Are Students Getting LAZIER? (One possible solution...)

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In this video Heimler offers one small (potential) solution to the growing problem of student lethargy in the AP Classroom. Many teachers say this has been a growing problem for years, and maybe one thing that's needed is a change in mindset.

[@drewdudgeon4195]

I definitely feel like I have unconsciously been moving towards this mindset so hearing how you consciously did it would be great. A lot of my recent conversations with students who are bored, overscheduled, lethargic, etc. has always ended up in the realm of grades. I say to them “well, maybe since you are in three other AP classes and you are a varsity athlete it might not be possible for you to ALWAYS HAVE AN A”. That response is so unacceptable now to students (and parents). Grade inflation across the board is also a big problem I think.

[@HeimlersHistoryTeachers]

I can relate. I always told my students the story about when I was in graduate school and had a big paper due in a couple days but then, unexpectedly, got an opportunity to go out of town with my wife. Being young and poor, this was a big deal to us. So I decided we should go. When I returned Sunday night, I cobbled together the best paper I could manage, which wasn't great, and turned it in. In my email to the professor, I acknowledged that it was probably nothing more than a C paper, but that's what I had. At this point in the story, my students expect the end to be something like, "and then he gave me an A on the paper." But what really happened is that I got a low C-because THAT'S WHAT THE PAPER DESERVED! But then I tell my students that I never regretted getting that C on a major paper because the experience I had with my wife was worth it. I try to help them understand the trade off and the choices they have to make. I wasn't always successful, but it worked some of the time...

[@drewdudgeon4195]

@@HeimlersHistoryTeachers thanks for this and everything else you do big guy. I’ll try and frame it this way the next time a student has this conversation with me.

[@carkawalakhatulistiwa]

​@@HeimlersHistoryTeachers there used to be a guarantee that if you study you will get a job. with gpt chat it will take a lot of work . I do not think so

[@veronicalevesque7009]

I'm a student, and a TA for two physics classes. I think another cause is that some students simply don't know how to do the work and ergo don't want to try. Many, if not all of the kids in these classes did Algebra 1 over COVID, and are missing vital skills to succeed in a physics class, but they're required to take it, so they come. So far I've been trying to individually help every student who clearly needs it, but I do hope there's some sort of way to help teach the kids who missed vital skills over COVID en masse, because not knowing those skills can mess them up for the rest of their school career.

[@HeimlersHistoryTeachers]

That's very true, especially on the classes that build upon each other. In history, thankfully, each class can stand on its own, but in math, yeesh. Yeah, that's rough.

[@aidanbusch437]

Yes, specifics PLEASE! Have been feeling this acutely recently. Would love to know how you do this on a practical, day-to-day level.

[@HeimlersHistoryTeachers]

Okay, I think I'll put it together for next week's video.

[@daphnezuniga1647]

I am currently a junior in high school and I can say that many of the points you brought up are true. Covid year definitely drove many of us students who already were on the edge of burn out into the ground. As I reflect I can attest that my performance my freshman year compared to my sophomore year were very different. For starters mental health problems skyrocketed while issues which were already present in the educational system were more visible than ever before. Even when I returned to in person classes things did not magically change. There was a clear divide between virtual and in person students in terms of basic knowledge. As we moved into harder courses fewer of the people who were in my classes could understand the lessons given and although some worked hard they still failed to see the results they wished. This could be caused for several reasons of course, but it mostly could be avoided if students felt less pressure in what is now a competitive educational environment. Where only the ones with the highest GPA, test scores, most AP classes taken, and extracurriculars can be accepted into their school of choice. Education has lately become less about learning what it means to be successful to the individual and more about what it means to be successful to others. If I am to be completely honest it seems recently the standard of success means perfection.

[@HeimlersHistoryTeachers]

Absolutely: that competitive environment is exhausting for students AND teachers. Cultural norms are exceedingly difficult to buck, but if I had one wish for this situation it would be that students stop playing the game. But I don't think that will happen, so I aim to be as supportive as I can be within the boundaries of the game.

[@noahkepner943]

I like this. We, as teachers need to hear this. However....................we have to also acknowledge that we are swimming against the current in larger society in regards to a love of learning being valuable, exciting and worth while. Education is no longer seen as a way to improve oneself. I've heard a lot of seminars/PD ect that say we have to be more entertaining to meet that dopamine tolerance. I don't think that's the answer either. So yes, we'd love to hear the details on how you are approaching this in your classroom.

[@HeimlersHistoryTeachers]

Agreed. To expect teachers to produce the same dopamine hit present in video games, social media, etc. is ridiculous and unattainable. Education will always be hard and require growth in critical thinking-something that will tax students. I think until we can help them see the "why" behind what we are doing in the classroom, we'll always fall temptation to trying to dazzle with goofy techniques.

[@droflowteach]

I really appreciate this mindset shift. I would love to see specifics and examples of what this would look like.

[@HeimlersHistoryTeachers]

Okay, will do!

[@thomasf915]

Very good video. I can say that as someone whos now 2 years past HS I was not watching this as a captive audience but as someone interested in both what you had to say and the highly polished way you presented it. super cool

[@HeimlersHistoryTeachers]

Well, thank you very much!

[@stegotyranno4206]

If i was a ultra authoritarian dictator of a totalitarian state...I would give so much more to teachers, the most unappreciated part of society.

[@eonstar]

oh wow, didn't expect this to be a video of such a small youtuber. Very high quality

[@HeimlersHistoryTeachers]

Well, thanks!

[@justinbedell7902]

Most definitely agree and I see the exhaustion from my AP students already. I also see a lot of resiliency. One other idea that may work is to build and sustain a culture of self-advocacy for students…a clear procedure for how to advocate for their needs and accountability and intrinsic rewards in place to support that. However, the effects of the human handling of the pandemic on the school front is exactly as you say, including the smart phone addiction which I believe is of pandemic levels in terms of Impact on learning and sustaining mental energy.

[@HeimlersHistoryTeachers]

YES to self-advocacy. I'd be curious how you put that system in place...

[@justinbedell7902]

@@HeimlersHistoryTeachers I give students clear deadlines for assignments and clear steps to take if they are going to miss a deadline. If they don’t take those steps, then an academic zero goes into the grade book. If they self-advocate when they’re going to miss a deadline, then they must form a plan with me for when they will do the work and when it will be turned in. If they self-advocate properly, the system works in their favor. Id say less than 1% of my students take advantage of this because our pace is so fast, the work piles up quickly. As you mentioned in a previous video, most AP students are grade driven and seeing “missing” or a “0” for an assignment is a no-no for them for various reasons. I do have a few students who miss deadlines and who do not self-advocate and I work with them and their parents, but they are few. The vast majority appreciate this system I’ve built of clear deadlines and clear procedures for self-advocacy (if they need it) that I see more “on-time” behaviors from students than ever.

[@rmorgenstern9139]

Can you expand on what your practical "mission" message in the classroom has become?

[@kevinromero352]

facts frr.. - 4th year psychology student

[@carkawalakhatulistiwa]

there used to be a guarantee that if you study you will get a job. with gpt chat it will take a lot of work . I do not think so

[@bedrock6443]

Or they just tired of the system and fed up with it. Evereyone has a breaking point.

[@paladinpariah325]

This is basically a very subtle way of saying this problem is the teacher's fault and we should take on the mountain of stress to fix it. I'm being asked to give students exponentially more work for one class than I ever had for any college history class, including 400 level seminars with sources in Greek and Latin. When they understandably rebel against this, you're basically saying I need to work even harder than I already do to brainwash them into thinking differently. I also have to do this in an American culture that is finally rebelling against the corporate abuse of employees with "quiet quitting" and a resurgence of unions. Sorry, this isn't a solution an unsolvable problem. The problem lies with the College Board's blind fanaticism to an unrealistic ideal and their singular focus in exploiting children to make money. If my students "quiet quit" and reject ridiculous levels of productivity being forced on them, they're in the right and I'm not stopping them.

[@HeimlersHistoryTeachers]

If my message came across as "teachers are at fault" then that was certainly not how I intended it. Leading my class as a voluntary organization actually increased my pleasure in teaching, despite the work it required. I appreciate your feedback, and if your solution (i.e., allowing students to quietly quit) increases your pleasure in teaching, then far be it from me to stand in your way. As my many caveats in the video communicate: this is just one man's experience. It's not necessarily generalizable.

[@noahkepner943]

I wouldn't say its brainwashing any more than the traditional way of teaching. We are all socialized to some set of behaviors and mindsets. He's trying to change that mindset to one that's more realistic and productive. It's not that you have to do more, it's that we have to think different. Yes, that takes effort to re-learn our behaviors. I do agree that the CB is unrealistic in its expectations for these courses. (Dual Enrolment with a local JC is the way to go!)