Authoritarianism v. Democracy: Francis Fukuyama on The Year of Elections | Amanpour and Company

Democracy has undergone a major stress test this year, with nearly half the world's voting population heading to the polls in a time of democratic backsliding and growing extremism. Francis Fukuyama, senior fellow at Stanford University's Freeman Spogli Institute, joined Walter Isaacson to speak about the danger of taking democracy for granted, and -- following his recent trip to Ukraine -- how he believes the war there might end.
Originally aired on September 19, 2024
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Amanpour and Company features wide-ranging, in-depth conversations with global thought leaders and cultural influencers on the issues and trends impacting the world each day, from politics, business and technology to arts, science and sports. Christiane Amanpour leads the conversation on global and domestic news from London with contributions by prominent journalists Walter Isaacson, Michel Martin, Alicia Menendez and Hari Sreenivasan from the Tisch WNET Studios at Lincoln Center in New York City.
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[@sandraspidle5972]

I enjoy this news station sooo much. Thank you all.🇺🇸🦅🌹 It is great to listen to genuine and honest interviews.

[@jaimerodriguez397]

Absolutely wonderful interview. Thank you

[@999reader]

I recommend reading Fukuyama’s bestseller and not reject him based on the title assigned by a publisher.

[@SupremeInvigilator]

This. People don't know that authors don't chose their headlines

[@scottgaillard8486]

I suggest people read all the great work he's done since then. The Origins of Political Order and it's companion are brilliant.

[@joem0088]

If you mean "End of History," all common sense tells us that there is very little chance of that.

[@paulevans4905]

It's a bluff, until it isnt.

[@quddusquddus136]

What a great answer to the last question. Thousands of people are slaughtered in Ukraine. It's so heartening to see this great historian makes a visit there. "A handful of humanity is preferred over the wealth of all nations." He remains "the best."

[@davisoaresalves5179]

Such an icon and idol.

[@scottgaillard8486]

Thank you Professors Fukuyama and Isaacson for demonstrating American exceptionalism.

[@brucemclennan9715]

Why is it always those that haven’t been ‘in harm’s way’ are always the most flippant about war games…..

[@aftdel]

True. He’s gone full neocon. So flippant and superficial.

[@caspar9794]

In the US, with only two parties, the real danger is to maintain an opposition the Democratic Party. The Republican Party isn't doing it, and they get worse every election, and a democracy is only works if there are several serious parties you can choose from. If the Democratic party is the only serious party, America will not remain a democracy, that's impossible. Democracy is a culture of debate and accountability that has to be tested and stressed all the time..

[@andrewtaynton3402]

Thank you. Informative video.

[@pictureworksdenver]

The end of the end of history.

[@KY-te4mn]

😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 how long that lasted !!???????

[@honorhonor3352]

Listening to this guy makes me think not everyone gets wiser with old age.

[@kevinjenner9502]

He was active in Robert Kagan and William Kristol”s Neocon think tank “Project for the New American Century” (a blueprint for ceaseless war in the Middle East) He also supported Bush’s illegal invasion of Iraq….

[@markfisher6404]

What specifically do you find to be unwise in his comments?

[@kevinjenner9502]

Was an active participant in the “Project for the New American Century” (a blueprint for ceaseless war in the Middle East) Actively supported Bush’s illegal invasion of Iraq.

[@honorhonor3352]

@@markfisher6404 NATO is a defensive pact? My ass.

[@markfisher6404]

@@honorhonor3352 ok. I agree with your assessment. NATO long ago jumped that shark

[@phil20_20]

Today, Joe Biden's jurisdiction ends at the Russian border. Time for a new sheriff. That's always been my biggest complaint about him. He kind of hedges on everything instead of bringing things to a good conclusion. He's absolutely right about the Democrats. They're like a Push-me Pull-ya. Forget the Donkey. He's mild by comparison. Maybe harnessed to a mule. Biden is just the type of institutionalist that supports the status quo. We need a whole lot of fresh blood, and not just in the Administration. We need West Coast people, the kind who come on merchant ships from all over the World!

[@Ashoerchen]

You had that for four years. Look forward to more.

[@gregoryamour3388]

In USA? VOTE BLUE UP AND DOWN THE ENTIRE BALLOT TO STOP TRUMP/MAD MAGA/ FASCIST PROJECT 2025! 🗳☑️💙🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸

[@phil20_20]

They have a primer for Trump, #47.

[@user_ar6332]

If the US votes Democrats to power, US would slide down to the club of third-world countries.

[@makestank4800]

Yes! totally agree my friend. Our country doesn't need a king, and a pack of looney tunes, on a fascist bent to run it forever. 💙

[@pcopeland15]

Thanks

[@tommcfadden5232]

The author of the End of History…..he got that wrong. Best to take his arguments with a grain of salt.

[@Mkundera]

Written by someone who obviously did not read the book. Love the Internet.

[@cosimocub]

so what. Fukuyama is great

[@kyleolson9636]

​@Mkundera Why do you say that? I feel it's pretty clear The End of History has been proven to be quite inaccurate at this point. Fukuyama even backtracked on most of his optimism in a 2014 Wall Street Journal article, and voiced even more pessimism in 2016 after Brexit and Trump's election victory. Even if western democracy survives these attacks from autocratic leaders both foreign and domestic, it's obvious the fight wasn't won in the 90s.

[@tommcfadden5232]

@@Mkundera not too late for you to read the book and compare his optimistic predictions with the past quarter century.

[@Mkundera]

@@tommcfadden5232 Ha ha come on, you obviously haven't read it. Who are you kidding?

[@alexcipriani6003]

populism is just democracy when you don’t like the outcomes

[@buzoff4642]

Populism, the broad political backlash from excessive elitism.

[@SupremeInvigilator]

Wow he's still alive and working? Great, but wow.

[@Maxwell-mv9rx]

He says elite class control capitalism create inequalities it is modern pictures of the capitalism. Democracy dont keep out this caracterization. However liberal revolution does put on elite corrupt out.

[@live_free_or_perish]

We became complacent while the oppressive police states gained power. Russia, China, and Iran gained strength while we slept.

[@buckfezos]

"Well Ukraine invaded Russia weeks ago and they haven't nuked anyone yet" AYFKM?

[@michaelh.sanders2388]

Makes me wonder who the master politician is Biden sure has a lot more experience.

[@graterdeddly9527]

Fukayama is undoubtedly a smart fellow, but sometimes he mystifies me in his seeming naïveté. Perhaps it is disingenuous, perhaps is for a Point that eludes. He says that NATO is a purely defensive alliance, and yes it began as such but since the demise of its raison d’etre in the Soviet Union. Yet it has expanded for unexplained reasons into Eastern Europe and then provocatively into former Soviet republics. Remembering that these republics like Estonia and Latvia had long been territorial components of the Russian Empire and the move of Western power into these regions was unprecedented, perhaps not since the Christianization efforts of the Teutonic knights around 1400. The most egregious omission on Fukayama’s part is not mentioning NATO’s aggressive bombing campaign against Serbia for its internal issues involving the Kosovars. This concluded with the leveling of large parts of Serbian infrastructure and the loss of territory as a result of NATO military attack. This was not an isolated event as in 2011 NATO launched an air attack against Libya that resulted in the removal from power of Muammar Gaddafi, and his killing. Whether these operations were justified is not relevant, the question is whether NATO is clearly defensive in nature and it is not. A longtime adage in international strategic thinking is that every offensive system serves a purpose as a defense and the same is true of defensive systems-even a tall wall has implications as an offensive weapon.

[@JanRostkowski]

Putin is proud of you. Why did central and eastern european countries eagerly join NATO? Not because at NATO HQ some Generals said we need to expand. The reason is that the voters in former Warsaw Pact states well remembered the Russian occupation, brutality, exploitation and oppression and worried that sooner or later another Stalin admirer would try to put the USSR or Russian Empire back together. So they voted for parties in Budapest, Sofia, Warsaw, etc which had NATO membership on their agenda. How right they were shows the current Russian invasion of Ukraine which regrettably due to German and UK veto did not make it into NATO in time.

[@SujitSivanand]

A threat is a threat and it cannot be a bluff. The one who threatens still holds flexibility over the options, which is why it remains a threat. How stupid to call a threat a bluff! This man is losing his sense of realism.

[@multipleleekisms]

Over 3 decades later and it appears that Francis Fukayama was overall, quite wrong in his book "The End of History and the Last Man," and Jacques Derrida in his sort of open-ended response in his book "Specters of Marx" was quite right. The Specters of the past are haunting us in greater intensity all over the Western world for the past several decades, and it's not gonna be enough to just defeat the populist right this election. We need to seriously rethink if liberal democracy in its current form is the apex of humanity, with its neverending cycles of production, consumption, exploitation and alienation. Democracy has been under threat for decades now, chipping away under the cynical Neoliberal ideology of selfish individualistic behavior at work and at home. This is the stew that birthed Trump and his populist demagoguery, after all I mean, if I were making a video game about Neoliberal capitalism, Trump would be the final boss battle! Class stopped being something we could talk about... So ID pol and culture wars, something always was the purview of the right actually, sucked up all the air out of the conversation. It's been actively used as a divide and conquer strategy by our own for a long time and now, even the authoritarians in Russia and China are using it against us. Fukayama seems like a smart, humble, thoughtful guy nonetheless and will always be an American to people like me and the big tent liberal-left in this international sense needs to start a concerted effort in its confrontation with corporate-state power and increase democracy at the workplace. We were so hell bent on "destroying socialism" as the far right still is, but in the process... We have all but destroyed the social. I must admit Biden and the Democrats seems to have started to realize this but it must continue... This doesn't stop with just defeating Trump only again.

[@Bronxguyanese]

Too many pbs and npr want democracy however democracy allows demogogary. Also democracy can only work if people are collective share same view points. Liberals in the Anglosphere don't share collective views thus creates communities.

[@M1984FA]

Francis Fukuyama, the new warhawk. Sad.

[@Mkundera]

Big fan of Francis Fukuyama but be misstates or at least oversimplifies a point. As about the 15:40 mark he says that "At the beginning of the American republic it was only white men with property" who could vote. This is not exactly correct. In some states, free black men who met property qualifications could vote during the early years of the republic, Massachusetts and New York come to mind.

[@buzoff4642]

"who met property qualifications" An inconsequential tidbit, given the poverty rate of the general public, including black men.

[@inakale]

yeah, rich people just didn't think it will affect population if they move all production abroad. totally innocent babies

[@buzoff4642]

Didn't think it'd affect population? That's generous. I'm under the impression, they and the politicians just didn't care if it did or didn't. They're expecting no repercussions. Relative to the 1800s, there've not been much.

[@Raymond-d2l7n]

Fukuyama is just another myopic academic. Put him up against Mearsheimer.

[@dennisyoung9500]

A bit hard to listen to FF knowing of his penchant for right wing apologetics.

[@bd3199]

That book hasn't aged well.

[@doug3691]

Take care of the basics, or basic politics will destroy you.

[@bl5752]

Isn't this the "end of history" guy? Maybe not a great analyst.

[@Interglacial_optimist]

What extremism are you talking about? What democracy are we taking for granted when the democratic Candidate was never elected by the fifty states in their primaries? Ukraine cancelled their elections and live under martial law.

[@paulevans4905]

Don't bring facts....feelings only.

[@NobodyCares-qn7yc]

This is not an "anti" response to what you've said above Interglacial, it's more for informational purposes. If you research the nominee selection process and continue to take the research a few steps further with relevance for the current situation you will understand how the process works with delegates and other selectors.

[@Interglacial_optimist]

@@NobodyCares-qn7yc We get to choose between someone we don't like and someone nobody voted for. Without a free press, which disappeared in 2003 during the invasion of iraq , the american democracy died.

[@buzoff4642]

Primaries, interesting topic. There is no requirement to win primaries. And given 50% of voters are Independent, the two minority parties, R with 25% and D with 25%, in some states do banish Independents from voting. Else, according to the polls, Sanders would've easily won the D primary. It's not just the district lines being gerrymandered. The voting processes and the demographics by location are also.

[@buzoff4642]

@@Interglacial_optimist Free press was turned into Agenda press, when Reagan repealed The Fairness Doctrine.

[@FullChick-h4l]

Anderson Brenda Robinson Jessica Davis Margaret

[@BubnHubn]

Oh, hello Mr. "End of History", new predictions? haha

[@markfisher6404]

Your ignorance of his meaning is showing

[@BubnHubn]

@@markfisher6404 you know, I kind of do not trust people who were so blatantly wrong about the state of world politics

[@markfisher6404]

@@BubnHubn so you think an alternative to capitalism has emerged since the fall of the USSR?

[@BubnHubn]

@@markfisher6404 no, I was talking about his book "End of history"

[@markfisher6404]

@@BubnHubn which you clearly have not taken time to understand

[@HarrodUla-z7i]

Davis Paul Lewis Edward Johnson Helen

[@jjgreen5206]

We aren’t going to Fascism or Authoritarianism🙄 I’m sick of these nihilistic, opportunistic authors

[@markfisher6404]

Technocratic authoritarianism is being focus tested currently with control mechanisms being field tested in Gaza and Ukraine

[@brandalyn8298]

Really bad perspective here

[@markfisher6404]

Really vague comment here

[@Interglacial_optimist]

Your guest says that russia hasn't moved at all in Kursk. A blatant lie.

[@letsRegulateSociopaths]

Whatever Vlad

[@Interglacial_optimist]

@@letsRegulateSociopaths Truth hurts doesn't it

[@letsRegulateSociopaths]

That's not "democracy" you are referencing, it is Capitalism, and corruption...

[@buzoff4642]

Capitalism and corruption are two different things. Buying politicians, in any economic or political configuration. All hierarchy is susceptible to corruption - nations, religions, households, businesses, etc.

[@Interglacial_optimist]

Ukraine is upset that they picked a fight with their neighbor and the united states isn't giving them enough ammunition?

[@cristinskadell338]

Ukraine was attacked and had to defend themselves.

[@patallen229]

The fascists of Ukraine have been exterminating Russian speaking Ukrainians and Russia had protested and signed a treaty to stop this but we ignored it , Putin gave us warning after warning and called Biden and Biden refused to talk this war is at least partly our fault. ​@@cristinskadell338

[@sitechca70]

@@cristinskadell338 You need not have bothered to reply. Any idiot with a brain and who can read knows Ukraine is the victim here. For them to spout blatant lies clearly shows they either believed or are pushing propaganda.

[@letsRegulateSociopaths]

Are you insane or think everyone is stupid? Ukraine is DEFENDING itself

[@Interglacial_optimist]

@@letsRegulateSociopaths Ukraine didn't have the weapons to defend itself so...

[@joem0088]

"Authoritarianism v. Democracy" is a tired cliche. Just a montra to divide and to polarise.

[@pageek3487]

1:10 wait, we can put restrictions on arms sales? 😂

[@Johnitnyre]

That might be illegal because it would limit profits to shareholders

[@pageek3487]

How? The government is not obligated to buy weapons from them.

[@buzoff4642]

@@pageek3487 Current US law is that no monies for weapons will be given to foreign nations who block humanitarian aid. Washington is breaking our laws, including this one. Yes, we can put restrictions on arms sales. But none of it matters, when corrupt politicians suffer no repercussions for breaking our laws.

[@pageek3487]

@@buzoff4642 I hear you.