AMMO REVIEW: NORMA Monolithic Copper 9mm in Calibrated Gel (2021)

[@tnoutdoors9]

I did make a comment here but just deleted all of it. Something to the effect of products that BY DESIGN underperform relative to penetration standards. Too much to unpack on the topic. I have no doubt that everyone will continue from where I parked it!

[@nighthowler8107]

I live in middle Tennessee too and I've found this ammo in local sporting good stores in my town. I like this ammo well and have been carrying some too, I do still like Hornady's critical defense/duty ammo better though for all defensive applications.

[@rre9121]

They are products that are designed to sell. That's what they are going for with the huge expansion and pretty petals.

[@charlesbronson9289]

I've been watching you for years. In my opinion you're the best, most consistent and detailed ammo reviewer I've ever seen. I pick my carry ammo based on your testing. Thank you.

[@madhatter6913]

Exactly why I come here. Tennessee!!!

[@themrjones]

Kentucky ballistics did a review on this ammo. All her did was shoot into a barrel of water because he knew the deal with them not expanding. With that being said I carry this ammo in .380. might burn it off at the range soon

[@justmeiswear]

You set the benchmark when it comes to ammo reviews. Very professional and straight to the point. As far as the ammo goes, this one is def a no go for me. HST’s and gold dots are still the go to.

[@warrenb8228]

Yup, HSTs all the way. Made me switch back from a .45 because the 9 was such a performer.

[@DirtyDan1]

You can argue that it had a decent wound Channel though. It would be better than nothing

[@justmeiswear]

@@DirtyDan1 Absolutely better than nothing. If anything, I would compare it closer to a FMJ round just going off what we saw in the video.

[@DirtyDan1]

@@justmeiswear but with a bigger wound

[@justmeiswear]

@@DirtyDan1 “Bigger”. Yea sorry not impressed. You may get a slightly larger wound channel but it’s not worth spending defensive ammunition money on target practice results. There’s no justifying using this for protection unless it happens to be the only option, which it’s not.

[@joshuagibson2520]

Greetings from Morgan Co, Tn. I wasn't aware of you back in the day, but I'm glad you're making videos somewhat regularly again. You're a valued asset to our community. Thank you.

[@tnoutdoors9]

Hello Wartburg

[@joshuagibson2520]

@@tnoutdoors9 lol. I'm right on the corner of Deer Lodge, but yes Wartburg is our county seat.

[@tnoutdoors9]

@@joshuagibson2520 I've been wanting to make a day trip visit to the distillery in Petros.

[@joshuagibson2520]

@@tnoutdoors9 didn't even know there was one! I'll have to check that out myself.

[@BlackTongue.]

Knoxville/Oak Ridge here!

[@baektpotato]

Nice improvement in clarity of display through the block. Always have appreciated our content both before the break and after. Thanks for your hard work and precise testing

[@tnoutdoors9]

I sliced a bit off the side prior to the "radiology" segment. Which is a statement you never want to hear while in a medical exam........

[@bannedbycommieyoutube5time920]

We should do a better job of punishing companies who advertise self defense ammunition velocities with ridiculous barrel lengths. I can’t even think of a 9mm handgun with a 6 inch barrel, and most everyone carries a gun with a 3ish inch barrel.

[@tnoutdoors9]

When I was clocking these rounds in the backyard my vocal sentiments were non-publishable.

[@nikobellic3526]

G34 17L Usp expert?? long slides exist

[@bannedbycommieyoutube5time920]

@@nikobellic3526 what percentage of people do you think have Glock 17L’s and USP experts, and what percentage carry them? There are long slide versions of 1911’s too, but it’s pointless to even talk about as the numbers are so small.

[@otm646]

The only way you are going to get manufacturers to list realistic velocities is if an international standard is instituted. Until every single ammo manufacturer is forced to test in the same barrel length and configuration no one is going to be the first to give up sales based on package listed velocities. The velocities on the package only sell to a specific subset of the consumer, everyone else who knows better will select their ammunition choices based on real world performance not what's printed on the box.

[@Throatwobbler_Mangrove]

They really should have an industry standard in labeling velocity/muzzle energy. It'd be nice to see the 2 most common barrel lengths represented for the intended use of the cartridge, for example a box of CCI mini mags listing specs for test barrels of 4" and 21".

[@MrBowser2012]

This is still one of my favorite channels.

[@beardoggin8963]

Thanks for making these tests so that we can all be more informed in our purchase decisions. I always recommend your videos when people ask me about carry ammo!

[@GrEmLiN76X]

Happy Thanksgiving to you and yours! Great to see you active again.

[@napalmstickylikeglue]

Love the review, I'll still stick with my HST's. You are the master of ammo tests!

[@stevem3605]

As always great content. I think everyone will agree that you’ve saved the shooting public a wallet full of money. That and the aggravation of testing so many self defense rounds. Everyone is glad you’re back doing what is appreciated so many. Thanks.

[@DavidLLambertmobile]

I chose to stop carrying the Winchester Ready Defense 9mm +P based on the video, low level of gel travel: 11" ⬇️. I went to Critical Duty +P 124gr 9mm in my Walther PDP Compact & M&P 2.0.

[@smithnwesson990]

Seriously I feel like it's 8 years ago with the TNOUTSOORS9 videos dropping. 👌

[@BatColonyEvictor]

Another great production! We've been wondering about this ammo for a while and now I think we'll continue with out HST and Gold Dots

[@john-paulsilke893]

Unfortunately the real choices are small. Just like .32, al your good choices are ball only and .380 is a complete crap shoot. I think those screw driver bit looking solid brass bullets are fairly decent though.

[@ConditionZero]

Great video as always. This again is one of those “better ain’t always better” rounds. Stick to Federal HST, Speer Gold Dot, or Ranger T. Not only are these proven in testing in labs but on the street as well.

[@no.step.on.snek.2423]

Sig v crown 124gr standard pressure is a contender in that category as well as federal punch..... But as the addage goes... Test what you carry, shoot what you carry, train with what you carry, and try your honest best to avoid the situation that puts it all to the test...

[@jdubz195]

Anytime I see different or new ammo on the shelf. I come here. Been watching these for years now. Best on YT! Thanks so much for the awesome content

[@pewpewTN]

The expansion sure is impressive on these when they do work. These could be good for a warm climate.

[@WeencieRants]

Gonna take a wild guess here. Over expand under penetrate at about 8". Thanks for another video! You've been uploading a lot lately hopefully this continues!

[@DavidLLambertmobile]

I'd say of recent ammunition videos, this Norma & the Winchester Ready Defense +P 9mm are both ⬇️. Stay with documented 🚔 loads: Speer Gold Dot, HST, Ranger T-T series, XTP, Critical Duty.

[@zaheerkader7426]

Still the best ammo tester anywhere.. Thanks for the amazing work

[@michaelmurphy7241]

iam glad you back i been looking for your videos thank you brother they have these online now at palmetto state armory for $8.99 box for 20 2022

[@multicammando]

The concise information and speaking about the ammunition tested is far above any other person online IMHO.

[@ItsTeezoUBZ]

Look good bro !! Good seeing an OG come back !!

[@JamesChurchill3]

I am from the UK, have no plans to move, no firearms of my own and yet I find these videos incredibly fascinating for some reason. You do good work, glad to see you're posting more regularly again.

[@tnoutdoors9]

Thank you, and your great grandfather Winston was a rock star.

[@no.step.on.snek.2423]

Man , i just want you to know the service you provide to our community is irreplacable, and uncontested. Thanks man

[@minnesotanice369]

when TNT outdoors uploads a video an eagle was born and I hear that AC DC song

[@jameskylebarretto6687]

I must praise you sir starting at 5:56. Not alot of shooter goes in depth like this. This is information we need when choosing the type of ammunition we carry❤❤❤❤❤

[@forrestthompson7209]

Just wanted to say I hope you had a great thanksgiving! Welcome back and PLEASE stay! Your ammo reviews are THE BEST I can ever find. Thank you sir!

[@donaldslayton2769]

Still my favorite ammunition reviewer, thanks for the video

[@bradeades4567]

Definitely glad to have you back. My go to for ammo ballistics.

[@haroldschrader3198]

Thank you for yet again for another awesome test. I really enjoy watching your tests very un-biased and to the point . As always it's a matter of personal choice. I use them in my EDC alternating them with the Sig Sauer JHP in my 18 mag . My choice I don't expect anyone to agree but I'm not on this planet to please other people. Keep up the AWESOME videos and stay safe my friend

[@ZEEKRAHERU1188]

💯

[@cnknguyen]

I always stop what im doing to see a new Tnoutdoors vid. glad to see a new one up.

[@mikehunt4947]

For some reason. KZbin doesn't have a notification bell for this channel but that doesn't stop me from searching and finding. As always, concise and precise review. Thanks for all your hard work, I hope you know how much your reviews are appreciated. Thanks, and stay safe! 👍🇺🇸

[@ramzankadyrov6035]

I carry these in the spring and summer out of my m9a3. They do pretty good out of that. They always expand in my testing. Anything shorter than 5” and they drop off immensely.

[@gutblaster187]

Best comment👍

[@youngboyharless9769]

Glad to have you back brother. Always liked your analysis and testing on ballistics gel. Stay safe

[@GBGuns]

We've been using this in our "What's For Dinner?" tests over the last couple years and not had any feeding issues that I can recall despite the longer length.

[@TheGreatDaneR]

"... striving our entire lives to avoid." Excellent work and commentary. Thank you.

[@thystaff742]

Love that you're back!

[@nathanmanley4203]

I'm glad to see you test this since it's one of the more readily available defensive loads I'm finding locally.

[@yadzkyboss]

I’m very glad you are posting test results again! I’m sure hot dogs and barrels of water are good test mediums but I prefer your way of doing things. Thanks!

[@LifeisGood762]

A friend of mine who's new to the prospect of using firearms defensively mentioned this ammo to me. I steered him away because of the low weight and this makes me glad I did. On the other hand thank you for giving us the straight information without much opinion beyond that it's not for you and letting folks decide what's best for themselves.

[@tnoutdoors9]

You made some very good points here of which you may not have fully realized their importance. New to firearms....those millions of people in 20 and 21 and most likely gravitating toward 9mm. Those of us like myself who had access to Gold Dot, HST, Ranger, Critical Duty and others that set the bar high. Those were the wonder years (apologies to Fred Savage) and I have great concerns they may not return. Today's new shooters have a smaller matrix of options and I have yet to really notice anything that's in the ballpark of our current "standards".

[@LifeisGood762]

@@tnoutdoors9 What's wrong with continuing to use the HSTs? The new folks don't need to use newly designed ammo. A Glock 9mm with HSTs is still an excellent standard. The golden years are still here!

[@tnoutdoors9]

@@LifeisGood762 Hope I did not imply the HST's are crap because they are absolutely top shelf, just a matter of availability on all the cited standards. I plan to retest the current rendition of the 147 HST because it has been redesigned, and possibly the 124 +P as well at some point. The 147 sooner than later depending on when the really cold weather sets in here. I do see the 147's out and about online. Related....gel test of the PUNCH is forthcoming.

[@LifeisGood762]

@@tnoutdoors9 Excellent. I'm excited for the punch gel test! I carry 147 grain HSTs currently and didn't realize it had been redesigned, so that will also be interesting. I've been finding that load in the small, impossible-to-open boxes locally at big box stores! I was so happy to see that.

[@tnoutdoors9]

Now has two cannelures and possibly changes to the skives. Rumor mill says it doesn't open up consistenly in LEO shootings. I've hit some water and clear gel with it off camera couple of years ago and can see the potential of tighter tolerances for expansion potential. Not that anything I do here is the-end all but I'm curious myself.

[@deletdis6173]

Oh, yes. The king of ammunition reviews and tests is back in business. A collaboration with ProjectFarm would be super interesting. 😀

[@garyK.45ACP]

We are thankful this season for another of your videos. I'm getting used to this. 👍

[@Cannibal_Actual]

Sure am glad the king of ammo testing is back!

[@LifeisGood762]

I just subscribed earlier today when I saw you'd started uploading again. Another great video, thank you!

[@sbumetal1]

Glad to see you finally putting out new content. Always thorough and informative. Thank you

[@whitecismale1815]

You're doing God's work. Glad to see you back after all this time.

[@NCshooter1213]

Awesome test. Thank you for taking the time to put these together. Preparing a block from Knox gel is a process in itself. Done it a few times and you sir seem to have it down pat. Thanks again for the test and info

[@davidboyd7773]

Good to see you back on my KZbin feed its been too long.

[@windzer]

Whoa tnoutdoors is back nice to see you back making vids

[@TheKentuckyPatriot]

Definite bonus points for a Burt Gummer reference lol. I hope you had a wonderful Thanksgiving. God bless you and yours :-)

[@l.peytonadams8570]

You are keeping up your high quality videos. Glad to see it.

[@pkobalt]

If it's in your budget/time, please consider getting a lone wolf barrel. I think it might be interesting to see the velocities of these things out of the long test barrels and see how the numbers hold up there.

[@wetdog5299]

Or out of a pcc

[@cuddzilla]

It's sooo good to see your new content!

[@mathewdostal2180]

I’ve missed your content thank you for bringing us this wonderful information and entertainment.

[@johnnybagofdoughnuts4193]

I’m still in the Underwood Extreme Defender camp as far as monolithic copper bullets go. I wonder if that philips’ head technology could be put in a rifle bullet?

[@tnoutdoors9]

The Underwood Defender is probably the only copper bullet I would consider carrying. Edited to add.....I would expect a Phillips rifle bullet to have a horrible ballistic coefficient.

[@fruitfarmfords8243]

They have them in rifle calibers too. On their site

[@joemoment-o1275]

@@tnoutdoors9 Social regressive put the .357 in the 350L and gets 3K fps 90gr

[@johnnybagofdoughnuts4193]

@@fruitfarmfords8243 they have rifle ammunition, but not with the Phillips head looking technology

[@fruitfarmfords8243]

@@johnnybagofdoughnuts4193 Actually, you CAN get the "phillips" style bullets in .429" .452", .458"... sooo.. .458 socom, .450 bushmaster, .444 marlin, .45-70 govt.

[@EastCoastMan603]

We thank you 👑. God bless 🇺🇸🙏🏻

[@shkotayd9749]

You remain the go-to for ammo reviews!

[@garrettstephens91]

I really enjoy this old school IWBA/FBI test. Keep it up!

[@moshedayan9049]

These are the videos that i look forward to! Thank You!!

[@Rvp5150]

Kind of seems like a “novelty” type of ammo. I’ll stick with my Hornady Critical Duty and Speer Gold Dot when I can find them! Glad you’re putting on fresh content!

[@Dealer23Golf]

Great review as always! Glad to see you back at it.

[@jefflovell3137]

Definitely got a new subscriber. Great content and honest as they come.

[@toddford2323]

Tommy, it so good to see you doing well. I hope you and your family have an awesome Christmas and holiday season!

[@tnoutdoors9]

Hello Todd

[@alphawolftactical160]

So glad, you're back at it. Go Vols!

[@roosterboy7357]

This is one I’ve been waiting on. I know this stuff is supposed to be extreme on expansion and when it comes to a living body and gel, there’s a difference. That small cavity is a bit of a concern though Edit: Just get you some 124gr HSTs 👍🏼

[@SoWavvyy]

I use the 124 +p HST's I have the 147 but I don't trust them due to low velocity.

[@Wabaanimkii]

Holy smokes you're looking a lot better, thanks for the vidya!

[@servererrorpleasetryagain2707]

Thanks! Always appreciate your thorough reviews.

[@PapaDon850]

I keep a couple mags of this for both my 9mm and my my .380 cal. I normally carry 9mm 124 grain Sierra JHP. Thanks for the video!

[@roykiefer7713]

TN - It is ALWAYS great to see a new ammunition evaluation from you, they unfailingly are outstanding, and your return to KZbin is heartening. I have fired a lot of NORMA ammunition in the last 50+ years and, in general, I believe it is s excellent. However, imho this simply is another “gimmick” contender in the 9mm Luger defensive marketplace. It did not expand consistently, and higher than normal velocity - with reduced mass - is very likely to provide marginal penetration. FWIW, monolithic copper bullets can work very well; for example, Remington marketed a Barnes TSX “Hog Hammer” in .223 that was really good, however, this this all-copper bullet doesn’t appear to be at all well “system engineering integrated” with the cartridge’s other attributes.

[@stevemoore6812]

Greetings from the PPRC, love your videos. THANKS

[@thomasburns4034]

“My personal edc criteria carry a higher value proposition .” Very well said !

[@Adam_B_Shooting]

Great video. Less than great defensive ammo though. I appreciate you taking the time to educate us on various types of defensive rounds. I'm waiting for something to come along that will make me want to switch from carrying Underwood Xtreme Defender 90GR +p+ 9mm. Love that round, but also curious on what else is out there.

[@Werepie]

Federal HST is pretty hard to beat, and just less than $1.00 on Optics Planet (for the 50 round box, at least) I believe the "Defend" half of Winchester's "Train and Defend" beat it in the OP's testing, but it was a very close second place

[@turnermerrell4000]

Great video as always. Have you tried a brighter larger light on the gel block something like one of the new crazy bright shop lights? That may help increase visibility or perhaps quite the opposite and make it so the camera can see a darn thing. Thank you for your fine work

[@cpprcrk1833]

Wake me up when someone invents a bullet that's better than HST's . Always nice to see you posting TN9 .

[@danichicago9140]

You sir are a National Ballistic Treasure!

[@johngifford7725]

"hyper ammo". I'll stick with the Remington green and white box 115grn JHP for 9mm. It works, and I can afford it. Winchester White Box 115grn ball is close enough to practice with when I can't. Great video. So glad to see you posting these again. You are fantastic.

[@chrissewell1608]

I am so glad you reviewed the Norma Ammo. I love the big blossom of the bullet, but was disappointed to see that it did not consistently expand. And as you said, when you factor in clothing and bones... the results can change! I wonder how well, a few Tennessee Oak, tree limbs would simulate bone, for testing purposes? But... if you really want real bones, just save some ribs after a Saturday BBQ?

[@tnoutdoors9]

There is a peer-reviewed medical article published citing oak as a viable replacement for bone. A few years ago I tried (off camera) the SIMBONE plates from Switzerland and it was just similar to shooting plastic tiles. The only suitable representation for bone is live bone, not dead.....therefore I'll probably avoid that aspect entirely.

[@chrissewell1608]

@@tnoutdoors9 Interesting stuff. Thanks.

[@shoxroxice]

I have been looking at these, and was so pumped to see a TNO9 review on them. While they may be great for some circumstances, they don’t seem to fit my need. I can’t wait for your next review.

[@waynehead7271]

Definitely not something I would consider for cold weather carry. I do believe in seasonal adjustments to ammunition, just as much as I do for my O.S.Bag. Now for warmer temperatures, where over penetration is a concern in public, these might work well enough. 😉

[@noahmercy-mann4323]

I appreciate that you mentioned momentum, and didn't harp on energy. I have never seen a foot pound stop or kill anything, rather the bullet must reach major blood vessels or organs, large supporting bone structures, or the central nervous system. When it gets there, it needs enough diameter to do some damage, and that can be via a large bullet starting out or one that has expanded. Almost none of the super-light bullets have the ability to accomplish this and it's why I lean towards "middle-heavyweight"-for-caliber bullets in my defensive and hunting ammo.

[@BLACKRIFLEREVIEWS]

Outstanding good Job I enjoyed it.I would like to see you Review the CCI Segmented 32 grain at 1640 its like a Stinger with a segmented bullet again with clear ballistics gell.

[@joshuabrown4030]

That's fascinating. I usually would expect very deep penetration by monolithic ammo, often with expanded petals completely detaching around the 7"-9" mark and the core travelling quite deeply - which might be bad for permanent cavity of the main slug or good for multiple wound channels, depending on point of view. This expanded terrifically - like in the range of a really good 45+p load - and all stayed together but had poor penetration overall. Tbh I wonder if they'd reduced the petal cuts a little or added some more weight to the bullet base if this wouldn't have been a really nice round. As it is, I can't deny being amazed by the expansion, but it might not do so well at an oblique angle shot... clogging looks like a problem too. Still, it's a cool concept, and might really go somewhere with a little more tuning. I remember where hollowpoint performance was in general back thirty years ago and it's come a long way, I have a feeling copper slug technology will have a ways to advance, too.

[@kingbaldwiniv5409]

Thank you for pointing out the "tested out of a 6" barrel" bit.

[@NickBlazer-cf1vs]

Sweet video. Just paid 8$ for 20. Had to buy 10 boxes. My box says out of a 4” barrel.

[@GametimeSlime]

PSA I know cause I’m getting some this week 🤣

[@aklover2660]

He lives!!!

[@flightparamedic505]

Great video Tommy! Yeah, as predicted, this ammo blows.

[@chuckfinley3152]

Always nice to see a tnoutdoors vid

[@todd5082]

Thanks for testing. I’d like to see a test of your top 3 favorite ammo (same caliber) in a side by side comparison. Then present the “TNOutdoors9 Trophy 🏆 “.

[@chrissanchez9935]

Thank You for this technically detailed video, just like your past videos. Thank You.

[@stellocut99]

There is some advantage for over penetration. Such as when shooting through a wall or car. Even through the windshield of your own car.

[@chrisknight174]

Norma seems to be dirty ammo too. I picked up 100 rounds of FMJ for a quick trip to the range and my gun was dirtier than when I shoot three out four times that amount of American Eagle. I do a thorough clean after every trip.

[@calcosPR]

DUDE I thought the same thing. I can shoot 700 rounds of Tula out of a pistol on an all-out range day and I know it'll have some pieces of powder around the spring, and some graying on the muzzle and chamber, but I took the norma fmjs to an indoor range to shoot like 250 rounds and later went to clean it and was horrified at the amount of gunk on it, not even unburnt powder, more like caked-on coal dust. Cleaned relatively easy tho, so it does what it says on the tin, just clean your tool

[@jonahpatton8879]

No mention of the under penetration on the package eh? "I feel I've been denied critical, need to know information" -Burt Gummer

[@amalfi460]

I will stick with my gold dots…..thanx for the great review as always

[@chiraqkingkushman2087]

Thank you very much friend for the video I was thinking about picking em up but didn't know cause the weigh and you said it best you have alot of non expansion on copper bullets

[@alexcastillo4317]

You're out here doing God's work. Thanks for doing these.

[@frankhinkle5772]

Thanks for that. I only learned about NORMA MHP today, seeing .380ACP on sale at a sporting goods chain. I'm leery of "new" ammo for self-defense. I prefer stuff that's had a proven track record of 10-years or more. Good test and opinion.

[@heroofharo]

Could you start molding a rack of ribs into the gel going forward? More typical winter gear (a section of the typical fluffy winter jacket, a shirt and undershirt) going over it would be interesting too. I know it's not the fbi standard, but I feel like a shirt and under shirt with ribs would give us the most accurate assessment for summer, and that fluffy jacket would be ideal for winter demonstration purposes.

[@davidwd62]

Glad your back

[@TKCL]

Love these tests.... But I've yet to see anything to make me consider switching from HST ammo in my daily carry.

[@nighthowler8107]

awesome!! I've been waiting for this test, been carrying this ammo for a while now and i like it pretty well

[@frankunderwood798]

Glad you are back and thanks for the work. But just a suggestion… is there any chance you can use the brown gel and cut open like the old days? Or even cut open the new gel? It is very hard to see the wound track.

[@tnoutdoors9]

I do not foresee returning to SIMTEST. I reached out to CORBIN's a few months ago and it was backordered indefinitely. That is when I decided to begin exploring 10% gel. SIMTEST seemed to be reasonably close to 10% gel results. I'm also not so much focused on the wound track; it just isn't that relevant in any type of gel when the focus should be the test outcomes.

[@shauen24]

Great Vid TN-!- Keep um coming.!. Miss your Vids-!-