America's Weird Anti Universal Healthcare Propaganda

[@TheStairsToNowhere]

I really don’t get the “the NHS isn’t really free you pay for it in taxes” point because like so are the Police, Fire Service and all public services, but no one seems to make a point of how much those cost if you have to have the fire brigade put out a fire, or call the police. That’s what taxes are for, to pay for public services.

[@bounty202g]

It's propaganda. You have an entire subset of Americans that thing things like the post office and public libraries should be done away with because they cost Americans money

[@petervaughan6854]

This. 100% this. + Education, road maintenance, refuse collection...the list goes on

[@captvimes]

Fire brigade is so good as a comparison. If you werent insured the fire brigade wouldnt put out your fire, you had to display on your buidling that you were insured. That changed for good reason so can this.

[@LiqdPT]

@@johnp139 it really should be. People shouldn't be making decisions about whether they can afford the procedure they need (or, from another angle... Oh, you need this procedure? OK, we'll charge you whatever the F we want since you don't have a choice). It's not a proper free market. People can't shop around for the services they need, nor do they likely know what they'll be charged. Hell, if you have a procedure done at a hospital and do ALL of your due diligence, you can't guarantee that all the providers involved will be in network. You won't know that until you get the bill

[@xAnAngelOfDeathx]

@@johnp139 It is in every 1st world country in the world except the US. Many 2nd and 3rd world countries have universal healthcare.

[@meowtherainbowx4163]

Universal healthcare is just health insurance but without having to worry about who’s in your network or how high your deductible is. It’s the exact same principle, just executed much better.

[@joepiekl]

Yep, it's insurance without anyone creaming money of the top for shareholders. Or advertising. Or the admin involved in claiming. Or any of the other costs that only exist because it's a profit-making company. And they claim the private sector is more efficient.

[@meowtherainbowx4163]

@@joepiekl Yes, I should’ve mentioned that myself. I get why for-profit companies are theoretically efficient, but we already know that it’s not working in this case.

[@elaexplorer]

It's true. I'm going to get more stents put in my heart on Wednesday for more blocked arteries (I had 2 stents put in 3 years ago). I feel perfectly fine and healthy except for some small pinches in my heart area when I'm relaxing (nothing when active, I know weird) if I didn't have the expanded state healthcare insurance (yay being poor?) from Obama care I wouldn't have gotten the pain checked out and would have had another heart attack.

[@ONLYJOKING101]

Yes its called national insurance.

[@MichaelSmithAU]

Much better than that even. Under UHC the doctor decides what you need treatment for - no insurance company or approval from another government department. If your medical professional thinks it needs to be done then its done. Exactly how it should work and I'm shocked people accept any other outcome than that.

[@daveayerstdavies]

Americans already pay more in taxes per person for non-universal Medicare/Medicaid than the British pay for the universal healthcare of the NHS. Why? Because American healthcare is the most expensive in the world by a huge margin. Why is it expensive? Because it's built to be expensive and there is no incentive for hospitals and insurance companies to make it cheaper.

[@coralovesnature]

Exactly!!

[@Hydraclone]

@@laurie7689 And here lies the problem. Healthcare shouldn't be a business. Peoples' suffering shouldn't be the basis for a busniess model. The cost of running hospitals in other developed nations is significantly cheaper, for this precise reason. Yet the quality and range of care is comparable, especially in places like Belgium. It also then doesn't bankrupt people for illnesses outside of their control. This is the same sick attitude as those who immediately bought up essential supplies at the start of Covid to sell it at a premium. No moral compass at all.

[@Rachel-rs7jn]

Exactly! I don't know the NHS but I have a lot of experience with the French system. The upfront costs are just plain cheaper by orders of magnitude, and it's not because of high taxes. It's because of regulation and a much more streamlined system (and probably a lot more, but those are the main tangible points I've noticed). The taxes are what make it actually free for French citizens/residents (they get reimbursed, while visitors do not). Case in point: the vet bills are also much, much lower, and taxes don't go toward that at all.

[@michael_177]

Stop on.

[@postie48]

@@laurie7689 You have just presented a perfect argument for an alternative approach to health care. Throw in the fact that the USA pays much more for less than average medical/health outcomes - while paying twice as much it appears the discussion needs to switch from IF to HOW.

[@rileylarch5417]

My personal favorite arguement for anti-universal health care is "why should I pay for other people when I'm not sick?" .... What do you think you're paying for with privatized health insurance???

[@Zephyr616]

As someone who has only used the NHS a handful of times in their 28 years, yet has been on and off homeless since 19, I feel that tax money should be going towards something I actually need rather than something I've only ever used once in a blue moon. The sheer amount of money going to the NHS could help elevate the homelessness crisis the UK has been facing for decades.

[@alphamikeomega5728]

If you're paying less for the same quality of care, whether you're paying for others' healthcare is simply irrelevant.

[@Ghost-ql6tn]

@@alphamikeomega5728 You'd think so but unfortunately the loudest Americans would rather people die in the streets than even thinking about helping BOTH of them. It's really sad and frustrating how selfish people can be.

[@countjondi9672]

@@Zephyr616 That should not be an exclusive proposistion. Doing more for the homeless is not exclusive with Universal Healthcare. I would rather see a great number of other expenditures in government rather than see healthcare suffer.

[@Zephyr616]

@@countjondi9672 Well yeah, we should tax the fuck out of the billionaires, and cut most of the military spending over cutting the NHS. But, do you really see that happening? The rich stay rich cuz they don't get equally taxed, and they also stay rich due to the industrial military complex. So in the world we live in, the only real thing that they could cut to actually do something about it is health care. And for me, it wouldn't make any difference. I stay away from big pharma as much as I can. I only use the hospital or GP if I'm practically dying or break a bone. So less than a dozen times in 28 years. While I've probably spent a total of 6 or 7 years of my life sleeping on the street If you haven't been there, then you don't understand. But when your local council basically tells you they have no interim care for you after you just come out of hospital for a suicide attempt and leave you sleeping on the street, your priorities start to shift.

[@anniesearle6181]

There's such a weird lack of empathy in "You're paying for other people". Like, hell yes I am. If my taxes made sure even one person doesn't go into huge amounts of debt or die bc they can't afford healthcare then it's entirely worth it

[@isaaclarson]

You're missing the point that the US is not a healthy nation. If we're going to do a socialized healthcare system, then everyone has a social responsibility to be as healthy as they can be. We're the most obese nation in the world, and obesity causes a myriad of health problems. Social healthcare here would cost far more than a healthy nation.

[@Silverwind87]

@@isaaclarson We have more than enough money and resources to solve our health problems. The only reason we haven't is because it's not profitable.

[@NespeCoaching]

"tHaTs CoMmUnIsM"

[@Silverwind87]

@@NespeCoaching god i wish

[@joschafinger126]

Absolutely. Plus, how can anyone forget the second part, "...and other people are paying for me"?

[@TheWheelsBlog]

I was once banned from a GLOBAL diabetes Facebook group (ran by American admins) because I noted how Costa Rica’s national health system covered all my diabetic needs, and they said I had a communist agenda lol.

[@davidribeiro1064]

That group ceased to be global pretty soon if that's their standard...🤣

[@slavianalbanovich9025]

What's the best pharmacy in USA to buy insuline ? the first beyond canadian boarder

[@joepiekl]

From what I've heard, most people in the States actually do support some form of universal healthcare (which doesn't have to be the UK model). As with so many things, the problem is legalised corruption (also known as lobbying). Like Evan's tax video, where everyone agrees it's stupid but it continues because big companies pay for it to continue. I literally got bored of watching John Oliver because the plot of every segment was the same. Most people support X, but Y makes a lot of money for some people, so they buy the politicians. And for some reason, that's not considered corruption because it's not done secretly.

[@Tustin2121]

Maybe if we actually did something about it, the “boring plot” of John Oliver’s segments could change to something else... Incidentally, that has to be the most American thing I’ve ever heard: “this channel just talks about the same stupid social justice thing over and over again, it’s so BORING! Move on already!” The Jimquisition gets those complaints about their coverage of corrupt video game companies, and now there’s this about John Oliver and American social issues. Like, Jesus Christ...

[@GhengisJohn]

@Rachel Forshee Phrasing is very powerful and it's frustrating as all hell. Ask a gig worker if they want rights as an employee and they will say "yes." ask them "do you want to maintain your freedom of employment?" as you sell them a bill that expressly forbids those rights and you will also get a "yes." It's a problem that so few people actually take the time to actually examine the details after their first impression, a very similar phenomenon to watching a friend of mine get outraged over news headlines without examining them further. Capital have become very aware of this and try very hard and very successfully to frame every issue in a manner where you support them or you support the apocalypse and a lot of times the power of their propaganda is bolstered by people's fear of change.

[@MrGrimsmith]

@@GhengisJohn As someone who once wrote documentation for non-technical people to use with fairly technical systems I can confirm that this doesn't just relate to politics or news, it's everything. Phrase the same thing in two different ways you get an "I don't understand this!" or "Oh, it really is pretty simple!" depending on which one you use. Something looking different but functionally remaining the same as, if not better than, the previous version is another example. Or any other combination of appearance and function is another issue. Too many folks are incapable of looking at things objectively and weasel words don't help that.

[@lynnb2562]

Most people I find are like myself, they don't mind the idea of universal healthcare they mind the government holding the purse strings. You've got to remember, my generation pays into social security which was supposed to be a universal retirement account and none of us think we will ever see a dime because the government stole it all.

[@curlygirl56129]

But also our government is so evil and they don’t even run the VA system well (basically it is government health insurance for veterans) so I’m struggling to see how they could do it on a grand scale when they can’t even get the sample size right

[@MrMasterDebate]

Most people don’t realize: private health insurance companies have zero incentive to invest in preventative care, since they don’t know if you will be on their plan for them to save money in a decade. So our system being more expensive is because we never invest in cheaper things like a single payer system does .

[@HelloIamCloudy]

Look, for all the horrors of the American healthcare system, there is one thing that is free. Preventative care. It is free across all insurance.

[@raerohan4241]

@@HelloIamCloudy Not possible. For one thing I know that not all insurance companies that guarantee 1 free doctor's visit and routine bloodwork (edit: or dentist's visit!) per year, so that already debunks that. Also, many insurances don't even subsidize other basic things like birth control or sunscreen let alone make them entirely free, so any claim that preventative care is free across all insurances rings even more falsely

[@HelloIamCloudy]

@@raerohan4241 on the ACA marketplace it is.

[@lovemusicbandchorus]

Cant forget admin costs. Depends on the study you look at, but administration costs are 25-80% of our healthcare costs. Personally, I'd rather that money go to my care than the CEO of some insurance company.

[@klogington]

Private health insurance does have reason to invest in preventative care, but healthcare facilities don't. For an insurer, the ideal customer is someone who pays their premiums and never gets sick. For them, a stitch in time does indeed save nine. A bit of preventative care investment can stop major precedure costs later. There is a bit of a barrier to this approach though. It pays off years later. Not at the end of this quarter. Companies with a long term plan might adopt it, but if they can't see more than three months into the future because of their shareholders, it won't be used. The healthcare facility, if they get whatever costs they incur covered by health insurers, they don't really have any downward pressure on costs.

[@straticfox4600]

What always confused me when I was little was watching Spider-Man 2 (2004) and the whole premise of sandman was that he robbed banks to pay for his child’s healthcare. Living in the U.K. I never understood why and just assumed that he was stealing the money for himself and just not taking his daughter to hospital but as I got older I understand the reality that her condition costs hundreds of thousands of dollars to treat and that robbing banks was really the only way for him to help her because healthcare was so expensive

[@bibianaguadalupeislasherre9880]

You mean "Spider-Man 3"? That movie was released in 2007.

[@autumnramble]

Yeah, Spider-man 2 is the one when Peter Parker is starving so much his body can't even produce webs anymore. The series was deeply depresing.

[@MHDebidour]

No Breaking bad plot in Europe: Walter White just go to hospital gave he's social insurance card and get treated.

[@luisfilipe2023]

@@MHDebidourif only it was that simple

[@luisfilipe2023]

@@PureOctarine because life is complicated

[@JRawlings14]

Lol I always find it funny when americans say the "but our taxes would go up" line when they're paying hundreds of dollars a month in insurance to an insurance company whose job it is to find ways to not have to cover you. Under universal healthcare, most of that goes away (there's usually still some form of private health insurance, but way less) and your taxes scale with your income, unlike health insurance costs. And universal healthcare actually always covers you. Always. Unlike private healthcare.

[@mitrimind1027]

And we also just pay more taxes on top of that anyway for our inefficient healthcare system.

[@alphahunterd]

taxes are already being misused. I really doubt the government can even be capable to implementing proper healthcare with said taxes. I mean there was this one highway that went through and the taxes that was supposed to go to it went nowhere and it still hasn't been built. I believe this was like 10 years ago

[@JRawlings14]

@@alphahunterd every other developed country seems to do it just fine

[@alphahunterd]

@@JRawlings14 oh trust me someone one somewhere is probably gonna f it up. they're going to try to move it somewhere that's nonessential or something. I wouldn't be surprised if something like a bad compromise happened and it turns out to be worse than what it should be. shame there's perfectly good systems to follow, but i just doubt the people in charge could do it right.

[@mitrimind1027]

@@alphahunterd the big problem with our government starts with elections being made on compromise, so we need to have rank choice voting so that we don't have a duopoly of mediocre lesser evil politicians.

[@1moretake51]

“Even if everyone in the wo- in the US” Good to know Evan is still American.

[@harry2803]

they're brainwashing still hasnt worn off yet

[@Samuel-qc7kg]

But hey, at least he doesn't refer to the US as America.

[@tacosmexicanstyle7846]

@@Samuel-qc7kg the terms are fully interchangeable in UK English in the same way that ‘Britain’ and ‘UK’ are. Modern English separates the continents into North and South, and you can use ‘Americas’ (plural) for both. Singular is almost always taken to refer to the sovereign state. If the US can’t be called ‘America’ then the demonym shouldn’t be ‘American’. Like we don’t call them USians or British people ‘UKians’ So yeah.

[@Samuel-qc7kg]

@@tacosmexicanstyle7846 Yeah man, like in japanese. They call the USA people "americajin (person from america). And it is like calling chinese people asian but not calling indian people asian despite them being asians too. I know man, but whay bothers me is that these gringos think only them alone are America. Some can even go as far as to deny canadians and latinos as american too. So yeah, it bothers me and a lot of people.

[@n.4173]

@@tacosmexicanstyle7846 britain and uk are not interchangeable really, are they (ask the northern irish). and america and the us either, but some english speakers decide not to care.

[@ChickyNYC]

As an American living in the U.K. for several years, I’ve experienced both medical systems in multiple regions (TX, NY, GA). I know of few people in the US who are open to the idea of any kind of universal healthcare, much less single-payer or socialised healthcare. If Americans came here and experienced the NHS, they’d go back to the US and protest they don’t have the same there.

[@lucie4185]

I am interested to know if rephrasing it too "crowdfunding their own healthcare" might have a different impact?

[@azaelianightshade3498]

@@lucie4185 Personally I think it would.... just because of polarizing feelings about certain terms and phrasing. Also, consider the average American has a 7th grade reading level and most articles and scholarly papers tend to be written at an average of and 11th grader.

[@thekingbarrelmaker7642]

I'm an American, and I had to pay $18000 for a six night stay in the hospital because I had peritonitis (a life-threatening condition if left untreated). That was with insurance, by the way. If I had been born into a different family, I could have died. I am jealous of people that live in every other developed country. My country's healthcare system is utterly disgusting.

[@azaelianightshade3498]

@@thekingbarrelmaker7642 I have a lot of medical issues and growing up I'd feel guilty because my mom had to take me for stuff and insurance was well American Insurance...not to mention my family's general health issues.

[@JennieC.]

I've also experienced universal health care and knew that could coexist with private health care(for the folks who could afford it and want better, faster services). I'm pretty sure right now most Americans who don't qualify for Medicaid or Medicare are paying more than of private healthcare and getting significantly worse quality of services than anywhere else in the world, unless you get sick enough often enough to exceed the deductible, you're never getting your money worth. The system rn tbh is neither universal nor private. It's a corrupt, overpricing, government encouraged monopoly model. I'd 100% support universal healthcare if they have a clear plan of how to get rid of I insurance companies and the hospitals they built. My concern is they won't do nothing to endanger their juicy campaign donations from trillion dollar insurance companies.

[@jacobhogan3208]

Being Canadian is like being the third wheel of this channel.

[@Rain-np7tk]

Yes

[@thetimetraveller2671]

German here - same

[@adriannahowell2359]

He mentioned Canada and how it’s untrue that we have to wait months to see the doctor here, which is a little misleading. No, you don’t have to wait months to see a GP, but you will have to wait months or even years to see a specialist. But the thing is that the same is true in the US as well lol so the wait isn’t that outrageous. There just aren’t enough of them.

[@DaveVespa]

I've assumed the Canadian health system is like how the British one was supposed to be. Dave - a Brit

[@Blirre]

@@adriannahowell2359 Years of wait for a specialist is indeed outrageous. Months, I can understand. Sincerely, a Finn

[@alexreid1173]

As an American, one thing I could talk about for hours is the incredible fear of losing your insurance. I lost my health insurance twice in high school when my dad was laid off. I’m disabled and usually see a dozen+ doctors regularly, and all of that had to be put on hold. I couldn’t get new glasses when my eyesight got worse, I couldn’t get my physical therapy, and we were in constant fear of an emergency that would force us to go to the emergency room (an ambulance wouldn’t have even been an option still because they’re so expensive). I’m in college now and still on my dad’s insurance, but I always know that it could be ripped away from me at any time. I’m lucky enough to have some money saved up (100% from emergency covid grants when I didn’t use them right away), but most Americans aren’t that lucky. It’s a whole crisis over here.

[@ORDEROFTHEKNIGHTSTEMPLAR13]

The stress you must be under and your not even in your 30's yet but couldn't America have a sort of NHS might not be a exact copy but something similar??

[@sew_gal7340]

Get a good job and your insurance will come from your employer, i only pay $10 for a doctors visit here in the USA

[@KurtHögerle]

So you got an insurance but you still have to pay, @sew_gal7340? How crazy, how stupid! Can you choose any doctor/GP? What do you pay for getting to the ER by ambulance? Can you choose any hospital? What's the deductible? For the rest of the developed world: 0$, 0$, and 0$m, any GP, any Hospital, 0$.

[@AngelineProductions]

@@sew_gal7340not everyone has this option. One’s ability to access life-saving care should not be reliant on one’s employment. That’s insane.

[@TVideoCZ]

We live in Czech Republic, my dad started to lose control over his left leg, after some test in a hospital they found out there is something wrong in his spine in the neck, he went to a surgery got a titanium plate to support the spine spend a couple of days in the hospital and after everything paid 0$ because that's how the system works, yes you have to pay taxes but when the shit hits the fan you can rest assured.

[@aidenoffire1987]

My husband is active duty. He originally enlisted for a job, but since enlisting, we've had two kids and I have been diagnosed with PCOS, Hashimoto's Disease, Hypothyroidism, Psoriatic Arthritis, and Fibromyalgia. I "joke" that my husband can never separate from the Air Force because of my health issues. But seriously, I take Humira weekly. I need two boxes a month, which would be about $13,000/mo if I didn't have insurance (as well as getting my meds on base, off base would have copays). Tricare is paid for by tax dollars. We already have a form of socialized healthcare. We just need to sell our souls to the military overlords to get it.

[@WhichDoctor1]

I believe that if you combine active service personnel, veterans care, medicare and Medicaid, and various other government-funded schemes the US government actually already spends as much as the UK government on healthcare. It's just that the rest of the population have to pay a roughly equal amount on top of that. A combination of a bunch of disconnected government schemes that duplicate expenses, and the private system constantly driving up prices for everyone means that even the socialised care you get is horribly expensive. If the US completely scrapped the current set up and introduced an NHS you could potentially actually get universal free care with the taxes you are already paying, and cut out all private costs

[@rikospostmodernlife]

*"Service Guarantees Citizenship."*

[@Matt09pearce]

That's scary

[@charlotteinnocent8752]

Do you know what the cost of that drug is elsewhere, like in Canada or the UK?

[@x1pa]

@@rikospostmodernlife You nailed it.

[@natalia-grace9314]

I'm from New Zealand, but most of my friends are American. I still remember the first time I realised that Americans are basically indoctrinated to believe that there's no other option that works. I got into an argument with a friend at the time, and her mother, about whether or not having a baby in NZ is free (it is). They accused my mother of lying to me about it, and that it's impossible that she paid nothing everytime she stayed in the hospital when she had a baby. It made me really upset that they didn't even believe that it was possible.

[@MsPeabody1231]

It's free in loads of countries, plus you also get maternity leave...

[@c0ronariu5]

Yeah it’s upsetting to think how clouded by propaganda they seem to be, and also how rigid the thinking. Can you imagine accusing someone of *lying about not paying to give birth??

[@Rachel-rs7jn]

Yep, I've had the same experience. Several times now when I've described my cheap and excellent care in the French system, I've just been straight-up told I'm lying. 🤯🤯

[@Nymbul1]

Hi, not-quite-indoctrinated American here(grew up being exposed to a large variety of cultures through family hobbies, but also was force fed the typical American mind set as well). A lot of the way Americans react when topics like this are brought up is a combination of a multitude of things, mostly disbelief and internal anger at our own country, which is frequently expressed in such a manner as to make it seem like we are accusing others of lying. And granted, yes, a large majority of Americans in this situation would legitimately be accusing a non-American of lying about the way the healthcare works in their home country, but for those of us with half a brain, please understand that we are just so browbeaten and disgruntled over the fact that no matter what we try to do as a collective, we are simply too poor to be able to buy out the lobbyists who literally get hired by major corporations to do everything they can to prevent things like universal healthcare from becoming a thing, because unfortunately, at the end of the day, universal healthcare doesn't make as much money like the current system in the US does

[@baronvonlimbourgh1716]

In the netherlands you get a private nurse at your house the first week, and the second week half days to help you get used to being a parent. They do cleaning, shopping, and cook. And they show both the mom and dad how to bath the baby, feed the baby, change diapers how to deal with crying babies etc. etc. They basicly come in and take over the household so the mom can rest and sleep and enjoy the first weeks of becomming a parent. And that is also free, even if you have multiple children.

[@LaurenReneeH]

I took an ambulance from my town’s ER to the hospital 20 minutes away earlier this year. A couple weeks later I got a bill for just shy of $10,000. Thankfully the hospital had to cover that cost because they didn’t have the services I needed and HAD to transport me for me to get the proper care, but it’s wild to think that I may be stuck with thousands of dollars of debt just to GET to a hospital someday.

[@gabrielex]

I really don't understand how can they justify that price, I mean that can't be fuel nor the ambulance driver or the EMT on board...

[@PortilloMoment]

@@gabrielex The price is not justifiable, but insurance company CEOs need paying. On something as basic as healthcare it seems nothing short of blatantly parasitic for a politically supported layer of monied influence to negatively effect what is best for a patient.

[@grahvis]

In the UK I was in the local A&E with a minor heart attack, was taken about 100 km to the specialist unit for a couple of stents. Spent a few days in the hospital due to another condition and after recovery, had a taxi ride home. Not even a piece of paper to sign.

[@gabrielex]

@@grahvis in that case I'm pretty sure that was expensive even if you didn't have to directly pay for it because stents are expensive.

[@gabrielex]

@@PortilloMoment This is exactly the kind of evidence that should be looked after and shown to people who keep supporting this kind of parasitic system, so that hopefully they'll understand that it is not right.

[@Muppetkeeper]

You hit the nail on the head. Many Americans only feel successful if they can see other people suffering.

[@valerietaylor9615]

And they don’t care.

[@crystlelakefarm1254]

​@@valerietaylor9615 Until it's them

[@alexwright4930]

"You're paying for other people." That's also how insurance works.

[@Zero86Sk]

@Haku Yuki Yes Really

[@martinpay3812]

Yes. The premiums paid by the many meet the costs of the claims made by the few. It’s not a difficult concept; the aim of the insurance company of course is to pay out less in claims (and staff costs etc) than it takes in premiums as the difference represents their profit…

[@divx1001]

@Liberals Are gross if you refuse to be educated, that's on you but stop trying to convince people otherwise 😂 you're just making yourself a fool.

[@mikecarlton9000]

@ Martin Pay LAG thinks that if he pays $400/ month for private healthcare, and he needs to go to the hospital after a year, the insurance company will pay a 50,000 bill out of pocket while he paid 4800 in premiums. They need not only better healthcare, but better education.

[@emlmm88]

@Liberals Are gross ϟϟ LOL, an SS symbol in the profile name. You guys are like living stereotypes XD

[@Cirkusleader]

I will never understand the "it's not actually free" argument. Like... I personally would rather pay an additional... Let's be bold and say $5 a month to make future medical expenses free, than pay $5000 in one lump sum one month and have to basically choose between going into debt, or cutting costs on a bunch of things tied to my lifestyle.

[@Gingerninja800]

people dont want socialised healthcare until they need socialised healthcare.

[@WhichDoctor1]

@@Gingerninja800 You do get the same attitude everywhere to some extent. There are British people who say things like "I don't have any children and I don't want any, why should I pay for other peoples kids to be taught how to read and write?". It's not their problem, until in 20 years time there aren't enough people with sufficient education to work and the economy collapses. But by then they would have found a suitable scapegoat (probably poor/brown people) to blame the consequences of their actions on. The only difference is that you have a whole ass political party dedicated solely to those kind of people

[@carrieseymour5197]

That's the whole principle behind insurance. Socialised healthcare is just like really, really good insurance, without so many people trying to take a slice of profit off the top.

[@maximushaughton2404]

As someone that likes to point out it's not free, I can tell you why I do it. The problem is that some people, inc many Brit's, that think it is actually free. Also it moves it away from the communistic idea, and makes it sound more like health insurance, but you pay to one company who handle everything for you, yes it's the government and not a blood sucking insurance company, who are only in it for profit.

[@bastiaan4129]

@@carrieseymour5197 yeah, but large evil corporations can't profit of that, that's why in the Netherlands they thought is was a good idea to squeeze those insurance companies back in again. Now our healthcare is still cheapish, but more expensive and less efficiënt than it was and the insurers make billions in profit!

[@vivwindsor4055]

We have had a Conservative government in the UK for more than 10 years, I don't think anyone here thinks we are living in a 'Socialist' or 'Communist' country.

[@carolinemcgovern4488]

I just laugh when Americans call our government socialist.

[@doodles4funo569]

@@gsurfer04 I think they are becoming more and more left because of Bernie and AOC.

[@EnigmaTimGaming]

I view Blair & Co. as Tory-Light, so really my entire lifetime (40 years) has been pretty much a Conservative government. Thatcher wouldn't consider "New Labour" one of her greatest achievements if they were truly leaning left.

[@SCGMLB]

By American standards, British conservatives are centre-left.

[@joepiekl]

Reminds me of when Ben Shapiro tried to call Andrew Neil a liberal because he couldn't answer his questions. That's Andrew Neil who created GB News, the most right wing news channel in the UK.

[@seprishere]

People in the UK complain about paying £5-£10 or so at a hospital parking meter. Not $1800 for a short A&E visit.

[@Emmet_Moore]

It's about the principle of healthcare being free at the point of use! Having to pay to go to the dentist or optitians, or for prescriptions in England - immigrant surcharges even - already go against the original principle of a National Health Service.

[@alexawalker2690]

Just England. Hospital parking is free in Wales and Scotland!

[@frannyparkerful]

@@alexawalker2690 is it!? ERI parking is definitely not free!!

[@postie48]

@@Emmet_Moore That is true the NHS dental is 'less than basic', eye tests/examinations are free but glasses are expensive, prescriptions I can understand the basic reasons for charging and remember that a very large percentage do not pay, and those that do it is a lump sum no matter how expensive the prescription is. But is is against the principle!

[@postie48]

@@alexawalker2690 No it's free at point of use! And it could be argued that England pays for Wales and Scotland (prescriptions as well) - but don't lets start that argument here.

[@georgesidcup23]

I paid taxes for 30 years. 3 months ago I had serious health emergency on NHS. Open heart surgery, 2 x post op stroke, multiple organ failure 4 weeks in ICU, pneumonia, pneumothorax . All doctors and nurses were fantastic, got all medicines and physio I needed, as well as air ambulance ( helicopter ) to get me to hospital on time and taxi to get me home after discharge paid for by the hospital. It cost zero, nada , zilch - only my wife's travel costs for visiting me. .... I can't wait to go back to work and if it means to pay for someone else's healthcare so be it, it's called being civilized. ( forgot to add earlier - all 3 months on full pay while on sick leave too )

[@hobnobkitkat]

I'm a Brit living in the US. The other thing I haven't seen mentioned is the whole in-network/out-of-network thing. Basically you can go to a hospital that is "in-network" with your insurance company (meaning the insurance will pay 80% of your costs) but find that one of the doctors treating you is out of network (meaning the insurance will only pay 60%). You will not necessarily know until you get the bill. The other thing that confused me on my first visit to the ER is that you do not get a single bill - you will get the ER bill, then you will get a bill from the doctor, then you will get a bill from the radiologist......

[@ORDEROFTHEKNIGHTSTEMPLAR13]

That's nutz😂😂

[@beauthestdane]

I make good money, I have insurance, and I have believed the system here is broken for decades. I know that I am one of the fortunate ones, but that doesn't mean I don't care about others.

[@dp0004]

What gives them a reason to care about you? Insurance cares about nobody.

[@spackar2720]

I work in the U.S. Health Insurance Industry. However, I believe that healthcare is a human right. Therefore, I hope that no later than 2040 the U.S. will have expanded, improved, Medicare for All national health insurance. My job provides comprehensive, low-cost health insurance. However, in my job I see high deductible plans which require the member to pay hundreds or thousands of dollars before coverage starts. It is shameful.

[@coasttocoast2011]

Australian here: I’ve never lived and worked in another country long enough to experience other health care systems but I know in Australia, yes you do sometimes have to wait like my mum did when she developed a fast growing cataract on her eye where it was nearly a year from her initial appointment to the surgery but it wasn’t affecting her quality of life. Two people at my workplace recently have been diagnosed with cancer and at least one of them was getting treatment within a week of being diagnosed.

[@cocoacoolness]

Exactly. I don't mind how our system prioritises based on how urgent the situation is, instead of prioritising based on how much money I have. I might have to wait in the ER for 6 hours sometimes, but I know if one day I get a heart attack I'll be brought in immediately on my free ambulance and jump the cue.

[@coasttocoast2011]

@@cocoacoolness Absolutely or you’ll get transported for free to a bigger hospital if you live rurally but have complications like my mum when she had me and had a prolapsed cord

[@AiBkomachi]

it’s not really that bad with waiting times, if you’re condition is more urgent you get treated earlier , NHS basically triages each patient especially for elective surgeries. Pay for nurses sucks though

[@topperhatschire]

You wait in the US too. It took 6 months for my wife to see a knee specialist. A year for my son to see a therapist. And we wait in the emergency room too. Just last week my friend spent 12 hours in the ER with her son who had covid and eventually went home with him.

[@cocoacoolness]

@@topperhatschire For real? I thought it'd be really fast considering everything is private. In Australia if you have money to go private it's super fast. My uncle said once he was in and out of the ER in less than 20 minutes and it cost him just $200. Super worth it he says.

[@BCMears]

Banter. The indoctrination of Americans is honestly impressive in a twisted way

[@nathan2743]

And the funny thing is, Americans will say shit like “people in China and North Korea are so brainwashed and they believe their government is the best in the world… etc etc” meanwhile the ones who are really the most propagandize and indoctrinated are the Americans themselves

[@talhahtaco2035]

@@nathan2743 i mean the whole communism example is about as blatant as it gets, you want people to survive on a living wage? Your a communist now, want to not be forced to go into insane debt for college or health care? Now your suddenly some Marxist, it's pretty infuriating, especially to actual socialist or communist people

[@andyonions7864]

Best country in the world... You better believe it.

[@nathan2743]

@@talhahtaco2035 yeah fr. I mean I’m sure most people living in capitalist countries are propagandized against communism but the extent of it in the US is insane. And of course almost no one knows anything about what Marxism and communism means other than as a synonym for bad

[@talhahtaco2035]

@@nathan2743 yeah i agree i understand why people may be weary of communism socialism or Marxism in general due to the state of China and the former USSR but here in the us it's like as soon as you even think about being a communist your pretty much seen as someone who hates your country, it's like people don't even want to understand they're perceived enemies

[@serendipity9649]

I am always amazed how so many Americans don't understand that even their insurance premiums pays for someone else also.

[@AngelineProductions]

It’s because we’re (purposefully) not educated about how it works.

[@charlottesinclair9354]

My dad had a heart valve replacement a few years ago which required him to be in ICU for a few days. Last year he was in hospital for 3 weeks, including 2 weeks in ICU, one on a ventilator, before we lost him. It was a stressful, emotional enough time as it was. I can't imagine how much worse it would have been if we walked away from it without him and with a massive bill. I live in New Zealand and I love having public healthcare. Yes it isn't perfect, but in already stressful situations it removes the stress of wondering if you can afford to keep trying to save yourself/someone else.

[@joshlloyd3133]

If the excuse of socialism and such comes up when the topic of the NHS is spoken about, you could say to them that by there logic services like the army is also socialist (or the word they used to describe the NHS), because they are payed for by taxes.

[@agnieszkasalach4395]

I swear, if fire brigades were an idea getting introduced today in the US, some people would decry it as communism and "why should I PAY FOR IT when some dumbass sets their house on fire?!"

[@nrellis666]

... and roads. Anyone who has ever used a road in America has benefited from "socialism". or the police, or the fire department

[@danielwalters5819]

“I shouldn’t have to pay to defend other people! I can defend myself with my gun that I don’t know how to use properly” - Americans, probably

[@charlotteinnocent8752]

People who run into this all the time in political discussions in America constantly say "Well, how about public libraries, fire service, public school, etc? Are THEY evil socialism too? Believe me, no one listens. They say that because as Evan pointed out, the are indoctrinated. They just CAN'T agree that it would be a good idea. They will fly off and find another right wing site to give them another excuse to be against it or say "Those things don't count!"

[@rikospostmodernlife]

@@agnieszkasalach4395 mcarthyism has affected american culture so deeply that they became antisocial while turning antisocialists

[@guy1524]

Nothing makes my blood pressure go up higher than being reminded what an absolute wreck our healthcare system is. 😩

[@wormsblink2887]

Hopefully not, you’ll be forced to pay for USA healthcare then.

[@timmytimmy105]

Our healthcare (assuming you mean the US) is the result of unprecedented 50+ years of intervention and manipulation by government. It's the most regulated, taxed and subsidized sector of our economy, with the government paying nearly 50% of total spending and controlling nearly every aspect of it.

[@Zeppelinschaffner22]

Americans: "Health insurance is communism!" Also Americans: "I haz ouchie, pleze go fund me."

[@evan]

oof

[@manifestationsofasort]

True

[@Zeppelinschaffner22]

@@evan GoFundMe, or how Americans call it: "Freedom and personal responsability"

[@lozloz7418]

@@evan there’s housing co ops where the rent is cheap

[@eattherich9215]

'Health insurance is communism.' 'Where's my stimulus cheque?' 😂

[@rksnj6797]

When I was young I was one of those "USA! USA! USA!" types. When I was in the USAF I was stationed in England and got to experience another country(besides Canada) and met and spoke with many people from around the world. Boy were my eyes opened!!! Many years later(decades actually), I have a job with very good health benefits (not cheap however). My wife, who has MS, and I still can't afford many of the treatments/medications she needs to help her with her disease. Thank you for your videos on this subject! I hope they open some more eyes.

[@iristigerlily]

My best friend is American-Kiwi and I'm a Kiwi. We calculated how much we both paid for healthcare and taxes. She paid more for her healthcare each year than I paid in taxes IN TOTAL. So in return, my taxes went towards so much more than healthcare (like schools, roads, firefighters, etc) and she STILL had taxes to pay on top of her healthcare insurance

[@sanders555]

Aside from the anecdotal evidence,I don't see how talking to one specific person from one specific country should have any bearing on anyone's opinion regarding universal healthcare.

[@iristigerlily]

@@sanders555 that’s the cool thing about anecdotes and opinions, you can choose to ignore them if you want. Hope this helps!

[@eddyland1557]

I think from Americans, the wait time excuse I feel comes partly from a place of selfishness because a good reason why the wait times are higher in Canada and the UK is because everyone can afford to go to the doctors whereas in the US not everyone can so the wait times will naturally be lower. I would much rather have everyone be able to afford to go to the hospital and have longer waiting times then have much shorter waiting times but not many can afford it.

[@Silentgrace11]

Not to mention, I’ve handled hospital scheduling and gotten a nice glance at physician scheduling…..scheduling 2, 3, 4 months out for necessary procedures. The US already has wait times, it’s just the ones who are fighting against NHS possibilities are already healthy people who aren’t subjected to it.

[@eddyland1557]

@@Silentgrace11 plus if the system is properly funded, then the wait times wouldn't be as outrageously long as they think it is.

[@gavinmorris154]

and with even semi decent appraisal of the medical urgency (triage, referral etc) you can mitigate the wait times or costs to health system. I think there are plenty of yt vids on the benefits to a single large healthcare provider with responsibility for long term national health. I think Evan reacted to a vid showing the American tax payer spends way more than in canada uk australia plus there was the cost to the patient on top

[@andrewsutcliffe4889]

You are under the illusion that there is no private healthcare in England. If your condition is urgent you will be treated immediately but if you need a new knee for instance you might have to wait 3 to 6 months. But if you are rich and stupid you can get it done the next day if you want to pay for it.....

[@abhaymanoj3784]

If you want to the doctors quicker you can go private if you wanted to as there is nothing stoping you. Its not like there is only nationalised health care in the Uk. Also if your seriously in trouble you would go to the ER straight away

[@borkbork4124]

I live in the US and I broke my arm playing an away hockey tournement. I was about 6 hours away from home, and my dad was the only who came with me. I broke it on the ice, and thankfully some medical staff from the collegiant league was there and was called to splint my arm then and there. Many people tried calling an ambulance but my dad stopped them due to the fact of how expensive the ride would have been. We had never been to this area so they put me in the car and my dad was driving whilst navigating the GPS on his phone to find a place that would treat me. I was scared for my life because my dad was distracted by the phone, we were in an unfamiliar place, and there was at least 6 inches of snow on the ground. I yelled at him to drive no faster than 10 mph because all the bumps from the road I could feel in my BROKEN ARM. It took us around 15 minutes to get there and none of the staff would put me in a wheelchair which was not okay. My dad had to yell at them to put me in a chair rather than making me walk while holding my arm in a makeshift splint. Not to mention a nurse ridiculed me for being scared and crying, he pulled the “I served in the US army” card, read the room pal. Like um okay, how is that relevant to a 16 yr old who broke their arm?! He had awful bedside manners, and he only acted like that when my dad wasnt in the room. He was my nurse and he was so insensitive to my pain. He didnt want to give me anything for me to calm down and numb the pain, another nurse came in and shot me with morphine because they had to rotate my wrist for the xrays and I was screaming so much. To this day I think my dad was standing outside and got very scared as to what was happening in the room and asked another nurse passing by to go in there and help me. Icing on the cake is they charged us way too much for a sling and a shirt (they had to cut me out of all my gear, including my expensive jersey), then sent us to a local walmart to pick up my pain meds, which also sells clothes and an arm sling for much less. We did not want to stay there for the surgery, we wanted to have it done at home because it would be less expensive in the long run. But that meant a six hour car ride with mild painkillers, while also sitting with the shock of breaking my arm…… Years later I am having nerve and tendon issues in that arm that are a) too expensive to treat or b) not taken seriously by a doctor because I am young. Remember I broke my arm when I was only 16. I have changed GPs and advanced practice practitioners so much because they do not believe me. United States please, we need to fix all of this! All of this, and I have only had that one experience thankfully, but many people in my family do not have insurance! My cousin who is my exact age had to get a tooth extracted because her parents could not afford to fix the cavity. It went untreated for too long that it had to go. If they had insurance, earlier on she could have gotten the cavity taken care of and still have that tooth.

[@eline6731]

Why would you need a wheelchair for a broken arm? Why would you get morphine for an xray? Yes, the US healthcare system is severely messed up, but not because of what happened in your story, apart from maybe the cost.

[@eline6731]

@@laurie7689 ah I see, that's not something we do in the Netherlands. Fainting in this scenario would not have been seen as neglect from the nurses in the Netherlands as far as I know.

[@adambennett805]

Yep. Exactly me, I always wanted to move to America when I was young but you couldn't pay me to nowadays

[@donaldstanfield8862]

It's insane here, death by gun everywhere, whackadoodle nincompoops as state governors that have exacerbated the trump total disaster over covid and encouraging general @$$holery amonst their followers You're wise!

[@pittarak1]

@@johnp139 hit a nerve, eh John. You obviously take it so personally when you hear people outside of your (US) bubble expressing that maybe you're not living in the 'greatest country in the world' after all?

[@dingusdingus2152]

U.s. citizen, born here, lived here all my life. I wish I could leave. If I had the money I'd be gone like I'd been shot from a cannon. I hate this place. I hate the stupid morons who live here. Every time I hear that greatest country in the world crap I want to puke green slime

[@jessicaable5095]

Hey, maybe if we did pay you, you'd be able to afford the healthcare 😂

[@BH-px5wd]

I was totally expecting the "I'm not saying the UK is just sunshine and rainbows" line to end in "have you seen the weather?"

[@greglawrence6260]

The Colorado River nolongermeets the ocean. The Mississippiis drying up, stranding barges, destroying farms, and reruining the soul. Just the start...

[@SillyStokey92]

Love that I'm watching this as a Brit living in the US who is literally picking up my meds and then rescheduling a doctor's appointment because I can't afford the unexpected mandatory appointment and charges this month and have to wait until I get paid next month, but also can't wait that long for my meds because they keep my chronic pain at bay lol.

[@myndigarcia1659]

Part of me doesn’t want to leave my extremely underpaid position because my healthcare incentives are so fantastic. But I have to cause I can’t afford my rent

[@juliusdavies2005]

It’s like modern day serfdom!

[@eddyland1557]

I am from England btw, but that's the most insane part of your healthcare that it's tied to employment. That seems dystopian to me as that's saying if you're unemployed, for any reason, fuck you.

[@myndigarcia1659]

@@eddyland1557 And majority of the time, they just pull the premiums from your actual check. My current job pays me to have healthcare, which is why I’m super hesitant to leave.

[@bounty202g]

@@eddyland1557 It's so that employers can exploit you and underpay you because you're scared to go without health insurance

[@xAnAngelOfDeathx]

Out of curiosity and if you are willing to share, what are the rough details of your healthcare plan? Co-pay? Deductible? Limits? Good luck to you.

[@MyLittleGreenHairdedMermaid]

By the way, junior doctors in the UK are similar to doctors doing their residency in the USA.... and if you work out their hourly wage, many of them make about the same

[@IceMetalPunk]

Checks out. The average salary for a medical resident in my state is $51,304. If they work 12-hour shifts 5 days a week (which I don't think is uncommon for residents, though I could be wrong), that's $16.44 an hour, or about ₤12.06 an hour.

[@violetskies14]

@@IceMetalPunk just wondering but as well as taxes do they also have to pay for health insurance from that money or do they get it automatically since they're working for a hospital?

[@IceMetalPunk]

@@violetskies14 Depends on the hospital. It's offered or not per employer, like any other job. The same per-hospital decision is true of whether the offered insurance comes out of their paycheck or not. Considering hospitals are entirely separate from insurance companies, working for a hospital has no bearing on health insurance opportunities.

[@violetskies14]

@@IceMetalPunk thanks I've always wondered about that. Means residents are probably worse off than junior doctors if you include insurance payments and student loan payments (in the UK you don't have to pay anything until you're earning over a certain amount per year). Outside of London £12 an hour is a good wage most people could live comfortably on even if it's not super high (though I do support them being paid more). For comparison my stepdad is a hospital cleaner and gets just under £9 an hour, a little above minimum wage.

[@littleannie390]

Yes a newly qualified doctor in the UK has to work long hours which is why their hourly rate is so low. After their second year their salary goes up considerably.

[@professorthread]

They'll be transparent if you ask. One of the FIRST things people advise when trying to tackle astronomical medical bills is to ask for an itemized list. Suddenly you'll notice the total cost goes down. Also our insurance tried to stick us with a $20,000 bill when my dad got airlifted to the hospital because he was having a stroke. He got an airlift because moving quickly is essential to prevent brain damage from a stroke. The hospital hadn't communicated to insurance that my dad had had a stroke yet so they thought it was frivolous and wouldn't cover it. WHO GETS AN AIRLIFT FOR NO REASON?? Eventually they did cover it BUT STILL. Also my dad wasn't able to get into occupational therapy FOR A MONTH afterwards to help with his memory issues from the stroke because insurance took forever to process the claim. He wasn't able to get his working memory back to nearly what it was because it took so long. He's able to function but it's definitely not the same and it cost him his job when he returned to work. Our insurance system is abysmal over here.

[@jessicaable5095]

I'm really sorry your dad had to go through that

[@alfieking8044]

On the point about wanting to be an American I feel like this has completely disappeared in the UK. As someone in their late teens America has always been the punchline of jokes rather than a society to be admired. I don’t think the American dream has been a thing in the rest of the West for quite a while

[@davidribeiro1064]

I think under GW Bush it became too noticeable that the US were not that great a country.

[@wolf1066]

@@davidribeiro1064 Long before GW Bush, actually. The USA has never been anything worth looking up to or emulating and the idea that the rest of the world wants to be like them - or is "jealous" of them - is nothing but US propaganda - just like "Land of the Free". Try telling blacks, Native Americans, Hispanics, women, atheists and LGBTQIA+ people how "free" they have been/are in the USA, see how far you get.

[@iCrapBubbles]

I had the oportunity to move out to America with some family that migrated out there a decade ago. I was like "Lol, no thanks. I may earn less money, but my quality of life is way better here." I wouldn't move to the States, even if I was to get crazy money.

[@fortheloveofnoise]

American dream fully died during the 2008 financial crisis.

[@ssilent8202]

I get it. You want to be American so bad that you pretend you don’t because it’s so embarrassing how much you want to be American

[@Thomashorsman]

Americans: I’m not paying for healthcare in my taxes! I’d rather pay for very expensive insurance instead!

[@mackereltabbie]

The great thing about paying for health care via taxes is that I can "pay for" the treatment I got when I was 20ish now that I'm older and can afford it

[@xAnAngelOfDeathx]

What does that mean?

[@mackereltabbie]

@@xAnAngelOfDeathx I became seriously ill and needed expensive treatment when I was young and 1. wouldn't have been able to afford it 2. had paid very little tax. Now I have more money and pay/have paid more tax, so I'm "paying it back" except without the financial worry that comes with medical debt.

[@postie48]

@@mackereltabbie I agree 'national/socialised' medicine has an economic benefit to the country as a whole as well as the moral necessity.

[@timmytimmy105]

@@postie48 It also has a detrimental impact to the country's economy as a whole and well as being deeply immoral. It's entirely built on a foundation of coercion.

[@glennmartin6492]

@@timmytimmy105 All government depends on coercion in order to enforce laws. You also have to distinguish between coercion and conditions.

[@markboon2024]

UK is depressing in a different way. "We need to look after the NHS" Bring up a decent pay rise. "Fuck off I clapped for them, what more do you want?"

[@ballisticmissl7919]

"Yeah, a raise? Your kidding right now"

[@cloverite]

Nurses had two pay rises last year, I work as Admin in an NHS hospital and haven’t had a pay rise this year. Nurses get paid incredibly well, trust me, they still continually complain about money. My niece, who is a newly qualified nurse earns just under £30,000 a year and drives a Mercedes. Nurses are not hard done to.

[@EinzigartigesLeben]

You want to tell me that 2.500 per month is much? Where the fuck do you live? A developing country?

[@ballisticmissl7919]

@@cloverite just because she drives a mercedes doesn't mean she is rich. Also, 30k is below average especially for such a strenuous job in the current climate

[@jasonstormsong4940]

@@cloverite Hazard pay needed because of all the accursed fools not taking basic health measures because of their attempt to reaffirm their freedoms without care for collective responsibility nor regard for their own health,

[@GR-gk5xs]

I have family members that look at me like I’m Mao Zedong when I suggest that education shouldn’t be 50,000 dollars

[@doodles4funo569]

You are right It should be free

[@costakeith9048]

Education is free, it's a credential from a university that's going to cost you $50,000. You choose to go to university, it's not a requirement, and it would be unreasonable to expect them to provide you with 4 years of instruction and a credential for free.

[@costakeith9048]

@@csnide6702 For one thing, hopefully it discourages a few people who have no business attending a university from enrolling. Frankly, 95+% of people in university today have no business whatsoever being there. And, secondly, if you are one of the vast majority who attend university but have no business being there, at least nobody has to pay for your folly but you.

[@botchamaniajeezus]

they should be looking at you like mao zedong instead, crying and on their knees thanking you for your great deeds

[@JackThomasCollins]

@@costakeith9048 I think you’ll find that an American university education is lesser than that of a European university education. Equally our education system before uni is a much higher standard here. Exams (tests) aren’t multiple choice, you are actually required to learn and retain information and think about what a question is asking, which filters out the less intelligent, universities can then fill their places with people who deserve to be there.

[@ReubenAStern]

3 years later... Luigi decided he wouldn't put up with it.

[@wombatpandaa9774]

I recently spent time in South Korea on a language learning program and one of the most consistent topics in our lectures was comparisons between Korean and American social systems. At the beginning of the class, our teacher had a fairly high opinion of the US and figured most things were better there - after all, it's the bastion of democracy and capitalism, of course it's better! - but by the end of our six weeks the five of us, who are all of the same mostly negative opinion on the US social system, had completely changed her mind. She was utterly baffled by how backwards the US is when it comes to healthcare, workers rights, and education. It's crazy how strong the idea yet is that the US is still a land of opportunity. Maybe it was 30 or 40 years ago, but not so much anymore. All it's really got now is undeserved clout and some admittedly great tourist locations.

[@divx1001]

Yeah the last time I heard people idolizing the US was back in the 90s. Thank God for social media otherwise we'd still be trying to immigrate to the US 🤣

[@TheBreadthatcausedLesMis]

It feels weird watching a community video on a Sunday. Especially when the video itself mentions they usually are on a friday

[@ShirinRose]

And aren't they actually usually on a Thursday, not Friday?

[@evan]

Yeah I am in between houses with video files all over the place trying my best 😅

[@ShirinRose]

@@evan We appreciate it! I hope you're having a nice time in Liverpool 😊

[@denisemeredith2436]

The reason some Brits say that the NHS isnt exactly free is because we have to pay £9.50 per item for prescriptions. If someone is on regular medication (not over the counter medicine) then they can buy a pre-payment certificate for £104 per annum which more than pays for itself. If you are in receipt of government benefits then you get free prescriptions. Some things like the contraceptive pill are free anyway. I am grateful for the NHS, I have had pioneering surgery and the laser used cost over £1 million. American's healthcare system is scary - I am glad I don't live there.

[@caitlin329]

Whilst the prescription fee is true (although not for all of Britain, and not for everyone anyway), the people who say it's 'not technically free' just mean that we pay for it via taxes. Aka the "free at point of use" that Evan mentioned.

[@scottwilliamson7703]

Not applicable across the UK, we don’t pay for prescriptions in Scotland.

[@carrieseymour5197]

Also, many people who are on regular medication will fall into a medical exemption category, so they will get free prescriptions (and if you have a medical exemption, any prescription is free, not just medicines related to the reason you're exempt.) You also get free prescriptions if you're pregnant or had a baby in the last year; over 60; under 16; under 19 and a student; or in Wales, Scotland, or Northern Ireland. Along with any medications that are dispensed in a hospital etc - it's only if you have go to a separate pharmacy that you have to pay.

[@denisemeredith2436]

@@scottwilliamson7703 Nor in Wales I believe. Its a bloody cheek that we have to pay.

[@emmy_the_nbnd]

Is the contraceptive pill free your whole life in the UK? In Germany you have to pay for it once you turn 22 and I feel like that's not right. It's basically just free in the beginning bc they want to prevent teen pregnancies but not everyone takes the pill for actual contraception buy for medical reasons.

[@MerrickKing]

This idea of engaging outside of your bubble is the reason that so many university students tend to have such similar ideologies. By having all of these young people educating themselves, all in such close proximities, discussing and challenging one another, they can finally start to understand views other than their own.

[@ORDEROFTHEKNIGHTSTEMPLAR13]

Absolutely nailed it

[@TommyLikeTom]

The way the light from your monitor colors the edge of your microphone stand is such a beautiful detail and makes me fall in love with you. The way that you incorporate your viewers comments into the discussion is a great way to get people engaged and catch them up to the current state of discourse.

[@LoraK31]

Last year I was diagnosed with a chronic health condition and had to be hospitalized 4 days (for a complication of this disease I didn't know I had). I was absolutely terrified of the bill. Somehow, I completely lucked out. Either my insurance company covered the whole thing or they never sent me the bill. Either way, I still haven't seen a bill and I will definitely not be asking about it lol. Living with a chronic illness in the USA is terrifying. You can't focus on things like moving or getting a better job without stressing about possibly having to pay thousands of dollars just to stay alive if you can't get insurance in time. And while Medicaid is helpful, they're an absolute nightmare to deal with. I hope the whole system's better someday, but I'm not optimistic.

[@dayzfallingdownx190]

I'm a Brit, living in London. I have enjoyed the benefits of the NHS and until fairly recently hadn't given much thought to what it is like elsewhere. A few weeks ago I was scrolling through social media (as you do!) and came across a post/PSA meme that emphasised that, in the US you should always ask the injured person's permission before calling an ambulance because they will be charged for it. Such a sad state of affairs. P.s. Yes, our National Health Service isn't perfect, BUT I WOULDN'T CHANGE IT FOR THE WORLD.

[@MarilynAlmodovar]

"Everyone has insurance in the US" this made me laugh loudly. My family and I moved back home to the US , after a decade in the UK and three years in France, where we were covered by the NHS and the Secu respectively. For the last ten years we've been uninsured because we can't afford Health Insurance in Florida and we can't apply to Medicaid. We were offered a Florida health care plan for our kids, which was twice our rent and covered absolutely nothing. So we've paid for everything out of pocket. After watching the other video, I'm glad that I did my own butterfly stitches after I accidentally sliced my finger with a ceramic knife. Or I would have had to pay 14k, which I find ludicrous, as per your last video. It truly boggles the mind.

[@violetskies14]

Why did you go back if you don't mind me asking? It seems like it would have been better for you to stay.

[@jacklancaster8622]

Doing your own stitches is wild

[@twisterwiper]

There are many ways to subsidize doctors. Europe subsidizes them directly. US subsidies high fructose syrup production.

[@emolass16]

After watching your video on US health care system Vs UK I have never been more thankful to live in the UK because I Would of most definitely of died and send my family in to bankruptcy from the cancer treatments as I had in a discussion with my friends I estimated it would cost around a million dollars to treat my cancer and most likely been refused further cover in the event of a relapse.

[@DanilloTheArmadillo]

Evan sounds like he's on Sulfur Hexafluoride (the deep voice gas)

[@evan]

I KNOW RIGHT

[@victoriaposada6330]

Okay good I thought I was the only one 😅

[@An19941]

RIGHT?! is it the mic? Or is he ill?

[@johnbewley3119]

about the waking around with a burst appendix: many women die from appendicitis because it's assumed that's period pains and it isn't actually looked into further. edit: spelling

[@cherylcarlson3315]

perfect example of sexism in medicine. With rare chronic diseases takes about 4 times longer for a woman to be diagnosed as a man.

[@SocialLocust]

There's definitely sexism in medicine, and I know that first hand, but my brother was also dismissed when he had appendicitis. The whole system is pretty messed up for everyone.

[@cherylcarlson3315]

@@SocialLocust tbf, it takes lots of skill to diagnose early appendicitis. Good thing is when it gets really bad is easy. I went in with symptoms of appendicitis but surgeon said my white count wasn't high enough and wanted to discharge me. Told him anyone can diagnose on autopsy and made him mad enough he repeated it in 6hrs where it doubled but still not where he was convinced. In OR it burst in his hands and I was septic for 3 days. This was the chief of dept. IMO, we need more nurses as safety net with mouth.

[@mikusheadphones]

mine was cancer in my appendix (: it took 18 months for someone to listen enough and get me my surgery. i also had endometriosis removed but my surgeon literally saved my life by listening in our FIRST appointment about how i really thought i was dying and no one cared. i was in and out of the ER like 3 times a week, had seizures and had to go by ambulance sometimes, etc. but 18 months to listen.

[@valtsstepanovs1368]

Just wanted to add my experience. A little over a month ago I had the symptoms for appendicitis. It was a weekend and my GP wasn't working so I went straight to the ER. They did an ultrasound and some analysis and my assumption turned out to be true. I had surgery around two or three hours after my arrival and stayed in the hospital for 3 days. I didn't have any insurance so I was a little worried about the costs but when I recorded the bill I was pleasantly surprised. The total cost was €50, €30 for the surgery itself and the rest was for the hospital stay. I'm completely shocked by these high prices in America.

[@manifestationsofasort]

And then there's me, who had to pay $3,000 for a six hour urgent care visit.

[@clarkeashley39]

I've never really gotten this. Like when I graduate and get a job, I'll prefer paying tax vs paying thousands of pounds when I'm sick.

[@fortheloveofnoise]

There is no one I wouldn't vote for if they would bring universal healthcare to America.

[@eliza8437]

Hello and welcome back to a man slowly losing his sanity

[@evan]

true

[@IceMetalPunk]

"Slowly" though?

[@EricJacobson1990]

Sorry to hear your housing situation is a bit messed up. I had a similar situation a year and a half ago when I first moved to Victoria.; I ended sleeping on a floor a month and a half after the first place I moved into here didnt work out. Best of luck!

[@v.s.1143]

I don't understand, why they do not consider health as a human right. 🤷

[@arrgghh1555]

Guns don't heal people

[@IceMetalPunk]

I often have the feeling that many Americans don't think *anything* is a human right except the freedom to do whatever they want.

[@OVERLEVENDE1]

You have a right to health. You also have a right to pay for it. I’d rather pay thousands to get treated than pay a single cent to some worthless human.

[@walover165]

@@OVERLEVENDE1 the thing you don't realise is, with that attitude, YOU are the one who is the worthless human.

[@teresafinch7790]

No one is worthless

[@johnwilletts3984]

I’m a Tour Guide in York. One of my favourite buildings is St Leonard’s Hospital. Founded in 936, all paid for through local taxation. Everyone treated equally. Archeologists sometimes identify the start of civilisation when they find a healed broken bone. This shows that the injured person was being cared for.

[@justjames1111]

It's often quoted that 90% of Americans don't have a Passport, and while that is no longer true and the figure is around 60%, the analogy would be a reflection of American Attitudes and Mindset. Talking with an American teacher residing in the UK he was saying that America is so Insular that State TV stations would rather report on a local Cat going missing than on what was happening in the rest of the World. So one has to ask, how did they become the wealthiest nation on Earth and of all that incredible wealth, why is so much concentrated in the hands of a tiny group of people and also why is so much spent on Weapons and War?

[@Yikes-Fook-o5t7r]

AIPAC controls everything. It's no accident.

[@endexyz]

10:34 ok that EXACT STATEMENT with "Canadians have a longer wait time than American hospitals so the US is better" was said by my computer science teacher and from another student in my first period. I was so confused because I never heard of it and I'm so glad it's not true, I was stumped on what to say so I just made the obvious statement like "Yeah alright but that means non emergencies are covered, it sounds like something they need to work on, there's no reason to just throw free healthcare away just cuz Canada has some issues", but didn't get much out of that, my teacher didn't believe Covid isn't as bad as """"the media"""" says it is

[@DieAlteistwiederda]

It's really not true they just let you wait a bit longer than actual emergencies like it is here in Germany and basically all other countries I know that have a similar system. When I actively had something wrong with me some years back I had my diagnosis within two days and then all necessary tests including an MRI within two, could have gotten it faster but was ok with waiting a bit longer because it was really just to see how bad it really is and with pain meds I was perfectly fine to wait a bit. Could have done it within 5 days or a work week if I had wanted to. At the same time I need a routine skin cancer screening, I will wait for an appointment about 12 weeks think and that's ok. I self check and if I would go to my general doctor and they would see something wrong with my skin I've first found they would fast track this process. Because nothing seems to be off right now I can wait, I won't die by waiting. They let people who need it have appointments faster than those who can wait and yes some people think their issues are more important but that's their problem.

[@mhaeric]

The wait times in Canada myth is rooted in some small amount of truth, but that tiny kernel of truth is used to talk about the entire system as a whole. Canada generally doesn't have wait times that are longer than anywhere else. Where the wait times can specifically be long, however, is for specialist elective surgery. E.g. a hip replacement surgery. Waiting several months to a year to schedule something like that would not be uncommon. Your trip to your family doctor, a public clinic or an ER, however, doesn't have much of a waiting time if even at all.

[@endexyz]

@@DieAlteistwiederda I'm glad you're able to get treatment for stuff like that, because in the US, specifically Arkansas where I live, most people just avoid going to the doctor at all, even if it's something serious, that's why I was so dumbfounded by my own teacher believing that myth because it makes the other people in my class think the US is the only way I'm going to be treated for my problems, even if I'm in life long debt for it, I really did feel stupid after that conversation, like I didn't do enough research

[@grahvis]

In the UK, surgery for such as hernias, are often done as a day case. When the specialist decided I needed surgery, the next thing was making the appointment to have it done.

[@xAnAngelOfDeathx]

It's bullshit. Although the Canadian healthcare system is not perfect, it is very good. Me or anyone that I know has never had to wait for any excess amount of time - specialists can take a reasonable amount of time to see but any other care is fast.

[@sweetgirlandhercats]

My mother broke her wrist on Friday and she told me to take her to the hospital on Saturday. I started panicking because I'm the only one who works in my house and I'm only working part-time because of school (worked full time this summer) and I just paid out of pocket last week because school starts tomorrow and on top of that my car needs a new tire. (and remember the bills are due in a few weeks) I started feeling better when my mom said remember she has Medicare because of her age and doesn't worry about it, if need be we will let the rest go to collections like we did when I broke my leg in 2014. Sometimes I hate this country. The US could be so much better and people don't let it reach it's potential because of "socialism" or "communism". I hope things either get better in this country, I get a career as an accountant in two years' time, or that I can move out of this country. Preferably all three.

[@GreytOutdoorsMedic]

I’m married to a yank and we keep talking about moving to the US, I am still put off by the lack of Universal Healthcare, having to do taxes yearly, and the fact the sales tax is never included in the display price in shops really puts me off.

[@michellemaine2719]

Simon, DO NOT DO IT. You will live to regret it, for many reasons. Living in the US nearly killed me.

[@costakeith9048]

I could see the healthcare situation being a serious consideration depending on your income and existing health problems. But the other two are pretty trivial, sure it's annoying to have to do your taxes every year, but $50/year for Turbo Tax and one evening a year spent filling out your taxes isn't exactly the best reason to avoid the country...unless you're involved in a lot of tax fraud and afraid of the legal liability inherent in signing the tax forms, then that might be a reason to avoid coming here ;) As for sales tax, no it's not included in the price, but it's cheaper than VAT; personally I'd rather pay less and have to calculate it myself than pay more just to have it calculated for me.

[@JuliaE28]

I have a chronic condition and the meds I need to function daily is $300 per month because insurance wont cover it. I'm a 23 college student and I am changing degrees so I can cover this and my other medical expenses. I pray it does not get worse and pre existing conditions are not covered. I'm 23 in medical debt from my medications on top of college debt and am looking at this monthly cost for the rest of my life. This is without any major accidents. Things need to change because no one should have to give up their dream job for better financial job due to a medical condition.

[@kanchoulabuzu4645]

America is just so individualistic thinking that poor people should not get sick if they cannot afford treatment.

[@pewp_tickalar]

As the cost of care in the US continues to far-outpace inflation, monthly insurance premiums, deductibles and other fees will continue taking up a bigger and bigger portion of people's income. Is this going to keep happening until Americans are paying 50%, 60%, or even 70% of their income on healthcare? Is there a boiling point that will be reached? A huge amount of reform is needed, but the last four years was spent clawing to keep the ACA which is an important, but very small reform compared to what is needed

[@DieAlteistwiederda]

Just yesterday I had this discussion about health care and education in the US and was screamed at by some fellow millenials that acted like your typical boomers that think just because they have suffered it would be unfair for everyone else not to suffer. This whole discussion was started by someone mentioning that more student loans are about to be forgiven which of course is a really good thing.

[@lilyliz3071]

How sad is that,sounds like they are selfish with no empathy for others,you take care

[@coralovesnature]

Ahh, gotta love the old "I had it rough, so everyone else should have it rough too" argument. Classic.

[@IceMetalPunk]

@@coralovesnature I wish it wasn't so classic :(

[@brunscrum9378]

So exhausting! It’s like some people from the US can’t grasp that things don’t have to remain in the same box of suffering, just to get poorer unless you come from blood money. Division is seen as a tool for marketing rather than an issue.

[@postie48]

Baby boomer here - yes I got my uni education free - partly supported by employer (1st degree) and Bursary (2nd degree) but there was an economic benefit to the country. BUT -- just sending off youngest to Uni - and thinking about what kind of top-up she needs from me, and her ultimate debt.............it's painful to consider.

[@swarticus4228]

As someone who works in the American medical billing field, I would say that I have become desensitized to the amount that we bill and just accept it.

[@GoldenTV3]

"But it's not free, you have to pay for it in taxes" Yes, that's how functioning societies work.

[@paul1979uk2000]

What's strange is that in the US, many don't go to see a doctor or to the hospital because of the cost whereas me in the UK don't go as much as I should because I don't want to be a pain in the arse and put things off, so much so that the doctor has to ring me up to see if I want a health check up, had a few of them over the last 5 years and naturally, it's all free as part of the taxes. It's great knowing that I can go at any time for anything I worry about without worrying about the cost and I have to wonder about the stress many Americans go through on health issues, especially people that have medical problems. From the outside, the US system just seems so barbaric in today's day and age. Also, what is this logic about health care being communist?, do Americans realize that the police and fire service are funded by taxes, why is it so hard for them to extend that to health care? Simply really, Americans have been indoctrinated by the Russians during the Cold War to think anything socialist is bad and health care companies are taking full advantage of that with the aim of profiting themselves at the expense of the American people, especially the poor and middle classes. There's another thing that Americans fail to understand, by having a universal health care, all of a sudden, it's in the systems interest to look after your health and well-being, that has a ripple effect on other things like higher food standards, better working conditions and so on whereas the US system seems to want people to get ill so companies can profit from it., your system is screwed up, a lot of the world knows it, it's mostly the American people that don't, well at least the older generation as there seems to be a glimmer of hope from the younger generations of Americans to do real change.

[@op19509]

The Kool-Aid/Ribena comparison was very good

[@bertaroo]

Why would they be against universal healthcare ?

[@meaganmw1205]

When rich people convince poor people it’s against their best interests.

[@luvdady]

Because we got government ran Healthcare called Medicare & medicaid. Research the fraud and excessive abuse. And don't even look at the veterans association. Yeah there's a whole lot more to the equation than oh yeah free etc...

[@matthewpoyner]

Because it’s “socialist” healthcare according to conservatives

[@jazz3799]

The main arguments mainly boil down to 1. “Who’s going to pay for it? Not Me!” 2. “We’ll be stuck with crappy plans and overstuffed offices if we de-privatize” 3. “It’s Communism!”

[@amethystlarktree5962]

Selfishness. Greed. Fear of anything they think is 'socialism' because they've heard it's a bad thing without even understanding what that word means.

[@daisywilliams2779]

Wait till Evan sees how much nurses and other healthcare professionals earns :(

[@Blue-fg8vt]

I guess the USA overchargeing is what let's it have rich doctors.

[@raywesterside3179]

The best thing about the UK tax system is free health care and also at 65 you get a state pension, this is £13000 a year. This increases by a small amount every year.

[@agalah408]

When you pay for an insurance policy, even before your money goes towards healthcare, the insurance company is taking 25% straight off the top towards its own admin and profits. That's a hell of a lot more inefficient than having a 2.5% government healthcare levy on all wages earned.

[@MindlessWanderings]

For me, the clearest evidence or greatest indictment of how bad it is in the US system is that travel insurance specifically excludes the US from normal/global policies. If you're travelling to the US you have to get a policy that specifically includes the US. Travelling to Europe? Sure, do what you want. Hell, you don't even have to tell us which countries you're going to.. In fact, let's just make it a 1 year global policy. That's right, you can travel anywhere in the next 365 days and get comprehensive coverage.. we'll even cover you in countries with active conflict zones as long as the government hasn't banned travel there (and there's embasy support) and you stick to an organised tour, you're fine.. Oh, you want a 2 day lay over in the US on your way? No, we can't do that.. You need the special "I promise not to do anything risky while in the US" premium insurance package for that... and we will be watching you. (Say what you will about insurance companies but if you ever want accurate data on a topic, look at what the insurance companies are using.)

[@postie48]

Actually that is an EXCELLENT point. (I think I will steal it for when I am dissing USA Healthcare in future.)

[@postie48]

@@jwb52z9 I am not sure I understand what you have said. I understand that when travelling in Europe (previously) I was able to claim reciprocal treatment. When I was travelling, while resident in a 'third world' country I needed travel insurance and that was more expensive if I was travelling to USA. So the point is travel insurance that requires coverage in USA (and Japan from recollection) is more expensive.

[@JB-qf5ep]

It drives me nuts when people say that in a public system we are paying for other peoples' care. Of course we are. It is also exactly what happens with private insurance. If you are not claiming on your insurance, your money is paying for someone else. This is exactly how insurance works. The major difference is, in a public system, the main objective is to use the money to help as many people as possible, while in the private system, the main objective is to make money for shareholders by denying as many claims as possible. The private system profits off of your fear, suffering and misery. It is truly sick.

[@lindabodewes7824]

Strangely the strength of the American culture has made me go the opposite direction my whole life. It always felt that it was blindly patriotic without critical thought. Even when I was very young I felt that.

[@michinwaygook3684]

I married an American and I immediately wanted to move to the United States thinking things would be better there. Before we could move she got pregnant and our first child was born. Our son was special needs and what quickly became obvious was that the best place for us to stay was where we already were - in Canada.

[@landonbarretto4933]

Canada is a vastly superior country. Shame on you for thinking otherwise.

[@ruthbaker5281]

I had a friend who had a similar issue to the person who thought they had appendicitis. He he had a sudden and rather mysterious illness that landed him in the ER, then was admitted. After the insurance, the left-over to pay was in the thousands.

[@mandybutnotpatinkin]

Finally made it in the under 301 club again! Yea American healthcare is straight traumatizing...

[@vitalspark6288]

Junior Doctors (that is, those in FY1 and FY2) don't get paid a lot, but that's because it's essentially an apprenticeship position. (Apprentices in other professions are allowed to be paid below normal minimum wage!) It only lasts a couple of years though, and after that, salaries go up significantly. The next stage up (a registrar) will probably make twice as much as a foundation year doctor. A consultant might make upwards of £300 per day.

[@JustinTunley]

As a UK resident I think our government owes us a adult conversation about the proportion of GDP we spend on health care. Around 10% may well have sounded generous in 1948, but the average age is now higher, more illnesses are treatable, more handicapped children saveable & in general the technology has moved on. Let's just say I'm not holding my breath.

[@TheEulerID]

That rather shows your lack of knowledge to assume that health expenditure as a proportion of GDP was around 10% in 1948. It was nothing remotely close, it was 3%, as even a tiny bit of research would show. Expenditure on health as a percentage of GDP has grown over time, and the is a question over the sustainability of the trend. It is not just health care, but the related area of care; adult care costs are the most rapidly increasing part of local government costs.

[@postie48]

In my understanding we achieve similar health statistics as other 'western countries' and spend about the same. There are substantial differences in some areas e.g. longevity in Japan.

[@TheEulerID]

@@postie48 Pretty well correct. We are about in the middle of OECD countries on health expenditure as a percentage of GDP and, outcome wise, we are fairly well in the middle too. Better in some areas, worse in others. Fortunately we aren't in the position of the USA that spends the most on health and has, at a population level, just about the worst outcomes.

[@michelleikoma2953]

I have heard of American friends of a very close friend of mine, the man was diagnosed with cancer, chose NOT to take treatment so his widow would not lose their home to pay for the costs. They were retired and only had Medicaid.

[@eromod]

They aught to keep telling their story till the system is made cheaper by increasing competition. That can be achieved by de-regulating so even hobbyists or vets can treat people and by giving prices upfront so people can choose the quality they can afford. The government is to blame because they make cheaper, voluntary alternatives illegal.

[@eclowe6594]

As an American too I cackled at "please wake up, but not in a hospital because you won't be able to afford it." Mostly because if I don't laugh I'll cry. Especially as someone with chronic illnesses. Also the way our insurance works for leave of absence is infuriating too. Didn't learn til recently that pre-existing conditions still have exclusions for short term disability insurance. It would be really helpful to my mental health even to be given a short leave... Full-blown case of burnout. Though that's not even a valid diagnosis in the US so it would just have to be based on my depression and anxiety disorders... But I just started this job in December 2021 and got my short term disability insurance in January 1, 2022. And since I had these diagnoses prior to January 2022 I cannot get short term disability coverage for them until January 2, 2023. Meaning if my doctor/therapist puts me off work now I just won't get paid anything... And I can't afford to do that. That would just make my mental health worse. So I'm just doing the best I can to hang in there and try to care for my burnout as much as I can... Idk that I'll make it til January but honestly I don't really have another option. The real kicker is even if the US decided burnout was a covered diagnosis and I got diagnosed with it like tomorrow, the fancy little preexisting condition clause says I'd still have to provide convincing evidence that it's a new onset disorder and not caused by the preexisting depression and anxiety disorders.

[@GreenLarsen]

Total health expenditure per capita measured in PPP international US $ (2019 numbers) US: 11,072 UK: 4,653 Healthcare quality ranking 2021 US: number 37'th best UK: number 18'th best Sources: OECD and WHO

[@ANTSEMUT1]

And there's a good chance that 40% of the cost of the American treatment is purely administrative, not necessary administration processes mind you but administration costs that are there just to nickle and dime everyone.

[@GreenLarsen]

@@ANTSEMUT1 extra admin, higher prices on drugs are prob the 2 biggest factors in this case. There are prob several other factor also, but.. all in all, if something cost more and the result is worse. That kinda scream for some kind of change (imo atleast)

[@eliskaneugebauer5338]

It's weird to me that every time healthcare is discussed it's either the all private US type or all gouvermant UK type. Like comon guys, if the idea of universal healthcare is that outrageous in the US why not try to implement something that's halfway there? Half of Europe uses Bismarck healthcare model and it works just fine, taking the best from both worlds (insurance companies are limited by the state, insurance which is mandatory is automatically payed from taxes, but because part of the private sector stays you don't have to wait months and months for a specialist etc.). Even France that has mainly the Beverage model (UK type) is to some degree affected by Bismarck politics. This 'all or nothing' mentality just ruins everything... All private model -> Bismarck model -> Beverage model and anything in between is a possibility

[@caitlin329]

We do have private healthcare options in the UK, by the way. People can pay for Bupa cover and the like. It just means that everyone has a baseline option so in theory nobody has to go without. You can choose to go private if you want to, like with schools or whatever.

[@eliskaneugebauer5338]

@@caitlin329 As you can probably tell I am not British myself 🖤 so thanks for the additional info. But my complaint still stands... Every time healthcare models are discussed it's always those two. And usually people who are for the US system use arguments that are only suitable for the other 'extreme' side of the spectrum and don't even realise there is a middle ground 💁🏻‍♀️ that's in use for example in Germany, Switzerland, Czechia and other developed European countries, therefore I always find this debate stupid and incomplete

[@caitlin329]

Grouping it all into the two categories of 'private' vs 'national' definitely ignores a lot of the nuances of individual countries' systems, but it makes the discussion far simpler. That's also why people tend to pick two or three more specific examples for the purposes of these conversations, otherwise there's way too much simplification. As you can see by the amount which isn't always covered even in the US vs UK conversation, like what I mentioned in my comment. Sometimes it's best to just generalise and present the differences like this.

[@caitlin329]

In Evan's case I think it's more his perspective as someone who grew up in the US and now lives in the UK than anything else.

[@costakeith9048]

There are lots of things that could improve the healthcare system in the US like requiring hospitals to charge everyone the same rate for the same procedures, requiring transparency in billing, requiring them to post their rates, requiring them to give you detailed estimates before you get a procedure that they are required to stick to, etc. Basically, if we applied the same rules that we apply to veterinarians or auto repair shops to hospitals, things would improve dramatically. But the problem is that there is no incentive to actually improve the system, especially by those who are hell bent on socializing medicine, because they fear that if they improve the system we have they will never get the political support to make the changes they want...but they don't actually have the political power to make those changes, so things continue as they are.

[@justinebarci1171]

Evan: ' the UK is sunshine and rainbows' 2021 summer weather 🌧

[@royw-g3120]

The other big advantage of the NHS model is a much larger (but still not big enough) focus on preventative care. So health campaigns on smoking, healthy eating and exercise. Americans would regard this as gross government intrusion on their freedom to do what they want.

[@kycrush8657]

Thanks for the video. Good thoughts, hope you get a place soon, always like your well explained points :) PS: Audio was at a lower volume in this one, the ad breaks were super jarring in comparison.

[@evan]

Audio is very consistent so I’d blame the ads

[@erikahecker6930]

I'm increasingly frustrated with the health care situation in the US to the point that I've considered moving to a different country (like the UK, but I need to research more). Currently an unexpected effect of the COVID situation was that the manufacturer for one of my medications stopped manufacturing it so they could make one of the vaccines and now there is a shortage which leaves me with out my meds. Because my medicine is the generic kind, my insurance won't cover the name brand (which we all know is more expensive) since there is a generic brand. There are options like Good Rx to have a coupon to bring the price down, but it only takes 10% off and I still would end up paying $250. Oh, and I currently don't have a job because I got let go at the end of June and unemployment is ending the extra COVID money they've been giving this week. I literally cannot afford to get the medication I need and this is not the first time I've had to make hard decisions like this.

[@joannaknight3341]

That’s insane, what medicine is it.?! In the UK we can pay £11 a month and it covers as many prescriptions as we need.

[@kayjay9516]

That’s insane, and not what anyone living in a “first world” country should have to live with. I hope you get your meds soon.

[@dingusdingus2152]

Effect

[@erikahecker6930]

@@dingusdingus2152 Fixed. Thanks

[@erikahecker6930]

@@joannaknight3341 Sulfasalazine