Arrow reacts to Deception, Lies, and Valve by Coffeezilla

[@pmarnoze8321]

“We don’t have the data support that” brother you know exactly what game I was playing TEN YEARS AGO TODAY and with whom

[@shouygui4955]

are we at the point where we are complaining that we can still access games we bought online a decade ago? xD These people cannot be real.

[@ReedoTV]

Later GabeN says: "Employees pull data, it's not pushed to them"

[@obliviator2]

⁠@@shouygui4955the real point of the comment just flew right over your head huh, people like you can’t be real.

[@pmarnoze8321]

@@shouygui4955 huh? No

[@anotherplum]

@@shouygui4955 what are you on about? did you just react to the wrong comment? xD

[@ThePateeeZ]

People should remember that coffeezillas audience is 1-5% cs players. Jeffs audience was 90+%. Just laying this information out there.

[@vankeisb]

It’s a shame. Jeff président.

[@Zarrx]

Armoury Pass is the next step to loop hole loot boxes. Likely cases will drift away.

[@SaintGGod]

BINGO

[@x.nihilo]

Cases are not going anywhere, unless the govt are regulating the industry into oblivion

[@BrainsBrainzBrains]

the Armory still has cases in it

[@mudchoo2069]

Seeing all the people in chat defending Valve or flaming CoffeeZilla when a point is brought up is crazy

[@colorlessink]

Valve should make a case called Lies and Deceptions.

[@strakk]

In that interview the way that dude just glares at the one that's going to answer like "bro, were you about to tell the truth just now?" and just takes over the interview with vague corporate nonsense and lack of data

[@SyRose901]

Valve has constantly given a lot of people including me, a dilemma. On one side, some of the best video games on the planet, and Steam is the only decent video game storefront out there(it still isn't 100% amazing but it's about 85% amazing, which is a benchmark really only GOG managed to hit). Steam Deck manages to be revolutionary in the relatively saturated market of handheld PC gaming devices. Investing into Valve products that isn't CS2/TF2 skins is certainly a good experience at worst. On the other side, there's this. A casino in all but name. Probably the biggest digital casino in existence, if it only was called one. Given my relatively recent entry to CS:GO and then CS2, the internet cafe I frequent has quite a lot of underage teens who are into skins. Luckily, most of them here have no way of paying money internationally, or even have such money in the first place to gamble, so they're *mostly* fine, but still, they're so into skins that I fear that they will get into gambling once they are adults, and get addicted much the same. All because Valve was way too smart about pulling this whole skin thing off.

[@SaarlaneKretiin]

thats why im fine with CS having a casino in it. if it means we get to have Steam in its current state, im all for it. the addicts and casino pays for all the amazing features steam provides.

[@MCPabs]

@@SaarlaneKretiin Valve already has crazy profit removing the CS2 casino, they don't need it for the features. Thats allowing illegal stuff with shit reasoning.

[@SaintGGod]

They're a company. They aren't human, don't treat them as such. It sounds weird

[@TaylorMorgan-y2z]

@@SaarlaneKretiin Steam is already super profitable from its 30% cut of all game sales. The addicts and casino just pay for more yachts for Gabe's fleet.

[@SaarlaneKretiin]

@@TaylorMorgan-y2z nope. Steam provides so much support and services: Workshops, Guides, Artwork, Broadcasts, News, Reviews + more. Thousands of games have them and it forms the bulk of the costs. The server power and management that needs is far higher than people think. If the case casino has to exist for those things to remain available for gaming to have a culture, so be it.

[@ethanstiles948]

“Well it is for me because I’m trade banned” 😂😂😂😂

[@SaintGGod]

Chat full of children who have yet to realize corporations don't care about them

[@the0peratoR]

Like 90% of his audience are basement-dwelling CS players, so they haven't been met with reality yet and still believe corporations are a force for good

[@julianp.2840]

Straight from the Coffee video here. Subbed immediately, you're a rare one.

[@Kanine39]

I seriously believe valve should make all of CS skins non-tradable, only marketable through steam market. That's surely going to crash the skin market immediately, yet I think it's the only way to solve this gambling issue and case farming bots

[@giannisv.4472]

Man your idea is genius. No more second accounts for farming, no more bots, no more gambling sites and still retaining their monetary value.

[@HerbaceousM8]

the reason they havent is because the steam market is a vehicle for money laundering

[@kadin9897]

@@giannisv.4472 no thats a terrible idea skins would not retain there value and millions of people would be fucked over

[@Noriaela]

This has been my idea for a while but the infrastructure that Steam uses would need to change. Skins are technically traded when you sell them. The chances of Valve changing that is very unlikely. Personally I believe they need to do that to all Steam items.

[@amsiizluerta1837]

Love that coffee did this series. However, still don’t believe anything will change. I know I wouldn’t be happy if my whole inventory became worthless or something so. Idk

[@yulyeong9220]

Your inventory wouldn't be worthless it would take an initial hit though. You could still allow 3rd party sites that sell skins just not gambling features

[@SaintGGod]

"Valve should stop kids from gambling even if it means they lose money BUT if it means *I* personally lose money I don't know"

[@TaylorMorgan-y2z]

You should probably cash out while you can if you're worried. There's absolutely a chance of an FTX-like situation here.

[@XTYRMIN8Z]

I mean, yeah, okay, sure. But in the context of this video (that being that your inventory has value as a result of mass child exploitation), kind of a weird take? Or maybe it's more accurate to say something along the line "read the room"? Like, yeah that sucks for you for sure but also...don't really care and get over it? Ya know?

[@moerons]

Perhaps, maybe ... you could stop pretending like your saving for retirement with pixels, and become an adult. They can make it worthless TOMORROW. Sell it all, invest in real world assets, and then don't worry about it. Plus, you are more likely to get laid in the real world. imagine that!

[@SoullessBeats.]

Gambling is ruining lives and Valve doesn't do anything cuz they're money hungry... :(

[@Juggernaut-bz1pt]

if CS "gambling" ruined you're life, you would've done it anyways in a different way dont blame valve for your mental weakness

[@SoullessBeats.]

@ Naah, they start frying teenagers brains at very young age and get them addicted to that dopamine effect. And with age it just gets worse and worse… 😢 Steam should implement some system where it would be needed to ID verify every single player to prevent people underage from opening cases + it would work as an amazing anti cheat, because it’d ban player’s ID to prevent him creating new account and it’d stop all the bot farms… But as I said these big corps are just pure evil, they’ll do anything to take all the money from people :(

[@SomePointlessGarbage]

@@Juggernaut-bz1pt Keep sucking up to mega corporations, brother. They really need your support. Children can get hooked up to gabling and that is not ok, no matter how you frame it. Valve also has the responsability, but they make too much money to care.

[@richardalcantara3359]

​@@Juggernaut-bz1pt I agree it's very easy to blame someone for your own failure. I have been playing CSgo since 2014 and never open cases

[@RealGSingh]

Should kids be able to have access to it 100 percent no, that being said if you are an adult that’s on you, and adults needs to stop being degenerates

[@WarlordRising]

EA might've started loot boxes, but Valve perfected it.

[@djjelled1895]

let us be addicted to the gold gold gold

[@soidjk]

Is this guy's chat actually dumb or full of children? To be fair, I just stumbled across this without any CS knowledge, but do they genuinely have no comprehension for the arguments laid out in the video? Or is it just a lack of knowledge on how casinos work? Or is the community around CS so within a bubble that they've become accustomed to the predatory practices and the environment? Of fucking course Valve has all of the power to stop this. For example, by removing trading at all, or even a small step to get rid of the deceptive animation, or be more liberal with trade banning. I don't know the ins and outs of the culture, so these solutions may have long term concenquences that I'm not aware of, but you get my point. Where did the critical thinking go?

[@gigsy737]

its what you explained, everyone thats in and in deep $ wise thinks they are just in a bubble of the community and they either cant get out or are stupid enough to believe what valve is doing isnt predatory

[@NEStefan_com]

multiply by knives. what about gloves ?

[@HeyWarren]

Where’s the testimony from the 13year olds that won while gamba.

[@Minestone0]

im not really in the CS2 scene, just watching this because im interested how cs2 yters would respond. wanted to say you are a good guy but your chat is cancer lol

[@AKKOS]

Is the video about case farm guy coming?

[@romaakaev]

not yet. he was a really small fish in the sea, idk if its worth it. unless we find out something new

[@AKKOS]

@@romaakaev Yea i know, but i came late to the stream and im curious about what he said

[@romaakaev]

@@AKKOS almost nothing. showed the instances, showed how he was farming. said he made like 700$ in 3 month and was scammed by the software provider

[@yulyeong9220]

The only chance the changes anything is coffeezilla is well respected and considered a journalist amongst regular journalists so it could possibly get more mainstream coverage and pressure from lawmakers if it can go mainstream enough but think it's a slim chance

[@vallytine]

Lmao that sucktube guy in chat

[@wilhelm391]

TY ARROW!

[@unknownentity8256]

15:44 I agree with you Arrow 100% but just because I like you as a personality, person, and content creator, for your safety I'd avoid making these comments. We've seen how crazy these gamba site owners are.

[@drowzee110]

cs should have kyc in the first place it only effects children

[@O6i]

i hate cheating way more than gambling but i like how valve handles skins better than a company like call of duty that sell you one skin for 20$ in a temporary game that is replaced annually and it can't be resold. or transferred over. i have never lost money to valve, when i want to cash out i can. but ive lost thousands to activision over the years. Now if we really want to talk about stealing lets talk about cheaters. They steal our time which is our only non renewable resource. We put our time in money into buying and building computers, paying for internet to play games only to waste all our time and hard work to cheaters. cheaters are the real thieves. i want biometric accounts with life time bans from gaming for cheating to end cheaters bot accounts and scammer accounts forever.

[@sh1elds_tv]

Very true

[@justespelund]

If you want biometric accounts, or having to enter something like social security for your account, you'd also get rid of underage gambling, both problems solved. I think you kind of lost the point of the entire video, the problem is not that some people lose money, and that others win. That will happen no matter what, some people are lucky, some aren't. The issue is also not that it is gambling, gambling can be fun when enjoy responsibly. The issue is the underage part, there is a reason gambling is regulated, there is no reason games should be able to avoid that regulation.

[@Sup12347GH]

steam just needs kyc. if you don't kyc u can't trade and if u do u gotta be 18+. problem solved for the most part.

[@gutuio2407]

only 130 views in 13 mins bro really falling off 😭

[@digitalnomad5728]

bro never took off

[@Luna0wl]

Kyc for steam accs would solve Cs cheating too

[@patatefn]

yeah but minors wouldnt be able to play

[@Luna0wl]

@@patatefn Yep the game is rated for 16 in my country so thats no problem. You can get ID with 16

[@bjenev]

@@patatefn just make it so to pay in the game you would have to kyc

[@patatefn]

@@bjenev yeah but that wouldnt solve the cheater problem

[@dalmationblack]

​@@patatefn just make premier MM KYC-accounts only

[@xDenomic]

all valve needs to do is make it so you need 2fac to trade. done.

[@mcjibbo6100]

It will nothing happen

[@reagretTV]

I'm sorry brother, the steam deck arguement is so lame, it'd be like saying arcade tokens are the same as currency. not that i disagree with the point as a whole.

[@Mattman_247]

In my opinion, Steam should make the cases instantly open instead of the slot machine looking thing so at least people couldn’t say opening cases looks like a casino game anymore. I think the problem is who is pulling the trigger(casinos), not the firearm itself(valve). To me, it’s people with no morals and greedy intentions taking advantage of people who make poor decisions and taking advantage of some underage people who should not be making the decisions in the first place. And by underage I’m thinking like 16 to 20 year olds. Coffee suggested that this is a major problem for 12 and 13 year olds, but I think he has exaggerated that angle a bit. I mean how could a 12 or 13 year old get a credit/debit card, and money on it, to pay for anything online without the help of their parents? Wouldn’t the parents be responsible for allowing them to do it at that point?

[@hagid_2411]

That’s what they did in France to get around their laws and it seemed to work

[@gragalakaisel1477]

did you not see the part 2? where he asked people how old they were when they started gambling and they said 13-14, and the fact that they're still doing it nowadays just means they got addicted to gambling at a very young age.

[@toafloast1883]

@@gragalakaisel1477 what were those 13-14 year olds doing playing a game thats age rated 18+?

[@Mattman_247]

@@gragalakaisel1477 Ok. So 13/14. How could a 13 or 14 year old get a credit/debit card to pay for anything online without the help of their parents?

[@tieko9000]

This might be a bit of a hot take right now, but i think valve might actually be working on getting away from the true slot machine gambling stuff (aka cases). from a business standpoint i can see why they wouldn't let go the copious amount of gamba money immediately while not having a replacement revenue stream at the ready. the recently introduced csgo armory as well as the dota crownfall update retain gambling elements, but introduce player engaging leveling mechanics with rewards (skins, stickers, voice lines, mini-games and more) for progress. in dota the basic "pass" was free and you could buy an upgrade for each of the 4 act that have been released during the last 6 months. i think the similarity of these gaming/season/whatever passes shows that they are looking for a solution to make money with skins/ingame stuff while driving player engagement.

[@0kayegs577]

Solution is simple. Just make it like valorant where you pay to get cosmetics in game. I know this concept sound ridiculous to most gamba addict cs players but you should not be able to pull your money out of the game yet alone profit from it. What do you think you are? A broker? Its just a computer game. There should not be a built in economy thats part of the game. I mean ANY other game where there are skins you simply pay for the skin and it stays on your account forever. And all of them do fine, none of the other companies need a market to keep themselves afloat. This is just valve making millions out of minimum effort that they put into a game. And cs players keep eating it thinking this is delicious.

[@rml4474]

Because it is delicious, its a whole fuckin ecosystem of its own and ive loved it ever since i started playing, literally made like 1000-1500 euros off of it too lol and couldve made a ton more if i had more money to put in/ if i had diamond hands with some items

[@0kayegs577]

@rml4474 you may have made merely 1500 euros but most players have lost hundreds of thousands $. Maybe even you have too, when was the last time you checked your Total steam spendings?

[@rml4474]

@@0kayegs577 Well thats their own fault for not being able to control themselves, only spend what you can afford, shrimple as that

[@0kayegs577]

@@rml4474 they are children man have you missed the entire point? Underage gambling?

[@rml4474]

@@0kayegs577 Yep, shit happens, the world isnt and never will be perfect, there will always be obstacles and hardships no matter what age you are, gotta find your way through it

[@nempk1817]

People are literally asking Valve to close the market and free trading. If Valve bans those sites you can say bye bye to 95% of the big CS championships. The graph this guy shows at 19:05 implying that the reason that CS grows is because of skins is just dumb. That's not how data analises work, did those upgrades only added the skins and nothing else? Ofc not, and games that had no gambling mechanics and had the same growth? If the update added a bunch of things and changed how the game PLAYS you can't simple imply the only reason the game grow was because of skins. I thank Valve every day for not listening CS influencers/PRO's because if they listened to then in 2003 CS would've died.

[@recursiveslacker7730]

People’s lives are being ruined. Also, legitimate sponsors are spooked off of the scene by all the shady casinos.

[@nempk1817]

@@recursiveslacker7730 "People’s lives are being ruined" by Valve? Are you really sure that the biggest problem is a game with the average age of players being 20y with majority being 18+? Did this guy made a video about Epic fortnite targeting literally children and Roblox games literally being used by predators(don't forget about the child abuse on the dev of games in there + the monetization with the same mechanics from CS but MADE FOR CHILDREN) i guess not. The fact is that you can't get money out of any of those CS betting sites to the real world without an bank account/paypal. "Also, legitimate sponsors are spooked off of the scene by all the shady casinos." This alone tells me that you're completely ignorant about e-sports. Explain to me why valorant has basically the same sponsors being the difference the bet sponsors on CS and the strange Chinese companies on valorant? Where are this magic sponsors that the bet scene on CS e-sports is purging since valorant is "modern audience" game with no betting? Its almost like what keep sponsors from CS2 is the fact the game is about terrorism and gun shooting. I don't want the experience of 95% of the legit players/skin users to be worse for the sake of punishing 5%.

[@axelshawAk]

Arrow or youtube is deleting comments on his youtube shorts and its pissing me off. I wrote a paragraph just to have it disappear. What be going on..

[@romaakaev]

i manage the channel. i did not delete anything

[@grepenoop]

Has been happening a lot for me on youtube for months now. It's definitely youtube either having you half blacklisted or just glitched. Either way, sometimes i comment on a short/video or another comment, and when i come back to check it's just gone.

[@hang3068]

All major game companies are making games featuring gacha or loot box systems. See no point to attack Valve...It's all gambling now and so many games are scamming players to some extent IMO.

[@troublishone]

Problem is most games you open a loot box for skins and cannot trade or sell any of them. Vavle is unique in that you can both sell and trade. IT makes their skins an entire economy on its own.

[@hang3068]

@@troublishoneYeah, and in other games unable to sell/trade what you got from lootbox/gacha does not mean ppl can't sell for profit, they can just sell their accounts. So I think ppl are too focused on the feature that skins exist in CS and can be traded for money... and at the same time doing their best to avoid the truth that players just can find so many ways to gamble in any game for profit as long as there is a big enough market/player base. CS just happens to be the game with so many players around the world, and ppl just can't stop gambling for game items. It's not just Valve's problem.

[@troublishone]

@@hang3068 Well I'll hard disagree with you there. Selling accounts is almost always against the TOS of games. As a result buying and selling an accounts in most games is way more sketchy and arduous compared to cs skins. A casual player is not going to sell their account almost ever, its just usually not worth the effort, and on top of that losing the account you actively play the game on. The only time it makes any sense is if you are grinding ranked, and getting certain elo/mmr or just accounts that are MM ready for the specific reason TO sell for profit. That's where I mostly see accounts being bought and sold (which is entirely unrelated to skins). As for gambling, I don't see how it possible to do without trading. Gambling accounts doesn't make sense, because then you will multiple accounts with different skins, which seems utterly pointless as you cannot centralize your rare skins. In fact I can't recall a single game that has a gambling culture like CS. This, indeed, is a problem only valve really have.

[@hang3068]

@@troublishone I get what you mean, it makes a lot of sense, but I'm speaking my view from the perspective of a player from an infamous country known in the CS community, some ppl here just proved from time to time that they can break TOS of CS or any other game to make money, for CS like case farming, cheats, etc. If cs bans trades I can only imagine how crazy some ppl will trade for accounts with high-tier loadout which costs hundreds/thousands of cases&keys to get. (If this ban does not drive them away to other games to profit). Gambling culture and all those shameful sites are bad for CS, but a loot box system that lures players to gamble for some digital items is the original sin. It definitely does not start with Valve.

[@troublishone]

@@hang3068 I don't know if loot boxes are truly that bad. Most of these games do not have gambling addiction issues. Like I said, that is very much something I only see with CS. The only games that come close are usually gotcha games.

[@beastfr0meast93]

as long people want to pay real money and "streamers" are paying there will be a black market

[@神林しマイケル]

It’s not Valve’s fault, it’s the government.

[@Je-Razor]

Which government? Governments for all Counter Strike players would need to coordinate such regulations. That is definitely above 100 different governments that would need to do that. If one of those countries won't the plan fails since people could use VPN.

[@SaintGGod]

Impossibly dumb take

[@神林しマイケル]

@@SaintGGod it’s not a dumb take. Valve is a company, and a company’s sole purpose is to make money. What Valve is doing isn’t illegal, hence, why they can still operate. We live in a capitalist world, nobody really cares about underage gambling. The US government knows about this issue yet doesn’t stop companies from doing such things. It’s like a parent that neglects their child and gives up on disciplining because that child finds loopholes on a rule that was imposed on them. Valve isn’t a charity, it’s a privately owned company. What they are doing is morally wrong, but in the grand scheme of things, it is not illegal. Valve can certainly put a stop to this, but why would they? The general public doesn’t even care about underage “gambling” let alone the numerous governments worldwide. Face it, Valve has the power to stop it - but in a capitalist-dominated world, they have no reason to unless it gets regulated.

[@神林しマイケル]

@@Je-Razor then let them use VPN, it makes the barrier to entry a whole lot harder compared to nothing at all. As i have commented on another person, what Valve is doing isn’t illegal, they have no obligation to put a stop on this unless you scream about “morality.” In a capitalist-dominated world, only regulations can truly stop such things. Are you the type of person to give up on a problem because they can find loopholes? So your solution is to not do anything about it because “oh, it’s hard” or “let’s not do anything to circumvent this problem because they can just find another way” etc… I’m sorry to say, but the world doesn’t care about underage gambling nor about gambling at all. They can easily fix such loopholes but they’re not doing such things.

[@beastfr0meast93]

He is using Reddit because Richard Lewis does it... 😂

[@shouygui4955]

"regulators" = someone from a foreign country without any undestanding or knowledge of the game making laws about it.

[@tkhhayden1949]

“Regulators” = Regulators

[@sliver7993]

Ah yes because each country doesn't have its own form of regulations and regulators. (Obvious sarcasm)

[@ithinkso27]

trust me bro a regulator is smarter than you

[@shouygui4955]

@@sliver7993 are you suggesting that kids betting on their pokemon card games and booster packs is somehow a crime? you're against games in general, because you are no fun and want a government agency preventing people from enjoying themselves.

[@justespelund]

@@shouygui4955 I think he is suggesting, that gambling, that is regulated in literally all other forms, should also apply to games, its really not that difficult to understand.

[@deeplookman]

I hope government will force valve to delete all the skins

[@CharouzFR]

why u mad bruv

[@deeplookman]

Im not mad but all this bullshit should stop at some point, kids are becoming addicted to gambling and no one cares, delete the skins or make them worthless thats it

[@mum-your]

30 mins of nothing, who is this content for lol

[@romaakaev]

he spreads awareness, even if wont shock-value anything its still good if more people will find out about it

[@stiery853]

exactly, everything he said has already been said by Jeff last year, but I guess making his own video is more effective in spreading awareness than linking a person's video.

[@zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz736]

Redditors

[@sliver7993]

You are basically screaming "I like fraudsters and fraudulent activity" also no @ because you know you're wrong.

[@jokhur4787]

The angry basement dwellers in your chat was amazing 😂😂