Antique Seth Thomas Overhaul - Part 11 - Oiling and Final Reassembly

[@edjunis2703]

Your series is so informative and is helping me so much. Thank you for your help!!!

[@vincentvargas6224]

Wow, you really brought it back to life with alot of power. Wonderful you make it seem so easy.

[@chrisperkins8808]

Excellent video, very informative and easy to follow. Good filming, Thank You.

[@BrackenClockWorks]

Glad it was helpful!

[@islepilot]

Really excellent series! Thanks for taking the time to do this. Very informative. You might want to be careful using a hair dryer or other heating element right next to an open vat of isopropyl though. :)

[@johnnybquick2849]

Very nice and knowledgeable video. Thank you:)

[@BrackenClockWorks]

Thank you for your feedback!

[@davidw2609]

Thanks for your care & labors in this fun hobby! You seem to have some definate ability as a teacher to methiodically bring your audiance along with you. May I ask if there might be any way we, the viewers, could see a little less of your right hand, your arm & your hat brim? Could the camera be positioned a little higher; perhaps close to your head & a little to the right? (You're right handed.) Except for the natural wiggley problem, a head -camera mount could also be helpful? The idea I'm trying to play with is that if YOU can see the issue you are discussing, then we can too.

[@BrackenClockWorks]

Sorry for the late response. I've been toying with the idea of trying some different camera angles and positions. I will take this into consideration for the next video! Thanks!

[@johntaylor6654]

Hello, thanks for your channel and video, a question please. I have what seems to be the same movement in a "Chicago" city series case. What are the "cogs" below the winding arbors for, are they winding stops, if so is there a part missing, or does this particular version not have them. my movement is the same as yours on this video, they appear to have no purpose. Unlike a previous video of yours with a clock with an alarm feature. Thanks.

[@BrackenClockWorks]

Yes you are correct they are for the Geneva Stops. However, unfortunately, it is quite common to find the parts that go on the winding arbors themselves to be missing. This is due to past repairers either deeming them totally unnecessary, or not knowing how to properly set them up. Either way, they aren’t actually necessary.

[@sueswenson2545]

I have cleaned and oiled a 80 year old electric Seth Thomas mantle clock and managed to change the chiming/dinger time by 10 minutes(prior to the hour and 20 miinutes after the hour).... Any easy description for me to repair this likely easy fix.. sue bob

[@derekr7814]

To make life easier you could invest in some post clamps. They clamp onto the movement plate and lift it off the table top. This makes life a whole lot easier and they are very affordable.

[@BrackenClockWorks]

Already own post clamps but feel since this is a back mount movement there's really no need.

[@borderbiomassfuels-firewoo6498]

Thanks for taking the time and so much effort to put together these videos. I've found them very interesting and informative and I'm now staring at my Seth Thomas wall clock with serious intent! I've just acquired a Jerome & Co New Haven weight driven clock. The transfer on the glass is near wrecked. Would you know if these are available or do I have to get creative with a paint brush?

[@BrackenClockWorks]

Weight-driven clocks are actually pretty easy to work on since there's no worry in terms of the mainspring. As far as the transfer, check out merritts.com or timesavers.com for reverse painted glass or transfers. Both companies have a pretty good selection but mostly depends on the type of clock and size of the glass.

[@chetmyers7041]

10:15 Would it cause any harm or accelerated wear to let the clock unwind laying on side and "twitching" like this? I have a ST 8-Day movement and if planning to store it away, is it harmful to store it 75% wound? Believe my clock has a relatively new movement as it is stamped Made in U.S.A. Also, don't think it has those "star shaped plates" which prevent over winding. How many turns of the winding arbors do those allow?

[@BrackenClockWorks]

The “star shaped plates” are known as Geneva stops. Many say they prevent “overwinding,” but that isn’t what they’re function is. They limit the winding of the springs to utilize a certain section of the strength to keep the clock from running slightly faster if it were tightly wound at the beginning, and slower from being at the end. Being stamped Made in USA isn’t an indicator of age, as clocks have been made in America since it’s founding, and before. If you’re going to store it, leaving it somewhat, or fully, wound shouldn’t matter much, but I usually let the clock unwind fully if planning on storing for extended period of time to keep the spring healthy. As long as the spring is lubricated, which also helps rust from forming in addition to lubricating it, it should be totally fine. And letting it “twitch” like that doesn’t make it wear any faster than if it were running normally.

[@Cobesclocks]

Does the clock work to this day?

[@BrackenClockWorks]

As a matter of fact, yes! Keeps excellent time, too.

[@ethangilcrease4198]

Hi quick question. What type of oil do you use when you oiled the clock. I am trying to figure it out because I am just starting in this hobby. Thanks Awesome Video's !!!

[@BrackenClockWorks]

I use a synthetic oil that is available from many different clock supply shops such as Merritts Antiques or Timesavers. It's generally inexpensive and a little goes a LONG way.

[@josal4983]

Thank you

[@shaannn.7]

Hello I am from Bangladesh. I have a clock from the company Seikosha. The clock stopped working few years before. There is no one near me who can fix the clock. So, I decided to do that by my own. I found that there is problem with the spring barrel. I think I can fix that. But the problem is with reassembly. Can you help me with it?

[@nilobrasil4207]

Great; but, unfortunately, didn't show anything about adjusting the striking train... It's a nightmare to me!!!

[@BrackenClockWorks]

Unfortunately, everything just happened to fall into place perfectly during filming and no adjustments were needed. In hindsight, I should've gone over those adjustments anyway. More videos will be coming, and I'll endeavor to go over that part! Thanks!!

[@emorywhite2666]

Andrew, I have an 89C where the hammer was not working. I had to adjust the rod at the top to get it back on the little studs on the top little gear. It was then striking properly when I tripped the smaller rod at the top with my little screw driver. Upon putting it back in the case after cleaning and oiling, it is keeping perfect time, ringing the bell on the half hour, but it is not striking the gong on the hour. When I trip the little rod at the top it strikes the hour perfectly. Can you tell me why it isn't striking the hour when the minute hand is at 12 o'clock? Thanks in advance!

[@BrackenClockWorks]

The small rod you're tripping... is it the one that would be on the right (when looking at the back) that sets into the deeper cuts on the count wheel or are you referring to the one that is nearest the centershaft? It sounds like it may not be lifting the rod high enough to disengage the locking cam to allow the gear train to spin and strike the gong.

[@emorywhite2666]

Either one spins the fan and activates the hammer.

[@emorywhite2666]

I have the mechanism back out of the case. Looking at it from the front I see a rod under neath the rod that rests in the counter wheel. It has a right angle on the end. It appeared to be bent. I bent it slightly upwards to about an eighth of an inch of the other rod. Now when I put the minute hand on the center shaft and turn it clockwise, when I get it up near where the 11 would be and it raises the other arm out of the counter wheel, the fan spins for a second and then stops. Moving it further up to where the 12 would be, the hammer than strikes until the other rod drops back into the large slot on the counter wheel. Am I on the right track? It appears as though it should strike correctly now.

[@emorywhite2666]

Let it run overnight outside the case. Seemed to be working fine. Reinstalled in case and it is working like new! Thanks for the inspirational videos that influenced me to keep trying until I figured it out!

[@BrackenClockWorks]

Yes it sounds like you're a bit more than on the right track, sounds to me like you've managed to get the count lever adjusted. :)

[@kingdom777866]

Andrew many thanks for all these videos, ive watched every one twice over.. or more, you inspired me to take on a project of my own with a Seth Thomas weight driven mantle clock that I thought i'd never do. The movement was very very bad.. in fact impossible to clean without a complete tear down, ive never done such an undertaking ever before, the poor old clock parts were covered in years of grime and a tar like substance. yuck ! After about 5 different cleaning methods (some worked, some didn't) I finally could see brass !! I was amazed at my tray of parts glinting and shinning at me.. I took my time, and carefully started putting it back together(watched your video again) and got it all assembled, perfect I thought, now lets see if it works ! well, the short answer is yes, and it keeps perfect time with out any adjustments either.. I feel really chuffed.. but.. (Theres always a but) on the chime side, I didn't realise that I had to put the wheels in a certain sequence to set it in its correct "Timing" ?? its not chiming at all.. ive mucked it up ! what can I do ? is there any way you could help me with this ? or where I can get the relevant information to set this correctly ? Any help would be most appreciated.. Thanks G

[@BrackenClockWorks]

My sincerest apologies for the super late response! If you try to understand how the chime train works, it will become clear as to what will need to be done to make it work. Look at each lever, each cam, each peg... understand their relation to one another. The light bulb will go off and you'll understand where to go next. This is an interesting point, by the way. I may have to come up with some real "teaching" videos in the future to help others out! Thanks, and hope you were able to get your movement working correctly again!

[@ahmedrafik4483]

hallo I have the same kind of clock and I need some help please

[@brackenan]

What is the problem?

[@syedsayeedurrahmanzaini4221]

Parts should have been properly washed and cleaned before reassembling them, there are lots of dirty spots on the surface।

[@BrackenClockWorks]

As demonstrated in the previous videos, they were cleaned in a degreaser and ammonia solution in an ultrasonic cleaner for over 15 minutes, then soaked in alcohol and wiped down with a cloth and fully dried with heat. I can see where you may see dirty spots, but also keep in mind the brass is almost 132 years old and has a few scuffs and scratches on the surface (from age or small defects when originally manufactured). It could be the lighting I'm using making it appear it's dirty, when in fact it's quite clean and shiny. Where, specifically, are you noticing the dirty spots?

[@jobloggs2753]

Hpr

[@derekr7814]

Sorry to say but every pivot you oiled needed to be bushed. The one you did was filed out too much. Any back and fourth movement is bad and all of them had it. Also when oiling you only want enough oil to fill the oil cavity. Anymore and you risk the oil losing surface tension and running. Also will attract more dirt and dust which is what kills bushings to begin with. Lastly seeing as you had it all apart you could/should polish the plates/gears. Of course in doing so wear rubber gloves so your oils/acids on your skin do not oxidize the brass once its polished. A footnote.... take pictures. Myself when I clean and disassemble large grandfather clock movements I lay all the gears out on a styrofoam block in correspondance with their respective positions. Then clean one gear at a time. Also you may want to get a pivot polisher in the near future.

[@BrackenClockWorks]

I actually mention taking pictures in the first video, but I've worked on enough of these to know where the gears/levers go. Look, I don't claim to be an expert. This is not a business for me, merely a hobby. I don't have any super specialized tools other than the spring winder and the bushing machine. I don't have any real means of polishing, nor do I see any need to other than for the look since it doesn't help anything mechanically. If this were a skeleton clock, that'd be a different story. As for the oiling, yes it was too much. I have a super cheap oiler that leaks out more than it should and should probably invest in a better one. And from what I've seen, the best way to polish pivots require a lathe, which is a little out of my budget. I do the best I can with what I've got. And bushing every pivot? I was taught you WANT some wobble with pivots or else it'll bind up due to temperature changes flexing the brass. (This is coming from the guy who taught me this craft with over 60 years experience, and clock repair books that actually have diagrams illustrating how much wobble is ok, and what is too much). Also, I have no problem taking constructive criticism most of the time. But this seems to discredit me to the point that maybe I should consider taking ALL of my videos down. (There is an option to privately message someone on youtube, I believe) And I have clocks that I've fixed more than 14 years ago that still run just fine and once they were adjusted I've never had to mess with them.

[@BradfordNeedham]

From what I've seen in repair videos, and from what I've read on NAWCC.org, there is a lot of art and leeway in clock repair. There's everybody along the spectrum from the "mess with it til it works" school, to the "do a museum quality restoration" school. I've found your generous videos very helpful; they are a nice contrast to the Preview-of-My-$40-DVD style clock repair videos I see so often. Keep posting those repairs!

[@BrackenClockWorks]

Thank you,@@BradfordNeedham, for your kind words! It's funny you mention "preview" videos because I had originally thought about doing just that with this series. However, after careful consideration, I decided to put it all on here for everyone to see. I don't make a dime off these videos, and I'm ok with that. In my opinion, clock repair is an art form in itself, and a great hobby to get into. You shouldn't have to pay someone to learn an art or a craft that you could easily try yourself and find out if its the right thing for you. The purpose of my videos is to show that it's not that hard to do, and is a very rewarding hobby to get into. It's like, when you take something that's over 100 years old and make it work again and/or look nice again... it's like going back in time and bringing the past to the present.

[@jimfuente7699]

Great video and you are doing excellent keep up the great work

[@BradfordNeedham]

Matthew Read, a clock conservator whose recent claim to fame is his working on the Bowes Swan automaton, provides a counterpoint to the "bush anything that looks enlarged" school of thought. See kzbin.info/door/vO7rK_F0cK-vDCB_xbQLNAvideos (sorry they aren't indexed). His basic approach is to check the depthing of each pair of wheels, and only bush if the worn position of the wheels runs significantly worse than the unworn position. He's definitely about conserving as much of the existing clock as possible, rather than restoring it to some inferred original condition. An interesting point of view, that illustrates the diversity of clock repair styles out there.

[@1pilotsteve]

way to much oil