Antique British military swords: 1827 pattern Rifles officer's sword

[@britishmuzzleloaders]

Enjoyed that Matt. I admittedly, do not have much knowledge on the subject, but the more you show the swords from the 19th century, the more taken I am with the graceful curve of so many of the blades.. I get (perhaps) why the Cavalry eventually went to the straight blade (as a simple extension of the horse and man) but I can not rectify the same kind of logic to the adoption of the '92/'95 (the dates escape me, but I refer to the straight pattern of the late Victorian to the modern day) pattern Infantry sword.. Surely there would be more opportunity to fence in a foot based melee... and therefore the ability to cut and thrust would seem, to my untrained sensibility, advantageous... These swords (like the Rifles' example you show here) seem much more capable blades than the later variants... Thanks.

[@rhysfitter1561]

It's a strung bugle. It's not a powder horn! Rifle regiments and light companies used to communicate on the battle field with bugles instead of drums( being too cumbersome for rapid movement, due to their roll as skirmishes in front of the line regiments) Also the reason why they march at 140 paces a minute, carry no colours, green (camouflage) uniforms and carry the rifle at the trail( hanging at their side) Just thought I would add that in. Great videos BTW

[@Forde1980]

I always enjoy these videos on antique swords and learn a lot - thank you. Those sabres are in gorgeous condition.

[@CodyandSteveDownUnder]

G'day from Australia mate. A quick story for you. I make Australian Light Horse videos. I have been blessed quite a few times now by people who appreciate my 'old man' 'low-tech' stories of the Light Horse history very kindly donate items to me. Just today I was given a sword by a family who had owned it since 1916. They had no idea what the sword was. I've spent the day researching it and it is a Robert Mole and then I found this video. Wow. Many many thanks cobber as I now know it is not only a 1827 Pattern Rifles Officer's sword but was made after 1845 AND it is one of the slightly smaller, shorter light weight ones. This video was priceless in identifying this sword and the family who gave it to me will be delighted. Cheers cobber, ripper effort mate. And yes, I subscribed.

[@CastIronSteak]

My favorite youtube scholar! Never has learning random bits of esoterica been quite so enjoyable! And don't discount the light, quick, snappy dress swords too readily (assuming they are well made, of course!) It might lack the ability to cleave to any great degree, but snapping fast cuts to wrist and then neck can take down an opponent quite readily, I have no doubt!

[@draco00]

Keep these coming Matt!

[@joejoelesh1197]

Given the breadth of your knowledge, I think you could make a very interesting video on Military organization during the Napoleonic Wars.

[@tasatort9778]

Thanks Mat! I learned something here today. I've seen knives with the "T" beam or pipe back design before but haven't seen any swords done that way. To be honest however I haven't paid much attention to single edge designs.

[@naturesoothingbeauty286]

The bugle and crown on the sword are specific to the British Indian army piffer units.... Like 57 Wildes rifles

[@benkeiller6560]

You mentioned that you were getting more involved with TV shows and things. You should go on an episode of Antiques Roadshow and bring _all_ of your weapons. Every single one of them, and dump them in a big pile in front of them. The expressions on their faces would be priceless! XD

[@CorySee]

I still want to see that short black handled blade (4th up from the bottom on your wall). PLEASE tell us about it! I love smaller swords like that. Great video matt, keep em coming buddy!

[@intrepiddevildog]

This pattern 1827/45 was used as a non regulation US army officers sword during the civil war. Many people think it is a model 1850 but it is not.

[@yermanoh]

hi all in terms of cost, how much would a new sword have set back a young officer and would there a big price difference between standerd non custom officers sword against a standard issue sword. thanks

[@MountainStreamSwordDude]

That heavily curved saber by the gauntlet sword is gorgeous! Care to show that one off at some point?

[@davidbradley6040]

Is the hole/dent in the ricasso for locking in the scabbard?

[@northwestmartialarts348]

Matt, have you ever done a video on the Rifle Brigade sabre that is hanging at the top of the screen? In particular the leather and steel scabbard. I have the same sword and would love to know more background. Thank you!

[@badpossum440]

so far i have found 4 blade shapes for the 1827, the original pipe back ,the 1892 ,1846 , and a light weight dress sword. Do the different shape crowns ,horns, & fullers mean anything ??

[@robdougherty5133]

I have one of these my grandfather's grandfather carried in the Battle of Chicamauga. I am assuming the Rebs traded cotton for arms in England. The blade is dark with age. What is the best way to clean it or should I? Anything else you could share on what you know on how many swords came 'across the pond' during this time?

[@TheManfromNibiru]

Being product of the 60's , what I observed are Officers armed with 45's , 45 revolvers but missed out on the swords . Sword business went out the door After WW1 . So I'm reliving this sword fighting into some kind of ground fighting combat .

[@cyrylkowalczyk9392]

Hi Matt, Last time you talked about the transition from pipeback to Wilkinson blade you pointed the restricted cut depth caused by the pipe, that was found particularly troublesome against thickly clothed enemies, like against Russian soldiers in Crimean War. On the other hand, the transition with this sword is predating the said war. Therefore the better stab capabilities and overal durability mentioned in this video seem to be more probable reason.

[@scholagladiatoria]

+Cyryl Kowalczyk Hi Cyryl, actually a lot of pipebacks were still in service during the Crimean War, as officers traditionally bought their sword at the start of their career, and lots of officers in the Crimea had joined before 1845. However, the main problem with pipebacks was certainly their general flexibility leading to poor thrusting power and penetration, but also the fact that they were more easily bent or broken than the post-1845 blade type.

[@clasdauskas]

To paraphrase Matt, "Rifle's officers thought they were a cut above the rest' - nothing has changed :)

[@ME-hm7zm]

It is now my life quest to own one of those dress swords.

[@shaneybiss]

I have got one of 1827 original rifles offers swords,I have no case for it,any idea how much it’s worth

[@sky4eyes]

is the regular regiment sword are more expensive

[@p4riah]

I know you prefer to leave your antiques in the condition you purchased them, but is there ever a circumstance where you would clean or sharpen them? If they are really dirty or the edge is really bad, would restoration work still decrease their value? Are there experts who can clean/sharpen/restore antiques while maintaining their historical value?

[@rrr2cats]

I have what appears to be an 1827 pattern rifles officer's sword. The blade has not been sharpened and there is no engraving at all on the blade. Were they made without engraving?

[@alfrede.neuman9082]

As a general rule, Senior NCO’s (Sergeants and Warrant Officers) carried the same swords as commissioned officers, but WITHOUT etching on the blade. They also will often have issue stamps like a broad arrow, or a small crown with a number under it. This is because their swords were issued and not privately purchased like officers swords. Therefore, what you have is almost certainly a senior NCO sword that belonged to a sergeant in the rifles.

[@rrr2cats]

@@alfrede.neuman9082, thank you.

[@EdselFordEdsel]

Is there a resource that shows how British military swords evolved over time? Like which "old" model sword lead to which "new" model sword?

[@scholagladiatoria]

+Nate Pendergraft 'Swords of the British Army' by Robson

[@EdselFordEdsel]

+scholagladiatoria thank you!

[@DeathWishMonkey]

An unrelated question but how good are rapiers at piercing heavy clothes?

[@Spiiiderrr]

Is there a way to estimate if or how many people were actually wounded or killed with antiques you have in your home?

[@jgrepshire]

Good info, will give me some small talk material whenever I meet up with my friends in the Rifles Regiment. Might I ask (admittedly off topic), do you (or anyone else) know much about the Model 1902 US Army Officers' Sabre? Much of the info I've found on it on the internet seems sketchy, some claim that the thin, narrow blade is indicative of the US Army deciding that sabres were really only for dress by this point, while others claim that it mirrors a European movement towards lighter, slightly more thrust-centric sabres.

[@scholagladiatoria]

+James Grant Repshire I think it was pretty much mainly inspired by the French 1882 and slightly by a couple of Italian models, which are all really more duelling sabres than 'war' sabres. The French 1882 is pretty decent as a thruster, fairly useless as a cutter (though good enough for a duel) - about the same as the US 1902 I'd say. Though when you compare any of these to the British 1895/97 it's clear that Britain still took swords more seriously - no doubt due to fighting Indians, Pathans, Afghans, Maories, Sudanese, Zulus etc. I'd be interested to know if there are any documented cases of the US 1902 being used in combat. Certainly the British 1897 and French 1882 were very occasionally - even in WW1.

[@jgrepshire]

+scholagladiatoria Thanks for the info Matt. I'll keep an eye out for any info on its use in combat. I once read a somewhat apocryphal statement that a few young infantry officers took them into the trenches with them in WWI and quickly abandoned the practice. I'd think there is more likelihood of them being used during the rebellions in the Philippines, which I understand often involved hand-to-hand combat.

[@ramisabreur7961]

Informative as usual ! Thanks :-) Matt can you please explain what is a blade " a la Montmorency " ? I often read about this type in French armies .Also what is your opinion on the French 1822 light cavalry saber . Best regards :-)

[@doratheexploder286]

It`s the blades with a large central fuller, and then a very narrow secondary fuller between the back and the central one.

[@sortehuse]

Is 1827 pattern Rifles officer's sword a kind of Sabre? If not what is the difference between this type of sword and a Sabre?

[@JC-Denton]

Dress sword?! Aha. Suppose they're good enough for opening a bottle of champagne... :-)

[@RobertFisher1969]

When you say the volunteer swords are less desirable, is that merely due to them being more common or is their some practical difference?

[@levifontaine8186]

I have two questions. First, on the rifle officer's sabre, it looked like there was some edge damage, possibly from combat. Is that the case, or is it something else? Also, have you made a video about the small cutlass like sword that is second down from the top on the wall? It looks interesting.

[@Escylon]

You are talking about the switch in sword design. Does that mean that every officer would abandon his old sword and got a new one? What happened to the old weapons?

[@scholagladiatoria]

+Escylon No, many kept their old swords. New officers would buy the new model of course and some officers who wanted to keep up with fashion would buy a new model sword, but they were not obliged to.

[@SlurponMuhdickKillTheState]

Interesting, but I'm not a fan of pipe backs. I do like that fullered later version though.

[@trashyalice1756]

The sun never sets on the British Empire

[@Smaleu24]

What is your oldest sword

[@Spiiiderrr]

But can you unscrew the pommel to end the video rightly? Sorry wrong channel. Keep it up, nice, ooh, nice

[@lajospapp258]

Not trying to diss anyone who likes them but, is the how does the dress sword compares to the spadroons? I mean from what I understand many of them are quite light in the blade, and seem to be flexible. Similar to this sword.

[@scholagladiatoria]

+Lajos Papp The dress sword is essentially a curved spadroon.

[@lajospapp258]

scholagladiatoria I see, thanks for the reply!

[@Hjerrick]

You mention that the design for the later blade was of the same type as the older backswords and such. Did the british army never test new sword designs before making them regulation? It seems daft to widely produce the pipeback only to realize later, that this new design was inferior in almost every way to the older ones.

[@manicdemise]

testing doesn't always show up flaws that are noticeable in the field. Add to that what exactly they are testing for and politics/influence, history is strewn in even in modern times with kit/weapons that got past testing and was found to be lacking in the field.

[@lajospapp258]

+Hjerrick That's what bugs me a little bit too :D

[@RelativelyBest]

+Hjerrick There was a lot of experimentation going on with sword design in the 19th century, not just in England but all over Europe. You see a lot of variation, with some very innovative ideas, much of which seems to have been a matter of different opinions of what sort of qualities a sword should have. For instance, there was a long debate on whether thrusting was better than cutting, and how the two should be balanced in case of a compromise. Then people debated whether or not compromising was preferable to specialization, and so on. This sort of thinking became very common once armor was phased out - you see considerably less variation in medieval times since there are only so many sensible designs when you have to factor in what kind of armor people are wearing. From what I understand, the pipeback was an attempt to make a light sword with a fine cutting edge that was still pretty stiff. It's not my favorite design, but they were fairly popular swords for a while so I doubt they were actually bad weapons. The main critique seems to have been their tendency to cause fairly shallow cuts. They are very light, though - I once got to handle a Swedish one and it was by far the lightest, most agile sword I've ever held.It felt almost toy-like and waving it around was really fun.

[@Hjerrick]

RelativelyBest Very interesting. You connected a lot of dots for me between Matts videos that I hadn't realized were there, thank you!

[@dockmasterted]

Hi Matt I have finally gotten up enough courage to ask ........... Just how many swords do you personally own? ........ and how many different types are in your collection?

[@manicdemise]

which one would Sharp have? :p

[@scholagladiatoria]

+Manic Demise An officer of Rifles in Sharpe's time would most likely have carried a flank officer's sabre, modelled on the 1796 light cavalry sabre, but lighter. Or possible a version of the 1803 pattern sabre.

[@manicdemise]

scholagladiatoria thanks!

[@Dithyrambos-h5e]

+scholagladiatoria Sharpe is described as preferring a heavy cavalry trooper's sword. Not even an officer's sword -- a trooper's sword. Later in the series he loses his original trooper sword and his friend, Harper, replaces it by effectively raiding the arsenal at the town they're stationed in. By the end of that book he "obtains" a Klingenthal (Saxony) sword from a Frenchman, repeatedly remarks upon how well crafted it is, but still ultimately prefers his trooper's sword. But Cromwell always played a little fast and loose with military regulations in the interests of telling a compelling story. Sharpe had no business being at Trafalgar but there's still an entire book devoted to it.

[@celston51]

+Matt L Indeed. Sharpe uses the 1796 Heavy Cavalry Trooper Sword for most of the series. Cromwell's reasoning for this is because Sharpe is not a good swordsman at the start of the series. He prefers bludgeoning and hacking opponents to death through sheer force. For the cavalry this makes sense, but I have no idea how 'accurate' such a notion is when fighting on foot.

[@justsomeguy3931]

You speak of infantry regiments and rifle regiments. In that age, weren't all infantry riflemen anyways? I thought the 3 wings were infantry, cavalry, and artillery; that the days of infantry with polearms supporting gunners were over. What's the difference between an infantry company and a rifle company? Of all the sabers I've seen on your channel, that 1845 is by far the one I'd pick.

[@clasdauskas]

At the time of these weapons 'Infantry' were mostly armed with non-rifled muskets, whereas 'Rifles' used what you'd assume.

[@janerikbthorvaldsen103]

Hi Matt! I know this is a little off topic but i need to ask was "lord" a genuine title in the middleages, or just a way to adress a member of the nobility?

[@janerikbthorvaldsen103]

+Decay ok thank you

[@ercluxior]

Where do you get your saber antiques?

[@MrLazyeyedhobo]

+ercluxior search on ebay

[@ercluxior]

I'm hesitant because they all seem to be from Chinese vendors. I don't know about the quality.

[@MrLazyeyedhobo]

ercluxior Try and rob Matt Easton when he's not home?

[@minuteman4199]

Where did Wilkinson get his knowledge to design weapons from? Was he an accomplished swordsman, or did he use people who were for advice?

[@lancerd4934]

+Minute Man He was more an industrialist than anything else. He ran the company that was known as the single finest manufacturer of swords in the British Empire. He inherited it from his father James Wilkinson, who inherited it from his father-in law-Henry Nock, who is best known today for producing the Nock volley gun. So he had a family history of producing military hardware, plus hundreds of employees working in his factories producing weapons on an industrial scale. Getting his design approved had less to do with supplying great swords than it was to do with his company's rivalry with Prosser who had taken credit for the pipe back design. Using a combination of marketing and political clout he got Prossers' design replaced with his own to ensure continued profitability for the company.

[@scholagladiatoria]

+lancer D

[@nikitaonassis6090]

+lancer D Excellent background information that helps with context..

[@minuteman4199]

Thanks guys, interesting story.

[@geraltvonriva9085]

Whats that animal at your banner ?

[@scholagladiatoria]

+Geralt von Riva A lynx

[@geraltvonriva9085]

+scholagladiatoria looks pretty nice

[@roberttauzer7042]

Matt does it again - history lesson masked as sword review : ) Good job. Btw why do you even want to review modern replicas when you have the full house of real things?

[@vishalzanjurne9145]

Same sward is my near

[@kennybrunton9389]

Nice I want 1

[@badpossum440]

All of these videos mention the crown of the reigning monrach but never tell us what the difference is between the crowns.

[@mbalazs3544]

was weary informative liked this one :)