Are Classic Cars Doomed? Is the 40 year rule killing them?

The 40 year rule for classics is great...but where does that leave modern young timer classics? Nowhere, thats where and things are getting harder for them.
The government have a Call for Evidence open regarding classics - click the link here shorturl.at/he52E and see I Drive a Classic talk to the Transport Secretary here • Scrapping ULEZ, Saving...
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[@LOTPOR0402]

Disgusting how it has to be 40 years old for tax and mot exempt .Nothing is better for the planet than to keep using old stuff if its a car or anything else

[@dallysinghson5569]

Those oldies are best left as uncommon classics, I can't imagine the absolute carnage the collective lungs would experience with millions of those things about.

[@philw4625]

Im not so sure...! I have a very soon to be 40 year classic which ive spent masses on to keep it running properly and in 'original' condition - new cylinder heads, liners, carb etc. It 'passes' the emissions very comfortably at MOT (as defined by its age) but I wouldn't want to drive behind it for long - you forget how bad the roads used to smell in the 70's from fumes! Even though it doesn't burn any oil, it stinks compared to a nice modern petrol car, and manages about 24mpg. I read a 'statistic' somewhere that a car from the 70s produced as much emissions in a year as a modern one would in its lifetime?? However, you cut it, its an expensive and/or time consuming labour of love to keep the older stuff running. The 40 year rule does at least make that a little more bearable, but the truth is it costs more and more to keep them running properly. A well reconditioned engine for mine used to cost about 2k 10 years ago. That has now risen to between 4 and 6k and that's nothing to do with the government - just increasing scarcity.

[@LOTPOR0402]

1 was not really going on about emissions at the tailpipe , but energy used in the production , and how that energy is produced 2 Who said anything about millions of classics being back on the roads , you can get cheap tax/free tax on a modern car and 3 Most cars built in the last 35 years are fuel injected and more effient than something older on carbs 4 Lots of modern heavy stuff are rubbish on MPG.The amount of cars on the roads now more than makes up for inefficiencies in older cars anyway.Uk alone must have nearly double the cars on the roads compared to say 1990

[@philw4625]

@@LOTPOR0402 30 million today vs 20 million in 1990. So unarguably more cars, but PM2.5 emissions have fallen dramatically (more than 75%) in the same time. There are obviously other factors in that figure however. Im not 'worried' about the emissions either - these classics tend to do very low mileages. They probably account for less than the log burners many of us have in our homes. Im with Mr Furious and have some reservations about the MOT issue - i take great care of my car, but i still rely on a regular inspection to keep it roadworthy as i don't have all the kit needed to properly check all of it, and that costs money. While mechanical failure is a rare cause of accidents, it isn't hard to imagine that it could be if unscrupulous types use the rules to be 'cheap'?

[@mattkinsella9856]

I have a 2002 Suzuki Grand Vitara which I keep as a second car. I live at the end of a half mile long dirt track and in the worst weeks of the winter it's the only way I've got now to get out with it's mud tyres and proper old manual 4x4 locking dif etc. However it's getting a bit difficult to justify the costs for only doing a few thousand miles a year. I understand it's not a classic car as such but I've looked after it for 22 years and my only other option is to get rid of 2 cars to buy a new big 4x4 pickup that I can use all year, still get the family in and be comfortable enough to use day to day as well as in winter. I'd be burning way more fuel over a full year, the Vitara would inevitably be scrapped and the massive emissions for producing a new pickup. Or imagine the impact on the environment if I did what my neighbours do and change that new big pickup every few years. We need to re-evaluate what is best for the environment in regards to cars and not just "emissions".

[@vitorpassos309]

Im 34 and usually the youngest guy in the car events I go here in Portugal. Only 2 years ago was I able to buy and then restore my Peugeot 309 Graffic, my first classic car. Wasnt very well received because people kept saying that it wasnt a real classic but then i asked, when it was the last time u seen one? 😂 If no one saves the more normal ones in the future none will survive 😢

[@alifloydtv]

Heh, I'm in my early 40s and I DEFINITELY don't think of Cortinas and Allegros as being from my youth - they were old cars even then (although I do recall the sound of a babysitter's brown Allegro estate). Proper nerdy nostalgia to me is maybe the Peugeot 205, but really more onto the Escort mk4, then things like the E36, 306, those cool early '90s Civics before the bug-eyed ones, mk1 MX5 (briefly owned one thanks to rust).

[@YBM2007]

I'm about that age and 'practical, affordable classics' is what interests me also, I think its the old farts forgetting how the 80s and 90s are now 30-40 years back

[@vitorpassos309]

I didnt even mention but now most car shows here only accept classic cars up to 1985 on their parking lots or inside of the shows themselves which just makes it even worse. Sometimes i register to go to events and get rejected with my 1991 309. At least i know before going there for nothing 😂

[@Flub-A-Dub]

- yes, I searched for a 405 estate & they are now as rare as hens teeth - However , out in the sticks in PT a lot of 1990's cars are still running used daily. (not regarded as classic yet)

[@michaelbenardo5695]

@@YBM2007 United States Old Fart here, you do have a point, us older guys often don't realize that, because were were all adults in those years and did not like those cars even when they were new, as they were such a comedown compared to the cars of the 50s and 60s, the cars we grew up with. But I for one am glad that you want to preserve SOMETHING, as once you become a "car guy", you might start getting interested in other cars.

[@SovietDictator]

The government doesn't care about classics. Here in the states, a guy from a VW forum went to talk to his congressman about the problem of putting ethanol blends into carburetted classics and the congressman was puzzled that anyone actually drives a car more than 20 years old, much less that they would need fuel for one.

[@davidelliott5843]

Ethanol is easily solved with a fuel additive.

[@Thumper68]

Democrats 😂

[@MrRAGE-md5rj]

And stinking Rino Republicans

[@paulhalley6760]

All the Government care about is making loads of money !

[@Kuson2]

I'm very lucky to live near gas stations that offer ethanol free fuel. It costs more but my old '99 Crown Vic is much happier on it even though it is fuel injected. E10 wasn't really around back in 1999 so I'm convinced that the ECU prefers that mixture. Could be placebo though. It genuinely seems to run better though.

[@davidp4456]

The fact is it is greener to maintain and run old cars. However the corporate interests behind Government forces us to buy new vehicles (more often) and make the maintenance of old vehicles prohibitive.

[@rogerphelps9939]

Where did you gett the idea that running old bangers is green? You are dead wrong.

[@richardhall2384]

not as green purely in terms of CO2 emissions from driving. But greener perhaps across the whole spectrum of production, shipping and distribution. Is the impact on biodiversity being considered by assembling a car with parts built across the entire world and shipping it here? Or worse still an EV with the very poluting and rare metals from Africa used to make the batteries. What's the human environmental cost of this? Is anyone calculating it? Overall I'm not convinced that a EURO3 petrol is much different to a EURO5 petrol really. A bit cleaner yes in terms of NOx and CO2 but enough to justify the above? On a world with finite resources.

[@davidp4456]

@@rogerphelps9939 I am if you quote absolute running costs and the much pro-ported efficiencies of the pro-EV campaign. As Richard here describes as the “whole spectrum of production” there is much more CO2 produced (and environmental damage) in providing new cars than is ever calculated in the statistics. Then you’ve got to consider the average life expectancy of cars. I’m not statistically minded but the average age of cars in the EU is about 12 years. If we equate this to replenishment time then you’ve got to make 3.3 new cars for every 40 year old car that is on the road. If you put these adjustments into your calculations I might not be as “Dead Wrong” as you think.

[@michaelbenardo5695]

@@rogerphelps9939 The manufacture of new cars is not a "green" process, especially since nowadays most are from Japan, a country that is not as "green" as the North American and the European countries, while keeping an old car running is keeping what already exists, instead of demanding something that has to be made. Also, the catalytic converter is what has turned cars into Global Warming machines, as it transforms Carbon MOnoxide in to Carbon DIoxide. Cars made before the advent of the converter do NOT cause Global Warming the way cars made AFTER the converters. Something that you radical environmentalists don't seem to realize.

[@michaelbenardo5695]

@@davidp4456 FACTS!

[@geoffnoyes520]

I believe that when the "computer screens" finally fail this will put many modern cars into the scrap yards, even if the rest of "the car is still ok.

[@jamesdecross1035]

Nah, people will install a Raspberry Pi and all will be fine!

[@volvo480]

@@jamesdecross1035 you can't, all the software and controls of the car are locked, some cars can even be disabled remotely if they are being tampered with. If the screen fails and new ones are either unobtainium or insanely expensive, your car is effectively scrap. This is a deliberate planned obsolescence strategy by manufacturers, because no one will buy new cars if the old ones are still doing fine after 20 years.

[@rockatansky1305]

@@jamesdecross1035 might aswell use an apple pie ?

[@chrispalmer9838]

That's the idea...

[@chrishart8548]

It's been happening before the computer screens. Anything after 2000 really will be mechanically OK with no rust. Electrical problems and sensors will be what puts it in the scrap yard. Or maybe a duel mass fly wheel.

[@iandennis7836]

Pressuring this government? THIS government? Good luck with that......

[@richardkent]

This government won't be the government for much longer. You need to be speaking to Louise HaIgh who, assuming Starmer doesn't have a reshuffle, will be the Transport Secretary before the end of the year.

[@ukmud6218]

​@@richardkentdianne Abbott would make it thirty 10 years

[@stevenwatson3963]

@@ukmud6218 Dianne Abacus

[@alanpatterson2759]

I was given this quote " It doesn't matter who you vote for, the government always gets in" the hidden hand!

[@itstheterranaut]

@@alanpatterson2759 Gramsci.

[@gwheregwhizz]

The irony is pre-war cars can have a wooden dash that can be refurbished or replaced, leather seats and door cards reupholstered, panels beaten, those chrome bumpers, lights and gauges restored etc. by many specialists to as new. Trying to get a new plastic dash, seat trim, door cards, panels, bumpers etc. for a 1980s/90s car (that was probably a limited run special edition, as was the fashion then) requires real effort and luck on auction sites. Modern classics often take the most work to own so their owners deserve support.

[@jacmar44]

As someone who owns and works on a lot of 80s/90s/ early 00s BMWs: yes, albeit there are techniques to repair parts that may not be common knowledge or usage. For example, dashes and plastic trims can be plastic welded, polyurethane foams where cracked can be filled with flexible leather filler and overpainted with PU vinyl coatings, panels can ultimately be fabricated.

[@VirtualPAH]

In line with consumerism led replace rather than repair, so lots of things are forced into obsolescence easier due to barriers to repairability. The modern smartphone being the most ubiquitous example, no longer usable purely due to lack of support from the manufacturer if they no longer provide updates for it. When an economy is based on growth and needing people to keep buying new stuff this won't change, and effects so many things in everyday life.

[@ColinCarFan]

There is a partial saviour in the form of 3d printing, at least for smaller items. If you can find someone who has a the part you need to replace, it can be scanned in 3d and duplicated.

[@craigdoriety9798]

True. I have a 1970 Nova SS and it is extremely easy to work on and reproduction parts are available.

[@michaelbenardo5695]

@@jacmar44 Like you said, most of us don't know how to do those things and don't know anybody who does. It is easy to find somebody to make something out of wood. Ditto for leather.

[@notroll1279]

I'm German and I'm observing similar effects here... In Germany, you can obtain certain privileges for a recognized "historic car". It needs to be at least 30 years old and in good and original condition (i.e. no rustbucket and no non-period mods). Once you've got an MOT examiner to certify this, you can change the registration accordingly and get a number plate with an H at the end. You benefit from a flat tax rate of 192 € a year (strangely rewarding people to baby large displacement forest killers into old age) AND entry into restricted environmental zones irrespective of the car's emission class. With safety and especially emission standards getting ever stricter, however, many potential classic cars are threatened before they can get 30 years old nowadays. Many Citroën C6, Renault Avantime or 2000s Jaguar S-Types were built with fabulous Diesel engines - so despite their classic potential, they are ostracized as "dirty old Diesels" - though not old enough to be protected. Some may survive to reach old age in the hands of rural folks who may not mind being barred from entering many cities and towns while paying hefty tax every year. But I think that too many good cars are pushed off the roads or to the markets of the Caucasus this way...

[@martinsvensson6884]

In Sweden everything 30 years or older is tax free. By default. And inspection only every 2:nd year.

[@paulgart]

In Ireland all cars over 30 years old are €56 pa to tax but younger than that they are subject to the same as a new car which is based on co2 emission’s. This results in me having to pay between €1.294, €1,807 and €2,500 pa for my cars that are not 30 years old yet plus they need to get tested each year until they are over 40 years old.

[@notroll1279]

@@paulgart Frankly, it's hilarious that any country totally stops inspecting cars from a certain age - it's nice to spare their owners from hassle, but if they're supposed to be driven, they must be safe. In Germany, the country's oldest car with a registration, an 1894 Benz Victoria, passed its regular roadworthiness test recently. It passed without faults - but since it has never had any newfangled stuff like indicators, the driver is required to use a luminescent sign to indicate where he is going and to drive the car during daylight hours only (headlights aren't terribly good, either...) 😀.

[@paulgart]

@@notroll1279 I agree with you 100% on testing cars no matter how old they are. At the very least they should be tested for essentials like brakes, steering etc BTW motorbikes here don’t require any testing no matter if they are new or old which is mad!

[@volvo480]

@@martinsvensson6884 in The Netherlands it's the same for inspections, but tax exempt only after 40 years and it will be "frozen" in 2028, i.e. only cars before 1988 will eventually become tax exempted. Inspection exempt after 50 years, but more important, we have VERY cheap classic car insurances for cars over 25 years (around €60 per year with 5000 km max) and unlike the UK, the car is insured, regardless of the driver. Tax is calculated for weight brackets and fuel type, e.g. for a 950-1050 kg car on petrol like my Volvo 480 we pay around €400 per year, for a 1450-1550 kg car like a Volvo V70 that will be almost €1000 per year but old (pre Euro 4) diesels get a 130% tax penalty and will be banned from cities.

[@sonofjak1971]

DVLA survey complete. My 1990 W201 Mercedes that i daily ( 3k a year miles approx) is now £200 for 6 months tax, i feel like i'm being bullied into an EV. Not on my bloody watch!

[@grifterchrisify]

Mines the same 1992 Daimler 4.0L £340 to tax a year only has 87500 miles on it. I'm not scrapping a perfectly good car and definitely not getting an EV. 0 chance of that

[@garethbird4259]

Same as my 1988 W126. Does less than 2000 miles a year and costs the same to tax as my wife's C Class

[@ambivalentonion2620]

costs me over 200 just to keep an Austin metro taxed

[@chrishart8548]

Don't get an EV plenty of cars are £0 road tax if the emissions are under 99kgco2. Even a mondeo or a passat or a qashqui and greenline or econetic version.

[@sonofjak1971]

@@chrishart8548 I like many others don't want to drive and own a modern car, you're missing the point.

[@JamesGadbury]

I prefer to own my cars outright than buy one on credit. I also don't like modern cars. There's no engineering integrity. For me, modern cars have aggressive, ugly, over-designed yet generic styling, oversized proportions, screens for everything and overcomplicated and interfering systems. Credit has allowed and tempted people to buy new cars that would have historically been beyond their budget. It doesn't seem responsible. The annoying thing is I feel I'm being responsible (owning a car I can afford and keeping it running long term), I'm being punished with expensive road tax and premium grade petrol, while subsidising owners of modern cars. I'm angry about it, tbh. There's nothing environmentally conscious about heavy, disposable SUVs.

[@stestar09]

Premium grade petrol has its own benefit of burning better making very slight improvements, i used it before the E10 shafting as its better for the engines i have . Yea regarding more expensive road tax , the older the car , should be the cheaper it becomes because were offsetting negative environmental effects of producing a brand new 1 . I too run a 20 year old 3.2d.i.d shogun & do my own jobs on it , i worked all my life - 47 now & can't afford a newer car & to send it into a garage, not everyone can afford newer -more economical, yet they punish us with higher running costs

[@kennethtalbott2233]

remove all the cars off the road that are being financed and our roads will be clear for the ones paid for.

[@JamesGadbury]

@@stestar09 regarding my comment on premium grade petrol... there used to be a 5-7 pence pet litre difference. I noticed it increasing gradually and now I'm seeing 15p+ per litre more for E5. Fair enough if it's down to production costs, but my old cynical mind says it's the captive customer (those that need to use E5 fuel) that are being exploited.

[@duckhunter8203]

Not everyone has the pleasure of being able to buy a reliable car outright, people need a reliable car to get to work without it braking down all the time, if you buy it cheap you buy it twice and spend copious amounts on maintenance. Why wouldn't you pay £200 a month for something new and maintenance free apart from a yearly service, I own a newish car, a MK2 escort and have fixed cars for 25 years as my job. That's like saying I can't understand why people don't save... of your on the bread line you don't have that option. Its easy to say when you have an option.....

[@jamesdecross1035]

Thank you for raising this issue. Sorry to say this, but it is about time the classic car journalists, like yourself, started talking about this more. Don't let it be too little too late. Thanks.

[@matslundstrom7763]

Here in Sweden: At 30 year old a vehicle gets tax excempt and only needs to be MOT:ed every second year. At 50, with a valid MOT, it never need to be checked again. And a vehicle can be reported as "not on the road" for an infinit time. This costs 3 pounds/year and the vehicle will keep its title.

[@peterriggall8409]

Likewise in most States of Australia there is some form of Concessional registration once a car is 30 years old. There is a logbook system. Here in Tasmania it is called Special Interest Vehicle (SI plates) with a logbook and limited to 100 days per. year. You do have to have a fully registered vehicle in your name to qualify. As cars are lasting longer (very little rust problems) the numbers of eligible vehicles is expanding which has caused a problem. Friend for instance has bought a 30 y.o. Ute/Pickup, put it on SI plates to do his tip runs and as a second car. It will never see a car show. This was never the intention of the concession. Good system but some will abuse any system.

[@Schlipperschlopper]

In Scandinavia soon the so called SMORVERBIDEN laws will bann driving ICE vehicles on public streets

[@YBM2007]

​@yt45204that is not true, but a piece of misinformation thats widespread in Sweden

[@YBM2007]

@yt45204 Yes I know better because I've read what that proposed legislation entails. People who still make the panicky claim that the government will now start impounding and crush classic cars have not.

[@YBM2007]

@yt45204 I'm going to need to see the exact quote. Also this disinfo has caused division here in Norway - with regards to Amcar specifically

[@MarcusTDM]

They scrapped the 25 year rule in 1997 but the 40 year rule didn’t start until 2014. Trouble is the government probably don’t want us keeping cars that have internal combustion engines sadly. 😢

[@volvo480]

It's not the government, it's manufacturers that don't want us keeping old cars.

[@stevebaker9709]

It was new labour Blair's mob .that stopped the 25 year rule and there was was no cut off date then the Conservatives got back into power and brought back the cut off date but had to make it 40years now when labour get back in they will scrap it again and historic cars will have to be MOT and taxed again

[@Fanakapan222]

The government of the incoming St Blair that scrapped it ? Must be a fair chance that if the same mob win in July, they'll scupper the 40 year rule.

[@paulhalley6760]

Yes, this 'time slip' wasn't mentioned in the video ......... In fact I've always been really surprised that the ones that qualified for Historic at 25 years, remained 'tax free'- we need to count our lucky stars !!!!

[@hendo337]

We know what this is all about, they want people to be hesitant to keep vehicles that are possible to repair yourself and isn't loaded with things that spy on you are under assault. Keeping an old car and keeping it on the road is the best thing we can do for the environment. The materialistic and greedy hate that.

[@BlackLines]

I rather think it's by design - they want rid of these cars. The scrappage scheme of 2009 was step 1.

[@AliMackMechanical]

I agree with you there BlackLines.

[@19892CV]

I really don't think there is a grand conspiracy to eliminate classics. Though they may become collateral damage due to ICE engines slipping into history.

[@BungleBare]

Back when I started buying classic car magazines with my pocket money around 1990 rubber bumpered MGBs were grudgingly being accepted as borderline classics. The oldest of these was 15 years old, the youngest only 10. I think this is partly due to them being a ‘60s design, but what constitutes a classic car largely became enshrined around then, just after the first boom in classic car values of the late ‘80s. The mindset in the classic car scene has struggled to move on, and categorise cars based on age, rather than what had already been deemed to qualify. It’s telling that the “scene” for younger classic cars is a slightly adjacent one to the mainstream classic car one. I do wonder whether the classic car cut-off point was partly driven by technology moving on. As you alluded to in the video Matt 80s cars look very different to chrome bumpered ‘70s ones. Crucially though (outside of highly strung exotica) most chrome bumpered cars are mechanically simpler, and at a level where they can be maintained by someone with a decent level of mechanical knowledge, a basic toolkit, and a Haynes manual. Most classic car owners would be comfortable maintaining a Morris Minor, for instance, in their garage at home, but might have shied away from trying to fettle a K series engined Metro with fuel injection that’s now as old as their Minor might have been when they bought it. The level of knowledge required to run 25/30 year old cars with the owner maintaining and repairing them at home is much, much higher. Mostly due to complexity added in to cars over the years. I personally run a 25 year old Ford Cougar as a second car. It’s very reliable, not too complicated as to be expensive to repair, but even so I sometimes I have to bail out and take it to a garage - there’s certain things I just can’t do at home. If I had one of its predecessors, a Capri, it would undoubtedly a lesser car (aesthetics and personal taste aside) in terms of reliability, performance, economy, emissions, and safety. It would though be very much easier to maintain and repair. Horses for courses, but a 40+ year old Capri would be tax and MOT exempt too. On economic grounds, I can see why a Capri would’ve more tempting - even though the purchase price would be higher, the running costs would be much lower if you were covering a minimal mileage each year, and planned to keep it for a good while as a hobby. Interesting video, Matt. Plenty of interesting points raised. Please keep banging the drum for younger classic cars.

[@mcirelandosharma7411]

​@@19892CVhave you heard of UN Agenda 2030 SDGs? No private property ownership, that means cars and houses. Old cars can't be switched off remotely, hence the need to get rid of them.

[@mcirelandosharma7411]

​@@19892CVperhaps your double negative was intentional? In which case my apologies 😂

[@RoyDavidson-g7g]

We got ripped off when they went from 25 years to 40 year's

[@gordonhughes4603]

Yep, thanks Tony Blair.

[@godfreyberry1599]

Government OVEREACH KILLS ANYTHING. The UK government has interfered with the joy of motoring and innovation from the get go.

[@rogerphelps9939]

No. A very sensible move. Clears old polluting rubbish that is junk in the eyes of anyone other than a small band of rather bonkers people.

[@dafdaffer1]

@@gordonhughes4603 yep 4 of my DAFs at the time got the tax free status scrapped in the 11 hour meaning keeping them on the road unrealistic.

[@fortheloveofnoise]

​@@rogerphelps9939old polluting rubbish? Then why are you still here?

[@fhwolthuis]

You have some real good points. I think the problem is the owners of classic cars are not united as a single party. So they don't have any power, unlike the motor industry. Maybe there is enough support in the UK to start a pressure group of a lot of classic car owners.

[@frankrizzo3922]

Great idea!! Need to get organized.. that's a fact!! 😊

[@hanshoogendyk2203]

My opinion has always been DIFFERENT MAKE/MODELS SAME PASSION WHAT YOU REALLY NEED TO DO IS ROOT OUT THE PETROL HEADS IN PARLIMENT GET THEM TO COME TO CAR EVENTS , GET THEM IN THE LIME LIGHT, then keep them there, however getting g car guys together and talking will take more efforts as there are too many short cut jack arses in the car world starting when they leave a car event

[@jeepxj8903]

It isn't so.much the 40 year thing that kills off the future classics, it's the massive road tax cost of the ones Caught by the various tax changes over the last 15 or 20 years. There are plenty of future classics that I have dismissed because of the tax. The only classics will be a few 1.0litre or diesel micro cars....

[@goosegog]

Have you not heard of the Historic and Classic Vehicle Alliance?

[@fhwolthuis]

@@goosegog no, I'm from the Netherlands, not the UK

[@autisticrebel1253]

My mum and dad's car is turning 25 this year and it has been really reliable. Owning an older car and keeping it going is probably more cost effective and better for the environment. They could half the road tax on a car once it gets to 20 years old, that way owning the car would be a bit cheaper.

[@jkk244]

I’ve got a 2002 MINI Cooper S which just turned 22 years old this week (I had tracked the build progress on MINI’s website as it was being assembled at Oxford back in the day, so I know its “birthday”). Anyway, while driving it today, I told myself that I was never ever going to get rid of it - I love it that much. Just hope I can continue to keep it alive in the future. The Texas climate here makes rust a total non-issue, so it’s only finding spare parts and being able to repair it as challenges to be met. Well, and dealing with the aging of all its plastics too. Fortunately, there doesn’t seem to be any anti-classic car legislation here. Annual registration for it is $75 (about £60) and I have it included in a bundle deal as part of my insurance for my classic cars (all 3 of them are over 25 years old) at a very reasonable cost. After reading all the comments, I realize how lucky I am with this situation.

[@davidspendlove5900]

The bmw Mini all downhill from there.Loved the r53.

[@MrDuncl]

In contrast American KZbinr The Car Wizard recently did a video on a 2002 Jaguar XJR. As soon as he showed underneath I thought that in the U.K. the car would be scrap as rust repairs to make it safe (and get through the U.K.s MOT safety inspection) would cost far more than the car was worth. He had the same opinion.

[@jkk244]

@@MrDuncl The US is so vast that there’s well-known nickname for the Midwest and Northeast parts of the country: the RustBelt. There, rust reigns supreme thanks to bad winters and heavy use of road salt. Cars from the southern and western parts of the US (especially California, Arizona, Texas, New Mexico etc) are prized due to no rust issues.

[@michaelcliffe562]

I own a BMW Z3 and a Toyota MR 2 W20 T-bar. Never ever is there going to be a new mid engined targa with pop up head lights or a new rag top roadster with an oversized straight six under an obnoxiously big bonnet. In my opinion, these cars were distinct in their day and they are going to be distinct in the far future. Just one of the things motivating me to hold on to them for as long as I can..

[@jimmyk9523]

No one wants a large engine car these days. That Z3 you'll struggle to give it away one day. Z4 you have to give away at rock bottom prices now

[@fugawiaus]

@@jimmyk9523do you live in a bubble? You don’t understand “classic”. As vehicles get rarer, their value goes up. Cylinders don’t matter. As far as 3 and 4 cyl cars are concerned they must work harder and therefore will wear quicker than a 6 or 8 cyl engine. You will be on your 3rd engine while a big lazy 6 or 8 is still going strong. It’s simply physics. The straight 6 in z3s and z4s are one of the most bulletproof engines ever designed and were put in the majority of bmws sold. I’d take the bmw over any overworked and over pressurised 3 or 4 cyl any day. I’m certainly not alone.

[@fortheloveofnoise]

​@@jimmyk9523LOL, 😂😂😂😂 come to the USA, you will find your statement is very wrong. Now BMWs here are cheap when theybare old because they are a nightmare to keep running. But say a Tiyota or Lexus with a V8, they are in demand.

[@jacquelinebrunder2384]

You are talking as if we still have a British government that values British things rather than a WEF controlled government that wants rid of all national identities including our, as they see it, silly preoccupation with car money pits, money that could be more usefully taken by them to hand to their favoured groups. If we keep voting for the same parties that are in parliament just now we will never have a British government serving the British people ever again.

[@alanolley7286]

Don't count on labour to help

[@zd-motion6688]

Kalergi plan

[@davidelliott5843]

Kalergi Pan Europa. I wonder if that was Orwell’s inspiration for 1984. It has significant parallels.

[@manoo422]

@Corey-mm7jw Voting is the ONLY way out of it.

[@imac-hunt]

@@manoo422😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣

[@leonardosimm3536]

I'm no expert (on anything) but it strikes me that keeping an older car on the road is probably more ecologically sound than manufacturing its replacement, even after taking into account the improvements in fuel economy and emissions of those newer vehicles. The ecological cost of manufacturing anything so complex is, after all, enormous. There are of course counter-arguments (improvements in safety, for one thing), but the relatively limited mileage covered by most classics would seem to mitigate many of those; less use equates to less risk (certainly in the minds of insurance companies).

[@kallekas8551]

I thought the Soviet Union collapsed in 1991…

[@X774M]

Take it from an eastern European, it never fell they changed tehre suits and spread it to corporations

[@barukkazhad8998]

The Soviets were free compared to us now😂

[@kallekas8551]

@@barukkazhad8998 I don’t know about that…ever driven a Lada 2105?🤣

[@fugawiaus]

Here in Australia they aren’t called “classic” cars they are called “historic vehicles” and you get an historic rego plate. It is based on age. Calling something “classic” is subjective. Depending on the state, the age is 25 or 30 years old. You join a club and get historic plates. This allows you to drive a certain amount of time in a year and rego is well under $100. The type of vehicle is meaningless.

[@phillipevans9414]

Here in Victoria, you get to choose between two usage levels for your "classic"...up to, either, 30 days per year, or 90 days per year, for your historic registration, with (from memory) the lower one costing around $120pa and the higher one circa $180pa, and you must keep a log book of your journeys. Historic registration is available to any vehicle 25 years or older, and the owner must be a paid member of a certified historic vehicle club (classic car club). There are no annual roadworthyness checks required, however the vehicle must be checked, and certified as roadworthy by a licensed tester, at the time of applying for historic registration. I have a '93 Ford Fairlane that I will be putting on historic rego soon. Cheers!

[@ambivalentonion2620]

This is exactly what I don't want in the uk at all, i fear that classics will be forced off the road for daily use with forcing black and silver plates and restricted use

[@fugawiaus]

@@ambivalentonion2620 you can still simply register them as normal with normal plates if you want. You can daily drive them as much as you want. It’s just an option.

[@ambivalentonion2620]

@@fugawiaus that's good, but i fear it will become forced at some point like in Singapore where they have black plates permanently attached to the car and limited to like 1000 miles.

[@phillipevans9414]

@@ambivalentonion2620. You can stil register a 25+ y.o car on regular registration for everyday use if you choose, you just get the option to choose to register it as an historic vehicle at lower cost, if you are not using it for everyday transport. Cheers!

[@rickmartin5288]

I'm 33 and vividly remember my Grandparents taking me to a car dealership nearby, where I basked in the glory of a brand new, racing green Rover 216 cabriolet. If I saw one now, I'd think of it as a classic. However, just 5 years later, my Jaguar XJ8 was rolled off the production line, and I use it as a daily driver, covering thousands of miles a year in it. I take it to car shows and so many people comment that they're surprised something "so modern" is on display, despite it being 22 years old. So I agree entirely, perception accounts for a great deal in what "looks classic" rather than "is a classic"

[@MaliqueGowley]

I dont know about england but in Australia we've got a strong classic car culture. Im 18 and im restoring multiple classic cars including an escort mk2 panel van and I've seen alot of people even kids doing the same thing as i am

[@MrDuncl]

Far too expensive for youngsters. It would be significantly cheaper for them to get something like a brand new Kia Picanto on finance.

[@markevans2280]

You restore that mk2 Escort kid, nice to see an 18yr old interested in classic Fords 👍

[@MaliqueGowley]

@@MrDuncl I didn't get my dream car at 18 by doing whatever's "easier" (I don't mean the escort, I'm also restoring another car which is my dream car)

[@lesallison9047]

Look after that van, not that many around in England. Plenty of the Mk2 saloons are still being used for training in rally driving. 😊 ✌️💚 🇬🇧

[@freddysquirenaranjo4859]

Officially in the UK there are 1.2 million classic cars fella, so yes there is!

[@robertmaitland09]

I have a 1998 Toyota Starlet, it's my only car that gets used for work, holidays, shopping etc. As long as it keeps passing its mot I'll keep it going as it's the best car I've ever owned

[@hunchanchoc8418]

Good man :-)

[@skylinegtsrock]

In that case you'll probably have it unti you die as it was made when toyota were made to last.

[@ambivalentonion2620]

​@@skylinegtsrocknot really, people always say that but there's a reason why there's hardly any corollas or starlets from that time left, the same as any other car, with good maintenance and keeping on top of rust it will last

[@skylinegtsrock]

@ambivalentonion2620 yes and the reason is the scrapage scheme. I worked for toyota during those years and seen all those great cars going to scrap. They'd still be on the road if it hadn't been for that.

[@stestar09]

I had 1 , a 98 & it was a brilliant car , the police took it 1 Christmas as i couldn't afford the road tax & was out dropping presents off in it , sadly i set off without headlights on & they stopped me , had to let it go as i couldn't afford to buy it out of the impound great car , took us family all over

[@kins749]

Survey completed, thanks for the pointer. As a driver of a 28 year old classic-to-be it's vital to keep these on the road

[@arunparkin2552]

I'm 21 but when I think of classic cars, I still imagine a chrome-bumpered car from the 1930s to the 1970s. I do however, see cars from the 1980s and 1990s as interesting, and my dad used to have a 1996 Peugeot 306 when I was a child, so I have fond memories of that. However, it's difficult for me to view a 1990's family car as a weekend only car. I currently have a 1970 Triumph 1300 FWD which I am driving pretty much every day for short trips and the occasional car show.

[@1500brakeduckpower]

Agreed. I am 26 and the older 50s/60s/70s cars are much more interesting to me. I run a 1963 Vauxhall Victor FB myself. There are some 90s cars that I like but I find many of them to be quite dull. A lot of the same drab colours were used in this time and the styling got quite boring. I can't really see many of them ever becoming as eye catching as 60s cars are now.

[@michaelbenardo5695]

That's what us "Old Farts" think as well, chrome-bumpered cars.

[@michaelbenardo5695]

@@1500brakeduckpower United States here, I would love to have a Vauxhall Cresta or Velox from the late 50s/early 60s. Yes, I know they were rust-buckets, but they are gorgeous cars. And rust is not a big problem here in California, as we don't salt our roads.

[@MrDuncl]

I cant think of any cars that my Father had which I would consider to be classics. However, I think differently about the Citroen DS23 Estate my best friends mother had in the 1970s. If people hadn't seen one it would look futuristic to them today.

[@ukmud6218]

When the scrappage scheme car you chopped in is now worth more than the plastic box you got 2k discount on makes me smile

[@23chilled]

Never went for it. Seen mates chop in their old nice motors for plastic junk and I was rocking a solid old German car and it was tons nicer than what they were rolling in.

[@awalk5177]

It is not Historic vehicles that are under threat. From what I hear it is cars that have been modified away from originality that come under scrutiny. It may be that the new rules would not look favourably on cars with wider wheels , wheel arches, different engines, suspension, exhausts from the factory product. Resto-mods may not fit with the current category of Historic vehicle and could be taxed. We need to read the proposals in detail. I am all for original 40 year old Historic vehicles which are a tribute to past engineering, they should be preserved.

[@waynepurcell6058]

What is wrong with a set of streetable coil overs adjusted to a reasonable setting for an instant handling improvement or wider (again within reason) tires. The answer is nothing. People that go crazy like here in the US with hyper lowered "stance" or other obviously unsafe things (squatted trucks), and I can understand it, but banning something "within reason for performance but not historic" is stupid. Just handle the people that take things to ridiculous and patently unsafe levels.

[@James-cs2wi]

Older cars are better built and more reliable😅😅

[@ColinCarFan]

They are definitely not better built and they're not more reliable, but they are easier to fix and will remain so

[@lordterra1377]

Better built from the standpoint they were designed to be serviceable. I like how older vehicles drive, where you can feel the road and vehicle move. Modern vehicles are too soft.

[@jsanders100]

So wrong, either you’re completely delusional or you’ve never owned a modern car.

[@michaelbenardo5695]

AND, if something DOES go bad, you can fix it in your driveway. Today's rolling computers have to be brought to the shop, and you will receive a HUGE repair bill.

[@lordterra1377]

@@michaelbenardo5695 Exactly I have 3 older vehicles I will take to my grave. :D Almost nothing modern is worth saving.

[@david1976aful]

I just can’t see cars made now will ever become classics in same way. Modern cars all look similar and have too many electrical components to go wrong and try and tinker with them will be a nightmare.

[@RobGMyMX5]

With respect, I think that's just a perspective thing. People who were your age in the 80s would have said the same about 60s and 70s cars. "Too modern, too complicated, too much to go wrong." In fact, I remember my grandad saying exactly that. Even a car from the early 2000s is relatively less complicated than something made in 2024. And plenty of older cars were still complicated and difficult to work on too.

[@peterduxbury927]

Not forgetting how simple it is with a straight 4 speed / reverse gearbox. Try repairing a CVT Transmission with a million worn parts inside.

[@gearhead9828]

Very true! 👍​@@RobGMyMX5

[@fortheloveofnoise]

2005-2014 Mustangs will definitly become classics some day

[@Morgans_Miles]

Being honest Matt, there already is a *massive* gap in classic cars - there are very few (in percentage terms) cars from the late 70s to the early 90s… most of them ended their days on airfields post-scrappage scheme. It’s “improved” the values of the survivors but there’s a generation missing…

[@deanosaur808]

Looking at graphs on Howmanyleft, I see no steep dropoff of cars made between 1970 - 1990 around the time of the scrappage scheme. For example, the ford escort, the drop started in the late 90s, and drops at a constant rate until around 2010. It's hard to find any evidence to support your claim 🤷‍♀️ Check any popular model of car on Howmanyleft, you will not find a sudden drop off of any models around 2009 🤔

[@jefftodd621]

Yes; the last generation of distinctive cars before they all became euro-clones. When did you last see any Renault 6, 12, 15, 17, 18? What about Chevettes, Sunbeams, Hunters, Marinas, Princesses! Fiat 131 2000TC (far better than an RS2000 but rotted 10 times quicker!)

[@freddysquirenaranjo4859]

@@jefftodd621 or DS Pallas

[@tonys1636]

The Ministry of Transport missed a trick when the test changed from cars over 10 years old to ones over 3, Road Fund Duty could have been changed to an annual mileage based charge. They should do that now and reduce the historic exemption to 30 years as here in Ireland and other EU countries. The more one uses the roads the more one should pay, it's a lot more fair for those that don't do high mileages. Forget about engine size as people who own gas guzzlers pay more through Fuel Duty and VAT.

[@stevepitts7998]

As the owner of a weekend driven 5 litre V8 doing around 2,000 miles a year I couldn't agree more. Over £700 road tax and it sits on the drive for 5 days a week. I must be mad!

[@X774M]

The only thing I disagree with is the pay by mile, unless it could be done by insurance based tax

[@nicksspeedshop8664]

I'm 21 and from Germany and I have a 1988 Pontiac Firebird I am fixing up together with my dad. It does run and drive and looks really good just needs attention every now and then. The government has to take her from my cold dead hands!

[@fortheloveofnoise]

My grandfather had one, and my mother a 92 Camaro (same car).

[@martentrudeau6948]

A 20 year old ICE car is greener than a Tesla. The Tesla cars expire before they are 10 years old, and then must be disposed of with a whole new car. ICE vehicles have better range, perform better in extreme weather, weigh less than an EV and handle and brake better than a EVs. ICE vehicles don't spontaneously burst into flames. The EV policies, are not about the environment or energy consumption, they about taking our freedom to travel away and controlling we the people.

[@davidvicari5139]

Brainless regurgitation of the fossil propaganda.

[@slowery43]

complete nonsense and ignorance

[@Nightdiver20]

@@slowery43 Lol, how dare he notice things

[@uneducatedromantic4049]

@@slowery43Tesla owner and year zero advocate … classic symptoms of someone who has suffered a traumatic past.

[@Since1970Canucks]

Must be

[@bispal]

Great video and well discussed. Thanks. I have a 1996 MX5 which i used as my daily until last year when I found myself, in semi rural Surrey, 200M in a ULEZ zone. I have owned my car for 11 years and I don't drive through the week much so only do around 1,500 local miles a year. I now have to pay £12.50 to drive my MX5 off my road. I pay and get none of the benefit as there is a very busy A road (non-ULEZ) 200M from my house. So I get the pollution (if there is any left after its used up by the thousands of TPO's trees lining the road) but still pay. its a lose lose situation. Made even worse as I run my car on sustainable fuel (as i do so few miles) So I am doing me bit AND getting penalised and no benefit. I had to buy a whole other car to use as my daily, so of course I bought a 3.2L 6 cyl Porsche and somehow that's fine. The best car for the planet (so I have read) is the one that exists already. Classic cars are not usually daily drivers, they do very small mileages. The big culprits are the 2.5 tonne SUV's that not only use a lot of CO2 to manufacture but are more or less 'throw away' on lease deals creating 3 year new car cycles, not to mention tyre particles from tyres lasting under 5k miles in many cases (press article about that today). So many people comment about my MX5, small children point & wave, it adds some joy to a world that's becoming ever more uniform and bland. Of course electric is the answer for the long term 15kmpa daily driver but we should be allowed our vinyl at the weekend instead of our streaming service so we can feel alive and joyous.

[@simonhowarth863]

What is the logic of buying into a throw away economy where manufacturers build cars to be obsoleted within 10 years ! The other problem is because so called modern classics rely on basic electronics and bespoke plastic components it’s so easy for the manufacturer to obsolete certain components thus rendering the car useless. I run a few original Audi RS models from 1994 to 2001……Audi UK has absolutely no interest in supporting its heritage even though it spent millions in rallying and Le Mans creating it ! Anyway thank you for making people aware of this impending disaster.

[@Sorted7]

100% agree. I also struggle when my 2001 e46 330i has become £415 to tax when a diesel - which we r being told is now the devil - can be free to tax or £30?! It’s like someone in government has no clue yet has been put in charge of this type of thing. Hmmm

[@exxel01234]

The government are only here to get as much tax from you without giving them any hassle and to spend your tax money on the most stupid of things plus embezzling some to friends 👍 it all needs changing

[@MrDuncl]

The transport minister who brought that in later admitted it was a mistake. They only looked at the CO2 figures and totally ignored NOX etc. Even before Dieselgate I decided I didn't want a Diesel due to the obnoxious clouds of black smoke many fairly new ones were belching out.

[@capitanvonchickenpants8492]

Having personal transport as a hobby will eventually be crushed, you will own nothing and be happy

[@LOTPOR0402]

Almost there, how dare you go against your controllers

[@johnnyjrotten59]

Communists don't like people having fun.

[@deanosaur808]

But we will still be able to own a debt 🥳🥳🥳 and a barcode on our foreheads 😅😅😩 I'm off to dignitas 🤣

[@Jam3sA]

I literally brought this very subject up in Hubnut's last livestream. My personal feeling is there's going to be a classic car black hole in future for 2006-2017 cars, purely on emissions-based Road Tax.

[@BRED510]

I completely agree, I actually think 2010 on cars are doomed as classics (unless it’s something really special) due to legislation and their complicated emissions (and other) systems that cost a fortune to repair, especially as we transition to other fuel types. If EV’s do become the future I could see some of those surviving as early examples (like early Tesla’s), kind of like retro computers are saved now.

[@jamesgizasson]

They've already started doing this here in the US. They froze exemptions at 1975 in CA, and they used to rollover every year. Now, they're eventually going to restrict or ban older cars in the future. They're already fighting to keep 25 year old imports out, or illegal to operate. It makes me sick.

[@keithmatthews1673]

Times change. I suspect that interest in older cars will go the same was as: antique furniture - Prices peaked in the 1980s but now you can buy antiques cheaper than Ikea furniture and that is what younger folk want. Yesterday I saw a nice victorian mahogony chest and a Georgian oak bureau for free outside a house! Classical Music - my local orchestra have been forced by the council who pay them to do some performances in fancy dress with added clowning to try to get younger folk interested. Hi-Fi - we used to have turntables amps big speakers casettee a cd players and LP collections but Younger people buy an Alexa box or a sound bar for the telly and sub for Spotify! The economics of old cars may change. Prices may be good now but could fall reducing the 'investment' potential. Also for how long will governments allow garages to sell petrol. In 20 years you might have to buy it in gallon tins if you want to run a lawn mower but it could become a restricted product. There are lots of products that are now hard to find of have been banned for 'health' reasons - eg paint strippers with Methelene Chorlide that used to actually remove paint. If there is consutation on old cars, it could go 'the other way'. The greens might lobby for old cars to not be favourably treated as they polute! The 40 year rule could be scrapped as not everyone will support the idea of tax free privilege and 90% of the population probably currently dont know about it and might not support it if they find out. In short we may be in for a distopian future where some things that were traditionally taken for granted may become tightly controled by the ever increasing hoardes of Jobsworths who want to impose their 'liberal' will on evereyone else. Sorry for the long rant!

[@jr-hr2mw]

4:16 I'm 24 and my memory of the 200 is my Dad having one about 15 years ago. Head gasket blew and he scrapped it

[@melcu1990]

my mercedes is 35 years old, i live just outside the bristol clean air zone so bit annoying but definitely worth waiting 5 more years. its my only car as well and love it

[@ClassicCarDriver]

No MoT is only because testers don’t know how to test old cars, and in some cases the tests are not valid. It doesn’t mean that you can drive a car which is unroadworthy though… you still have the responsibility to do that. Most classic owners look after their cars so well that this is nowhere near anything that could be considered a problem…

[@MrDuncl]

It could be a problem with 25 year old cars. There again, from our experience, getting a MK1 Ford Ka up to 25 years would take some doing. At ten years old it had no mechanical problems and four holes in the floor !

[@steveparker9946]

Excellent post. My TL;DR takeaways: 1) Reduced rates for low annual mileage makes a lot of sense, environmentally and in terms of road use 2) Around the 14 minute mark: Progressive taxing on older cars based on their market value*. In the older-car realm, the owner of a £10000 Ford vs a £400,000 Ferrari can probably afford different levels of vehicle tax. So yeah tax the Ferrari owner a bit more because they've got an investment going there, so it's legitimate to tax that whilst allowing the Sierra owner to maintain their car too *however you judge that!

[@usuallyfixingtinkering]

Matt his video should be entitled "Are all Cars Doomed?" because that is what is happening and not just Classics, the tunnel is converging on both sides. People don't really want pre-war classics and this will soon moved to pre-80s classics. But equally people don't except the majority of 90s cars as classics because of how modern that era simply was! Unfortunately instead of easing pressure on the car community I can definetly see the next Government abolishing the 40 year Tax exemption and start re-taxing everything! It's a shame but everything has it's time and we should be concentrating on the present, enjoying them IN THE PRESENT and not focusing on 20 years time and what that brings. There's too many things to worry about other than cars in 20 years time very sadly. We just have to live and enjoy these cars in the present because tomorrow is ever guaranteed. Simple.

[@VirtualPAH]

I'm glad people like yourself are making youtube content to show how easy it is to work on cars from the 90s and early 00s, before electronics got too complicated, that can be considered modern classics. Just how much room so many of those cars have in the engine bay to make working on them easier, and how little more than a decent socket set is required. The simpler it is the more people will look to do tinkering as a hobby and save money not paying a garage to do the easier jobs. This will drive demand for modern era cars that are in that sweet spot of having enough modern luxuries without being too complicated and intimidating to have a go oneself.

[@usuallyfixingtinkering]

@@VirtualPAH Absolutely which is why these modern classics are such a delight! One of the biggest concerns of the future of the industry is a skills shortage. If everyone like myself started making videos on "how to do this" etc, they'd be little issue. It's all about knowledge, sharing it, knowledge is power and it will sustain the hobby for longer. In fact, it's not sustainable to own any car without basic mechanical skills and know-how. Otherwise your at the mercy of garage labour costs in 2024!

[@dlam2864]

The UK gov is the problem. Here in Arkansas US. There is no inspection or emissions required

[@YBM2007]

How on Earth is that a good thing

[@dlam2864]

@@YBM2007 government does interfere with what car you can drive

[@jackn4853]

Safety first in Arkansas.

[@MrDuncl]

To clarify the U.K. MOT checks against the rules when the car was made. On a 39 year old car it was something like "No visible smoke". As for the rest of the MOT inspection if you roll up in a car with rusted through engine mountings it will fail whether it is 39 years old or 3 years old. Fun fact: It was the latter that killed off the Lancia brand in the U.K.

[@fortheloveofnoise]

Same in Alabama, my car would not be legal to drive in Europe 😂

[@BRED510]

I’ve said for years mid 90’s on cars won’t reach classic status and won’t survive like previous generation cars, a mixture of government legislation and the electronics of those cars will end up killing them. I think cars 2010 on are really doomed as we transition to other fuel types as the interest to keep them (unless it’s something special) won’t be there, and the cost of repair as they get ever more complicated with DPF’s, Adblue systems, etc means they just won’t be repaired and survive. There is zero point me having a non historic status classic as I live between Bristol and Bath. Remember it isn’t just London, it’s all the CAZ zones that are popping up.

[@timbutton4990]

I've thought for some time now that the plan was to get 20+ year old cars off the road. It started when the MOT changed, I've been told that testers have to find 'advisories' on older cars for example.

[@davekirton4096]

As an MOT tester I can assure you we don't have to find advisories on older cars.

[@JohnnyPaton]

Funny you say that. My daughter's 2003 Fiesta got an advisory for corrosion on the subframe. I checked it myself and there's about two little spots of surface rust.

[@davekirton4096]

@@JohnnyPaton I understand what you're saying but that's probably down to the tester being a bit over keen shall we say, there's no requirement to find advisories.

[@JohnnyPaton]

@@davekirton4096 I think they just advise on minor corrosion to keep themselves right.

[@SalvageMasterEssex]

@@davekirton4096 some MOT testers would find advisories for a brand new car 🤣🤣

[@Reman1975]

Never thought about it like that before, but yeah. In my head, an '86 Capri is a desirable classic (Still miss my 2.8i special), but an '86 Sierra is just an old banger. In the mid 2000's I weighed in an '89 plate 1.6 estate because it was going to take me about a week of evenings to weld it up for the MOT. It was just easier to scrap it and buy another cheap banger to run about in. On the other hand, the '85 2.0 Capri Laser I had several years beforehand took me over a month to fabricate and weld in all the unobtainable floor panel sections it needed to be made roadworthy again, and the thought of scrapping it didn't even cross my mind.

[@Car_and_classic_lover]

I'm 18 and at one point had a 2002 Mazda MX5, 76' Rover 3500 and a 1999 Rover Mini. Still have the Mini. Although I'm worried about its future. Although its still got an A series engine (with a catalystic converter!) It is still being effected by ULEZ etc. Yet my V8 rover was tax exempt. I love the fact that these 40yr old classics are being protected, I definitely agree that 25yr old vehicles should have a different tax bracket. I'm fairly confident that the love for classic cars will contine for many years to come. There are still loads of people my age who love 50s/60s and 70s cars. But I definitely agree that 20/30 year old cars are under threat. Classic cars genarate a lot of money for this country. So i doubt the government would want to get rid of them, I think its a case that they just don't appreciate 20/30 yr old cars yet.

[@fortheloveofnoise]

My grandfather just got an 02 Miata this year, base model with the 5 speed manual instead of the 6 speed manual

[@marcusspinks5258]

The road tax cost and the insurance companies charging (I’ve been told) high insurance prices to young enthusiasts isn’t helping encourage the younger population to keep interesting cars on the road. Isn’t up cycling & recycling buss words for the modern world? EV is just encouraging the throw away lifestyle?

[@iansmotorsandlife7408]

I daily drive a 97 astra arctic, 1.6 16v. £325 for the year for VED. It’s also crazy expensive on insurance but that could be a local thing. Point is I’m daily driving it to get my value out of it. I love driving it but I don’t know how many people like me can keep them going when it’s this much.

[@MarkHurlow-cf2ix]

My 1966 Galaxie 500 convertible looks like new , I put all wheel disk breaks in it electronic ignition and so on but it’s not going to hold up to any law that says don’t drive a death trap because it was a safety hazard new. I made it a lot safer over the years out of fear…lol but I love it.

[@PaddyWV]

There's been an extraordinary rise in the price of engined vehicles in recent years which is either profiteering by manufacturers OR a deliberate attempt to narrow the gap between petrol motors and EV's. It was only 2017 when the Dacia Sandero appeared at £5995. Look at that now!? I am reminded of the time that CD's were an emerging force. They were priced at about £12.99 upwards. Vinyl albums were still around £5.99. So Government slapped VAT on music and vinyl shot up in price. Killing the Market. Deja vu.

[@hunchanchoc8418]

Yes - WHY does a Sandero now cost £14k ?

[@deanosaur808]

The same goes for mark one escorts. There are thousands left yet the prices would indicate that they are super rare 🤷‍♀️

[@MrDuncl]

@@deanosaur808 Rally successes and the fact that there used to be hundreds of thousands. My first car was a two door MK1 Escort. I sold it in 1984 for £495.

[@fortheloveofnoise]

​@@deanosaur808Racing heritage

[@sandwichbar8226]

They don't want you driving, Petrol, Diesel, Hybrid or full EV. That's tbe end game...

[@GT380man]

Or motorcycles either.

[@ukmud6218]

I've got an 88,90,90 and an 09. With the longest ownership of 24 years. I'm in it for the long run

[@sandwichbar8226]

I've got a 79, 85,, 90, 97 and an 05. 👍

[@ukmud6218]

It just feels normal doesn't it😂

[@Zeem4]

82, 02, 05 and 06. The 02 is the daily driver, the 05 is the backup car, the 06 is the current project and the 82 has been sat in a garage for at least 12 years without being touched, but it's next in the project queue.

[@WaynePickering]

In Australia,in addition to what the previous person said regarding Historic Rego,the major Car Clubs lobbied the Government to allow personal use up to 60 days/year,instead of the previous rule of only traveling to a mechanic or a car show.The Classic Car scene is a huge industry in Australia,as well as being a good social outlet and investment.I imported a 1975 Cadillac Coupe DeVille from the U.S.,and don’t even have to change it to Right Hand Drive,due to it being over 30yo.

[@DavidFerriday]

I had a 1993 W140 S500 that I wanted to just enjoy for the odd weekend of the year but it was impossible to even get insurance for it so I had to sell it.

[@LeftIsBest001]

Great topical video. It's a situation we're facing in Australia too. I suppose one thing that's different is that during the 2010s, vehicle manufacturing died here, so those remaining Australian built vehicles could become "classics" earlier than they otherwise would. The other issue is fuel.

[@NotRubensDad]

I do wonder with the arrival of electric cars, which often do look substantially different, will then start to age the 90's stuff finally.

[@jasoncornell1579]

The thing about electric cars is they can all be remotely turned off

[@davekirton4096]

​@@jasoncornell1579No they can't

[@zm321]

@@davekirton4096 Cobblers. Thirty years ago the McLaren F1 could be remote started from the other side of the world to where the car was. A modern EV can be remotely switched off and this is in fact already being done. I'm aware of cars on finance agreements being remotely switched off when owners have defaulted on finance payments, this is happening now in the USA and New Zealand, and back in July 2017 Auto Express here in the UK ran an article about sub prime finance companies doing this.

[@tonyashby9287]

Hi I have a 2006 renault scenic mk2 1.4 it costs me £351 pounds a year road tax and the car meets all of the emissions tests and ulez. Is in good condition would like to keep this car on the road .

[@hunchanchoc8418]

I didn't realise the VED tax had got so ludicrous. :-(

[@ablestringer9063]

I drive a Mk3 Mondeo 2.0L Auto on a Y plate on a daily basis, currently doing about 10K a year. I paid £590 for it in 2019 and its been one of the best cars I've ever had. It meets all the ULEZ requirements for all the cities in the UK and its even got a Crit'Air3 rating for Paris and other French cities. Cost me £34 a month in tax which I don't really mind and about the same in insurance. I'm not interested in modern cars in the slightest, maybe a newer Mondeo at some point.

[@MrDuncl]

The fact that I got a Mondeo as a company car in the month they were launched makes me feel old. There again my first two cars (Mk1 Escort then Mk3 Capri) would now be eligible for the 40 year rule if they hadn't rusted away.

[@zuiko21]

Very interesting video! I'm in Spain and the owner of a late '71 Citroën DS. To put some context: -The Road Tax is usually MUCH lower here, no matter the age, especially up to 1.6L engines. But if your car is a "classic" (30+ years old), depending on the city you live in, you may get total exemption, partial exemption... or no benefit at all. Fortunately, I got the full exemption, although had to pay the first year of ownership (~130€) -My DS has to pass MOT *yearly*, including emissions tests for any car made since 1967... unless it's declared as a "historic" car; but the procedure is expensive (~1000€) and very complex (including an engineering report, etc). Then, you get new plates (with an 'H' in front) and MOTs become less frequent (every 4-5 years, depending on age). Also, you can drive the car into low emission zones, IIRC. A new law is in the making to turn this procedure cheaper and simpler, but not yet... -Lastly, some insurance companies accept classics at much reduced rates, with some restrictions: you must be the owner of another "modern" car (supposed to be de daily driver), have a mileage limit (~5000 km/year) and only the specified driver is legally allowed to drive the vehicle! You may include as many authorised drivers as you want, as long as each of them is the owner of another "modern" car...

[@johndutton9739]

My ‘89 Volvo 240 is currently £345 just to tax. Too much for a second hobby car really so it sits in my drive. :( It’s crazy how it’s crept up and up. I reckon labour will probably scrap the historic tax thing altogether before it gets to being 40 years old. I reckon a lot of future classics will be scrapped because of high tax rates. A 2006 mondeo st220 is £710 to tax - who is going to afford that on a second car - not many folk.

[@uhn100]

This was a eye opener for me Matt my first car was a 1953 Morris Minor series 2 road tax was 12 pounds the following year it went up to 25 pounds when I left the UK and moved to America it was 130 pounds for the year classic cars are thriving here I own a 1995 Jaguar XJS Convertible with a 146,000 miles it's classed as a antique emissions exempt and the tag is $50 a year so I think some changes for classic cars need to be done for sure thanks for sharing this video and giving your thoughts on this issue best regards Andy Allen.

[@PaddyWV]

In 1998 I interviewed Russ Smith at Practical Classics. We spoke about the possibility of Classic Cars being legislated off the road then. His thoughts then was that across Europe the Classic Car lobby and the Industry that supported it was powerful enough and contributed enough revenue to be able to counter any fears people might have of being eradicated. It didn't happen then. I would hope it won't happen now.

[@Slippingclutches91]

That's all very good points. I had the realisation the other day. If most cars start going electric and hybrids. In 10-15 years time we won't have and second hand cars as they won't be worth fitting new batteries into them. When purchasing a second family. A 740 we add how much tax we have to pay on it until it's exempt into our budget. It will be exempt in 88. Unfortunately they're trying to get rid of the older cars on the road. Keep our classics going I say.

[@williamwales6619]

Food for thought, As i have said before i currently drive a 21 year old Honda Civic,65 k on ODO. Recently spent quite a few bob on the rear braking system. £400 plus VAT. to be exact. Probably won't pass another Mot due to corrosion on the rear wheel arches and surrounding area. Used to do all this work myself but due to health issues can't do it any more. Probably be my last car as well. Can't afford to run it Tax , Fuel Costs and insurance. 50% increase in my premium year on year. 5% cost of living. I don't think so. AT least Dick Turpin had the decency to wear a mask. This government has the power but not the will to sort out the people who are robbing us blind. Stopping there in case i get into trouble. Finally i have been driving 52 years and owned a car for all of them always paid my dues . I won't do the maths . Thanks for the opportunity to get it off my chest. Later 😠

[@nige1840]

You've had a good run of car ownership...Memories to cherish.

[@fortheloveofnoise]

Have the metal replaces and weld on new metal

[@redsidebiker]

Mate, I'm with you! I've got 2 cars. Both of which are over 18 years old and used as dailys. The newer one is a late 2005 Pug 407 tdi estate (almost 180k on the clock) that is mostly used for work and shopping. The older is a Calibra V6 auto (1998) with 93k on the clock - 17 of which are left registered (9 are SORN) used for shopping work & fun. I can fix both with a hammer and a handful of metric spanners! VED should be on fuel - the more you use, the more you pay. My personal mileage including commuting is

[@BuddyTheWolfYT]

Here I am in Florida driving an 07 with smashed out cats, no inspections, feels great man...

[@deanosaur808]

Leave those poor cats alone 😛🤣🤣

[@fortheloveofnoise]

Here in Alabama is even more free

[@davidp4456]

I thought you were going to pick up on the latest news that the Government is no longer going to recognise a car as a classic if it has had a chassis repair and force it to become a Q plate.

[@willswheels283]

Ah interesting subject Matt, yes it’s a shame that there’s a perception that cars that don’t have carburettors, distributors and chromed bumpers are not really classics, I made a Facebook post on a page and mentioned that in a few years time we’ll be seeing mid to late 2000’s cars being posted on this modern classic page of cars that we don’t see anymore and some comments were negative saying that cars of the 2000’s for example lack classic style and character! But each decade of cars have their own style of car design and therefore is part of our history. I think any vehicle that has survived 20 yrs on uk’s pot holed, salt laden mucky roads should get a concession on tax and a regognition and credit to its owners who have bothered to look after them.

[@fortheloveofnoise]

Cars of the 2000s that will be classics: Miata S2000 TT Mustang Camaro The various Zs MR2 Spyder Fiat 124 Convertible FRS/BRZ/GR86 ect ect....

[@Thanos.m]

I agree with you what I think realistically speaking not many people will daily drive a 30 year old car so I believe like in many other European countries classic status should be brought forward to 30 years now for cars bwtwen 20-30 years old I believe you should be able class then as classic as you mentioned with perhaps some mileage limitations free passes to ulez zones etc. One thing that does make me somewhat optimistic is when I started going to various modern classic and classic rallies about 8 years ago I used be one of the few if not only younger person there but that has changed every year I see more and more younger people in those but we do need to support them.

[@FrankInAShed]

Very interesting video, I've had vaguely related thoughts about my Mazda 323 and NA MX5; ie; "i've only got 5 years until they're on free tax and mot!!... I bet they'll change the rules before i get there!!!!" 😵‍💫 I wouldn't mind the MOT being a requirement for "young classics" if they just let us have the victory of free tax, fat chance considering the financial position the state/economy is in. 😕

[@rockatansky1305]

...,plus all the illegals we have to support !

[@ednowliniii]

Here in the USA, I have a VW bug (1955). The DMV said it wasn’t an original numbers matching car, therefore they said it was a “kit car”, and needed to conform to current emission standards… 2022 at the time.

[@jonathonedwards6741]

I somewhat disagree, my main point is me. I’m 28 with an enthusiastic father who now owns a 1929 Austin 7 and although that’s not really my ideal ownership experience I will likely inherit this now 95 year old car. This enthusiasm has also rubbed off on me as I’m a proud owner for a 2013 swift sport that I can see me owning 20 possibly 30 years down the line, I also own a so called “real classic” in the form of a 1960 Austin Healey Sprite that I plan to keep for a long while and introduce my kids to. I’m hoping that I can pass on the enthusiasm for these 2 cars to my future children. It’s for these reasons I don’t think that the classic market is doomed, yes I’m willing to keep my Suzuki on the road and more than happy to keep MOTing my Sprite yearly (now I own it) as I see the MOT as a fantastic way of maintaining these cars.

[@marvwatkins7029]

Notice he never says who he is, as if he considers himself that well known and on fact famous. What hubris. What a braggart. He's also no Jay Leno.

[@goblin457]

This lot in governance at the moment don't care they don't even care about their own citizens so unfortunately doubt they'll care much about what is a classic car

[@alisterwest6987]

Second that 😮

[@goblin457]

@@mikecrimlis3366 That's why I won't be voting for them, you wouldn't in a million years get me voting Selfservatives and Labour are just as bad as they're

[@chrispalmer9838]

No establishment political party gives a damn for average citizens. We are less than livestock to them...

[@SalvageMasterEssex]

@@mikecrimlis3366 Definitely...Labour are all car haters so don't expect any free tax from them.

[@robbierobson3251]

Good points, well made. However, our cherished 40+ year old classics lived through the era of NO tax or MOT exemption, and they were saved anyway by people who loved them at the time, despite the costs involved. Modern classics of less than 40 years old will still be saved by those who remember them from when they were new. Nostalgia counts for everything. Pre-war cars are fetching less and less, unless they are a Bentley, Bugatti or similar. Each era of car will have its day, then, as the generation who remembers them is replaced by one that does not, will fade into history. That is the way of things and nothing new. Classics of any era will survive as long as there are a sufficient number of enthusiasts to look after them, and, sadly, no longer than that.

[@TheOmegastoopreme]

The madness is how it's better for the environment long term to keep an old car going and not scrap something then buy a new one. I swear it's all about money the more get bought it must fill the coffers better :(

[@bill90405]

You’re on to something…

[@fortheloveofnoise]

Money is the root of all evil.

[@kevinjacobs2730]

The Trigra Twin Top is beginning to enter the 20 year mark on the earlier ones ( 04 onwards) its already a rare ish car as only 20,000 or so were sold. my 09 1.8 is over £300 to tax, and I only do around a thousand miles in it each year. An example of a car that could be lost though high taxation.

[@arrangrant4614]

The UK government plan to eventually restrict the supply of petrol & diesel, petrol stations will gradually disappear. I am guessing you will have some sort of license and a very good reason to obtain any.

[@sockrabbtt]

I think one of the cores of these types of modern problems is that young people really just don't care about cars today. some even hate them and resent anyone who doesn't.

[@johnandrews8983]

Hi I've always been into classics I've had many But nowadays it seems like we as citizens can't have what cars we want its more like what the government including sadact khan want us to drive We go out & work hard to earn money to indulge in our hobbies but no thats not allowed Bring back the 70s-90s when there wasn't hardly any restrictions Not a classic but my 2008 ford mondeo diesel has 271.678 miles on it & still runs spot on..

[@JustCallMeHorse]

My 02 freelander with 162k on the clock has passed last two mot's with no advisories and no rust and she easily passed emissions test, as it running on biodiesel for the last few years. I'm keeping mine on the road as long as I can, as I love driving it😁

[@tonys1636]

A farmer friend makes his own biodiesel, he collects used veg oil from local chippers, filters it and mixes it with a small quantity of home distilled alcohol, he says it is a lot cheaper than agri diesel. His machinery gives off a chip smell. He also saves on the disposal cost of unsold, not meeting the grade wheat and barley. The 'Vodka' is great too.

[@JustCallMeHorse]

@@tonys1636 Thats so cool to hear, I just mix 30% kerosene to my veg-oil gives of a kerosene heater smell with a hint of a chippy. I get more mpg out of the freelander then normal diesel too :)

[@mancavehobbies6213]

My car is a 2005 Renault Kangoo 4x4 with 158,000 and she passed her m.o.t with only 2 advisorys.

[@andrewthompsonuk1]

I agree its very important to cherish the cars of the 90s or the 00s. Particularly the UK built cars. It makes me sad how few 20 to 40 year old UK built cars are around.For example the amazing products of Sunderland or Swindon that are totally forgotten.

[@TC10193]

Rover 200's may still be at the old car stage but there are always a disproportionately large number of them at classic car shows.

[@martinlaver007]

‘‘Twas always thus. One only has to look at the vintage car market. Old cars eventually get forgotten and become museum pieces. All cars will, in time.

[@mikeburnitt403]

My other half owns a 2003 Astra 1,6 Auto (left to her by her Uncle at only 2 years old) which used to cost £210 to tax, now, since the change its £345, the Government are going out of their way to get old cars off the road and into the scrapyard because they get more off us by forcing us to get a new(er) car VAT etc so why would they listen!

[@LawrenceMclean]

We had a 1961 Ford F100 (pickup) with a "Y" block V8, we parted with it, it had over 500,000 miles and had only ever had occasional oil changes, even the battery was original. British and most European cars were considered rubbish by many people outside of he major cities. 1970's Toyota corollas are still daily drivers (in areas where rust is not a problem).

[@grifterchrisify]

Also Ulez is a scam 12.50 to use a car does that go to the environment? Does it f@ck straight into khunts pocket

[@Con-Brio]

100% agree. The current system is unreasonable and makes no sense. I have owned my 32 year old MK2 Golf GTI 16v for 24 years, HALF MY LIFE, I want to keep it!... I also live in the expanded ULEZ zone, so to drive it once a month for a few miles I have to pay £345 Road Tax, £50 MOT and £150 ULEZ. Obviously that is all on top of the insurance and tax on petrol. We should really only pay road tax for the days we use our cars on the road.

[@OldCarsNewVan]

I totally get the thing about high road tax for 20/30yr old cars - our 1993 mx5 (pictured) is about £360pa (ouch) whilst our Rover P6 is free 😀But if you think the UK is bad - check out a channel called Seaside Garage. Nice guy - based in a Nordic country - with some really cool old cars. He has an old camper which at the moment (before it hits a landmark birthday in about 3 years) costs circa 5,000euros a year in road tax!!!!! So please don't think the UK is some outrageous rip off outlier compared to the countries as it's simply not true. There are far worse countries / systems out there!

[@davidelliott5843]

The Fiat FIRE engine (the first to be built entirely on robot lines) was noted for head gaskets failing. In reality they are very reliable but like any reasonably modern engine, the coolant capacity is low. They warm up quickly but absolutely will not tolerate a coolant leak. A float sensor in the coolant tank is a very handy idea.

[@maverick6216]

Crown Victoria Will Last Forever

[@griswald7156]

Ford falcon please..