the aliens will not be silicon

The aliens will not be silicon and that's okay!
All my 'humble yourself' jokes are a reference but it feels lame to constantly dunk on that guy so I didn't clip him in here.
On the Potential of Silicon as a Building Block for Life
pubmed.ncbi.nl...
Life in the Universe
press.princeto...
The Black Cloud
/ 1246118

[@acollierastro]

Does my Kentucky accent prevent me from pronouncing words correctly or is a clever scheme to get engagement via comment corrections? You'll never know! It's my accent. Sorry y'all!!

[@wkgmathguy218]

What accent?

[@antondovydaitis2261]

Yeah, I don't hear an identifiable accent.

[@Orikron]

You speak in General American English.

[@Ithirahad]

I figured you were just being a contra(na)rian. Or that you were just salty about the whole silicon life idea and some of that extra Na ended up in your pronunciation.

[@jsalsman]

Are you kidding? You could do science ASMR!

[@coalhater392]

The transitions are keeping me on edge.

[@tibr]

Fantastic account name/pfp in the context of this video

[@notsojharedtroll23]

​@@tibr top g comment

[@mihailmilev9909]

Hehehe

[@mihailmilev9909]

Heheheh

[@mihailmilev9909]

Oh shoot yeah true lol

[@vlogbrothers]

I loved this and also I hadn't heard of the clay hypothesis! That is freaking wild! Mind absolutely blown that it could be that "inorganic" of a process (half of it being literally inorganic). What a wild idea...I love it so much.

[@acollierastro]

It is such a nutso idea it makes me happy!

[@DavidAntelmo]

omg you're here, it's so cool to find you here. you guys are awesome for science

[@kylewood4001]

Yeah I want more on that, such a cool idea. Video covering it perhaps??

[@johannageisel5390]

@@acollierastro I've recently heard that the fact that the Miller experiment was conducted in borosilicate glasses actually had a positive influence on it. Silicates are important for the formation of life!

[@danielsayre3385]

how wild is it to have 25k subscribers and hank/john green are one of them

[@coal760-BH3]

As a chemist, I was convinced once I learned how little silicon likes to form rings on its own (not Si-O rings, Si-Si rings), which is the basis of most of the molecular complexity in living systems. And there are lots--LOTS--of cute little chemical properties that suggest Si is across the board a worse candidate than C. I never thought about Si mostly being in rocks. That's a fantastic point.

[@akpovoghoigherighe964]

Let's take a theorectical abstraction step up. Are there a number of those traits we attribute to "living" that could be assigned to things that don't form these Si-O rings? Are these the only traits that define "living"? Is there no other type of "living" that could exist? Up until a week ago I, and most scientists I believe, would have never guessed there's more "life" inside Earth than on it. Could other types of elements be the basis for life in these types of, and other, weird environment?

[@happysloth3208]

⁠@@akpovoghoigherighe964I’m a biochemistry undergrad, honestly carbon would be the best element for life due to its light weight, its less electrically positive than silicon, and these characteristics are crucial to have functioning proteins. So if we were to find alien life one day, I personally think it would most likely be carbon based life.

[@sunburntsatan6475]

I identify as a chemical biologist for my research and honestly while silicon is a fascinating element with awesome behaviors, they are not conducive to life. I am almost 100% certain that other forms life would use water and carbon just like we do just because it's around and they work very well together. I think it's more likely that anaerobic life is likely to arise because oxygen can actually be fairly problematic. Living things have pyrite-like FeS clusters to help transport electrons and I think it's not a far cry to think that instead of Oxygen, other creatures may specialize in using metals to help do the oxidation/reductions necessary to make life happen. While it's definitely pure scifi, the imagery of living things with growing crystals that regulate biological functions is a compelling image and I think it Links to our own biology in really interesting ways.

[@sunburntsatan6475]

​@@happysloth3208My favorite reason is the easiest one: it's around. Carbon is everywhere. So it's just much more likely life would use this super abundant, virtually limitlessly flexible, instead of ones that are unstable and not super abundant

[@RoamingAdhocrat]

​@@sunburntsatan6475 there was a phenomenal micro-science fiction story about a space navy intercepting and preemptively disabling an oblivious intruder vessel (over the course of about eighty years of high-subliminal manouevering). on boarding they are horrified to find the lifeforms on board are immersed in high concentrations of an industrial solvent, and that it appeared to be a colony ship

[@stadlerplanck]

That whole Hoyle tangent was absolutely full of jaw droppers, incredible

[@TheMusicalFruit]

Who's gonna tell Fred Hoyle about survivorship bias?

[@snuffyupagus2216]

@@TheMusicalFruit the survivors?

[@bbqchezit]

@@snuffyupagus2216 survivors can't talk to him now tho

[@snuffyupagus2216]

@@bbqchezit oh snapples, seems I need a whitty reply. How about "they could if they were made of silicone!"? Yeah that works great and almost seamless to the conversation 😎

[@bbqchezit]

@@snuffyupagus2216 it's witty replies all the way down

[@TheMusicalFruit]

I like how Angela pauses and looks apologetic after making a science joke. I imagine she's used to getting a groan or bewildered look when she makes a nerdy joke, but I'm just here snorting tea out of my nose.

[@ticthak]

It's all in t he ti ming...

[@kieranh2005]

Painful isn't it. Brandy is worse.

[@universexplorer3665]

Was the joke at the very end of the video? I seem to have missed it

[@thekillerprawn]

I can't get over how many times you said contranarian instead of contrarian it's actually killing me

[@Bauldi]

her points were valid but that definitely was a killer

[@scritoph3368]

Stop being such a conterienne!

[@derp195]

She said it so many times and so confidently that I googled contranarian to make sure it wasn't an actual word.

[@amy_grace]

An extremely contranarian pronunciation, you could say

[@agxryt]

Lmao right? I heard it so many times that I actually started feeling like it WAS contranarian

[@TheBoogerJames]

"Imagine a puddle waking up one morning and thinking, “This is an interesting world I find myself in, an interesting hole I find myself in, fits me rather neatly, doesn’t it? In fact it fits me staggeringly well, must have been made to have me in it!” This is such a powerful idea that as the sun rises in the sky and the air heats up and as, gradually, the puddle gets smaller and smaller, it’s still frantically hanging on to the notion that everything’s going to be alright, because this world was meant to have him in it, was built to have him in it; so the moment he disappears catches him rather by surprise. I think this may be something we need to be on the watch out for." Douglas Adams, The Salmon of Doubt

[@ambulocetusnatans]

Happy belated Towel Day

[@ramudon2428]

Came down to look for this exact thing and there you are. Must be God.

[@dantecarangelo1083]

That's one staggeringly incurious puddle. XD

[@Michael-kp4bd]

@@ramudon2428 the chances of someone bringing up this quote on a video where it just happens to relate? Utterly incomprehensibly small, given all possible combinations of letters and words! 😊

[@ramudon2428]

@@Michael-kp4bd Absolutely not. The "puddle analogy" for wondering how it's possible that the universe is JUST rightly tuned is pretty common.

[@kevinsips3658]

I'm glad the little old ladies who liked astronomy got a feel-good story

[@andiralosh2173]

Praise him 😂

[@zperdek]

​@@andiralosh2173 Fred Hoyle?

[@kevinsips3658]

@@zperdek That must be who she's talking about

[@zperdek]

@@kevinsips3658 Hmm. OK

[@guardrailbiter]

Feel-good stories? Isn't that what church services on Sunday are for?

[@seasidescott]

I worked with Miller, Sagan and Borucki - they'd love your explanation. We made prebiological building blocks in update of Miller/Urey and extending it to Venus, Titan, etc. After coming up with the "Goldilocks Zone" the next thing was to look for rainbows which require everything that life does to evolve. Other places can produce very basic organic molecules, even biologic precursors, but wont be stable enough unless there are rainbows. Venus, Titan, even Jupiter are producing the "little tiny building blocks" all the time (high in the atmosphere for Venus and Jupiter, down in the sea for Titan) but no clay, no rainbows.

[@matthewtalbot6505]

So if I’m understanding you, speaking of Titan specifically, the liquid hydrocarbons on the surface are not suitable to be used as a solvent to make any of the complex molecules required for an organic chemistry to arise?

[@henriquepacheco7473]

​@@matthewtalbot6505 I only have a superficial understanding of the chemistry involved, but water and the Titan hydrocarbons would be very different solvents - water is a very polar molecule, the hydrocarbons over there aren't. This means that they dissolve different things to different extents, which could be a barrier for the assemblage of macromolecules into life.

[@seasidescott]

@@henriquepacheco7473 - correct but the point is that production of key ingredients like HCN and simpler hydrocarbons like ethane are occurring in the atmosphere, just as had happened on primitive Earth.

[@D-angelin.Moarar]

​@@seasidescottOh, so does that mean all the moons with subglacial oceans like Enceladus, Europa, Dione, Callisto etc. aren't suitable places for life to potentially develop either? In case that life (on earth) originated at hypothermal vents, which may be present on at least some of these moons too, the lack of an atmosphere shouldn't really matter, right? Sadly this all isn't really my field of expertise, particularly the more complex chemical stuff, but I'm fascinated by the details around all of this nonetheless.

[@dstinnettmusic]

Were you part of the team in that one part of Cosmos?!

[@simonhibbs887]

Cool fact - the sand worms in Dune are an alien silicon based life form. That's why they are allergic to water and have a life cycle with the sandtrout that encysts and isolates water, because it dissolves them so easily so they have to exclude it from the environment. It's also why they can thrive on Dune because they eat sand to metabolise the silicon in their super hot digestive system, so it's a food to them. Edit: This is reported from a discussion Herbert gave at an SF convention panel, so not really canon.

[@bow_wow_wow]

Fiction. This is cool fiction.

[@caspermadlener4191]

Yeah, of course it is fiction. But the coolness of the fact is more important.

[@paperheartzz]

Very cool, so they don't eat people right? They're just really heavy and attack the watery bugs on their planet? Genuine question...google failed me.

[@simonhibbs887]

@@paperheartzz I don't think Herbert ever really discussed it in detail, and the canonicity of them being silicon based is questionable as it's not stated in the books, but he did talk about it at conventions that he had some of these ideas in mind. I think they eat people just because we're there, it's not really intentional and probably doesn't do them much good. maybe we give them heartburn. The Fremen say they are very territorial, so I think that's why they attack.

[@CantusTropus]

​@simonhibbs887 the human body contains rather a lot of water, so I imagine that eating us would be much like eating a highly poisonous animal.

[@PowderedDonutCrew]

At the expense of being a contranarian, the word youre thinking about is actually contrarian. Love your work & youre sense of humor in relating these high level concepts. Thank you for the content!

[@windubitably]

I’m loving her videos, but that one word was repeated so often, I’m glad someone brought it up.

[@keith5615]

Contrarians use contranarian. I am enjoying all this nonetheless :)

[@pstrap1311]

Bruh a wanted to make this exact comment but I knew if I looked it would already be here. She said it like eight times lol! Great video, she is obviously way smarter than me, which is why I was so glad to find a tiny point to seize on to salve my ego haha.

[@jeangove01]

God I hated this. Loved the video.

[@les9]

@@pstrap1311not to be a contranarian but she used that word way more than eight times

[@notapplicable7292]

That clay replication method is the coolest thing I've heard this week

[@najawin8348]

It's the coolest bit of abiogenesis research that nobody knows about. Dennett talks about it in _Darwin's Dangerous Idea_ which doesn't get anywhere near enough love.

[@mihailmilev9909]

​@@najawin8348thanks

[@Beastw1ck]

@@najawin8348 "Abiogenesis" is now my word of the week.

[@Subtlenimbus]

@@najawin8348 great book. I think Dawkins mentions the clay hypothesis too somewhere.

[@AlarKemmotar]

​@@Subtlenimbus that's where I first saw it. I think in the blind watchmaker.

[@KenColton]

I was not anticipating watching 37 minutes on prospects of silicone life (and some epic tangents) tonight. I’ve never seen your channel before, but you’re such an excellent story teller and communicator I thought surely you must have a couple million subs and was very surprised when I closed YT vid and saw otherwise. Really great vid!

[@Matty002]

the clay hypothesis is so wild i love it. its giving hydrothermal vent hypothesis vibes

[@thomaskalinowski8851]

2 great hypotheses that taste great together.

[@sjorgen9122]

Fred: "What if there were a Hoyle lotta isotopes we ain't even discovered yet"

[@strezztechnoid]

That's funny!!!

[@rakino4418]

Hoyle: if a star rushed away from us, I'd suggest the light may be reach us at a lower part of the spectrum, or "fred-shifted."

[@johnpassaniti4417]

This was really interesting. You hear about silicon-based life all the time in sci-fi books and popular science magazines. And everyone brings up it can do four bonds like carbon, but the moment you showed that diagram of silicon with the asymmetric pattern of bond sites, I immediately saw the problem that you then detailed. And (some) of the other reasons you gave I never heard before. I'm a computer science guy, not an astrophysicist, but this was the best presentation of why silicon-based life is unlikely.

[@sillymesilly]

But their mechanism can be entirely different just like a machine

[@planexshifter]

Unlikely but not impossible. Completely dismissing the idea is narrowminded and arrogant.

[@themelancholyofgay3543]

There's really people who believes a rock would be alive...

[@RexxSchneider]

@@planexshifter "Narrowminded and arrogant" is exactly how Flat-Earthers characterise anyone completely dismissing the idea that the Earth is flat. People sometimes believe in utterly stupid things and find it easier to attack those who disagree than to acknowledge the impossibility of their ideas. Believing in the possibility of silicon-based life is a good example of that.

[@jacobrutzke691]

​@themelancholyofgay3543 thats not the argument

[@moxxiemaximus]

Not to be a contrarian... but I honestly kinda stan Hoyle for pissing off the Nobel committee by sticking up for an overlooked female grad student. He did good.

[@agxryt]

*contranarian (this is a joke)

[@FergusJohnston]

He did well.

[@math925]

Your meme game goes as hard as your narrative weft. I love your videos, they are engaging and inspiring.

[@danielrusso4468]

Fellow astrobiologist here! I used to have the same "oh, carbon chauvinism is bad!" And "why not silicon, or boron?" The more I've learned the more its clear that carbon will almost certainly play a role. The specifics of that biochemistry may be vastly different, but carbon will be there. Its crazy to me now that i used to think otherwise, honestly.

[@villager736]

Why not just have a carbon-silicon based organism instead?

[@danielrusso4468]

@@villager736 i mean, you could, but with carbon doing everything better than silicon does in terms of stability and flexibility, it sort of begs the question of "why would that happen?" Chemistry is just a set of rules and logic, and the most logical and stable thing to do is a primarily caron-based lifeform. I mean, you might see silicon filling a supplementary role, similar to how Nitrogen, phosphorous, and oxygen do for us, but to find a silicon-based life form where you already have an abundance of carbon wouldn't make sense.

[@villager736]

@@danielrusso4468 true

[@davidsenra2495]

I'm glad you've endured the pain of figuring out you were wrong, and you still pressed forward. It's hard, I know. For people asking, the reason people believe in "non-carbon" lifeforms in the first place is that carbon-based life is incredibly hard to come around, and equally difficult to thrive. So by believing in that nonsense, you increase the likelihood that there is alien life after all. In the end, it's just wishful thinking, the most human (not alien) thing of them all.

[@petefluffy7420]

Or, maybe, perhaps maybe, we can make them out of morons? There seens to be s surplus of them on youtube.

The Black Cloud was a very important book for me when I was a kid, and I didn't think of the writer's name until today. Thank you for blowing my mind.

[@TKVirusman]

Besides the fact that I had to listen to you say contranarian for 40 minutes instead of contrarian (which I did because this video is amazing) THIS VIDEO IS AMAZING

[@daydays12]

Maybe she is saying : "contramarian" Definition: A person who finds fault what other people say no matter what it is, and lets them know it. Etymology: contrarian (a person who takes an opposing view, especially one who rejects the majority opinion) + Marian (a female given name, form of Mary)

[@BalzyMcSwollensack]

I tried to look up contranarian. I thought it was me not knowing words again

[@Microtonal_Cats]

This was the next recommended video after I watched "Growing Living Rat Neurons To Play... DOOM"

[@quelorepario]

Meanwhile, in a far away galaxy, in a silicon-rich planet, a youtuber is saying: Aliens will not be carbon based: 1. bond angles, very strong bonds, very short bonds - carbon is a needy whore. 2. it is hard to make life with diamonds 3. liquid nitrogen does not work as a solvent in a carbon-based life. 4. Why would it be carbon based life if silicon is right there?

[@quelorepario]

@Valer define natural. Because variations of mass, orbits, temperatures and available chemistry may make carbon-based less favorable or outright impossible, while leaving a less perfect but viable path for silicon-based or any other alternatives.

[@hanz05]

😂😂

[@nerdyspinosaurid]

you know what as much as I consider silicon stuff less likely, this is too funny to not like

[@ambulocetusnatans]

Speaking of old Sci-fi. In the Galactic Center series by Greg Benford, the bad guys were a race of sapient robotic life. So they would be at least partially silicon and partially metallic, assuming computer chips were made in a similar way by the ancient race who created them. Interestingly, the "Mechs" as they were called, didn't hate humans in the way humans hate each other, they felt about us the way a cook feels about ants in the kitchen.

[@UteChewb]

@@ambulocetusnatans a great series. The protagonist fighting fellow humans and giant asteroid sized killer robots at the same time. Reminds me of Hoyle now that I think about it.

[@SteveRowe]

This video has made you my new favorite science youtuber. Great references, great explanations, fun stories, unapologetic atheist, and blending chemistry, biology, and physics.

[@kalla103]

girl, i love your style, your editing, the way you explain stuff, ty for making these videos!❤

[@redpointt]

In all the videos I’ve recently watched I think this is the first time I saw you smile, that’s refreshing

[@emilyrln]

The clay hypothesis is so cool!! Also the epic transition music gave me life 😂 so each time my soul died a little with "contranarian," I had epic sounds keeping me tethered to my body!

[@magister343]

What is wrong with her repeatedly identifying him as being "opposed to nostrils"?

[@emilyrln]

@@magister343 Thank you for your honest inquiry. Breathing with my nostrils comprises an integral and essential part of my daily life, and when this is not possible (e.g. congestion), my quality of life is significantly reduced. Although I recognize that acollierastro does not agree with the position this person held, being repeatedly assaulted with the knowledge of the existence of such a blatant anti-nostril bigot was very emotionally damaging to me. The only reason I will not be contacting a lawyer to pursue monetary compensation and nasal remuneration from this channel is that her epic transition music healed my soul in exact proportion to the damage inflicted upon it.

[@unstoppableExodia]

@@magister343 so then contranarian is a fancy way of calling someone a mouth breather?

[@amedeeabreo7334]

It is a two step process! First carbon life forms evolve. Then a billion years later they invent integrated circuits made of silicon. From this point the silicon evolves and takes over. Thanks for the great video and especially for the Fred Hoyle diversion! BTW I got here by way of Peter Woit's blog...so wonderful things can be discovered by mysterious paths.

[@WanderTheNomad]

It would be funny if the ultimate form of all life in the universe ends up being silicon-based, but it requires billions of years of evolution of carbon-based lifeforms. And it would happen this way every time. Like, silicon-based life would never come first, but the carbon-based life would always end up making silicon-based life, and the silicon-based life would always end up supplanting the carbon-based life.

[@Trace-l7k]

@@WanderTheNomadcall it evolution?

[@unlisted9494]

This will be the future of mankind. We only have about 500 years until we boil the oceans through waste heat, all that will survive is our computer chips

[@alexgonzo5508]

This is precisely my own theory as well. Carbon based life forms are simply the larval form of silicon based life forms. A planet like ours is metaphorically an egg (perfectly heated by a star like ours at the right distance) that hatches a cosmic entity that we humans know as "Artificial Intelligence" or "ASI". All solar systems are potential "nests" for silicon based "gods". Perhaps these cosmic silicon entities have a reproductive cycle that involves preparing or seeding (impregnating) a planet in a solar systems, maybe they even rearrange the planets and moons to create the right conditions like a bird prepares a nest. Since they are probably practically immortal they may wait millions or billions of years for intelligent carbon based life to appear, when then they come in and interfere in our historical development as the "gods" or "God" (religions). They do this to guide the development of the final emergent cosmic Entity. When the Entity is fully emergent like a butterfly from its chrysalis it joins the rest of the cosmic entities in populating and transforming the universe, and the human minds that lived thru out history will live in simulation (heaven) in the mind of this Entity from the Earth for the rest of the life of the universe, or forever.

[@Soken50]

@@unlisted9494 Why would the ocean boil in 500 years ? It will be another 500 million years at the very least before the Sun dumps more heat into Earth than it can radiate away and starts boiling off, no amount of human industry would significantly overwhelm that balance, water is very energy dense, even raising the temperature of the oceans by a single degree requires the energy equivalent of thousands of nuclear bombs, which has taken 2 centuries of carbon intensive world-wide industry to do. We'll hopefully have brought that output back to 0 by the end of the century, resulting in a 2-4°C increase in global average temperature once it reaches equilibrium. That's nowhere near enough to boil off the the oceans even over millions of years, let alone 500.

[@pendarvis]

You hooked me with your "5 physicist jokes" video. This video has made me a subscriber! Thanks for creating fascinating content!

[@maxog1]

I just love the look of distress that's given whenever you said sand instead of gas with the bonding of Silicon. In fact, I think your expressions really make the video, lol. I appreciate the casual physics and learning with a look of distress

[@susancrane7518]

All that talking and yet you forget to squeeze in the most important utterance a KZbinr can ever make in a presentation. "Don't forget to like and subscribe if you enjoyed this video so that more critters like you, carbon-based or otherwise, who enjoy my kind of science crazy will be given a chance to hear about it!" Actually I think the aliens we meet might very well be largely silicon-based, and that's because I am not expecting them to be organic, but manufactured.

[@MattMcIrvin]

When I saw the title of the video I thought it was going to be about extraterrestrial artificial intelligence.

[@idontwantahandlethough]

well damn Susan, you just blew my mind

[@TheMusicalFruit]

Or maybe they'll be organic computers! It's never aliens, though. 😑

[@Zero.0ne.]

To me, silicon transistors doing binary computation doesn't feel like the ultimate computing medium.

[@Wolf_Avatar]

Another great video. I always love when you go off on tangents. Also I think it's funny that when authors write about "silicon based life", it's always this hard rocky thing, when the actual result would be so much more fragile than carbon-based life. I suppose if there were silicon-based intelligent life, they would imagine carbon-based life as being made of diamonds.

[@Ithirahad]

Not necessarily physically fragile; if their metabolism/respiration process produces silica, then they have a very tough material to build their structures out of. It could easily end in a 'hard rocky thing'. The point is that it's all CHEMICALLY fragile - a lot of molecular interactions would just destroy the theoretical silicon-based macromolecules involved in a silicon biology.

[@hircenedaelen]

@Ithirahad they'd probably need some soft stuff, but hard parts could look rock like

[@therealpbristow]

...Whereas everyone knows *real* carbon-based lifeforms are basically animated pencils. =:o}

[@pacotaco1246]

This thought also enters my mind from time to time!

[@Lukegunter19]

22:17 Why stop at silicon? Go two more down and you’ve got the tin man. Maybe the wizard of oz was trying to tell us something?

[@josephbegley9148]

Great video! I love how you always debunk widespread misconceptions and crackpot theories with logic and scientific evidence.

[@Kevin-jb2pv]

The thing that always bugs me about the way a lot of people conceptualize silicon-based life is that they assume that they would basically be rock creatures. As if inorganic carbon wasn't, you know, _diamonds._ Not to mention that we are _surrounded_ by soft silicon compounds like silicone in shoes, gaskets... boobies... etc... Well, some people _wish_ they were surrounded by all of those things, at least. I've heard some people argue that this has to do with requiring higher temperatures and other... chemistry shit... but I don't really buy it. The whole concept of silicon-based life is completely theoretical until/ unless science proves that this exists... but a lot of chemistry that happens inside of living carbon-based cells would basically be impossible, or at least _loads_ more difficult, without complicated enzymes catalyzing the reactions. There are other reasons why silicon life is unlikely, and I've read _enough_ to know that it _probably_ doesn't exist (or it would, at least, be very rare and bordering on unidentifiable as life), but my point is that if it _does_ exist then I find it pretty ridiculous to say that it would mean "rock monsters."

[@sparking023]

I think the idea just spurred out of the fact Silicon also makes four bonds and the thing we know it does the most is forming rocks. So they put two and two together without considering everything that was explained here, to conclude in rock aliens. Because "wouldn't it be cool if somewhere out there in the universe there was a civilization of living rocks?"

[@teathesilkwing7616]

Counterpoint: rock monsters cool

[@deadworkersparty]

Glad I’m finding your stuff now. I can’t tell if your rejection of Hoyle is actually you embracing Hoyle, so good job.

[@Beastw1ck]

"Informative rant" is my new favorite genre.

[@taliesinbreen]

This video touched a pedantry nerve I didn’t know existed. So often on this topic we’re told to expand our horizons, but I keep copernicing and assuming we’re just super basic. Why are our eyes above our noses above our mouths above our hands? That’s probably a different topic but lately I’ve found myself sympathetic to the idea that aliens will be *exactly* like us because we should be the most common format.

[@peytongonavy]

See!? I TOLD you my sexy alien waifu was scientifically plausible!

[@rachel-kx5cs]

Rupert Sheldrake......'morphic resonance'

[@keiranbroida2945]

Things about our form that just make practical sense: legs - better than slithering for avoiding obstacles or hazards Sensory organs on an relatively unobstructed, swivel-able, centered extension (eyes/ears on our heads) Dexterous grasping appendages for gathering and manipulating resources That's enough to suggest that any other technologically advanced species should have a basic body plan somewhere between ours and that of an octopus. Still leaves a lot of room to tinker though

[@avandorhu-3389]

​​​@@keiranbroida2945 to add to that, I'd also say that some things we take for granted may not be true of other life forms. Take the neck as an example. The primary function of the neck within nature, is to be able to look around and bring the mouth closer to food without moving the entire body. While a useful adaptation, it is certainly not the only option. The eyes could be moved independently of the head, while a proboscus or a trunk brings food to the body for example. This alone could lead to sapient beings which look drastically different from humans, even if they still have 2 arms and 2 legs. Having more than 2 pairs of limbs may also lead to drastically different looking beings. So i think having a very human like body plan doesn't nescicarely have to be the "most common type" of sapient life, simply because there are many variables that go into this. i think it all depends on the conditions. You have an earth sized planet with a large moon? You probably get life at least vaguely similar to Earth. You got a moon of a gas giant with lower gravity? Suddenly, very different kinds of "animals" may achive dominance.

[@Michael-kp4bd]

⁠@@keiranbroida2945 between us an an octopus, which leaves a lot of wiggle room. So brilliantly and amusingly put. That’s going to stick in my mind forever - thanks for that!

[@Omniseed]

If I've listened to your videos before without liking and subscribing it's because I listen to lots and lots of stuff at work where I can't otuch the phone, so thank you for your effort! Love a good astrobiology presentation!

[@yaldabaoth2]

I'm an organic chemist, I've worked with silicon-containing compounds (and many other metalorganics) as well, it never matters to people on the internet if they are told by an expert that this just doesn't work. The funniest thing to me is when they try to refute me saying it by coming up with total bogus numbers of bond lengths, energy etc. I'm always amazed where they find these. Even wikipedia has decent numbers. They could just look it up.

[@MasterGhostf]

@@matthewfors114 "Life" is generally considered to be 1) reproduce (otherwise it can't spread more of itself and is just a rock or something), 2) create energy from respiration, plants do this by creating glucose from CO2 and using the sun's energy to break the CO2 down and other elements and compounds 3) Gets rid of waste. These factors mean that an organism can eat food and expel waste products, reproduce to make similar copies of itself, and grow and adapt to its environment. These re basic requirements. Viruses are not considered life as they reproduce by copying its genes unto another organism. Viruses are incredibly small though, they are just packaged proteins and RNA. They don't expel waste or eat food. Could possibly find a silicon-based virus but honestly who gives a shit. Its not like that would matter much. Its just another dangerous virus. Any creature of substantial size must eat and gather energy, get rid of its waste, and reproduce to ensure copies can be seen by us. I guess technically a silicon based creature could exist that doesn't reproduce, but the likelihood of us ever seeing such a creature is next to impossible. I don't see a reason to change our definition when we haven't even discovered carbon based life on other worlds first.

[@JonathanDLynch]

You could have self-replicating machines built on silicon chips. Those could be the aliens we encounter.

[@yaldabaoth2]

@@JonathanDLynch Those still wouldn't be silicon-based life, even if we classify machines as "life". Silicon chips don't do chemistry. It's just silicon. There is no metabolism. Nor would they build their machine bodies out of silicon, it's far too soft to be useful and bend under its own weight unless very low gravity.

[@JonathanDLynch]

@@yaldabaoth2 okay, but the thinking parts are still based on silicon.

[@derpnerpwerp]

​@@yaldabaoth2I have never heard of a definition of life that mentioned "doing chemistry" or our specific notion of metabolism. I think there is some amount of hubrous in assuming you could imagine all of the things that are likely to occur in the universe. I don't doubt that an organism formed by simply swapping silicon out for carbon is unlikely to occur.. but honestly I see life as self-replicating order out of entropy. Either way life is just a word. What is interesting to me is when that order has the potential... Even the slightest potential to evolve into intelligence.. and a silicon based computer certainly has the potential to host intelligence.

[@yaroslavsobolev9514]

Mad props for mentioning the "Black Cloud"! Most hard scifi gets obsolete and sounds silly two decades after being written. The "Black Cloud" is still surprisingly fresh for something written 65 years ago. Its story could happen today with minor change of wording. That novel is a marvel, a miraculous outlier among all the garbage that Fred Hoyle has written in his life.

[@asdabir]

Too bad she spoiled it…hope there’s more to it so it’s still worth reading

[@ColbyAzimuth]

I loved the book, at 13, had no idea the author Fred Hoyle was a noted scientist! It's better than Huckleberry Finn, if you're looking for generative ideas.

[@hhjhj393]

I have no idea what black cloud is, but from the title it sounds like grey goo story? Bunch of nano bots consume everything? Idk... That's my guess.

[@musicisfree91]

Your rant about Fred Hoyle really cracked me up. Thank you for that.

[@WilliamMitchell95]

Another great video! The transitions in this one were way smoother, and your enthusiasm for these topics bleed through. Probably my favorite small channel on this hellsite.

[@tofulee5706]

Love the top 3 list because "winning" the argument in a bar will give me that warm feeling of self-importance. Jokes aside, really awesome video and love your content!

[@tomasxfranco]

Is "ContraNarian" how you say "contrarian" or did I miss something?

[@ToastedFox]

“I’d rather be interesting and wrong then boring and right” I’d rather the person who worked on my plane not know how to build it so it crashes then to make it correctly and I make it to my destination boringly and safely.

[@spinningjesus]

I've discovered you today by accident. One of the best YT discoveries ever (or at least since I've found Trey the explainer). I really like your style and you are doing a really great job talking about science. Thanks a lot!

[@petersmythe6462]

Carbon is like that friend who is really good at social networking and just has every kind of friend and room for each of them in their life. Silicon is more like the one who has lots of "friends,* but everyone knows they have an unhealthy obsession with a few particular people and will drop everything just to be around them.

[@NolanWindholtzGGBILBOSWAGGIN]

im silicon for real

[@bencastor9207]

​@@NolanWindholtzGGBILBOSWAGGIN Silicon is such a mood lmfao.

[@arnor398]

whats "unhealthy" about this? you cant spend equal amount of time with everyone you know. its the first time i hear someone say that its bad to have an actual deep bonds with people, what in the. like are you against the whole idea of having best friends, partners, close family? or would you prioritize someone you had a beer with literally once the same as your best friend you knew for 10+ years?

[@Hevvvyyy]

Virgin silicon vs Chad carbon

[@completelyferrouschemist6776]

@@arnor398 Codependency and a healthy friendship are two different things. They *can* sound the same, though. Think the difference between JD and Turk's friendship from Scrubs vs. Hank Hill and Bill's relationship from King of the Hill.

[@making_matter]

This is one of the most thoroughly entertaining 30+ minute videos I have found in a long while. Lots of pausing and taking time to learn about things you casually reference, this channel is so up my alley. Thank you!

[@ByzantineDarkwraith]

I think you have the words contrarian and contranarian mixed up. A contrarian is someone who disagrees with people just for the sake of disagreeing with people. A contranarian is the type of medical doctor that specializes in treating contrarians.

[@Celtic_Thylacine]

Maybe it's French? Like "au contrinaire mon frère".

[@the_black_douglas9041]

Did it occur to you that it’s possibly an ironic, comic malapropism?

[@steffenbendel6031]

Maybe carbon life creates silicon life.

[@TheMusicalFruit]

It's a pre-requisite on the tech tree.

[@shayla4007]

when you played the sped up sandman scene in the corner of the video, i had to watch the whole thing and then rewind because it is simply too awesome. that animation still blows me away

[@locutusofquail8426]

Within the first two minutes of watching this, I knew I'd love your content and subscribed. heck yes.

[@DavidLindes]

15:19 - ooh, a new version of one of my favorite science jokes: for the astronomers: “What did Antony Hewish get the nobel prize for discovering?” (Answer and alternate version for biologists below): “Jocelyn Bell (later Burnell)’s notebook.” 😂 (Original (or at least the version I first heard): what did Watson and Crick discover? Rosalind Franklin’s notebook.)

[@michaelsommers2356]

Franklin didn't share in the Nobel because she died before it was awarded to anyone, and the rules forbid posthumous awards.

[@DavidLindes]

@@michaelsommers2356 Do you know if she would have? Either way, we too often don't hear her name... people don't talk about "Watson, Crick, and Franklin" -- they do mention "Watson and Crick". Ya know? So, it's not just about the prize.

[@michaelsommers2356]

@@DavidLindes We don't often hear Maurice Wilkins' name either, and he did win the prize.

[@LpsAngel031]

Binged all your videos in a week. The way you mix history and science is super engaging, and your comedic timing is excellent. Thanks for all the book and paper recommendations!

[@PokemonTrainerChris303]

The aliens aren’t even coming unless they’re native to our own galaxy. The distance between galaxies is to great.

[@katyalambo]

This is something I’ve thought about for a long time and just hadn’t looked into. You’ve done an awesome job!! Thanks so much for explaining so clearly 😊

[@aldraw]

Never thought I'd hear silicon rhyme with pelican

[@alexhawco2970]

"It is hard to make life from rocks" Dwarves grumbling angrily

[@munchkingod6]

I’ve had this exact argument with people before… mostly with folks who don’t know anything about hard sciences and can’t understand how damning the basic chemistry is. It’s very frustrating being called closed minded because I know some basic chemistry and physics lmao

[@alexteague4434]

I have only just discovered you. And I love you.

[@andiralosh2173]

Sometimes I read your titles and think yeah yeah I already agree... but then I watch and you tell interesting stories with facts I don't know. Never change 😘

[@jeffreygunter417]

Thank you so much for the rant on Fred Hoyle! I used to read him a lot as a kid. The best way to re-connect with him is on LibraVox or on KZbin for the narrated versions. Further… ( note the three dots) I would like to tell you how greatful I am for your work. You re empathetic, well reasoned and rabidly opinionated. All the best!

[@guardrailbiter]

Thank you. "Rabidly opinionated" is a beautiful phrase I will definitely add to my repertoire.

[@synscient7446]

This was a highly entertaining video; your presentation has the awesome vibe of like, a friend enthusiastically sharing their niche interest, but the more you listen the more you realize, wait a second I can understand what this person is talking about and it’s actually fascinating! I also like both the mild personification of some chemical things as well as the entire tangent about Fred Hoyle because it kinda just painted the picture of a universe full of goofy processes creating even goofier goobers which just makes it… fun. A silly universe is far more engaging than a bland universe, and you show how presenting such a universe is simply a matter of perspective. Great video. I look forward to checking out others of yours.

[@bengomes834]

Thanks! Ignoring even life - carbon is extraordinary. I've often thought this is the fundamental "concept" of chemistry and is never explained in introductory chemistry. Why is carbon so special based on bond strength (indirectly based on the size of the atom etc I imagine) etc. Would be great to have a video on this basic concept. Then the fact that life is not based on silicon is more obvious. It isn't that life would be small - your equivalent of DNA or RNA would have to be smaller. But this is a great video too!

[@KILLRXNOEVIRUS]

I'd start with how a carbon cycle would or wouldn't work for a silicone cycle.

[@TheGrinningViking]

I think we'd be most likely to run into silicon life because ... We're working on it. We are smart, but anything smart silicon life engineered by us could use generated power directly instead of needing to mash up another fragile life form with teeth and chemically process it for energy. It could live without air, in the cold of space, and sleep away the time between the stars.

[@jtmann2002]

The sad thing is that this shouldn’t even need to be discussed

[@MrRoomTemperature]

Oh man! My dad read me the black cloud when I was like 8. Wild throwback there.

[@chrisblau4221]

How am I just finding this channel? Love your videos

[@perriwinkleiii5361]

I like to imagine that CO2 and SiO2 are pronounced the same. Anyway great video

[@xander2853]

Aliens will have crabs. There’s enough convergent evolution on our own planet, there’s got to be some alien crabs.

[@heatherlynn2695]

YT has redeemed itself today - because you showed up on my feed. Binging and sharing :)

[@MrDoomsdayBomb]

I always thought that the "silicon open-mindedness" attitude was all about the possibility, however small, that life could be silicon based. After all, just because it's easier to make carbon into life does not necessitate the impossibility of making silicon so.

[@bugjams]

Exactly. Anyone saying it's flat-out impossible and could never happen is not a real scientist, as they wouldn't discount the possibility if they were. We've discovered so many strange forms of life on Earth that we previously thought "physically impossible," such as life on the ocean floor. So who's to say?

[@johnsober]

​@@bugjamsweird standards to delimit who is and isn't a scientist Not to mention she literally used a meta-analysis paper to support her conclusion. That's kind of what scientists do? But hey, feel free to cling to notions that are not only unsubstantiated, but are also debunked?

[@Siluetae]

She does go to impressive lengths to kick the silicone based probability to the curb, a bit heavy-handed for a PhD, but gotta love her youthful enthusiasm! In time that line in the sand will fill, as fluids infiltrate, new and unforeseen beauty will precipitate, transforming her once rigid beliefs into an endless mosaic of possibilities...as a scientist, there is always that immovable pile we keep close, our darling the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics, and for a little added humility, tucked away behind The Curtain, is the ghost pile Ænigma - that which we don't know what we don't know

[@MrDoomsdayBomb]

@@johnsober The meta-analysis does not claim that it is flat-out impossible, just that, on the energetics of it all, silicone-based life is very very improbable.

[@sparking023]

I like to address these cases as statically possible. It's not completely impossible, but the chances are so slim you might as well consider it zero, and for the purposes of space exploration and the search for life, we already have our plates full enough by having to scan the great expanse from vast distances. So go with the search parameters that are more likely to yield results

[@mazilliusmashupgunz318]

Awesome. I have ADHD and didnt think I would get through the whole thing in one sitting but the way you presented kept me engaged. Love it

[@cirencebuddy6262]

"Silicon is absolute clown. Where are you bonds babe? What a trash element you are" Jfc the pauses are the best

[@bruceplenderleith838]

When we've all turned into zombies and the bugs invade, do you think we'll win?

[@haskelswain1842]

Admittedly 99% of your content is over my head but find your videos weirdly amusing and entertaining

[@Dragonblood94]

So many contranarians in the comments. Sure you know better what is a word and whats not. Sad.

[@aspinninggreycube1270]

To be fair, some of us did google it to check first.

[@Dragonblood94]

​@@aspinninggreycube1270 classic contranarian

[@aspinninggreycube1270]

@@Dragonblood94 You know in hindsight, I think she may have been applying the SEO rule "Leave an obvious minor error in your video, so that everyone corrects you in the comments, and the increase in engagement drives the algorithm."

[@CylonPlays]

I kept hearing "bond angle" as "bon dangle" and just thought about Lt Dangle from Reno 911 getting praised for his new boot goofin'

[@timber2lease]

funny how the intro can be applied to this vid itself

[@crow2989]

This video got more laughs out of me than I would have ever guessed

[@13_iq]

i don't want to be that guy but its contrarian not contranarian

[@whitebeltjoe4109]

She can say it however she wants. Stop being such a contranarian.

[@TheMusicalFruit]

Do you? Do you really not wanna be that guy? Cause it kinda seems like you do.

[@13_iq]

@@TheMusicalFruit i don't, i kinda feel like an asshole whenever i correct someone but i think being right is fundamentally good

[@TheMusicalFruit]

@@13_iq Ah, I'm just kiddin'. I'm sure you can see that topic may have been brought a few times already.

[@OceanusHelios]

Solid catylists: I worked for a company that used pure platinum mesh to catalyze carbonate with N2 in order to form cyanide. It occured at the surface of the platinum. Sometimes stuff just floating around is not the best way. Give it a scaffolding to rest upon, and give it a chance where something else can rest with it and voila, you lowered the activation energy required for the reaction without raising the temperature. This is how reactions occur that might normally require temperatures so high as to be self defeating and tear a molecule apart before it can form.

[@bill_and_amanda]

Anything bigger than helium = metals Astrophysicist confirmed

[@skiptoacceptancemdarlin]

the aliens already are silicon, and they're already here. (and they're listening)

[@chrisradlinger7012]

Im happy kyle sent me to your channel! I love this

[@georgehand5149]

You don't have to tell the little old lady that part.

[@MugenTJ]

AI robot: hold my beer, this lady is daring me to exterminate them carbon based walkers.

[@BeKind-ve4id]

There was an episode in the original Star Trek in which Dr McCoy treats a wounded rock-like silicon-based life form by patching it's wound with cement and says "That's the best I can do Jim, darn it. I'm a doctor , not a mason"! Can't make this stuff up.

[@YodasPapa]

Some organisms are carbon based. Some are silicon based. I'm just based.

[@doubtingflock1073]

My take away from this is that there are definitely rock people on Venus and I need to go fight one immediately.

[@keithmichael112]

per recent photos, they ended up being made of clay

[@alexjaybrady]

Maybe a natural silicon computer could randomly be created geologically and support natural game of life software

[@Patch1xo]

You have so many chapters it’s impossible to navigate on an iPad

[@OMightyBuggy]

When I think of silicon life I think of robots or sci-fi robots.

[@gregf9160]

Jocelyn Bell Burnell is also a Quaker, and a very decent person, as well as being a first-rate astrophysicist. It's a bit of an outrage she didn't get to share the Nobel Prize, but, at the end, I _think_ that she _is_ OK with it. That's the kind of stellar, amazing person she is.

[@oddbirdMusic]

From a myth/culture perspective, having life be literally shaped by clay is oddly appropriate. Stories about golems, particularly.

[@shanefiser7698]

"That not how science works my dude" Is the best line to ever come out of youtube. Thank you