August's SPICY TAKE: Role Select was NOT a Good Idea/Why ROLE SELECT & AUTOFILL Arent Going Anywhere

[@keromora]

I remember trying to learn the game through blind pick. Half the time I’d call a role and someone would go that role anyway. The moment I unlocked draft I never looked back.

[@clarence3238]

Yea, blind was a nightmare. Way more griefers

[@huntersuper98]

Yea but we're talking about ranked League here. A mode where at least most of the time people are trying to win. Blind pick doesn't work like pick order either. Blind pick people just pick at the same time, pick order draft was one at a time people picked in descending order.

[@rufogallardo7168]

@@huntersuper98 this is old Lol, ranked you didnt have roles, so still had to call it and pick order decided the roles

[@huntersuper98]

@@rufogallardo7168 Yes I know that. Thank you. That changes my comment not at all lol.

[@charlybessette9818]

People that dont like autofill didnt know that before you had a call it first in the chat and even then, if you were last pick, you were last pick

[@rufogallardo7168]

last pick was sup

[@runeserpent1449]

i remember playing ranked with my scuffed laptop and always getting stuck with jungle because i always joined the match after everyone else called their roles and now im a jungle main

[@ShadowRaZeV1]

Yup ahaha. Bad net, or bad pc... or both. Both of those made you join late and that's one main reason that pick order can cause tons of problems in locations with less access to good internet or hardware.

[@inbeing3464]

why not implement what dota did?create a system where players are rewarded for playing unpopular roles which allow them to play more popular roles at a faster queue time. it would basically be autofill but you actually have control over when you get filled.

[@OG_ALviK]

Probably because it's overwhelming the amount of players who will only play top mid adc and maybe supp while never touching jungle. No wonder i never get filled and my queue times are on average 50 sec in em - dia elo.

[@dtstar331]

My personal grievance with autofill is that it's rarely equal, i.e. it doesn't try hard enough to keep autofills on a role for both teams, which almost always leads to the autofilled player having a bad time and possibly costing their team the game. If one side has an autofilled jungler, the other team should, too; no exception. If one side has a filled teammate and the other does not, guess which team is more likely to win the match

[@kinggrantking]

I mean that's just not true; their matchmaking system highly prioritizes having equal numbers and even positions of auto filled players. It does happen at times that those standards aren't met, but at the same time you are explicitly expected to be able to play every role. If you being autofilled support is so heinously atrocious that you lose every time the enemy support isn't autofilled, you need to practice support more.

[@dtstar331]

@@kinggrantking 1) support gap is nowhere near as impactful as a jungle gap 2) if I'm expected to play well in every role, how about Riot actually makes a competent tutorial for each role instead of relying on community-made resources while printing endless amount of skins and *maybe* something more once a year. It's a joke that they're worth millions of dollars and can't put together a team that would make the game actually approachable

[@kinggrantking]

@@dtstar331 1. Which is why August (and other rioters) have explicitly said before that they try their best to ensure there are as few main vs autofill junglers as possible. I don't know where the idea that they don't care comes from. 2. Your opponents also don't have access to a tutorial, so while I agree the new player experience sucks it is at least completely consistent between players and thus not the reason one player is better than another. The opposing support also did not get a 12 disc instructional dvd set from Riot when they made their account.

[@Xyltin]

Which is a problem of the autofilled person sucking in the filled role, not the problem of the system directly. I have no problem getting filled because I know I can play most roles well enough for my elo. It is pretty much what he said, role selection is so good in giving you your main role that people stopped playing other roles frequently enough, when it is just a normal part of the game.

[@x2lazy2die]

there is very likely a form of weighting autofill does. e.g. autofilled on non primary role = -x mmr. so if ur team has an autofill and enemy does not it probably means that their overall mmr is lower

[@NoFatVampires]

If there is no autofill it will cause AN INFINATE BACKLOG in anything above like platinum. There is not enough junglers to make the games. So you would literally have days long queue times

[@darealrulezbreaker9493]

Yeah but if i get autofilled jungle, i HAVE to dodge. its not a choice i can make, me in jungle would just mean 100% grief and 100% certain autolose cause i cant jungle for shit. So the result is: same people are back in the queue just like if i couldn't be autofilled to jungle and the queue times are a bit longer. Edit: It would maybe be a different story if as soon as i get autofilled to jungle, I get put in bronze games instead of my normal rank lol.

[@homyachock]

@@darealrulezbreaker9493 terrible idea. I'll tell you more - Riot already did this once, when each role had own elo, and it went terrible, cause SURPRISE, challenger player on another role is still challenger player with his knowledges, reaction and he has the same hands, so autofill players were just smurfing on noobs. And even more, it still didn't fix queue time, cause if you autofill sup to lower rank, there's still no sup in higher rank. So yeah, your idea is just one of the biggest Riot failure.

[@darealrulezbreaker9493]

@@homyachock i mean yeah i completely agree with you, it is not doable in practice simply because not everybody is as shit in his autofill role as i am in jungle.. so if the same system puts someone 2 ranks lower that does not have as big as a skill disparity in the roles as i do it obviously gonna be a disaster. That wasnt a serious suggestion on my part anyway but good point.

[@homyachock]

@@darealrulezbreaker9493 just play some jg games in normal. Jg is easy now, it's not old days when you could die from camps if you don't kite. Plus jungle is counterpick-proof, so you can pick 1 champion and stick to him.

[@vrmax1919]

would rather wait 20 min for a game thats fucking fair than waste 30-40 min with either me being autofilled or a team mate being autofilled making the LUCK based game even more LUCK BASED

[@hulyefasz7043]

i like the way dota has it. you basically autofill, (select all roles) and every autofill game you get a +4 tokens, then you can choose not to autofill and select the role you want but it consumes 1 token. so from 1 'autofill' game (when you select all roles) you get 4 tokens to play 4 games with your preferred role.

[@edde2429]

Even better, only wins give you 4 tokens and losses give you just 2

[@corw22]

I feel like I don't have a word in this debate because it doesn't really ever affect me. I main jg/supp

[@OG_ALviK]

Same here. Though It's funny people bitch about everything like this while needing to be handled like toddlers in game while they insult you to the core. Indeed funny.

[@memeJoestar]

im with August Here, played League since 2012ish and was way more fun and Had way more Stories without role select

[@paradajzisnicla]

I liked the times when every player was expected to know every role at a decent level more

[@Mirro18]

i don't know if that would be a thing if I am honest, but i at least FELT like playing was smoother because everybody had at least a baseline understanding about what everyone else was doing. Not so much "WTF why you not helping?!" "My dude, there is literally nothing i can do"

[@nathanielmohr9622]

"Mid or feed"

[@paradajzisnicla]

@@nathanielmohr9622 This is true there were trolls. But is there much difference between someone saying "Mid or feed" and a mid laner getting autofilled and feeding under the new system?

[@zachearyvang1189]

@@paradajzisnicla with autofill, you can make up the difference in skill and try for a win. "Mid or feed" was basically a guaranteed loss with someone sprinting it down. Autofill also doesn't fester more toxicity in the community the same way "mid or feed" did. What's the difference between an autofill feeding and a main role feeding?

[@BrianMcKee]

@@zachearyvang1189 I don't remember being trolled by these people very often. Most people had secondary roles that they'd prefer. Don't get me wrong, trolling did happen, but I get more screwed by autofills today than I ever did by "mid or feed" people.

[@intifadayuri]

as a League player you should ideally be able to play all 5 roles on a decent level. Laning is a fundamental you can carry accross 4 roles and they´ve made jungling easier than ever.

[@Ranorimonus]

I agree, role select was amazing when it came out but nowadays as people really stopped playing more than one role. The overall level of understanding of the game decreased massively with it. I'm on that would love to have the old queue system back.

[@Monstufpud]

I would rather not play, then get into a match quickly for a role I don't want to play

[@mpfree325]

Then dodge.

[@ISesseriI]

Then that is what will happen lol. You will get 20 minute queues in gold mmr because no one wants to queue for support or jungle. I was there for pre autofill league of legends, when it was just role select, it took a minimum of 8 minutes just to get into a draft pick normal game. It turns out when you don't play 6 hours of video games every day you might prefer to get into a match faster and sometimes play a role you don't want, over only playing one match because the queue took up half of your free time

[@santir2396]

@@mpfree325 They nerfed dodging, they also added anonymous lobbies (becouse why would you get the option to dodge the guy running it down, or the autofill jungler locking his 30% winrate graves). Riot has constantly removed autonomy from the players and the choices you can make as an individual to decide if you want to play a match or not. Dodging is just either a hunch choice or something you use if someone is hostaging or dodge baiting instead of being a tool for getting good quality matches. Now you're stuck with horrible match quality in every elo besides high grandmaster/challenger, a sistem that prevents you from seeing if someone on your team is gonna be a dead weight, that also prevents you to check ping, that also prevents you from seeing who starts surrender votes or spams surrender. On top of EVERYTHING else that i just mentioned, you still get autofilled, which highly reduces your win cons.

[@loudwhispre9406]

@@santir2396 Anonymous lobbies prevent people from being targeted by stream snipers in queue, and it prevents people from looking you up, seeing that you're on a loss streak, and dodging you. That was very common before anonymous lobbies. You have clearly never played before anonymous lobbies were a thing, and it was much, much, MUCH worse before they were added. Random trolls are always gonna be a thing, but specific trolls targeting you will always be way worse, because it affects the people you queue with. You might not be getting targeted by stream snipers because you don't stream. but what about the other people in your lobby? The support might be a streamer, getting stream sniped by an inting Nunu ADC, but that means you also get the inting Nunu, just for being on the same team as the support streamer. Anonymous lobbies hide players from targeted harassment, which reduces the number of blatant trolls. There is no other angle to this that makes anonymous lobbies bad. You are coping, you are stupid, you don't know what you're talking about.

[@abjoern]

​@@santir2396 When you press accept and go to champ select, you've chosen to play the game. Once you're in champ select you're already in game. You choose whether or not you want to play before you queue up

[@JMQA1]

100% solves the problem if they make the same role autofilled on both teams every time there is a autofill.

[@jobliar937]

This would make q times super long tho and force the system to do higher elo differences to make up for it which then lowers the quality of the games

[@A7TGzed]

Nah just make jungle not autofillable

[@GlacialScion]

​@@A7TGzedThat'd be implementing a solution to a problem then removing the solution part of your implementation.

[@GlacialScion]

​@@jobliar937You would just have to increase the frequency of autofilling to make up for the change. Probably would be for the best, honestly.

[@kentuckyfriedsocks4384]

i absolutely loathe it when my jg is autofill, but enemy jg is on role and on main/onetrick

[@wor2xfs250]

Are people really complaining about autofill? I get my role like 95% of the time. Do people not remeber how awful everything was before role select and auto fill?

[@ja0062734]

Mean there's people who don't get their role 95 percent of the time it depends on timed popularity ... And there's some roles people loathe playing and will int and dodge just to not deal with it.

[@krejman]

​@@ja0062734every time you get autofilled you get protection for 2 games so it's imposible to not get chosen roles most of the time

[@Spin793]

"Do people not remeber how awful everything was before role select and auto fill?" I mean it was added eight years ago, so probably not

[@anthonyfaiell3263]

The point isn't about YOU specifically. The point is about team balance and matchmaking. . Let's say it's a diamond 1 lobby. One team gets all diamond 1 players on their main roles. Let's say the other team get's all diamond 1 players, but two of the players are auto-filled. . Now let's say you are on the team with the two auto-filled players... You did NOT get auto-filled, but two of your teammates did... and none of the enemies players are auto-filled... . That game is statistically probably an auto-loss for you. . This is where people's issues lie.

[@krejman]

@@anthonyfaiell3263 you know matchmaking tries to balance auto fills among teams right?

[@MakoShiruba]

I feel like you should take notes in how Wild Rift makes it's system, where instead of picking two roles, you order them in how you want them to find a match. For example, I don't like Support and my Mid champion pool is filled with Battle Mages and Magic Vanguards, so I rather not subject my team to my inting because I play weak and off meta champions. I am also kind of not in the mood to Play ADC without a Support Duo. So I Queue Jungle and Top, putting them either one in first or second. Then, the game launches and I'm at least 70% of the time just in the first three roles and I know WHEN I'm AutoFilled when I land on Mid or Support. If I do reaaaally good on AutoFill or the game finishes, next game I am not AutoFill and I'm 100% confirmed to have my first picked role. If I do remarkably well on that role, I get one more chance at it. After that, I'm back to the roullette. I feel THIS SYSTEM is the best one, since I am not at the mercy of getting autofilled every game and, if I perform, I can get another chance to keep climbing and playing my prefered roles.

[@innerbeast415]

9:20 - this point 100%. The idea that you can be a high mmr player without knowing how to play all 5 roles is incredibly dumb. Players should be expected to learn the GAME of league, not just the game from their preferred starting location.

[@blueKoniro]

this is just an opinion. Nowdays it CAN be like that, so saying it should be X or y way is just a way of thinking

[@Flossylearner1]

5:09 auto fill is also making players play roles they don’t want but at least the new method you’re explaining the player would have a choice. Autofill gives you no choice and forces you without any lp bonus,skin etc

[@emresarkaya1845]

brother can we get a full screen PLZ

[@HeWhoQuacksss]

Can't unfortunately, in order to get content out every day i need to format it for both longform and shortform content. But who know's, maybe one day i'll give it a go if I manage to get enough time :)

[@subek1205]

​​@@HeWhoQuacksss perfect the way it is if it helps w daily content, preciate what you do, keep it up :)

[@HeWhoQuacksss]

@@subek1205 Ty Ty, I appreciate ya!

[@TDeane]

@@HeWhoQuacksss This format is great, love the videos man

[@96Logan]

​@@HeWhoQuacksss Just sharing a voice of reason in this clusterfuck of a game is admirable. Thank you for making Riot August's content digestible.

[@kinggrantking]

Rules are rules, and one of the rules of solo queue is that you must be capable of playing every role, and sometimes the difference between you getting your desired rank vs not is whether you can be a better autofilled jg than your autofill jg opponent. No one at any point ever promised that you could play adc every game or play Jinx every game or whatever. Morons in comment section have absolutely zero zero zero basis for thinking that they are in any way entitled to not play certain roles. You DO have to. It's explicitly part of the game. I don't know how this is at all complicated.

[@GrammeStudio]

role queue is a privilege not a right. a diamond on his main role is lower on his off-role. that's just a fact. and it SHOULD show on the rank ladder when someone is able to play multiple roles vs someone who can't. autofill expresses that. someone who cant autofill will be behind on the rank ladder. without role queue, the difference between the 2 shows up more, on the rank ladder. the more roles a player is tested on, the closer we are to finding out his TRUE rank. the only solution that does not lengthen queue time, is to abolish role queue. if everyone is autofilled no one 'is'. it also alleviates conflict in shotcalls due to different knowledge of a given role. like when people disagree with jungler over which objective to prioritize...or disagree which player a support should pivot towards helping more, etc. the problem stated with pick order can easily be solved by having riot assign the roles randomly the moment players enter champ select

[@RobotboyX2]

Feel like role based rank had a future, but the community ruined it within weeks.

[@skilledroy376]

God awful take

[@OG_ALviK]

​@@GrammeStudioit doesn't alleviate shot calls at all. Like before and like now people that aren't the jungler view the game from their selfish perspective of which move will benefit me the most at any given moment. While junglers don't. Plus people have no context about any other enemy player other than their laner and maybe the enemy jungler. While the jungler has about most of them in a good rounded way. That's why you never make calls when jung is around. If hes dead or on the opposite side of the map or absorbing pressure away from obj, then maybe. Else just don't.

[@sadiablo93]

@@RobotboyX2 So what happened when they tried? I did not know role based rank was actually ever a thing.

[@GryphonBlazier]

I am also an old player, and I miss my ability to say "Support > Mid > ADC, just don't make me jungle" and actively make my team better on average by being 'the support main' that wasn't guaranteed by the system. It felt like my flexibility was an asset, like my ability to manage expectations and make as many other players happy with role assignment as possible led to tangible rewards and better games. It felt like starting each lobby with a conversation helped us as a team to build rapport and feel good about our chances (or to feel bad and be toxic or queue dodge, which is its own cost). When you are basically forced to start the conversation of who takes which role, it naturally flows into conversation of which champs synergize, and led to conversations like "Oh, we both want mid, but you want to go orianna mid. If I know we have an orianna then I'm happy to go malphite top and we can wombo combo". It also meant the few times where I wasn't able to get a role I liked, where I was forced to jungle, people explicitly knew that and were more understanding. "I never jungle, I'll do my best" "Yeah man its good, since we're doing the ori malphite thing you can just go fiddle and ult in that pile for easy wins. Don't even worry about ganking pre 6 we'll hold our own"

[@someguy1ification]

Note that, in WoW pve, the roles are not used in equal numbers. In dungeons, it's one tank, one healer, and 3 dps. Dps are needed in triple the numbers of other roles, and they're still the role that gets kept waiting. In raids, it's even more extreme. A raid finder group has... It's been a while, I think it's two tanks, five healers, and *eighteen* dps. Dps are used a little over three times as much as healers, similar to dungeons, but outnumber tanks *nine to one* And dps is still the role with too many to field them all. I can't speak for the ratios in ff14, I haven't played it, but I expect there is a similar phenomenon. Whereas League has equal numbers of every role, so it doesn't get to soak those extra players on the more popular one.

[@anthonyfaiell3263]

Eh yes, and no. I kinda do actually see your point. . But I would make the argument that ADC, Mid, and Top are "dps roles" Support is "healer" and jungle is "tank." Or at least it's treated similarly, with league players avoiding support and jungle like the plague.

[@96Logan]

​@@anthonyfaiell3263 I think your explanation works very well actually. Everyone knows that jung and support are the least mained roles so it works out the same way. It doesn't matter that the class or champ archetype aren't matching up 1 to 1. You still have 3 desired options and 2 undesirable ones.

[@OG_ALviK]

​@@anthonyfaiell3263that depends on the meta. Some time ago support rhole was the DPS while mid was supporting. Toplane usually is tank except this season where most were adc. In jungle you can find anything really.

[@anthonyfaiell3263]

@@96Logan Exactly! Thanks for summing it up nicely lol

[@96Logan]

@@anthonyfaiell3263 Got u fam. I'm a support main. It's what we do ❤️

[@7h3fir3sid3]

I've seen a single digit amount of "mid or feeds" since role select was invented. Before role select that happened like every fourth game

[@anthonyfaiell3263]

25%? I feel like it was closer to 100%. But maybe I'm misremembering things.

[@markopusic8258]

It's not that role select was a bad idea, it was a different idea. It allowed people to specialize in what they wanted to play at the expense of their flexibility. I don't believe either is actually better but I know that I prefer League with role select because I'm a specialized player, I'm fundamentally a support whenever the role exists within a game so I'd rather queue support and get into a game where I can do that without any complaints rather than force it on a role where it's not as optimal, or worse, force me to play something I don't want and don't care to play, so basically keep me as far away as possible from the hell hole that is toplane.

[@anthonyfaiell3263]

Oriana or Karma mid Ivern jungle (or any tank really) Karma top (or literally any tank is a good support for the team) Ashe ADC Support . You learn to adapt my friend. There are support style champs for every role.

[@saku7143]

no role select: general toxicity/trolling at champ select but everyone had a higher over skill floor in every role role select: players get their main role more often which should be more fun but now teams with autofill's literally have a player(s) who will be little to no help drastically dropping their odds of winning in a competitive game. Sucking especially in roles with higher impact that game. (supp/jungle early game or adc late game) no one is saying there are no downsides to removing autofill. it's just dumb as hell that there feels like there are solutions to the issues that come with auto fill that dont get used. mirrored auto-fills, lp/mmr loss reduction(most likely based on performance to minimize throwing), GOING BACK TO NO ROLE SELLECT, not giving one sided auto-fill teams (especially teams with auto-fill top) blue side, disabling auto-fill in elos where que times are shorter, etc, etc. At this point its quality over quantity. We'd rather have more fair games but less games overall than more shittier games but more games overall.

[@Blueberry_Koi]

the problem w this is that there is no going back now especially considering champions are so heavily tied to a single role due to their kit. unlike dota2 which arguably if you can endure a terrible laning phase any hero can be a support because there is more active items and the maps are more complicated so they dont have role select for norms (but even they need it for ranked), league just cant function that way, blind pick is chaos

[@Gomace]

We should just be able to queue up with which 5 roles we want to play in order.

[@OG_ALviK]

Like in wild rift?

[@Gomace]

@@OG_ALviK If that's a feature in WIld Rift, then I'm staring to think Wild Rift is on to something more than just early visual updates😂

[@KyoHoliday]

@@Gomace wild rift has done an extremely large amount of beneficial changes that PC rift can sadly only dream of

[@doodlebob9889]

I just wanna thank august for talking to the community the way he does, has honestly given me a whole new appreciation for the dev side of league!

[@KD-_-]

As a season 1 player I agree. Expectation of skill was higher when you couldnt play one role.

[@mightymcphee]

im a season 3 player and while i agree that exectation of being able to multi role to some degree was better i also see how much harder the game has become since back then. i remember hitting diamond elo whilst having fun and still not knowing what half the items do, now its a grind to get out of emerald every split not being able to chill in ranked games like i use to, so i think its better that we allow people to focus more on one role than rolling the dice every game now that the stakes have risen

[@OG_ALviK]

Actually i remember very well that there wasn't much to any complaint between team mates when someone wasn't on their main rhole. Usually it was just the autofilled who was complaining a lot, but also manu times 4 of 5 people weren't on their favorite rhole and "Main rhole" wasn't much of a thing back then (s3-5).

[@lexiette8343]

A system where you can choose the order in which you enjoy roles the most like instead of just primary and secondary youd have all 5 ordered

[@bastenthegreyhound7206]

Kinda wish they would expand on autofill and role select a LOT more than it is currently 1. Allow for 3 roles to be selected instead of 2 roles 2. Add clarity by adding a visual slider that shows which distribution of autofill you are at (For those who don't understand. Think of auto fill as a slider of -2, -1, 0 , +1, +2 and if you get on your selected role, you go closer to -2 and if you pick a riot requested role or self fill you get closer to +2. the closer to -2 you are, the more likely you are to be autofilled, and then garenteed at -2 and the closer you are to +2 the closer you get to being Autofill protected, until at near absolute protection at +2. This is explained in more detail in a blog post riot posted when role select and auto fill came out. Too lazy to link it, maybe I'll do it later) 3. add a speed test to test for internet speed strength and internet speed consistency to weed out players (Like me and my friends) who have unstable internet (Jumps around from 40 to 4000) or weak internet strength (steady 130 connection :: More than a .3 second delay from input to action) 4. when autofilled, make sure the autofilled player is at the BOTTOM of the team select screen. This might sound odd, but the players who know they role they are on should be the ones who decide the meta in the match. Someone who is autofilled jungle should not be able to dictate the teams playstyle. however, someone who is autofilled should be able to follow up and support the play style of whatever the on role players lock in. 5. champion selection guidance for those who are auto-filled or volunteer filled/riot requested role. instead of being shown all 30+ characters you own, of the champions you own, and algorithm will show you 3 choices based on the the champions your teammates have picked. This allows for less failure in picking champions who work together, but also removes one element of a possible game loss from any auto filled players hands. I mean seriously, it's hard enough as is to deal with the mental anguish of knowing you're going to lose the game for your team on support. It would just make it worse to be on a support with ZERO synergy with the ADC. These are just wishes tho... If only I could work at riot. I wouldn't be pitching my ideas in a youtube video comment section XD Wait.. If I can spend all this time typing it out here... I could just type out an application form...huh

[@JacobGiocondo-gv2uf]

I dont mind autofill, but when riot autofills me when im on a 3 loss streak, and the enemy autofill is on an 7 game winstreak, i get kinda pissed.

[@alexithymia6288]

The unfortunate truth is that role select and autofill are completely different in terms of manageability depending on what your main role is, at least in general, and we do see a little more variance nowadays. Top and jungle can easily flex with each other, mid mages can go bot or support or even jungle sometimes, mid assassins can jungle (if not on the main champ, on another assassin built more for jungle), ADCs are kind of SOL aside from like Kindred jungle and the occasional time we find a marksman who makes an OP mid flex pick (which Riot really doesn't seem to like), then supports are all over the place since there's such a massive variety in which champs can effectively support. I'd guess the goal nowadays is find 2-3 champs in your main role that you're really good at, then 1-3 for the off-role and another 1-2 as flex picks in case you do get hard autofilled instead of just secondary role.

[@acidicpuddle2]

Am jungler and have never autofilled.

[@HookahOtaku]

because jungling sucks ass, and everyone blames you for everything going wrong in the match, and nobody gives you props when merit is granted. this is why jungling is the least popular role and why youll never have to autofill.

[@OG_ALviK]

Same here. And often (1 every 30 games or so) times i get filled in my ex main rholes (mid and unfortunately top)

[@MIIC2]

Role select is the best thing ever. When I started playing I was always bullied to be support. Now I get to play mid and I enjoy it

[@Slapsamillion]

Yall need to get this guy to stream on YT.

[@briancomforti3890]

Waiting for the first pie graph themed champ

[@car-keys]

So just let the adc queue get large? The people playing the other roles will get in games. Just communicate the players place in the queue. If players see that their estimated time to get in a game is exceedingly large, they'll just play another role.

[@100brokensticks]

Alright, hear me out: you have assigned roles, but everyone is autofilled and you just get randomly forced into a role every game lol

[@LaurenceWilliamson]

It would work for players like me but most new players would take so long to become proficient it might be quite rough for them. Also pro players wouldn't get much practice in solo queue that way.

[@mcharblebarf4964]

Wouldn't a role being unpopular in the first place be the core issue

[@krejman]

You can't just revamp the role system, backlash would be huge so Riot is stuck with 2 roles that are inherently toxic to play with

[@MakoShiruba]

There is always going to be a role that players would play less. Sometimes is not even the role being weak, sometimes is just how players play and how the climb, what rank they are and more. Not to mention, public perception of the role.

[@QuestionableQs]

⁠is impossible for every role to have an equal amount of players. There will always be an unpopular role as long as humans have the free will to choose

[@pieman2025]

no game in history made the Sup role a desirable thing to play (closest was Overwatch, but tanks suffered) no matter the game Sup/ Tanks are typically always the lowest population in a game's player base. Most people want to be the main character and DPS typically allows you to live that fantasy because you get immediate feedback of dmg dealt and kills which directly contributes to winning the game in 90% of cases. indirect ways of impact on games will inherently lower the population of people that want to play sup because you unironically have to be smarter to understand your impact on a match via healing or repositioning or tanking all things that can help contribute to winning but typically killing the enemy is universally accepted as contribution that wins the game. another thing is that good sups rarely feel that they are impactful but Dps will feel the impact that sups provide more than sups lmao. so all these reasons is why this issue will almost never change with very few and rare exceptions, because JG should technically be the most popular role but its too high maintenance and toxic.

[@homyachock]

Anyone who disagree with August here is delusional and wouldn't like their own ideas if they'd actually try it for few months. And I say it as the one who often disagree with Riot, but he is 100% right here. The only thing they should make is to let players choose all 5 roles priority (like widrift) so for example if sup and jg are needed, I would be autofilled as a jg cause I put jg 3 place and sup 4 place.

[@crxstalstar5488]

i q mid/adc and for a while i was getting adc so often that i ended up just learning yasuo bot and climbed really quickly cuz people werent used to it.

[@silbergreen649]

i would like the option to say "i can fill but therefore my team has less autofills"

[@hoveringgoat8061]

This doesn't make sense to me at all. Want to play popular role? Get long queue times. Simple. Want short queue times? Play less popular roles.

[@ImSnowl_]

So to summary the first 5min : Autofill exist cuz otherwise people stack up, we could give cool stuff to make people want to play the other roles, but they would end up playing something they don't want to play People don't want to be autofilled either it's the same result minus cool stuff, just give cool shit instead of giving LP loss for free

[@jeffkoenig7402]

Exception: Sup mains should be able to opt out of autofill JG. I've queued X/Support every single time since the system went into place, for thousands of games over the years. I like sup. I usually get sup. Very rarely, there's another sup in the que and I get the X (adc or top). Very, VERY rarely I get autofilled - but when I do, it's *always* jungle, the one role I don't (and can't) play at least reasonably well. I've *more* than done my part to keep the match making moving, I shouldn't ever have to screw my team by getting jungle lol

[@hansjurgen4567]

As someone that plays mostly normal games, i LOVE to play full fill, as when i think about what i want to play i cant make a decision, and even what champion i want to play i only know seeing the diffent picks already shown and with the clock ticking odnw. But the big issue is, full fill is not actually fill. Its jungle 60% of the time and support 15%(I do enjoy support). So i hope one day you can queue fill primary, and excluded role secondary.

[@sf_macedo]

As a jungle main, I've never been autofilled and therefore autofill isn't real.

[@CloudEck-i9e]

Idk why we have role select tbh. I was welcome to it initially but there's a certain charm of having a diverse skillset. I feel like the understanding of the game was better before it

[@sevincit]

So he's saying if you let people chose longer queue times they will all take it. So he admits people want it, but they refuse to give it to them. Wild.

[@sonmond3]

Why not just make opting out of autofill reduce the lp you gain and simultaneously reward people purposely queuing in as auto fill with the same difference? Make it so the players are rewarded for their mastery over all roles and players that want to enjoy the comfort of one role get that option even at a reduced lp gain? Normals can be the same though, no one cares if they get autofilled there. There's no loss with dodging those.

[@kylelacey1212]

Honestly I think the problem is less autofill and more that the games meta has been reinforced time and time again by Riot and is rarely allowed to organically move and develop outside of extremely niche scenarios, to where if you get a game without a jungler or without a support, you can't make that work because the game disallows these strategies. It's very stringent on how flexible you can be where as back in the day it wasn't like this. You picked your champ and selected lanes basically after you got into a match and you played the game. You could even jungle without smite. So with a strictly enforced meta, you have to make sacrifices and that means if you want to get into a game in any reasonable amount of time, the enforced positions have to be present, and you may end up having to play one of them.

[@MEnUequals2]

honestly they should make me pick 2 roles I DONT WANNA play and be done with. thats 3 roles then I can play

[@karlosliskovic]

back then there were barely main roles. it improoved league by alot.

[@rufogallardo7168]

role pick made the game substancially more fun, for everyone

[@TheSorrowfulAngel]

Id still really like some improvements to role selection. I understand that you cannot give people an option to never get a role, even if auto-filled. That just defeats the purpose of auto-fill. But the system would definitely improve in a number of ways if you could select any number of roles, not just 2 or 5. For example: I play all roles decently well, but my worst ones are mid and support. Why cant I Q top+jungle+ADC then? At least I can, voluntarily, fill more roles like this. Another big issue with role selection, in my opinion, is how the concept of primary and secondary roles feels absolutely meaningless. I Q top primary and jungle secondary? Ill get jungle like 80% of the time. I Q jungle primary and top secondary? 95%+ of the time, I'll jungle. This system heavily disincentivizes putting unpopular roles as your secondary. If I mainly want to play top and some jungle... Well, I cant do that. I need to go something like top+mid if I wanna primarily play top - despite mid being a bad role of mine. If this whole system would just be a little bit more sophisticated, the result would be more people voluntarily picking unpopular roles, at least as their secondary. People would also pick fill more often if fill wouldnt be jungle or support 90% of the time, but actually a varied experience, which is what players that pick "fill" want. This isnt a solve to autofill or anything, but it would improve the experience of many players and would also at least help reducing the amount of times people are auto-filled.

[@Rogmash]

hello before i watch the video i tell what comes into my mind first - u took it to far with ranks - u took it to far with certain champs - thats why the Q takes so long in high ranks aswell - autofill is complete trash - not every champ should be allowed to play any position ... just make it champ specific selection - ez balance - u took it to far u wanted everything now thats what u get ^^

[@einjharrelraca]

I find it funny that augest uses ff14 and wow as examples for long que times for popular roles. You know what square enix and blizzard did to fix this issue, and reduce que times for dps to be generally under 3-7 minutes in ff14, and under 8 in wow? THEY MADE EVERY ROLE FEEL GOOD TO PLAY NOT JUST THE DPS, and didnt just fucking abandon 2 of their roles and say "eh auto fill will fix it for us" like riot did. Riot refuses to fix the problems of "why does no one want to play adc or jungle right now"? and instead just said "Fuck those roles, lets just force up to 4 schmucks to suck it up and be the meg for the team."

[@einjharrelraca]

@@Aryzo I dont personally find the themes to be lacking too hard. although supermodel with a gun is pretty overdone so far i admit. ADC i think the issue stems down to their gameplay feels genuinly awful. I compare to feeling like you are playing commander in Magic the gathering against 3 mono blue control decks. You do nothing but ask for permission to do anything all game.

[@existentiallamp]

every role in league does feel good to play though. you just dont want to play all of the roles in league

[@einjharrelraca]

@@existentiallamp thats a blatant lie. XD we have an entire role who has been screaming their role feels like dogshit since season 8, and the entire playebase just tells them to shut up. Its the role thats been on the auto fill list with jungle since season 8.

[@lonemichi5289]

@@existentiallampyou seem to be able to enjoy watching paint dry. Unfortunately for the rest of us we’re not simpletons. 👍

[@lonemichi5289]

MMO’s are in general a terrible comparison as it’s far from the majority that actually queue for PvE (especially past the first month). You’ll know this if you ever go on FF14 and travel to Limsa. That’s not even mentioning the server issues when new expansions are released

[@mondomola]

Fun fact: if you pick mid as secondary you are never going to play mid, you go straight to jng/supp

[@OG_ALviK]

Me picking always jung main and mid second; truuuu

[@arfner]

It depends. The following numbers are approximations, and are meant to give an idea of how often these scenarios occur. If you go top/mid you will get top 75% of the time, mid 25% of the time. Mid/top 50/50. Jungle/mid 100/0. Mid/jungle can't say, I hate jungle, but I'd imagine you get jungle a lot. ADC/mid 95/5. Mid/ADC 50/50. Support/mid 99/1. Mid/support 50/50....maybe even closer to 25/75.

[@OG_ALviK]

@@arfner Can confirm. I pick jungle primary and almost never get the secondary rhole (mid) Nor i get ever fill in supp/top/adc.

[@arfner]

@@OG_ALviK Would you say it's more like a 99%/1% situation, then? I have a friend who jungles a lot, and when he goes jungle/mid I've literally never seen him get mid. Based on your comment, it sounds like you do get mid occasionally. Is that accurate?

[@OG_ALviK]

@arfner yes. but VERY rarely... Like if i check my last split stats i have around 40 games with top/mid/supp picks out of 200 games in total. But i also sometimes just dont want/feel like going jungle so i pick for supp/mid or top/mid. And sometimes when i pick jung/mid i get actually mid. So yeah. 99% could be a curate. I had many streaks with even 30-50 games in row only jungle. Also occasionally i join lobby and ask if anybody mains jung and swap with them when i feel like it. But yeah. If you enjoy jungle and don't get bothered by the insane toxicity (that i rarely find), jungle might be the best rhole to play.

[@noname1247]

Pick order queue actually gives a reason to first pick lol

[@JB-su6cu]

So why on earth does the UI not tell you which roles are currently least popular

[@thomasstumpf294]

it does. the "priority roles" are the 2 roles currently the least ppl are queuing for. (when you select your main/secondary roles, you see the priority roles being marked, i'm sure you recognized it already, at least subconciously)

[@arfner]

"The problem is that if you can opt out, then everyone opts out" so, use your own incentive ideas to get people to opt in. Give them a chest once per day or every few hours or something, give them some key fragments, or like 10 RP. There are ways around this and everyone could be happy.

[@Hitokirifelix]

to this day i just play ranked queues on support/fill cause i was raised on old ranked and just playing what i got

[@kosnickn]

in overwatch before double tank removal and other things i remember in gm queue in a really dead meta on a weekday at 3 am at one of overwatches worst player counts I queued for dps and didnt get into a game after 214 minutes of queueing and the servers werent down LOL

[@cielteal]

August finally has a good take.

[@janthran]

just need to give us HUGE rewards for choosing fill primary

[@andrepettersen9389]

Just make it an option that you can tick, i would rather wait 10 min to get one of my two roles than to get some random role i dont want. You might think that it would make the whole system suffer, but id say that more people would end up maining support if they dont want long wait times and dont want to autofill. Also if i get autofilled i 100% of the time dont try to actually win, i just pick some champ that seems fun. For example choose a top champ as support and then just try to have fun with it, most times it doesnt work and we lose, and you might blame me for it, but i play a game to have fun, not to be tortured to play something i dont want to play for 30 minutes.

[@Totally_not_Kelkel]

But are you having fun waiting 10 min in que time?

[@andrepettersen9389]

@Totally_not_Kelkel its not like im staring at the queue while waiting, i can just watch youtube while waiting for the game to find a match

[@Dan_Herl]

COLDEST TAKE OF 2024

[@bpruett1225]

If league went back to the old pick style I'd just not play league again that shit was dumb.

[@Corode713]

I know idc about timers if everyone is where they are supposed to be. Another reason why gamers are unhappy with auto fill. Ruins game integrity imo. Not to mention dodging these games is looked down on. And punished. Oof.

[@anthonyfaiell3263]

I don't care if I have to wait longer, as long as it improves the game quality. The entire goal of ranked should NOT be "create an environment where players can spam games back to back with little downtime." It SHOULD be "create games that are as balanced as possible." . The whole idea of ranked solo queue is using a team based system to facilitate personal progression. So ideally, each player should be able to say that their teammates are pretty much equal to themselves and the other teams players... and that makes it so that each and every player can essentially "be the difference." And in a perfect world, this is what climbing ranked would look like. To progress from diamond 2 to diamond 1 SHOULD require competing with and against diamond 2 players all on their main roles that they used to earn that rank in the first place... but that's rarely the case. . Most matches end up coming down to who has more autofilled players. Or which team got the player that did not belong in that elo, and was just put in that match to create a quicker queue time. These are factors that the individual solo q player has zero control over, and kind of destroy the integrity of ranked LP ratings. This is essentially what turns it into a grind, because games are oftentimes literal coinflips. . Ranked systems should absolutely do their best to create fair matches... I genuinely do not care if we have to wait longer for those fair matches to occur. I want my rank to most accurately represent my skill, not my luck. And I believe quite a few other people would agree with that.

[@bv1782]

Thats you, but what about the millions of people who have exactly 30 mins ? You have to realize majority of the people think opposite of you. And the game was a lot better back before positional que, i agree with August, I will add on top of that, back then players were not elo inflated, a diamond 1 in season 5-8 could play every role at that level now people are diamond on main role and when they get secondary they are a silver( this also is for me personally im 70% winrate mid 23% jg, if i played mid only I would be d1 and not emerald 1) Also ranking up im league is never about luck,if you are better than your rank you will always climb, people who can’t climb is because they belong right there where they are stuck. I thought the same as you in Season 5, then i created 9 different accounts and they all ended up at the same elo(plat1-d4 )with similar stats , then i realized its a me problem. I did some extensive research about meta and where to improve and once i realized what i need to do i climbed to d1 in a week. Same now, I didnt play league for 3 years, I came back and got Emerald 1 jn a week and been hard stuck for 2 months now. Its 100% the way i play. This is also how challenger players get to Master in 2 days on fresh accounts.

[@ST-in7fo]

​@@bv1782"mid of feed" and ctrl v spam made old mm so enjoyable

[@OG_ALviK]

​@@bv1782I can agree and not. I'm jung main currently former top riven otp. I've never been able to hit diamond on my main account while plenty of time hit up to d1 on smurfs or alternatives. And the same goes for most high profile players. When they start losing games on one account they just drop it and start another one from scratch to hit rank 1. It happens now like it happened in s3 when i started playing.

[@yuumijungle548]

okay but how you do explain 4 autofills on one team and 0 on the other? mathematically that doesnt make much sense if it was just for queue time, thats because it isnt and hes intentionally not talking about the real reason why autofil has to exist.

[@kingj3312]

problems not autofil. problems that one team has 2 and the other has all roles.

[@nopenever9829]

Tbh i never got autofilled ... I play adc and support ... i dont care what of these 2 i get ...

[@thomasstumpf294]

that's because if you queue for at least one of the 2 roles, that are "priority" rn, you get autofill protection. for example: im queuing jgl main and supp 2nd, in lowelo the 2 two priority roles alternate between any combination of jgl, adc & supp 95% of the time. so 99% of the time at least one of my 2 roles is priority, if not both even. and that means that im 99% of the time autofill-protected (that's example numbers, actually i cant remember ever not being autofill-protected), and for you it's probably similar, since your 2 roles are also 2 of the 3 lesser popular ones in lowelo.

[@Goblin749]

Im literally soft inting auto filled jungle while watching this. I don't mind auto fill too much just accept it as an lp tax and go next.

[@tipilot3791]

if you any rank on your main, you should be able to play all other rolls at the level of the rank below. the game isn't that different or complicated. if you're mid one trick you still see how good players play on the other rolls so you should be able to copy that to a lower degree when you offrole or else you're just a fraud that just got their rank by game volume and not improvement.

[@dukendade8260]

I cant help but feel the topics addressed in this video are issues riot needs to fix but puts the issue on the player base to solve. (without achieving any goal or fixing any issue.)

[@SebastianKhyleLBaja]

Just have an enable autofill option ffs

[@Frightning]

8:40 I actually agree with this take, I remember playing before role select was a thing, and tbh, it created an expectation among the playerbase that you need to be flexible and be able to play something in other roles and that you shouldn't assume you'll get the position you want when you queue up and it also made sure that people had to work on all 5 roles at least somewhat if they wanted consistent results. People that wanted to 1-trick back in that era where the ones most vocal about wanting role select so that could end up a role where their main champion was good, and I get why they wanted it. There was also the issue since no one was actually assigned a role, people would fight over the role they wanted (this could've been solved by the system simply assigning role in champ select).

[@Name-nq7tj]

I call bullshit I was forced to play support every game or have some loser hard run it and whine the entire fucking game.

[@marcuionut6319]

Take whatever number of support players, make that many games. The rest of the player base will get a pop-up "Today you are not allowed to play. Touch grass." and this time will reach the maximum average duration someone is willing to wait to play non autofill. Few days maybe

[@Aemulator.]

They have no reason to incentivize you to stop playing the game lmao. They’re never going to add a “log off and try again later” feature over making the matchmaking faster

[@WoodsRunner]

Jungle is usually less popular than support?

[@krejman]

How to kill a game 101

[@marcuionut6319]

@@Aemulator. But that's what people want, no autofill. I think having a 15 hour queue is worse than getting a message "come back in 15 hours " I was also mocking the guys that want no autofill no matter what

[@homyachock]

​@@WoodsRunnerjg is never less popular than support, maybe in Iron only?

[@chriswho12345]

idk about autofill, i'm a jg main

[@abjoern]

I think everone would be way better at the game with the old system since they actually get to learn what the other roles do

[@BigMuskachini]

old league was a superior game ill stand on that any day. Modern game blows so much ass its unreal

[@Arbiter5154]

couldnt agree more

[@phlasc]

Auto fill is a requirement because you pigeon holed the game design to stick to a meta. Remove the meta, stop enforcing it, remove roles.

[@aldohorn1704]

People seem to struggle to understand this. In Overwatch there was a time when high elo games had a queue time of about 20 secs for Supp, and about 12 - 15 minutes for DPS. The average overwatch game is about 10 - 15 minutes. This means that Supp players played every game and DPS players had to wait the duration of one game before they could play. This is not the worst if it's 15 minutes... but league games are like 30 minutes long.

[@David-vk5sv]

and? DPS players dont want to play anything but DPSm if they dont want to wait they can change roles

[@MrBoat-me5ts]

Graph me like one of your high school math projects uwu

[@Waelly17]

he's bald (

[@unhaix707]

I would like it if we could rank the roles like i main mid/adc but my support isnt too bad but i autolose top lane and jungle

[@QuestionableQs]

Ranking the roles sounds like the best move. So if i get cucked and get jungle at least I know it’s cuz junglers literally weren’t existing in that moment

[@OnlyTidus]

They tried this already and people just ran it down on roles they didn't care about

[@homyachock]

@@OnlyTidus you didn't understand him. He meant rank every role in terms of priority. Like, my first 1 role is jg, then mid, then bot, then sup, then top. So if I'm autofill, there's more chances that I would play bot, not top.

[@yasoumain3902]

I feel like it should be different in master+. Laners can get autofilled in other lanes and do "fine" on average but support and jungle players should never be autofilled into other lanes. Laners are at least in master+ better mechanically than support and jungle players so the gap when they get filled is so big its unplayable.

[@homyachock]

Then jg and sup players should learn how to play the game. If they can't lane

[@twigz3214]

As a Jungle main I just learned a few champs I can lane on. I play Ziggs since I can flex him mid and bot and can shove waves in an unfavorable situation if needed or when support is roaming if I have to temporarily lane 1v2. Also as a Talon jungle main he can work fine mid. I also play some Vlad who can flex mid and top.

[@OG_ALviK]

A main jungle / support that gets autofilled almost never happens. They tell you they are fill but in reality they are just exhausted with the rhole and want to take a mental brake from it on something more chill and relaxing like pve farm simulator toplane or nuking stuff from midlane and roaming around mindlessly picking up kills and ofc flaming the jungler.

[@vrmax1919]

yea the thing with autofill is game quality you get fucked in the ass by whoever has more autofill making this shit game MORE LUCK BASED than it already is

[@hugospam71]

one possibly overlooked benefit of the old system is that having to discuss who gets what role is a conversation starter. I strongly believe removing the necessity of talking to your teammates was a major contributing factor to the increased toxicity the game is seeing

[@koroxo1152]

Weird, I remember those times the opposite way. People fighted for roles and if they don't win it's a dodge or a troll 😅

[@OG_ALviK]

Yes and no. While it's true that people interacted more back then. But it's also true that the interactions where much more toxin and lots more of them compared to now. Especially after they removed the names in lobby, almost always i join a lobby where nobody sais anything and the game starts...

[@gagecoutch3284]

Been saying this as an outsider. Imagine going to the park for a pick up game of any kind and throwing an int feed tantrum that you didnt get your role or the game isnt going your way

[@TheHYDROrooster]

Ok, auto fill Kyrie as a Center vs Shaq and see what happens

[@gagecoutch3284]

@TheHYDROrooster that's a pro league solo que has more in common with a pick up game at the park. For those times where you have the 6 ft 13 year old that's obviously playing center that has more in common with a role preference. Play 3 or four games move up in priority for top pick on the team. Voice comms help in putting a team together too.

[@LNRDi]

"Unless you want queue times to be very long, it's not going anywhere" - this seems like a non-answer, I think you'd find a majority of ranked players would deeply prefer long queue times where they're guaranteed their role over the current system. I think what the person is asking you is closer to "Why does Riot need the queue times to be so much shorter when players would not prefer that?" - which is a valid question that I also have. Does Riot have survey data from recent years about what the player base would prefer re: Auto-fill? If not, how are they making their decision to keep it? On what basis?

[@anthonyfaiell3263]

I just made a comment like this. 100%. But unfortunately our argument here is often shoved under the rug. . To me, it's simple though. Saying "unless you want long queue times" as a main argument implies that spamming games with little downtime is their goal for players... The only world that is a goal is a world where Riot wants to create an artificial grind to lengthen play time and encourage microtransaction purchases. . Purely speaking from a ranked integrity standpoint... "fair matches" trump literally everything else. There is nothing else that affects ranked quality more than fair/balanced matchmaking. And perhaps long queue times would dissuade the brainless ranked spammers. Encouraging mostly only people who actually gave a shit about LP and winning games to queue specifically for ranked.

[@sebs2157]

Id rather sit in queue for 20mins than have to play out a 20-30min game thats an autoloss cause im in a role I have no idea how to play

[@OG_ALviK]

If everybody could do that, you and everybody else would be sitting at 40, 60 80 min queues and people would quit the game out of boredom.

[@mikilgene3851]

Can you just try it for like a week please

[@miruajin6448]

Just keep it as is… role queue is the one of the biggest reasons I stayed But, more variety in botlane sounds enticing…

[@chiidybang370]

Yeah but you can bypass this if you just always leave que if you didnt find a game in under 2minutes. Im doing this as a midlaner. Played over 200games this season only got filled to my second role 2 times. 0 times autofilled to a role i didnt choose.

[@andrewadams530]

Why don't you show the paint D: so sad

[@pedrohenrique-db3xd]

Someone didn't watch the full video

[@Powerate]

The sound of his keyboard is very satisfying

[@emilemil1]

I think there are two big issues with autofill. First is that it happens randomly, which means that to opt out you have to dodge. I think it would be better if you were forced in role select to pick a role that needs filling. Sure, some people wouldn't queue at all, but that's better than having people dodge or be toxic all game because they were forced into a shitty situation. Second is that you can lose LP while autofilled. The solution is simple, while autofilled your LP doesn't change (unless reported), instead if you win you get bonus LP gains for the next few games, and if you lose then the bonus disappears. That effectively makes losing while autofilled less punishing since it can never reduce your LP, but wins can increase it. The actual bonus you get should depend on how far you are from your "true" rank, so basically you get a lot while climbing but very little if you're sitting at a 50% WR, preventing LP inflation.

[@homyachock]

That's terrible udea, lol. People wouldn't tryhard if they can't lose LP, even now people can refuse to tryhard

[@GrammeStudio]

riot is primarily trying to avoid long queue time. allowing players to sit out is going to worsen that problem. i dont see how losing 25 LP during autofill is that much different from losing 12 LP during autofill with potential to win +12 bonus LP in next few matches. seems like more work to get to where we started. worse: while the incentive to work for bonus LP might exist, most players are more interested in playing desired role, caring less about LP. the most powerful role being the least popular is the proof of that. meaning: they would just soft int to end the match faster so they can move onto match where they can play their main. dont even bother with the reporting implementation, it's just an unreliable system unless you're willing to embrace false positives. 1) players are trigger happy with reports 2) reports on soft int rarely even brings punishment.

[@OG_ALviK]

Maybe reduce LP loss while autofill and increase if win? I mean marginally. So if i usually lose 20, when fill i lose 18. And if usually i win 22, when fill i ll win 24. A little bonus like that would be neat.