Avro Lincoln; The Super Lanc That Was Outdated When it Arrived

When the British began thinking about their bomber needs when it came to attacking the Japanese homeland, they did the logical thing and created an upgraded Lancaster - the Avro Lincoln.
But their roots meant they were very soon outdated in the post-war world.
Despite this, they soldiered on and gave service in bushfire conflicts around the globe.
If you like this content please consider supporting me at Patreon:
/ ednash
Want another way to help support this channel? Maybe consider buying my book on my time fighting ISIS:
amzn.to/3preYyO
Interested in military affairs/history?
militarymatters...

[@tomnorcross859]

I was a navigator on Lincolns with 61 squadron at Waddington, Eastleigh Nairobi, and Wittering, and later with 83 squadron at Hemswell.before joining the V Force Valiants at Marham. I am 90 years old now, and joined the RAF in 1950 as a cadet navigator.

[@TheOnlyTYRE]

Thank you for your service. You secured our freedom and safety. o7

[@paladamashkin8981]

How cool. Glad you found this video sir and an honor to meet you

[@sprre3899]

I hope you are keeping well. 🫡

[@pierreschmit9148]

My respects to you, Sir

[@dickdastardly5534]

Godbless you sir and thank you for protecting mine and others futures❤️🙏🏻

[@_od_7825]

It’s worth noting that it was developed into the Shackleton, which was the very final variant of the Manchester line. That remained in service to the early 90’s.

[@jimtaylor294]

Indeed. From the mid' 1930's until about 1994... damn impressive for any aircraft lineage. That; and the Manchester line also spawned the Lancastrian, a seperate spinoff aircraft, and the Lanc' / Linc' were the first British aircraft of their size to test turboprop's & straight up jet engines.

[@robmclaughjr]

Another awesome name. It should be given to another tough plane.

[@atlascheethac7869]

Sadly the Shackleton only saw action once with South Africans in its whole international service life

[@LEESS1005]

I was at Lossiemouth with the Shackleton,the BBMF had the engines and all the spares after the Shackleton left service.

[@LEESS1005]

@@jimtaylor294 the actual history is,Manchester,Lancaster,York,Lancastrian,Lincoln,Tudor,Shackleton and Vulcan,there were several other civilian versions of the above aircraft,(York and Lancastrian),and can’t forget the old faithful Annie.

[@pauldulworth2768]

I just watched this with my 7 year old son, his first foray into military aircraft. He said, “I liked watching that.” And so another generation is introduced to this passion and I cannot think of a better channel to start his education with. Cheers.

[@EdNashsMilitaryMatters]

Excellent! Though please check my videos before showing him, I do have bad language/adult humour in a few.

[@marineboy6033]

Lovely anecdote!

[@warrenmilford1329]

Introduce him to making plastic model kits and see if he likes it. He'll not only learn about planes and tanks etc, but also of world history, and the parts they played in it. He may enjoy it more than video games.

[@LaurenceLDN]

@@warrenmilford1329 I'm not sure the world needs any more plastic...

[@warrenmilford1329]

@@LaurenceLDN Well, you're right about that, but there's a lot less plastic in probably 50 model planes, compared to a game console, that is replaced when the latest model is released, and ends up eventually dumped. As well as in the make up and packaging of new games, which once played, share the same fate. I learnt so much from making models, not just from the info supplied about each one, but also from the further reading that it encouraged me to do. There are also balsa wood and cardboard models available as well.

[@paulkirkland3263]

When I was a child, I used to sneak under the fence at RAF Watton, and play inside a couple of abandoned Lincolns.

[@1joshjosh1]

That would have been definitely fun. Dropping pretend bombs on Japan!!

[@raulduke6105]

You lucky dog!

[@toomanyhobbies2011]

And somehow security just missed you? IDBY

[@yahoo463]

Wouldn't have been so much fun bumping into an RAF dog.🐕

[@paulkirkland3263]

@@toomanyhobbies2011 This was in the early 1960s, and it was a very different world back then. On Sunday afternoons, people used to go for walks on the airfield, past parked Vickers Varsities and Canberras - an RAF police van used to do a circuit of the perimeter track every hour or so, but that's all. The two Lincolns were lying on their bellies at the north east end of the airfield, ready to be used for fire training, and we lived in the married quarters nearby, ( Cardington Road if you want to Google Earth it ). It was easy to slip under the fence and get to the aircraft. Later on, around 1968/9, they were gone, but there was a HP Hastings and a Canberra's cockpit section lying in the same area, both also accessible.

[@dave41184]

The Lincoln was designed with the concept of the 'Bomber Stream' attack method still in mind. It improved on areas where the Lancaster had fallen short which Ed explained. The Lincoln might well have seen service over Europe but for some development issues. For example the 3 blade propellors on the Lincoln B.I caused a lot of vibrations and only 50 or so were made, until it was found that 4-blade props cured it. All the B.Is were then converted to B.IIs. Integration into service took a long time too. For Tiger Force ops, I think the intention was that the Tallboy and Grandslam bombs would be used to bomb Japan's bridges during a land borne invasion of the mainland. I like the Lincoln, it has a place in the RAF's history.

[@bulukacarlos3571]

Greetings from Argentina. An important use that was given to the Lincolns in addition to those mentioned in the video was to "bombard" the first Argentine Antarctic bases with supplies until the construction of landing strips.

[@scootergeorge7089]

Greetings from the USA. In 1975, I was assigned to USN patrol squadron VP-65 when we retired the P2V-7 Neptune. Many were mothballed but a few were purchased by Argentina. Their surface search radar came in handy locating the Royal Navy during the Falklands/Malvinas fight.

[@Yosemite-George-61]

"LV-ZEI" 🙂

[@terrystevens5261]

@@scootergeorge7089 There are no such islands as the malvinas.

[@scootergeorge7089]

@@terrystevens5261 - No "malvinas" but the Argentines call a certain islands "Malvinas." or, more specifically, "Islas Malvinas." The English, call them the Falklands. Facts.

[@mikerodent3164]

​@@scootergeorge7089 Yup. 1494, Treaty of Tordesillas, sanctioned in 1506 by Pope Julius II, says that all land everywhere belongs to either Spain or Portugal, with a big dividing line in the Atlantic. No land belongs to heathens, and even less to despicable heretics. The problem is that Popes are infallible (though, technically, they only became infallible 3 centuries later, so a big question relates to whether Papal infallibility is retrospective). So anyway, tough luck for the indigenous inhabitants of South America: convert or ... I dunno, burn in hell for all eternity, perhaps? Either way, no land for you. Fortunately, no-one at all ever lived in the Malvfaklands until some miserable, cold British people decided to try it one day. But, aha, Papal infallibility! So yes, the Failkvinas belong for all eternity to the pious Catholic faithful of Argentina. As long as they remain Catholic, pious and faithful, the fact that they are Conquistadores and imperialists can be forgiven (if they confess and repent, sincerely, all the sins they can think of). But do they remain so? And when they repent their sins, are they truly sincere? God knows.

[@brucehewson5773]

I have a photo of my father, standing in the cabin of RAAF A73-31, head above the cockpit, guiding the pilot while taxying after landing at Tengah, July 1951, being the first aircraft to complete 100 operational sorties in Malaya.

[@JK-rv9tp]

The engines also soldiered on powering the Canadair Northstar airliner, which delivered hearing loss and tinnitus to many a Trans Canada Airlines traveler.

[@deltavee2]

When i was a kid they were of course called Tin Can Airlines. I believe we have a North Star sitting outside at the Air Museum here in Ottawa waiting for restoration.

[@garethonthetube]

Yes, never a good idea to have unrestricted exhaust stacks next to the passenger cabin. I think there was a mod that routed the cabin side outlets to the other side of the nacelle.

[@JK-rv9tp]

@@garethonthetube Yeah I think so. That was why the first class section of most piston airliners was at the BACK, not the front.

[@nairbvel]

Considering the fact that active duty Lincolns made it all the way through the 1950s I'd say she didn't do too badly for a design that was basically born obsolete... :-)

[@szilardtoth8814]

British Classic

[@CallsignEskimo-l3o]

My father was a Gunnie with the RAAF loading the Lincolns with bombs during the Malayan Emergency. He always a a soft spot the the aircraft.

[@alan6832]

I really don't see why they kept making them after ww2 ended. The few Lincolns made before VJ day, along with remaining Lancasters and a few purchased B29s, could have filled the gap from Lancaster to Valiant, especially if they could produce a few B29 components in cooperation and for local parts supply.

[@nomdeplume798]

My dad was in 205 Sqn for most of his 9 years in the RAF. They flew Sunderlands from RAF Seletar in Singapore and also carried out bombing raids on what were then termed CTs. Bombs were mounted on racks under the wings instead of depth charges. He said he couldn't understand why they were just bombing monkeys and birds, l later found out there may have been method in their madness.

[@davidewhite69]

@@alan6832 didnt help that Australia had a Prime Minister who was staunchly supportive of everything British and refused the RAAF the approval to buy American until the Brit equipment became hopelessly obsolete, hence why the RAAF had Lincolns, meteors and Vampires instead of B-29s and F-86s.

[@asc.445]

Lets also not forget shortly after came the Canberra and the V bombers. It was just a question of timing.

[@peterthepilot4413]

My Dad flew the Lincoln and the B29 and thought that there was no comparison, he loved the B29

[@tomstevenson161]

Where the Lincoln looks like another B-32 failure

[@owenshebbeare2999]

@@tomstevenson161 Yet the Lincoln wasn't a failure, unlike the B-32.

[@arakami8547]

I wonder what the unit costs were for the two aircraft; Lancaster was 1/3rd the cost of a B-29, I see the Lincoln being 1/2 that of the Superfortress. Development costs were definitely larger for the B-29, it was more expensive than the atomic bomb. Edit: this video states you could get 3-4 Lincoln's for a B-29, or 5 Lancasters for a B-29.

[@peterthepilot4413]

When my Dad picked up various B29s from the USA the first thing he would buy was leather or rubber to repair his shoes and boots then chocolate and candies.

[@russellmiles2861]

Well, the RAF preferred the B29 and flew them in early 50s as a stop gap till the VBombers arrived.

[@Simon_Nonymous]

I've just got back from the pub after a six pint session and got this gem to watch. Thanks Ed!

[@jacksclabassi4209]

Good Man

[@tgmccoy1556]

The British know how to "Stretch" a design. Ask any MGB owner. BTW the Shackelton wasn't taken out of service until The late 80s /early 90s

[@davecoz4227]

KZbin agrees, here's a 1990's doc about them kzbin.info/www/bejne/m52of3-XZZaLfqM

[@tgmccoy1556]

@@davecoz4227 thanks 😊

[@jonboy9912]

And the V Bombers hit the Falklands and refuelled the fleet for decades!

[@WoT_the_Feck]

Yup Canberra is still in service with NASA I believe

[@johnkelinske1449]

@@WoT_the_Feck Yep.

[@johnjephcote7636]

That shot at 08.54 looks like the third prototype with three-bladed props that I photo'd at Cranfield in the late fifties/early 60s. Still in camouflage with the 'P' but no guns. Three bladed props upset the harmonics of the a/c so they went for four-bladed. The Cranfield prototype was scrapped. The Napier de-icing Lincoln at Luton had a Lanc nose which made recogmition awkward when, as a schoolboy I walked around it (no security then). Lincolns regularly popped up at Biggin Hill airshows and at one I photo'd the last three on a flypast.

[@underconsideration3227]

Finally evolution? Shackleton anyone?

[@truckerallikatuk]

Yep, the super-lincoln aka the super-super Lancaster, or the super-super-super Manchester...

[@javiergilvidal1558]

Arguably Shackleton is not a super-Lanc, since it's not a bomber. The Manchester lineage of the Shack is undeniable, but the latter might rather be called a next-generation Sunderland. Whaddya think?

[@dylanmilne6683]

@@javiergilvidal1558Aircraft don't lose development heritage because of change in role. Regardless Lancasters we're used as maritime Recon post war too. Sunderland was a flying boat a totally creature made by a totally different company.

[@javiergilvidal1558]

@@dylanmilne6683 .... but not for a "totally different" purpose! Funny, too, that you answer my "The Manchester lineage of the Shack is undeniable ..." with "Aircraft don't lose development heritage because of change in role".

[@allangibson2408]

The Shackleton wasn’t quite the final evolution either - the RAAF built four turboprop Lincoln’s that were used in atomic tests in Australia. They were used to drop prototype nuclear devices from 45,000ft to calibrate the aerodynamic models for the British V-bombers.

[@johndavey72]

Boy ! That' s a hell of a photo at 4mins 10 secs Ed. 3 feathered with just the Starboard inner running ! No margin for error from that pilot ! Thanks Ed. (Someone mentioned Shackleton !)

[@DickHolman]

WOW! Is that an RAAF turbo-prop variant?

[@jamesbugbee6812]

Ekeing out flight in ground effect?

[@terrystevens5261]

@@DickHolman Flying testbed.

[@jamesbulldogmiller]

No aircraft lasts forever... except the B-52 , and the KC-135

[@AtheistOrphan]

Don’t forget to C-130 and the U-2.

[@commandingjudgedredd1841]

Tu-95

[@jamesbulldogmiller]

@@AtheistOrphan you’re Right in both accounts. The U-2’s ‘replacements’ SR-71 and A-12 are all in museums, now.

[@jamesbulldogmiller]

@@commandingjudgedredd1841 Of course!! the loudest plane ever, also the longest lasting!

[@brianwillson9567]

And the U2

[@stracepipe]

My Dad flew Lincolns in 83 squadron at RAF Hemswell and for the Bomber Command Bombing School at RAF Lindholm. My claim to fame is that his squadron flew the planes in the film "The Dambusters".

[@dean-gm1lg]

Parts of the film where filmed at hemswell as well I believe

[@stracepipe]

@@dean-gm1lg yes, it was used as Scampton.

[@dean-gm1lg]

@@stracepipe I thought so I go to carboot and autojumble at hemswell

[@mpersad]

A terrific analysis of the end state of the Avro Manchester. The context for the aircraft in post-war era is spot on!

[@gregjetnikoff7124]

I grew up in my early years with the local Air Force having Lincolns at the local Air Base ( Townsville, Queensland. Australia). They used to have open days. I have actually been inside one AND sat in the rear gunner seat. They became coastal patrol planes before the Neptunes began.

[@gm16v149]

You learn something new every day, because I always thought the Lincoln was powered by the 37 litre Griffon, as in the Shackleton. I was going by the shape of the radiator nacelle. Apparently it just had uprated 27 litre Merlins from the Lancaster. They used to fly from the Woomera-Evetts Field aerodrome in South Australia.

[@jimwest63]

@@wilburfinnigan2142 The Lancaster could carry 14,000lb to Berlin. Not exactly short range in the context of the war against Germany.

[@jacktattis]

@@wilburfinnigan2142The US gave nothing they made the UK pay

[@jacktattis]

@@wilburfinnigan2142 Lancaster 1660 miles with 14000 lb

[@georgebarnes8163]

Not forgetting the big Short Stirling, the heavy bomber that was restricted by politics and not allowed to be developed, had the Stirling been allowed its big wings it was more than a match for the Lancaster.

[@robertcook2572]

@Keep Campaigning The hangar size thing is a myth. Look it up.

[@grahamepigney8565]

A big problem with the Stirling was the angle of attack on the wings. Rather than rebuild it (which would have produced a nose down flying stance as per the Whitley) they just lengthened the landing gear to get the wings at the right angle for take off. The spindly undercarriage was responsible for many take-off and landing accidents. The upper fuselage and wings were taken from the Short Sunderland. The Stirling had a limited bomb load and the segmented bomb bay restricted the ordnance it could carry. The standard hanger was 112 feet, and servicing was to be carried out in the open air. The 100 feet wingspan was part of the Air Ministry specification I believe it was all electric. I have a fire axe that is rated safe at 1,000 volts that came from my grandfather who worked for Shorts.

[@ross.venner]

03:18 - Note the Village Inn radar under the tail turret. Best photo of the install I have seen.

[@dwp1970]

Great video, Thanks. I almost always chuckle when I read or hear "Why didn't they simply..." It's hard to predict the future especially when you are fighting a World War.

[@TheDkeeler]

I'm still awaiting for a 1/72 scale model kit of the Avro Lincoln to be released.

[@Simon_Nonymous]

me too Dave - I'm bracing myself to make a Manchester conversion from a Lanc in order to complete a 1:72 Bomber Command line up, but would love to make a Lincoln just to end the story

[@PiersLawsonBrown1972]

You can purchase a conversion kit that makes a Lincoln from an Airfix Lancaster B.I/III kit, made by a company called Flightpath UK.

[@pickeljarsforhillary102]

Get on it Airfix!

[@adriaandeleeuw8339]

@@PiersLawsonBrown1972 www.southernskymodels.com.au/AVRO-GAFLincolnMk-30-Mk-31EnhancementSet-4158.html

[@atilllathehun1212]

Yes, long overdue. Come on Airfix!!

[@johnjephcote7636]

I love that shot (nerves of steel to take it!) of the single engined Linc flying on the deck during proximity fuse testing.

[@lesterross1]

Well, another Remembrance Day here in Canada. I am lucky to live in Southern Ontario, where we get to see one of the only Lancasters still flying, pass over the memorial services at the the Cenotaph. Look forward to it every year.

[@EdMcF1]

My Dad was flown around Arabia when in Aden in the RAF in a Lincoln in the mid-1950s, one of them had been used in Malaya and was a bit knackered, it never made it home as the fuel tanks broke so it was scrapped locally.

[@itsnotalwaysblackandwhite8624]

I was always under the impression that the next step up from the Lancaster was the Avro Shackleton. In all my years, sadly, this is the first time that I have come to learn of the Lincoln. As time goes by there seems to be more information coming out of the woodwork about innovations that occurred in WWII.

[@givenfirstnamefamilyfirstn3935]

It was no secret.

[@adoreslaurel]

As a teenager [around 1956], I got to look inside one at the Government Aircraft Factory in Melbourne. fascinated by the bomb bay bypass, from memory you dragged yourself down this rectangular tunnel by as rope to get to the other end.

[@SvenTviking]

To be fair, the B29 was equally as vulnerable to the Mig 15, it wasn’t that much faster than the Lincoln, not enough to challenge a 650mph jet.

[@mebsrea]

Right. At that point, maneuverability and damage resistance were probably more important.

[@jeffreywilliams144]

The B29 had a much more lethal Defensive armament and more range.

[@bobbyrayofthefamilysmith24]

@@jeffreywilliams144 no it didn't. Its defence was no match for jets. Jets made these bombers obsolete

[@jeffreywilliams144]

@@bobbyrayofthefamilysmith24 I have Never been a fan of WW2 British Heavy Bombers Including those Joining B29s Over Japan if the War were to Continue. You're Correct the Lincoln was Obsolete and the RAF Washingtons as Well.

[@jeffreywilliams144]

@@bobbyrayofthefamilysmith24 Just an Aside I am not talking About Korean War Skies here.

[@boomslangCA]

Regarding the B-29, there were also massive development problems with it and for a while it looked like it would die before it saw any active service due to the problems but the US, being the US, stuck at it and got it working finally.

[@lairdcummings9092]

Usually, if you throw enough money at a problem, it can be overcome. Not the smartest solution (usually), but a reliable one.

[@interman7715]

The B29 was a very advanced design with pioneering features which naturally bring problems, the B 29 made everything else look stone age .

[@bulukacarlos4751]

Greetings from Argentine Patagonia. What was expressed for use by our country is correct, but one more use was missing: At the beginning of the 50s Argentina's strong presence began in Antarctica, but there was no good landing strip, so the Lincolns were used for "bomb" the bases with food and other supplies. A very anecdotal use was the bombardment of the Perito Moreno glacier (I don't remember the year) because the glacier did not break like it usually does every 4 years, and a lot of water was accumulating with the danger that this entails. By The way 0:21 Narrator:"- But no plane last forever......" C-130: "-Hold my jet A-1"

[@henryluczak9156]

I was born and raised in Hatfield (South Yorkshire) near RAF Lindholm, under the flight-path to the north-west of the aerodrome. An enduring memory from the mid 1950s is watching Lincolns climbing towards and over our house, their Merlin engines on full power, still at a relatively low altitude. They were eventually replaced by Hastings, which although just as noisy, were not the same spectacle as the Lincolns.

[@stuartmoles7138]

I spent my last 18 months of RAF service at Lindholm on Lincolns as an engine Tech. We also had 1 Hastings and about 8 Varsities as the Station ended up as the Bomber Command Bombing School for Navigators who were destined for the new V bomber force.

[@robertguttman1487]

Vickers had a much more advanced bomber in development at the sea time, called the "Windsor", but it did not go into production.

[@McRocket]

Finally Ed, IMO, you are doing your channel PERFECTLY. Regular content, SHORT videos usually (very important, I think), always interesting, well presented, good data, HUGE variations in stories PLUS, you have a great delivery...you sound knowledgeable but easy going. And I still love that you save us 15+ seconds from EVERY, OTHER VIDEO site (it seems) and their slightly-condescending, sales pitch 'don't forget to like, subscribe and....blah, blah' after EVERY vid. In my opinion, for what it is worth, you keep this up and you will be over 100K subs FAST. Cheers. ☮

[@johnfinch8173]

Hi Ed. The South African Air Force used the Avro Shackleton for maritime patrol up to the 1970's if I remember correctly. It would be great if you could include the history of this aircraft when you have the time. Love your videos.

[@EdNashsMilitaryMatters]

The shack deserves it's own vid in time:)

[@Hiznogood]

This channel is turning out as one of my favorites! Keep up the good work!

[@Yosemite-George-61]

I'm American, ex USAF (B-52, RC-135X) I don't think the Lincoln was a "Lantern jawed victorian monstrosity" It was a good airplane, it did not cost a lot and did it's job well in an era where the Jerry's and Japs were gone and the jets were comming. In my view, it would have been waste of money to but lots of B-29s or B-50s that money could (was?) be better used to develop jets. I think the Air Ministry did allright on this one.

[@GaryJohnWalker1]

Ultimate developmemt of the Manchester - a footnote video on the Shackleton would be well worthwhile. Stalwart for Coastal COmmand and of course dragged on into AEW service.

[@luvr381]

Was just about to make the same comment.

[@cowbanchalam9725]

Yep, my immediate thought too. I remember visiting a couple of retired Shackletons at Gatwick

[@ryanparker7258]

The Shackleton was also used in the ASW role before being replaced by the Nimrod.

[@wideyxyz2271]

I remember seeing a formation of these flying over on their way to Woodford at the end of their service life. For a few moments I thought Id slipped back in time until I realised what they were! A glorious sight indeed!

[@adampoultney8737]

Not to mention the Tudor or Ashton

[@dpeasehead]

People forget that thanks to things such as operational difficulties and the unexpected phenomenon of the jetstream over Japan that the incredibly costly B-29 was dangerously close to becoming a failure. It was the switch to low level fire bombing under LeMay which turned things around. In fact, mass firebombing of nearly defenseless Japanese cities was so effective that some had to be deliberately spared in order to leave something for the atomic bombs.

[@terrystevens5261]

That low level one engine shot was taken over RAF Defford near where i live in Worcestershire. a lot of pioneering radar research took place there, due to it's proximity to the Royal Radar Establishment in Malvern. the worlds first hands off flight and automated landing also took place at RAF Defford. the arcraft used was an old Boeing 247-D airliner that was gifted to the UK by Canada. that happened in 1945 and we now don't even think about it when we board our holiday jets.

[@doughart2720]

G'day Ed. For someone who specialises in odd and rare aircraft I'm surprised that there was no mention of the long nosed Mk 31 Lincoln of the RAAF. Maybe another time. But keep it up. This is good stuff.

[@Ensign_Cthulhu]

He did touch on "Australian Lincolns of various marks", but I think the main thrust of the vid was to detail its evolution in the RAF context and what lay beyond it.

[@mladenmatosevic4591]

B-29 also became obsolete with jet fighters, so Lincoln was less expensive for same result. Effectively, British had 3 choices: 1) Upgrade existing plane 2) Build whole new piston bomber, knowing that jets are coming. 3) Develop jet bomber for 5 years, while war is still going on.

[@owenshebbeare2999]

@@nickdanger3802 Jets were not bombers were not used in that war, though B-45's carried out some reconnaissance.

[@CncrndCtzn]

“Less expensive for the same result”. Same result, huh? Are you implying the Lancaster had the same performance as the B29? British propaganda still spinning it 😂

[@wraitheful]

all the planes being developed were very expensive (early jets, pressurization) at that time with early large strides coming one after the other. Even the B-29 was outdated while being outrageously expensive.

[@RegBarlow]

I thought we leased the updated Boeing B-50, with more powerful engines and a taller tail fin, for RAF Bomber Command rather than the B-29!

[@sidefx996]

Same result??? Are you seriously going to compare the Lincoln's impact on the war to the B-29's? You can't possibly be that obtuse...

[@astridvallati4762]

The RAAF Lincolns were also used in Fly-Through Tests of Atomic Mushroom Clouds ( Maralinga). Both AirCrew and Ground Crew servicing the Aircraft eventually died of Radiation Contamination Cancers many years after Service...we had Two Veterans ( Factory Engineers) who both died from such cancers, up to 30 years after RAAF Lincoln Service...and not very nice ones at that.

[@jimtaylor294]

A criminally underrated aircraft IMO. Ironically the Shackleton - in some ways a shortened Lincoln - proved much more could be squeezed from the airframe, with her four *RR Griffon* engines turning contra-rotating propellers, complimented with two Viper turbojets. Russia's postwar Tupolev Bear, certainly suggests that the Lincoln could have been developed further, in a more useful way than the *Boeing Washingtons* we had for a relativy short time, and - to the best of my knowledge - never carried nukes, which is what they were theoretically for.

[@letsseeif]

The origin of the Lincoln was the twin engine Avro Manchester (not ideal) which morphed in the four engined Lancaster (a HUGE success), then as the war neared the end, the LINCOLN materialised. Apart from the normal production run in the UK, Australia built 73 Lincolns at Fishermen's Bend (CAC -Commonwealth Aircraft Factory) Melbourne VIC..

[@richardmarshall4322]

Very good video. I liked the comments at the end about the B29/ Lincoln issue. A point not raised is that Avro amongst others WERE developing a new bomber. Not an interim piston powered B29 type but a Class of aircraft that blew everything else out of the water. The V bombers, especially the Victor snd Vulcan were streets ahead of anything else including anything the Yanks had. B52 is an overgrown B17. Not in the same ball park. Incidentaly only one complete Lincoln exists, that is the beautiful example at the RAF museum at Cosford. The Lancaster is at RAF museum Hendon.

[@lesterross1]

There is a Lancaster in Hamilton Ontario in Canada. It flew over the Remembrance day services in Southern Ontario this morning.

[@rojaunjames747]

Since you are doing post war aircraft can you do the DH Hornets one aircraft that is forgotten in history

[@brucebaxter6923]

love that plane

[@raypurchase801]

Phenomenal. Useful to compare the Hornet with the Dornier Pfeil, an aircraft designed for the same purpose but dreadfully over-complicated. Whereas De Havilland simply grafted a single-seat cockpit to a Mossie and made a thousand detail improvements.

[@brucebaxter6923]

@@raypurchase801 Yep. Metal spar Straight spar Offset landing gear Smaller nacelles Thinner wings Counter rotating props Etc etc etc

[@raypurchase801]

@@brucebaxter6923 Agreed.

[@davidhandyman7571]

My father worked at the Experimental Workshops of the Department of Aircraft Production at Fisherman's Bend, Melbourne, Victoria, Australia. I remember him talking about being involved in experiments to convert Lancasters into Lincolns.

[@stilettoheelslover]

My father was an armaments fitter on Lincoln's (amongst others) in the RAAF, 1948-58.

[@itsjohndell]

Very few Americans are aware that indeed the development of the B-29 was by far the single most expensive project of the war. But we needed a long range very heavy bomber for the Pacific. And we needed a plane that could deliver the bombs being developed by the Manhattan Project. Hey, humour me: Why did the UK continue use of .303 guns instead of the .50 BMG?

[@owenshebbeare2999]

As for the guns, many reasons. Bear in mind that a group of modified Lancasters were developed to drop the atomic bombs if the B-29 failed as a project and, due to technical and time issues, the B-29 Silverplate models used the British bomb release mechanism designed for 11,000lb Tallboys for both Little Boy and Fat Man. These were both fairly close to this weight, despite looking quite different to the Tallboy or, indeed, each other. The American release mechanisms didn't work until after those two missions, and aircraft modified for the US were the Saddletree variants.

[@ianthomson9363]

One reason for retaining the .303 Brownings was that Britain had vast stocks of .303 ammunition, the last of which didn't get used until many years after 1945- possibly 1970s- I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong.

[@CplBurdenR]

@@ianthomson9363 Correct, surplus 1950s .303 was still being sold off in the 2000s. Another reason the .303 Browning was retained was that the .50 Calibre simply wasn't enough of a benefit for it's weight. The US had a rather strange obsession with it, mostly because they couldn't get their version of the 20mm Hispano to work properly. We could, and we did. Notice when uparming the Lancaster, and the standard armament for the Lincoln, included 20mm Hispanos. Yes, they did have .50s as well, but the 20mm Hispano is much more bang for buck. The US Navy in particular saw the writing on the wall, but again was limited by the miserable reliability of the US M1 20mm, which wasn't solved until the post-war M2 using electrically primed ammunition. Notice how quickly the US Navy switched to 20mms post-war. It took the ineffectiveness of the .50 Calibre in Korea against the MiG-15 to convince the USAF that they needed 20mm Cannons. (some F-86Es in theatre were converted to carry four 20mm Cannon, firing in two pairs rather than simultaneously, and the later production F-86H carried a more refined installation)

[@PassportToPimlico]

The Americans had a problem with the B29 Superfortress. It had two bomb bays separated by the main wing spar. As it was, it couldn't carry the atomic bomb. With a great deal of effort, the US created the Silverplate project that could allow for the B29 to carry the atomic bomb. However, there was a contingency plan for the Lincoln to have done the job, although this would have meant that the RAF would have had to try out their new idea of in flight refuelling.

[@petersouthernboy6327]

The B-29 was *always* going to be the plane to carry the atomic bomb and Spaatz never seriously considered anything else.

[@owenshebbeare2999]

@@petersouthernboy6327 Not quite true, a group of modified "Black Lancasters" were seriously considered as a contingency measure, and were ready to go, if needed. Additionallythe Silverplates had to use a British bomb cradle/release because American designs failed at the time. Later Saddletree B-29 aircraft used an American release mechanism, and varied from Silverplates in a few other fairly minor ways. There was a fair bit of "all the way with USA" attitude from people like Spaatz, but it wasn't official policy for the Silverplate aircraft to be 100% all American, and practicality and time made this the case, as it had with the Manhattan Project.

[@PassportToPimlico]

@@petersouthernboy6327 kzbin.info/www/bejne/a4m7aqOqeLOjn80

[@petersouthernboy6327]

@@PassportToPimlico kzbin.info/www/bejne/qnq0m2Wnm9WLick

[@petersouthernboy6327]

@@owenshebbeare2999 kzbin.info/www/bejne/qnq0m2Wnm9WLick

[@alanhigham6509]

I worked on Lincons at Manby in 1958-59.

[@sirronnorris3343]

RAF Hemswell 1953-54. My father was an 83 squadron Lincoln rear gunner. Flew 20 sorties from RAF Tengah, Malaya. That followed his 40 operations as a Halifax rear gunner in 1944.

[@alanhigham6509]

@@sirronnorris3343 I flew as as crew on several 6 hour flights. I spent most of the time on the rest bed just below the mid upper turret as my headset was duff. Happy days. Alan.

[@geezee1579]

Awesome that Someone with UK accent giving out specs in MPH and Feet which can understand while the American gives out specs in Metrics.

[@bop3752]

What school did you go to that didn’t teach both?

[@geezee1579]

@@bop3752 An American Federally Funded Pubic school system. At the time the Inch system was the only system in this country, Which kept this country Great.

[@stephenrickstrew7237]

The B -29’s engines were notorious for catching on fire and those Magnesium rich Crankcases were impossible to put out … Didn’t the RAF modify some Lancaster’s to deliver the A bomb .. the B29 was still iffy even late in the war … a friends dad was stationed in Tinian and he sad the engine fires were a nightmare …

[@gordonsutton2161]

I lived in Kenya in the middle 50,s and these were used against the mau mau, I can still remember them flying over the school.

[@SimonAmazingClarke]

Excellent account. In war, especially when it seems yiur on the home run, expence on aircraft design is hard to justify. As was mentioned, it was basically an up designed Lancaster. In the 1950s both Jet engines and turbo prop engines were coming out with so much more power. The C130 Hercules was designed around 1954. Note, even the highly advanced B29 was on its way out shortly after the war.

[@pushkarajdongre]

I wish my father was around, he would have tripped out on these vids!!

[@javiergilvidal1558]

Was he a packy Halifax pilot?

[@pushkarajdongre]

@@javiergilvidal1558 , no he wasnt in the packaging industry nor was he a pilot. Infact he was an architect and an aircraft enthusiast especially for the ones from the second world war.

[@paulkirkland3263]

@@pushkarajdongre packaging industry - love it. Nice comeback, sir. Some people are so thick they can't even spell their insults properly.

[@danpatterson8009]

When you have more money and resources, and your factories are not being bombed, it makes it easier to build an all-new aircraft like the B-29- which certainly had its share of teething problems. The UK was no slouch in tech- they invented the jet engine, and had jet fighters before we did. They provided vital data for the Manhattan project (for which we showed our gratitude by not sharing atomic tech with them after the war). And they handed us the cavity magnetron, which was a great leap forward in radar technology.

[@petersouthernboy6327]

Enrico Fermi didn’t need *anything* British to sustain the world’s first nuclear chain reaction.

[@lairdcummings9092]

A similar argument has been made in support of the m-91 carcano rifle; not the most modern battle rifle - not even in the Italian inventory - but adequate to the task and far cheaper than retooling and replacing the existing inventory at a time when resources were severely constrained.

[@MarkCSevenSixTwo]

Uncle Roy would want you to look at the Short Sperrin next, Ed....

[@rangefinder3538]

The Lincoln doubled for Lancasters in the "Dam Buster" film. Another great episode Ed.Great work.

[@johndavey72]

Really ? I think you're wrong but l will check up ! I thought the RAF used and adapted 5 Lancasters for the film .

[@davidjones332]

No, they're definitely Lancs.

[@johnjephcote7636]

The film makers used the four Lancs held in storage since the making of the far better film (for aircraft and accuracy) of 'Appointment in London'. It was filmed at a Lincoln/Canberra station so there are many Lincolns in the background with postwar markings. It was difficult to keep the Canberras out of shot. The film company was secretly charged less because the RAF crews merged their film work as continuation training (from the Lincs). After the film the Lancs were quietly flown away to Silloth to be disposed of. Coastal Command kept some MR Lancs until October 1956.

[@stratac30]

@@johnjephcote7636: correct, as described in the book Filming the Dam Busters by Jonathan Falconer.

[@localbod]

I could only find this information online. However, when I checked the serial numbers against a database of RAF airframes, they were shown as being Avro Lancaster Mk VIIs. Curiously enough the Lancaster Mk IV and Mk V were later designated Lincoln B1 and B2 respectively. Information: "For many, the stars of the film are undoubtedly the Lancasters themselves. It is hard to believe that Lancasters were in short supply when the filming commenced in April 1954. Four Mk.7 aircraft were taken out of storage from 20 Maintenance Unit at RAF Aston Down, Gloucestershire, and specially modified for the film. These were NX673, NX679, NX782 and RT686. In fact, ’673, ’679 and ’782 had already developed a taste for the movies because they had recently starred in Philip Leacock’s feature film about a wartime Lancaster squadron, 'Appointment in London', which was premiered in 1953. To make the Lancaster Mk.7s resemble as closely as possible the actual B.III (Type 464 Provisioning) aircraft that flew on the Dams raid in 1943, three (NX673, NX679 and RT686) were specially modified at Hemswell by a working party from the AV Roe Repair Organisation at Bracebridge Heath, Lincolnshire. Purists will notice a number of differences between wartime Lancasters and the Mk.7s that appear in the film. Perhaps the most obvious is the Frazer-Nash FN82 poweroperated rear turret that was equipped with twin Browning 0.50in machine guns. In 1943, the Lancasters of 617 Squadron would have been fitted with FN20 rear turrets armed with four of the less-potent 0.303in Brownings. In addition, the series of small windows along each side of the fuselage that were a noticeable feature of wartime Lancasters were deleted from the post-war Mk.7. And note, too, the absence of the engine exhaust covers that would have been present on wartime Lancasters to reduce glare and suppress sparks from the hot exhausts at night."

[@gordonlawrence1448]

The Lincoln was not the last derivative of the Lancaster. The Shackleton first flew in 1949 and retired in 1991.

[@poil8351]

avtually the shackelton was a derivative of the lincoln itself.

[@Dilley_G45]

He said "the final evolution of the MANCHESTER"

[@briancavanagh7048]

Mr Nash I must compliment you on your videos. They are just getting better & better, all the time. Not that they weren’t excellent to start with. Keep up the good work.

[@mcal27]

Loving this series on lesser known aircraft! Can I add a vote for the Armstrong whitworth Whitley?

[@simonmcowan6874]

That's so 1930's

[@mcal27]

@@simonmcowan6874 Yeah has 1937 written all over it! Angular, but I love it! I also love the Skua and Whirlwind lol

[@oxcart4172]

It's one of those aircraft that looks like an April Fools joke-but the government fell for it!

[@mcal27]

@@oxcart4172 what can I say.. I love the ugly ducklings lol To fair the Whitley along with the Wellington did Stirling work early in the war

[@oxcart4172]

@@mcal27 it has er...character, I suppose!

[@andrewbranch4918]

When I was a kid I used to see the shakelton flying over the north east coast on sub patrol. Didn't look outdated to me. It looked beautifully belligerent especially those two 20s sticking out of the front turret. Same stable, same quality. Too young to see a Lincoln unfortunately

[@michaelblaszkiewicz7283]

I wonder why they didn't change the nose for more speed? It looks as aerodynamic as a Mack truck.

[@Simon_Nonymous]

it's fugly isn't it?

[@atilllathehun1212]

It was a so called' ideal nose' (why I don't know) A production Vickers Windsor if built would have had something very similar.

[@michaelblaszkiewicz7283]

@@atilllathehun1212 I would guess the guys from marketing thought it sounded better than "garden shed" nose.

[@Ensign_Cthulhu]

At the speeds the Lincoln does, visibility matters more than pure aerodynamics. Remember: the Lancaster's round bubble is a bomb-aimer's station only; the Lincoln's nose also has to serve as the nose gunner's sighting station since the actual gun turret is "blind" unlike that of the Lanc.

[@frasermitchell9183]

And if you want to see an actual Lincoln, go to the RAF Museum at Cosford in England. You can also see two of the V-Bombers there too, a Vulcan and a Victor.

[@garethonthetube]

Superb museum. Lots of amazing prototypes. There is a Valiant there too, the only one left I believe. Excellent Cold War exhibition as well.

[@kayserbondor]

54 MU at Lichfield had many Lincolns in LTS 1952-3, very handy for a kip if you were on night picket patrol, I suppose they went to the breakers yard not long after. There was an area there that had been used for A/c’s scrapped, Typhoons, Mosquitos etc., still lots of lights perspex and fittings around in fair order. U/c lamps perfect spotlights for your motorbike.

[@lordpitnolen2196]

I thoroughly enjoyed my VIP-Day visit and trip in a Lancaster at East Kirkby, Lincolnshire, England. Should be on everybody's "bucket list".

[@donquixote3927]

It would seem foolhardy to develop a Superfortress clone with the jet age at the door. There were about to be plenty of B29’s in storage as the B50 came on stream.

[@stephenwarhurst6615]

I remember seeing a out of service Lincoln park near the runway at Wagga Wagga at RAAF airbase Forest Hill mid 1970's when I was around 6 years old when there was a Air show

[@adamlee3772]

Very interesting video. Thanks for taking the time to produce and upload it.

[@kevinohalloran7164]

I've been reading about World War ll since 1965, and I've Never Heard of This Model Until Now! That's how important channels like this are. Thank you for your excellent work and presentation, Ed Nash!

[@geoffreywealthall9348]

As a boy Lincoln’s we’re based at raf lindholm where they trained navigators. These planes used to drone around in figures of eight diving those of us living east of Doncaster mad, particularly at night in the summer

[@Falconar12]

I Worked on Lincolns as an airframe mech From 1954 till end of 1956 at RAF Hemswell. The so called bubble beneath the centre fuselage was the radar scanner cupola used for radar reconnaissance. The Licoln was also used for air sea rescue and housed rescue equipment in the bomb bay--- dinghies etc. The Canberra was used at Hemswell while the lincoln was still operating. And once saw one do a belly landing on the grass in front of and not far away from the hangars. Also saw a Linclon overshoot the runway. It went straight over the road and down a very steep slope on the other side. The fuselage broke into three pieces and the undercarriage struts were sticking through the top of the mainplane. The squadron commander approached me one day and said as I had been working on them for quite a time, I had to get kitted out with flying suit and parachute which I had to wear by the way and go up ona 6 hour continental flight the next day. Some experience as I had to sit on the main spar cover . Then worked on Canberras and Vulcans before being transferred to RAF Wyton for two years on Victors. That was some aircraft. .

[@domenicoamantea8796]

😅😅😅

[@JayHawke84]

Lancaster and the "Super Lancasters" (the Linclons) could of benefited with turboprops and jets, it does make me wonder how these aircrafts had all Merlins replaced would perform. On the RAF having outdated aircraft, the USAF operated Consolidated B36 Peacemakers when RAF bomber command had Vickers Valiants replacing the Lancaster/Lincoln

[@nickdanger3802]

Valiants replaced the B29's the US loaned to Britain. They were called Washingtons in RAF service. The B36 could reach the USSR from North America, the Valiant could not.

[@LEESS1005]

My old ATC commanding officer,flight lieutenant Ken Norman was a navigator on Lincoln’s and was part of the bomber force over Borneo.

[@martykarr7058]

The original Lanc was the backup for the Manhattan Project if the B-29 Silverplate version didn't perform well enough. There were even British crews who like their American counterparts practiced making atomic bomb runs without knowing what they would be carrying.

[@NoName-ds5uq]

Britain at that late stage in the war didn’t have the resources to focus on Japan like the USA did, Germany had been the focus. I think the Lincoln was the best they could’ve hoped for until the end of the war.

[@RichieWellock]

well done @ Ed Nash's Military Matters i recently went round one of avro's plants were at least the lancasters were made, Amazing all the avaitional bits still left at abandoned AVRoe manufacturing plant , even finding parts of a avroe tudor. great to hear you information on the Lincoln's progress

[@AdurianJ]

The Mosquito replacement fared better though as the English Electric Canberra was so good the Americans bought it.

[@markmullins7990]

Yeah Britain couldn’t throw unlimited money at a project like America could even then , it was a good plane from an established line of development and they didn’t have the benefit of hindsight like we do looking back at the past they had to predict the future needs of the R AF

[@javiergilvidal1558]

Anything on propellers was seen as a stop-gap from 1944 onwards. The Vulcan was already on the drawing board in 1947, as were the other two V-Bombers. That technology was something the yanks couldn't even dream about, irrespective of the undeniable fact that Britain was in deep financial trouble, a trouble which would have precluded her from building vast contingents of B-29 relatives. The big gamble was on a few, vastly superior jet bombers capable of delivering a nuclear payload to knock out the Soviets with a few devastating blows.

[@jamesfanning5279]

Living and working In Kenya from 1978 to 2006 I had a Swedish friend who'd been a journalist covering the Mau Mau uprising of the mid '50s for some Swedish publication. The RAF operated a squadron of Lincolns from Eastleigh airfield on the outskirts of Nairobi. Seeking a good first hand story my friend got a ride in a Lincoln on one of the regular bombing exercises of supposed Mau Mau hideouts up in the Aberdare range of hills north of Nairobi. As the bomb aimer called out "bombs gone" , the pilot turned to my friend Sigvard , shouting above the engine din , "there goes another few elephants !". Needless to say the general conclusion was that these bombing missions were pretty much a waste of time against a rag-tag but none the less resourceful Mau Mau guerilla force.

[@Steve-GM0HUU]

A number of Avro Lincolns were used as test beds for a variety of jet engines. E.g. Avon turbojets on outboard engine postions.

[@brendonbewersdorf986]

I never heard of this plane thanks again for bringing it to my attention I do alot of writing on alternative history so rare aircraft like this give me all kinds of ideas thanks again!

[@Stockport9b]

My late mother’s brother, Squadron leader Albert Tooth DFC was killed whilst test flying a Lincoln in July 1948 from Boscombe Down experimental station. It was reported as flying low over Deptford village with smoke pouring from it b4 nose diving into a cornfield. He had survived the war as a spitfire pilot and subsequently as liaison officer with Wingates Chindits in Burma.

[@yaragi]

Great video, once again! I thoroughly enjoy your work.

[@dermotanthonydavidkyne1019]

I note that you do not refer to the final modification of the Lincoln, the so - called "Long - Nosed" Lincoln. Which had an extended nose. Which housed an additional crew member. They were used by RAAF Marine Reconnaissance. They were withdrawn from service around 1957. And scrapped in the early 1960's.

[@jb6027]

One could argue that the final evolution of the Manchester/Lancaster was the Shackleton. Love your videos. Please keep them coming!

[@joeblow9657]

Fascinating stuff Mr Nash

[@davidreid8075]

I remember them at RAF Hemswell. Standing on my father's, Sgt George Reid, shoulders.

[@edevans5991]

Yeah it's amazing how quickly designs were dropped back then. Even the B29 was being used as a "medium" bomber by Korea. Meanwhile F15s may never be retired, let alone B52s.

[@stratac30]

What is not mentioned, is that Roy Chadwick ( Lancaster designer) had already pencil designed the Avro Vulcan before the end of WW2, so he was way ahead of the Americans and in fact the RAF requirements as to what the next generation bomber would be. A very brilliant man.

[@robbietoms3128]

The b29 also had alot of problems. I believe that most of the b29 that didn't make it back from Japan bombing runs were due to plane problems and not being shot down. At least the earlier ones had problems. Also I believe that there was a Lancaster in the pacfic to carry a nuclear bomb if needed. It was a back up. Not sure if that was true or not

[@davidwright7193]

A very typical story for late war developed prop aircraft. The B29 was also obsolete soon after deployment. The design requirement for the V bombers went out in 1944. The war time development stream during the war favoured incremental improvement and quick delivery where as post war you switched back to step change improvements and new capability in 5 years being favoured over a bit better in 6 months.

[@samrodian919]

Very interesting I knew almost nothing about the Lincoln until now. And I know a lot more about it's successor the Shackleton. Thank you.

[@sealove79able]

A very interesting video Mr.Ed.Have a good one.