Lathe Collet Attachments - South Bend Model A Lathe

[@joeambartsumyan7259]

Thanks for help. I finished making it a little while ago. Decided to skip the bolt at the end of the coupling nut. I’m sure a mallet won’t damage it. Pinned the coupling nut by drilling a hole through it and the all thread, then gluing the back end of that very drill bit into the hole using red loctite. Worked like a charm. I didn’t have any round stock to make the bushing out of so I got a 3/4” (largest they sell) bolt from Home Depot and machined it out of the hex head of the bolt. Worked out perfectly. I now have a collet system on my lathe. Thanks again!!!!

[@BasementMachinist]

+Joe Ambartsumyan You are very welcome. Glad it worked out for you. The bolt on the end of the coupling nut was an added feature I put on because before I got a plastic dead blow I was using a brass hammer. I doubt the brass Hammer would damage the coupling nut either but it was just added protection.

[@mikewalsh9812]

I just got the Beall adapter for my 10K and it looks good. Can’t wait till collets get here to check it out. I like being able to pass stock through the spindle

[@georgechambers3197]

Good choice on collets. I've used them for some time now, the MT3's fit 3 of my lathes headstocks. Makes it nice for whichever lathe is in use. Thanks for the video.

[@BUILDNIGHT]

Another nice option is a Hardinge Sjogren 5C Speed Chuck. I have one and Highly recommend it for a South Bend 9” lathe.

[@BasementMachinist]

Those are very nice. I have used them before, but they can be pricey.

[@davidcudzilo6924]

Thanks for the quick reply, I went to the vintage machine shop web page to look up the specs. I got the spec for the SB9 A form Catalog No. 46-B page 9 date of catalog is Jan, 1939. The spec state that the head stock and tail stock are MT2.

[@johnunderwood3132]

I have a 1937 9”c

[@johnstrange6799]

This really helped me get my head around about 90% of the collet mystery. I'm still unsure on a few things, but also now sure of many others. Thank you.

[@BasementMachinist]

+John Strange I'm glad it cleared up a few things for you. Let me know if you have any questions.

[@johnstrange6799]

Thanks, and Happy Thanksgiving btw. What I am still in the dark is 1. The Nomenclature/sizing. What is the difference between E and C collets, and how do the numbers come into play? 2. I need to determine what spindle taper size my lathe has.

[@BasementMachinist]

Happy Thanksgiving to you as well. There are many types of collets and we could probably talk for hours about them, but here are a few pointers. E collets are also known as ER collets. These types of collets use a nut to push the collet into the closing taper. These collets are generally used for tool holding but can also be used for work holding. ER collets have a pretty wide clamping range, +0/-.039". Meaning, a .500" ER collet has a clamping range of .461" - .500". C collets are used primarily for work holding. I believe they were developed by Hardinge, but don't quote me on that. These collets use a draw bar to pull the collet into the closing taper. The clamping range of the C collets is pretty narrow, +0/-.005". This requires the work piece to be pretty close to the collet size. The number that goes along with the ER collets denotes the size of the cavity opening. The cavity is what the collet fits into. ER32 collets use a 32mm cavity opening. The number that goes along with C collets is along those same lines. Although I'm not exactly sure what the number represents other than physical size of the collet. 3C collets are smaller in size than 5C collets. Hope this helps. What type of lathe do you have. Maybe I can help determine the spindle taper.

[@johnstrange6799]

Ahh, I see. it actually makes sense now that it makes sense. Thank you. I have a 13" South Bend. I've read that it takes a proprietary taper, but at the time the veil on collects in general which you just lifted was still in place, so a proprietary taper was just another color of my uninformed confusion. I'll have to research it now that I have a better handle on things. Thank you again. I really appreciate each little bit of understanding and knowledge. In the big picture these little elements add up. :)

[@BasementMachinist]

South Bend made two versions of the 13" lathe. Each one had a different spindle taper. The small bore uses a MT4 taper and the large bore is South Bends proprietary taper. To figure out which you have just measure the spindle bore. The small bore spindle is 1" and the large bore is 1.406".

[@anthonycash4609]

Thanks so much for the information I spent the better part of the day looking a barrel nut to weld to my draw bar with no luck. I will research this information and go this route. Thanks for the speedy reply.

[@machiningbasics1729]

Very nice video I have a mill and often just for small work use the taper collets in the lathe . My lathe is an import so setting up the 5c collet chuck is faf for small work so even if you have a collet chuck taper collets are still great

[@BasementMachinist]

I agree, for quick little jobs taper collets are the way to go. Sometimes I have found myself doing a job where I have to switch between the 3 jaw and collets several times and using the taper collets are much easier and faster.

[@davidcudzilo6924]

I think you are correct about the MT collets that fit the SB9 A. should be MT3 collets. I am just concern that all the spec I have come across for the SB9. States that the SB9 A are equipped with a MT2 headstock and tailstock. If you could shed some light on this issue that would be great. Thanks again for the informative machinist youtube channel. I like your format.

[@BasementMachinist]

I put this reply in one of your other comments, I'll put it here too. If you are referring to the specs at the bottom of the page, that is for what type of center to use, for when you are turning between centers. You use a MT2 center along with an adapter to fit the MT3 spindle. On that same page, there is a paragraph called "Headstock Spindle." In that paragraph it states that the spindle is MT3. The reason for using an MT2 center with an adapter is so that the center sticks out further from the spindle. This makes room for the lathe dog to engage the dog plate.

[@davidcudzilo6924]

Thanks again for the quick response. Plus clearing up this issues!

[@BasementMachinist]

No problem, happy to help.

[@thesmallengineguy6924]

I actually bought a SB9 for $1000 and then sold the lathe just to get the collet attachments with it lol. It was worth it but this looks like a good option as well. Great video.

[@BasementMachinist]

I did the same thing. I bought a Model B that has a lever type collet attachment, however, it isn't actually made for the lathe. One of the previous owners modified the lathe to make the attachment fit. I'm not doing that to my near perfect Model A. It was a loss, but a small one. I didn't pay very much for the Model B.

[@Jordan-jx6zc]

I have same southbend. Just wondering a ball park price if I was trying to sell.? Condition is good. Also have a extra motor and everything is there no parts missing. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thank you

[@josephlovell6951]

mt 2 is also what you use in the tail stock on a sb9 the head stock is mt3

[@anthonycash4609]

Very good video and informative. I have a 9" South Ben lathe that I recently acquired that came with a draw bar but no collets I have purchased a full set of 3C collets to use with it but I am finding out that the draw bar threads are not in that good of shape. Would you know what size threads the 3C collets have on them. My gold is to either repair the old draw bar or make another one. I have researched it with no luck on finding the thread size. I can only assume that it is standard threads due to its age. I can also tell that they are fine threads on the 3C collets. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks for your time and good video.

[@BasementMachinist]

The threads are an odd ball. The Hardinge catalog says they are .640-26. Making one yourself is doable but you may want to check out Little Machine Shop. They sell a universal draw bar that you will cut to length. That will eventually be the route I go when the time comes. littlemachineshop.com/products/product_category.php?category=-195207565

[@anthonycash4609]

A month ago you helped me very generously on my draw bar for my South Ben, sense then I purchased the draw bar from the web page you gave me and cut it down to size and it works just great. Thanks so much for that. As I said in my conversation with you a month ago I am just a hobbyist at it and by no means am I a machinist. In learning more about it I have discovered that I have some backlash in the cross slide nut , and it is above me to be able to cut the threads of that type to make a new one. Would you know of a place where I could purchase a cross slide nut for a 9" South Ben. Thanks for any help I might be able to get.

[@BasementMachinist]

Awesome, I'm glad the draw bar worked out for you. I'm still planning on getting one myself at some point. For the cross slide nut, there are several on ebay for around $40. www.ebay.com/bhp/south-bend-cross-feed

[@anthonycash4609]

I looked up the draw bar you recommended and this does look like the best way to go. I did read that you cut the draw bar to your length. Does the draw bar tube have threads deep enough into it to cut off to fit a South Ben 9" lathe or does the draw bar handle come off and you cut that end of it and reinstall the handle. I was just concerned about the length once it was cut if you had to cut the end with threads in it would there still be enough threads left to tighten the collet.

[@BasementMachinist]

+Anthony The hand wheel comes off. I believe it is pinned in place.

[@anthonycash4609]

Thank you for all your help on the draw bar. I ordered it today from the link you gave me. Will let you know how it turns out once it gets here.

[@BasementMachinist]

+Anthony Awesome. I believe it comes with the 3C adapter as well. You'll have a spare.

[@BasementMachinist]

Well I finally bit the bullet. I ordered the draw tube and a set of collets. The 3MT collets work well but I would like to have the 3C. Being that my Barker PM mill uses 3C collets as well it only makes sense.

[@anthonycash4609]

Good deal. I hope yours works as well as mine does. I sure do not regret getting it. I made a new hand wheel for mine out of billet aluminum and put groves in it to better fit the hand and tighten.

[@lacaver64]

Ive a mt4 in my sheldon lathe ,but wath is better a direct collet ,or a er32 collet head?

[@BasementMachinist]

Sorry I missed your comment and sorry for the late replay. In my opinion using a direct collet is always better. There is less stick out which helps with rigidity. However, there is a larger range of material sizes you can hold with an ER collet. With an MT4 the largest size is .750 inches. An ER32 I believe will handle 1.125 inches, I think... With the right ER32 attachment you can also have complete pass through of the spindle which MT4 collets can not do. Bottom line is there are advantages and disadvantages to both. You will just need to think about the projects you do and how you plan on using your collet system before making your final selection.

[@anthonycash4609]

I think you might have already answered my question , I was reading the comment section where you was helping another gentleman on collects and you gave him a link to Miller Machine and Fabrication, it looks like they might be able to help me with the cross slide nut. In looking into this would it be better to buy screw and nut rather than just the brass nut ? I can only assume that the brass nut would be the worn out part but not sure how to tell if the screw has wear on it.

[@BasementMachinist]

There are several sellers on ebay that have these nuts. I would start there because having one custom made will get expensive. When you pull the cross slide off inspect the screw for wear, chances are there is some wear but it may not be enough to worry about. I personally would probably start with just the nut and then the screw later on if needed. www.ebay.com/bhp/south-bend-cross-feed

[@anthonycash4609]

Thanks again for all your help. You've been a wealth of knowledge. I was able to order the compound and cross-slide nut , new and at a good price. I'm sure this will take most of the backlash out of the lathe. Being new at it and shy about buying things that I am not 100% sure of , has been very nice having someone like yourself to ask first. Thanks again and I hope one day I can repay all the kindness you've have shown me.

[@BasementMachinist]

You're welcome, no problem at all. Just glad I could help.

[@davidcudzilo6924]

Nice vid and channel, I have a question concerning the MT3 collets for your SB 9A. I also have a SB 9A and would like to get a collet set up for it. I am going to purchase a set of MT collets. My question is should I purchase MT3 collets or MT2 collets. The spec for the SB9 A states that the head stock is MT2?

[@BasementMachinist]

Thank you David. The spindle taper is MT3. I'm guessing the spec you read may have been for the tail stock, which is an MT2.

[@Homeshop54]

Thank you for that video! I have a sb9 and plan on using your setup. I have one question...it’s the thread protector need for expanding support? Or just protection for the threads? Also did you make that nut?

[@JourneymanRandy]

Hi , maybe you can help me. I just bought a South Bend Model C 9 inch lathe and I'm missing the rack and all the info out there does not metion dimetral pitch. without this info I can't get a new rack. Thanks.

[@BasementMachinist]

I'll measure mine and let you know.

[@BasementMachinist]

I'm going to assume that the Model A and Model C use the same rack. I'm not 100% sure if they do or do not. The spur gear has a DP of 14. This mean that the rack pitch would be Pi/14 = 3.14/14 = .2243 inches. That is the distance between teeth.

[@JourneymanRandy]

You have been very helpful. This is the begining of a long restoration. I din't get much but I just bought a 9 inch SB. I plan to make an effort to get her back to working order without going broke. Thanks. I bought a chinesse 5C collet chuck and I'm very happy with it. Around $200 with backing plate ship and all.

[@BasementMachinist]

Good luck with the rebuild. Let me know if you have any other questions. I'll do my best to find answers. That isn't a bad deal for the collet chuck. Typically that combo is well over $300.

[@JourneymanRandy]

Thank for the offer. I plan on asking. Check CDCO tools. www.cdcotools.com This is the place I ordered my 5C collet chuck and 32 collets.

[@miguelcastaneda7236]

atlas/ chraftsman are also clausing..check e bay on that collet chuck can find with partialy finished plate under 200$ other parts my little machine shop in pasadena ..foreign supply well tarriffs...thanks orange guy

[@joeambartsumyan7259]

What length is the all thread cut to? Great video BTW?

[@BasementMachinist]

+Joe Ambartsumyan The threaded rod is cut to around 11.5 inches. Thank you for the sub.

[@joeambartsumyan7259]

Basement Machinist thanks for the prompt reply. Is that 11.5” total length or 11.5 just sticking out of the coupler nut?

[@BasementMachinist]

+Joe Ambartsumyan That is the length of the threaded rod without the coupling nut on it.

[@joeambartsumyan7259]

Basement Machinist thank you! That’s big help!

[@DimaProk]

Too bad my South Bend 10" doesn't have MT3 taper in the spindle.

[@kenzpenz]

Hello, I must have missed it, but what kind of colletts are you using here with this holder. I heard ER collets . Must be getting late so bear with me. I have a 3C collett setup with several colletts. Did you buy that holder, or make it . Awhile back I purchased a 5C setup to use in a bench vise. Thanks .....Ken

[@BasementMachinist]

Hello Ken, I am using Morse Taper 3 collets in the lathe for the time being. However, I do plan on upgrading to 3C collets in the near future, being the little horizontal mill I acquired uses 3C collets, it only makes sense.

[@jackwalsh7549]

Why did you not address 5C collets?

[@BasementMachinist]

Good question. Simple answer, 5c collets do not fit the south bend model a.

[@jimm2442]

Excellent Video! Thank you very much I am now a subscriber.

[@BasementMachinist]

You are welcome, and thank you! I hope to get back to making more videos soon.

[@davidcudzilo6924]

Attached is the link to the SB catalog No. 46-B vintagemachinery.org/pubs/1617/16459.pdf

[@BasementMachinist]

If you are referring to the specs at the bottom of the page, that is for what type of center to use, for when you are turning between centers. You use a MT2 center along with an adapter to fit the MT3 spindle. On that same page, there is a paragraph called "Headstock Spindle." In that paragraph it states that the spindle is MT3.

[@adilsonjr5705]

Interessante!🤔

[@dougguynn2622]

enjoyed

[@jma8352]

so i have a model c not quick change but i got a box of gears with it. same process right? Thank you!