Are we ready for neo-evolution? - Harvey Fineberg

[@nigelmckee3058]

The most beautiful thing about this is you're not just selfishly improving your own body, you're improving your entire future family tree, and if enough people do it, humanity as a whole....

[@ThomasGiles]

I choose not to define my life by it's bad stuff. A world in which only good stuff exists, in which only good things happen, would be a wonderful world indeed.

[@JungleJargon]

Love is patient, love is kind and is not jealous; love does not brag and is not arrogant, does not act unbecomingly; it does not seek its own, is not provoked, does not take into account a wrong suffered, does not rejoice in unrighteousness, but rejoices with the truth; bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.

[@Jahanam9994]

I'm glad you asked that. In the video, he states that polyphyletic groups can't exist because "two sets of monkeys can't come from a source that itself was not a monkey." But if the "source" was a monkey, where did IT come from? This flaw is the reason why we don't call the "source" a monkey entirely, but "monkey-like," or sharing some, but all, of the traits of monkeys.

[@JungleJargon]

Changes of the same kind are not transformations of any kind. Reality is a brick wall. Respect it.

[@satire9298]

I've fantasized about all this ever since my first biology class. The problem I see with Neo-Evolution is that we would be taking on a huge responsibility. I believe Natural Selection may seem imperfect because it's benefiting our species in ways that we can't comprehend. Natural Selection isn't bias. The strict, unforgiving system is how it creates such perfect machines. We may be too forgiving, bias, or novice, and accidentally make us (or whatever) more and more unstable and weaker over time.

[@MrBleery]

As humans we will always try to improve ourselves, to me that is a natural flow for evolution. Take the bacteria explained in the video for example that can live in the steam vents, that evolved so it could live in that environment or rather it improved itself so that it could survive. Humans have the ability to think of complex ideas create technology and avoid natural selection. But technology is our minds natural ability to manifest an idea into reality so we can improve. It's all natural.

[@sofiatgarcia3970]

Whew! That's a tough one. Love is never one-sided. Love seeks the best in you and accepts the worst without (to much) complaint. Love gives because it feels good. Love is a tiny adoring puppy, a child at your breast, a hug before you brush your teeth in the morning. Love is separating the recyclables from the organics. Love is a pat on the bottom while your doing the dishes. Love IS peace, stg

[@LastHCompany]

As Thomas and Guy-Man, the robots of Daft Punk once said: Work it harder, make it better, do it faster, makes us stronger. Excitement of the future right here.

[@stesit]

The original version was uploaded April 2011 on TEDtalksDirector. TedEd just uploaded it again.

[@JungleJargon]

The layer is a 15- to 18-inch-thick layer of phosphate rock in the southeastern United States. The rock is 65 percent phosphate, which means that the layer is made primarily of the bones of dead animals. The bones were clearly deposited by a huge flood; the deposit is at least as large as the Everglades! And mixed into the layer are bones of all sorts of animals that evolution says could not have lived together, including human bones and Hadrosaurus bones.

[@ThomasGiles]

Well, the question Peter was asking was SHOULD we do it. That is the whole point of ethics; to figure out if, even if it CAN be done, SHOULD it be done at all.

[@JungleJargon]

The pressure of the ocean plates is what pushed up the mountains and equilibrium has not been reached yet because mountains are still rising. The sediments deposited by the flood were not nearly as hard as they are today.

[@JungleJargon]

Water always takes the path of least resistance, it never cuts straight canyons. The backed up water only has to take a single way out.

[@AbsentWithoutLeaving]

Yes, I know that is the question Peter was asking. My response was that the presenter's question wasn't if it should be done, it was if we will do it. My answer was that of course we will, because it's been bred into us by the very evolution we're talking about here, to push forward, many times to our own detriment, but nevertheless. No question in my mind that we will do this. We will, and should, question the rightness of it. That's part of the process, too. But we will do it. It's who we are.

[@Jahanam9994]

You have me mistaken; I said two species can develop very similar traits, NOT become the same species. However, since Old World and New World monkeys share a similar lineage, it is possible for one set to be "older" than another, yet retain very similar traits because of similar environmental stressors.

[@MrAmiiine1]

what made me crasy, is that this video is made in 2011, and it's uploaded on 2013 !!

[@JungleJargon]

You cannot forget that John was the only remaining personal eyewitness of all of the events.

[@JungleJargon]

There are, in fact, places that are sheered off flat. They are called plateaus. Canyons are made when a large body of water is backed up behind a natural formation of deposited sediments and then easily washed out after the flood waters subsided. Everest was pushed up after the flood and it consists of sediments deposited by the flood. The sediment layers were deposited horizontally for the simple reason that it was a global flood that covered everything. Canyons formed after the water settled.

[@GCHelena]

Our eyes are quite similar to those of most of the mammals around us. There are only very small differences. That's why pig eyes are often used in high school during biology classes. They are so similar to those of humans.

[@speedyblupi]

He has a point though. We know mutations occur, and we know that they can create new, useful traits. Experiments with fruit flies, yeast, bacteria etc have proved it on multiple occasions.

[@relaxedmonk]

You are right in the sense that we use science to continue to prove the theory of evolution.

[@JungleJargon]

No belief is comparable to absolute truth. Only your Maker, Himself, is able to cover your sin, transform and remake you because no one else can. That is the only absolute and eternal truth there is.

[@JungleJargon]

Yes, I have questioned the speed of light because it arrives in almost no time which is much faster that our observation of it. The fact is that eack life form is a different kind because it cannot generate any new directives to be something it does not have information for.

[@Kano61]

Very very true. Everything is relative. But i also forgot to add on to that comment that, no matter what race, or creed, everyone would be HAPPY in their own skin, or more like people who could afford the procedures when (or if) they become available. Happier people means a better society. Oh and p.s. - i meant to say *They're instead of *their.

[@JungleJargon]

The plates are not able to deposit layers of water deposited sediments. The ocean plates are what push up the mountains made of sediments deposited by the worldwide flood and sometimes igneous rock comes up through the sedimentary layers.

[@LeonelMendesCogita]

the most important TEDtalk of this century in my opinion.

[@mrbushido56]

evolution makes tons of sense and we also have allot of things in common of other animals

[@JungleJargon]

A change of the same kind is not a transformation of any kind. A kind is what belongs to the same family tree. Not everything belongs to the same family tree. Humans are the only thing in the human family tree.

[@AdrenalineVideos1337]

This is the time of changing 2012 and onward is about. I see the intelligent life on earth quickly growing past "humans" in the next 2000 years

[@SaltyChann]

I wasn't presenting an argument against this technology. I was presenting something that should be looked at if we are going to have everyone use this technology. Over population is something we need to think about if we are going to make human beings last longer. I do understand the astonishing contribution this technology may bring to us, but let's not be blind to the possible side effects. If we do not consider everything we will make mistakes...

[@kuntsog]

I can share one fact about love that this is "intense emotions capable enough to drive us to do impossible, well for better or for worse". But honestly I do not have any Idea about its side/s, one, two or even three, four lol... If you can explain why love is never one-sided.. I'll be enlightened.

[@JungleJargon]

consecutive layers are deposited in rapid succession and I am talking about the *same* layer anyway. You are just a little slow in catching that.

[@bobian414]

I'm intrigued that he said little about the idea of combining our technology (I.e. computers, etc) with us to help accelerate the evolutionary process even further. Personally, I would be curious what Dr.Fineburg's response would be.

[@speedyblupi]

A protein can easily change and remain functional! (A mutation doesn't necessarily affect the protein at all anyway - various DNA sequences code for the same amino acid, e.g. cysteine can be TGT or GTC) Many amino acids, though structurally different behave chemically identically, so would not affect the protein, and often any mutation will not affect important parts of the protein (such as the active sites of enzymes) and it will still be able to perform its function.

[@PDPresents]

your discussion of sex being the introduction of death correlates perfectly with the genesis tale of the tree of knowledge of good and evil and the subsequent birth of cain & his half brother abel.

[@speedyblupi]

CORRECT. Finally I've found someone else who isn't acting either like global warming is something we can all just ignore, isn't just being an average selfish modern person who just doesn't want to give a shit, but isn't saying it's going to kill us all and everything else on the planet..

[@franklouuu]

By messing up with the telomeres? I've heard from several scientists that there is still a long way to go in that area because increasing cells' life span that way has some nasty side effects to the human body such as making you more prone to get cancer

[@lynnaxel5611]

The idea is completely fascinating it is both good and bad but that is what makes it more interesting

[@Iamwolf134]

To have the ability to produce the necessary enzymes to break down alcohol. To make your nerve endings not as receptive to alcohol.

[@speedyblupi]

the laws of physics perhaps. How they create chemistry. How mutations in genetic code occur. How we KNOW this can occasionally be beneficial (though usually it is not). We know because we see how viruses develop new traits. Viruses show no variation preexisting when a cell is infected. A single virus with a single genome infects a cell. Yet the viruses created by the cell are genetically varied, and this leads to traits such as ability to be passed between different species.

[@AcanLord]

Evolutionary systematics is beautiful. i just love the complexity and structure of lineages.

[@williamwilson6499]

Ok. How about some details? It's one thing to say there are flaws but it helps when those perceived flaws are stated for others to consider.

[@TadaGanIarracht]

It even seems kind of unnatural to me... It's definitely the smartest option though. AND I think that genetic engineering will be absolutely vital to exploring the galaxy. People don't live long enough, their bodies cope badly with lack of gravity and we aren't very radiation resistant... but with a few tweaks here and there... yeah I think that's the only way to go interstellar.

[@speedyblupi]

Correct. Evolution doesn't claim transformation of kinds (at least not in the way you think it does) Variation within "kinds" (I use quotation marks as I have no idea what it even means - can someone please DEFINE it to me?) is what evolution says should happen. The species will diverge, and pick up new features along the way, and anything will ALWAYS have loads of the features of the things at any point before it. We are vertebrates, just like Tiktallik We have DNA code just like bacteria do

[@akopyan2009]

It is very interesting to witness new technological/scientific advances happen faster and faster. There is research done right now of small computers/robots that people may swallow or inject into their body for longevity & health. These robots supposedly are to repair tissue damage and fight unnecessary bacteria, viruses, etc. Of course, I do not know if this would ever become mainstream in my lifetime

[@speedyblupi]

If it's 65% phosphate it doesn't indicate that it's made of bones, because bones don't have that much phosphate in them - in fact the mineral part of bones consists of 66% phosphate, BUT this ignores the large amounts of collagen and growth factor. If this layer was made ENTIRELY of bones most of them would have fossilised. Even if there was a worldwide flood, there would be no reason that the layer would be so thick, unless somehow dead animals got swept there from around the world.

[@Improbabilities]

Different species develop different abilities. Our ability to speak and transfer very specific information gave us the possibility of sharing knowledge, which is a huge advantage. But are we more adapted to nature, or are we adapting nature to fit us? When we can't manipulate the Earth as we want anymore, or the negative consequences of said manipulations become to great, the other monkeys might still outlive us.

[@niemtec]

Great talk. Gives a lot to think about. I was wondering what software did he use for that presentation?

[@covanentsbane]

As fascinating and exciting as this is, I can't help but think of Gattaca.

[@speedyblupi]

so what made the continents soft enough to withstand the stresses of moving at speeds up to a mile per year? At the moment the continents move at about 3 inches a year. If the continents were that soft not to completely flatten any hollowed out structure (such as a cave or house) as they moved at that speed, then why didn't all the mountains sink all the way into the mantle?

[@BinaryJoe]

I'd encourage anyone who watches this video to learn a little bit about history as it applies to our already terribly disastrous ideas and practices about eugenics. If we've come to the point in our history where past thoughts of atrocity have become no more that an intellectual exercise, then tee isn't much hope for the human race anyway.

[@TheFunnyFreak]

It would be like making a new character in a mmo, and letting you choose 3 or 2 things. I would go for Fitness and Talent. ;D That would make me like a warrior/thief?

[@relaxedmonk]

Care to elaborate that one?

[@speedyblupi]

If the water is very deep then the path of least resistance is virtually always straight. THINK ABOUT IT. Is water deep enough to cover mount Everest going to all flow down a tiny windy channel between hills and mountains? OR is it going to flow over the tops of all the hills and mountains, eroding all of them? I would have though it was simple logic that a worldwide flood couldn't create such a narrow and winding canyon, but obviously not for some people.

[@Kano61]

This is why i want to be a genetic engineer. To be involved in improving the human condition, so people don't have to live their trapped inside the boundaries their DNA confines them in. People will never think their "ugly", or "not good enough", or etc. That's my dream.

[@AbsentWithoutLeaving]

But the question is not whether it's fair. The question is whether we will do it. Of course we will. We're designed for this.

[@TheMisterWeirdo]

I just hope this becomes a reality, cuz it's really interesting. And those people who hate this, just back off when that comes. Its individual choices.

[@williamwilson6499]

It's a name given to a time about a half billion years ago where it seems major groups of animals appear in the fossil record. Check out 'Why Evolution is True', by Jerry Coyne. Also plenty of information on the web from universities.

[@JungleJargon]

Carbon dating supports a young earth because diamonds and dinosaur bones still have C-14 in them. The same layer is the same layer anyway.

[@speedyblupi]

Homeostasis is how things are controlled within organisms, such as heat and electrolyte levels, not what you seem to think it is.

[@JungleJargon]

It is not even possible for consecutive layers to be separated by millions of years. Do you even think at all?

[@Zralf]

one fundamental flaw with the whole idea: it asumes the people making those choices know what they are doing, and right now you can't trust some people with puting together a lawn mower let alone the genetic composition of their offspring.

[@JungleJargon]

The Eden genome is a hypothetical genome that contains all of the proteins that are essential in all the different kinds of life forms so that instead of mutation to get the essential protein, life forms start out with a gigantic genome and then splits up into all the different life forms. The only problem is where the gigantic Eden genome came from. I sometimes wonder if we will get over the joy of our salvation.

[@JungleJargon]

Canyons are not made slowly, They are washed out very quickly by backed up water.

[@sofiatgarcia3970]

Happily and sadly, I think you're right. peace, stg.

[@speedyblupi]

What sort of transformation are you looking for? A caterpillar transforms into a butterfly... Evolution& mutation&natural selection doesn't say that an organism should transform, but that its offspring have variation caused by mutations when copying. Very little genetic change occurs outside of cellular reproduction - only the sort of mutations caused by carcinogens, UV light etc.

[@asyrafonn]

1. The problem with scientists who believe in evolution is that they feel that there is a MUST to relate and correlate everything! Why can't they just accept the fact that creations are created solely on their basis? Yep, human possess some genes found in other species and vice versa. So? That's just how we are created.

[@DapperDragon]

8:41 My same philosophy. I'd just prefer to live as long as the universe will allow me to.

[@sutematsu]

Although I can see how "neo-evolution" could potentially do wonderful things, it seems perilously close to what people have been attempting to achieve through eugenics. Also, I'd be worried that such technology would allow those rich enough to afford the treatments to diverge from those too poor to afford them, so that we "accidentally on purpose" create the species division described by Wells in "The Time Machine." This is the sort of science fiction that I don't want to come true.

[@randomusername818]

4chan? That may be where that phrase originated but it's become so popular that non-4chan users use it too.

[@randomusername818]

I suggest you pick up a copy of a high school biology book.

[@antoniosianez2970]

what's even more sad is none of us will ever see this day. would be pretty cool.

[@JungleJargon]

Have you seen the Mid Atlantic ridge? Have you seen the Rocky Mountains?

[@VegasBlackbyrd]

this talk part of the internet marketing campaign promoting the Prometheus prequel

[@MikeDM1987]

So... there is no relationship between human eyes and primate eyes? I don't know where you learned the definition of relation, but when I was in grade school we were taught that if two objects share a characteristic (e.g. eyes, oppose-able thumbs etc.) that those two objects are related based on the fact that they share that characteristic.

[@OzzyKayra]

We all have the same organs, if not maybe an addition or less of a couple. Our organs, though, are adapted for a specific function. An eagle's eye must be much more accurate than that of a human's because of their need to see from such distances. The structure, though, is identical. The cornea, the iris, etc. All connected to a brain. Some species don't require eyes, like single celled organisms or organisms that don't live in light. Thus, evolution dictates that we rid of what we do not need.

[@alphaenemy]

I don't think typing debates are a waste of time at all. It takes time to research responses from time to time, find the papers that contain the research, etc. You have a spiel, and can snake oil it around like a pro. That's why you want one on one debate. It's a great forum to exhibit your dishonest tactics.

[@Meximagician]

Then we can modify ourselves for efficiency (like how most reptiles are partially solar powered) or to better survive the dangers of space or other planets (Mars would make a good first step, just artificially induce a dynamo to keep the radiation levels down). In the short term we could expand to the water (merpeople) or harsher areas that we couldn't before (mountains, deserts, tundras).

[@tomanders6268]

Incredible speaker.

[@HeCtorCapitalCe]

I think it's more likely that our understanding of genes will increase from animal testing, till a point that we don't need living subjects. Imagine that we would have a simulator that could predict the growth of a genome over time (subjected to simplified environmental conditions). This would prevent us from breeding three-legged humans. But the brain would still be tricky, and it's growth in an complex environment unpredictable.

[@franklouuu]

The problem of genetic manipulation as it is now is that we can only make relevant alterations in the genes of animals when they are in the embryonic stage.

[@Jahanam9994]

I just watched that video, and while it asked some good questions, I found it flawed in many of its presumptions, like how species are defined.

[@checkle1]

you obviously have never taken any comparative anatomy classes or evolution classes. Evolution makes complete sense and answers nearly everything. I say "nearly" because we don't know everything and we never say we absolutely know the truth, that's just bad science.

[@UristMcTubedwarf]

if we can encourage our children into free thinking and creativity, the future will be full of new inventions and discoveries that better the lives of everything. believing everything a magic book or scroll or random guy yelling about stuff in the street says is what kept us back so many times.

[@AbsentWithoutLeaving]

It should. Science fiction is an exercise in predicting the future, based on known science and its potential progression.

[@Youzarzif]

Can't wait, looking so forward to it! :)

[@Alpinex105]

These raise some interesting socioeconomic issues. For starters, who has access to these biotechnological processes? Could this create a division within our society? Please people don't just rely on the scientific authority, these are very complex issues that have some important social consequences.

[@imann3]

So.... the last portion of his talk was a form of eugenics? I mean I get the good it could do in terms of eradicating certain illnesses, but there is also a principle that often we don't know what the hell we're doing when rooting around in our bodies. Our functions are not isolated, every part affects every other part in some way. In eradicating one thing we would likely open ourselves up to an entirely different threat.

[@Aryes1101]

there is obviuously a relation between our eyes and others...

[@ProtectionUnderLaw]

Roar and I are both named Daniel. Dan, Danny, Daniel, Dandy Dan Danielson. Y'know Rachel, sometimes it's best to just let some people go. We're either open or closed. We can't force open a closed one. I mean we can, but then we just make them twice the psychopath we are.

[@TheLonePantheist]

7:15 If you don't enjoy your existence then what is the point of existence? Survival is not enough, an insect survives, yet let's face facts, they are bound to this planet and will share its ultimate fate. In order to survive, one needs a reason to survive.

[@FrumpyPumpkin]

Oh but it does affect the physical structure because the bacteria often develop the means to either pump out the toxins, or the bacterial membrane can disallow the binding of toxic substances to the membrane.This doesn't even take into account genetic changes that introduce novel proteins into the organism that are physically different from previous proteins. I know you're not actually trying to have a serious discussion and are more than likely just trolling.

[@JungleJargon]

Kinds are the first original life forms that were made which gave rise to the variations of kinds that we see. DNA proves there are different kinds because essential proteins perforing the same essential functions are different in different life forms proving they are not related.

[@sofiatgarcia3970]

Oh, sorry, I thought you'd turned for a minute. Sounded like you were referring to ID.

[@speedyblupi]

Hey, we do have fossils from BEFORE the Cambrian explosion, just not very many.

[@IamtheNinjaKitty]

There's a difference between genetic alteration and evolution. I'm only 13 and to me, this is obvious. Plus, there's a difference between adaptation and evolution. Adaptation is proven.

[@speedyblupi]

EVERY part of evolution has been observed, apart from mutations. and even with them we know how they happen. We understand mutations and how they happen We understand natural selection. We understand genetic recombination. PLEASE INVESTIGATE WHAT OUR THEORY ACTUALLY SAYS, BECAUSE IT DOESN'T SAY WHAT YOU THINK IT DOES.

[@S0vereignX]

i still don't get why evolution is so damn hard for people, it's one of the simplest concepts around. it was a debate 50 year ago, far from it today. the future of man will follow the same rules by artificial means, we wouldn't have ANY medical industries that actually worked without the evolutionary process, just that simple. your childhood to adulthood is no different, its not just your life, its your personal evolution. you change over time depending on circumstance

[@kimpeater1]

He doesn't mention the process by which we determine which genes affect which phenotype. The usual method we use today is by "turning off" some genes, and then seeing what happens. This is how they catalog the genes of fruit flies and currently lab mice. This usually results in unexpected deformities and mutations, many often fatal, but that's the point. Is it a fair to experiment on hundreds if not thousands of clones who will likely die a gruesome death for these benefits? I don't know

[@Crabbadabba]

Yeah. For science it’s worth it. Seems kind of like a villainous plot from a Marvel movie but there’s a possibility to repurpose those clones. Still opening a can if worms if not carefully maintained. I don’t think life and death are that important, do we think about our birth through our lives typically? No. Do we actively think about death? No. That’s because they’re both inevitable.