Analyzing Analyzers (

[@daveN2MXX]

100% nanovna...best cost vs benefit. Also very small for portable use.

[@kenhagler7166]

They're also quite easy to use as an antenna analyzer. Just watch a five or ten minute KZbin video showing you how to do it.

[@davep6977]

I agree, NanoVNA all the way for me. Had the MFJ and got rid of it. Too clumsy for me. You can tune as Dave said, but I can set the nano for 100Mhz to 200 and see the swr dip and if there are any other dips. (You can see the performance of a dual band antenna on one screen). Then you narrow it to 140 to 150 and see the lowest swr as well as the antenna bandwidth and watch the graph as you tune it. I've hooked it to my shack antenna when the swr went up to see if there's a problem or if it shifted because of rain or something. For me, the best tool I ever got. W9DLP

[@AugurIliKur]

Kinda overkill for SWR since you have to calibrate it at least 3 times for every use. But it is amazing if you need any of the other functions. When I worked servicing repeaters and pagers we had to lug around a HP 8920 communications test set. That's basically a 5U rack with a handle full of lead acid batteries, a heavy CRT, and instruments. Now I can slip a NanoVNA and a HackRF Portapack into my pocket with an adaptor kit and take over the world.

[@kenhagler7166]

@@AugurIliKur You only have to calibrate it once, and then you can save the calibration. I've found that you don't even need to reload the calibration, presumably because I never use it for anything else or let it run out of power so it retains that calibration.

[@marksalyzyn2344]

Dave said about the NanoVNA "They are always changing the firmware", when he should have said "wow, you get to change, if you want the firmware to capture new features and functions". For example, it already works as a 50Khz to 1.5Ghz CW Signal generator out of box, but one can control the drive current on the oscillator chip and add AM modulation, or add FM/PM modulation by shifting the frequency slightly, so one can tune the front end and IF stages on your reciever. "Wow, the code is open source, I get to add this if I want"

[@daviddurflinger3104]

You know David your videos are awesome they are straight forward and easy to understand, you are a benefit to the ham radio community, keep up the great work, AI7VS Dave Arizona 👍

[@angeldelvax7219]

About the nano VNA: I'm by no means an expert, and it really does have a steep learning-curve. For me though, I bought one because of my low (or non existent) budget, and I'm not disappointed! It really does a LOT of things. BUT.... It's not a perfect measuring tool, like the antenna analyzers shown here. I would definitely NOT recommend it for somebody who doesn't know how to use it, of doesn't have any use for it other than measuring SWR. It's really too hard to learn for just that single use. If you are building your own radios though, it becomes more useful for, amongst others, measuring filter response, cable interference, things like that. Even then, I'd suggest to use it only as a rough guide tool. Save up for better and more precise equipment. But that's just my personal findings after using it for some time. As I said, I'm by no means an expert ;) (PD7RAD)

[@jwerp0]

The rig expert also connects to your computer with the supplied USB cable. You can then save the graphs, print them out etc. 73 WA8MDC

[@IW4DBX]

My little about it, just because I have one of those cheap nanovna. It takes a learning curve because it is very complex but great tool to test rigs. Fortunately youtube have plenty of videos and I've been able to use it from the very beginning in the right way. Last word to thank Dave for his wonderful explanations that make easy this precius intriguing hobby. hugs from italy and 73s iw4dbx

[@gregmihran8616]

For me, the RigExpert AA-230 ZOOM is all I need for antenna analysis and tuning (and I also own the MFJ 259C and Comet CAA-500 M2). Not only is the RE user-interface and the graphics the best IMO, the ZOOM feature is amazingly useful when looking for resonance in- or out-of-band. Dave was mistaken in his comments and perhaps doesn't understand the RE zooming function - I use the RE up/down arrows constantly: zoom-out (up arrow) to find the resonance if it's out-of-band or zoom-in (down arrow) to identify a more accurate and specific resonance frequency in-band. I also own the RE Stick and use it primarily for portable ops in the field. 73 KJ6ER

[@tpcdude]

Some of the antenna analyzers (including the MFJ 269) do not have enough RF power to work through my 590' open fed delta loop and balanced tuner. Another thing to be careful about is to not leave the analyzer connected to an antenna when transmitting another nearby antenna it can fry the input stage even if it is powered off.

[@nathanhaltman7235]

Mighty Fine Junk........Research return loss, dynamic range, output power (tracking generator), out of band rejection, port calibration, time domain reflectometry, 2 port VNA,......

[@williambouchard4480]

I would like to add that there is a great book put out by the ARRL, Understanding Analyzers, that I think is also very helpful. I have the same Rig Expert analyzer that you have Dave and it is very nice, however, I find it a little complicated to use and I definitely have to refer to the manual. I also have the Comet antenna analyzer Mark I I with digital and analog display and I like it very much. The reason I bought it is because it will work up to 500 MHz. I will add that is only an antenna analyzer and will not check any feedline like your MFJ. The MFJ 359 series will check up to to 440 MHz if you need to check antennas in the higher frequencies. A great video. Keep up the good work. N3EDO.

[@rodneyjohnson4794]

i have that book. love it!

[@kenthufford743]

Buy an Analyzer, or have a friend or ham club that has one. The MFJ 259-269 have been around for years and work fine. The NANOvna's are cheap and work, but are a little confusing to work with. The Rig Experts's are great, but not cheap.

[@jackK5FIT]

Another great video with clear explanations. I considered the MFJ analyzer but decided on a nanovna just for the cost. The learning curve is steep (especially when you're older) but I have it set up as an swr meter and have successfully tuned several antennas including a 40M inverted V, a 20M vertical with counterpoise and a hamstick dipole. I may still go with an MFJ but for now the nanovna gives me enough to tune with.

[@peterromeo9786]

The Rig Expert analyzer will read “outside of band“. Just zoom out and it will plot across all bands.

[@forgetyourlife]

Rig Expert sends him the aa-230 and now wishes they didn't. It says ZOOM right on it!!!

[@KevinMaxson]

You can also use the arrow keys to change frequencies just like you’d use the dial on the MFJ.

[@TheNoCodeTech]

good information

[@batica81]

I agree that NanoVna is not as easy to use, and I am still "a fool with a tool", but for 45usd it is very helpful instrument, both for measurement and learning.

[@firepark32]

Love my 230 zoom. Couldn't justify an extra $200 for the AA-600 just to add 440, but other than that it's a dream to use, especially if you spend some time to learn use the functions/shortcuts. The bluetooth option is nice, as it lets you take more then 100 samples when doing things like SWR charts, and you dont have to lug a laptop around.

[@9999plato]

The nano vna works fine as an SWR meter. It takes 10 20 minutes to get set up for each band you want to look at. Mine is set for the entire HF band at once and then I have settings for smaller sections of various bands.. I don't use the more intricate readings like the Smith meter or reactance. It does take about a minute to make a fresh sweep and give you a fresh picture and in that respect these pricey meters are probably faster but no better. The nano VNA can do many things above my needs and perhaps you will grow into them. It is a precise scientific measurement device.

[@jaysmall8780]

Another great video! I have one on a switch, so I can "fine tune" with my antenna tuner without sending a carrier where the net I want to work is. Great for Band Hopping with a G5RV or other non resonant antenna. Jay K7WLE

[@HitchHiker4Freedom]

My best buy was a Rig Expert Stick. Worth every cent for building antennas.

[@Roddy1965]

Yes, it's helped me diagnose and tune antennas big time. I am sure I would have stressed my rigs without it. Rigs cost more money than analyzers.

[@forgetyourlife]

want another one? I went back to the aa-55 after the stick 230.

[@HitchHiker4Freedom]

@@Roddy1965 Exactly. Cheaper to have one then to replace burned up radios. I like building my experiments from scratch. SWR meter just won't cut it. I want to see the whole picture.

[@Roddy1965]

@@forgetyourlife I'm not 100% on the Stick interface, but when you hook it up to a laptop, it's very easy to use, and I really love it. The mode where you just push a button and it finds the best resonant band is pretty good and easy, though. I love the aa-50 etc. A friend has one.

[@forgetyourlife]

@@Roddy1965 yeah, I never plugged it into a pc. It was outdoor use only for me which is pretty limited.

[@kevinkc3onohelijeepworld953]

Rig ex are great but expensive for tool that sits around most of the time. I say any amateur can learn the few calibrations you need to do on a nano vna to get it to operate as a ant analyzer. It’s rather easy and you need to calibrate the rig ex if you want to measure twin lead. And if you want to isolate you coax out and just measure the ant on a rig you need to calibrate aswell. Yes you pay 350 for convenience of a two button or knob dedicated analyzer but with all they can do so much more then just tell swr. They can measure impedance. It’s a valuable tool. I don’t own the expensive ones just a basic 2.8” nano vna and I love it made adapters and it’s just as good as one of the others 😉😉 and it saved me 300$ to sit in its box ☺️waiting for the next balun I wind or ant project I want to explore. Nano is easy and menus are easy 2 hrs and I knew enough and a few more vids and it became a necessary tool

[@bentrider1972]

I use a iPortable iP60z Antenna Analyzer..small light and works great for my portable qrp fun..have built a lot of dipoles with it and as kept my buddi stick and buddipole tuned perfect :D

[@TestSpaceMonkey]

Once you get used to the menu system and calibration on the NanoVNA usability is not an issue. I would suggest that it's worth getting one of the nicer models (30-40$ more?) with a fully-enclosed case and UHF connectors. I've worn out the SMA connectors on mine after less than a year and I'd hate to drop one of the little basic ones with open sides in the dirt when working on an antenna outside.

[@ChipEckardt]

If you join a local club chances are the club, or a member, can help you for free. Most club members love to help other hams.

[@Gator_Bait_Motorsports]

I have the Comet CAA-500 Mark II. I love it. It is 1.8 to 500 MHz. A little more expensive unit, but taken care of, will last longer than you will. Very easy to use and versatile. Just another option. I understand the money factor, as I am retired, living on SS, so I have to stretch me money too. I love tinkering with new antennas to try new things, so I can justify spending the money. I am spoiled by it now, and wouldn't be caught without one. WA9H

[@opticalman1jeffkeokro741]

Hi Dave, great video. I, like you have both the MFJ and the Rig Expert. Many times I use both on the same antenna project. I always take the Rig Expert along when I use the Buddy Pole to check set up. They are a very important tool if you like to experiment with antennas. Keep up the good work hope to see you Thursday night. Jeff KE0KRO

[@dren2jdh544]

I have the MFJ 269C. The D has extended frequency below 160. Unless I have a radio that goes that far, the 269C covers all the radios I have. Like i said, not below 160 and anything about the police/EMS bands on 70CM, I really don’t need. I have stock antenna from ambulance builds. So 160-6m, 2m, 1.25m and 70CM is fine for me. I do want a digital one to learn more about the smith chart.

[@MrJaz8088]

If your Build Antenna's then Yes, as knowing how far your really off in ohm's and how much reflection helps so much in getting the SWR right, if you are putting up a Ready Made, then SWR is enough, the cheaper Chinese copies like the AW07A works well, mine's been running for 4+ years, or the cheaper SARK100 ANT works, if you had the Money then one than can scan the band aswell

[@mrkattm]

I have the MFJ-227, the ninivna and the nano vna. I would recommend the minivna tiny by mRS over the nano VNA and over the dedicated antenna analyzers MFJ, like you said the dedicated analyzer are one trick ponies, the nano vna is really just a toy but is getting better, the mini is a fully mature product and simple to use out of the box.

[@Mike-H_UK]

IMO, I think that you are being bit unkind about the nano VNA. Although it has its failings as Dave pointed out, it is a lot, lot more than a toy and I've found mine invaluable in a number of problem solving applications.

[@JohnSmith-bb2np]

Their "how to buy" tab has 3 links to sellers that don't carry it, or don't have a page for it. That's not a good sign about the product you are recommending.

[@Roddy1965]

Without a VNA, you're just looking for black cat in a black room, at night.

[@miketessitore6987]

Dear Dave, I have to get something off my chest. That top shelf behind you has a couple of pieces of radio technology with the front feet hanging precariously over the front edge. It's driving me crazy! My therapist said that I should contact you and express my concerns. Is it possible to put a deeper shelf? Thank you, K2MJT.

[@buzzsah]

I have the rig 230z and find it to be worth the money. If I were to buy it again I'd buy the 600 or 1000

[@NoiseWithRules]

I have several vector network analysers. They all need 'calibrating' before use. The MFJ doesn't, so it is quicker to use. I don't have one but have used one. It only works on one frequency at a time. Seems old-fashioned and clunky to me. Most VNAs scan a range of frequencies and graph their results. They differ in the number of points they graph and the frequency range they scan. They need 'calibrating' before use, for every different frequency range. Often they allow for a commonly-used calibration to be stored. My favourite is the 'Sark 110'. It is very small and lightweight, also looks very good! It covers all the frequencies I'm going to use up to but excluding 440MHz. It is easy to use, does more than you can reasonably expect and is very accurate (given accurate calibration!). It is expensive. And you need a set of calibration standards, not supplied. Good calibration standards are not cheap, either - they go from pricey to eye-wateringly expensive. The frequency scan is as wide as you want and it captures enough points to make a good graph. For example, you can set it to cover 1.8 to 29.7 Mhz, average each data point over several measurements, with a delay on starting the scan. Attach it to the feed point of the antenna (remember - small and light), press the start button and haul the antenna into the sky. Come back after half an hour and collect the results - both as an on-screen graph (option to download the screen as a bitmap) or download the data points. This 'deep scan' mode can collect 10,000 data points, so even a complete HF scan gives enough detail to show up any problems. The data format is a standard CSV file so is easy to import into spreadsheets etc. Some applications can use the file directly - such as SimSmith. There is also a 'Sark 100'. It is cheap. I have one. It isn't accurate - there are fundamental problems lurking in the firmware. Not recommended! I have several NanoVNAs. They are very cheap! Cheap enough to buy several, with different connectors. I have SMA and SO239 versions. Some come with calibration kits included - beware some of the SMA standards don't have proper connectors and will wear down your sockets quickly. The major failing of NanoVNAs is the small number of data points in a scan, max 110. However, there is PC software allowing you to stitch together several scans under PC control. Good but not practical on a windy, rainy antenna field. One advantage over the Sark110 - they are 2-port devices so can measure through filters etc. The Sark is a 1-port analyser - fine for analysing antennas but can't handle filters. I have some 'analogue' instruments too, 'noise bridges', 'return loss bridges' etc. They are much less accurate, are slow and difficult to use and have few redeeming features. They languish at the back of a drawer somewhere. Why bother? A simple 'SWR meter' is a useful monitor in your feed-line. Everyone should keep one in circuit in case something drops off your sky-hook. It tells the 'magnitude' of any mismatch. What it misses is the 'phase' of the mismatch. You can't tell if a problem is due to mismatched resistance or reactive impedance. A VNA (or even the MFJ analyser) will give the solution quickly. 73 de M0PTB PeteS

[@jamespence48]

Good video. Gave up on my nanovna.

[@joerogers4227]

I use my antenna analyzer to check coax after I crimp new connectors. By using the TDR to measure length in both directions I know the other end connector is ok

[@garrysekelli6776]

Whats a TDR?

[@g0fvt]

@@garrysekelli6776 it is a Time Delay Reflectometer, in simple terms you can measure the delay between sending a pulse and then receiving the reflection. If you know the velocity factor of the cable you then know where the reflection is originating.

[@garrysekelli6776]

@@g0fvt ah. Cool. So it works by sending electricity down the wire but in pulses. Then a separate part of the machine measures how much the wires heat Up.

[@g0fvt]

@@garrysekelli6776 Heat is not a factor with measurement, think of it about like radar firing down the cable then waiting for the reflection.

[@clems6989]

Time Domain Reflectometer. measures coax length by sending a pulse down the cable and measuring the time it takes to reflect back. and calculates the length.

[@patdbean]

Are analyzers a good thing for a club to own? Because how often would any one person need to use it?

[@kenhagler7166]

If the person has a magnetic loop antenna, or a Buddipole, or some other antenna that needs to be fiddled with when you change bands (or even frequencies for those loops), the answer is "constantly."

[@patdbean]

@@kenhagler7166 yes, true.

[@scottfulton159]

I recommend a MFJ 223

[@paulriley4566]

Hi Dave, can you please help. I have a rig expert Aa55zoom and a stick pro that I have used to check my antenna SWR! MY Confusion is that with both rig experts I obtain 1.6 / 1 But when I use the Icom 7300 in built SWR Graph that plots as you key the mic I see an SWR OF 3.O / 1 ?.? Why would this be the case, portable isolated meter shows a 1.6 Icom says 3.0. Love watching your videos. Very informative VK4PRO AUSTRALIA (Paul)

[@Rickm505]

That MFJ is obsolete. NanoVNA goes to over 1GHZ and shows an entire band at one time. Nano is accurate, cheaper and better

[@farmcat3198]

It sounds like you may have a pet bird in the background. If so, what kind?

[@TheRetiredtech]

Do somepre research the nano is outstanding..

[@TheRetiredtech]

Nano VNA 30 bucks best in class

[@kbell101]

Certainly cheapest in class. The form factor and ergonomics of the Rig Expert are much better for field work. I own both and use the Rig Expert when climbing around on the museum battle ship my club works from. I use the NanoVNA in my home shack

[@nathancross405]

Feels a little like an ad for MFJ. The nanoVNAs have a learning curve but are more powerful and flexible. Ham radio has a learning curve too. The firmware “issue” is not really an issue unless you upgrade the firmware which is not necessary. Pick a version learn it and stick with it. I really appreciate all of Dave’s videos but I feel like the argument here for old technology is somewhat artificial and spurious.

[@bobrigg1429]

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