Tony Ordered A New BMW M2! Options & Costs Revealed [S6, E12]

[@evanvolk5996]

Sam - As a certified Porsche technician, my #1 piece of advice for reliability on your 992 GT3 is DO NOT have an oil change performed with the engine hot. Drop the car off for service the night before so the oil is relatively cool when it's drained. The new GT3 engine uses a plastic oil tank and there is an issue where the threads for the drain can get ruined if you try to remove the drain plug when the oil is hot. If the threads on the tank get ruined, the engine has to come out to replace the oil tank. Porsche has a document out about it, and I've unfortunately already seen it happen (customer had oil change done at another shop)

[@carlfrederick8433]

Do you understand why the 991 GT3 had 3 drain plugs to remove for an oil change, but the 992 GT3 has the 3 drain plugs in the same locations, but only 2 plugs get removed? Also on the 992 GT3 only around 4 quarts of oil normally gets removed on an oil change, instead of around 8 quarts on the 991 GT3. Do you understand the reasons behind the change from 991 to 992?

[@evanvolk5996]

@@carlfrederick8433 If you are following the factory workshop manual you only remove 2 drain plugs for both the 991 and 992. Which 2 you remove on a 991 depend on if it's a 991.1 991.2 The 4 liters of oil that drain out of the 992 engine is certainly a big change. We measured the amount we drained out of the first 992 GT3 we worked on to make sure the service specs weren't incorrect. My guess would be that they wanted to run a smaller oil tank on the 992. They did the same thing when they moved from 997 to 991 (designed it with a smaller oil tank). Likely for space and weight savings. My best guess with the 992 is that you only get 4ish litres out because it's got a small oil tank and the rest stays in cooler assemblies, oil passages, etc.

[@GordonGreenCincinnati]

That seems CRAZY Porsche would make a engineering failure like this to save weight.

[@fortissimolaud]

It's absolutely a tyre thing, you need winters or at least all weathers for snow. Summer tyres just aren't built for snow it's a hazard. I like watching the Tyre Reviews youtube channel

[@SH7SH7SH7]

Why do range rovers handle any conditions with normal tyres then

[@adam69_]

@@SH7SH7SH7 trucks and SUVs tend to have all season tires which are not great/not terrible in all conditions, but the performance summer tires will definitely suck during winter, even the twisted UK version of it. It’s not only about snow and ice, it’s also about temperature. Winter tires are made of a different, much softer rubber. The regular P Zeros would become hard, plastic-like if you used them below 5°C.

[@GreenSpartan122]

The RS6 in the snow is definitely a tyre issue. We have snow and as low as -11 degrees here in Denmark right now and my little Up GTI on winter tyres has had no issue getting around on snow covered roads. The RS6 (especially with it's quattro system) would be fine on the right tyres. CarWow have done some good comparisons on winter vs. summer tyres, the difference in traction is huge in snowy conditions.

[@Kxji]

When Tony told Sam he's going to ruin the car for putting Pirelli's 🤣

[@Chrissy-H]

The zoom in on his face is 👌

[@christophebrou1178]

Sam,as an Austrian,we have a winter tires compulsory until April,so you definitely need winter tires in your Gt3 if you want to enjoy our mountain Passes! Greetings from Vienna!!

[@daggidding4478]

That is correct. This also is the case in Germany and Switzerland and northern Italy, Dolomites

[@JoaoBorgesSr]

The same here in Sweden.

[@Swixperience]

I live in Switzerland and hearing you two expect to go anywhere uphill on snow without proper tyres is hilarious. It somehow explains the chaos on our mountains roads whenever snow comes. Usually lots of Yellow & Dutch plates stuck. :-)

[@helmetculture]

Mate I repeat DO NOT attempt to drive that car with delivery tyres in even 1CM of snow. You'll literally not be able to move. We've already had two binned because of it. I would highly recommend the winter tyre

[@andrewhurstcars]

Yes Sam I would get a set of winter tyres for your GT3 - you’d be mad to risk a £170k car driving round on winter roads on summer P Zero tyres in the U.K. As for abroad, winter tyres are mandatory in countries such as Austria from 1st November to 15th April, and with minimum 4mm tread. Calling P Zero “all season ish” at 4:24 is simply not true, it is very much a summer tyre. Also yes Land Rovers are fitted with ‘all season’ tyres as standard, so of course they will be better than an RS6 on summer tyres, but they do not have the 3 peak mountain snowflake symbol, so still won’t be as good as dedicated winter tyres. Note the dedicated all season road car tyres such as the Michelin CrossClimate 2 do have the 3PMSF, so are classed as a full winter tyre.

[@benpenagonzales6014]

I can highly recommend Michelin cross climate for year round use

[@GazMoby]

Just as I set my bottom down and lift my phone for lunch this gem lands 💪. Must be Thursday.

[@snakewad123]

Yep at work eating a microwave lasagne watching tha pod :)

[@GazMoby]

@@snakewad123 this show helps digestion I find 😁

[@snakewad123]

@@GazMoby I'm 29 had the same Renault clio since I was 16. After years of watching stg , I'm finally about to buy a new car 😂 167k miles it did with no major faults other than a new cam belt

[@BakersTaste]

No. Get snow tires. They make a difference. P zeros are nothing like what you actually need in the winter, especially when your car costs 150k

[@braydonscully4646]

Pirelli make a dedicated winter p zero set in the correct size for the GT3, so given your pirelli connections I would highly recommend ordering up a set!

[@mitchellsteindler]

Believe it or not, summer tires don't work in the snow. You're going to fling off a mountain, Sam.

[@nickgalla-barth6336]

Living in Switzerland, we always change our tires/wheels according to the season. O bis O, (October to Easter) we have winter tires fitted. Please remember that winter tires are not snow tires. These are tires that manage the cold (Softer rubber suited to temperatures under 7 C) and additional water/snow/ice. On my X5 I have set of wheels that get changed, but on my 911 GTS they fit the tires onto the centrelock wheels. (The wheels cost 4 grand each, so expensive to have a separate set of wheels) I don't know the specific regulations, but I can't imagine you would get away without winter tires in Europe. (Definitely not in Germany, Switzerland, Austria)

[@rupertm2542]

For a couple of old boys who claim to auto experts your knowledge of tires is shocking! To think an RS6, on pretty well road going track tires (ps4 level), is ludicrous. You should educate yourselves on tires before saying a particular car is poor in the snow. The RS6 on something like a Cross Climate 2 would have been unstoppable on icey roads. The large tread chunks on a sporty tire will not have the malleability to provide grip on snow. I tried to drive on snow with PS4s on my daily. Could’nt get off the drive, so swapped to my Cross Climates and off I went. All season tires are only any good in the snow, poor in the wet for example, but are bloody handy for that week it snows!

[@mtnvalley9298]

Audi Q7 with Good Year snow tires here in the nastiest, coldest spot in the lower 48 states, 8,400 feet in the heart of the Rockies. This is a GREAT snow/tow car and I've driven it in the nastiest blizzards with confidence. Pulled my Go trailer on many camp trips overland. Great car.

[@GabeDeMoraes]

The RS6 not able to go up a hill is 100% down to tires. It doesn’t matter that it’s 4wd if the rubber being spun isn’t meant for the road conditions. Summer tires have a temperature range as well, if it gets too cold (like in the winter) they’ll get too hard and won’t grip. The Range Rover scenario described is down to tires, it’s probably on all seasons. If a Range Rover was on summer tires it wouldn’t be able to make it up the hill either.

[@Mike-dd8bd]

Myself, my sister and my boss all owned a Audi with the newer generation infotainment system. All of us had problems with it. Biggest problem was phones never connecting and getting random black screens. My boss actually had them put a new ECM into his Q8, but the problem never got fixed. I also previously owned a last generation Audi and never had these problems. Overall the system worked much better. What Tony is saying about them switching to in house software is 100% correct.

[@benpenagonzales6014]

VAG used to have Panasonic systems until a couple of years ago. They may get better but the ID and new golf have had issues

[@Aoi_Fans]

The hike in M2 money is great news for the older M2's. The depreciation curve on the earlier gen, 2015-21, is going to flatten out a bit cause of the new price point. A 2019 with lowish miles is looking quite sweet.

[@dam00r]

Sounds like Tony needs winter driving lessons

[@GreenSpartan122]

and a lesson on what a difference winter tyres make...

[@WilliamStevens007]

Winter tyres on a RS6 you would go anywhere on snow.

[@MrEkpa]

You need winter tires to drive in snow. In Sweden it's law to have winter tires between 1 December and 1 april

[@beckygair2272]

Another great episode Many thanks for the fun and laughter Tony and Sam

[@uberseehandel]

Winter Tyres In Germany, when you buy a new car, you get a factory deal on an extra set of winter tyres and rims. The dealer looks after them for you and swaps them over as required. In the UK, and much of Europe, we need tyres designed for the -15C to +15C range; these can be driven faster on the Autobahn than the "happislappies", which work best in low temperatures. Even in the UK, it is a good idea to have winter tyres because normal tyres have sidewalls and tread that goes hard when the temperature drops. Some of us have three sets, winter, spring/autumn and summer(semi-slick) I'm not keen on levering tyres on and off rims, it can get brutal. Winters should, ideally be on narrower rims.

[@MarcCoteMusic]

In Quebec, winter tires are compulsory between December 1 and March 15, though it's a good idea to keep them on until the first or second week of April given our often long and brutal winters.

[@darkbro66]

I think Sam and Tony need to get a tire expert on the podcast to teach them about winter driving lol. None of the tires they mention in this episode are supposed to work under 0 degrees. PS4S and other similar tires are legitimately dangerous in the snow

[@factsaroundtheworld123]

here in Finland its mandatory to have winter tyres after 31st November. i have two sets of alloys, the original ones for summer tyres and aftermarket for winter tyres...

[@benpenagonzales6014]

I can highly recommend Michelin Cross Climate for year round use. Nearly all cars have summer tyres so as soon as you get to freezing they’re useless. And the tread is deeper so they last longer too!

[@Taylor40667]

This was one of the best episodes Love in depth car talk episodes about models etc… my Preference ⭐️

[@lovekalms9174]

As someone who spends a lot of time in Swedish skiiresorts, RS6s, X5Ms, X3Ms, Panameras and Cayennes, all of them cruise around in -20 and huge amounts of snow. All wearing winter tires since its the law during winter in Sweden. So, definitely a tire thing!!

[@thegermangamer8018]

Sam, please ask Tony if he would prefer automatic steering if it were faster on a track. Just to end the discussion over a manual gear box.

[@ivanostojic6089]

Most of the Europe have laws that you must have winter tires on your car starting November/December and it is also common sense (at least to me) especially on a powerful car like gt3.

[@RedC220]

We bought two Taycans earlier this year. They were both sold back to Porsche at 4months and 6 months old respectively due to major problems. I replaced mine with a Ferrari FF in which I drive 800-1000 miles a month. So far my Ferrari has been spot on. I will never buy another Porsche, mainly due to their inability to deal with the issues, not the actual issues themselves.

[@benpenagonzales6014]

Yes it’s often the dealer experience that stays with you

[@zippymark]

My X5 is a totally different car with it's winter wheels on it, which is why I have two sets of wheels.

[@tonipepperoni77]

I’m sorry but you guys are so off on RS6 and snow. Come to the states. See them blasting around mountain roads with 12 plus inches of snow and them being on rails. It’s all about the drive and tires. And no a Range Rover ain’t getting through it. Audis 4 wheel drive system is incredible.

[@andrewkennedy452]

Porsche reliability problems = Taycan. Come on Sam + Tony, you should know this 🙂

[@stephenteerling7373]

I agree with the many comments here about winter tires (or tyres). As F1 fans who understand how tires work with temperatures, and how different hardness of tire compounds need to be brought to the right temperatures, it should be easy to understand how having a tire compound that is designed to work with cold temperatures will make all the difference, not only in cold and wet environments but also in snow. As the only part of the vehicle in contact with the road it is just as important in snowy conditions as all wheel drive vehicles. Most all wheel drive vehicles have open differentials and once a wheel starts slipping all the torque goes to that slipping wheel and all wheel drive looses it's advantage. A winter tire can help stop that wheel from slipping in the first place.

[@Druezy]

Really love the pop ups during the conversation, I appreciate the effort!

[@nigel.w]

You do not need special rims for winter tyres.

[@simonborowicz9284]

Winter tyres are mandatory in most of EU between November and April boys.

[@marcusskarland1155]

As a Swede we get lots of snow and cold. Winter tires is the only thing helping you trough winter! If you have good tires you can go anywhere in any car, so the rant about Audis and bmws that can’t get through winter with summer tires is just a laugh lol

[@BenB91]

Any normal 2wd car with winter cars will be far better than any 4wd car in normal tyres. Range rover included.

[@tonys.568]

Using the main set of wheels to unmount your summers and put on winters agin and agin comes with a risk. You can damage a tire, it can not seal and so on. Get another set of wheels if you get winters. Tires installed once!

[@thepisteoffice]

You both seem pretty clueless re the benefits of winter tyres, and especially when combined with narrow rims. I've seen plenty of Range Rovers/high end SUV's in alpine ditches due to their summer tyres. And not just for snow as they're way better on UK roads in the winter. I get a used set of rims for the winter tyres and run 'em from Nov to April so apart the initial cost of the rims (which will keep their value) your tyre cost over time is no different as your summer tyres then last twice as long.

[@karlbuckley8346]

Regarding the manufacturers charging for manual transmissions, I factory ordered a Dodge Challenger Scat-Pack manual in 2019. In the US the manual was a no charge option and the auto box was around $1200; but in Canada where I live the auto was included and the manual option was $1500 extra.

[@uncooldad3965]

Land Rover/Range Rover put all season tyres on from the factory which is why they are more capable off-road from new.

[@MRVSKIN]

Absolutely loved this episode. Totally agree. The SVR f Pace is totally overlooked and is such a shame because it’s stunning. I would have this over the Range Rover svr anyday and save a ton of money

[@nathanoconnor8559]

Giddy up, Thursday just got better. M2 and GT3 EURO ROADTRIP!!

[@trickydicky1978]

Winter tyres or chains are obligatory in Italy until 15th April.

[@gpaje]

All season is fine in most winter situations, but in regards to a summer tire, more than just grip issue is they will get damaged in below freezing weather if they are used, even moving the car in a parking space could damage the tires at around 25F / -4C temps and below. If you get caught in those temps, you are supposed to get the tires up to 30F / -1C or higher for at least 24 hours before putting any load or pressure on them.

[@gee6940]

FULLY LOADED

[@borjastick]

Sam don't be tempted to go to Sheerness to take a peek. It's like a 19th century penal colony and they'll serve you up for brekky.

[@derekjohnson3445]

Hang on, I've had a 2010 model year Cayenne for nearly 12 years now with very few problems. It's on coil springs, not air. My neighbour got the updated 2015 model and had a few more issues.

[@BarryMakariou]

RS6 on winter tyres will be invincible.

[@RobScoffin]

Macan’s have a common problem with the 4-wheel drive transfer box, mine needed replacing after only 40,000 miles, fortunately under warranty as it was £15k to fix. It now has an oil leak from the top of the sump/bottom of the block, which is a £7k engine out fix. That . aside, it’s a brilliant car! Mine is a 2015 Macan S diesel with 70,000 miles on the clock. Love the channel.

[@christaylor4946]

Looks like they do make Sottozero3’s in the correct size for Turbo S but different speed rating as per Pirelli’s website. Haven’t driven it on snow with summers but I’m impressed and have a lot of confidence in my xdrive 335d with winters on 👌

[@nickw1322]

That RS6 in snow issue is all down to the tyres. Watch Quattro snow videos online! RR won't go anywhere on any tyre, tyres make all the difference

[@christopherruddick88]

To be fair to Aston Martin, my current gen Vantage has had only two issues that it returned to the dealer for, no fuss or problem. 5 years free servicing as well...most of the issues do seem more electrical related to AC, infotainment these days.

[@zooski1516]

Gt3 will be sold within a year max.

[@mitchellsteindler]

Agree. He's not even excited about it.

[@TheShootingBrake]

I kind of wonder if he will keep it for even a few months. Car Market is crashing and he's known for being a bit rash. He's buying at the top of a crumbling market. It would be really foolish if he sold right away, but he needs to either not take delivery(if that's an option) or hold on to that car until the market bounces back in 3-5 years.

[@andrewhurstcars]

I’d give it six months. The GT3 market is already softening fast, and this isn’t a press car.

[@zooski1516]

@@TheShootingBrake it’s still worth 100k more than what he will pay for it so to not take delivery is foolish. He will keep it for a bit as he hyped it up and he won’t get another one from Porsche if he sells it quick. He would not buy the car if he knew he would lose money on it. That I’m sure about.

[@Coronerlex]

The RS6 would be a monster with proper snow tires on it. Any car can be terrible in the snow with summer performance tires. Tires are EVERYTHING. Put some Pirelli sotto zeros and you're in business.

[@WilliamStevens007]

Harry's garage has probably put 3000 miles on his already by now.

[@royd72]

Great episode 👍 Sold my RS6 recently, missing it so badly, was bleeding me dry tho and had to go Bought new Golf R Performance and not feeling it, for sale soon

[@clivecalvert5336]

All Land rover products run all season tyres as standard where the German brands have sports tyres so tyres definitely make a difference.

[@ianashton1226]

Here’s the thing… the manual may be £500 option. But those cars will fetch a £2-3k premium in 10 yrs. you already see this with 987 and 981 cayman/boxters

[@simonborowicz9284]

Lads...RR come on a tyre with a slight bite to them, and RS6 is on a performance road tyre. It's a tyre thing.

[@iPod2024]

How can Tony forget about the 991.1 gt3 engine reliability disaster !!

[@harryneild3711]

I read that the unreliability article was based on average repair bill out of warranty

[@I_am_Jesus_though]

Lovely Thursday evening watch for me 😁

[@brockwilcox2037]

Great chat!

[@eddiefara]

Sam you’re right, it’s all about tyres. All range rovers except SVR come with all season tyres designed and developed to work in the snow. RS6s X5s etc do not. Surprised Tony didn’t know that considering he sells a fair few of them.

[@jamesobrien4498]

do a video on the roma with Tony before he flogs it!

[@nayanmandala23]

adam lz got a brand new 992 turb o s when they first came out had to get the gearbox replaced within the first two weeks because it failed before he even broke in the car.

[@gee8482]

Watching from Gibraltar

[@jamespugh]

Good episode. Congrats Sam on the gt3 on way soon.

[@rrj1977]

You need winter tires if you drive when the temperature is below zero degrees. Pzero are no good below 7 degrees.

[@-LK34-]

Surprised they never talked about the backlash on the recast thing

[@jd32k]

What are you talking about

[@os3990]

Yeah get the winder tyres!

[@Neil2022]

Put a range rover with summer tyres Vs rs6 with winters on a hill with snow. Winters all day long

[@Maurice_Moss]

FYI you'll go further in the snow in a 2 wheel drive car on winter tyres, than an 4x4 on summer tyres.

[@themotorsportarchives]

The M2 and the Ferrari Prius are on my list next year! I meant Toyota..

[@markwickens7271]

I should think the F Pace SVR is an ideal vehicle for a shopping trip to Moët & Chandon… 😉👌

[@ollllivertwist]

Isn’t the new M2 8-speed auto with a torque converter rather than DCT?

[@ollek111]

Dam I'm picking up my ford fiesta ST3 today that I ordered a year ago 😭. And here is sam getting a Porsche GT3 in the same year. 😭 Loved the episode by the way.

[@BarryMakariou]

Perfect Christmas Present to yourself!

[@shoarectube]

They will be fiiiine. Greetings from Switzerland where it is currently 0 degrees and icy.. 4:43

[@colinmorand129]

All season tyres are a good compromise in winter, not full winter, not full summer

[@alastairs3727]

great episode!

[@smokey91820]

Tony drinking out that water bottle reminds me of an old lady with a bowl of soup on her lap hahah

[@helmetculture]

Correction on the M2 it's not a DCT on the G87. It's a ZF single clutch torque converter auto.....

[@WilliamStevens007]

Interesting to see the brand new GT3 touring on Gravelwoods website.

[@Some.One_Unknown]

2:33 That editing is spot on!! 🤣🤣🤣

[@ChrisDorgan]

The wow, £61k for the new M2.... I remember my OG M2 (2016) and I thought that was expensive at £46k-ish. It's a 100hp near increase on power though but massively more expensive. Mad to think that's more HP than the old vantage. The OG M2 could keep up with most on the road (as demonstrated on some SCD tours :P) so this one is going to absolutely fly. Is the new M2 DCT? that box was ace.

[@fraserpitkethly2265]

talking about the rs6 maybe the new s6 avant might be a good shout. 3L diesel but still somewhat sporty and comfortable

[@helmetculture]

Tony is so right about the cup 2

[@charliemacklin7017]

I had an f pace for a month as a courtesy car, fantastic car, so underrated, would have one in Heartbeat

[@jrooney06]

Trust me it would be in the dealership more than on the road.

[@thecremeegg]

Tony in not having Porsche being unreliable shock 🤣 He's right about modern cars not really breaking engine wise anymore though, it's evident by the fact you never see broken down cars by the roadside nowadays apart from punctures

[@mikemitch1041]

I had a 2015 CayenneS V8 Diesel had it for 2 years never had a thing go wrong with apart from service never had a issue

[@Neil2022]

Need a set of all seasons until spring.

[@mikesonic29]

So excited for the GT3!!!!

[@stuartsmith5308]

Porsche, McLaren, Aston Martin, Ferrari all seam to have a record of things going wrong on their cars. Lamborghini always are mentioned in group tests as cars that were the only ones not to go wrong. Could Lamborghini be the most reliable mass Supercar maker?

[@tictoc677]

Lamborghini has the least reliable supercar gearboxes outside of the UK so no

[@guerinsgarage1183]

I had a Jaguar F Pace Gen 1 for 4 years, and it's one of the best cars I've owned and people bring up the infotainment which was the same as most of the LR products. It looks better than a Velar with its strange Fat front end and doesn't have the same reliability issues; I don't get why the Land rovers badge is any more exclusive than Jaguar and is way more exclusive than owning one of the 3 Main Germain brands. Gen 2 of the F Pace interior is now the same as the 2 new RR's and if you think you get the SVR for £85K you have to pay £40k more for the Sport.