Asexuality, Trolls, Hate Speech | Dr. Debra Soh

[@DrDebraSoh]

I start answering your questions at 3:10 :)

[@NQuiz52]

Dammit! I missed this LIVE!

[@meowateyourchips7417]

The reason why we don't see the awareness push from Asexuality community anymore compared to like a decade ago is because we were basically bullied out of our own community. Back then there was an active push to be seen by the older activists. They also approached academics to ask them if they were interested in studying asexuals and some were interested. A few wrote papers on Asexuality. With all this, Asexuality became more well known and this became a double edge sword. Suddenly, we found our forums and spaces getting a lot more traffic which itself was not a bad thing but the crowd we attracted were no other than tumblr users. After a while, every other day I would see stuff like, "I'm addicted to s*x, am I asexual" and we were like, "no, that's contradictory". These people who were told no didn't just leave the place afterwards. They stayed and made up more microlabels every other day that would fit their sexuality. They also complained to the mods a lot and some even became mods. After that we were told we couldn't "tell someone what their identity is." After that, we couldn't say no anymore to the posts that say, "I want to have sex but I'm not attracted, does that mean I'm asexual?" The ones who couldn't hold their tongues were banned. Imagine that, actual asexuals banned from their own community because they "invalidated" someone who's obviously not asexual. There was a lot of drama and infighting. We wanted the definition to be changed so that it was precise and clear. We wanted mircrolabels gone but eventually, we lost because I mean... we are so few in numbers. Most older members were either banned or they left voluntarily out of protest. I sometimes go back to check what is happening and it's no one I recognize. And the formerly active activists who appeared on national TV even, seemed to have disappeared into thin air. Not sure if it was other reasons but they don't seem to be doing anything much anymore. Even if there were more recent studies on Asexuals, I wouldn't trust them because I don't think they would be studying on actual asexuals in the first place

[@DrDebraSoh]

Thank you for sharing this. I did a really fascinating interview with David Jay back in the day. Sad to see wokeism ruin everything.

[@meowateyourchips7417]

@Dan Banny Asexuality (back then at least) doesn't mean people don't get romantic feelings and it doesn't mean they want to be alone forever. Beyond that, since it's very uncommon, it was a way to connect with others who were similar and talk to each other. Some asexuals met up and ended up dating each other. Even the partners of asexuals who aren't asexuals came in to have conversations and talked about their relationship issues. We also wanted to get studied by scholars so that one day we could find out what caused it but that's a wet dream now. A lot of asexuals didn't want to be a part of LGBT+ either and I was one of them. Tumblr didn't invent asexuality. A man named David Jay that Dr Soh interviewed at one point as she mentioned in her comment above did. This was before tumblr days. You can easily google him and there's still footage of his past interviews. There was also a documentary at one point.

[@pythonjava6228]

Definitely. As an asexual person myself, it's so annoying to see the term asexual can be used for anyone who doesn't have a high sex drive. I have seen so many posts of people saying "I experience attraction and want to have sex but I'm still asexual". That is an obviously contradictory statement but we cant say otherwise otherwise were labelled gatekeepers and tossed out. Nowadays LGBT labels are seen as a club more than anything else. The terms can mean anything that anyone wants them to which obviously means that they mean nothing.

[@meowateyourchips7417]

@@pythonjava6228 Yeah, I remember those ridiculous questions on the forum every other day. The push for clear and concrete definitions didn't work at all. That's when I decided to leave the community because to me it didn't make sense for a word to mean anything. I suspect that there's some agenda to keep the definition loose while using inclusivity as an excuse because it significantly increases the number of people who can identify with it. So, it makes the overall movement bigger.

[@meowateyourchips7417]

​@Dan Banny but it's not about the sex drive. Asexuality was something that couldn't be explained in ways that we know of i.e. sex drive, hormonal levels, medical issues, etc. New words popping up is also how languages work. When there's something that's common enough, people give words to describe it. I don't see how labeling itself is an issue here. The issue is making it into an identity, a social statement, wearing it like a badge of honor to feel special and revolving your life around it. Similar to straight, gay, bi people who make it their whole personality but the existence of this attention seeking behavior isn't magically caused by straight, gay, bi labels. It's caused by the attention seeking people. You also see it pointless because you are not the odd one out in terms of sexuality. Asexuality is very abnormal. Our societies revolve around sex. For a period of time before the tumblr thing, it was a very useful label for me and many others. It helped us figure out why our relationships weren't working. It still helps because every time we date someone new, we can let them know that sex is gonna be different. Even though I don't use the label anymore. It made me understand myself better so now I can communicate better. It's a dealbreaker for many and would you rather I didn't understand this part of myself and therefore, not communicating this before getting into a relationship? It's not fair to the other party and it's not fair to me either to feel obliged to put out. We are not putting anything in a box and closing it. It's about self reflection and understanding your sexuality more. If anything, it opened more boxes because when you know who you are, you can start taking the steps to do something about it instead of blindly walking around.

[@RichardPallardy]

I wonder how many people identify as asexual simply as a way of explaining their avoidance of rejection and intimacy for non-trauma related reasons. I've spoken to a couple people who suggested that they might be asexual. I got the sense that it was more because they had a tough time dating due to deficient social skills or being physically unattractive than because they weren't actually interested in sex.

[@FM-cs1rn]

I mean… even ads generated towards gay men have this tone of “don’t trust doctors”. There’s ads on KZbin suggesting I won’t be able to talk to my doctor about PrEP so I should get it online. I think I rather find a new doctor if I couldn’t talk to them about sex. I don’t deny that people do have a difficultly speaking to their doctors about their sexuality but this is more fear mongering than providing sound advice. A doctor can monitor my health in ways I cannot…

[@badsocks756]

I'm trans and I 100% agree with your take on self-ID and prisons. The very idea that we'd just throw someone in a women's prison because one day they claim they're a transwoman is insane. I've had multiple surgeries including an orchiectomy (so that I no longer produce testosterone) + been on HRT for years in order that I might pass as well as possible. In other words, I have an established history of gender dysphoria and am taking the necessary steps to be recognized as a woman. Simply saying "Oh you say you're a woman, guess we've got to believe you" with no requirement to bare minimum take hormones for long enough to get a serious change in a person's behavioral disposition, or surgery, or whatever, is absolute lunacy, and insulting to transwomen like myself as well. Unless there is a serious process to ensure that the person is both genuinely trans AND not a threat to women prisoners (meaning no convicted sex offenders for example) , certain very antisocial offenders WILL abuse this self ID system to prey on women. It only takes a few instances of this happening for it to be a problem worth considering, and we probably shouldn't wait til it's a huge problem to start thinking about how we can keep ciswomen safe while respecting transwomen's rights That said, I think if a transwoman genuinely has dysphoria and has been on hormones (and/or has had an orchiectomy/vaginoplasty) and doesn't have a history of sexually abusing women, I don't think they represent any sort of significant threat. Estrogen does a lot over time to change a person's emotional/behavioral profile. For me, my anger/aggression went way down, to the point where now my anger comes and goes in a matter of moments. I'm more prone to sadness now, and can cry more easily. In addition, my sexual attraction changed a ton. For starters, visual stimuli are now much less important than before. Also, whereas on testosterone I used to first notice a person's individual body parts that were appealing, and then I would zoom out so to speak to see the whole person. Now on estrogen I feel like I see the whole person first and foremost and take interest in that, then if I'd like, I sort of zoom in with my eyes for parts I like (I rarely objectify in this way anymore though). I think a genuine transwoman with a brain that's running fully on estrogen is going to be fairly unlikely to be violent much more than your average cisgender woman. All that said, keep up the good work. Particularly around free speech -- please understand, a lot of trans people agree with you!! But we can't speak out either, for much the same reason

[@mstrailertrash058]

That's a false question or false dichotomy. Free speech is necessary for diversity and inclusion. To try to effect diversity and inclusion without first or at the same time insisting on free speech will result in homogeneity and exclusion.

[@JasonBower-ql3cd]

Dr. Maggie Yu actual provided a friend some helpful reccommendations afew years ago, regarding health autoimmune deficiencies. 😊 Fyi: Jason Hwang B.

[@awclark3]

This one I get confused on. Are they sexless, or bi sexual, or some other identity all together?

[@ContrarianExpatriate]

I appreciate your attention to the subject of asexuality. However, I think you define it incorrectly. Asexuals generally do experience physical attraction to people, but not experience sexual attraction. I as an asexual man do experience targeted attraction to particular females, but it never gets to the point where I am interested in having sex with them. I am sex averse for whatever reason, but I love and feel physical attraction to women.

[@veehope2702]

I feel the same but isn't this just low libido? I'd be happy to have sex maybe once a year.

[@ContrarianExpatriate]

No. Libido is sexual urge which is entirely different than then the overall lack of sexual attraction to people.

[@NoopyP]

I am also sex averse / sex repulsed, and I think that I actually found out about what it meant to be asexual after a conversation with a classmate about how prevalent sex is in our society and I realized something about me was different as I had never felt sexual attraction and had always been repulsed by the idea of sex.

[@jasonleonard9776]

So the gender differences matter when someone claims to be asexual - if it is a girl, there's reason to suspect trauma. If it's a man, he could likely be biologically atypical. Interesting that the target of arousal is what makes the distinction. Looking forward to next week's stream - thanks Dr. Soh!

[@pythonjava6228]

Definitely, a person who's experienced trauma isn't the same as someone who's brain is wired differently. I think the split comes when you notice there are people who have been asexual for as long as they can remember and this is a lifelong trait vs people who seem to have "acquired" asexuality through illness or trauma. The latter group needs support and aren't being helped by turning their experience into an identity but the former is just different wiring and probably a normal variation in humanity. Thats just my opinion tho. I have encountered asexual women with no history of srxual trauma so they definitely exist. I would also argue that there is some percentage of asexual women who have it as a lifelong trait and also experienced trauma so in that case the asexuality would have been there regardless. I would love to see research and neuroimaging on asexual men and women but I doubt there's cultural momentum for it.

[@silrana7166]

As someone on the ace spectrum (who has been for as long as I can remember) with no such trauma, I agree. I’d like to know why I’m this way - just a simple, clear cut scientific explanation for what would happen in the womb or to a child’s development that would result in them being asexual or having this limited sexual attraction. Hearing Debra’s (sorry if I spelled name wrong) response to demisexuality made me realise it really is something that is misunderstood and there is basically zero scientific research about - sure I felt a little disappointed and disheartened, but I can’t blame her. It’s an educated look on it. You can think of demisexuality as asexual...until you’re not. I’ll explain. The way I see it (and have experienced it) you go through your life as practically asexual, until you form a strong emotional bond with a person (can take years) and maybe, potentially and eventually sexual feelings sizzle and slowly erupt - but only for this person. Before this, you never felt any sort of sexual desire for anyone in particular. You would have described yourself as being ace your whole life until this point. Until all this time has passed, all this bonding and strong friendship, with this person - and something you never thought was possible happened - you sexually desire them. And then, only - you are indifferent to everyone else. Not because of an agreement to monogamy, but it is literally impossible for you to feel that way for anyone else. That’s how your brain is wired. Lo and behold, that’s the difference (from my experience) between being demisexual and being asexual - and the difference between being demisexual and (apologies for lack of eloquence) a ‘regular straight’ person. Hope y’all learned something new or gleaned some new insight into the matter. I genuinely despised how people misuse the term so flopping and have ruined it before it’s even known, but now I no longer care too much - I just describe myself as ace to avoid the confusion, and I only divulge this when necessary, anyway. In any case, I’m aware my experience is quite different from others and want to know why.

[@pythonjava6228]

@@silrana7166 I agree that asexual and demisexual are two very different phenomenon. I think it would be prudent to study them somewhat independently because undoubtedly there are different neurological reasons for never feeling sexual attraction at all vs feeling it under the circumstances you describe. Demisexual would technically be a descriptor of how someone can experience being straight, gay or bi but there's something different with demisexuals vs the general population. I agree that its not simply choosing to abstain from s3xual activity until a bond is formed. Its not experiencing attraction at all which is not a common experience for women. I've grown up around a alot of women and they can definitely tell if a man/woman is hot even if that person is a stranger. A demisexual wouldn't relate to seeing a person that way.

[@NoopyP]

Yes I've just never had any interest in sexual endeavors, no trauma or anything. I found out about the mere existence of sex quite late and it absolutely disgusts me. I am sex repulsed / sex averse so I don't want to ever have sex or even see it... I discovered what being asexual was like a year or two ago.

[@StriderMack]

What kind of therapies would you suggest for a woman with low libido possibly due to SSRIs?

[@newseefgenesis9191]

Try acupuncture...

[@slowbrodragon6951]

What is the 'c-word'?

[@jwhippet8313]

Rhymes with Sharona.

[@SlyNine]

@@jwhippet8313 I thought it rhymed with punt

[@jasonleonard9776]

@@SlyNine i thought it was chlamydia haha public schooling did me in

[@KodaLeck]

My friend says he's ace,he's been through a lot he was adopted at a very young age,doesn't know his biological parents,doesn't eat that healthy,has a stressful job,was bullied in school,thinks he's ugly,do you think he's ace due to all that like trauma wise rewiring his brain

[@stigmoen5411]

Heard you on Joe Rogan! You are great! Regards from Norway! Sorry, I cant write!

[@kurthouck7551]

I just found you on a podcast and plan on listening to you more. I have a question that isn't really related to what has been discussed here. What are causes of men having strong sexual fetishes?

[@NQuiz52]

Cupcake with frosting on the "inside"? Hmmmmmm... You're in Canada, right?

[@NoopyP]

I've never drunk alcohol and I plan on going on like this my whole life. It's just not something I'm interested in experiencing and I don't like the idea of messing with my brain and letting my guard down like that.

[@k.c.8658]

Hello!

[@johnnyaguilar3611]

😍

[@DumbledoreMcCracken]

You need to have multiple cameras to make the visuals more dynamic