The LNG Cold Energy Opportunity

[@Derekzparty]

Energy transfer is always 100% efficient ... just usually not in the form you want!

[@bbgg8642]

I respect you for going for that Hank Hill Texas accent. You missed gloriously

[@jsimsgt96]

Dang it , asianometry!

[@atomic_wait]

​@@jsimsgt96That asianometry ain't right.

[@Enjoymentboy]

LNG is pretty amazing stuff when you consider that you can both get 3rd degree burns and sever frostbite from it at the same time.

[@5th_decile]

The LNG industry have to get their leaking house in order.

[@GroovyVideo2]

I agree - Every gas well is leaking - including capped wells -

[@Paul-hr6yg]

5:28

[@Paul-hr6yg]

5:38

[@Paul-hr6yg]

6:05 7:55 7:55 7:55 5:46 5 5:50 5:50 :47 5:49 5:49 5:49 5:46

[@Paul-hr6yg]

8 8:30 8:31 8:31 8:31 8:31 8 8:31 8:31 8:33 8:33 8:33 8:33 8:33 : 8:34 8:34 8:34 31 :05 8:30 8:19 8:19 8:19 8:20 8:20 8:21 8:22 8:28

[@larryslobster7881]

datacenter cooling is a technically very cool application

[@metagen77]

Cool

[@ninesninesnines]

was literally just thinking that

[@sudeeptaghosh]

No it’s not .. the job water can do anything else is just a waste of money

[@ras0k]

babe wake up new LNG Cold Energy Opportunity just dropped

[@adymode]

6:22 The gas in consumer bottles of most kind Propane, LNG etc. is liquid at the pressure inside the bottle. The cold energy, its latent heat of evaporation, chills the bottle. The liquid boils off inside the bottle when gas is released. High pressure keeps it liquid far above the temp it would be liquid at 1 Bar, which is in the -150C range. If the bottle gets too cold it can slow gas output. Can happen with camping size stoves.

[@megalonoobiacinc4863]

I guess its a propane/butan mix as well in computer blowers too? They can have several hundred bars inside (disturbing to think about when you hold them). If you aren't careful when you use them, the surface or electronic components will catch ice and be damaged.

[@wills.5762]

@@megalonoobiacinc4863 Closer to 10 bar...still plenty to remove a couple fingers, but a far cry from hundreds.

[@brodriguez11000]

We use propane. The only cold affects the regulator, hence insulation around it.

[@Ludix147]

The computer blowers are just compressed air, so mostly nitrogen and oxygen

[@emptyshirt]

@@Ludix147 Many computer blowers are halocarbon to reduce flammability, like difluoroethane and tetrafluoroethane Honestly, I don't understand why they are legal considering the greenhouse potential.

[@Nerd3927]

You, sir, are in a class of your own!

[@ikea_wizard]

you have become one of my favorite youtubers to watch. keep up the good work.

[@tanall5959]

On the power generation side, I wonder how feasible it would be to use the 'cold energy' as the cold side of a sterling cycle generation plant? With waste heat and/or solar heating for the hot side?

[@dianapennepacker6854]

Yeah I thought the same thing. Feel like that is the simplest way. Always been told they work via changes in temp, but I've never seen one using cold temps.

[@X4R2]

According to the wikipedia page on the Organic Rankine cycle, it seems to be better for lower-temperature sources like waste heat.

[@megalonoobiacinc4863]

its the most efficient way and its definitely possible, just not commonly commercially developed. There's tons of videos on utube of sterlings running on ice cubes, they can even run on body heat. The only thing they need is a temperature difference.

[@oadka]

way less powerful than a rankine cycle in the same form factor. We're talking megawatts here.

[@The_MAC_CAT]

Thanks!

[@KarlKarpfen]

Are you aware that the ship in 1:26 isn't an LNG carrier, but an LPG carrier? LNG ist typically stored at ambient pressure at low temperatures and ships to do this efficiently look like fairly normal tankers. LPG liquifies fairly easily at about ambient temperature or slightly below at far above ambient pressure, which leads to ships stacked with several most efficient high pressure tanks: spherical tanks Edit: 1:26 is an LPG carrier, 2:30 is an LNG carrier.

[@THypher1]

Older LNG tankers use the MOSS type spherical tanks and new LNG tankers use the membrane tanks that are boxy and not as tall but still extend above main deck compared to an oil tanker for example. Also, LPG tankers are often quite a bit smaller than LNG tankers due to the nature of their cargo, and they often use cylindrical tank instead of spherical tanks.

[@geneballay9590]

Very interesting and well done. I worked the oil and gas fields for 36 years, literally around the world and have been around LNG several times, but your topic here had never occurred to me, and I now know that at even 76 years old there are still things to learn.

[@BossGodfrey-g2d]

Cold Energy and Cold Energy Accessories

[@jweathers131]

You know what's funny? The Saltwater freezing method is already in use. It is used to make Ice beers. It is also amazing to think that there is a world of boundless energy at our disposal. If it could be used as effectively as possible, how much less power generation would the world need?

[@GerbenWulff]

LNG recently has become a hot item in Europe. But most of the pre-existing LNG terminals don't have any of this. I know the LNG terminal in Rotterdam was mainly build to be able to supply NG in case supply from other sources (like Russia) was disrupted. They have a big storage facility to store the content of an LNG tanker and quickly evaporate that and put it into the grid. Now the use case has changed completely. Supply from Russia has been disrupted for the unforeseeable future, so LNG is regasified continuously, added to the grid and then either used directly or stored in old gas fields for when it is needed. Because it is expensive to build pipelines for gas transport from Siberia all the way to Western Europe, Europe has adopted a strategy where they import gas year round and in summer store most of that gas for use in winter. Now that pipeline gas has been replaced by LNG there could be great opportunities for making use of that cold energy as the LNG regasification installations see more year-round use.

[@meteorknight999]

For financially problomatic western europe it is expensive unless you are just pipeline built by china which isn't wasting funding on land of corruption or against their supplier

[@adymode]

I believe most of the gas arriving in tankers remains liquid (under pressure) until released from bottles, large and small. When gas is delivered by lorry it is in high pressure liquid form. It is usually consumed at a rate where the bottle is big enough to sink the "cold energy" of evaporation into its surrounds.

[@GerbenWulff]

@@adymode No, that consumption using evaporation is done in small time applications, like a natural gas vehicle with an LNG fuel tank, (like a truck or ship), or an off-grid location that uses LNG to power their heating, but only gets supplied a few times a year. Most LNG is gasified and put into the natural gas grid. In all cases there is an evaporator, so an LNG truck is driving around carrying a heat exchanger that helps to gasify the LNG. The pressure in tankers. lorries and LNG vehicle fuel tanks is about 5 bar if I remember correctly. You can call that high pressure, but if you want to convert LNG to CNG (compressed natural gas), you need 200 bar pressure, so they increase the pressure pumping the LNG before evaporating it.

[@adymode]

​@@GerbenWulff If its combustable gas being transported in a tank - its liquid. If its only compressed gas inside, the tank is practically empty. Think about it, why drive a huge heavy tank of gas around when liquid will move hundreds of times more. Propane liquifies at around room temperature at 10 Bar (10 atmospheres) The pressure in transport tanks cant get much lower than that if they are not almost empty and its not very cold. They can get much higher if they get hot, the valves are designed to bleed off excessive pressure. The faulty idea, that tanks of compressed gas are being driven around, and that majority of LNG is gassified/vapourised/boiled off BEFORE end use is distorting this idea of lots of wasted "cold energy" In industry the LNG and extracted propane , butane etc. Is piped and transported as high pressure liquid. It is not often used rapidily enough to required expensive vapourisation, the tanks are usually just colder than environment.

[@adymode]

I use these bottles and tanks. They are full of liquid, sloshing around. Tap the side of them to estimate how full. Its not 'super compressed' gas, its just liquid propane and butane. You can see it in transparent cigarette lighters as well. I love this channel, but this particular investigation is not firmly attached to reality.

[@BobConnor-n2g]

Why not send the cold gas through like an evaporator coil and let moisture condense so that now we have fresh distilled water? Near the ocean it is like desalination. You would not even need to heat the water, it would work like a dehumidifier in a humid area.

[@onlypranav]

As he mentioned in video.. vapor to liquid required 7 times the energy of liquid to ice. It'll be quite inefficient. I think sea water to ice, and then RO would be a good use case if the region in dry and lacking clean water.

[@emptyshirt]

@@onlypranav Also water's latent heat is over 4x that of natural gas. You'd only get 149 ml of water per liter of natural gas. 0.41/1*800/2200=0.149 (the 800 j/kg comes from the video)

[@floatingsystems2929]

Your measured and rational optimism always helps to pull me out of a depressive state. I really needed that today. Thank you so much for making these videos.

[@michaeltrillium]

The consistent high quality of this channel is just incredible 👏

[@kiwiPatchAz]

Hey I love your videos. I would be fascinated if you can do a video about my industry. I work for the Japanese machine tool. Industry representing brother and matsuura. I'm very interested in the history behind the 2 companies, and I think they are one of the best examples of Japanese ingenuity. If you have questions, please reach out to me. I don't know if there is an easy way on this app but the cnc world is massive and touches every part of our lives I'm actually installing a machine at a customer who makes the base plates for the three hundred millimeter wafers for fabs here in phoenix

[@RK-cj4oc]

Awesome!

[@rollinwithunclepete824]

Thanks Jon! Never thought of Cold Energy. Learn something every time I watch one of your videos !

[@carmatic]

my first thought was thermoelectric energy generation, but i guess i dont know much about any of this.... you would have thermocouples between the cold LNG and the ambient atmospheric air, the temperature gradient would cause a voltage to form across the thermocouple, and by allowing current to flow, the inherent inefficiency of thermocouples would generate the heat necessary to boil the LNG

[@davidgoodwin4148]

Most nitrogen fertialier comes from nitrogen by freezing the air. 50% of the nitrogen in your body comes from this process. Specifically while the Haber process heats air to a high temperature, there are a bunch of cooling steps in the process (much of which can use air). However, the purification at the end is done at negative 20 C. (The process makes ammonia, that is basically nitrogen fertizer).

[@aditchitale8017]

Something to keep in mind is that LNG is insanely bad for the environment. The losses for LNG during transport are quite high due to evaporative losses, and those lost gasses are primarily methane, the worst possible gas to release into the atmosphere, 84 times more potent than CO2 as a greenhouse gas.

[@JMiskovsky]

But Local burning is ok.

[@larryslobster7881]

still better then coal

[@simplexicated]

Watch climate town video on this

[@bromine_35]

Can be fixed with a flameoff tower?

[@reddixiecrat]

What do you think happens to that methane if it’s not turned into LNG?

[@2kadrenojunkie]

gotta love cold exergy edit: turns out this was intentional, i was poking fun at a percieved typo at 4:31. 5:42 is where its revealed as a non-typo

[@JMiskovsky]

This method is besically energy transfer by tanker. LNG can be used also for trains ,car and trucks etc. Cars with Hybrid LNG + battery had been prodiced. Do not forget about fuel cells.

[@matthewf2795]

Interestingly the word "coolth" describes stored "cold energy" that you can use later for cooling applications, think stashing away all the snow you get in the winter to use for cooling during the summer.

[@Jupa]

Coolthwip

[@aadhaarsharma2786]

The challenge is saying that word without lisping 😂

[@AK-vx4dy]

You never disappoint. I take phone to hear something in mean time and ended standing with it for whole video 😅

[@mytech6779]

One correction, there is no boil-off waste during transport. The boil-off is used to replace part of the main engine fuel.

[@ClericChris]

I'll propose 2 solutions: A cost practical one and a cool idea one. 1. Cool a super conductor driven motor turbine gen. Cheapest, just weld pipe points from point A to B and skip LNG.

[@esterparis1190]

For a long time I have regretted that this cold energy is not used in France. The theoretical efficiency of a thermal machine, for the same temperature difference, is all the better when the cold source is very very cold. Desalination by cold can surely be optimized with a laminar flow and a slow formation of fresh water ice on walls flexible enough to be able to break the ice once the tank is emptied of its water.

[@paulhorton5612]

Not new energy as such, just partial recovery of some of the staggering amounts of energy required to liquefy the NG in the first place - still, every bit of efficiency helps

[@szurketaltos2693]

I do wonder if it would be possible to just run a LNG fuel cell, and capture the CO2 as dry ice for sequestration and/or cold energy. The kinetics at those low temperatures would be a challenge though.

[@karlkarlson3502]

I had a rabbit 🐇 named Rankine. I named him after the scientist. I wrote it out as "Rankeen". I use to watch King of the Hill with him. Very good memories from this video! 🥰

[@jaredkennedy6576]

Multi use seems to be a pretty good way to go. Combine desalination, air separation, and electric generation, plus there might be some natural gas left over to send out to those who need it

[@szurketaltos2693]

Non-steam district heating systems (e.g. in Stockholm) could definitely benefit from cold energy in the summer. You would probably need natural gas storage in which to put most of the gas until winter, to balance out the seasonal aspects.

[@gus473]

6:40 Ford Motors, in collaboration with Thermo Electron Corporation, built a demonstration Rankine Cycle semi-truck around 1970. That summabich easily topped 105 mph with this low-pollution, external combustion power plant! (Ralph Nader dedicated a chapter in one of his books about this effort.)

[@justincheng12345]

How about centralised cooling for hot climate area. For example Hong Kong is running its centralised cooling plant, it might just linked into the LNG unloading and tap the coolness out of it.

[@SimonZerafa]

Use that cold energy to extract CO2 and CH4 from thr atmosphere. The CO2 can be stored as a Carbon sink snd the CH4 is another fuel source and a greenhouse gas best not left in the atmosphere. Thr CO2 can also be a source for other chemistry.

[@fishyerik]

Just spending fuel to evaporate the methane faster than it would do anyway just from ambient heat is insane. Even if that isn't much compared to the amount of energy in the LNG, and also the energy that could be extracted by utilizing ambient heat, or low grade waste heat isn't that much compared to the energy in the LNG, wasting, instead of extracting, useful energy is in principle a very bad option. While freeze distillation is much more energy efficient than single stage thermal distillation, at normal temperatures, you can't really stage freeze distillation as you can vacuum distillation, meaning, with a sufficient temperature difference, multistage vacuum distillation can be significantly more energy efficient, and also directly produce distilled water, and not just low salinity ice. The preference for multistage thermal distillation has some really good reasons, in contrast to a lot of common practices, like burning stuff in order to speed up evaporation of methane. But then again, vacuum distillation could by "powered" by very small differences in temperature, like common differences between in ambient temperatures between day and night, or evaporative cooling using sea water in dry climates.

[@racheddar]

Qatar's LNG windfall is set to double its sovereign fund, you can bet they're investing in all sorts of LNG efficiency-boosted technologies for transportation.

[@0neIntangible]

I was wondering if Peltier devices could be applied to some processes, if their efficiency and working principles are adequate enough to harness in some way. * Edit: Wikipedia clarifies it as the "Seebeck effect", thermo-electric generator.

[@maks9644]

The cold energy could be described as exergy, which is the term that describes usefull energy, while opposite of that os ANERGY, which is basically energy of the environment. The terms were invented by slovenian engineer Zoran Rant and are very usefull in such scenarious as is this video. Edit: I see you have explained that, i didnt watch up to that part when writing the comment.

[@pomicultorul]

thank you for your work!

[@jimurrata6785]

That geothermal plant in Hawaii that got overrun with lava was using heptane IIRC "Cold energy" is kind of oxymoronic, isnt it?

[@spherevsgravity]

I enjoy your content about water and energy gas specifically. Thanks

[@Iangamebr]

The liquid oxygen and nitrogen demand problem is already solved. 4 Starship launches consumes the entire US production of liquid oxygen of the day, we will be seeing thousands of launches of those a year very soon. We need to literally and, at least, 10X the production of liquid oxygen for that alone. The industry will probably 20x production by end of next decade.

[@nihalbhandary162]

I was thinking the same thing. Space needs Methane (Natural gas) and Oxygen for their Methlox engines. LNG could be used to produce LOX this way which could be really useful for them. Although I think they do not regassify LNG as they need it in liquid form.

[@onlypranav]

Sadly US would be the one liquifying the nat gas. It has so much nat gas that there should not be any reason to import that stuff.

[@Meton2526]

I'm amused that this is technically refrigeration, with the compressor and evaporator being separated by a cargo ship in the middle.

[@RC534]

While casually watching this video I was immediately drawn into the video again when the word exergy was mentioned at 5:45. Professional deformation from teaching thermodynamics 😆.

[@ramtuff06]

Hydrocarbons that phase change are extremely volatile, cause major safety issues with routine maintenance, this is why propane tanks are made the way they are they're made to puncture not collapse, puncture causes a high speed jet that increases the velocity so high that auto ignites the hydrocarbon with the air So what you're saying is that you wanna put small napalm bombs in a server farm? Not to mention if the equipment fails and leaks the hydrocarbon into the air, causing static auto ignition, great idea, but just not practical

[@Engineersoldinterstingstuff]

If you do not want to be dependent on Putins or Saudis gas, LNG needs to be available.

[@matneu27]

The plan is to get independent of war criminals and states who kick-ass human rights, as soon as possible, by producing the energy environment friendly from renewable sources in the own country. I see LNG as a bridge on that way. At least, the harvesting of cold energy from LNG will not save 1g of CO2 by burning it.

[@jercos]

"No relation to vapes"... except that's exactly what it's doing. Applying heat to a liquid to vaporize it for delivery. It's just vaporizing a fuel instead of a drug.

[@H0mework]

Amazing output as usual

[@chiliphil64]

your step in a boat and you step on a ship.

[@sheekolampman737]

5:36 ENVARMENT

[@beaverbuoy3011]

XD

[@FirstNullLast]

Wouldn’t heat pumps also play a good role in this? Use the waste heat from cooling the lng to heat up water?

[@aadhaarsharma2786]

How about just running the LNG through thin stainless steel pipes and letting the warm, moist ocean air just condense on it? That condensate should be 100 percent pure water, no?

[@aryaman05]

Yes they could. Waiting time ridiculously long, or heat exchanger would have to be 10 football stadium big. LNG carrier doesn't have that kinda time to wait around to discharge its cargo.

[@onlypranav]

Also, vapor to water takes far more energy 7x compared to water to ice.

[@walterpleyer261]

Heat, Cold? Sounds like a case for a Stirling engine

[@pierQRzt180]

I like when energy is recovered somewhat

[@nobodynever7884]

Sounds like Stirling engines need to enter the chat. All that cold would make them more efficient as the temperature differential would be huge.

[@djamondaxuzm4712]

RANKINE CYCLE MENTIONED 🗣🗣🗣🔥🔥🔥

[@HenryJames-q6t]

FYI: Bloomberg has a piece about Japan getting back into semis.

[@gumpyoldbugger6944]

There is no such thing as a waste product/by-product, it's just an unrealized potential raw material. Case in point, petrol/gasoline. Back when we were first started refining crude oil to produce lamp oil required to the diminishing supply of whale oil, petrol/gasoline was an unwanted by-product that apart from a small amount being bottle as a solvent sold in pharmacies, was flush down the sewers and drain. Today, petrol/gasoline is arguably the number one product produced by refineries around the world and lamp oil, aka kerosine is now mainly used to power jet engines. I would not be all that surprised that in less then a hundred or so years time, what we call nuclear waste today could become tomorrows petrol/gasoline anology.

[@jeffgaufin2606]

I just learned so much

[@NeoFromMatrix123-b1v]

It would be great if Canada could export LNG well, via pipelines, rail, and/or cargo ships.

[@davidallen2058]

Cool stores can use "cold energy" directly.

[@carlosdominguez3108]

"Smoke stack in Saudi Arabia." I don't know why I found that funny but I did

[@sailorbob74133]

I wonder if the new carbon neutral NG power plant design that Exxon Mobil is proposing uses this cryogenic carbon capture idea.

[@pingnick]

Wow argon etc in Japan! Very impressive yeah LNG seems likely to be prevalent into 2030s so worth investing even if payback not immediate

[@azertyQ]

... Just don't look into what would happen if one of those tankers had an "accident" ...

[@nobodynever7884]

You could also cool down some over clocked crypto mining.

[@chrisnuk]

"You do you" 😂

[@EyesOfByes]

Airconditioning

[@andymouse]

Fascinating !

[@coincrazy3563]

so we put all the GPUs next to the LNG and boom goes the cooling cost

[@briandavis577]

The “cold energy” from LNG gasification can be used to separate oxygen from the air and then used in the Allam Cycle to generate electricity. Then nearly all the CO2 can be captured and increase the efficiencies of all processes involved. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allam_power_cycle?wprov=sfti1#Description

[@Rkcuddles]

Huh. I always thought we did it with changing the pressure instead of directly heating it

[@onlypranav]

Depressurising and evaporation takes energy away, so the lng would get even colder. Like eptying a spray can makes the can cold.

[@Rkcuddles]

@ remove the coolant and add pressure?

[@williamhoodtn]

Very interesting ideas!

[@Ch3ckman]

Best one yet

[@nomadhgnis9425]

So what about guyana's new lng project.

[@JeffBilkins]

Icecream and icecube factory. But more serious the datacenter cooling seems like a good idea.

[@emptyshirt]

Data centers are actually a pretty poor use case. Water evaporative cooling gets you into a good enough temperature range at a much larger scale. Water has a latent heat of vaporization of 2258 J/kg compared to natural gas's 507 J/kg.

[@energyideas]

Goes boom.

[@navsenjoy]

Sailing LNG carriers must be using this cold energy to move by running thier engine turbines... If not, why..?

[@bloofle674]

What do you do with the liquid CO2 after you capture it?

[@patrickderp1044]

it is a useful solvent! you can extract all the really pungeunt essences from plant matter using liquid co2

[@OpreanMircea]

This video was very cool!

[@Briand-ei1gs]

Why the hell would ypu use joules. Unless your trying to obfiscate . Use a an energy metric that is actually uses in financial markets so people can no the monetary figures.

[@andrewkruchoski7757]

throw some sterling engines of the cold pipes eh?

[@michaeljf6472]

Gotta love the "transitional fuel" already building up infrastructure for the next 50 years

[@onlypranav]

That's how long the "transition" would take if not longer

[@edumacation7567]

New mic?

[@st3v4nt]

Hoping that Indonesia as one of the biggest LNG exporter to Japan do explore this but only see Japan, Thailand and China do it.

[@kid_missive]

Natural gas is not a low carbon alternative. Bit of an oversight for you, I must say.

[@Longlius]

It's much lower carbon than coal and diesel

[@aryaman05]

Hydrogen content, hence overall energy density is way higher than gasoline, diesel, furnace oil or coal. It Is low carbon alternative, of the so-called fossil kind.

[@matthiasknutzen6061]

Hate the term "cold energy"

[@NintroTV]

LNG cold energy could be a practical solution for scaling liquid oxygen production, as discussed in Gassin' Up Starship (kzbin.info/www/bejne/o6jChpSmh6iKbtk). Based on calculations, the global recoverable LNG cold energy (320 PJ) could support up to 70,000 Starship launches. Leveraging this underutilized resource could address the energy demands for cryogenic propellant production while improving efficiency.

[@jsimsgt96]

No! You do YOU! lol

[@Briand-ei1gs]

300 thousand petajoules? Isn't a petajouls 277 gigawatthours? So we are talking around 75000 terawatrhours!? Haha something wrong.

[@luipaardprint]

That’s quite the pivot, starting to make oxygen not included tutorials?

[@RafaelHabegger]

Cool Cool Cool

[@CocolinoFan]

"Opportunity"?!

[@GroovyVideo2]

Good on Japan

[@tk421dr]

lng is is cuddlelesss. awww