Applying Decals Without a GLOSS varnish

In this video we will explore the possibility of applying decals straight onto paint, without a Gloss varnish. This is a controversial topic, Glossing has been a staple technique in scale modelling for years, but is it necessary? lets take a look !
www.vms-supplies.com

[@lpjmodels]

Dont forget to like and comment and subcribe if you want to see more videos !

[@ferbieticklater7429]

I have always found the decal application process to be the most frustrating part of modelling, with many mishaps being explained as "battle damage". I'll definitely try this procedure next time. Thanks for sharing James. Stay well mate!

[@lpjmodels]

Thanks Ferb ! It may take some practice like all of our techniques, I felt after a few years of doing it it was time for a video guide 😀 The smoothness of paint is key to the technique, good luck !

[@rebelroostermodeling6460]

BINGO. The only thing I would say is that you forgot to mention that a lower pressure will be necessary for the thinner paint. Too many people think spidering should always be fixed by adding more paint, but in making smooth finished paint, its just like you said….thinner paint and closer distance. But that will require a lower pressure. But overall, well done, its so good to see someone else who knows the fallacy of gloss before decals.

[@lpjmodels]

That's a great point, sometimes we take these things for granted !

[@Panzermeister36]

Great video. I've decalled over matte for years. I've only ever had silvering over gloss, because I can spray an opaque paint much more smoothly. Clear varnishes are hard to judge so that when I sometimes got an orange-peel rough finish, which then screwed decals. The roughness of the paint that is going to reflect light is a very very fine microtexture, and not going to catch air pockets and cause silvering. The roughness of an orange peel texture is a much larger macrotexture and can catch air bubbles, but not affect the apparent reflectiveness (gloss or matte) or the paint. I also don't bother with setting solution. I use solvent as the setter, applied right before the decal. This really helps adhesion as it fuzes the decal to the paint from the inside. You covered some great points in your professional video. Adhesion is key to not getting air underneath, and smooth matte paint is more than enough to not get air bubbles.

[@lpjmodels]

Thankyou Evan, what solvent do you use for your decalling ? It sounds like something fun to try :)

[@Panzermeister36]

Just Micro Sol, before and after. Warm water for the decals. Perfect every time.

[@jamessteale805]

@@Panzermeister36Would you do it differently if you primarily made aircraft? I can see how using micro Sol on smaller German crosses or stars on tanks would be fine, but using them on large aircraft decals, where the exact placement angle is key, could be really tricky

[@Panzermeister36]

​@@jamessteale805 armoured vehicles also have large number spreads with wide spaces of clear film between and inside the numbers. The micro sol beforehand doesn't immediately melt the decal. You have two minutes to adjust the position.

[@jamessteale805]

@@Panzermeister36 conveniently I just bought a bottle of sol without getting the set. I’ll give it a try. Thank you!

[@andygorman858]

A new technique to try! Always learning something from your vids!

[@lpjmodels]

Thanks Andy, 🍻

[@windsorspitfire]

Thanks for tackling this topic. I learned modeling with a hairy stick and no spray anything, and my process was (1) brush paint, (2) apply decal, (3) Solvaset. Just solvent, no setter. And it almost always came out great, even with 1970s decal technology. In some ways I have lost the confidence of knowing how things behave that I had when I built dozens of models a year, and using Future or clearcoats is kind of an insurance policy. I will try this process out on my next not-too-serious project.

[@lpjmodels]

I understand the reasoning of using a clear as an insurance, I think with how many products we have these days it's easy to use 2 products thag don't like each other

[@chris_obarski]

Very informative and engaging video! Cheers 😀

[@lpjmodels]

Thankyou Chris that is amazing ! Many thanks for the support

[@johnalecsscalemodeling]

Outstanding video James. Found it educational even though I usually do decals the same each time. I do not always gloss coat first, but always cover them up after with VMS Satin HD.

[@lpjmodels]

Thanks John ! Vms Varnishes rock 🪨

[@Simon_Nonymous]

Cool video James. I'm fence sitting on what I choose to do, simply because I've had some good results with no gloss undercoat since I started airbrushing on some quick and easy builds I have done, but I've not had any issues with transfer undercoating with gloss and satin varnishes interfering with my paints and finishing varnishes either. Meanwhile - 95% of what you do is what I do, so hopefully I am doing something the best way possible!

[@lpjmodels]

Thanks Simon ! I always had issues with gloss never being actually smooth, just shiny. I found the GX range really good and I expect the VMS varnish is probably pretty good. But laquer varnish undercoat don't like decal fil for some reason, occasionally leaving ghosting or tone shift where the film is. The thing that soured me to it was very early on using a humbrol Klear, that didn't state what it was made of, I ended up adding and oil wash and having the whole finish melt 🙃 been trying to find ways around it ever since 😀

[@jpgabobo]

This is how my father showed me using Solvaset over a rattle-can dull finish when I was a kid. Today I never use a clear gloss coat for decals (especially on polished metal finishes) & use the Micro Sol & Set with Q-tips and paper towels. Glad I'm not crazy.

[@lpjmodels]

We're all a bit crazy 😮

[@rorogaulois5700]

Hello very interresting one more time.thanks sir for the time spend for us. I ll try with my next model

[@lpjmodels]

Many thanks for watching and good luck

[@allanrichards3752]

I think the key is the smooth finish, be it gloss or matt. With gloss, if you don't have other issues, it is easier to get a smooth finish because if you don't you get a matt or semi gloss finish, so gloss paints force you not to spray dry. With matt paints spraying on the dry side almost aids the matt finish. If you are doing complex camo schemes or mottling then it is not always easy to put enough paint on the model to ensure the paint is smooth. I would recommend sanding the matt paint with something like 1000-1500 grit to ensure it is smooth before decal application. The other issue if the paint finish is not smooth is that the decal won't slide easily for positioning or getting it to sit well on the surface.

[@lpjmodels]

Sanding can help, mrp dries usually to a slight sheen. But laquers generally are more forgiving with finish.

[@allanrichards3752]

@@lpjmodels To be honest I have had a lot of issues with compatibility and ruined quite a few models in the past. I now stick to Tamiya acrylics for spraying and Vallejo for brush painting.

[@alec_f1]

Finally, the old "always gloss before decals" is helped to become debunked by more SMCG acolytes.

[@lpjmodels]

I understand why folks do it, but it's not as essential as people are lead to believe

[@joseluiscastanorestrepo]

Nice video.

[@motorsportinscale2291]

Nice vid James. As someone who does race cars and bikes mainly, I have a fair amount of experience with decals. I too rarely use gloss before the decals, with the notable exception of red paint and white decals. (It helps prevent the decals from turning pink!) As to slivering, it's more a function of poor application or crap decals in my experience as you said.

[@lpjmodels]

Ooh the pink decals don't sound great, is that a reaction to the top layer?

[@motorsportinscale2291]

@@lpjmodels I think the red pigment leeches into the white so the gloss provides a barrier.

[@johndillon8051]

Older Tamiya decals were notorious for this effect. White decals over red turned pink and over orange turned peach. Generally not a concern for military subjects, but a disaster for a Formula One Ferrari or a Jaegermeister sponsored Porsche.

[@wadejustanamerican1201]

Thanks for the video.

[@lpjmodels]

You're welcome Wade

[@herrlogan17]

Maybe when trying to peel off the carrier film from Eduard decals, that would change the preferences of matt/gloss varnish because of the adhesion, but who knows. You just really want 100% adhesion of these peel off decals. Great tutorial though, thanks :)

[@ModelMinutes]

An interesting exploration of a much-debated topic :)

[@lpjmodels]

Thanks @modelminutes !

[@davidcole333]

I have been leaving out the gloss varnish for some time, but what I do need to work on is getting the paint smooth. I'm guilty of not thinning the paint enough and holding the airbrush too far back. I often times end up with that rougher surface from the paint drying before it hits the surface.

[@lpjmodels]

Distance and thinning can be a knack but once you got it it becomes instinctive

[@wasrio1403]

Very good video. I agree 100%. I also do a light sand if I'm feeling extra careful 😂

[@lpjmodels]

Thankyou 😀

[@sergecolin3856]

I use a gloss varnish before decals for many reasons: - it protect the acrylic paint coat from other water-based works like.. decals. But I agree that this coat is attacked by the decals solutions... So I'll try your way of applying those... - it helps to move the decal and place them... I4m hearing that it's possible to do it also when applying the set solution like you do... - it helps for the next steps of rivets and panelining: the oils, prepared enamel products or even the acrylic ones... But you make me thinking that on the last models I made, I used acrylic wash from Vallejo direct on the paint inside the cockpit and it works... I'm though not sure it will also works for larger surfaces of the wings and fuselage...? As on the other side I often have problems with the gloss coat, I'll try to follow your methodology at one ! Thank you !

[@lpjmodels]

It's worth exploring the technique, I always do washes over matt or satin myself, I like the grip the surface provides 😀

[@NielsenDK-1]

...and....Let the Fight begin...You infidel😂 I`m looking forward to this guide. I do not use gloss varnish myself so I´m very interested in how you do:-)

[@lpjmodels]

Enjoy 😊

[@mazinman3]

I use a small electric coffee cup warmer to keep my tap water warm to hot. The decals come off the backing paper so much faster with hot water.

[@lpjmodels]

I had one of those, a little usb one. I'll have to dig it out

[@sylvainplante9882]

Yes, exactly! This is what I use to. I bought mine used on marketplace for $5 and it works perfectly, love it!

[@johnking6398]

I have been doing this for a while now and it works for me I don't like gloss varnish I don't use them now more

[@ricardoroberto7054]

I never gloss a kit. I paint with acrylics then buff with a cotton wool pad then apply decals with minimal carrier film and with a decal fixer and rolling with a cotton bud.

[@lpjmodels]

Lots of buffing or light polishing going on in the comments!

[@user-rg2jc5kc3j]

An excellent common sense approach, if you don't mind me saying.

[@antoniossamiotis555]

I use gloss varnish not necessarily for decals but to protect the paint and for the pin wash. So eventually I will use it.

[@lpjmodels]

I use my post decal matt for my protective layer. I dont mind working the oils over matt but a lot of people like to use it over gloss exclusively. I like the grip it provides !

[@paulsmodels]

You never know what the quality of some decals are going to be so it's always a crap shoot. I have had decals in new Tamiya kits be really bad, and then in some old Revell or Lindberg kits, the decals worked great! I just finished an old Lindberg kit of a LSD (Landing Ship Dock) ship. I laid the decals on the model right onto the dry, painted surface, no clear on the paint first. They went down really nice! I will lay a clear coat of some sort later for protection.

[@lpjmodels]

That's Very True Paul, some decals are so bad.

[@slowioczek]

I tried applying decals on a mat surface (Color) unfortunately always with a big problem. Not with silvering, but with positioning the decals. I must admit I am clumsy and I always need to adjust my decals after placing them from paper to a model. During finding a right placement for decal I almost always tear the decal when I don't have gloss coat underneath it. Second thing is that I love how the surface looks when you apply oil paint on gloss varnish let it dry overnight and then whipe down an excess. This procedure is not possible with matt surface. There is only one gloss varnish that I trust: MR. COLOR SUPER CLEAR III gloss.

[@surturiel]

Normally I only have silvering with stencils, and given that I work with 1/72nd, those pesky stencils are tiny and mostly carrier film... What I do sometimes is just to poke them before I clear coat it, with a wet pass, it normally seeps into the decal.

[@lpjmodels]

Stencils are the worst !

[@johncrimmins1540]

Hi LPJ, you are handy with an airbrush ! I dropped you a line a month ago about cardograf decals on a Copperstate armor car. I was freaked out because as you said in this video, there was a "Patchy" appearance under the decal. That's what I had. Never seen this before. After putting a semi-gloss coat then a flat, they looked great. Looked this video. I usually use Microscale products except sometimes Solvset for heavy duty use. How does your use of VMS clear coat and decal solutions differ? Thanks, John

[@LazyKalor]

Using varnish is necessary when model was painted with water soluble paints like vallejo, otherwise water and glue from decal will react with paint leaving stains.

[@Panzermeister36]

Respectfully, that's really an excuse for fragile paints. I use durable paints and can skip the varnish, save time and no stress. But, either way works in the end.

[@LazyKalor]

@@Panzermeister36 Yeah, I know it's detrimental but single layer of lacquer based satin varnish does it's job good enough and gives more predictable experience with oils later. I really liked Eduard's decals with removable film though.

[@NielsenDK-1]

Thanks for the video. It is very educational. As a brushpainter mostly in the one true scale, I use microscope paper to smooth the surface before applying decals, and I use (if necessary) AK Ultra Matte varnish for the matte appearance. I didn't know the pesky newer Eduard decals could be fixed with matte varnish. Many thanks for that knowledge, cheers👍🍺 What about if a satin or gloss surface is wanted?

[@lpjmodels]

Satin or gloss over the top should be fine too , it's just variances in the final film layer I believe. The new eduard decals are a mixed bag. Sometimes you can see the pixels on certain colours and it's really off-putting. If they were cartograph style screen printed with a liftable film they'd be 100%

[@NielsenDK-1]

Thank you for your reply. I wonder how it could go so wrong Eduard's new decals. @@lpjmodels

[@KGmodels]

I never used to apply a varnish before decals,and I don’t see much silvering on any of my kits,even those that are couple years old.After getting a proper varnish,I don’t think it actually matters do you apply a varnish before.Thanks for the info!

[@lpjmodels]

Thanks KG. The reason I stopped glossing before was I kept having issues which was a shame

[@ps4streamingHD]

Without the clear coat, Microset activated the paint in one of my models and the area around the decal looks strange. For me, clear coat every time...

[@lpjmodels]

That's fair enough, I think it depends on the durability of the base paint and how much solvent is applied, everyone has their methods !

[@robk5865]

Great vid. I have 2 questions... How dry/how long after using a setting solution can you safely cut a decal at the panel lines? And can I sand around the edges of a decal covered in matt varnish? I've only seen this process with gloss.

[@lpjmodels]

Thanks ! For cutting the decal they must be completely dry for best results. And yes you can sand the film with a matt varnish too 😀

[@KABModels]

i've never really gotten the hang over decalling without gloss. I nearly screwed up some of my best work by trying it, but thats not to say its a bad technique, only that i need practice with it. I've never really had silvering with gloss coats though, only on models without it. i think the lesson here is not to try it while filming videos and to practice it when not filming lol

[@lpjmodels]

I found it tricky to implement new techniques sometimes when filming. Paint can help though if you use one of the newer laquers like MRP, Outlaw or SMS

[@thekinksfan5102]

Excellent tutorial, smoothness and adhesion are the most important variables. Unfortunately some decals take ages before they get released from the backing paper, Techmod comes to my mind. They don't budge until they have soaked for minutes. I wonder if I should use warmer water, but wouldn't that also dissolve more of the adhesive? Is that VMS set & fix sticky, leaving stains? In their tutorial they advice to use brush & water to get rid of the excess adhesive. I have their original 2 in 1 decal solution, that one is quite sticky.

[@lpjmodels]

If you get some excess VMS set and fix on your finish it's a good idea to wipe it away yes, I wouldn't say it was super sticky but It can, if you get a bit somewhere show through the next layer if your not diligent. Yes some decals can take ages, I wonder what the manufacturer does differently 🤔

[@thekinksfan5102]

@@lpjmodels thanks for the reply, maybe I should try that newer VMS setting solution, I use mainly MRP so cleaning the surface with water is no problem. These new Eduard decals have some good qualities, and if matt coated are pretty good, some people's negative reaction to them is exaggerated. New Eduard decals release very fast, which is good, makes decalling faster too.

[@briansmith6862]

THANK YOU for finally showing this to the "gloss brigade"! Nearly every "top" KZbinr goes the the "gloss before decals" route, and my blood boils when their dried gloss coat is as rough as sandpaper, totally defeating the object of the gloss in the first place. But it doesnt matter, because you MUST gloss, right? Because "that's what you do, right"? NO - LEARN HOW TO USE THE BLOODY AIRBRUSH!!!! "But, what about my washes"? DOESN'T MATTER - SMOOTH IS SMOOTH. Washes will settle into smooth matt paint better than rough gloss varnish.

[@RaduB.]

Applying decals is a form of art. There is no 'right' recipe. Just good practices. I don't like using coton buds... Because of the potential loose fibers getting under the decal. I use kitchen paper instead. And I avoid unnecessary clear coats, too.

[@lpjmodels]

Radu I agree with the cotton buds, I think it's convenience for me but I'm very careful not to leave any strands

[@CFster]

Paint small for a smoother finish. 👍🏻

[@Vorpal_Wit]

White vinegar will dissolve the decal film leaving behind just the printer pigments. In fact, thats what MicroSet is. No decal film, no silvering. Personally, I have always skipped the gloss varnish, because it actually reduces the amount of surface texture the decal pigments have to adhere to. The purpose of gloss varnish in the past was actually to make positioning easier by giving you a slippery surface to work with, which isn't necessary if you keep the surface well wetted, as the decal floats until in position and pressed into place.

[@Panzermeister36]

Smart man. One of the few who understands the actual reason, rather than blindly following the steps just because "that's how it's done"👍

[@sylvainplante9882]

Vorpal, I put MicroSet on my French fry…😜

[@timalexander4129]

No gloss...yes! 👍

[@lpjmodels]

Attitudes seem to be more accepting of different ways of doing things lately which is nice !

[@mikes5637]

You monster!😮😂

[@lpjmodels]

😈

[@kevinfutter]

Thanks for pronouncing "decals" just like I do. Rare to hear it.

[@lpjmodels]

I sometimes get flak for it, usually from folks stateside, I dont know why it matters !

[@jasongotshadowbanned]

Because putting on a gloss is SOOOO hard.

[@lpjmodels]

Oh no, trying new things. 🤒

[@johnathan133]

Its not hard but its a waste of time. It does not address the actual cause of silvering which is poor adhesion.

[@vmoney9106]

I’ve seen so many shitty gloss applications that were rougher than the surface before gloss.

[@johnathan133]

@@vmoney9106 Could not agree more.

[@freedomfirst5557]

Blasphemy.....what is this witchcraft? Go on.....I'm listening.

[@lpjmodels]

It's nice to have an open mind with techniques, always nice to experiment and try new things 😊