"Bad" King John: How Rubbish Was He?

King John is often named as one of, if not the, worst kings in British history... but just how rubbish was he?
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Intro / Outro song: Silent Partner, "Greenery" [ • Greenery - Silent Part... ]
SFX from freesfx.co.uk/...
Linked videos and playlists:
Line of kings: • Taking the Throne: By ...
Images (from Wikimedia Commons, unless otherwise stated):
Screenshots from Disney’s “Robin Hood” (1973) from disney.fandom....)
First page of “King John” from “Mr. William Shakespeares Comedies, Histories, & Tragedies” or The First Folio (1623). From Schoenberg Center for Electronic Text & Image (SCETI).
Production photograph of Philip Leach as King John in front of the tomb of the monarch in the 2016 production of Shakespeare's King John staged by the Worcester Repertory Company in Worcester Cathedral on the 800th Anniversary of the King's Death. Directed by Ben Humphrey (17 October 2016)
A 12th-century depiction of Henry and Eleanor of Aquitaine holding court from an illuminated manuscript. Illumination adorning the Lancelot du Lac manuscript of Gautier Map, part two, La Quest du Saint Grail, la Mort d'Arthur, c.1301-1400. Held by the Bibliothèque nationale de France, French Manuscript 123, folio 229.
Detail from one of the Becket Leaves (BL Loan MS 88), possibly by Matthew Paris, showing Henry the Young King (13th century).
King Henry II of England and his children (before 1308). Held by the British Library (Royal 14 B VI)
Chronique de Saint-Denis (ou de France), The Coronation of Philip II of France; 14th Century (after 1332, before 1350). Held by the British Library (Royal 16 G VI f. 331).
Richard the Lionheart, Richard I of England, being anointed during his coronation in Westminster Abbey from a 13th-century chronicle by Matthew Paris: Chetham MS Ms 6712 (A.6.89), fol.141r.
Manuscript illumination from “Grandes Chroniques de France” depicting Richard I and Phillip II receiving the keys to Acre in 1191 (c.1375-1380). Held by the Bibliothèque nationale de France, département des Manuscrits, Français 2813, folio 238 verso.
Map the Angevin (Plantagenet) Empire across France and England during the 12th century. Created for Wikimedia by Amitchell125.
Photograph of the tomb effigy of Eleanor of Aquitaine in the church of Fontevraud Abbey. Taken by Adam Bishop (2011).
Holy Roman Emperor Henry VI grants a pardon to a pleading Richard I of England from Petrus de Ebulo, Liber ad honorem Augusti sive de rebus Siculis, fol 129, recto (circa 1196). Source: Gerd Althoff, Hans Werner Goetz, Ernst Schubert -- Menschen im Schatten der Kathedrale, Darmstadt: Primus Verlag 1998 S. 18 (Scan) ISBN 3-89678-090-5 (Burgerbibliothek Bern, Cod. 120.II, f. 129r aus der Handschrift Petrus de Ebulo, Liber ad honorem Augusti)
Portrait of King John of England (John Lackland) by Matthew Paris from his Historia Anglorum 1250-59. British Library Royal MS 14 C.VII, f.9 (detail).
Photograph of the tomb effigy of Isabella of Angoulême in the church of Fontevraud Abbey. Taken by UAltmann (2006)
Murder of Prince Arthur by Thomas Welly (1754). Engraving after The Death of Arthur painted by William Hamilton. Held by the National Galleries of Scotland.
Fresco depicting Pope Innocent III at the cloister Sacro Speco (c.1219).
King John of England hunting on horseback, 1167-1216. Illuminated manuscript, De Rege Johanne, 1300-1400. MS Cott. Claud DII, folio 116, British Library.
Arrival of Louis in England from Matthew Paris, Chronica Majora, II, fol. 46v (13th century).
Illumination showing the Coronation of King Henry III (13th century). Cotton Vitellius A. XIII.
Quoted texts:
Sobehrad, Lane. “Hating John: HOW ENGLISH CHRONICLERS PORTRAYED THE KING.” Medieval Warfare, vol. 7, no. 2, Karwansaray BV, 2017, pp. 12-15, www.jstor.org/....
Histoire de Guillaume le Maréchal (History of William Marshall) (13th century).
Also consulted:
The Oxford Dictionary of National Biography entries for the various individuals discussed in today’s video.

[@jackieheidorn5875]

I'm curious if John had been able to go to the Crusades; how would that have changed history? Killed? Hero status?

[@ReadingthePast]

I’m going to pin this because I think it’s a really interesting question and I like to see what you and others think. I’m inclined to say being out of the country during this period was a great way to have your kingship well remembered - always good to have regents to blame for the unpopular stuff 🤷🏻‍♀️

[@fabrisseterbrugghe8567]

John seemed to understand the importance of the administrative side of things which might have made him very useful in the Crusades.

[@rhiahlMT]

Seriously, I think the man was bi-polar with a bit of a baby of the family chip on his shoulder. Which, to me is understandable. Those Angevins were a rowdy lot. Imagine growing up with all those brothers, bold as can be in their time. To top it off, John from what I've studied, was a good administrator. Richard gets all the glory for his military prowess, but he cost the country a fortune. Which did not matter in that time of honor. Richard was the good king because of his military prowess (and being Eleanor of Aquitaine's favorite son in no way harmed him), John was the bad King. While we can look at it now and come to a lot of conclusions, I think John more or less earned the sentiment of bad King because he did not seem to be capable of reading the mood of his nobles in his time. History will keep writing things about the Kings and Queens of England, yet we cannot fathom the period of time in which he lived.

[@Sorcerers_Apprentice]

Depends on if he were put in charge of fighting, commanding or logistics. If the first two, would probably have ended badly for him (he was an average soldier and had horrible people skills), if the last one, would probably have been remembered well (he was very good at administration and law).

[@christina1wilson]

@@rhiahlMT He doesn't seem to have any military capability--so if he had gone in charge of a military group, it wouldn't have gone well. But I've also read elsewhere he had good organizational skills, so if he had been willing to be more of a quartermaster type maybe things would have gone well. (But considering his family, the time period, etc I don't see him being willing to not be in charge of a military unit).

[@lilibetp]

I terrified the cats laughing at your line about John throwing his toys out of the pram.

[@BJones-yw4dd]

LOL Yeah, I stopped and rewound to hear that again. Dunno if it's a typical "Britishism", but it was a delightful image.

[@mandymagnolia1966]

I’m seriously gonna need someone to animate that 🤣

[@TheWendybird123]

I too laughed out loud at that! Good line and what a way to describe a spoiled rotten brat!

[@ckcribbs8577]

Dr Kat, I would love to see a video from you about Eleanor of Aquitaine. Her relationships with her two husbands, her daughters, her sons, and especially how she took in her ex-husband's daughter to raise as a bride for Richard. I have always been intrigued by her influence and independence as a woman of that time.

[@everdinestenger1548]

That the BBC cast a black actress tot play Eleanor was very disappointing. No noblewoman of that period was black.

[@christopherstephenjenksbsg4944]

Excellent, and very interesting video! I couldn't help but think of "The Lion in Winter." (I adore Katherine Hepburn's portrayal of Eleanor of Aquitaine.) I know the play isn't history, but it certainly seems to have hit close to the mark so far as family dynamics are concerned.

[@grievousangelic]

I thought the same thing! "Lion" is one of my favorite movies, and yeah, even though it may be historically suspect in some areas, the writers hit the family conflict on the nose.

[@Babba08]

It's my favorite "Christmas" movie.

[@Bobrogers99]

If "The Lion in Winter" isn't history, it certainly could have been.

[@mattieb7348]

Agree! I plan to rewatch it after this. An excellent movie.

[@Terri_MacKay]

One of my favourite movies too, and what a fantastic cast!! I don't think it's considered a comedy, but there are lines in that film that have me in tears...like when Geoffrey calls John a "walking pustule". 🤣

[@elsie1742]

The best storyteller ever! Clear, succinct but thorough. As said before, the best!

[@davidcolin6519]

I think that, as usual, the lens of history creates some curious distortions. Richard "The Lionheart", who rarely even set foot in his kingdom (I have been told that he only actually spent 6 months in England throughout is reign) is treated with undiluted adoration. While John is depicted as money grabbing and faithless (I mean, who WASN'T among these generations of kings?). And yet Henry Tudor (Henry VII) was probably MORE avaricious, certainly more apt to ride roughshod over the population, far more duplicitous as well as usurping a crown that he had no real right to, but he is also treated with relatively kind appraisals, even though the majority of his brood were almost as unpleasant as he was.

[@jehannedarc1429]

I’ve done some research of my own and most of what “history” says about King John is blatantly false, and was written by his enemies, many of whom were angry power hungry barons with some strong motives. Even the Magna Carta isn’t really about what it’s made out to be. It’s a travesty the terrible reputation that was attached to him. He made some mistakes like everyone else, but he did many things right. This is a case of enemies writing history with plenty of distortions to go with it. And I find it rather curious that the homicidal Henry Vlll wasn’t called Bad King Henry.

[@aagold76]

so wonderfully portrayed by Nigel Terry in 'The Lion in Winter' 'My God, If I went up in flames, there wouldn't be a soul alive who'd pee on me...' to which Richard (Anthony Hopkins) replies, 'Let's strike up a flint and see...' pretty much sums John up. As Geoffrey (John Castle) says to John, 'If you're a prince, there's hope for every ape in Africa.'

[@KoalaKate]

I ADORE this channel! Have been binge-watching it. I would like to hear more about the women in his life: His 2 wives but mostly his mother, the awesome Eleanor of Aquitaine.

[@tinawantland398]

So…my husband’s last name is Wantland. There is a story that relates him to John “Lackland” and as the story goes, because the Irish very much resented John being made “Prince of Ireland”, they put a twist on his nickname, and instead of “Lackland” they called him “John Wantland”, and his illegitimate offspring were identified as “Wantland’s bastards”. Of course impossible to confirm, but my husband is of Irish descent, and allegedly a descendant of King John through one of those illegitimate offspring. Interesting!

[@ronaldstrange8981]

Quite superb. Brilliantly scripted and presented. Makes the subject so interesting. Thankyou so much.

[@themurrrr]

New subscriber here. So nice when youtube recommends you something you would ACTUALLY love to watch. Just wanted to say a quick hello and a warm thank you for making such interesting vids. Have only watched two of your vids, but I was riveted by the angle of your research… the many possibilities you presented… I am absolutely sold on everything you’re selling, eventho you leave me with more questions than I thought I could have 🤣 Looking forward to catching up on all your vids while doing the boring household chores. A big warm hug all the way from Curaçao ❤️

[@prettypic444]

you know john was his father's favorite- when his brothers rebelled, his father raised an army. when he rebelled, his father died! (no wonder the guy's in therapy)

[@walkerhjk]

Would you care to discuss the civil war between King Stephen and Empress Matilda, countess of Anjou in the 1130s please?

[@utuberhoda]

I love your work and think you are wonderful!

[@TheJennick13]

As a mother of 3 boys I've always wondered if a major factor in John's behavior could have been related to his being the youngest son, not to mention being the youngest child of the family? his older brothers were all slated to inherit titles, land, $$ & influence, he would've understood this from as soon as he was old enough to, which would probably have made him feel angry & jealous- I'm sure his older brothers would have teased him mercilessly & probably physically knocked him around a bunch while mocking him when would've thrown a frustrated tantrum, I've seen my own boys fuss & fight like that for years when they were growing up. John would've see his brothers being trained in the martial arts, seen their father King Henry probably interacting w them, maybe providing some instruction or insights into political life, so he would've felt even more resentment at not being included. Those feelings would grow & build up as years passed, one brother crowned king, another learning hands-on how to rule Aquitaine w their mother. I definitely can see how he would've turned out the way he did.

[@laurenpiantino8312]

Enthralling and fascinating depiction of someone I knew little about; King John. He certainly came across as a despicable individual. Thank you so much for enlightening upon a part of english history which had been, hitherto, unknown to me. :)

[@gamer2101]

I freaking loved Robin Hood by the way. Still the best Disney movie ever!!

[@ameliecarre4783]

I can't watch the jail scene and then the church scene without crying buckets.

[@christina1wilson]

Well, did John do anything "good"? Besides being so awful we got Magna Carta.

[@gloriamontgomery6900]

My sister can still recite A.A. Milne’s “King John” which is just irresistible

[@Lisa59]

What good things did John do before I comment on whether he deserves to be called Bad?

[@ravenrose7094]

This was a really great video. If anyone's curious about John's annulled first marriage, Isabella and John were both great-grandchildren of Henry I. They'd been given special permission to marry, providing they didn't have a sexual relationship because of how closely they were related. This meant no children. Once John became king, this obviously wasn't an option for him. Like most other kings, he wanted to be succeeded by his own son, so he needed a new wife.

[@MrsJohnsonListing]

I want to talk about the fact that in the Disney movie, half the cast was clearly American 😅 The sheriff of Nottingham being the most prominent example 😝 If they ever decide to reboot it, I want them to use classic animation but an all UK cast 😝

[@ChemGirlLiberal]

So Phillip offered his sister- the one previously betrothed to Richard, who had been cast off because she had been having an affair with Henry II- to John. And he had to be persuaded not to marry her. Gotta wonder if that marriage would have been considered legal in the end.

[@lucyosborne9239]

Can anyone say sociopathy?

[@susannemulholland4804]

I'm interested in Henry III. How much did "blood out'

[@karlkarlos3545]

I haven't seen any evidence that makes John any worse or better than most medieval Kings or even later monarchs such as the Tudors and Stuarts. So the term Bad King seems to be, yet again, a name coined by surviving enemies and rivals. If he had been victorious he would without doubt be known as Great King John.

[@jazzblue9005]

Very interesting. Given who John turned out to be, I've always wondered why Henry II favoured John! Best of a bad lot?? However, I think you have a good point.... a man who is intent on holding onto power will LOVE someone who has no chance of power of his own (for the time being at least).

[@JeannetteSolimine]

My introduction to John was from Disney's Robin Hood as well. John has always fascinated me as a really bad character, but I do feel for him a bit. He was the last child of Eleanor of Aquitaine and Henry II, and they were always fighting from John's early childhood. Eleanor spent most of John's childhood and teen years as Henry's prisoner. Can't have done much for his character development to see that. You mentioned William Marshall as Henry III's regent at the end of the video. If you haven't already, could you do a video about him? He's a fascinating man who served 5 kings, if you count Young King Henry. I'd love to learn more about him and hear your take on him.

[@emmacrooke807]

William Marshall is one of my dad's favourite historic figures

[@peteg475]

I always liked Simon Schama's pithy comment about King John: "By always presuming disloyalty, he virtually guaranteed it."

[@bridgethuggett5602]

Great, I thought it would be about how we all had misread John, but, a tually, no he was a self serving , highly unpleasant person who seems very immature, perhaps becuause of his father’s indulgence leaving John a spoilt brat

[@pricklypear7516]

Records of the time show that one of the most popular names for boy babies, John, became decidedly uncommon during and shortly after the reign of King John. I can't think of a more scathing indictment of a monarch!

[@revade6698]

Hi, Dr. Kat. Another triumph, as per usual. In watching your video, I couldn't help but be reminded of just how much poor parenting (in this case by King Henry II) often leads to disastrous results in / by / from the children. Anyway, I look forward to next week's installment. Until then, please take good care.

[@sarahwatts7152]

And it's repeated with Queen Victoria and with the Prince Regent and...

[@crossbowskiss]

Up until Princess Diana NO royalty has ever raised their own children..Prince phillip came close but was more of a play with Dad then a child rearer..

[@revade6698]

@@crossbowskiss Hi, Lori Ann. My point exactly. The same could also apply to any people - affluent or otherwise - who abdicate their parental responsibilities.

[@beth7935]

You know you're doing badly as a Mediaeval English king when your people want to replace you with a FRENCH king! :o X'D I only learnt about that embarrassingly recently, but I thought it was pretty damning. And I believe the interdict was a significant factor in people's hatred of him at the time, unsurprisingly. Overall, it seems like he was quite _fairly_ maligned!

[@herzkine]

as he basically was " french" himself its not that bad :-D

[@waldensiandescendant5866]

​@herzkine well actually not french south of france was not part of france back then and there was a completely different culture and language in south of france

[@willbleed550]

Or worse…a catholic

[@JonCrs10]

@willbleed550 that wasn't an issue yet. Still had another 300 years or so before the idea of Protestantism was even entertainable to most Europeans, let alone the English. And even then, England's reformation was near entirely political compared to the mainland that actually radically changed up theology. There's a reason the Anglican Ordinariate exists in the RCC but not, say, a Lutheran Ordinariate

[@catherinelawson9074]

The A.A. Milne poem was one of my favourites when I was a kid. "King John was not a good man/He had his little ways/And sometimes no one spoke to hm for days and days and days."

[@jenniferschillig3768]

"And oh, Father Christmas, my blessings on you fall/For giving him a big, red, India-rubber ball!"

[@gloriamontgomery6900]

Yes! My sister memorized the poem and would recite it with relish at family gatherings

[@starrywizdom]

That was my introduction to King John as well. Mr. Milne presents him with quite a bit of sympathy: King John was not a good man -- He had his little ways. And sometimes no one spoke to him For days and days and days. And men who came across him, When walking in the town, Gave him a supercilious stare, Or passed with noses in the air -- And bad King John stood dumbly there, Blushing beneath his crown.

[@pearlsaminger9544]

That has made me smile, I loved A.A Milne's books as a child . I completely forgot about that poem , strangely enough last week, I found myself thinking about . The King asked the Queen, and the Queen asked the dairy maid , Could we have some butter for the Royal slice of bread ? 😂🤣😁

[@gertsgarden]

Whoooooodaloody! Golly what a day! I first learned about King John the same way. I still find myself singing that song 40 years later. Thank you so much for great memories and new knowledge.

[@serendipity191]

Same! One of my favorites as a kid. Now I’m going to have the song stuck in my head for days though.

[@oohforf6375]

Sounds like there's a (sizeable) kernel of truth in those fables. He sounds like an exceedingly entitled and opportunistic rich kid who hated being told "No".

[@Sorcerers_Apprentice]

His other problems were that he has zero charisma, horrible people skills and even worse luck. The country was nearly bankrupted by Richard the Lionheart's ransom, so he needed to raise taxes, which is never popular. All his military campaigns ended in disaster, really bad for a Western European King in the Middle Ages. He was like Stannis Baratheon from Game of Thrones cranked up to 11 (except for the military skills).

[@sallyozuna3883]

A Donald Trump.

[@Sorcerers_Apprentice]

@@sallyozuna3883 John of England at least rode with his army.

[@ankhpom9296]

Donald trump sounds so similar like john.

[@littlebuglex]

Every video I'm astonished by the amount of preparation and research that must go into them. Can't thank you enough for the amount I've learned from this channel

[@janebaker966]

Really interesting. King John seems to at the least had a innate gift for acting with incompetence at every opportunity but without the sort of personal charm and charisma that lets some people get away with it. About 15 minutes walk from where I live is a high point from which you can see for miles over to the Severn vale and the hills of Wales in the far distance. The setting is now suburban but the view is still stunning (in my opinion). For centuries a wooden lodge stood here called King John's Hunting Lodge,there are these all over the country. The sort of historians who can study old manuscripts,pipe rolls,taxation scrolls etc have said that of all the Plantagenet Kings John spent the most time using this Hunting Lodge as shown by the records of food,fuel etc purchased. So maybe he spent more time hunting than practicing statecraft,seems like he did.

[@davidwright7193]

Well when John Lackland is at a hunting lodge he isn’t bankrupting his nobles through enforced hospitality and can carry on the affairs of state by signing letters and affixing seals to documents etc. You can’t do that when you are besieging Acre or rotting in a German prison cell while waiting for your younger brother to collect a ransom that will bankrupt the kingdom as Richard Coure de Leon did.

[@elagabalusrex390]

At least John spent his reign in England, as opposed to his brother Richard who was outside the kingdom for well over half his time as king.

[@ginadelfina5887]

I like this - "It would probably be quicker to list the people he didn't fall out with"! Right now I'm reading "Queens of the Crusades" by Alison Weir, which includes John's story from the point of view of the women in his life. I agree that King John's death - sadly - was actually quite timely. He died before he could pass on some of his more unpleasant qualities to his son, and his death caused the magnates to abandon their support for the French prince. The new King Henry III was also blessed in his guardian - William the Marshal, who ruled wisely during Henry's minority and didn't try to grab power for himself.

[@debbiewestlake3666]

Fascinating as always. Have you considered one about Richard I? I find it difficult to understand how he achieved such great acclaim when he was rarely in England and then - with Eleanor's help - bankrupted the country to pay his ransom. Or am I totally misguided on those points?

[@janebaker966]

Richard had charisma,that intangible,mysterious gift,the word actually means gift. In modern day parlance he was "hot",but of course also "cool". Whether he was actually gay or not,the debate goes on he was definitely more of a fighter than a lover,power and status must have been very important to him. And he lived in an age when successful fighters of the aristocratic kind got the highest status.

[@jimbazinet7172]

Richard gets the Crusader King, early death, and Robin Hood boosts. So he gets bonus points by the historians for being "christian" and saving Jerusalem, he gets bonus points for not living long enough to cause too much trouble, and he gets extra bonus points for being a literary legend!

[@prarieborn6458]

At his coronation he forbade jews and women to attend. It was said that he never consummated his marriage to the bride Eleanor had picked and brought to him.

[@ElliotOracle]

I love this channel so much. Would you be open to doing a video on the recently rediscovered wooden White Falcon badge of Anne Boleyn soon to return to Hampton Court? I know you would present an amazing backstory. Thanks for considering Dr. Kat!

[@mtngrl5859]

From the readings I've done of King John, the best I can say of him is that he seemed to care for all of his children whether they be legitimate or illegitimate. In addition, he seemed to be very attached to his wife Queen Isabella.

[@joplin.baby123]

We can thank him for the Magna Carta, although unwittingly. There's always a silver lining if you look for it.

[@Angelina14799]

I've always been fascinated by Eleanor of Aquitaine, and of her marriages and children. There's something about that period of history that really fires my imagination. This was a terrific video as always.

[@carmenpeters728]

He did get away with doing a lot of harm simply because he could. I don't find it all that much different from modern time s.

[@ladymeghenderson9337]

Kat, to put it point blank, John was a total rat bag.

[@annwilliams6438]

I don’t think any daddy king should name their son Arthur if they expect them to live long enough to sit on the throne!

[@Bethelaine1]

Richard was no great shakes, he spent large sums of money on the crusades, which he expected the country to pay for. He didn’t pay attention to the condition of the people of Britain. Of course, the people suffered under many kings, they were only important when they were needed. John may have been no worse than most.

[@Terri_MacKay]

I thought that Richard spent almost no time in England, despite bleeding the country dry to pay for his Crusades and his ransoms. I read once that he spoke French, and could barely speak English because he spent so little time in the country. If true, it would help to explain why Richard was considered a hero and John the villain. If Richard spent so much time out of England, it would be easy for his supporters to paint him as the Crusading hero, who was doing God's work...good King Richard, Richard the Lionheart. True, John seems pretty unpleasant and incompetent, but he was also left to do Richard's dirty work, i.e. endlessly collecting taxes to pay for Richard's Crusades. An interesting "what if"...how would Richard have been regarded by his subjects at the time, and by history, if he had spent more time in England and could be seen to be the one constantly demanding more taxes from his people?

[@nateb7638]

It certainly seems like the worst of John's reputation comes from writers who view the church as a good thing, not another tyrannical group in of itself

[@beanalupines5101]

My favorite movie as a child was "Lion In Winter" with Katherine Hepburn and Peter O'Toole. This story has always intrigued me.

[@dhoward8816]

I originally only knew about John from the movie "The Lion in Winter." Then I listened to the Marc Morris book "King John Treachery and Tyranny in Medieval England: The Road to Magna Carta" on Audible. However, I really enjoyed your telling about him. I learned a lot from this. Thanks for all you do.

[@eliscanfield3913]

He certainly deserves a bad reputation. Whether he's the *worst*? I don't know. He has competition.

[@janetregan2382]

Interesting to note there are no other King John's in Britain. Seems left out of the approved royal names list. I blame his father for a lot of his character flaws choosing favorites. Old King Henry started a lot of the land grabs and upsetting the "noble" order. Greed and power, a devilish mix. Thank you for a very interesting video.

[@jasperhorace7147]

George V and Queen Mary had a son named John.

[@stanlygirl5951]

@@jasperhorace7147 Is that the poor Johnnie who was youngest son who was epileptic, had learning disabilities and died while a young teen? I do believe he was never expected to become king at his birth, having several older brothers. Seeing his problems during his younger years and his early death probably helped keep his name off the list for heir and spare.

[@ankhpom9296]

Greed and power sound like the corporate monopolies and Trump.

[@janiced9960]

Well you have done a really good job of blackening John's name even more and the sad thing is that I have to agree with most of what you said. However, the whole era needs to be looked at in context. His moral character was hardly helped by the family he came from and if he was not a steadfast son, then neither were his brothers. The concept of primogeniture was not automatically accepted at the time so Arthur was not being swindled out of his inheritance. By all accounts Arthur was a nasty piece of work as evidenced by his treatment of his grandmother. It is claimed that he was very cruel- no doubt he was but other kings had been just as bad and are not singled out. Henry I's treatment of hostages was barbaric - and they were young children. More complaints about his taxation policies but it was Richard who had practically bankrupted the kingdom to pay for his wars and crusade; he is quoted as saying that he would have sold London if he could find a buyer. And then there was his ransom. He was captured by Leopold of Austria as a result of some very shady dealings he was involved with in Palestine. Sorry I can't remember the details but it involved an assassination. Richard had the good fortune to be a good general which John was not but it meant that he was assailed on all sides. So - he divorced his first wife to marry Isabella of Angouleme but because of the political situation at the time he was dammed if he did and dammed if he didn't and I wish I could remember all the details now. but perhaps its just as well that I can't I strongly believe that a lot of John's problems with his barons arose partly from the fact that for the 10 years of his reign Richard was only in England for about six months and as for returning home to save his people, well sod that for a game of soldiers. John tried to be a good king, the fact that he failed does not negate the effort. He did instigate a good many reforms of the legal system and instituted the system of the Rolls. He also provided free grain for the poor during a time of famine which no one else seems to remember. So he didn't trust his barons; he was probably right, they were unused to a king who was always looking over their shoulders and as for Magna Carta, it was a load of rubbish and totally unworkable. Its significance lay in the fact that for the first time the king could be held accountable and could not do whatever he liked. The only clause from the 1215 version of Magna Carta still on the statute books relates to fish weirs on the Medway. I also take issue with the claim that most of the important barons had sided with Louis - William Marshall hadn't and if he hadn't then I should imagine that his lead would have carried a lot of weight I'm not trying to whitewash John; not even Daz could do that but I do feel he is pilloried for many things of which many other kings were guilty and I get tired of the finger always pointing at John. Sorry for my rant and I do enjoy your videos

[@jessk6081]

I wonder if John had been allowed to go on crusade, and/0r spent more time with his brothers/mother then his father, if that would have changed his personality and Kingship style. It just seems he tried to be as much like his father as he could be.

[@Isrjisoneavalable]

I just have the Disney song “the phony king of England” playing in my head.

[@ReadingthePast]

I wish I could say that passes, but it’s been stuck in my head since I started working on this one 🤣

[@BeantownMrs]

I know what I’ll be watching this weekend 🦁👑

[@kayfountain6261]

@@ReadingthePast you could change to Maddie Prior's John instead sung from his mother's perspective.

[@paulmclaughlin4092]

It's revealing that there has never been another British Monarch calledJohn since.....

[@thatswhatisaid8908]

Just as there was never another Richard, after the third. I think he would have been a great king, had he lived, unlike John.

[@betslirette2001]

No more Richards, either, after RIII.

[@betslirette2001]

Agreed

[@lauramason5667]

As there hasn’t been a Richard since Richard III!

[@kellyhenderson9972]

I’m really curious about medieval illustrations . Everyone always looked like a cartoon character. . I wonder if that was the fashion to draw caricatures ? I’d like some history on that.

[@lucindalavelle4246]

I don't think k they had discovered perspective at this time

[@thescarletgraywitch8052]

Also: Arthur seems like a cursed name for the Kings to name their heirs in England. I always wonder, if there'd been another King Arthur, how it would have effected the resultant writings and mythology of King Arthur.

[@JonCrs10]

Maybe its like how even when Pope John II instituted the papal name tradition (Mercurius didnt like the idea of being a Pope with a heathen god's name), absolutely none of the successive popes would dare consider calling themselves Pope Peter II. Except with the papacy having less fragmented primary sources compared to whoever the historical Arthur was.

[@thescarletgraywitch8052]

@JonCrs10 possibly, but there were actual Arthurs who were heirs to the crown, and all died before they could ever assume the throne. Richard the Lionheart named his nephew Arthur to succeed him, and when Jihn took the throne, it wasn't too much longer before his nephew was killed by John in a prison. Henry VIII older brother was also named Arthur, but died as well. On a side note, it's always been so over the top to me that Popes chose the name Innocent. I mean, come on no one assuming St. Peter's throne back then was innocent. 😂

[@pat412pear]

I find it interesting that leaders were so forgiving of their former foes. H2 forgave his kids (but not his wife), they fought but forgave each other. Philip kept raising up whack-a-mole style whenever comflict was brewing, seeming without punishment. Pope Innocent was either a sworn enemy or an accomplice depending on the day. John's death did seem to clear the chessboard so to speak - so everyone could reset. In this Game of Thrones you could lose without dying.

[@kathyastrom1315]

When I told my dad that I had found out that King John was his 24th great grandfather, he got the best “Really? Him??” look. I was more into the fact that Eleanor was my 26th great grandmother-I first learned about her in my British History class in college, and think that she was one of the two most interesting woman to come out of medieval England (the other is Margaret Beaufort, who was the stepdaughter of my 17th great grandfather).

[@dewrock2622]

You are actual royalty...

[@traceywilliams944]

are you posh Kathy?

[@ameliecarre4783]

Ah yes, the highlight of every comment section of every history channel : people who absolutely must mention they descend from somebody famous as soon as that somebody is mentioned in a conversation. That's exactly why I come here.

[@ameliecarre4783]

No she's actually not.

[@lilibetp]

We may be related...

[@DipityS]

He doesn't appear to have had the best upbringing. With what we now know of childhood abuse and the consequences to the adult's psyche - perhaps all these kings and queens couldn't be anything but raging sociopaths without the ability for empathy and constantly in a zero sum game where anyone else getting anything took something from them - even their kiddies. Because, no, quite honestly, this John wasn't the sort of fellow you could like.

[@nicoleachilles8765]

I think with John the reputation is determined by success or lack of it. His early adult years don't seem to be too different from Henry I... stuck between a controlling father and rebelling brothers, depending on the brother, insecure of his position but with as much ambition as the older one... even the strive with the barons is nothing new. Only the outcome makes the difference.

[@charlesmcdermott6139]

I can’t imagine anyone finding John to be a good king. He presages the chaos wrought by Donald Trump!!u

[@ankhpom9296]

Much of the description of john is no different than of Donald Trump.

[@breeinatree4811]

I wonder if John's taxation would have been so heavy if Richard hadn't emptied the royal coffers funding his crusades.

[@morriganwitch]

He reminds me of a certain politician xxx

[@ankhpom9296]

Would that person be trump?

[@edpe64]

He seems to have had rather a thin skin with his continual fallings out with various persons. Perhaps as he was the fourth son it was never anticipated that he would become the King of England despite his father's favouritism. As such perhaps he was never schooled in matters of Kingly behaviour and he never really learned where to place his trust. Ad his father's favourite he was probably spoiled or at least always expectant of the best for himself to the detriment of others. Nevertheless as a result of his kingship we have the Magna Carta though subject to several changes through the years. This document forms part of the unwritten British constitution and us held in great reverence by American lawyers who paid for the monument at Runnymede.

[@texaskatydid1081]

My favorite history trivia question is "What happened to evil Prince John from the Robin Hood stories?" Answer: He became the King John whose nobles forced him to sign the Magna Carta.

[@rebeccaabram2312]

I now have "The Phoney King of England" stuck in my head. Thank you...

[@dkirk5814]

Always enjoy your impartial and well structured essays.

[@conmckfly]

The story of John left me exhausted! 😅 He was a busy guy. Really interesting bit of history. Thank you Dr. Kat.

[@OnomatopoeiaOlly]

Love your videos, keep up the wonderful work!

[@lilibetp]

He's my 22nd-great-grandfather, so I try really hard to think of him as just incompetent and not actually evil...

[@Terri_MacKay]

Several people in the comments have John in their family tree. It's interesting how you all have a different attitude towards that relationship.

[@lilibetp]

@@Terri_MacKay LOL I actually noticed that myself.

[@joshuddin897]

Bravo. You must be proud. What an achievement!!!

[@lilibetp]

@@joshuddin897 the denial runs strong in my family.

[@herzkine]

Well as so many people all across comments in videos about john claim to be desendant from hom it looks like he did one thing rather successful.

[@bigm9228]

This was great. You quoted someone who described hell as being even more vile with John in it. I think that says everything.

[@franm.8343]

His tomb is in Worcester Cathedral, as is Prince Arthur Tudor, Prince of Wales.

[@vickiibendit943]

King John has always fascinated me. Was the the horrible person he’s portrayed as behind? Or is history being “written by the victors?” I have no idea, but the things is known to have done, and the things he is suspected of doing is a list that is longer than most care to scrutinize. I really enjoyed this particular segment! English history has always entranced me and I love visiting England. I’ve done research into my most prominent English line, the Sutton line of Dudley’s. Before his death 6 years ago I convinced my 88 yr old father into taking a DNA test which verified we are from the Sutton line. I’ve been able to trace the line back to 980. Whew!

[@tukicat1399]

At least Richard III was a decent king...

[@Disturbinglywick993]

If he won in bosworth he would done good work certainly from an administration point he was good he was too reckless he probably would have still won at bosworth if he held back

[@TheMogregory]

Dr Kat Please demonstrate how all Europeans are descended from Charlemagne and any other person, famous or obscure, from that time. As it's a numbers game, each person's ancestors increase exponentially as they are traced back in time until they are a multiple of Charlemagne's contemporary population. Therefore we share ancestors. You could demonstrate this more clearly than I. It must be exciting for those interested in their genealogy to be able to document this link but it should be remembered that the link is shared with the majority of the current population of European descent.

[@ameliecarre4783]

I second that. Yes please. A thousand pleases with cherries and sprinkles on top. Thank you so much for making this suggestion.

[@TheMogregory]

@@ameliecarre4783 ooh yes, sprinkles. It's a poorly understood topic and so is the terminology. For e.g. describing oneself as the direct descendent of a childless person. Also tracing descent through the male line comes with its inherent uncertainties. ;-)

[@janebaker966]

Yes we all are descendants but don't all know it. It is inevitable because the generations spread out and out

[@baladilady]

Im always happy to share that John is my 22nd great grandfather.

[@joshuddin897]

Bravo. You must be proud. What an achievement!!!

[@baladilady]

@@joshuddin897 Absolutely. It was very clever of me.

[@renae9365]

Prince John sounds like Prince Harry. Coward, self soothing, jealous of his brother, throws his toys, wants everything to go his way, greedy, conflict everywhere….

[@carolinecarruthers7415]

This is fab! I'm going to teach Y7 about King John next week, this is the perfect refresher!

[@klatie256]

Ah my many times great grandfather!! When I found out the Royal connection was through him I have to say I felt disappointed 😂 but I’ll take it for Eleanore of Acquitane, what a woman

[@thrillergirl021]

I’m a little disappointed you didn’t mention how Alienor d’Aquitaine never showed any interest in raising John, unlike her other sons. She left him to be raised by a religious order, the very same order whose land he later confiscated. Interesting, no? Given his attitude and his action, it is speculated that John might’ve been an atheist. Some people go further and speculate that he might’ve been abused as a child by the clerics. He seemed to suffer from depression most of his adult life and acknowledged his own military shortcomings. He was often stuck between a rock and a hard place. His nobles refused to assist him and fight to retain their French domaines, then blamed him for losing them. I’m not saying he was a good king, but there are nuances to his failures, which still makes his fascinating.

[@thesunrising4982]

Some vocabulary for my students: Enraged by sth Seems pretty evident Might be worth remembering To pile all of gifts on sb Malleable - malleability Abdicate

[@happygrandma5637]

I'm coming a little late to this party but am hoping I'll find an answer to a question that has been nagging me for a long while. When the Magna Carta was signed it seems that Barons were the most powerful. Now, however, a list of the hierarchy of British nobility barons are rated last. Was that 'on purpose'? How did they lose their power? And how did Dukes (not royal), Marquesses, Earls and Viscounts get ahead of Barons. Why weren't Barons first and the rest under them?

[@johnny196775]

Richard's greed and lack of care for the crown of England should have been mentioned. The financial strain his involvement in the crusade caused most of John's actions. I don't think this was a very original or sophisticated analysis. Also, his antagonism between himself and the church was largely caused by his time studying for the clergy. I think it would have been more fair to mention that as well.

[@gordonmather5941]

Great summary of John. It is striking that all attempts to rehabilitate his reputation have failed & that John was indeed one of the worst kings of England. That said, John has certainly been the object of relentless waves of often inflammatory defamation over the centuries. There's no question that his failures and defeats outweighed his successes and victories, but he nonetheless did show occasionally the capacity to fulfill the role of a medieval king and not all his reverses were the result of his character flaws.

[@flygirlfly]

Rubbish? Well certainly a flip-flopping weasel. His character is quite similar to modern day politicians 🤔

[@johnguglielmini6658]

thanksfor doing this did not expect it to happen so fast

[@SeGG8791]

I find it sort of funny that King John was such an awful king that he's the reason we have the Magna Carta, and the impact that document had on the future of not only the monarchy but government itself. Like, how different would the world be if he was an "average" King?

[@downtime86stars17]

John's got a 'bad' reputation...but Richard really wasn't all that 'good.'

[@suemulvihill]

Another enlightrning piece. Thank you. Would you consider William Marshall as a topic for your interesting talks.?

[@PandaBear62573]

My view of King John is he was such a bad king that there have been no other king's named John. A couple of years ago I read The Plantagenents by Dan Jones and it gives a pretty thorough explanation of all of John's horrible rule.

[@janetgraham-russell4476]

Does anyone else cast Emma Thompson as Eleanor of Acquitaine?

[@patrickshaneomarra5162]

I think he was a legit king, however, he may have had a nand in paving his way up the ladder.

[@helenangus1675]

Wow! Love this episode King John sure was not a happy chappy ever.

[@catharinehamilton6244]

If you’re interested in King John, an absolute must read is Sharon Kay Penman’s “Here Be Dragons”! It doesn’t vindictive him but makes his decisions understandable.

[@tfSmudge]

Amazingly told Dr Kat. English history is our blessing, however brutal or disappointing. Thanks for enlightening 😉 🇬🇧 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿 🇬🇧

[@AMVactivists]

The king who annoyed the barrons enough that they invented the rule of law

[@susanhepburn6040]

Thank you for a very informative and well-balanced view of John. Personally, yes, I think he deserved the epithet 'bad.' I wouldn't trust him as far as I could spit!

[@NimLeeGuy]

Sounds like Henry II was very rubbish

[@anastasiabosakowski8651]

I love this video! I've always wondered if John was as bad as he's always been depicted. Looks like he was - and worse! Thanks for you research.