Are LEGO Trains Too Small?

[@zachcheung8400]

For 8-stud wide trains, there would be more details, but that also means more pieces, more weight, and more power required to move them. Also a bigger price as well. 6-studs wide seems like a good balance of having a decently sized train, sufficient detailing, weight and power balance, and affordability. It's also important to mention that different train sets are made for different purposes and different audiences. The crocodile train, emerald night, and others like that are specialty trains for enthusiasts and people who like trains, while the city passenger and cargo trains are mainly for kids who want a playable LEGO train set and a full loop of track, and for most kids this may be their first LEGO train set.

[@billdoggonejones]

ehh... I think that there's a higher level of detail provided by 8 wides. Roofs, for example, look much neater as 8 wide pieces. Interiors can be more fleshed out at 8 wide. In my opinion, there should be 2 product lines, the 6 stud city line and an 8 stud model line, like creator expert but for trains. This could really corner the market on model trains.

[@jasonnikolic]

And space, the larger the train set the less likely a parent will care to purchase it if they don't have the space. IMO a larger train will look more ridiculous than the oversized cars we already get. You may as well just build your city with Duplo if you need bigger trains.

[@matsv201]

I have a compromise suggest that fill all boxes. German French UK train are usually 2.8-2.9 meter wide. US, Canadian, Scandinavian trains are usually 3.1 meter wide. If the 8-12 range would be Continental EU trains, they could be 7 stud wide, and the Adult lego like would be North american/Scandinavian trains they could be 8 stud wide. Then all trains would be to the same scale, but still different sizes.

[@billdoggonejones]

@@jasonnikolic dude, 8 wide trains can still run on the original tracks and can still navigate original turns. There's no difference apart from a slightly wider carriage that isn't even larger than the diameter of the track.

[@skedzer4803]

I made a custom 8 stud wide train. It weighed a lot even without batteries. It was a power funtion system, and wasn't as fast as normal, but could still run fine.

[@sergio.lameiras]

I´d love to see someone make a MOC of Snowpiercer with its 1000 cars. Can you imagine something like that rolling around a city? Even in micro-scale it would be something massive!

[@anthonyrobinson4285]

I like snowpiercer too

[@40K_Guy]

That would be awesome

[@jamesgroccia644]

I feel like those would be sold as separate packs of one coach each, as well as the fusion-driven locomotive. Lego would need to make that single set its own theme, "Lego Snowpiercer," just to give each set its own piece of the massive train. And wowza, that sounds pretty neat in my opinion.

[@sergio.lameiras]

@@jamesgroccia644 love it!

[@JasperJanssen]

1000 is a lot. Really a lot. Even at the standard 20 cm or so per car, that would be a 200 meter long train. You could really only have that running in something the size of a cathedral or convention hall. And you’d have to have a couple of hundred of the cars be motorized, because lego locomotives aren’t *that* good at pulling cars. And probably couple them together more tightly than magnets allow for. And then all the different locomotives, all pulling slightly differently, need to be properly synchronized.

[@petervigvari8258]

I think the problem is not size of the trains but cars and everything else. This crazy size increase needs more and more space which is not available at everyone's house. Personaly I stopped buy Speed Champions after TLG have changed the size from 6studs to 8ones. I can not see any added value in this huges cars compare to the old ones from the 80's.

[@magnuskallas]

I agree. I really dislike the 8 stud wide ones. IMO option they hit the Creator car area. Could have developed a new line like Model Club or something.

[@P6tu]

I also agree. 8+studs wide is too much. I've tried to keep my city cars in the

[@minox835]

I agrees that. 8 studs speed champion is for collection and its too wide for lego city, I prefer 6 studs.

[@patrickmartin3322]

Honestly 8 stud wide trains would be optimal as you could still use the same track and wheels and still have it look fine. (I mean the Emerald Knight has a 9 stud wide locomotive and it looks great)

[@matsv201]

I don´t quite agree. The engine and the wagon is totaly out of scale to each other. Also the loco is way to big compre to pretty much anything else. Emerald nights would have been a British or trans european loco, they have one of the narrowest loadinggauge in the world (for standard gauge). So the loco would in reality be fairly narrow,

[@scottthewaterwarrior]

I mean, when most people say 8 wide trains they mean the main frame of the locomotive. My steam locomotives are actually 10 wide at the pistons. Even a lot of the official 6 wide LEGO trains are technically 8 when you count handrails and such.

[@patrickmartin3322]

@@matsv201 true, perhaps 10 or 12 wide trains would make more sense

[@matsv201]

@@patrickmartin3322 Well.. it depends on. To me a minifigure is 2 humans wide. They are 16mm (+arms) wide and 40mm tall. A typical human are 1.75 meter high, so that give scale about 1:43. How wide is a human, that is kind of the wrong question, how wide is a aircraft seat, typically 42cm (Torso only). That gives a scale of 1:27. A bit over half. So what scale is L-gauge. Assuming standard gauge, its 1:38. So how wide would the train be. Well it depends on what scale and what train you use. For a British small loading gauge train it would be 8, 7 or 12 studs wide depeding on if we count Min figure lengt, track gauge or minfigure width. For TGV it would be 9, 8 and 13. For North european and north Americans it would be 10, 9 and 14. For Shinkansen it would be 11, 10 and 16. What would be really cool would be if Lego made all there train to the same scale, but made the small children set as british trains set, like 6 wide, matching up with 6 wide trucks. Making the bit larger one, like central european 7 studs wide, and making the adult once north american or north european 8 stud wide

[@matsv201]

Maybe i was unclear. The best match i think is half the min-figure width. So that why i sad 6, 7, and 8 (i rounded the number so they are not exact but somewhat close. This also match up with the size of current ISO containers made by lego. Cars really need to be smaler.

[@kevwebb2637]

Keep the track size the same, just increase the size of the locomotive and Car body size. They are normally a little wider than the track ties.

[@eemeli1744]

Exactly

[@AlcoLoco251]

Heck, the ties on the current track are already 8 studs wide. Just make a switch that puts the tracks a little farther apart when running parallel and update the curve radius to be a bit larger.

[@nobodyshere8902]

8-stud train frames on a 6-stud track (9v or PF/PUp) are the best in my opinion. They have the best balance between accuracy and lego city integration & playability. I'm planning to MOC my two 60197 passenger trains (the yellow-cabin ones) into 8-stud model with double-length railcars.

[@garycpriestley]

Really great summary, analysis and recommendations. Personally, I'd be happy with moving to a 7, 8, 9 or 10 stud wide configuration which would still stay within the reasonable bounds of most cities. It would also provide far greater internal seat configurations like realy trains have. Also, why not more suburban designs. I agree they've stayed safe (lazy) with the same general roll-out but suspect safe is simply profitable.

[@alexnunes]

I think you hit the nail on the head with the approach. It is safe and simple with the way they are doing it.

[@smoothcasanova5082]

I think the 6 stud trains are just fine. What lego really needs to do is make more realistic trains like the Maersk, the BNSF or the Santa Fe Chief (and rolling stock) for the avid train collector and they would be able to compete with the model train world. I would love to add an official lego version of the black Northern Southern train to my collection.

[@randomstuff4954]

They should really make longer train cars, they are always so short

[@irock8888]

If there are more details to the train, we need more room to work with, right? Hence, i favor 12 stud wide LEGO train.

[@kingdomsbricks4762]

@@irock8888 I build 8 wide but it should be 10-11 studs wide for accuracy.

[@_ort]

They need separate rolling stock

[@thaddaeuswong3574]

Or a Lego Denliner from Kamen rider Den-O.

[@MayoHosko]

Personally I like 6 stud wide trains. I’m biased however because I like vintage scale 4 wide road vehicles

[@avocadoseveryday9354]

Hehe same they are the best cars and roads the perfect size for one minifigure to not be able to move

[@tjbricks4432]

Respect

[@salagadula84]

I feel cars and vehicles are scale creeping. Don't mind if trucks and bigger vehicles are six wide, but I think cars should stay between 4-6 wide.

[@MayoHosko]

@@salagadula84 agreed I don’t like scaled up LEGO. It takes longer to build and bigger sets always cost more money

[@salagadula84]

@@MayoHosko And they look really weird next to minifigures. Cars aren't usually taller than drivers.

[@jamesquaine6264]

I feel like they could keep the same tracks with 8 stud trains, just have a bit of overhang... They also need to start making more station, level crossing etc sets

[@charlez073]

From '69 the 12v trains drew their power from a slot-car like third rail that ran down the the middle of the tracks. In '91 that third rail went to the actual tracks and we lost the "model rail" feel that we had from 1980: like switching tracks (7856, 7858, 7859); stopping trains at station (7860); and lowering booms at crossing (7866), all from our transformer bases (7864).

[@НиколайИванов-в8ы1я]

one issue though - 9V is still the model rail track, the fact that a lot of american companies keep making the archaic tri-rail doesnt mean everyone else in the world is using it

[@TheBrickGuy7939]

I think they are within tolerance but I still think it is possble for them to begin making 8 stud wide base plates that are also longer.

[@YEAHMAP]

Love the fact that this video showed many lego sets i owned back in the days.. but you included them all in a big city: Any childs dream!!

[@Toby_Price]

I believe that trains should definitely be expanded to at least eight studs wide, while keeping to the six stud-wide gauge for compatibility. The criticism that they would be too large for the City theme is a bit of a misdemeanor, as the issue lies truly with the City theme being vastly underscaled for minifigures. City is pretty clearly designed to be playset oriented, and thus, with lower part counts and smaller buildings so young fans can afford them. When you see people make minifigure scale MOC buildings, they're typically much larger than even the Creator modular buildings - so themes like Speed Champions fit in really well. I think LEGO should continue to advance the scale of sets to be more accurate, if you can say that with minifigures, instead of catering to a inaccurate scale established in the 1970s. Yes, tracks gauge and buildings size may need to increase, but it would be for the betterment of LEGO's scaling as a whole.

[@ericpalacios920]

Honestly the track gauge is probably fine. As it stands, the current gauge technically corresponds to 10 stud wide trains, but I think with a scale of roughly 1:48 (8 wide stud trains for north America) Lego could pull of some great models

[@Winchester1979]

Lego trains are already some of the most expensive sets out there, and making them bigger would increase the pricetag even further, and tank interest from non AFOLs who have to consider their budget. If AFOLs with large wallets and lots of space want to build bigger trains, they can MOC them easily enough. The one thing that I think Lego is doing a poor job with is that their one and only curve radius is very very tight for even some of their own official sets (some of the passenger sets have trouble going around the supplied ovals...) and the only way to get larger radius curves is either the flex tracks or buying third party. Back when I was a kid, Märklin had a system where you'd get a basic oval with your starter train set, and then there was a set for adding a straight parallel track for a station, another set for adding an outer loop (with both larger radius curves and curved switches), etc. The track expansion sets were pretty much universal and could be added to any basic starter set and with all of them it made for a rather impressive display that you didn't have to build the way they showed you. I sort of wish Lego would do something similar.

[@rijkemans5114]

I agree. Lego trains aren't that popular, and the average parent buying a train for their kid will likely care more about the price tag than about the width of the train.

[@Speyde]

1:24 The Designer really loved caves and tunnels at this Era

[@skylarmickel]

I personally like the 6 stud wide trains they work really great in my city they don't take up a whole lot of room. I personally hope they continue to make 6 stud wide trains for many reasons I like how they fit my city and my City's already designed around these trains second I don't want to have to buy a bunch of new train track my city uses slightly over 100 pieces of track so buying all new track would be very expensive. Instead of making new trains that or 8 studs wide I personally would rather them re-release monorail but that is just me and this is just my opinion and what works for me.

[@LordPhobos6502]

I've seen some amazing 8-wide MOC trains, and yes, the detail is worth it. However, the added weight means much more power is needed to move them. 6-wide is... small. Always has been, when the width of the tracksvis similar. Train bodies are usually close to double the track gauge, so... 10-wide can be said to be appropriate for the track. But the weight goes up again. More motors, bigger motors, more power. I do like 6-wide. They are a bit small, for sure, but they're cute, you can run trains from any era and they're at least the same scale. Model railroading has always been a balance between detail vs what you can fit in a model / didplay space, and lego being a larger model makes that harder. I think if they were going to move on to a new train era, I'd say, keep the track gauge, make wider curves, and go 8-wide trains (most road vehicles are 6-wide, so this seems decent). But I don't see it happening.

[@matsv201]

My sugestion. 7 wide for 8-12 year range european like trains 8 wide for for adult range, US like trains

[@sudiousmine]

I will rebuild my city layout to accommodate wider trains.

[@LD1-38]

If you assume a scale of 1 stud = 1 foot and that a mini figure is a few inches shorter than the average human, the current track size is actually pretty okay. The standard track gauge for most rail networks is 4ft 8.5in, and the rail heads of LEGO tracks are about 4.7 studs apart. They’re just the right size to tie up minifig damsel in distress across the tracks. This scale even works with other things. Most cars are about 6-7ft wide, and big vehicles such as semi trucks, fire trucks, and buses are about 8ft wide. The only thing that stands out are the Speed Champion cars, but even alone they kinda look big for the minifigures. I think the track should stay the same while the train bodies grow. This is because most trains are significantly wider than the tracks they run on. Of course, this proportionally-accurate-train concept has issues of its own, and goes into a long conversation about scale, tight track tolerances, and wheel size.

[@titusl2025]

I think problem evolves around the modern Lego cars. In one regard going six studs wide for cars has open the doors (no pun intended 🙂) to adding greater detail. But in another respect these cars now dwarf vehicles that should be theoretically much larger than cars in every proportion i.e., Trains, trucks, buses and the like. To combat this I built about 30 car and suv mocks that are 4 studs wide which is terribly challenging to do without them looking awkward. This paved the way for me to build a 6 stud wide, 4 car subway train and a number of 6 stud wide transit buses. This allowed the total fleet to look more proportional to each other.

[@ashleyhamman]

I had wanted a Lego train throughout my entire childhood. Why did I never get one while also being given Bionicle and Mindstorms kits? Anything bigger than N-scale or maybe HO-scale is just so much space that even an oval would require running throughout a room or its own dedicated space, so larger probably poses a limit to what parents are willing to buy for their kids, which no doubt would be an important market to keep.

[@ashleyhamman]

@@johnperic6860 I'm not sure how you've come to the conclusion that I don't, is this some sort of Freudian dig?

[@xymaryai8283]

@@ashleyhamman i think they were making a transphobic joke at you T -T but yeah, as a kid even the 6 stud trains are far too big, if i wanted anything more interesting than a circle track, it would take up the whole floor. i think LEGO should come out with 2 or more model scales, as the community had sort of already done. for trains in particular, 3 scales would be plenty, a 4 stud, the standard 6 stud, and a more detailed 8 stud. if i had a 4 stud set as a kid i think i would have had way more fun (especially if it was a powered rail set) and also annoyed my mum far less XD

[@Sibian_Wolf]

In the 80s, Lego city care were 4 studs wide. That fitted the 6 wide Trauns well. In my opinion.

[@E46SedanGaming]

In my opinion it’s the other way around. Cars/trucks are getting too big. 6-wide is where the City cars/trucks max out in width, but speed champions cars will go to 8 wide as of 2020, which means the trucks will go to 10 wide, which dwarfs trains.

[@royfromsmashbros4857]

Love the video! I think the main issue with the LEGO trainsets is compatibility. LEGO is THE company when it comes to making interchangeable parts, and we all know that. The issue with making a larger, wider track would result in compatibility issues between older sets and newer sets. Yes, LEGO has changed their track designs multiple times from their initial train sets, but a permanent change to a larger track would result in lots of issues. Train track is already decently expensive for a consumer, considering that LEGO is a premium luxury product. it costs $160 USD to build a passenger train, and making those already expensive sets incompatible with new ones is simply a poor choice. Since LEGO pieces also have to be molded as an all-in-one parts in order to achieve the precision required for play, wider track pieces aren't really feasible, as that would simply increase the cost of a piece of a similar length. One crucial fact I feel you're overlooking here is the main target audience of LEGO. It's children. Children who won't likely have access to massive basements or rooms to display their Lego Cities, or have the funds to buy expensive sets. I think the loss of the most target audience is much more important to factor in LEGO's decisions than the idea that they won't modernize by making rail sets larger. In regards to a lack of 8 stud wide track, I don't think the issue is with the track at all. I think that what needs to change is the large base piece the rail trucks attach to. That's kind of exclusive to trainsets, and provides the platform the trains are built on. Making the train base wider would allow for 8 stud wide trains without a modification of the track. it's a cheaper solution that would solve the problem more easily than a complete track overhaul. Of course, there could be potential issues like the train falling over at high speeds, requiring a larger turn radius, or requiring a stronger motor, but those fixes are likely easier to implement than a complete rebuild of the track design. TL;DR Track expensive, Target audience kids with non-adult budgets, Potential less costly solutions include making the train bases wider to 8 studs to compensate.

[@billdoggonejones]

uhh... we're talking about the body of the railcar, not the track itself.

[@ronik24]

Thanks for the video! :-) There are a few things that can improve your Lego/brick railroad: - longer radius curves, for example Trixbrix offer up to r120 plus r104 switches instead of Lego r40 - a massive difference. Also, special pieces like 1/2, 1/4, etc. straights are available. - take a soft underground, I use artificial lawn carpets underneath - the trains will run much smoother. - If you use PoweredUp, "supercharge" your hub easily by attaching 2 (or even 3 are possible) additional AA batteries. You only need a battery box for a dollar, a tiny drill to make holes for the wires and something to cut a small metal plate in half. No more tools or materials necessary. 8 wide trains are already commercially available. Mould King models are 8 wide and way more interesting and complex than anything Lego has produced to date. And German BlueBrixx have announced a wave of 8 wide models soon (scroll down their trains page and look for announcements with the hint (8w)), together with a larger scale small display steamer like suggested in this video.

[@wellardme]

Nice video! I think Lego could make a killing from having a specific train brand with locos, rolling stock, buildings. It's much cheaper, quicker and more versatile than building a real HO railroad for example. I know there are loads of mocks but this is something Lego should really look into.

[@jjlegend3922]

6 stud wide cars are perfect. You can easily create 4 seater cars that actually fit more than 1 mini figure. Trains should be 8 stud wide, allowing lego cars to fit on open train cars. It would give the lego scale a more astetic-pleasing look.

[@firetoacat]

I feel that if Lego did decide to increase the size of the trains, they would just move them from six studs to eight. Sure, there would be a slight increase in the price because there would be more bricks, but Lego train sets are normally pricey as is. Doing them as eight stud would also add a tiny bit of realism in that actual trains tend to hang a little bit over the edge of rails, a Lego version of that would work well if balanced right. If they did do the eight stud bit, it would then allow Lego to put more functionality into their train cars, like working doors so that people could have a minifig coming out one door and be posed to look like its heading to the next car. I feel this would be great for many people, myself included (I recently got my first Lego train set and I was a bit disappointed when I found out that the doors on each end of the train cars are just decoration). And if its about weight and all, they could make a few new parts that would help decrease the weight of a slightly larger engine and cars. They do that all the time with their sets.

[@legod1717]

I like the size as it is. I would also like to see the electric rail return and keep the battery powered stuff for the technique and mindstorm builds.

[@redenginner]

I figured the six stud wide train standards has sustained itself because any wider would lose compatibility and increase set costs overall. A passenger train costs around 150-60 now and with eight stud wide tracks and cars we could see 250$ passenger trains and 500$ cargo trains,which means citys intended audience of kids won't be able to even dream of getting a train set anymore.

[@billdoggonejones]

it's not tracks, they're talking about the train carriages themselves.

[@LittleJohnAB1]

I think the train size is alright. But would like to see more variety, like they did with the Sana Fe and old Steam train sets a few years ago. Where you bought individual cars and locomotives.

[@dutchdude5400]

Amen ! Please LEGO, bring back the 9 volt motor and metal tracks, and some awesome Diesel loc designs ! And end the ugly UGLY passenger trains !

[@vuurkip2491]

Despite being borin in the earl 2000's and mainly growing up around the 2010's I have alot of nostalgia for that blue track. My grandma owns some of the stuff my mom used to play with so that blue track was basically my childhood. Crazy to think it was that old

[@PurpleRhymesWithOrange]

Now would be the perfect time for Lego to change the train standard. So many people are rebuilding their Lego cities for the new road plate system!

[@potatohead5910]

3:34 This is incorrect, if the average person's height (around 5'9") is wider than the rails (4'8.5" American gauge, scale may grow or decrease slightly depending on the country) then the width should be around 5 or 6 studs (what we have right now) with trains that are 8 to 10 studs wide.

[@suspense_comix3237]

I don’t think that a LEGO 8-stud wide train would help matters. I don’t believe that LEGO should release 8-stud wide trains with 8-stud wide tracks to fit the trains. This is because of scale issues. I get it - the cars are getting bigger and bigger! But the trains dang aren’t. The real problem is about interior. We haven’t seen sleeper trains in the LEGO City Line at all. Sleeper trains would be pretty cool as LEGO could add a lot of detail and other stuff into trains. By that I mean, not only do they add just tables and chairs for every single god dang car, they can add, say a bed, a bathroom, a dining car, a coach car for those poor passengers who can’t afford First Class with fancy roomettes and beds and stuff, etc. They also should update the main locomotive which powers the trains, as LEGO City trains keep the same stupid cockpit piece for the Locomotive, with some changes here and there.

[@jasonemkay]

Love this. Also there is no reason not to bring back the metal rails and ditch the batteries. They can still use Bluetooth controls if they do it right.

[@hesterclapp9717]

I think 6 studs is enough, and it's better to have a standardised guage than larger trains

[@THE_IRON_HORSE]

They really do need to make trains bigger considering in real life trains for example the SD70ACE and ES44 are 15 ft tall and it kind weird seeing a Lego car that is literally almost the size of a train when in real life cars only reach the safety stripe of locomotives

[@fluffnose3386]

Speed champions was one of my favorite themes. But I haven’t bought a single one after they switched to 8 studs wide. It’s ridiculous. Not only are they wider than trains and most baseplate road lanes, they also are just as wide as a damn plane. That’s insane and I want to slap whoever decided to change it.

[@airworks7809]

It is out of scale, but proportions and detail got better. So they are good for what they are made for

[@Toby_Price]

I'd counter it by saying everything else is too small. No truly scaled plane should been eight studs long, for example. Those types of sets are obviously meant for children, so saying that a proper scale shouldn't be established for collector sets because they don't fit in with kids sets is silly. On KZbin, there are countless videos of properly scaled minifigure planes that are gargantuan. The eight long planes don't even cover the length of a single wing.

[@umbrellaoli]

8 Studs Trains are a must plan of evolution, as well as different radii. MOC's always working at the limit of the current system.

[@jtonline99]

The size is perfect, what I wish they’d do it put a bit more ooomph into the theme because there’s so much potential for this to be a serious model railroad contender. More trains, more wagons, more building options, etc… you could buy all kinda cool things with 12V, and 9V just turned everything into the same year on year drudgery.

[@dd_zzero6827]

I don't think comparing the size of cars to trains is a good one. Cars are way too big now. They aren't realistic. Trains are fine. They don't need to be any bigger. Any bigger and they will look awkward too.

[@CarsSimplified]

An 8-stud-wide train would definitely scale things up in a way that would improve realism, but I feel like compatibility with existing trains and set costs in general are two angles keeping them as 6-stud-wide models. It would be pretty frustrating to deal with a scale change if you've already got a lot of train parts for the only size that has been done for decades, and plan on adding more. Definitely some odd scale stuff happening across the board right now, though.

[@OwenAnimatingandGaming]

I think trains should be 7 studs wide and keep the “5” stud wide Lego City cars instead of upping all the size of cars to the point where the cars are wider than the trains.

[@WesternOhioInterurbanHistory]

I think Lego should make an 8-stud wide wheels and track, and the trains themselves should overhang the rails by 1-2 studs on each side.

[@H.Kirsch]

The track is not the problem, you can easily just build the trains 8 studs wide and they look great.

[@WesternOhioInterurbanHistory]

@@H.Kirsch I just want them like 10 or 12 studs wide that is all

[@pliosaw]

@@WesternOhioInterurbanHistory I've made a 10 wide train, 12 is too wide for a locomotive, 10 seems to be just right,

[@WesternOhioInterurbanHistory]

@@pliosaw how wide were the rails

[@pliosaw]

@@WesternOhioInterurbanHistory they are the normal lego track, I have a video test running the train on my channel called something like Lego CSX 4757 Test Run. From watching the video, it doesn't look too unnatural with a wide train on normal track.

[@TheOtherGuys2]

The problem with making the trains bigger is that then they'd be harder to fit on the tracks. They've been making the same size track for decades, and suddenly changing the size of trains would mean all that track instantly becomes outdated. And we know for sure Lego wouldn't just up and change something that's been an established system for decades. (*cough*roadplates*cough* ahem, excuse me *cough*darkgrey*cough* ahehem, sorry.) I think a better idea would be to sell individual train cars and engines. They did that back in like 2001 I think. That way you could build your own trains. If you want an 8 car passenger train, you can buy 8 passenger cars, an engine, etc. Next year maybe there's a dining car, then a double-decker, and so on. Better than recycled play set designs that are just the same thing over and over.

[@Ivan-pm3dq]

Honestly the Lego® trains are the perfect size, length, thickness and also design. Some people modify the trains to make them look better, but, in my opinion, they make them a way, so they're not made for mods, like, if you put more roof on something, maybe the driver wont be able to enter the cabin. So, in conclution, Lego® should be making trains like this, and not change the thickness, beacouse its perfect also for minifigures to fit in. I would apricciate if you like this comment if you agree ❤ 👇 👍

[@TheBrickCraftsman]

Yes! That's why all my train MOCs are in 8-studs wide.

[@marknieuwstad2504]

Nice bit of history. I never knew they had a 'blue' period. I often wondered why passengers couldn't sit die by side. But making the trains wider would also mean changing the tracks, or change the space between the carts/wagons (for turning). Right now, I'm fine with it.

[@klaymoon1]

I think it’s way to narrow. 10 wide seems appropriate but I’m hoping for at least 8 wide in near future. Even 10 wide fits with the current rails.

[@mattsmocs3281]

Personally i follow the pennlug regulation of 8 studs equals 10 feet (this is also a set standard by Brick Model Railroader which was founded by PennLUG members) it creates a scale piece that looks ok next to mini-figs. Ive seen some larger scales done aswell such as the 9 wide C&O ten wheeler. I still have some 6 wide in the more Accurate to scale narrow gauge (rails closer together) and i have both common 2 stud between builds and even a 3 stud between (need to finish that one) and they work fine

[@brickartisan]

Alex should definitely be the voice over if Discovery channel ever branches out to LEGO history and information 😄

[@alexnunes]

My dream job right there! 🤣

[@brickartisan]

@@alexnunes you’d do a great job at it 😄

[@ClickedBricks]

Really enjoyed this video! I envy anyone who uses the 12V track as, I agree, it is far superior than using the heavy batteries!

[@matsv201]

Its a hard choice. The 12V track was superior with signaling and switches. But the 9V track look so much nicer. There is also a limitation with both 12V and 9V track that few people think about. You can´t make loop track. I kind of think that charging rack is probobly the best over all option. The lego like would really need a total revamp.

[@Kelkschiz]

I think I have to disagree. Trains are not separate entities, they are part of an ecosystem. I've been to the USA and in the USA most things are very large, including houses. But LEGO is not just for the US market. There is no way you could fit a larger track system than we have currently in the space most people have available for it.

[@MartyMcFly3]

I think you are missing the point. You don't need to change to a larger track system. Alex is discussing whether the normal 6 stud width should be expanded to maybe 8 studs wide just like 2019's Disney Train & Station.

[@BNSF_101]

8 stud wide would work, and maybe make the old designs like the metro liner the standard.

[@COASTER_CHASER_1]

A multiple style design would be nice then let people choose the best open for them…. Maybe a scale system similar to the Ho Scale or O Scale trains then maybe through there online store you can choose the scale and size you want

[@jasonnikolic]

Maybe on its own as a display, but to be placed in an existing city? You may as well just build your city with Duplo at that point. I'll admit a large train with vintage style detailed interior would be amazing.

[@billdoggonejones]

you're forgetting that something like Lego City is wayyy under scale for minifigures; they're playsets. Modulars, on the other hand, would fit quite nicely in my opinion, and unlike city sets, they're built to a more realistic scale.

[@HuyDoQuang237]

Personally, I think 8studs should be the good option (10studs could be the best). Speed champions just to 8studs is the great option, making cars look more balanced with the high and the length!

[@delilas2398]

I don't like the idea of changing the track size at all. Just like the new road plates, making new tracks that are incompatible with the old ones sounds like a terrible idea to me. However that doesn't mean that trains couldn't be bigger. It should be rather easy and frankly more realistic to have a wider train chassis (e.g. 8 studs). That and wider curve radii could make for a perfect expansion of the current system, instead of replacing and, to a degree, invalidating the old one. As for the cars, just let them be smaller, the new ones don't fit on the roads anyway.

[@Solbrick]

I’m a fan of 6 studs, but I definitely believe in trying new stuff and there’s a lot of great 8 stud Mocs out there. And as you say it’s strange that everything else gets larger, but the trains don’t.

[@goldfing5898]

To me the strange thing is that the curve radii don't get larger. This would be a requirement for larger 8w trains (actually even for the current 6w trains).

[@Vilhelm22]

Realistically with the track size (which I think is a good size) most trains should be 10 studs wide, or approximately 1 stud = 1 foot. This is 1:38 scale. I’d really recommend looking up the L-Gauge Prototype for more information on this.

[@joshuabradley6624]

Eh more like 1/42 scale I've found that scale works best after doing some ww2 panzer models

[@Raven319s]

I agree. IMO TLG focuses too heavily on the playability of its younger age demographic. It is that fine balance of play scale vs Minifig scale. I do think AFOLs and the model train community would be a huge buyer of larger scaled LEGO train sets.

[@kevinwelsh7490]

the tracks are 6-stud gauge, so the train cars can be made 12 studs wide to be similar in proportion to actual trains.

[@harrytodhunter5078]

No, I think the trains are fine. The City range trains and City range cars fit together well, as intended. Speed Champions is a different range, with a different purpose. They are meant to be scale models of real cars, not necessarily cars designed for the city range. The best way to solve this is to make a new Trains Range, and make those trains bigger, and mostly for display, like with speed champs. Then you can have the smaller, less realistic but more child friendly City cars and trains as one thing, and the larger, more detailed and older audience Trains and Cars as another.

[@Toby_Price]

Personally, I think Speed Champions is more accurate in terms of a realistic scale for minifigures, even if it isn't the most accurate height-wise. They're obviously more detailed, but with the interiors being large enough now to comfortably fit two minifigures side by side, it seems natural compared to small four-wide cars that can barely fit a single minifigure most of the time. LEGO City is a theme that clearly prioritizes playability over scale, so I don't believe detailed sets for collects should come at the expense of that. The simple solution, like you said, would be to introduce a range of Speed Champions-esq theme of detailed trains that still remain relatively minifigure scale.

[@Celtchief]

Forgive me if other's mentioned this, but I did peruse some comments and found no mention of the Disney Train. It is an 8 stud train based on a narrow gauge, so possibly the most accurate to size of all the models, and does show lego is willing to do 8 stud trains. Of course, it was also a super expensive set, but a chunk of that was the very accurate station. I know quite a few modelers who did have to reconfigure their cities to make room for the 8 studs, but they did it.

[@kingdomsbricks4762]

I have calculated stuff and it really should be about 10-11 studs wide. Which would mean that the cars should be smaller than what they are now. For example, a modern diesel loco in the US is about 10 feet wide, I have a ford excursion which is about 8 feet wide, so if I put that into lego, a minifies has a leg size of 1 stud which is 1 foot irl. So lego Lamborghini's that are standard, like the Aventador, should really be 6 1/2 - 7 studs wide not the same as an 8 wide truck. So the vehicles are just not quite right, except for the bigger vehicles which should be around the correct stud width.

[@chris_wizzudz]

I just bought the new passenger train and I have plans to MOC it into an 8-stud wide train so it has enough room for more than 4 minifigures per car.

[@fryncyaryorvjink2140]

What if they go back to having the rails separate from the 2-by pieces while also making the wheels separate from the motor, effectively allowing fans to make trains of any width? I guess the problem then is the inside and outside rails on bends. You'd have to have a bunch of different bends to keep them parallel

[@alexnunes]

I like that idea!

[@fryncyaryorvjink2140]

@@alexnunes i too prefer the electrified track, hopefully there'd be an option for metal or plastic tracks. I heard someone was making metal lego tracks a while back. I've been curious if putting foil tape on plastic tracks would work, but i don't have any

[@Mr_Boss_Smile]

old lego trains use to do that allowing people to make their own width

[@fryncyaryorvjink2140]

@@Mr_Boss_Smile are there any problems with curve tracks inner and outer diameters not matching up when changing track width?

[@SalmonJonesTheMagnificent]

You know it's never bothered me. It does kind of force you to get creative but you can pack a lot of detail and personality into something six wide.

[@13thmistral]

Fun fact: way before 8 stud wide cars and such, i always thought lego trains were to small, always meaning back when i was 10 or so. as a bare minimum, you'd actually expect a 10 stud wide build, so you have 2 figures at either side and still space for some path in the middle. ideally ? well, i think 12 studs wide is plently, while i think i would hate something as wide at 16 wide.

[@honeybear278]

I think a 8 wide train should be Made. 6 studs are a little too small. I also think that some of the Cars today are too big. 8 Studs For a Truck, Bus or Hummer ist ok. But a Standard Car should Not be wider than 6 Studs...

[@D4id0]

The trains are not too small... the modern cars are much too big ;) Personally I don't like the current Lego cars.

[@Taconephotography]

Thank👏you

[@grantm6133]

I’m cool with the 8 stud wide cars for speed champions as it helps include details such as 2 side to side seats, but other than that I agree. I love the old 4 wide cars.

[@fluffnose3386]

The new cars are WAY too wide and it honestly makes me angry. They aren’t even scaled to minifigs well either. Speed champions went from being one of my favorite themes, to “I get mad whenever I see it”

[@merrimacksacoproductions4497]

@@fluffnose3386 quite frankly I appreciate Speed Champions moving to an 8 wide standard, yes it’s virtually impossible to integrate into a city due to the size, it allows for better detailing, and the scaling looks more accurate as these sports cars are wider than they are tall. This would make 8 wide a good scale for trains too without modifying the current track system, however Lego’s biggest flaw with their trains in the turn radius and lack of specialized track pieces to create accurate looking yards and such. While I can live with the switches not being specialized, the turn radius is something they need to fix

[@fluffnose3386]

@@merrimacksacoproductions4497 that’s fax

[@paulsbricks]

It would be great if LEGO started producing 8 stud wide trains for the city theme. They could also for the creator expert theme make some more detailed trains.😀👍

[@SirLANsalot]

there is a company out there currently making new Powered Rails and motors for LEGO trains, and a conversion kit to allow you to put a NMRA DCC system to said track. The new Motors and new "decoder" blocks allow you to run normal DCC, usually used for N or HO scale trains, with your LEGO trains. Their objective is to make lego trains into more of an actual "scale" train setup rather then being just "oh its a cute toy train". Lego trains are going through the same evolution that prior scales did, much like how Lionel trains started as a "oh its a toy train" in the early 20's and 30's and evolved into a complete scale with high detail locomotives and rolling stock. Other scales came along and, again, all started out in the "toy train" level and moved into realistic level of details. Lego is going through the same thing, the size of track will probably not change, and the number of studs the locomotive is, might change to add a few. However unless Lego, or someone else, comes up with a much wider track and loco as you mentioned, this will probably be what we have.

[@christjoeng]

Lego did produce a running 8 studs wide train(!) which I happen to own - the Disney train and station 71044. Although this is a really nice train, it looks very much out of place in my layout and is now mainly used as a standalone train circling the christmas tree. I am happy with 6 stud wide trains. I thinks they look and handle very nice.

[@csharp57]

I’m still on the fence about increasing the size, but the lego train sets do need some attention. Maybe the aftermarket sets from other brands are making lego think they can’t compete and won’t invest time into the train themes. If they believe it won’t be heavily supported they will concentrate on areas that make the most money. (Harry Potter, Star Wars and such) Take the Polar Express that reached 10,000 votes on lego ideas recently. It reached the judging review stage and stopped there. I think lego should create a separate part of there company that caters to AFOL. Get in touch and see what they want. We are making decent money and would pay if lego goes the extra mile to give us what we want. Charge a membership fee. This should more than cover the cost of production. Then scale down the sets and see if the general public want to own the inexpensive version.

[@countofelysium9070]

8 studs wide for normal gauge trains, 7 studs wide for narrow gauge trains and 6 studs wide for trams. That's my general rule for trains. (And for Shinkansen trains who are wider than other normal gauge trains I use 9 studs wide). I only use the minifigs height to get a basis for scale. A minfig is is four bricks tall, since the average height of a human is around 1.8 m, four bricks stacked equal 1.8 m. Lay four stacked bricks next to a plate and you see the brick stack is five studs long therefore five studs equal 1.8 m. From there there I approximate the size of the model using the measurements of the original trains. It's not perfect but it gets results.

[@MartyMcFly3]

I couldn't agree more Alex. But the sad reality is that the LEGO Group's only focus is children's trains & 6 studs wide is the perfect size for them. It is also not financially viable for the LEGO Group to increase stud width as this would significantly increase cost of their train sets. I was encouraged by the 8 stud wide Disney Train & Station but I believe this is sadly, a one off. #BRINGBACK9VOLTTRAINS

[@dealerovski82]

I always thought the tracks were too wide and didn't fit the lego theme. Train size was fine at 6 peaces but tracks should only be 4 and for wheels I used to just peel off the normal car tiers and let them run on the old tracks. it wasent a perfect fit, But I wished lego would make something similar. I made some really great amatur trains back in the day for myself.

[@abossoum2392]

Yeah they are very SMALL,as a normal person who rides a metro everyday,the I know that the metro width from inside is about 9 feet long,and a track gauge of about 4 feet and something...so the lego track gauge should be 8 studs wide,and the train itself should be 18,that will also give us a HUGE space for functioning some serious things,such as moving doors and whatever could come to our mind

[@carterjames8829]

Off topic, but let me just say that at 3:00, I love that red diesel locomotive. I would love to have one like it.

[@Adumzzinthehouse]

I think if you buy the 2014 LEGO cargo train set, get the engine pieces in red, remove the stickers, you can have something close to that.

[@VestedUTuber]

Short answer: Yes. Long answer: Yes, unless you're trying to model UK equipment. Thing is, the track gauge is fine if you bump up to 8 studs wide, as most locomotives and rolling stock in the US and mainland Europe tend to overhang the track a bit. However, there is one caveat - LEGO designed their train system to be able to negotiate VERY tight curves. That's why everything's 4-axle, 6-wide and short-chassis. Anything more accurate would require a larger minimum radii than LEGO produces. Luckily FxBrick makes stuff for that. I don't think 16 studs wide is necessary. The problem with going that far is that it's assuming a minifigure is exactly the same proportionately to a human - it's not, minifigure proportions are, for lack of a better word, extra thicc, and if you had a body the shape of a minifigure chances are you'd take up an entire seating bench aboard a train too. You really have to take height into account here, if you assume a standard minifigure was 5ft high and built a proportionally accurate train 16 studs wide, what you'd end up with is something the size of the Breitspurbahn concept in minifigure scale.

[@SilvanBG170]

No they are in a perfect size i love the size from the lego trains they are good to build a little City and like this or a little railroadcrossing or something like that

[@joshuafischer2452]

I love the 6 stud trains, I just think that they need to do more variations, rather than just recycling the same thing every year

[@____admin]

Yes,yes they are

[@Freddie44utube]

Totally agree I’ve been thinking for years that Lego are missing out on producing a range of train sets engine and rolling stock I honestly believe there is enough following to have a complete separate branch to the company dedicated to railways it would not only attack Lego fans but collectors and train fans.

[@YouGoneMad]

Are those 9v Tracks plentiful on Bricklink by chance? Expensive? Still Switch Tracks and Crossing/Lights still available? I would give ANYTHING for Train to go back to the 9v Track permanantely!

[@YouGoneMad]

Can you mix and match that IR sensor/COntroller to the 9v System by chance?

[@rbleisem]

You forget a few things, first of all, small track trains exist, so the rails is fine. Secondly, twelve studs seem quite fine to me, go wider and you get problems with the cars & trucks, a proper Lego truck is ten to twelve studs wide, unless they start to update the Adventures their car seating aria piece, a bit. The reason I say twelve studs wide, is for the seats in the passengier wagons. But if you go wider, you might end up going longer as well. You saw that Lego Ideas idea of the Knight Rider Team? Kitt & the Knight Industries Truck & Trailer combo? I do agree with the trains themselves, though, same formula, 1/2 a train & a small platform for goods loading. Why not a full train and a 3-in-1 station modular, that can thus easily be made as big as wanted? With a full train, they could do a boggie sharing trick and lower the amount of wheels needed. And as for the best Lego Train MOC, look up "Lego Metro Aurora" here on youtube.

[@mattiasthorslund6467]

Wider trains while keeping the same tracks would make the Lego trains look more like the proportions of real-world trains. A standard gauge train is typically about twice as wide as the distance between the rails. 10 studs might look about right, except for in the UK.

[@benstoever]

I totally agree that 8 wide trains would fit the current 6 wide City cars better. (I use 8 wide trains in my city myself.) An 8 stud wide train set would, though, also require the cars to be longer. And releasing that wouldn't make sense to me as long as there are no wider radius curves coming with the set. Such a set with 16 regular curves and 2 straights (as usual) would make no sense to me. If they don't include wider radius curves, I would prefer a 6 stud wide passenger train set that finally has doors again. :-) Separate sets for single cars or station buildings would also be really nice. The current city subtheme with only two sets + the track packs is kind of lacking, I would say.

[@rjc0234]

I think the strangest thing is that LEGO is bringing more and more branding into their games. in the 90's and early 2000's when i played with LEGO, i always imagined their 4 wide cars and 6 wide trains as more of an idealistic world of miniatures, instead of a replica of how we do our trains, cars, and houses in real life.

[@BattleshipOrion]

I think that the trains are slowly going to second/third party groups, with LEGO keeping a handful around to keep them on the cheaper, and less detailed side. Though I don't personally own any OFFICIAL sets, have you seen some the second party sets? 9 volt/power functions/powered up capability, and done to be realistic, even on tighter radius curves, not to mention, second/third party rail systems that make Lego curves look so sharp that they can cut grass. Engines and cars easily go for $200 each, which given that Lego cars go for $20 (depending on the line) is a darn good deal given size. Now I must ask, why have commercial trucks not grown?

[@mattevans4377]

You'd have to also completely redesign the set the trains come with if the trains got bigger. The current sets are designed for 6 stud trains, and can't fit anything bigger. If you really wanted bigger trains (or even smaller trains), the easiest thing to do would be to split sets up, so you buy rolling stock, track, and rail buildings all separately, amd probably sell those in their own line too, like the 'Rail' line (get it).

[@IamMagPie]

Standard rail gauge in most Western countries is 1435 millimeters. Keeping in mind a normal person is 1600-1900 millimeters tall, it means the distance between the two tracks can't be more than the height of a minifig. However, trains have quite a lot of overhang outside the rails. Six stud wide LEGO-trains have no overhang. Increasing the width from six to eight studs would be optimal. You can keep the rails, and get more realistic trains.

[@andrews_lego_tanks_and_more]

I really don't think the size of the trains is the issue, it all too often boils down to LEGO not offering enough wheels and wide enough turn radius tracks. These are, in many ways, the biggest problems train moc makers face and something LEGO hasn't done something about.

[@scottthewaterwarrior]

I build 8 wide trains and 8 wide cars, lol! I tried building 10 wide trains at one point, to better scale with my cars, (IMO 10 wide is the most accurate size compared to the track gauge) but 10 wide drastically increases the parts and price even compared to 8 wide, and getting them to navigate those crazy tight turns was next to impossible. Power was also an issue, requiring 3 9v motors just to move the locomotive, tender, and one flat car. My current 8 wide trains like custom curves with a larger radius better, but they can still go around the standard curves at reduced speed.

[@paveloleynikov4715]

4:20 It is nice how you illustrate "let the consumer decide" with out-of-sane-scale speed machine...

[@Trootsbloxplayzthemetalfan]

Something in Lego digital designer on my computer I figure it out if you use to train bases from 60098 heavy haul train and put them side-by-side you can make a really big passenger car