Ben Clymer Presents: Ep. 06 - The Lange Episode With Wilhelm Schmid

Recorded on the same day that Lange launched the new Zeitwerk Minute Repeater in Honeygold, this episode features Ben chatting with Wilhelm Schmid, the CEO of A. Lange & Söhne. The two chat about the evolution of the brand on the eve of its 30th anniversary, the metric by which Lange measures its own success, what it takes to buy one of the brand's extra special limited editions and even some of Wilhelm's favorite non-Lange watches.
Got a question for Ben? Please send it to [e-mail]. Who knows? Your topic just might show up on a future episode.
Check out the article here: www.hodinkee.com/articles/ben...
Follow HODINKEE: / ​
See more videos on our site: www.hodinkee.com/videos​
Download our podcasts: www.hodinkee.com/podcasts​
Shop for new watches and accessories: shop.hodinkee.com​
Shop for vintage watches: shop.hodinkee.com/collections...
And don't forget to SUBSCRIBE to our channel. Thank you!
#hodinkee #watches #lange&sohne

[@jonesmgmt1002]

Best episode so far, finally some real substance. I love this CEO, great ambassador for Lange, truly inspiring

[@davidpatrick9302]

Best brand CEO interview I’ve ever listened too. “Our watches are handmade Ben” Wilhelm says with a bit of attitude. Fantastic!

[@robt8620]

Total respect for Wilhelm Schmid and the Lange brand.. this is why i am a proud owner of a Zeitwerk Date and the Lange 1 perpetual Calendar pink dial,.And even though after spending a fortune on the brand what Wilhelm says means i am still not eligible for some pieces , i understand the situation and repect what he says even when it is sometimes frustrating. Brilliant interview , cant imagine another brand being so open.

[@thamid6403]

This is a great conversation. I like the clarity and sincerity of his responses.

[@julbor9002]

Clssic German :D no bs. loved it too!

[@atreidis3946]

Lange is in my opinion one of the most innovative watch brand regarding the past 20 years. And the best in class regarding movements and finishing. Thanks for this great interview.

[@desireless4092]

Pure class. Ok. Ciao.

[@JuanLopez-rx6sx]

Ben working OT to keep hodinkee afloat 😂

[@kevincrawfordphoto]

They / He took his eye off the ball for too long. There were some positive developments I saw coming along (for a while). I think the pendulem is swinging pretty broadly. Hoping they will continue to broaden their demographic appeal.

[@edjack1993]

Hilarious. Great use of emoticons.

[@food2430]

wtf are you even talking about @@kevincrawfordphoto

[@kaiserphoenix01]

LOL

[@Luke.Cooking]

Bob’s Watches is putting out better content these days.

[@krizmarek]

I appreciate the length of Ben's socks. Well played Ben. Well played.

[@jta.71]

He is wearing a pantyhose!

[@FelixRodriguez-vg9pp]

Yes yes yes, best episode so far… only Hodinkee through Ben can give us this caliber of guests and perspective on the GIANTS of the industry.

[@shuycg]

Simply not true. Teddy interviews many CEO and the productions are much more elaborate. Theo and Harris and others do it, too.

[@HowIsThat69]

Hmm ain’t it an over exaggeration calling Lange a giant? With 5000ish pieces produced per year, they hardly are more than a micron company. Their percentage of the over all market is not really giving grey hairs to many of the other producers of luxury watches. No matter how great their watches are, they are just a niche brand

[@FelixRodriguez-vg9pp]

@@shuycgof course others followed, but most will agree Hodinkee has access to every sector of the Industry and the biggest personalities and collectors. I’d be cool to see Teddy rubbing solders with Roger Smith or Ed Sheeran.

[@FelixRodriguez-vg9pp]

⁠@@HowIsThat69good point, but from my perspective, Lange is part of that conversation without a doubt.

[@shuycg]

​@@FelixRodriguez-vg9ppTeddy's progression might as well take him there. But nevermind, I was just mentioning some people yo counter the statement that only Ben has yhis sort of access. I could continue Wei opens many doors. Loved his series on Debethune and the chance to "meet" Denis Flageollet. Tim Mosso is also one of my preferred creators. I find him relatable.

[@TobIas-or9dj]

Best interview, great guy, awesome brand… more of this and Hodinkee will be able to rehire a couple people

[@johnnewman3316]

I love this brand. Their quality and finishing is perfect

[@nikr1d3r32]

Hodinkee is been taking beating for the stuff they put out lately but credit where credit is due, this was great conversation and they even managed to snuck in some pictures of the watches that they were talking about which is always welcome. Very well Hodinkee 👍

[@scribetribe]

Hodinkee are back, hoenstly. Amazing, content!

[@minibus1351]

I respect Ben trying to get concrete answers.

[@IVAtheLT]

I appreciate the honest in this interview. And as someone who just acquired a zeitwerk from a boutique and is now allocated an odysseus in early 2025, everything he said tracks. The closest boutique is 5 hours or a short flight away, so it did take several visits when I was in the area for work, over a year and half period, for the manager to vet me as serious and offer me one. And then it was another 8 months from there until it was ready for pick up 😂

[@vdbdg]

BRILLIANT interview, the right questions and Wilhelm sets the record straight because I’ve heard the collectors side and this balances it. It’s makes me appreciate the brand and consider finding the right Lange for me. I had purchased secondhand a fantastic 1815 Annual but I found it hard to read the date and had to pay a tax bill. It went to a great collector. I hope to be able to buy another Lange soon and keep it forever. I’ve never been but welcome at the HK boutique btw, I got to discover the honey gold split (congrats Ben) and the Odysseus white gold which Wilhelm has just convinced me to give another look at. I like how the brand is de facto forced to limited production and product cycle. Keep it classy and buck the hype. A friend worked hard on getting his steel Odysseus and doesn’t dare wearing it. What a shame. I’d wear it at the beach personally. Especially since Lange service will always bring the watches back to fresh condition.

[@audemarspiguet4237]

Wilhelm Schmidt is probably the most honest CEO in the watch industry

[@spektrograf]

As it's been said already, this is really a fantastic interview. Well done by Ben and Mr. Schmid.

[@sigma02chi]

Best episode by far. GREAT questions Ben!! VERY interesting

[@sigma02chi]

Snoop said it best: “Hodinkee without Ben is like Harold Melvin without the Bluenotes, you’ll never go Platinum!” GREAT to see Ben back in the mix. He IS Hodinkee.

[@sumitkar8146]

The best episode of this series by far

[@themainspringer]

Excellent video and thanks for asking some of the tough questions that the community is curious about. Can you do one video just on watches by fashion/Jewellers brands, Bulgari, Chanel, LV, Piaget, etc.

[@meyergoldstein6208]

Great interview with a great CEO. His responses to some penetrating questions were on point and reflect a reasonable if not admirable brand philosophy. They also come across as genuine and with no holding back. If your brand is doing something right and you are a watch collector you will have to wait and make difficult choices. If the brand is of the caliber such as ALS, which is quite unique actually, then the brand will need to make equally difficult choices in how they manage and expand their customer base. I for one do not want to see ALS “lose themselves”, as Herr Schmidt says, in pursuit of a populist strategy. And whatever I end up being able to acquire will be all the more appreciated, even if I’m also somewhat limited.

[@peterharding5184]

this was awesome! just got my 3rd.....cant wait for next year to see what they come out with.

[@fordhoogendoorn7046]

Thoroughly enjoyed this interview. As a 24 year old, I’m yet to delve into Lange but this was engaging throughout.

[@oneal14attnet]

Wonderful interview Ben. The only subject not covered was retirement of models. Patek does this regularly to preserve value of its model lines. The current sales model Lange employees demands loyalty and punishes grey market activity. Where as Patek benefits from grey market valuations over time. The grey market has a place in the watch world. I don’t sell my watches but economics dictates the natural occurs of a grey market. The bundling question is still a sore spot for customers. It drives potential ones away. Love the Brand but not the expectation to sell me a watch that I do not want in order to get one that I do want.

[@danr6175]

Wow, they will qualify you as being good enough to buy one of their watches. Congrats

[@duck2h465]

Such a down to earth attitude, love him and the brand

[@Z411G]

I think Wilhelm meant 'You can't make a Tomlette without destroying a few Gregs' 😂

[@gabb05]

fav brand, bucket list

[@kenneth7333]

love this...

[@wuaw2011]

Lange Brand Mission: force sell dress watches to people that want its sports watch. Thank you Ben for asking the hard questions!

[@johnnewman3316]

What’s the answer to stop this?

[@peterharding5184]

a mission i 100% endorse

[@kevincrawfordphoto]

It's their brand. They can manage it however they choose. One thing is for certain...."Lange gives no f*cks." I've known this about them for several years now.

[@MasterFornicatorx1]

Yeah, they’re known for dress. If you don’t want those, you’re not really into the brand if you “only” want the sportier one. My two cents.

[@shuycg]

Really hoping to learn why is a ALS deployant so expensive. Multiple times what others using the same supplier ask for.

[@JackoWillMakeLives-loveu]

Because f you that’s why. That’s Lange’s approach

[@RovexHD]

We need to know the cost in R&D and labour.

[@shuycg]

Same supplier makes them for IWC for example. And those cost a small fraction. Labour cost must the same... Even if the design is supplied by Lange, ​how much could that be over what a IWC designer costs? R&D is definitely the same since they don't research and develop anything about a this part. Probably didn't even had to (re)search for the supplier. They are well known and already jad contracts with the company that bought Lange.@@RovexHD

[@RovexHD]

@@shuycg I see what you mean. I wonder what stops them making them in-house. Especially at the prices they charge for their watches.

[@steini6771]

Any AD of expensive goods, especially in this case, watches, should have any product within their collection for a fair ( 0 - 6 months) delivery time. As a watch collector, I have often bought other watches/brands due to silly and long delivery schedules. This is not a win-win for any brand (Rolex can you hear me). Thanks for a great interview and yes, I have two Lange and love them.

[@watchGWW]

Classic Halloway move!

[@alexito9213]

I love and collect Lange. And I get it. 5000pieces only so they want to squeeze every possible money out of that. I have 9 collected and never sold one. So - who is passionated and who is after the money here? The only think I can agree on with Herr Schmid - the white gold on the rubber is also my favorite Odysseus 😂

[@UserKR13]

Im in a similar position as yourself. I see you are not the only one who thinks this way. Collectors who are VIC and above will know what you mean 100%

[@harrycee656]

I understand that i need to "work hard" to get promoted at work. So in this case I need to "shown you the money" hard enough to get promoted on that list. I am certain that regardless of how passionate i am for ALS that they will gladly sell to someone richer than I. So when rich people want something, they expect priority. Rich people seem to value having the power to get something others can't. Money is not enough, power is what the rich are truely after. Then they complain when they dont get what they want.... 🤔 So I want to start a relationship with an Odysseus, and you won't sell it to me. However, I do understand ALS trying to cater to their affluent customers with the 5k units they build. If their watches are not exclusive and desirable then the competition has a opportunity.

[@louisshambarger2230]

There was a used 1815 in a shop where I trade. It looked a bit worn but they wanted new price for it. Why should I pay new price for a used watch when I could get a new one from a boutique? The 1815 has the look I like best but I wanted an 1815 up down. None was available. I bought the 1815 from Zadok in Huston. I asked about a Saxonia ultra thin with the blue sparkle dial and they put me on a list. After I saw another interview where the president of Lange said he was going to concentrate on the more complicated watches in the future, I lost hope for the Saxonia . Not long after that Zadok called me and had one. I bought It ! I have never been to the Zadok store but the people I dealt with there by phone are very nice. I rarely ware the Saxonia Ultra Thin. It is a special occasion watch to me and there are very few of those in my life now. If I bought another Lange it should be in a smaller size for a lady but with a GMT hand. For myself, I would trade in both of my watches for a Richard Lange “Pour le Merite”. But with Honey Gold case. I know the Richard Lange is styled after the Observation watches but I still prefer the Arabic numbers of the 1815. The Roman numerals seem too large for the dial to me. The 1815 isn’t the fanciest watch but I like it better than some of the more expensive ones.

[@schizo0223]

Can't go wrong with a Lange 1...

[@alexito9213]

Greed is the real reason for the boutiques. The customer experience is not better and the staff is not as knowledgeable as Herr Schmid wants to make us believe. I am sure the trend for boutiques and boutique only models will collapse sooner or later. For me as a collector it is much better to have multiple brands so that I can compare.

[@aeolus1982]

Maybe ALS can get away with that. Production numbers are low

[@TheDryDown]

Do you only take 3/4 salary? This notion that businesses should be run as charities is ridiculous.

[@alexito9213]

@@TheDryDown the prices had been high. Now they are ridiculous.

[@WarChest]

I respectfully disagree with the customer experience aspect. Before I ever bought a Lange, I spent time at the Madison Ave boutique several times. They sat with me for 60 to 90 minutes at a time, chatting and laughing and even going off topic and just talking a bit about life. I don’t expect any salesperson except for the most seasoned to have all knowing knowledge of any brand. But after visiting tons of boutiques in and around NY, Miami and LA. I have to say that ALS was the brand that ended up earning their paycheck from me.

[@salemdxb]

bundling is stupid ? here in Dubai I have been asked several times in the official boutique to bundle !!!

[@jeanlefranc3817]

9 seconds into the video and we have Ben's casual shoe right in the middle of the screen, and it stays there for most of the show 40 minutes later, Herr Schmid, a proper gentleman, still hasn't lifted his feet from the floor. He embodies Lange und Söhne so well.

[@sebastian5030]

Would not expect a CEO to not somehow put a weird smell to a brand when representing it (thinking AP, PP, Omega, etc.)... But this guy, this CEO, he makes me feel good, relaxed and his humbleness is infectious.

[@shuycg]

What is he on about? There are Langes on Jomashop.

[@aandsb4366]

I love the the pieces from this brand, but cannot stand to have a conversation with its representatives or its boutiques. They make my stomach turn with the games they play. Why should I buy an $80k piece I don’t want just for the outside chance on a piece I do want when the secondary market premium on the piece I want is at or only slightly above retail? This kind of BS only serves to drive customers away from the brand and into the secondary market.

[@MasterFornicatorx1]

Literally every AD plays these games to even get a Patek. If you only want one Lange, I question your interest in their ethos and design language.

[@ianskelly6911]

I agree , you really would think that ALS would be above this and realise that they are not Rolex and that is a positive, people who buy ALS are collectors and don't want to be treated this way. It is really disapointing and an own goal as it would be a great opportunity to differentiate themselves

[@TheMightyMedia]

bundling is common throughout Asia for Lange in boutiques, total BS if otherwise is said regardless of from/by whom

[@christophlentsch2943]

So they want to avoid watch-flippers, because they don't appreciate the product and just want to make money. But what about the "real" collector, that keeps the watch for 5, 10 or more years, but puts in in a safe, never wears it (and thus robs another enthusiast of the chance to enjoy the watch) ... and THEN puts the watch in an auction. Why should that be OK?

[@seanpratherful]

“If you’re in an emergency situation and need to sell a watch, [call us for permission].” I hate this era of watch collecting.

[@realdata8624]

You have the guy dressed professionally in a suit, and then you have a guy mismatched with rolled up jeans needs to tell you exactly what hipsters run this company.

[@sergezerkin]

Their datigroah goes beyond retail .. who cares !! Are they tripping balls ?

[@kaiserphoenix01]

His narrative on "oh our watches are so sought after and it sells above retail" etc is getting old...Its true models like the Odysseus does yes, but those days are long gone where lange dress watches are trading above retail, most are like 30-35% off...(Yes i know, not the honey gold, lumen etc).

[@sergezerkin]

“Somebody” is trustworthy … what a joker … is he trustworthy

[@RovexHD]

Is it me or should screws on watches be symmetrical.

[@salemdxb]

I think he is living in dreamland .. Lange is dying .

[@rayleeaustralia]

Like Omega have more Limited Edition on offer than non LE😂

[@MrParadigm1981]

Good news… nobody is buying Lange and trying to flip for a 40% loss, haha. Lange doesn’t have to worry about flippers.

[@sergezerkin]

Copied AP business model

[@bg18871]

Herr Schmid is pretty loosey goosy with the term "gray" market. Gray market watches are unworn watches with unactivated warranties that were sold to nonAD's by AD's looking to offload excess inventory. There is essentially no more gray market for Lange watches since they shut down most AD's. What's left is "used". Except dealers don't like that term because it devalues their product. Now he goes on to say, they try to get their watches into hands of people that are true collectors who don't care about secondary market prices because they won't sell. So why is he so concerned with used prices? Because if used prices are close to retail, it lets them sell watches at full retail from boutiques at no discount. Next he discusses why bundling is ridiculous, but in the next breath he says "build a relationship". Cognitive dissonance on full display!. "build a relationship" is code for buy a bunch of watches that you're luke warm on to get the piece you really want. Which is basically bundling over a multiyear period, but in some ways bundling is better because it's transparent. With "build a relationship" its more like buy this now and maybe we'll sell you this later. They could discourage flipping by not honoring the warranty if the papers are not in your name. Or engrave the owners initials on the case somewhere, in addition to blacklisting have the buyer sign a non-binding show of good faith that you won't sell the watch or invite the owner to watch events and ask them to wear the watch. This whole build a relationship stuff is the worst part of the multibrand retailer experience brought into the boutique. No one likes AP boutiques or Watches of Switzerland unless you're an NBA player for AP or IG influencer for WoS. About a year ago a spreadsheet of Lange's allocation algorithm was leaked. It was clear that lumens and honeygolds and odyseus went to the highest bidders. I'm sure they're making lots of money and doing well, but at some point many will be soured by this.

[@sergezerkin]

But it will take to follow the AP business model as they had the royal oak .. a Lange is still a dress watch watch company and with those hideous Sinn cases and braclet from brogionili they will never get anywhere .. yeah datograoh is nice and 1815 chrono also are nice but majority of people will never buy it … so they are limited to very small customer group .. and they won’t buy 5 langes like they do with Patek to get noutalis .. so unless they make new bracelet watches they will never see success.. also the after sale game they suck as you have to wait half a year … soon people will stop buying watches to make money on speculation and they will be left in a decline of demand and production will be even more expensive

[@jjpthe2]

What a snoozer.

[@swampscott2670]

I still don’t get how people lead high caliber international brands like this and have such weak language skills.

[@DelusionalNYC]

You MUST be joking .Wilhelm speaks better English than the majority of Americans and Brits

[@RovexHD]

His English is very good. Very mean comment and uncalled for.