American Reacts Why Did Britain Lose Ireland? | The Anglo-Irish War and Irish Independence

[@corkboy4523]

The British didn’t lose Ireland, the Irish took it back, and there are still 6 counties to be taken back!

[@kennethmurphy9654]

WELL SAID CORKBOY WATERFORD BOY TOTALLY AGREES

[@ohwow5301]

Yes it was just a normal GAA match and the British army came in and shot indiscriminately into the crowd of innocent people watching a GAA match.

[@TheOrlandoTrustfull]

There is definitely no chance that this comment section is going to be an absolute clusterf**k

[@donny5530]

Bulls**t. Come at me bro!

[@matthewjamison]

@TheOrlandoTrustfull YT were on delete overdrive on this one, to stop adults talking amongst themselves.

[@seanmcmichael2551]

Conor .... if you thought that clip was hard work, just wait for the Comments ! I'm a Dublin-based Irishman (hey cuz !) who originally grew up in NI in the 60s/70s during the Troubles. I'm saying nothing .... except Happy New Year to everyone, whether British, Irish, American or elsewhere 🎉😊

[@smiley9872]

Happy New Year to you too.

[@spruce381]

DNA isn’t Irishness - Phil Lynott was Irish - it’s a cultural choice

[@12alocin]

99% of "The English", at the time were being worked to death in mines, mills, factories, and shipyards, or, when too old, dying in workhouses. Ten or twenty very rich landowners caused all the problems of that era.

[@Jake-jr2zh]

Britain lose Ireland 😂😂😂 Ireland took back what was stolen from them . Americans and their lack of knowledge regarding Irish history.

[@bill-wd7zs]

I spent around 4 years in N.Ireland as a soldier back in the 70s and early 80s. We were given brief history lessons before we deployed but it never really scratched the surface. My time there left a deep impression on me to say the least. When I got out of the army I decided to read as much as I could from both sides and to be honest it is a complete minefield. A short 30 minute vid like this is informative but I still recommend reading a few books on the subject.

[@smiley9872]

Our forefathers lived it and their stories will be brought down through the generations. I wish you well and fair play to you for having researched it. I recommend a few YT videos where the narrator does not have an English accent and perhaps a video from an Irish historian.

[@WesleyDawes-yo7dv]

ye but if scotland voted to stay they don't carve scotland into UK scotland and independent scotland, everytime there is a general election in england they dont carve the country into labour england and tory england. catholics were treated like shit and ireland voted to leave, its actually really simple.

[@spruce381]

Loads of mates here in England who served - like you, most had no clue when they were sent there. I’ve changed some of my views - Roi was a church run state up to the mid 60s and piss poor - no sane unionist would want in, but education and attracting business has made Roi, income richer and more progressive than 90% of the UK. Middle class unionists are more open to a change now. And diehard shankhill loyalists have no money or support. If it ever happens their culture of marches, bonfires etc has to be and will be respected.

[@spruce381]

Conor - repetition is one of the best tools of education - I’ve watched Ken Burn’s the west and civil war numerous times and pick up new stuff everytime - you learn naturally.

[@berniemadden9548]

​@WesleyDawes-yo7dv omg, if you were a jigsaw you would be dangerous

[@dzzope]

Ireland wasn't just subdued by britain. The lands were cleared of Irish people multiple times over the centuaries and settlers replaced them only to become more Irish themselves and rebeling. It was a massive problem even in the rulling classes. I think it was Cromwell who finally settled British rule over Ireland by litterally killing everyone he could. "To hell or to Connacht" was his declaration to the Irish. Before the "Plantations" over 60% of land was owned by Catholics, after it was less than 10% It's a long and brutal history.. Like far too many places

[@mattstacyandthepomskies]

Good point. I have a fun slice of history for you, cut down as much as I can. My village was home to a soldier who went to Ireland under the banner of his master when his master was Lord Deputy of Ireland and he commanded troops in the Irish rebellion. He then came back to England and switched to join the New Model Army. He then switched again, and took Pontefract castle for the King. He was killed for his actions. His grandparents were direct descendants of multiple Tudor monarchs, through multiple competing lines. History is very, very messy.

[@Obannion_]

You are not wrong. My family were settlers but became rebels, we are who we are. Our family history has proved us well and good, the lands were eventually taken back from us by the Irish Land Commission, we are happy with that, the bishop of Galway tried to take the land but the land commission stepped in and gave the land back to the Irish people rather than it going to the church.

[@fyrdman2185]

@@Obannion_ Back to ireland with you then paddy

[@spruce381]

Jaze, that, simplistic shit.

[@Ejej-zi4vo]

​​@@fyrdman2185make them tan Enough talk and try make them.

[@jgog59]

Just for future reference since you’re learning. The Irish government in British government do not refer to Ireland being included in the British Isles. So they say the Anglo Celtic Isles, or the British Irish Isles. Contrary to what many people will respond to this names change and it’s just out of respect. Even the queen when she visited never referred to it as the British Isles,but these Isles. The British were brutal the six counties were never supposed to be their own country.

[@spruce381]

Connor - im 30 seconds in and prickling - what made the Irish want to break away from the United Kingdom? - oppression, discrimination, dispossession, being culturally repressed - never asking to be part of the Uk - and on and on

[@mattstacyandthepomskies]

I get you. I really do. But by the same logic Cromwell also waged war on the north of England, the harrying of the north killed and displaced many English people in the north, the English people at large never asked for King James to come down from Scotland and assume the throne and the English at large didn’t play any part in the decision by the British ruling class to allow/oversee Scotland sending loads of Scottish Protestants to Ulster to displace the Irish. Funny old world, eh?

[@Ejej-zi4vo]

​​@@mattstacyandthepomskies Over 4 Million irish died in british occupation throughout 500 years The language gone and majority of the culture gone all that's left is what survived occupation Compare that too your bullsh*t in North England Cromwell burned one of the most chritian sites in Ireland and the roof too the Chapel of Cashel which was deemed a christian heritage site Churches all over ireland pillaged by british soldiers Celtic shrined and dolmen tombs were knocked some older than the majority of europe Cromwell conquest of ireland is noway comparable too his actions in england

[@mattstacyandthepomskies]

@ my other comment has been deleted so I will try again. The Cromwell you rightly despise also caused mayhem and suffering in northern England. He and his troops billeted in a barn in the village I grew up in. They surrounded the castle and the area and starved the people into submission. A colonel who had served in Ireland came to take the castle and did so by colluding with the local priest, they were both captured and Cromwell had them hanged. To this day the local church is Catholic, the local school is Catholic, the local working men’s club is Catholic, much like many other northern English towns. In the late 1800’s and early 1900’s striking miners were turned on by their own English government who sent armed troops and police to evict them from their homes. What other government turns troops on their own people? The UK government. Infamously Churchill sent gun boats up the Mersey. Ever wondered why the 1984/85 miners strike in England was so militant? That’s why. Because the workers of the north had been crushed under the boot of their own government too many times and had enough. What did Thatcher do? She sent in the paramilitary to break the strikes. Evil. Right up until the IRA made the women and children of the north legitimate targets the support for the Irish cause (and even the IRA) was high in towns like mine. I genuinely don’t think Irish people are taught this properly, just like the English aren’t taught properly about Ireland and the horrific things the British Government did. We are separated by a common cause. The people of Ireland need to reignite that forgotten memory that the people of England used to be their friends, and that the Government of the UK did things not at the orders of the general population of England, Scotland and Wales, but because they just did whatever the ruling classes wanted to do.

[@andrewwhitaker5678]

British genetic DNA is the most common, it’s just when Americans are asked for there perceived national heritage most Irish or Germans Americans would state they are Irish or German heritage where as the early British settlers would now say they simply American.

[@Ratzie01]

You should watch "The wind that shakes the barley". A truly epic film about this time period.

[@mango2005]

Technically it was John A Costello's government who declared us a Republic in 1948. But de-facto, De Valera ended the British monarchs role in Ireland (except in a few symbolic cases like accrediting ambassadors) by abolishing the Governor General (Viceroy),. the Oath of Allegiance, and negotiating the return of the Treaty Ports (3 ports held onto by the British) and the new 1937 constitution. He also ended the Land Annuities, which were repayment of loans to Irish farmers in the 1800s to buy out their landlords (many of which were absentee living in Britain). Ireland was supposed to keep paying them after leaving the UK but De Valera refused in 1933. This led to the Anglo-Irish trade war. The return of the Treaty ports in 1938 was part of the resolution to that. What De Valera did was partly possible because of the 1931 Statute of Westminster negotiated by the pro Treaty government of WT Cosgrave, that allowed Commonwealth countries to overturn laws passed for them by Britain.

[@ltbot78]

Ahh the quiet before the storm... Good luck Connor

[@smiley9872]

indeed

[@matthewjamison]

I started laughing when I seen the video he was about to watch. Thinking, buckle up for the comments 😂😂

[@JeepersCrikey-p4p]

@@matthewjamison I am sitting on my hands, but my feet are tapping. "Why did Britain lose Ireland" Britain never had Ireland except by force.

[@smiley9872]

@@matthewjamison I's about to get good!

[@matthewjamison]

@@smiley9872 🤣🤣. They're already deleting comments left & right. I've had 4 vanish so far.

[@letheas6175]

You should listen to that song called ''Come out ye Black and Tans''

[@smiley9872]

"Come and fight me like a man"

[@HaiLsKuNkY]

why?

[@smiley9872]

@@HaiLsKuNkY 'tis a lovely song, even for the unlearned. You might learn something even.

[@letheas6175]

@@HaiLsKuNkY I don't know? I like it. I'm not Irish but it's a good song!

[@matthewjamison]

@letheas6175 'Go on home British Soldier, Go on home' is another good song.

[@DavidBenson-lw4mj]

You should watch the wind that shakes barley

[@terranceaddison4599]

Im learning more about irish history....it leaves me speechless..in terms of how i feel. I know whats done is done, but HOLY SHIT..i cant ignore how it leaves me burnt up inside.. 🔥🔥

[@Ikit1Claw]

4:33 Pharaoh Con-norhotep 4:48 O'Connor 23:05 Pretty much. Police later claimed they were fired upon from the crowd, but all witnesses claimed shooting was unprovoked. Also, the date is wrong - this was in 1920. 28:09 Thats Afghanistan and China

[@dbrennan6041]

The comment made by Mr. McJibbin from 14:15 to 15:33 is the precise explanation of current policies being imposed by the supra-national trade union of politicians and bureaucrats that believes themselves entitled to pursue full political union, for themselves. I wonder why there were so many rebellions in Anglo-Irish history? I wonder why the Irish are currently being reduced to extinction by total colonisation in their ancient and only homeland by their own (EUnionist) politicians and bureaucrats? I can't comment further due to American-EU censorship.

[@kennethmurphy9654]

HAPPY NEW YEAR MC JIBBIN FROM YOUR IRISH COUSINS, KEEP LEARNING

[@DarthBill-h6f]

Ok i'll be the one the kick the hornet's nest, I had family on both sides of these conflicts and still have family who were on both sides of the troubles.

[@smiley9872]

Most of Ireland had and still has, it is mostly why we have two main political parties, FF and FG. It is what it is.

[@DarthBill-h6f]

@@smiley9872 So I've heard.

[@claregale9011]

Hi connor , very emotive subject here , you should look up Mo Molam she was instrumental in getting both sides together in talks for a peaceful end , she has stuck in my mind for some reason .

[@KernowWarrior]

She often gets overlooked, She is probably the most important person in the peace process. She managed to get them around the table and talk, she was battling cancer at the time, which I think made her more determined. If it wasn't for her I truly believe The Good Friday Agreement would never of happened. Remarkable woman.

[@claregale9011]

@KernowWarrior Absolutely she was a great woman .

[@thepoliticalhousethatjackbuilt]

The red marks on the map highlighting British control are the main urban centers of Ireland outside of the North east coast of Northern Ireland and Dublin, you have Waterford, Cork, Limerick and Galway. That red and light blue flag with the yellow star is the flag of the Viet Cong who fought a guerrilla insurgency greatly influenced by the IRA guerrilla insurgency, with the American armed forces making many of the same mistakes in Vietnam as the British made in Ireland.

[@jgog59]

The Normans became more Irish than the Irish. They were incorporated into Celtic culture Queen Elizabeth try to put an end to that. They had varying degrees of control over Ireland. They always controlled The Pale Dublin, so it was always in constant flux

[@vcrossCelticfc]

This documentary is terrible, I would recommend getting Irish history from someone from Ireland. A great author from that peroid who's dad was involved in 1916 and knew all the players is Tim-Pat Coogan.

[@Seanadun]

You're fine.learning Irish history is confusing at best of times. This coming from.svn Irish woman. Nice to know you're interested.

[@danielferguson3784]

The English were just endlessly frustrated by the Irish, & their pathological sectarianism, which you hardly ever found in mainland Britain. The fanaticism on both sides is a hangover from the religious wars of the 16th/17th centuries, but with an additional political element, with various people seeking to take advantage to enhance their own position. Ireland was never a unified independent country, but rather a collection of separate distinct kingdoms, often at war among themselves. The Normans, not the English, invaded & attempted to conquer the island of Ireland, just as they had conquered England, & moved into Scotland & Wales. It was an Irish King at war with his neighbours that invited Normans in to help him in his wars. The Plantagenets claimed rule over Ireland, with the blessing of the Pope, & ever since, until the modern state of Ireland was declared in the 20th century. It's ironic that Protestant 'Irish' American supported Catholic Irish nationalism, when most had left Ireland to escape Catholic control.

[@Ejej-zi4vo]

That's bs Roman empire was constantly under rebellion it was still an empire How come that's not the same with irish being united English out of ireland and if they don't leave they will stay here for eternity

[@matthewjamison]

In hindsight. I don't think we would ever have got the 'Good Friday Agreement' & lasting peace in N.Ireland, if the IRA hadn't took their 💣ing campaign to England's doorstep. The English have never given an inch in their whole history. I don't think they would have without that campaign. They nearly took out Thatcher's whole government in the Brighton 💣ing. I think that got their attention.

[@mattstacyandthepomskies]

Sorry but no. Just no. The IRA blowing up innocent kids in Lancashire etc was every bit as cruel and stupid as anything the British government/army did in Ireland. Why hold innocent members of the public in England to account for the actions of the government? The innocent public had zero control of or should have held zero responsibility for the actions of those making decisions. Thankfully people with half a brain eventually got the memo that peaceful negotiations would work.

[@MichaelCoIIins]

shame they missed though

[@mattstacyandthepomskies]

Blowing up innocent kids and women in England who held no responsibility for the barbaric actions of the British government/army in Ireland too? Stupid comment. Thankfully people who understand that calm, peaceful talking would create peace came to the fore.

[@matthewjamison]

@@MichaelCoIIins Indeed. I lot of English, Welsh & Scottish people would have been happy too.

[@matthewjamison]

@mattstacyandthepomskies The British Government, innocent??? 🤣🤣🤣

[@MetalMonkey]

I'm Irish and I use feet/inches. Either I wasn't thought the metric system in school or feet/inches made more sense to my young mind. Maybe I was in the middle of the change over? We used to use MPH now we use KPH. I was in school until about 1990/91

[@InquisitiveBaldMan]

Explains hes 97% British.... "Hey you use feet and inches"... Really? The only reason you use it is because you came from here.... "King Edward II of England declared in 1324 that an inch was the length of three grains of barley placed end to end" Inches were likely created by the Romans. I only wish Americans actually used Imperial correctly.

[@raybo64]

Oh dear. The best thing to do with this simpleton guide video is to consign it to the bin. There is not a Hope of beginning to understand without years of study. And the annual so called loyalist marchers could sit at the front of the class this time and learn that there was history even before 1603 and that the world did not begin on 12 July 1690, which they never even considered to remember until from 100 years afterwards. But by Christ they've made up the time since to completely numb their little minds.

[@MichaelCoIIins]

Well, lets see what you have here

[@AnnesleyPlaceDub70]

Because unlike the Scottish and Welsh we weren't taking no for an answer, we fought and gained ⅚th's of the island back, and the occupied 6 counties of the 9 county province of Ulster is governed by.....Sinn Féin. Super stuff 🇮🇪🤣🇮🇪🤣🇮🇪🤣

[@stephwaite]

Sorry Connor, couldn't watch this one. Too many painful memories. 😢

[@johngault22]

Would love you do a deep dive into your DNA journey as I have done three actual tests and used every website that let’s you upload your DNA results for them to do additional analysis and have read a lot on the methodology but still a bit fuzzy about the whole area so would value your opinions on this whole subject. Btw I guessed about you having Celtic heritage something about your name tipped me off. 😉🧐🤓

[@JeepersCrikey-p4p]

You don't need a DNA test to know you are Irish, people have moved all over Europe for 1000's of years. If you are Irish you feel it, you stand for justice and truth. Ireland stands with Palestine, proud Paddystilian here!

[@vonbeedle554]

Many Irish Gaels betrayed Ireland in the past (Kevin O'Higgins, Eoin O'Duffy) and many, many from foreign stock gave it all for Ireland (Wolfe Tone, Cathal Brugha).

[@Roz-y2d]

What a load of bollox. 🤣

[@darrengeoghegan1895]

😂😂😂😂😂

[@Irishman0855]

Amen brother

[@grimreaper1149]

What a woke comment from a 🤡🤡

[@catherinedonohue2662]

Like so many places in Europe,the place is no longer a Europian country. More likely muslim Arab, Pakistani, Indian, Brazilian, African. Anywhere but irish.

[@useall7665]

Look at the movie "michael collins".

[@declanmurphy6427]

Don't be so stupid! How could you lose something you never had?😂😂😂

[@BackroadTv2016]

Unfortunately ireland still isnt free , even tho we are independent from the uk , oir government and police force is still owned by brittish companies, what we have in irrland is called home rule, one if irelands republican soldiers basically signed an agreement and turned the brittish gun on his own people and signed for home rule instead of a free country

[@jgog59]

I would suggest you watch Michael Collins (1996) very good film by Neil Jordan. Liam Neeson Brendan Gleeson Aiden Quinn, incredible cast. The Wind That Shakes The Barley (2006) starring Cillian Murphy is incredible film. One of the best films ever made about the fight for independence and the Civil War. It was denounced on the floor of the UK parliament the British still can’t see their role in any of it

[@jedsithor]

Michael Collins is a fun, Hollywoodised movie though it's full of inaccuracies (like an armoured vehicle being used in the Croke Park massacre, different people being merged into single characters, people dying who lived etc) and Julia Roberts Irish accent is horrendous. Alan Rickman as Dev was inspired casting though (even if he is played a little colder than the reality). The Wind That Shakes The Barley is a brilliant, brutally honest film that's a very hard watch for an Irish person. Most of us only ever watch it once, largely because the pain of the Irish Civil War is something we buried as a people and didn't really talk about for decades and the film hits a raw nerve.

[@kennethmurphy9654]

Mc jibbin the british army drove into CROKE PARK and open fired on the crowd and killed 17 people including MICHAEL HOGAN A TIPPERARY LEGEND, THATS WHY CROKE PARK IS SACRED TO THE IRISH, CROKE PARK HAS ONLY 3 STANDS AND HILL 16 HOGAN STAND , ITS IRISH PRIDE , mc jibbin look into the history of the GAA

[@Ejej-zi4vo]

If you want too learn actual irish history and traditions watch brehon academy ancient ireland or irish social life They are like free lectures on old irish history and irish law pre english conquest.

[@jgog59]

Take an ancestry DNA test it’s much more comprehensive. They have a larger database. You’ll get much more specific. I think they’re on sale for 39.99 now. PS you might have London because of all the Irish that have moved there. Ancestry DNA test is better

[@jackieblue1267]

Everyone with British Isles ancestry gets places like London, Glasgow, Dublin no matter where they come from because they are large areas with people from all over. Ancestry's GCs are much more accurate.

[@DerekTJ]

In fairness, the video timeline is hopping all over the shop.

[@smiley9872]

I totally understand what you are saying around 9 mins in, it is a lot to take in. The main point is that Ireland was plundered by Britain for 700 years, once you know that, you can go on from there.

[@kevinquealey]

I think you will find that the Normans plundered England for a few centuries.

[@grantjohnston7972]

Also, at the begining you asked why the plantation happened but then proceeded to answer your own question around the 15 minute mark 😂

[@Frank788]

Ireland was & is still is part of the British Isles.

[@jgog59]

Sorry, I’m leaving all this stream of consciousness on your comments. The Irish never went along with the British foreign policy once they became a free state and were part of the British Dominion. Éamon de Valera very mixed feelings about that man. He gave too much power to the Catholic Church, which only in the 1990s lost that power. They left the Commonwealth/Dominion status in 1949 officially even though they had left psychologically 25 years earlier. England definitely try to cripple the new government with tariffs, etc..

[@conallmclaughlin4545]

22:38 yip that's exactly what happened

[@mikki3562]

Just for the record: Ireland is not in the British Isles. It is a term still used by the British to include Ireland, but it is not accepted in Ireland officially or in any official documentation. The British did agree in 1998 to desist from referring to Ireland a British isle, though it is still used mainly by the British media and politicians when they are not speaking to their counterparts in Ireland.

[@mattstacyandthepomskies]

I’m afraid you’re wrong. The British Isles is the official name for the archipelago of the many islands. This includes the island of Ireland, the island of Great Britain and many other islands some of which (like Ireland) are not part of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland (the political union). Just like the French call the English Channel La Manche (the sleeve) that doesn’t mean it is also not correct to refer to it as the English Channel in the English speaking world. I understand that it is politically sensitive to people who cannot separate the Great Britain but from the political union, or for people who misuse the terms.

[@mikki3562]

@@mattstacyandthepomskies I always find it amazing when people try to defend this aspect of British colonialism, as you have done here. Firstly, Britain and Ireland do not constitute an archipelago by any definition, and your use of that term is clearly only an attempt to disguise your otherwise crude effort or instinct, to defend the continued use of British colonial language. You also referred to the “official” term being British Isles, when in fact that is not the case, and which you would have noticed if you had read my comment without jumping into an automatic defence of what I assume, is a culture you have been brought up in. You will have to accept that Ireland has never accepted British rule and it has never accepted British colonial terminology foisted onto it, which included the possessive colonial reference to Ireland a British island. There is no reference to Ireland as a British isle in any official documentation in Ireland including school curricula. It was removed a long time ago along with other vestiges of colonisation. In 1998 the British government agreed with the Irish government to drop any reference to Ireland as a part of the British Isles. The British government accepted Ireland’s right as a sovereign country to use its own terms and titles in all respects to its place in the world. But that is not enough to erase the continued use of the possessive colonial term generally in Britain’s media and political establishment. As I said, it amazes me as to why people in Britain are so defensive when it comes to such things. But they really will have to just accept that they have been miseducated on Britain’s colonial role in Ireland, and get over it. Ireland decides its own titles in all matters not anyone else. Saying this is just politically sensitive, is quite ignorant and wrong in any case. I would advise you to understand this. In addition, since you appear to place weight on what is official, then you have to acknowledge the official reference to Britain and Ireland is one of several other terms, and not the one that you prefer.

[@mattstacyandthepomskies]

@ firstly, search your internet, the Wikipedia entry for example states: “The British Isles are an archipelago in the North Atlantic Ocean off the north-western coast of continental Europe, consisting of the islands of Great Britain, Ireland, the Isle of Man, the Inner and Outer Hebrides, the Northern Isles, and over six thousand smaller islands.” So yes, the island of Ireland is part of an archipelago known officially as the British Isles, along with other islands, which are not part of ‘Great Britain’ or the United Kingdom. Secondly, nowhere ever have I defended the barbaric acts of colonialism. I am a historian who has studied in and worked in former British colonies such as Kenya, and a member of various historical bodies, I openly call out the British government where due. For balance I will also always point out that within that the Scottish were absolutely central to the plantations in Ireland, because they were. Just as I will always point out that hundreds of thousands of Irish people displaced native North Americans in North America. Just as there were a small number of Irish plantation owners in the Americas and a small number of Irish slave owners in the United States. The little known history there is actually very compelling and only just starting to be understood. One thing doesn’t excuse another. The Irish people were victims of barbaric acts by the British Government and the ruling powers from Scotland. The Irish people had horrific famine due to those acts, and were displaced. In turn the huge Irish American society exists because they also displaced and stole land and benefited from acts in the Americas. The world is a complicated place. As I stated previously, I understand that in Ireland the term is a sensitive one, and that they use other terms as a result. As I also said this is not unusual, for example the French call the English Channel something else. But in the English speaking world the British Isles and the English Channel are still valid, legitimate names that appear on maps. I am baffled that you don’t know that the islands are an archipelago though, that’s basic geography from little school.

[@mikki3562]

@@mattstacyandthepomskies I see you have completely ignored my comments and just rushed to say the same incorrect things again in your automatic defence of British colonial culture, even though it is at odds with reality. You do not show any understanding at all of a definition of what an archipelago is, or more correctly, you choose not to. You think Wikipedia provides a definition of an archipelago? It doesn’t, and incorrectly saying there are thousands of islands making up an archipelago along with Britain and Ireland is sheer nonsense. You only need to look at a map of Britain and Ireland and then look in a dictionary for a definition of an archipelago. You will see it is not an archipelago; it is two large islands and some small islands off the coast of each island. It is not a large chain or group of islands. I’m not saying however that the British Isles does not exist. It does because the British describe their country that way, but it does not include Ireland and they have no right to call our country by a title designating it theirs in name. I have already said in my comments that the official term applying to Ireland in terms of its geographical position is not British Isles. The British government agreed to that with the Irish government in 1998. So your incorrect continued reference to it being official is something you would need to consider along with your strenuous effort at defending an offensive colonial term towards Ireland. I should add in case you think otherwise, I regard the use of the term as offensive to Ireland because it derives from British imperialist conquest of Ireland, and it has now been officially removed. You refer to its use in the English speaking world as though that made it official and legitimate. I would encourage you to acknowledge the reality that Ireland decides the titles used to describe it in all respects. Not the English speaking, Anglosphere. It is a possessive, colonial term: not geographical, not a name given by the Romans or anyone else. And most importantly, it is Ireland who decides. If you think my saying so is just being too politically sensitive, you will be wrong. I am referring to facts: historical, political and cultural in the world as it is now in our time. I can see we will not find any agreement. But I wish you well.

[@mattstacyandthepomskies]

@@mikki3562 an archipelago is a group of islands. The islands that Ireland is one of, is a group of islands. You are LITERALLY incorrect to claim that the islands on whence I lived are not an archipelago. That is a bizarre lie. As I repeatedly have said, I fully understand that to the Irish calling that archipelago ‘the British Isles’ is problematic and sensitive and as a result they call it other things but in the majority of the English speaking world if you ask someone where the ‘British isles’ are on a map they will point to the islands. If you asked them where the ‘North Atlantic Archipelago’ is (one of the names used by some) they wouldn’t have a clue. Just like if you asked a French speaking West African where ‘La Manche’ is they would know, but if you asked most people in English speaking East Africa, they wouldn’t. I genuinely have no idea how you cannot grasp this. As you you repeatedly trying to paint me as some sort of a defender of colonialism and colonial ills, that’s just ad hominem. I’ve openly told you more than once that I am open and welcoming of genuine critical review of the ills of empire, whether that be of the British Empire, the Portuguese, the Roman or yes, the mass displacement of natives by Irish people in North America, along with their kin from all the other European nations. Should we approach the REASONS for the Irish mass displacement of natives differently to that by the British, the Dutch etc, because of WHY they left Ireland? Sure. But that will never excuse it. Really KZbin comments aren’t a great place to debate the intricacies of it, I have written various papers on this from the angle of an East African resident of British birth, particularly related to the Mau Mau, so I am fairly confident of my assertion that I am not an imperialist or a defender of the British Empire’s ills.

[@spruce381]

History for non Irish - written in ten drunken minutes A version of Irish history. My short personal An indigenous culturally Celtic, Druid led people got converted to Christianity in the 5th Century, by Patrick a Romano Welsh dude. . By the 7th century monks were doing missionary work in then Saxon England, the English eventually opted for the Roman version, kinda funny later. Invaded by Vikings ( Norse and Danes) 9th and 10th. They settled mainly Dublin, Wexford and Waterford. Brian Boru, won a battle with Vikings, but many had settled by then. Late 12th century - one chieftain in a divided clan based country invited French speaking Anglo/Normans to help him out - this led to more Normans and an English idea of ruling Ireland - they didn’t and Ireland got used to Henry FitzGerald, and Gerald FitzHenry, who were loyal to their possessions - becoming more Irish…. 1601 changed everything - Northern Earls - O’Neil and O’Donnell, who had never been unconquered, did a Tottenham at Kinsale. Earls scarpered, leading to the plantation, (replacement population) by of their northern territories by mostly Scots - this comes back later. The idea of countries and nations was not on the horizon then, but folk taking your land was. 17th century also led to the zealot Cromwell beating hell out of Irish Catholics to save their souls and reduce the chance of an back door invasion. Murdered loads and exiled many to the west. Londoners inviting in a Dutch king led to him beating their former Anglo-Scots king at the battle of the boyne. Catholics and Protestants fought on both sides, contrary to what many believe. More plantation in the north east, and a little in the rest. Religious penal laws led to n English Protestant ascendancy in most of Ireland, with Catholics being disenfranchised of their previous limited rights - not allowed work for they government, or stand for Irish parliament. 1789 - France changed the world - birth of republics and seeds of nationalism. This created a thought revolution - like hippies and to a lesser extent rave, all over Europe. 1798 - Protestant led revolution - slow burn - no wifi or even telegrams 19th century, nationalism grew, emmet, dreamer revolutionary, and Daniel O,connel - Hume like fight for Irish Catholics Famine - led to huge resentment of English establishment, and the start of a sentimental, but active, bitter, Irish base in New York, Boston - they financed much of the rest 150 years. 20th century, hopefulls, but unlikely win, had uprising, not entirely popular, with Dubs and others who had relations fighting in France. The needless and stupid Kilmainham executions, changed that feeling totally. Led to post war 26 county Treaty, negotiated by Collins and others. country spilt and civil war, 6 north eastern counties controlled by Protestant, who mostly hated and feared Catholics Independence in theory for 26 counties , but controlled over time by a repressive Irish catholic clergy. No Protestant northerner, was interested in joining the poor repressive Republic. 60s - ROI had seeds of economic and social change. 6 counties had MLK inspired civil rights movement against, poor housing, job chances and blatant gerrymandering, on the late 60s. Was met with b-special (RUC branch) brutality. London sent in british troops as a buffer to sectarianism. IRA - Provos, used this, as recruiting tool, actions led to internment and more recruitment. Blood Sunday in Derry before internment did this too. Next 30 - sectarianism, bombing and shooting led to loads of horrible and celebrated shit. ROI continued to slowly slip away from the Catholic, towards education, jobs and life, using an educated populace and low tax to attract investment. Last 30. NI peace for most, apart from some deprived loyalist enclaves, who have no money or support. ROI went from 80% of Uk gdp per capita to 120%, also largely rejecting a clergy who abused and controlled. My take. Tried to relate objectively - and left out loads. My synopsis of Irish history - think it’s still too deep and detailed for the sasanachs, one take, with no spell check.

[@grlfcgombeenhunter2897]

U have a good Irish ☘️ name anyway

[@mattstacyandthepomskies]

I totally agree with the point you made about the Scots moving to Ulster to displace the locals, too true. However, you made an error in comparing that to the Falklands, as there the British didn’t displace a native population as there was nobody there. The comparison doesn’t work really. A lot of modern Scots totally forget their part in Empire, slavery and Ireland etc, and their colonial activities in South America and like to point at the English, funny old world. There was a lot of support for a free Ireland in many northern English villages, my own included. In the 1910’s Sinn Fein often came to the village I lived in to raise funds and support, as there was (still is) a large Catholic community here. However, when the modern IRA started to bomb and kill innocent men, women and children in mainland Britain in response to the British government’s actions in Ireland the support evaporated. Don’t forget, working class northern English villages often were under the heel of the British Government also, so we’re naturally allies to Ireland’s cause and held negative views of the actions of British army wrongdoings. There are heroes and villains on all sides. Mainly villains. One man’s hero is another man’s freedom fighter, but both seem to have a habit of killing and maiming innocent people.

[@dzzope]

Same goes for the Irish.. We emmigrated to the corners of the world and still do but god forbid there be a refugee center in an Irish town. In 1847 the Choctaw people sent $170 to help the Irish during the potato famine, Irish Imigrants were doubtlessly involved in removing these people from their lands. There will doubless be many comments claiming the Irish are victims but it's just history which repeats the world over. War and hate, greed and lust for power, it's in all of us(to varying degrees). One thing you probably missed from media of the time (and I don't condone the IRA targeting civilians) is that it was in response to a series of murders and disappearances either by the UVF or simply by neighbours, not to mention the actions of the British military using deadly force to put down peaceful protests and intellegence services assisting the UVF also targeting civilians. To me, that was the IRA's fall from legitimate freedom fighters to extremist nationalists/terrorists.. If they could have focused on legitimate military targets, I believe they would have been much more successful in their cause, as it turned out they just sickened everyone with their actions, showing they were no better than those they wished to surplant. As you aptly said, neither side has clean hands or a clear conscience.

[@BoyzohBoyz-ep7sz]

@@dzzope OMG! The Choctaw were very generous to the Irish, the Irish were equally generous to the First Nations during 2020 cov1d. I welcome any legit refugee to Ireland, I do not want to see so called refugees in Ireland who have a list of felonies in their own country.

[@mattstacyandthepomskies]

@ you actually make a really good point. Whilst we must recognise that the Irish were victims of appalling policies when in the union with Britain, many Irish people clearly profited from stolen land in the United States. It’s unfathomable people don’t realise this. Historians are only really scratching the surface of Irish slave ownership in the southern states etc too, it was obviously to a much lesser extent than the English, Scots, Portuguese, Dutch, Danish etc but it did indeed happen. The world is one tangled mess of slavery, invasion, colonialism and war. Tribalism in action.

[@smiley9872]

@@mattstacyandthepomskies and you are failing to untangle that mess! Keep twisting it, we know who we are, we know we are not saints, no country on this earth is without sin. The British government committed atrocities on our island, The IRA committed atrocities on the UK mainland, until the full facts are put out, it is hard to have reconciliation.

[@mattstacyandthepomskies]

@@smiley9872 I am not and have never been a politician. I am not and have never been a spokesperson for the British. I am a historian who has read in Britain and abroad and I openly call various acts of the British government out for what they are. You on the other hand are immensely defensive when others do the similar for certain groups from Ireland. By discussing the bad things a state and its actors did in history nobody is negating the suffering the same people of that state had in history. The two countries-exist.

[@Merv-q7x]

I live in Northern Ireland and grew up in the 70s and 80s and let me be clear the celt's have been skipping across from Ireland and Scotland for thousands of year's you make it sound like it was one way no there are English men and women today who are descendants of the Irish the same with Scotland today should they go back to the land of their ancestors?

[@Ejej-zi4vo]

Bs Scottland was created by irish Scott's is Latin for irish Ulster was ruled by ui neill for 3000 years before any anglo was born.

[@garymacdonald7165]

Study Celtic v Rangers!

[@adrianmeade6049]

How did Britain lose America. ..... how does that statement feel buddy?

[@jc-16.]

You cant lose what was never yours, no matter how many years of subjugation pass under your murderous reign.

[@ray1287]

You can defeat an idea

[@Craicfox161]

The ulster plantation was inevitable

[@poo2764]

Ireland is not in the British isles, it is in the Irish isles! You want to learn well here is your chance. Type into KZbin. Rory Duffy on Irish famine. Click on the video with the skull on it. Sit back and educate yourself. The British told lies about so called famine it was not a famine it was genocide. 🍀🍀🍀🍀🍀🍀🍀🍀Erin go Bragh.

[@carolinebyrne9392]

If heanry the 8th had reached a catholic then ire.land would be still part of the ik because the irish would have adored a cathlouic king Charles 3rd

[@carolinebyrne9392]

The English tried very unsessfully to civilised the irishand I do t know just why ther bothered there arse

[@carolinebyrne9392]

Because if the king had staied a catholic the irish would have put up what ever he said

[@Lubikit]

....and 25% haggis 🤣

[@spruce381]

The lad ignores the biggest event in Irish history - the famine - led to a almost country wide hatred for the British establishment. Even the educated could see cartoon portrayals of the Irish as subhuman. - the US, an embittered body of Irish emigrants in Boston, and NY sent money to Irish nationalists for 150 years - knowledge wasn’t key, hatred of Britain was That was the beginning of a widespread anti British feeling. My great uncle fought and died in France - for money, not loyalty

[@paddyneville1535]

My advice to you is stay out of it.

[@PaulVincent-n2x]

They bombed the shit out of us! I grew up in fear of being blown to pieces by an IRA (Iish Republican Army) bomb, left on a bus or a train.

[@zuppymac-xi8rk]

You do realise that the IRA only came about because of the RUC and UVF, terrorists. Supported by the UK Gov

[@henryjackson6677]

No it was just a football match. The GAA were seen as being very Nationalist

[@williambranch4283]

England didn't get me Lucky Charms ;-)

[@jedsithor]

Lucky Charms aren't a thing in Ireland. You might be able to find them in some special shops that import American brands but most people have never heard of it and those who have only know them from seeing them on American TV shows. Also, given how much sugar is in them, I don't know if they'd even be classed as a cereal here, just like Subway "bread" isn't classed as bread.

[@sbjchef]

The final battle between the papists and the royalists in Ireland has yet to be fought

[@jedsithor]

Papists? Lol the Catholic Church is disliked by Irish Catholics more than it is by Protestants.

[@kjdempsey]

The Irish smell of cheese

[@Jake-jr2zh]

You smell of ignorance.

[@adrianmeade6049]

Your name Dempsey is an Irish name.... you've just insulted your own ancestors... !!!

[@kjdempsey]

@@adrianmeade6049 my first name Kieran is also an Irish name. Half my family are Irish. The Irish simply smell of cheese, what’s your point?

[@kjdempsey]

@@Jake-jr2zh you smell of butter for some reason?

[@adrianmeade6049]

@ that’s simply not true and is a ridiculous thing to say. I am Irish I live in Ireland and know how we smell. Same as any other population in the first world. Perhaps you need to get your nose checked.

[@johnhutton5079]

@ McJibbin warch the move Michael Collins