This is one of the best monitors of all time (Commodore 1702)

[@tarzankom]

I had that monitor when I was a kid. I had the whole C64 setup. It was pretty great, and brought me hours of entertainment. It was the whole reason I got into programming.

[@wimh-e7l]

I live in the Netherlands so we had a Philips MSX2 at home. LGR did a video on that machine. Our MSX had a monochome green monitor. If you started the MSX without a diskette or cartridge inserted, it booted to MSX-BASIC made by Microsoft. That got me into programming 😀

[@mresturk9336]

I remember my friends having one. Though I didn't realize just how great it was for gaming until I hooked my SNES up to it. Beautiful crisp image with amazing color quality. My father had a C64 and I played quite a few games on it. But I was very young at the time. So the difference in visual quality from a monitor compared to a standard TV went over my head.

[@Andy-Christian]

I had that monitor. I didn't consider it all that special, until it was 2003, and I was still using that monitor every single day, and it was still picture perfect. I had it plugged into a VCR, and a DVD, and of course the C64 breadbin. And I had gotten the monitor used from my uncle who had purchased it new when they first came out. 20 years later it worked perfectly, and I had thousands of happy hours playing games, watching movies, and TV shows on that perfect little monitor.

[@roadsiderebels3039]

I worked for a power plant back in the day. There was a room with giant breakers in it. There is a phenomena called "Arc Flash" that could literally ignite the dust in the air when these breakers were energized. Its possible the sparking you experienced was arc flash. Once it burns the dust off, no more sparking.

[@metaleggman18]

That would make sense, especially if it hasn't been turned on in a while and dust accumulated.

[@RomstarOrion]

Exactly this. There are some exposed electronics in the HV section that can arc with dust build up. Its a pain in the ass, but I don't think I ever saw one damaged by it.

[@coyote_den]

Arcing and corona are easy to get when you have 25kV hanging around. Generally it is contained by the EHT lead and the anode cap, but dust or soot (and especially that damp greasy cigarette smoke residue!) can make a path from under the cap to the DAG. Snap, crackle, and pop all day. It was worse with vintage TVs when you had a lot of charged metal parts inside the HV cage, but the tubes and flyback in those were made to withstand some arcing. Solid state sets can't deal with CRT arcing and it can blow the HOT if it happens too much.

[@foogod4237]

26:34 The "christmas tree" ground is actually referenced to the negative output of the bridge rectifier, not the AC plug (you can see it explicitly tied directly to the negative output of the rectifier in the schematic), so it doesn't matter which way around you plug the plug in. The rectifier makes the plug orientation irrelevant. However, since there is no isolation transformer on that input, the "christmas tree" ground will actually follow _the most negative voltage_ of the AC input at any given time. That means that for half of the AC phase, "ground" will be 0V (neutral), but for the other half (when the polarity of the AC input is reversed), it will drop down to _negative_ 120V, relative to earth ground. This is fine for anything else running off of that same bridge rectifier, because the positive voltage will always be varying in the same way (and thus always have a correct DC potential relative to that ground), but compared to anything that is actually connected to a "normal" earth-referenced ground, that "ground" is actually not a DC ground at all. It actually constantly has AC voltage on it, ranging from 0V to -120V at 60 Hz (even when the plug orientation is correct). Essentially everything in that part of the DC circuitry is still "vibrating" at 60 Hz AC (relative to proper ground) the whole time it's running.

[@whosonedphone]

I was getting the feeling something was off about the explanation. Thank you.

[@skeggjoldgunnr3167]

Content quality is off the charts here! Your delivery is at its best.

[@johnglielmi6428]

Loved the video as always Adrian. For anyone confused by your explanation of the different ground symbols the (upside down Christmas tree) is an Earth Ground and the (Brush symbol ) is a chassis ground which does eventually make it's way back to earth ground. There is also a signal ground symbol which is an open triangle. Anyone interested can google these ground types to get more info on them.

[@nakfan]

Thanks for that info 👍 BR, Per (DK)

[@sandyd6602]

thankyou friend. Very useful to know esp when troubleshooting.

[@toddjbradshaw]

I'm a 52 year old guy and had one of these when I was a boy along with a 1902A when I went over to the Commodore 128. Sadly those things have been long gone to my shame. And so after all these years, I found one 1702 in mint condition on ebay and I've had it on my retro-table for a month now. I cannot tell you how happy it made me to have one of these again. It's truly a beautiful monitor, and nice reminder of kinder days.

[@calinculianu]

The 1702 was my first monitor back in 1984 when I was 7 years old. It was the best and lasted me 16 years until the year 2000 when I was still using it to watch cable TV in my room in parent's house. It was as vibrant and sharp as it was on day 1. It's a real professional-grade monitor. Probably the highest quality low-res CRT you could get at the time. Great bang for the buck.

[@Dreamshadow1977]

I'm glad you digress a little bit. I watch your videos to learn more and your side trips are teaching a lot of the little details and real world effects that an electronics course might not teach. Thank you for taking the time to teach!

[@a4000t]

The 1702 is great,used it for everything from tv,vcr,and commodore 64. still sits on my c64 today! When i think of that soft warm RGB glow of a crt,the 1702 is it. Broken doors were a commodore tradition :)

[@DisplacedGamers]

It is one of my favorite monitors as well. Thank you for the video, Adrian! I've also wanted to have the ability to run composite video into the back of mine but never took the time to investigate. I am up for ANY additional videos you make about the 1701/1702 series - especially any "hot rod" mods of sorts.

[@Colin_Ames]

Great video, as always. Considering the popularity of this monitor, and knowing the ingenuity of the retro gaming community, I am a little surprised that an RGB mod doesn’t already exist.

[@jdubs78]

We had this same exact monitor when we were growing up. Of course we had a 64 at one time but long after we stopped using the computer we used the monitor for video games. I remember plenty of Tetris and Pinball Madness matches on the NES with my dad and brother over 30 years ago! Great times and memories. Although a lot of your videos are way over my head technically, I absolutely love your channel and love looking forward to what is coming next from the basement! Keep the great content coming! Stay safe and healthy from northern Illinois!

[@parjf]

The 1702 was the monitor I wish I could have - friends had it with their C64 and it was a great combo. Still very fond of the Amdek amber monitor with our Apple IIe clone we had back then, but the 1702 was just cooler.

[@Halftrip]

I still have my 1701 (never did have a 1702) with door intact, thank you very much. I’m still reading up on the differences between the two monitors. Thanks for this video!

[@db_37205]

I first saw the 1702 for sale in 1983 and as I recall, it was $89 more expensive than an equivalent BMC monitor. I had been using a 12" BW TV since 1976, and the purchase of a $269 BMC was the next most expensive one since my C64 at $329. A year later, I was able to buy a VCR and could watch TV in color

[@MrLurchsThings]

Breadbin + 1701/2 + 1541 = pure beauty.

[@mistermac56]

Lots of us in the Nashville Commodore Users Group back in the 80's had these monitors and we used bronze clear acrylic panels cut to fit the front panel of the monitors. It made the color really pop. We used Velcro in the corners to hold the acrylic panels in place.

[@Stoney3K]

Not to mention keeping the face of the CRT clean, of course.

[@moose7000and1]

Thanks for sharing that acrylic panel tip, I just installed one today and I'm very impressed with result.

[@mistermac56]

@@moose7000and1 glad to help! Since we hauled the monitors around to meetings, and visits to the Huntsville CUG a lot, it was a big help to protect the front of the CRT, as well as making the color pop.

[@Sheevlord]

I think that the circuit for RGB signal conversion could be built using op amps. This way it can be easily inverted (if needed) and scaled to the required amplitude. You'd need relatively fast op amp chips suitable for TV signals, otherwise the image might get fuzzy.

[@1000davetron]

I liked what you had to say about the "color killer" features when color isn't detected, especially with the Apple text modes. I have a couple Color II C Monitors that have a button that allows the user to tell the monitor to go to Monochrome mode. If you'd like to have me on as a special guest with my monitor, I could do it.

[@weedmanwestvancouverbc9266]

I own a 1701 and 1702 Commodore monitors with the front doors intact, I had a 1701 back in the 80s when I had my first C64 and Atari 800. My family esp siblings love the had this monitor as it meant they didn't have to share the television with me. But also later, when I got myself a VCR, they all wanted to watch movies on this monitor not the bigger television due to the better picture

[@nefaurora]

Adrian, I own (4) 1702 monitors for quite awhile now, and what I've noticed the last 30+ years is that when you power the 1702 on or off with the power switch, the unit does a sort of "self deguassing".... You can actually hear it if you listen . It was probably one of the first monitors ever to have an automatic "self deguassing" at the Power switch when turned on or off... :o) Tony K., Melbourne, Florida. (Formerely from Long Island, New York..)

[@screamengine]

I found a couple ROADSIDE during "spring cleanup". I cleaned up alright! Got 3 overall in my hoard and they are truly amazing with serious lasting power. A testament to JVC for sure, but also a testament to Commodore's discernment when it comes to components. I'm surprised Atari never badged a monitor for the 8-Bits. Maybe they wanted to stay in the living room. How I'd love an XL themed babe to accompany a tricked out 1200XL. :)

[@richardwaters9284]

Couldn't agree more on the quality of this monitor!. I still have my original, along with the sales receipt from the legendary east coast store "Crazy Eddie's". I purchased it on 11/5/1983. I have one of the older 5-pin din video 64's and for $7.19 I also bought a cable that lets me connect from the 5-pin din to the chroma/luma/audio jacks on the back. It's all still working today!

[@Towdeee]

I absolutely love when I can't understand and follow a thing, but Adrian's voice and way of explaining are so awesome...

[@martinda7446]

@15:50 he turns down brightness and the blacks become lifted, funny effect as camera compensates.. But so do our eyes. That screen phosphor looks almost white at first glance but when correctly set the blacks are indeed black in a lit room. I noticed too back in the day that these light phosphors had wonderful colour. They may not be the same as there are dozens of variables - but I and a friend had the pick of a bunch of TVs and I thinking I was smart grabbed the ones with the dark phosphors thinking they would perform better... His light ones just blew mine away! Identical sets, different tubes only. I begged to swap one.

[@95Comics]

i only recently found your channel but its already one of my favorites! all the timgs i want to do, you do, and make videos of it! great work in every aspect! thank you for all the entertaining videos,keep them coming!

[@annareismith6843]

I love the Commodore 1702. I had one and used it for gaming on my retro game consoles and never had a 64. And on my old TI-99/4A. Tell they both died and I gave up on fixing them. I have a lot of good memories of playing games on them.

[@stevenorgate4307]

I've never commented before but I've loved all of your videos....be it Commodore or anything else..you do an amazing job and I thank you for it!

[@whiskerlesswalrus]

The christmas tree ground is chassis ground and the other ground symbol is for Earth ground you see these symbols a lot in old AM 5 tube radios in the day-great video and great to see these monitors are still chugging along!!

[@Daveyk021]

Adrian, please note, those Hi-Voltage probes expect a meter with 10MOhms input resistance. At least with the older Fluke 83s, they were 11MegOhom input resistance in automatic mode, and 10Mohm input resistance in manual range mode. The difference is about 100volts for every 2000volts. I am not sure with the 121GW that you are using.

[@adriansdigitalbasement]

Good cool -- I just looked up the 121GW and its 10Mohm. You're right that would cause it to read inaccurately if the input impedance wasn't the probe was designed for.

[@KAPTKipper]

The 1702 was desire and used by many 80's hobby computerist. Atari and many others. Finding one these days with the front panel is a rarity. I used mine for years as a display for the kids DVD player using a cable I made.

[@rvbzero7]

I still have mine. It's great. Was always great for using "Safe Area" when I ran my tv show! Top Monitor Ever

[@DeathMetalDerf]

Just commenting to appease the almighty algorithm! Great stuff as usual, Adrian! Thanks so much for everything you share with us, the nostalgia hit is always just the best!! I hope everyone is well and having a great day!!

[@jobibi]

Ive been using mine for a good 34 years, played all my NES, SNES, N64 games on it and still work like a charm, its actually power on beside me as I write this message :D

[@billrenfro9798]

That 1084 monitor was made by Magnavox (North American Philips). Back in the day they even sold a TV tuner that you could use with that monitor to watch regular TV channels.

[@mastertravelerseenitall298]

I dug out the family's old 1702 once for use in a VCR dubbing station. I was shocked how good the image was. Great vid!

[@V-SEC943]

by far my favourite channel anywhere

[@AlmostThere197]

I upgraded to a PC after my first year of college. The 1702 did admirable duty as my TV, I hooked it up to my VCR and it was my primary TV for almost 5 years.

[@emmettturner9452]

griff3125 on AtariAge was asking about a “Digitek” RGB mod he found installed on a Commodore 1702 monitor he bought from eBay. IIRC, someone else chimed in with an old magazine scan or something showing that it was a commercially available RGB mod kit specifically for these Commodore monitors. It appeared to be digital RGB… like CGA or C128.

[@richfiles]

My God... Imagine buying a 1702 and discovering it had an _RGB MOD..._ And then returning it, cause it wasn't what you ordered... How did life on Earth not end in that very moment, because _surely,_ that _HAD_ to have been dense enough to have created a singularity...

[@perhansson6718]

It looks like a very simple mod, just some passives and a coupe transistors, I wonder if the netizens here could find better pictures or a schematic for it? I'm sure Adrian would do a video on it, here is a quick Google that will find the discussed AtariAge page: “Digitek” "RGB digital" commodore 1702

[@emmettturner9452]

@@richfiles Yeah, I recall my own intense disappointment because I had a 1702 at the time and was wondering if its enduring popularity had led to any documented RGB mods. Even considered offering to trade before I read to the part where he had just sent it back. D:

[@emmettturner9452]

Found DigiTek’s ad on page 60 of “COMPUTE!’s Gazette” September 1986 (Issue 39, Vol. 4, No. 9). KZbin totally mangled this comment.

[@emmettturner9452]

@@perhansson6718 The text of the ad follows: CONVERT YOUR COMPOSITE MONITOR TO RGBI! DigiTek, Inc. introduces the RGBI Conversion System! Now you can convert your 1702 composite monitor* to true, 100%, full color, RGBI (all three guns driven separately)! With the flip of a switch go to composite or RGBI. This is not an emulation of RGBI or a monochrome cable and requires no software or use of computer memory. With our conversion system your composite monitor IS an RGBI monitor. Enjoy the full potential of your C128 - use of the 80 column mode, the high resolution mode and the full 2 MHZ speed. All this with a picture quality that equals any factory built RGBI monitor (but for a fraction of the price)! Our conversion system is a hardware add-on and requires minor assembly. The system comes complete with detailed instructions for converting your monitor. Our conversion process is simple and easy to perform. All components necessary for assembly are included. For those requiring additional assistance we have provided a technical support number to call. We are firmly committed to customer support. So don't wait any longer - get the full use of your monitor - convert it to RGBI with DigiTek, Inc.'s RGBI Conversion Syslem! Just send $49.95 plus $3.50 for postage and handling. For more information or to place your order call our customer service line at [phone], or write to: DigiTek, Inc., 10415 N. Florida Ave., Suite 410, Tampa, Florida 33612. There is a $5 additional charge for C.O.D. orders. Dealer inquiries welcome. *Conversion available for all composite monitors, write or call for further information. Edit: Quick edit to see if KZbin ghosted this comment since it will sound like commercial spam… Nope! We good.

[@fixitalex]

You know Adrian. Maybe I can guess what was arcing. At high voltages and high frequencies a circle cracks are tend to appear. So maybe there were some cracks around fly-back or horizontal output transistor or near. Maybe it was loosing contact and after your manipulations it fell in contact again. I recommend you to re-solder all pins of fly-back transformer and HOT transistor. I saw this many times.

[@saschajoseph]

Absolutely love the Commodore videos!

[@reevesy1979]

I love the 1702, found mine on the side of the road a few years ago, and now proudly sits on my desk with my C64C (with the occasional spin with my NES)

[@aspire0831]

Retired TV repairman Here The chassis ON that monitor looks similar to so many other chassis on other TVs of the era from the mid late 80s to Mid '90s, and the picture tubes ranged in size from 10 in 11 in 12 in 13 in 14 in to 15 in up to a 21 in on that kind of chassis, what they called a portable TV some weight up to 60 lb and the cabinets were made from a light gauge sheet metal, and the smaller ones were all made from plastic!

[@JerryEricsson]

This was my thought as you spoke of the arching, I have seen this in many old televisions, where the dust has accumulated so. thick that it causes the HV to arch where the HV enters the picture tube. Once cleaned, the arching is cured and you are once again back in business. (I accidentally discharged the HV from a picture tube back in my days as a soldier, an officer brought his huge old television into our shop and requested we look at it. Not our job, but you know how that goes, well if you ever served, you would. So as I was reaching for something, I happened to come in contact with the HV and got knocked on my can. I was lucky enough that the same arm that came in contact was also in contact with the ground. I still have a scar where the power exited to ground. Lessons like that stay with a fellow.

[@vinylexperience77]

I had the same monitor for my C64 in the early 80's. I loved it

[@johnjoyce]

I have one of these that needs work and have been holding off. Perfect timing!

[@zero0ryn]

That is also very interesting design with the split ground. Here is the UK we have 240V (230v) All the monitors I've worked on have an isolated B+ PSU. It usually has a high frequency switching transformer.

[@09danstart]

240 volt but everything is designed for 230v that why nothing lasts. vacuum cleaners, kettles or anything that uses a linear transformer are being overloaded.. especially if it comes from china. switch mode power supplies are ok and anything made in the uk years ago still works, i made a bucking thansformer to step the voltage down to 200v to power things that a want to last forever.

[@Daveyk021]

Just fixed a 1702 that was blooming and I could not get the horz off the right side of the crt (it squished in). The 125volts was not regulating. It would start at 108v and go up to about 120volts depending on brightness/control. Luckily it was just bad solder connections on all four pins of the regulator. This was was from 1984 and the picture is still very bright and had brilliant colors!!

[@stanbecks1097]

That Diversion was GREAT, Thanks!

[@jeromethiel4323]

Simple dust can lead to "tracking" where the dust on the surface of the components can cause arcing. Just touching some of the HV components can cause the arcing to stop. A good cleaning of the flyback and the HV cables will do a lot to help.

[@francoisrevol7926]

32:23 I suppose they didn't do it for the video to limit the possible reflection-caused interference due to having a star-like circuit, as the video is more susceptible to this. The other plug not being terminated would bounce the signal back. Although it's probably negligible with a correct signal.

[@DavideNastri]

You're legend! I really admire your work, keep rocking.

[@ArriGaffer]

Yup. I got a 1702 in 1980 ish for the Atari 800 I bought. It did years/hours of service on a few Ataris. Then it became a TV monitor for a long time. (Watched B5 on it.) Then it wound up on a tape duplicator array for several more years. After sitting dark on a shelf for a decade, I sold it to a retro gamer a few years ago, still working perfect, door intact. He's happy, I regain shelf space. Incredibly well built gear. Very reasonably priced. What an anomaly!

[@ScottHiland]

LOL. I love variability in pronunciation. When I hear you say moiré, it makes me think of Tuesdays with Morrie. 🤣Fun video and love your enthusiasm for Commodore and the early days of personal computing!

[@williamgreen5575]

I've never seen this monitor before, but as soon as I started watching this video, I realised it was identical to a Toshiba portable colour TV I used with my MSX in the mid to late 80's. Then you go and mention it was also made by Toshiba! You open it up, and what do ya know, a Toshiba picture tube! Great little TV/monitor.

[@do0ranfrump260]

Still have my 1702 that I bought in Dec 1984. Works like a champ.

[@WalterGreenIII]

I use the rear luma/chroma jacks on the 1702 for composite. Simple non evasive mod. with single female to dual male rca Y cable. Plug the two male ends into the luma and chroma jacks and then the composite source into the female end. The result seems to be a perfectly acceptable composite image from any composite source. I never noticed any degradation from using a y cable on the back instead of the front composite input.

[@jaredwright5917]

I have a 1084S monitor that I got from my dad many years ago. I like that it has the connectors and cables for just about every Commodore computer. Mine also puts out enough RF interference to completely mess up any CRT TVs nearby when it's on.

[@TheMechanator]

The 1702 was a great monitor for the Atari 8bit home computers also. I serviced a few in my days at Tandy Electronics for Radio Shacks/Computer City. The Atari 800, had a 5 pin din video output including luma/chroma and composite. Another good mod would be to add a second audio channel for Left/Right if you are going to make a RGB mod. Some retro Atari folk do have dual Pokey chips for stereo sound out there. :} Suggest a typical small PC speaker driver like the TDA amplifiers.

[@DishNetworkDealerNEO]

I would look at C526, C534, both 1500 V operating, for little pins sticking out of the top of them. These are safety capacitors. That are designed to arc off excessive voltage beyond their ratings. Also commonly on the picture tube gun drive board, there may be more of the air gap safety capacitors. What happens is as that soot accumulates, that arc over voltage at which time an arc will occur, will lower into the operational voltages of the circuit. Once the first arc carbonized the sooty dirt, the arc voltage lowers until cleaned off the body between the arc pins. Air blasting it may not be enough cleaning to prevent further arcing.

[@button-puncher]

Some TVs and monitors had neon lamps on the board for arc suppression. It's been 20 years since working on a CRT so I can't remember the what/why, but I just remember seeing them on there, know they were for protection. BTW, touching the horizontal output...YOW!!! I remember that. Not only high voltage but high frequency. A special kind of sizzle when you brushed that transistor's heatsink. Excellent video and excellent explanation. I'm probably one of the last people that went to school and had a course on servicing CRT sets. :) I had a 1702 growing up and used it as my TV, connected to a VCR, just like you said. Gorgeous saturated image. I wonder if it's still in my parents basement...

[@MakeKasprzak]

Thank you for the tangent on isolated grounds. This is something I've been curious about.

[@bbjunkie]

The smell of ozone from the inside of a tv/monitor that has been arcing for a while... ooh can't beat it 😁 Worked on an old tv recently that hadnt been powered up for 10+ years and could still smell it.

[@spatsbear]

I know exactly what that arcing is: That is internal to the tube. Probably from handling, moving it around, there may have been something that got dislodged. And when it arcs, the screen will blank just as you described. Just running the monitor like you did was enough to burn it off and clear it. And it will not hurt anything. More than likely, when it did do it, you would have seen it flash inside the neck of the tube. It is a pretty common issue, and it is the same symptom that sometimes shows up upon doing a CRT clean/rejuv with a CRT tester

[@TheMovieCreator]

And a side-note: The PAL 1701 totally has a tint-knob, but all it does is to shift the colour-temperature a bit (between more yellowish or blueish I seem to recall).

[@senilyDeluxe]

It's greenish/bluish on mine. Maybe a hint of purple in the blue. The effect is rather subtle and I never really knew what it was for, because back then I didn't know about NTSC (or color systems in general).

[@robyoung9463]

Best CRT Monitor EVER BUILT, thanks 4 shearing, the cabinet design would also allow u to SIT it on the floor and it will tilt up at 45deg. handy if used as Prompter or vid. camera monitor.

[@illn0r]

Still have this monitor from when I was a kid. Old & tired but after a smack or two on the side it works flawlessly.

[@electronicarchaeology]

The arcing sometimes caused by not being used for a while and my have a little dampness inside prior to first being turned on. During my time as a service engineer in the 1970s & 80s if we suspected intermittent arching, I used my breath on the suspected areas like the EHT cap and fly back transformer, sometimes it made a spark show up, don't get too close though.

[@danielleblanc5923]

HI Adrian, I think the dark bezel frame in front of the screen is mean for a tinted 'contrast glass'. Because of how the case is made, they can be completely flat. I have seen some of these with super strong double sided velcro. This would compensate for the exceptionally light coloured phosphor. When it comes to the arcing and subsequent shutdown of the monitor I would check for broken solder joints on the flyback transformer. This is a fairly heavy component and because of the thermal mass it can be difficult for the wave soldering to put enough solder on the pins. A loose connection there can absolutely cause the kind of symptoms you describe. Taking off the back cover can release mechanical stress causing the symptom to disappear. By the way I am amazed at the simplicity of the regulator circuit. The Amstrad CTM640 and CTM644 by contrast use a complex hybrid module Sanyo STK7308.

[@whiskerlesswalrus]

The big power resistor doesn't bleed voltage off for regulation the power resistor increases the current handling capability of the regulator IC so all the current from the monitor isn't passing though the Regulator IC and if you look at the part number STR3125 the regulating voltage shows up in the part number-the STR series of regulator has been used in many different devices over the years and is pretty robust and there are switch mode variants that have been produced

[@ovalteen4404]

The signal handling of the 4th pole is interesting. If it's handling a composite signal, Q251 is on, which shorts out ALL of the contrast amp signal, making the trap irrelevant. At the same time, it provides power to the "detail amp" block in the processor. When Q251 is off, the detail amp is also off, and the trap is the only relevant part for the contrast amp pin.

[@00Skyfox]

I have a 1702 monitor (was playing the C64 on it about 15 minutes ago) and the picture is still gorgeous. It could use a replacement of the front/back switch, and I need to glue the flip door (once I find it), but other than that it works perfectly. BTW, the little hole to the right of the volume knob is access to the "Sub Bright" adjustment. And speaking of dust, a lot of dust can really mess with a CRT. Many years ago in the late 90s our TV kept intermittently flashing a solid green screen. When it started sticking, a smack would bring back the picture. Eventually the solid green screen remained, so we took it to the local TV repair shop. The crooked owner of the place told us we needed a new picture tube, $300, so we decided against that and brought it home. I opened it up and clearly the guy hadn't even been inside it because everything was covered in a thick layer of dust (and no finger marks in the dust to indicate any diagnostic probing). I blew the thing out with our big shop vac on blow, and once it was clean the thing worked fine again. We got another 2 years of life out of that TV just by cleaning it. I forget what finally died on the thing.

[@walldoo99]

I learned from my friend to use my monitor as a tv on the VCR, and the picture was amazing.

[@CandyGramForMongo_]

I had one! It was the best darn little tube of the time. Used it with my VCR as well!

[@davidmunro5577]

The arcing was probably caused by having some latent dampness in the components and after a period in warmer air, it would dissipate and then the arcing would not occur. This is common where the unit has not been used for a long time. I used to service TV sets for a living so was well acquainted with the problem if the tv had been cold. Your monitor is probably perfectly OK.

[@meruginger934]

I like that there are pictures everywhere in the schematic that show what the signals should look like on an oscilloscope at those points.

[@metaleggman18]

I got this monitor as a tween (tho at the time this would have been around 2003 or so) off eBay because the NES manual mentioned it. Got it and a s-video to dual rca adapter and I've been using it to play retro games for forever. I've got a NES, TG16, SNES, Saturn, and N64 hooked up to it, switched between using some neat, old stock Sony passive S-video/composite switches. Works really well. I currently have it in between my floor standing hifi speakers, as well as hooked up to the hifi, so it's hilarious looking, and sounds amazing.

[@bf0189]

My memories with this monitor are strangely from the early 00s. My uncle would bring this monitor over to play Xbox with us during cookouts when I visited them in Indiana so we would play Halo, Tiger Woods PGA Golf and much more. It was fairly light and easy to transport for a CRT and okay built in speakers. Like you said it was fairly bright so the viewing angles were fantastic. TVs weren't really super cheap especially HDTVs and they were far more bulkier. Computer monitors of that time weren't ideal too so the twenty year old Commodore Monitor made perfect sense to lug as a portable monitor.

[@radio-ged4626]

There may be spark gaps on the tube base which may have been a little humid or dusty which caused it to flash over. Sometimes they use neon bulbs for spark gaps. The focus sometimes has a spark gap on the tube base which can crack over if slightly damp. Toshiba tubes are usually vety good, but that could have been arcing internally around the gun somewhere.

[@madmodders]

The Commodore luma+chroma isn't quite up to s-video spec. The voltages and timings are a bit off. It's fine by most old CRTs, but some LCD TVs doesn't like that at all. The voltage can be somewhat "fixed" with a 330 Ohm series resistor on the chroma line.

[@Umtree]

I had a mint condition 1702. I carried that thing around with me for 25+ years (along with my C64 collection). 😢 all sold now…. I needed the space. If I can ever afford an actual house, with extra space….. I’m buying it all back again.

[@anone1243r]

Did you also sell them with a buch of magazines? In Switzerland? 😅 I just might be the guy who you sold them to.

[@Lion_McLionhead]

Those were so incredibly sharp, able to resolve brown, it's amazing they were ordinary rebranded TV's.

[@mrnmrn1]

Arcing at the anode connector is probably more common with Philips-made Commodore monitors. I have a Philips CM8802 monitor, great monitor without Svideo, but with RGB on SCART, and it gave me some HV shocks through the vents on the top, because the HV anode connector has a weirdly long, stiff stem and it touches the vent on the top side of the back cover... Great design choice. I can clearly hear it ticking when I put my hand around that area, and if I put it there after the monitor was on for a longer time, sometimes there are some visible arcs with loud snaps between my hand and the back of the monitor, through the vent grille, and it can bite quite well! It's not a full-on anode voltage shock, just a strong static buildup, but still... I can also smell ozone if I use that monitor for a few minutes. I had some old Philips TVs with the same type of anode connector, and most of them had the same problem. I stopped using it because of this, until I replace the anode connector, but I think the reason for the bulky stem of the anode connector is because there is a series resistor inside, and I don't want to leave that out, so I might end up leaving the original connector in it, just clean it very well and maybe put a few layers of thick heat-shrink tube on the stem of it.

[@johnpetruna8888]

The "dot pattern" is very obvious as soon as I hit the KZbin "pause". Fascinating stuff. [And I think I saw a diode marked "X-RAY PROTECTOR" on the schematic.]

[@Greg8872]

Interesting on the back label ( @4:30 ), both say "Manufatured at IWAI Plant", but JVC gives address in Japan, Commodore gives their address, which if I was looking at that line (ignoring the other "Made In Japan" on both of them), would think it was made in Pennsylvania.

[@JamesBricker-lq3nu]

When the rear switch grounds the base of Q251 the transistor is turned off and the 3.58 Mhz. filter is in play to remove any false chroma signal from interfering with the chroma signal entering from the rear connector. Placing positive voltage on Q251 turns it on bypassing the filter and thus creating a 3.58 signal to send back into the chroma detection circuit. Pretty clever.

[@adriansdigitalbasement]

Ah neat. Ideally then it would be neat to add an extra circuit to detect the color burst and enable the notch filter when needed. That way using a monochrome signal like from an Apple II in text mode, the filter would not be in play and you'd get a much sharper picture magically. There was probably some color decoder IC available back in the day that could do this which isn't made anymore.

[@andrewlittleboy8532]

The best part of Saturday Evening!

[@electrolyticmaster8396]

I have a 1702 from 1984. Other than my C64, I have used it with a cable box, a VCR and a monitor for video taping. After several years in storage, I plugged it in to my old C128. It came up right away, but the color wasn't very well. After a while of being powered up, It started looking pretty decent.

[@JohnToddTheOriginal]

Whew! Thank God for flat panel LCDs like we have today.

[@JerryEricsson]

I have an old Commodore Monitor in the back room. I had it hooked up to my SX64 suitcase computer for years.

[@desiv1170]

My 1701 monitor is still my choice for my Vic-20, Atari 7800, and alternate open composite input (I have a 3 port RCA switchbox) on my desk. I used to use the chroma/luma for my C64 and/or 3DO when I had them up here.. Great monitor!!

[@Choralone422]

My next door neighbor and best friend had that monitor along with a C64, disk drive and a Commodore dot matrix printer back in the 80's. I don't know what ended up happening to the monitor but we were still occasionally using it in the late 90's with SNES or N64 hooked up to it.

[@redhawk668]

I have the 1701, which is the precursor and it looks exactly the same. I actually made an adapter to adapt the RCA connectors to s-video input, so I can use normal s-video cables with it. In fact my own design s-video modulator replacement board for the ZX Spectrum actually works great on it. And, yes the door is off.

[@perge_music]

I had one of these, my parents bought it as they didn't want me to have a TV set in my room as I'd be obviously watching 'unsuitable' programmes. The local Radio Shack had a TV tuner section from a VCR for sale which I bought and plugged in to turn it into a TV set. My first hack!

[@entertainmentdudes]

Great video as always, Adrian! Still have this monitor! Back in the day, I hacked an s-video cable to discreet rca connectors so I could hook up my s-vhs player! I also used to use this monitor to shoot BB games in High school with an svhs camera. One day it fell from the top bleacher face down and didn't get a scratch! It is built like a tank. I also did the rear input mod years ago because I hated connecting in the front. The monitor still works today and I have it hooked up to a C64.

[@Wingloader]

Still using my 1702 in my basement workshop with a dvd player/netflix. The front/rear selector needs a little love, but what a workhorse. My front cover is still in tact. I thought maybe I had a rare collectible. I guess I'll just keep on using it. Wish I still had th C64. Great memories in my early teens.

[@nekomasteryoutube3232]

Yeah I had this nice little "card" that was actually the base of some old Phono sound system my mom got when I was a kid. The 1702 fit JUST NICELY on it with the base of the monitor the right size to fit inside while the sides of the "cart" held the monitor up. And because of the way it was built there was a little shelf about 3/4th up from the open top of the cart, I could easily fit a VCR on it under the 1702 without the 1702 actually sitting on it. I used it basically as my own little "portable" TV I could move around the room or apartment for watching stuff on or playing video games on. Though I was silly as a kid and gave it an extra speaker so I'd get at least dual mono sound from BOTH sides of the monitor.

[@jeromethiel4323]

The "brush" symbol (as you referred to it) is not ground, it symbolizes "chassis." Which may or may not be grounded.

[@Drmcclung]

We had the JVC version at home which my oldest sister dragged home from her first job at a Dr's office when they upgraded from it (and an endless loop VCR) to something else. Played NES on it for a long time.. If memory serves it had a tinted piece of glass that clipped onto the front of the bezel for higher contrast, but I absolutely cannot remember if it was for the JVC or a different monitor I had. In any case the JVC served me well for many years after it spent the first part of its life stuck on a wall mount in a doctor's office. Finally it just wasn't worth moving from place to place anymore and I tossed it years ago. Kinda wish I'd kept it because I had no idea it was the exact same set as the Commodore