixiao 0-cycle on Aventurine's side, there was actually a CN TC (you can check the clip on their youtube channel called "Narwalncy", who were able to 0-cycle Aventurine using a team of E0S0 Feixiao, E0S0 Robin (with Bronya LC), Hunt March 7th and Moze. That's how cracked Feixiao is lol. There is absolutely no way an E0S0 Acheron or E0S0 Firefly running at the same investment can do it as easily as Feixiao. #1 dps is accurate.

[@ryuki9788]

@@Maralagidyne and it's the fact that it's the lowest costing team to 0 cycle Aventurine when there's wind AND img weakness (for Fei and M7), not even on element characters like Boothill, Acheron and Jingliu can do it

[@senseioct8564]

the power of 48% memory imprint moc buff

[@ryuki9788]

@@Daverf1f he does? nvm then. can u name the yt vid or is it even from yt?

[@ryuki9788]

@@senseioct8564 gonna tell u rn the moc buff does minimal shit. next moc will be break focus but Feixiao will still have the most comfortable clear with all the wind weak enemies. nice try on trying to downplay Feixiao though

[@MuchoBurritoHD]

@@ryuki9788You can’t say the memory buff does nothing wdym. The buff is literally to boost the new characters wdym 😂

[@-Exen-]

27:15 "Topaz has a fat ass? I didn't consider that variable" LMAOOOO

[@editimpact66]

Ratio's best team is still IPC even if Topaz is T0, you get 3 debuffs anyways and if you somehow still don't there's the Topaz preservation lc that you can throw at Aven. I think people forgot Ratio himself has a debuff..

[@LucasGomes-ng2go]

Good luck landing his debbuf lmao, it's a 50% to 60% chance to land it, depending on the enemy. I personally am not taking the odds. I agree Topaz is BiS nowadays, but just bcs of Duran. If you run Salsotto or Glamoth, it's 100% better to use debbufer + Tingyun/Sparkle/Robin

[@lstinside8688]

Jiaoqiu is better for him than E0S0 Topaz

[@sakutaro3musik486]

if prydwen critiria is E0S0 then how are kafka and black swan that high for so long? They are garbage without anything for a long time now and Acheron E0S0 is not T0 her sig is a big game changer for her

[@LucasGomes-ng2go]

Acheron has the problem of having dogshit LC options outside her sig. I play since launch and I only have GNSL and the Swan and Acheron cone at s1. She also cannot use the best supports in the game, the harmony characters. Dont get me wrong, she still does very good damage, but it does not come close to FF and Feixiao.

[@bubblesparks]

​@@LucasGomes-ng2go bro ur lucky to have even just one copy of gnsw or even the ache swan lc I have shit luck on banners that i play acheron with s5 fermata.. her dmg is so bad esp after waiting for the ult (ache-jq-pela-galla team)

[@Cappy_Cat]

​@@LucasGomes-ng2goShe can use the best harmony characters in the game, one other nihility like pela and a harmony works just as well, if not better, than two nihility characters, especially if you don't have Jiaoqiu.

[@The_CodFish69]

25:13 actually JQ ( S1 ) + Robin has shown interesting results on the Dr. R Team and in certain situations he actually outperforms E1S1 Topass in said you should look into it. I personally don't have her but with JQ + Robin I've gotten some nice clear times using him.

[@Max465]

So more serious take on why I agree with Fu Xuan being Tier 0.5. I think its valid for Tier lists to consider players not having every character for the same reason I think its valid that they don't just rate the whole tier list off every character E6. So you said "Cause she's the third pick, she should be in the third tier". That alone is a wrong way to think just due to multiple comp types. But also...I don't have Huohuo. So for me...she's second pick in A LOT of comps. Maybe even first because I need two comps for endgame modes. And she performs very well in those comps. I also have Luocha and there are times where I believed he's the second/first best in a comp and he failed me, only for Fu Xuan to pick up his slack even though on paper she shouldn't synergize with the team. If you have every character in the game? Sure...she might be T1. But if you don't she a more than worthy pick while easily performing above Luocha.

[@alonelycacti]

I feel like the reason jq is t1 and hmc is t0.5 is because firefly dies without hmc but acheron is still a top tier without jq, like i literally cleared apoc shadow full stars with acheron/pela/sw/fu xuan plus i also 4 cycled aventurine as a casual with the same team yesterday. The only place i believe acheron really needs jiaoqiu to be broken is pure fiction.

[@soulfulhuman8724]

Agree 💯

[@JohnDoe-si4eg]

If memory serves HMC had gone up bc of SBE Himiko had been stronger than her normal variant.

[@alonelycacti]

@@TerraTheWise I was talking about e0s1.. but yea e0s0 without jq is kinda scuffed

[@27Ganon]

I think Gacha Smack's impression of Yunli might be colored by not having her sig. He mentioned dependency on AoE attacks multiple times in his stream - anyone who has Yunli with her sig knows that this is a non-issue due to her sig's incredibly high taunt value. This is an E0S0 tier list but since he has the sigs for most other DPSs in the game, it's hard to believe he can compare Yunli to them fairly. Sigs on most DPSs make a huge difference, Acheron would similarly suffer a ton without her sig (but nearly everyone has it). It's only really Firefly that's the exception out of T1+ DPSs.

[@mediumsurmoon6283]

Did you forget the fact that literally every single characters in the tierlist are considered E0S0? That’s the main and important criteria Prydwen considers when making this tier list so it would be fair to every single players in the game, also to set a fine base line for people that do not have said characters and is interested in how well they fare against other characters, at specifically E0. How is it fair for Yunli to suddenly have an E0S1? Just to satisfy your biased feelings toward her? And also just to clarify it to you further, S0 basically stands for “No Signature Light Cone”

[@tieAcherry101]

Plus, yunli can work with Robin, Sparkle, Tingyun, Topaz and even Jiaoqiu. Huohuo would be the only necessary premium pull, but aventurine can also make the cut.

[@fr3941]

@@mediumsurmoon6283 I’m confused did you literally not read anything he said? He literally said it’s an e0s0 tier list and you still wrote this comment..? He knows it’s an e0s0 tier list and he acknowledges it

[@LucasGomes-ng2go]

​@mediumsurmoon6283 every single character besides Acheron right? bcs there's no way anybody thinks she does as much damage as Feixiao or Firefly without her sig

[@aaarin7767]

@@mediumsurmoon6283 "This is an E0S0 tier list but since he has the sigs for most other DPSs in the game, it's hard to believe he can compare Yunli to them fairly."

[@Kaelel376]

Where's the clown that tried to argue Luocha had the same pull value as Huohuo in the older videos

[@ravenwong651]

Erotic walrus?

[@apotatowithnorights]

I tried luocha in a friend's account and man... it felt like bailu 😭

[@Ling3620R]

@@apotatowithnorightsKkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk

[@manbearpigsereal]

Yunli always belong in the apex tiers, she dominates all content.

[@LikeACrouton]

Argenti's only fall off was with his VA

[@NoWastedPotential]

fr

[@gwterror]

Seele is better than the others in T2. The difference is if you have a hyper invested Blade/Himiko/QQ, they're still whatever. Seele though? Seele is amazing with hyper investment, far beyond the others, and honestly far beyond most units.

[@Supreme-King]

I beat Aventurine for the first time with Ratio, Herta, Bailu and Sparkle. Both Gepard and Bailu are underated.

[@xuk6042]

Do people even use gepard anyway 😂 gepard is carrying my alt account 😂

[@charlesill1134]

​@@xuk6042 Gerard literally carry my new account,just level 60 and I must fight Sunday💀 and the worst part is I use Feixiao hypercarry😂. But this man just ult and almost no dmg to my 3 other characters

[@zannax351]

2:49 Smack I think you may have forgotten to mention two extremely potent supports for Yunli in Jiaoqiu and Robin. Jiaoqiu in some situations can outperform tingyun for yunli, and robin I'm almost certain is just best in slot for yunli in just about every scenario. Yunli Jiaoqiu Robin and Huohuo is a team that can 0 cycle Aventurine in current moc without limited eidolons. Edit: Robin was definitely mentioned later in the video which is great, I think jiaoqiu is still worth highlighting as an option for Yunli

[@stevevang8888]

Dont care how long this video is, I like hearing your thoughts about the meta that is going on in HSR even though I'm a casual.

[@ghostbl33d65]

For me, FX is more of a 2nd pic nowadays which i agree is kinda sad. I still think she has more value than Gallagher outside of break teams because she has an automatic CC negate and most importanly her crit rate boost makes builds so much easier to manage. Her sustainability and value hasnt fallen off, she just doesn't synergize with any particular metas assets like the T0 sustains.

[@AndreiSorin1994]

27:15 Bro got destroyed with that argument 🤣🤣🤣

[@TopTOBiiiii]

Subscribed since hsr 1.3 and I still fully watch your longer videos and streams (hsr and wuwa). Keep it up man!

[@ABC-yj6cy]

Do take note that that Clara at T1 has her traces maxed out 😅

[@IdeasAreBulletproof]

Iyo could never

[@CuteC3]

I fricken love it when you push the Welt agenda. Doing the old man justice. Keep cooking Gacha Smack!

[@anonnymus6355]

''Do you know how hard it is to make a hunt character work in all modes?!'' Selee since 1.0: That aside I'm really surprised smack didn't pick selee up, She's one of the characters with the most gameplay variety and quality cooks and he seems to do those often so I thought he'd enjoy her.

[@RaulXq]

9:08 How is Huohuo better that Aventurine in Acheron? I mean she does have her technique which give you one debuff but that it and her energy doesn't help Acheron while Aventurine has crit vulnerability debuff on ult and can run Trend of the Universal Market for more stacks. Maybe HuoHuo is better in Dot Acheron but dots are declining in power and again Trend of the Universal Market can be usefull in dots.

[@youngfamoushype]

No question she made hunt relevant again, but she also has the most absurd performance to investment ratio from a pure team stand point, and that shit isn't even a point of contention. They really should start doing what the Nikke team does for their site, and start adding levels of investment symbols on the characters. Example: $Feixiao$ T0 with A-R-T.

[@Vicric]

Why do people say make hunt relevant, as if Ratio Topaz and Boothill weren't clapping cheeks. Seele also dominates CN clearing speeds.

[@vinhinh6810]

@@Vicric true, the only reason why hunt ain't relevant is because 90% of the playerbase claims hunt is "hard" to play, and so they result to fawn over every destruction character since "unga bunga" requires no brain

[@Radiant450]

@@Vicricthe casual playerbase has this hate boner against Hunt and I can sorta kinda understand why: its because Hunt is not strictly always plug and play like AoE and Blast units, yet can still surpass them easily if you put an ounce of planning. Hunt being ST has never actually crippled its performance and clear times (except PF with units other than Seele), they have always been strong.

[@keneunaegbu851]

I love how everybody wants to criticise FuA on their team cost while staying silent on DoT team cost 😂

[@xMomoee]

​@@keneunaegbu851 Fr the damage is even worse💀

[@endoleon2765]

1:54 Tbh, Clara's been carrying me since the beginning and I got her e2s3. I thought a better version of herself from every aspect could only be a must have. Glad I was right lol (ok I do pull eidolons here and there too, e1s1 robin, e2s1 sparkle, e2s1 Yunli got me 1mil in latest moc 12 💀, still her e1 is insane). I'm literally using Yunli/Huohuo/Robin/Sparkle everywhere, works disgustingly well.

[@moikha226]

I think they kust hate Arginti and Yanqing. Arginti isn't even T0 in his own game mode where he can just spam his weak ult and one shot enemies. As for Yanqing, he is pretty decent and tge only thing that is bad about him is his need for a shielder, but Firefly needs both HMC and RM to even be considered decent , so I don't really swe the problem here

[@critanddam9031]

49:00 yunli was strong even when she had enemies that weren’t attacking her

[@senioralexander0]

Fr let’s see how he reacts next MoC with 300 spd enemies

[@Lewa500]

Fu Xuan giving crit rate and being able to use Trends is enough to put her a tier above Luocha

[@thederp9309]

The thing with sustains is their main value is just the sustaining any extra value is just a bonus. If you think about premium teams, then I think that having the most optimal sustain is merely a cherry on top kind of deal. It’s nice but it doesn’t add much, it’s just a nice bonus. That’s why IMO the first 2 limited sustains are all you ever need, you never have to worry about pulling another sustain ever again unless there’s an enemy that either destroyed abundance characters or preservation characters that kind of forces players into a uncomfortable position so they are inclined to pull the other path. IMO the first two sustains have the best pull value ever, they beat out the value for supports because playing without sustains is inconvenient and just hell on Earth… Gallagher was a character that relieved this issue, especially for super break teams so now it’s argued that it’s just 1. But the value for 5* limited sustains after the first couple plummets off a cliff. The difference is usually so negligible that while Luocha is the one without a specific niche with his nearly useless buff cleanse in most cases, it doesn’t matter. Players should just go for a sustain that’s on banner if they’re missing one instead of waiting for the “best” sustain, a sustainers value comes disproportionately more from them making the game convenient than the buffs.

[@mhbarney8499]

How do you know Gachasmack just LOVES hearing himself? Doing content that would take minutes and drags it to hours. 🎉

[@whiteglint8191]

24:31 I feel like you are underrating how good the FuA team is for Ratio. I didn't have Topaz E1 or S1 so instead than pulling Aventurine I used QPQ Gallagher who provided SP, Debuffs and energy. It was performing still way better than the team with TY and Pela. Before Robin came out the Topaz Ratio team with Ruan Mei was also already completely functional.

[@oIIified]

Shit takes on Yunli, brother man simply hates on her for some reason lmfao. IL and Jingliu stand nowhere near close to her cause meta doesn't like to stagnate, older units, especially dd's, will always be worse. About the trio not attacking her, there are 2 nodes in MoC, simply put her on a different node, it's not like they'll put 2 of the same boss or 2 different dot oriented bosses on both nodes, can't wait whenever that fucking happens amirite

[@LucasGomes-ng2go]

is je talki g about the puppet trio? bcs I one cycled that bitch with Yunli e0s1 pretty fucking easy. There's no problem if they don't hit you on a battery team, you just waste an ult and kill everything on the next guaranteed cull.

[@eckology016]

Yeah, that's a good point. You see similarly things with FF if someone has a locked weakness bar. Okay... then put her on the other side, they're not gonna do two bosses that have locked weakness bars, nor are they gonna do two bosses with super low hit frequency.

[@LucasGomes-ng2go]

@@oIIified even on the puppets, I 2 cycled them last MoC with her bcs the chain guy attacks you twice, so if you have the right set-up, that's 2 culls on them, and since the HP bar is shared, you kill all of them in the process

[@oIIified]

@@LucasGomes-ng2go Exactly, she's far from useless against them as they're able to attack Yunli consecutively 3 times. Give her a full on dot boss and she'll still be able to easily clear within ~5 cycles thanks to one trace, she just deals that much damage.

[@gorilazoe]

@@oIIified This is where her flexibility comes into play, against enemies that don't attack much or at all (like that puppet that only inflicts dot) you can slot in a sub dps like Topaz to help her deal with them.

[@lenkaisen7767]

Hey smack, on the Seele matter I will say that the placement is fair. Everyone says that she requires a fucking ton of investment because that is simply a fact and, as everyone always says, she is a walking skill check. I can manage to do a 3-cycle clear in this MoC first half (which imho is a fair and acceptable clear) with a Monoquantum setup, the key is just playing Seele correctly. Being this said, Seele belongs to that tier precisely because she isn't very accessible to play even for endgame players, but when you get the proper investment onto her she becomes a totally diferent character.

[@harri7649]

I think Firefly and Acheron should move down a spot because we're talking about E0 and Feixiao literally can pop off at that but the former 2 pops off after a few eidolons

[@Cryantis]

Scoobydoo is the goat

[@Flamelance_Accendo]

I cannot regret at all getting her.

[@Indian_gae_boii]

i did not want to pulll her but I got her accidently while trying to get some of the 4 stars on her banner honestly I was a little sad at first because that meant I did not have enough pulls for sparkle E2 but right now, Im so glad I got her, shes so comfortable to use and her teamwide ult regeneration is actually so nice,

[@masashiyeo]

So glad I chose to pull for Feixiao, she's such a beast helping me max MOC and high difficulty DU too

[@expunge5651]

I used fexaio with march 7th no topaz robin and adventurine and man they really cooked up lots of content

[@Hejsnksvdi]

Yes, with march on the team, every time you use feixiao's skill you get 3 consecutive follow up

[@expunge5651]

@@Hejsnksvdi that team feels broken bruh n I’m not even done setting the team comp yet

[@Panda-yw4us]

That team would definitely do better with Robin tho the fact that Feixiao performs well even with a free character just makes her a t0 character

[@Hejsnksvdi]

@@expunge5651 yes i have that team and i even haven't finished building robin yet the team is performing that well

[@expunge5651]

@@Hejsnksvdi yes bruh they aint even fully loaded on my account yet but that comp be hitting like a truck

[@AnikethBandi]

I honestly have to disagree with the Aventurine take just because I feel like your looking at how good huo huo is when your teams are best optimized, and completely forgetting well she performs at the basline. Shields on average are far better than heals because it removes the need for you to be considerate of the squishiness of your dps or squishy supports like tingyun. Then there's the skill point element, a decently built eventurine almost never has to use his skill, give you far more flexibility. For example, I prefer aventurine over huo huo on acheron comps because he's the difference between having my black swan or jiaqui putting in an extra skill without having to ever worry about them potentially dying. Huo Huo on the other hand fucks up skill point usage if u don't think far ahead enough, which most casuals arent doing. Not to mention aventurines ability to give shields to all 4 members rather than huo huos 3 person blast is a life saver when all 4 party members are low. So while yes at your level, where people are far more focused on optimizing teams and builds, huo huo might be better slightly, Aventurine at the baseline is far better than huo huo can provide at the baseline. And for the vast majority of players in the game who are looking to pull for characters, they arent gonna optimize everything. So a character who performs as the very best at a baseline and the second best at the very top, is much better than a character who is the second best at the baseline and the best at the very top, because most people are never gonna actually bother trying to reach that very top.

[@ninthfriend3347]

If they're mostly rating the characters e0s0, then I do think Acheron should be moved down. Her sig offers the biggest improvement because better buffing and giving her an extra stack. But I do feel dps nowadays has their sig offering bigger performance increase over their f2p options.

[@LucasGomes-ng2go]

Agreed, Acheron without her signature does not come close to Feixiao or FF on herta shop cones, and even then, the LC situation for her is rougher bcs she only has two 4* gacha cones as viable alternatives and it's arguably easier to get her sig than s5 GNSW or Boundless Correo. The only good option you have after that is playing DoTcheron with Fermata, which is very scuffed, or cope with Solitary Healing on a normal 2 debbufer comp

[@sufferred7030]

between Ruan Mei and Robin, Robin is more universal, Crit value character still more than break and DOT characters, Robin is the best for Crit value dps Ruan Mei can replace her, but never as good as her

[@LucasGomes-ng2go]

there's also this problem I have with RM, where characters that have a lot of elemental dmg in the kit perform not that great with her, like Ratio, Topaz, DHIL. I don't know exactly why, but swapping her out for a SW in Ratio or a Tingyun in DHIL gives me much more damage, and I tested this extensively. I guess is just opportunity cost. Her res pen is still good but giving different buff probably gives better results.

[@digitalmaijiin6236]

Am I thr only one who has absolutely no issue running a yunli team without tingyun? I have 100% ult uptime with sparkle robin...

[@kain1799]

You're not wrong to say that dot and Kafka do no damage without bs. The whole thing is that Kafka is the driver for all dot past and future. Bs is incredibly important now but she isn't able to carry dot on her own. Which kafka will keep going up unless they make a better character who can pop all dots.

[@karman3k012]

Personally feel like acheron is missing two units for perfection since FuA and Break has their full team support and do dmg. While acheron is just her dmg and jiaoqiu support and chip dmg.

[@editimpact66]

Aventurine is bis sustain for every single fua team that robin is a part of, except yunli tho. He's better for acheron too, and if you don't build Gallachad for FF teams, he's better there as well. He is completely sp positive while offering damage and a bit of support at that. I'd say Aven shoukf still be the sole T0 for sustain, tho I definitely agree Huohuo being the second best right now.

[@yazan_7706]

50:32 I don't totally disagree with you about yunli but when I was playing her in the last MOC against the choir I got 1 cycles my team was (sparkle - yunli - robin - huohuo) sparkle + yunli + huohuo they all were e0s1 except for robin she were e0s0 im not saying that she may not fall depending on the opponent but if you understand/memorize the opponent's moves you can play around them

[@yazan_7706]

and yes yunli is my favorite character in the game 🙂

[@nf7694]

"sparkle + yunli + huohuo they all were e0s1 except robin she were e0s1" so all e0s1?

[@fr3941]

Yeah idk what he was talking about with that one..? I played yunli first half and she cleared perfectly fine

[@yazan_7706]

@@nf7694 sorry all were s1 but robin

[@senioralexander0]

Last MoC with choir I also 1 cycled with e0s1 yunli, e3 tingyun, e1s0 Robin and e0s0 aventurine… so yea he ain’t cooking with his takes

[@ML-sv5ez]

I think the difference between Acheron and Feixiao is Feixiao is like a blitz character due to her team comp while Acheron is a WMD. Its like comparing who's better - The one who has the best navy, army and airforce or the one who has the nuclear bomb?

[@DaemonKingOberon]

Im so glad I saved all my pulls for E2S1 Aventurine. His all type resistance down on basic attack and Robins E1 25 Res Pen is crazy together.

[@krzysztofwisniewski8325]

26:42 Yeah, getting E1 Topaz is easier than s5 DDD though. Im at S4 and picked 2 copies this week on Robin banner xd.

[@Mantovao]

The thing about Fu Xuan is that, yes, you´re not gonna zero cycle, but godddammit, it feels so nice and comfy to just press auto and still clear everything in 1-2 cycles. 100% Clear, full stars, in all game modes. Just for that she is GOD Tier for me.

[@mengyue1472]

Pela is BiS in any ice comp the more ICE dps the more she gonna shine like the sun. Also Yunli should be tier 0

[@_ninjaneer]

I gotta be real with ya man, the thing is, they finally fixed Hunt with Boothill/Feixiao. I've been saying for a very long time, that for a Hunt character to compete with AOE units in terms of low cycles, they have to be able to 1 shot a unit into nonexistence with overkill dmg. I love my boy Dr Ratio, but he never really stood a chance compared to DHIL/Jingliu (and now Firefly/Acheron). Its really good to see the versatility that Feixiao can provide to a path I was convinced was going to always be inferior. (Boothill is a little different, simply because he is a break unit.)

[@shirou_white]

"the acheron copers aren't ready for this!".... jokes on you mate, i'm an Acheron coper AND a Feixiao coper!

[@DeathDawns]

YOU LEAVE ARGENTI ALONE SMACK! He's a kind boy just trying his best

[@sora519]

You convinced me to get Robin E1 I was on 50/50 and got her with a single pull at 4 just after getting Feixiao, and both helped me clear Level 5 new SU, thank you 🙏🏻

[@Darkneonflame13]

Fact boothill isn’t in tier 0 is nuts he is more flexible than firefly and does nearly similar damage when quickly stacked, also Acheron Feixaio is way closer than you think, she does not shit on Acheron their damage is relatively similar and without Robin at E0S1 Feixaio is not a tier 0 unit at all and that comes from my personal experience, also fox man really brings Acheron up making her ult frequency so nuts

[@eckology016]

The problem with Boothill compared to Firefly is that even if you do everything perfectly in terms of playing him (compared to Firefly who's the single easiest character in the game to play), your result is... the same thing you get from Firefly. So it's just doing a lot of extra work to get the same thing you can get with no work. A half-tier difference for that seems fair. If he was substantially outperforming her when played optimally, that'd be a different matter. As for Feixiao and Acheron, if you do have Jiaoqiu and don't have Robin, she's obviously better, but that's a silly way to compare them. You should compare them both without their best support (Feixiao clears) and both with their best support (Feixiao clears).

[@Darkneonflame13]

@@eckology016 I completely disagree that Feixaio clears. she is a single target dps you still gotta take multiple turns focusing down one guy which can mean cycles can drag on, Acheron does not have that issue since she hits just bout everything and also hits em much harder. does it take longer for her to get her ult somewhat, but if your supports are 160 and she has good enough speed you can usually get 3 ults a cycle which is definitely killing whatever is in front of you. As for boothill well unlike firefly his damage increases based on how big enemies health is, you are not seeing firefly one shot certain bosses like he does. I think Feixaio and Acheron are pretty much similar with their best supports, I think boothill should be tier 0. Also there’s the fact Acheron is now good everywhere, and if an MoC has multiple bosses like say Kafka side Feixaio is taking quite a bit to get through it.

[@kindaviral3736]

@@eckology016boothill over feixiao if both played correctly tho, I think we should take them at their best played since it’s a turn based “strategy” game

[@Mamjamsham]

@@TerraTheWise too much effort and its just having 2 braincells to get his trickshots as soon as possible. you are making yourself look dumb lol. why bro so upset about Boothill deserving T0 also Boothill quite literally needs less investment than FF due to not having attack to break effect conversion which means you dont even need to give a shit about relic main stats even if you dont care about 0 cycle, he will still comfortably 1-2 cycle with generic gameplay if you have 2 braincells

[@Cappy_Cat]

​@@eckology016Without their best supports feixiao does not clear Acheron bro that's a delusional take. She hits for like 250k, which is alright, but acheron can do that on a single target too, even without her best supports, and then does that damage to everyone else too. Comparing them without their best supports, Acheron is the one that completely clears her.

[@FirstLast-qq9zh]

The tier list is based on current content. If Yunli sucks in the future, then she should be moved down when she starts sucking. Currently she’s great so she deserves her spot and I think you and prydwen are underrating her based on some theoretical future value.

[@hildianseeker6568]

Huehue finally attaining the respect she deserves 🗣

[@aboutme7810]

I think Yun-Li is 0 tier and Archeron is 0.5 without that Foxian.

[@LucasGomes-ng2go]

agree, Acheron is not that crazy at e0s0 without Jiaoqiu

[@timofeyfayzullin1489]

Finally someone is yapping about BH being absolutley busted with bronya

[@youneselbairi9224]

yunli's sig is a huge gamechanger with the cdmg buff and the taunt topaz and robin are also very viable with yunli which i noticed you hadn't mentioned

[@mzcrdz]

Bro casually drops a 1hr video thank you king

[@hitagisenjogaharaqweenqwq6735]

2:55 I think it's coz tingyun is heavily f2p considering she's not longer that much used due to most people using firefly and archeron teams

[@thefakeslimshady6969]

Huohuo is growing on me. I'm so glad i got her on her last rerun

[@LucasGomes-ng2go]

respectfully, saying shit like "Yunli will fall off when enemies dont hit you" is as valid as saying "Acheron falls off if the enemy has infinite eff res" or "Firefly falls off if enemies lock the toughness bar". Yes its true, but there's always two sides in MoC. The odds of both bosses invalidating your DPS gimmick is extremely low, and in Yunli's case, its not a big deal, you just have to play the battery team and spam her ult to get the guaranteed Cull on the next one. I literally did this on Aventurine, a slash on the dice to get two ult charges and then two culls on his face after winning the bet. Literally one cycled his ass with zero eidolons. Even on Choir, you just have to time the ult for the pipe or the violin guys and she works fine

[@koko-hh2bq]

This 100%

[@TheRoleplayer40k]

@@TerraTheWisejust have e6 Yunli like me, counters any ability

[@LucasGomes-ng2go]

@@TerraTheWise what enemies? There's a single one, the DoT puppet, and its always paired with someone else that does hit. If Hoyo introduces a single boss that has 300% eff res you gonna say Acheron is dogshit? Smack's point was "Yunli is good but not the best bcs if the enemy does not attack she does nothing", and my point is, there's a single enemy that kinda makes her clunky but its still not a big deal, to the point where saying this as an argument for her being worse than the top dogs is the same as saying "Acheron does dogshit damage bcs the Swarm King has 40% eff res so you need a billion EHR on every debbufer to make her work" when in reality majority of bosses have 20 to 30 res.

[@senioralexander0]

@@TerraTheWisewell we do have SAM who locks toughness bar why is that happening again unrealistic? And even then yunli is still valid with enemies who don’t attack but firefly against enemies who lock toughness bar for very long? No

[@taydrms6932]

Gepard has been my go to sustainer since launch and I’m super comfortables

[@rameking1]

YunLi for me was a HUGE account buff. She instantly became not only my primary physical carry, but also one of the most powerful units on my account next to Firefly and Acharon. And that's running her with a Himiko/Feixiao as a sub-dps. Her only support is Robin. Her ability to AOE taunt, self-heal, and AOE retaliate made her a god-tier unit. Edit: Your final comments on YunLi were very true. She falls off in any format where enemies don't AOE or she can't guarantee her taunt will work like on enemies that put a target debuff on a party member.

[@sleepicat]

Black Swan’s kit is fine, but the only way DOT will be as strong as other archetypes is if they powercreep Kafka.

[@michelangeloalbiero1862]

Sorry, but saying huo huo's better than aventurine for dr ratio is just wrong an you know it, I understand u like her and her play style, but personal preference shouldn't factor in so heavily when making a tierlist

[@AsianMarianKaren-]

it'd be so cool to see an animation of Feixiao and Acheron butting heads in battle.

[@themangaboi4969]

I have survived with only one limited 5 star which is Fu Xuan since I got her. And my other healer which is Gallagher and bailu, and for yunli, I ran Yunli without Huo Huo, and Tingyun by using Yunli, sparkle, Robin and Fu Xuan clearing 1 cycle. So yunli is without energy supplier is still really good.

[@GreenScreen_41]

Atleast Argenti and yanqing are consistent😂😂

[@Drejkol]

For Sparkle, I have to disagree. First - she enables every single team composition to spam their abilities. Second - she gives you GIGANTIC CD (and CR if you have her Sig) buffs. 3rd - You don't need hyperspeed Sparkle to perform - just 150ish speed Sparkle is enough to perform like Bronya and literally boost your hyper carry to action, which means that you don't need her Sig. Broyna's Sig or even Past and Future LC is literally free +32% dmg from ass. I have Ruan Mei E0S1 and the only team I'm using her, is the FF one. In Acheron (E2S1) comps, Dhil (E1S1) comps, Jingliu (E0S1) comps, Feixiao (E2S1) comps she's just weaker than my Sparkle (E0S1). You can try that yourself - Sparkle / Ruan Mei + Aventurine + Pela/Jiaoqiu (They literally performs the same) + Acheron. Go to the Feixiao boss battle (after you finished 3 weekly battles for the rewards, you can battle any boss for free unlimited amount of times) and fight her. Do 3 runs with Sparkle, then 3 runs with Ruan Mei. Full auto ofc. After the battle is over, check the timer (it always shows you how long the battle took you). Every single time Sparkle teams will clear it faster. Ruan Mei's penetration gives you WAAAAAY less value for hyper carry, than Sparkle's CD (and CR). She should be in T0 for being able to boost so many characters, not RM.

[@Noamy092]

Dont even try to start fighting with the rm copers 😭 her amp is literally garbage. Even e1s1 jq > e1s1 rm which is funny to me. Fx and even my dhil did way more dmg with jq over rm. Rm is literally a jack of all trades master on none lol

[@cadiusk3553]

I run yunli without any of those supports and she goes pretty crazy in alot of content, I do have her sig though

[@zycane]

Everything apart from the sustain take was valid. Sustain take on Fu Xuan, was probably a slight smooth brain take. She's still the only type who can guarantee one of dps'ers not getting one shot in certain scenarios. Aventurine's and every other sustains' weakness is they can't really prevent a death if the same non-tanky unit gets focused by enemies, and we'll likely see something similar to that very mechanic, not to mention the constant extra actions of certain hard hitting bosses, would be interesting, when a certain someone who does hard single hits in succession, came in one of the 3 modes. She's the only one who can spread out damage on others to herself. the only survival in question becomes Fu Xuan herself, which a proper built Fu Xuan can also counter.

[@BigSteppa3443]

8:10 I hear ya brotha, but lets be real for just a second... Aventurine is literally best sustain for the TOP 3 MOC units, on the list YOU AGREE with!!!!! QUICK YOUR YAPPIN OLD MAN

[@electrickzy]

No way Smack’s chat really thinks that Blade , Himeko & Jingyuan deserves to be in the same tier as Seele lol

[@antoniolesha]

Happy I went for a E1 Huo Huo, always knew she would dominate!

[@tomas-lm6rf]

I disagree with “Dr Ratio best team is tingyun debuffer and huohuo”. It has been shown multiple times that Dr Ratio Topaz Robin and Aventurine outperform any other team with Dr Ratio in it. It’s SP friendly and has the right amount of debuffs for Dr Ratio 100% FUa guarantee. I’m aware of his passive that needs at least 5 debuffs for full potencial but 20% damage boost is nothing compared to Topaz and Robin FUA damage increase. And no, u don’t need E1 Topaz or Sig Aventurine to function.

[@ahmedmubarak751]

How are you applying debuff easily tho ? I've tried that team multiple times and the fact that I have to gamble my chances for ratio to do his follow up makes me want to jump off a cliff

[@austinadvincula4410]

​@@ahmedmubarak751 Topaz e1s1= 2 debuffs Aventurine =3 debuffs You're over stacking on debuffs pretty much

[@Blade_XV]

Its not ratios best team at e0s0

[@tomas-lm6rf]

@@ahmedmubarak751 Ratio and Topaz passive debuff already give u 80% chance for FUA. You just need Aventurine Ult or break the enemy or burn the enemy with the “Trend of the Universal Market” lightcone on Aventurine to reach 100% chance. Hope i could help u :)

[@Secret123890]

I agree with Smack this time... Prydwen were cooking like my dad for almost 1.5 years until now.

[@victor.kopsch]

The thing is, most of us already have E1 in some char. With E1 or even E2, the tierlist change drastically. Dan IL S1E2 with Sparkle S1E2 its in the same level of a Acheron S1E2 and BronyaS1 for example.

[@ablacadabla7243]

could someone tell me when is huohuo best in slot for ratio and acheron? lol that was some mad take

[@Max465]

I think Lynx is properly rated. I don't even know who we're talking about below her. I've never seen that dude on my account. IF HE WANTS TO BE ABOVE LYNX HE SHOULD SHOW THE FUCK UP

[@juniorraya1023]

Always fun to see this list Growing up means u realize how much value have robin and Sparkle over RM in a Turn based game And my bro saying Feixiao makes Hunt for all modes 😂😂😂😂 Seele doing all 3 endgames since day1 without the expensive team cost that Feixiao has No wonder Seele always have high tier on CN lists Since shes a high skill character (unlike ff and acheron) with a high skill ceiling thks to the supports Besides Yunli has a trace that fix the "enemies dont attack" problem, with her team (tyng/huohuo/robin) she can easily 1-2 cycles Aventurine which is faster than FF Overall this list always makes ppl talk in a bad way without even understanding the game properly