Big Battles - Mass Combat in 5e D&D and TTRPG

[@WebDM]

Thanks for watching! Want more Web DM in your life? Check out our Patreon for our podcast, bonus vids, and more! Patreon.com/webdm Or our Twitch channel for live streamed ttrpgs every Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday! Twitch.tv/webdm Or our live play archive on KZbin: KZbin.com/webdmplays

[@peershaunm]

the franks

[@lomp1582]

I'm just waiting for the intro where pruit finally says, "Hello everyone, I'm Jonathan Pruit, and this is Jimathan Davis, and we're going to be talking about fantasy names on WebDM."

[@almostirrelevant9181]

A good example of adding magic into war is battle in the Inheritance Cycle. Each unit of soldiers has a magician that can protect them from enemies spells. Magicians are communicating telepathically which allows for much faster reactions between different sectors of the battle. One of the most interesting strategies that emerged is magicians searching each other out to try and kill each other, because of the other side’s magician died they were almost certainly dead. Anyway, great episode. Thanks for the inspiration:)

[@OkamiG15]

Honestly, I loved the idea of wizard battles from the Inheritance Cycle, of two wizards trying to break down their mental defenses so they could have the informational upper-hand and decide the battle with one spell. Unfortunately, D&D just has Counterspell, which functions the exact same.

[@wafflingmean4477]

Yeah the Inheritance Cycle has one of the best examples of mages in combat I've ever seen. The Witcher has a major one as well (in the books. The show's version of the battle was pathetic and didn't factor in the armies). Essentially the mages on either side were pretty evenly matched, and prioritised taking each other out all the while trying to slip gigantic attacks past the other sides defences to give troops on the ground the advantage.

[@andrewdavis8251]

I love getting to hear Jim's opinions about large battles and the insight he brings to the discussions.

[@JPruinc]

Andrew Davis he’s a badass!

[@chasebalcziunas4289]

Are there interns for Badassery?

[@blackhornwasp]

I like to start with big battles early on. Show the more mundane fight of nations going to war. Players caught up in it, enlisted, or drafted from the general populous or from imprisonments. The hell of war tests the metal of my players. They get to see how to fight with strategy and tact. Then the battle ends and the party is formed from a battle hardened squad of individuals who shared this horrific or epic experience depending on the campaign.

[@SunbornWanderer]

Reminds me of the all guardsmen party

[@XanderCottrell]

so mass combat is my excuse to play warhammer in the middle of a dnd game :P

[@TB--sp9wy]

Yay!

[@darkbunny9994]

That was honestly my strategy. I'm trying to figure out a mass combat system that has some Warhammer and some Total War elements to it. I am, uh, not great at making wargames, so it's slow going.

[@TheJarric]

@@darkbunny9994 armies of antiguetly might work dnd has empire book that coud work for u too

[@MrKoalaburger]

Absolutely

[@tarunnarang8232]

Great topic, 5e needs more big battles!

[@JPruinc]

Tarun Narang All the big battles!

[@jamaigar]

Yes pls the most terrifying experience mankind has ever felt in all dice thrower tables in the world :D war and battle and mass murder for everyone

[@Thornspyre81]

Agreed, I'm adding an Undead army to my Curse of Strahd campaign. It's only comprised of 25 indeed, but it includes some of the bruisers like Death Knights, Skull Lords and and Mummy Lord.

[@Brianf66999]

I love Jim's fascination with history so much! As soon as they mentioned porcupine formations I thought "Bad war", and they instantly mentioned it. Fantastic, love every episode thanks so much guys!

[@JPruinc]

Brian Butler you’re welcome and thanks for the kind words

[@blakebrockhaus347]

I think he was in grad school for military history for a while.

[@MrFForger]

@@blakebrockhaus347 I think he once mentioned he has a degree in military history or medieval warfare

[@martinschafer6002]

The connections in the community :) Web DM, Matt Colville, Sly Flourish, my three big inspirations mentioned in one (very awesome) video :)

[@Bluecho4]

One idea I like for a DnD setting is the idea that if a dead body isn't properly disposed of - burying, cremation, sky burial, etc. - it will tend to give rise to undead. Both physical reanimated bodies, or unquiet ghosts. Corpses and bones will be sought out by unclean spirits, while the souls of folk who died in agony, despair, or anger will return to act upon their grudge. As such, battlefields in such a setting would be _terrifying_ to behold. Incredibly dangerous, both during and after the battle. I can see PCs being sent in following a fight to guard other soldiers, not only to retrieve the wounded, but to make sure the dead stay down. Former battlefields might be absolutely awful, in much the same way that a village taken by plague or famine might be. Locations where zombies or skeletons wander, dragging weapons around, looking for something living to kill. Entire fields might be abandoned or forbidden, simply because they're so dangerous to the communities that live nearby. Not to mention if any fallen heroes were never recovered, they may constitute major threats to anyone unlucky or foolish enough to wander near. (Which naturally creates its own potential quests, to brave the undead hordes and pry magic items or notable banners/crests/etc. from their owners' cold, dead hands). That bit about the villages taken by plague or famine have their own complications. Plague especially, since adventurers or treasure hunters might have to stalk from house to house. Breaking into sealed buildings, with unquiet dead waiting inside. If the PCs make enough noise coming in, they may be surrounded by the sounds of hands banging on boarded-up doors and windows. A creepy situation, to be sure.

[@Darknight4434]

Thats a great view actually

[@wildewalker]

I love your concept, here! It really has a similar feel to the cursed region in my HB setting, called the Tombs of the Forgotten, where ancient cultures had a great series of battles and left their dead untended. Now, nearby more modern cultures are often invaded by armies of undead led by intelligent masters or potent champions that finally stir from fitful slumber to aimless rage.

[@consecrated2718]

This is covered quite well in The Witcher. Me too gages drop up all over the world due to improperly disposed bodies

[@ralanbek95]

Good afternoon, Inquisitor Davis and Commissar Prui- ! *BLAM*

[@JPruinc]

Chris Jolley HOLD THE LINE!

[@nargenhargel9233]

CADIANS ARE ALWAYS READY

[@spinomitegames9000]

There was something I loved from the first clone wars. A squad of ARC troopers came to save a group of jedi from grievous. Great idea for lower level characters to do.

[@paulc1527]

I had kind of hoped you guys would have mentioned the option of using a mass battle as a type of dungeon where you treat volley fire as traps, trench lines as dungeon mazes, and large melees like an environmental hazard. I am pretty sure that was from an old 3.5 supplement, and it is a way I have done mass combat in the past as well.

[@floridamancode_e2673]

Bit of a correction. Standardized uniforms we're not a thing in medival. Each Knight had a personal banner he would use. Each army would be tons of different colors and banners

[@absolstoryoffiction6615]

Men do not fear bloody metal soldiers. They fear... Rainbow Banner Man.

[@AGrumpyPanda]

@@absolstoryoffiction6615 Wasn't so much intimidation as it was for identification- very important for everyone, friend or foe, to know who you are so that A) your friends don't kill you because you're on their side, and B) so the enemy doesn't kill you because they know you're worth money.

[@absolstoryoffiction6615]

@@AGrumpyPanda I would kill everything and everyone in a war because I'm color blind and need glasses. Although, if people need a Castle of Death Traps. Nothing escapes my sight. lol

[@floridamancode_e2673]

@@absolstoryoffiction6615 just look at the heraldry. Wolf good guy, lion bad guy

[@Jhakaro]

Identification wasn't nearly as big an issue as people would think because you set up large lines of formations. So essentially you understand, don't attack the guys to your side, attack the guys facing you that are jabbing at you. If a battle line has broken down and people are fighting individual duels like they show in most films, then something has gone horribly wrong and most likely, one side is routing and being ridden down.

[@chrishousenick6105]

I might have a Web DM addiction. I'm listening to this video while at the same time reading Jim Davis' master's thesis on Medieval cavalry. CH, Ph.D. & DM

[@TFRComrade]

Link?

[@Andrewc87563]

Link?

[@MrFForger]

Link?

[@Kafinated.]

@@MrFForger digital.library.txstate.edu/bitstream/handle/10877/5577/DAVIS-THESIS-2015.pdf?sequence=1

[@BNRmatt]

I'm a fan of how Savage Worlds does mass battles. Your players have a way to contribute every round, no matter what they're good at, and the emphasis is on morale rather than attrition.

[@pranakhan]

I heard Matt Coleviles team is working on some mass combat rules system that can run parallel to 5e, like their other book Strongholds & Followers. Love to hear you guys talk about that one

[@analogue_galaxy]

I've made each player in charge of one squadron and made the combat pure tactics on a map (no dices) - it was quick, it was fun and players actually made it right

[@CJ_esc.artist]

Would love to know more details on that!

[@vladtheinhaler146]

Me too

[@Nolinquisitor]

Those thumbnails man... Starship Trooper Jim Davis and John Snow Pruitt.

[@JPruinc]

TRAV IS OUR SECRET WEAPON!!!

[@blackouthorus1519]

Honestly these thumbnails kill me

[@thomasparkin259]

My favourite moments are typically when I'm playing the fighter as a champion, bellowing his name and daring the enemy to die by his blade. Basically just imagine Gyoubu Masataka Oniwa's entrance in Sekiro.

[@danieldosso2455]

Woo! Really glad they mentioned Matt Colville's book, I'm super excited to get my hardcopy and will most definitely back his Kingdoms and Warfare when he puts it up!

[@ChristnThms]

I'm glad you guys brought up trenches and modern tactics. The presence of magic largely imitates modern weapons for the most part. So the tactics would be similar as well.

[@geoffdewitt6845]

YEAAAH! Mentioning Colville for the win!

[@kyubii972]

Really awesome to have all this time of Jim talking about what he knows its quite fascinating to hear him just talk about the history of this stuff. Fun to learn.

[@WisdomThumbs]

EDIT: Jim described francisca throwing axes. The Franks used them. Hard fought shield wall battles would often have knots and piles of the dead. Just... pre-stacked, because that’s where a breach happened.

[@MrSweetiebear95]

I like big battles, and I cannot lie. My other players can't deny. When the DM walks in with a battle mat, and all his minis in a case, I get sprung!

[@cattrucker8257]

My anaconda don't want none without an army, hun

[@geoffdewitt6845]

Love seeing Jim's passion for the subject. He just looks like he's having fun geeking out. And Pruitt is just sitting there like, "I know, bro. I know." Fucking great.

[@liammay6102]

Call lightning is a nightmare on the battle field.

[@DANTVSVERGIL]

What I love about big battles is that afterwards, whether or not that the pcs were in it, the massive amounts of death bring in the Sorrowsworn and you could have your pcs fight some of those

[@pontusvongeijer8986]

One of the most vital spells in a world with both magic and large infantry formations would obviously be find familiar. :) Having a hidden mole waiting in the ground untill the right moment to cast a huge spell through it, or a flying familiar to just channel your spells from above. (Obviously there are lots of super powerfull high level spells, but the familiar+fireball combo doesn't require a high level caster so you can have lots of them and they are not super difficult to replace.) :)

[@sophieirisviel4100]

honestly imagine a chain warlock negotiating with an enemy general while his pseudodragon does whatever and kinda acts like the scaly cats they are, sitting in the enemies lap or something when suddenly, inflict wounds at fifth level, 7d10 necrotic damage and the general is most likely dead

[@criticalsuccess9926]

Awesome stuff here! It’s cool to see how the topic evolves from when it’s a Patreon podcast topic to when it becomes a video. Great work!

[@emophobe]

Always down for some BIG NATURAL BATTLES

[@cattrucker8257]

Big battle goth dm

[@alexp.4270]

If your players like having a personal connection with their troops, and constantly talk about getting upgrades for them or aiding them, I have found Colville's system is pretty satisfying.

[@forloveofthepage2361]

Great stuff as always guys. Magic is a huge game changer. Mass armies without mass protection are a waste when one person can devastate the enemy. I like to have mass battles after a journey of gaining allies so that those allies can augment the battle in different ways based on how the players employ them. Makes for a great level of tension because the players also weigh losing that NPC.

[@legithopecrew]

A spell that I find almost always gets ignored in big battle DND simulations is leomunds tiny hut. It's an action to put up and is impenetrable by definition.

[@JKM395]

I think this ties in well with another episode you did on whether combat is sport or war. It seems like, once you get to this point, you've settled on war and that brings an entirely different set of goals and battle techniques with which some people may be uncomfortable. It's important to know your audience and not take things further than the people around you are willing to go.

[@valk_tl1433]

The Cavalier’s time to shine!

[@Tysto]

I’ve researched Medieval warfare, & this description is spot-on. I’ve also created my own tables for rolling up a battle. The PCs can recover from a bad roll (your flank collapses, etc.) & make the next table roll with advantage by fighting a skirmish combat themselves.

[@ataraxia7439]

It's so cool seeing Jims knowledge about this topic come up.

[@ttprophet]

perfect timing! i'm doing my first large scale battle this weekend! need all the advice i can get. here is my idea: Loudwater has paid tributes to local goblin hordes for generations to maintain peace in the city and trade routes, but just up the river orc hordes have desecrated the sacred greypeak mountains, and it has awakened stone giants from their slumber, causing dammed waters and lakes to drain and redirect, flooding the valleys in a natural disaster that is making high ground scarce. The goblins (and other wildlife) were forced to migrate from their flooded caves and have raided the city shortly before out heroes arrive. They were repelled by the local militia, but at a great cost to the city. they will not survive another sustained attack, which they suspect will start again at dusk after the goblins regroup. They find out that a large amber stone they found in an earlier session is a key component to a "spellplague tower", which is a homebrew defense tower designed to protect the city with a magic barrier used during the spell plague era. Only one local genasi wizard knows what it is and how to use it, and it will require time (20 actions) to channel it's power and re-activate it's defenses. the heroes must plan their blockades, set traps, and make a strategy to defend the city square while the wizard awakens the stone. When the stone awakens, it zaps all the hordes in the perimeter to ash, but it will transport our heroes to a plane that exists inside a stone, and they find that it was imprisoning (like a pokeball) everything it zaps, including all sorts of evils from the spell plague era. They will use cunning and combat to escape the stone's prison, hopefully without releasing the demons and monsters back onto the material plane.

[@ttprophet]

Follow up: I used the mobs table from the dmg and made a 30ftsq scale map of the city. There were catapults and flame archer teams that did massive damage or created short term flame walls, but if they missed rolled a d6 for random direction and it destroyed or burned whatever wall or building it hit, so it was a gamble to fire it inside the city. There were a handful of large houses barricaded with 1d100 townsfolk inside to force the hero’s from their clustered positions and attempt to save them from goblins burning or tearing down the walls with innocent lives inside. Every safe house destroyed affected their gold pay. Each hero had 4 volunteer militia men that gave 40 temp hit points as well as 1d4 extra damage per militia man on a successful hit. Every turn a new group of goblins would run into the city from a random 1d12 starting point. A roll might put a mob in a location on a flank or hard to reach area of town, Each group was pre-rolled for mob size and could not be determined until a pc was within 120ft. Some as little as 5 up to 20 each. After 10 turns the spell plague tower would charge up and chose one random pc with chaos roll and gave them 1d10 charges to annihilate hordes with. For a brief moment the player became a god of destruction. Lol The party had ptsd by the end but it was really fun and they had some great rolls and inspiring moments.

[@robinwang6399]

The killing enemy general part reminded me of a Chinese historic recored from the Song Dynasty. where solders snipes a enemy general from 600steps away with a siege ballista from a city wall and ending the assault.

[@michaelmrozek7206]

I have a super over the top and complicated war system that basically combined everything you talked about in this video

[@wildewalker]

Publish it! Every system has merit and we all love a good system that's easy to use and drives a great story.

[@jamalcolmson]

I HAVE BEEN WAITING FOR THIS VIDEO FOR LIKE A MILLION YEARS!!!

[@witchboy44]

20/10 thumbnail for Pruitt this week

[@JPruinc]

Marcus Dagenais it’s a great one!

[@EnderLord007]

I love this take on large scale battles, because I feel like the skirmishes and running around a countryside in the hours or days leading up to a big battle would be super fun to play. Not only are you trying to track and avoid the movements of a great number of enemies, there's plenty of opportunity for random yet urgent questing from citizens in danger, captains or sergeants of the friendly army, or even just random shit you come across. Then finally, if something starts to happen, it comes to a climax in a big battle.

[@HoboMan6productions]

The skirmishes evolving into larger battles is the battle of Gettysburg 😂

[@flannelshirtenthusiast4159]

"Battle of the sunk cost fallacy." Cracked me up

[@zoraster3749]

“The mobile infantry made me the man I am today.”

[@vladtheinhaler146]

The enemy cannot roll dice... If you disable his hand.

[@kotahitt9563]

My high school history teacher once told me that war is "Punching the other guy until he doesn't want to get punched anymore."

[@RemedialHappyMan]

Hey I just wanted to say thanks for making these videos. I like to listen to the podcast and these videos while I'm working on stuff for my own home campaign. I don't play 5e so a lot of the specific rules topics or class analysis videos are more just interesting flavor topics for me. Your videos on table topics having to do with group dynamics have been extremely helpful though, I've lost some of my edge on metagaming, dislikes of races and classes, and other topics as well and in general its changed my perspective and I enjoy more of my players characters and more of the sessions we run as well. More importantly I've watched some of the live play for the many of the various campaigns around the DM-help ecosystem and its helped me realize that it's more important to focus on what I can bring to a game to make my sessions unlike any others my players will play in, rather than focusing on trying to find the "right" methodology towards preparation and play. Your videos have helped me grow as a DM/GM.

[@WebDM]

This is all amazing to hear. Glad we have helped make a difference in your gaming, and thank you for taking the time to tell us

[@zijldianrage]

Love when I get a mini history lesson when watching. Awesome ideas, and things to consider. Thanks as always!

[@mussante]

Great imagination. You've given your audience a ton of ideas of how to create wonder-filled encounters. Ive never played pen and paper D&D but know a lot about the lore, and I really enjoy your pontifications

[@LastFanStanding12]

I love your D&D videos, but I would watch a series of Jim just talking about real world historical military tactics.

[@WebDM]

Thanks for the suggestion!

[@benjaminodonnell258]

Sudden out of nowhere campaign idea: The characters are trapped inside a city under siege, and the only way in and out of the city is a mega-dungeon beneath the city...

[@valk_tl1433]

In a longer, focused campaign, you can train forces or give them some abilities. Maybe new stat blocks. Mob -> militia->regular->professional. Better stat blocks more or better abilities, and have them gain these through battles as well as some RP of PCs training them, maybe using some roles to gain abilities that way. Having a formation stat block that can scale, and lowering stats with casualties. Have the option for them to brake up, becoming individuals based on the casualty count left if they break or need to evade AOE. It stats to become another game, but could be interesting.

[@MrDMSir]

Solid idea.

[@jessemccaughey4231]

That thumbnail is fantastic! +1 to whoever came up with that one

[@Ghastly_Grinner]

"During this time period" Ah yes back when the World was D&D 😂

[@2hotyscotty13]

Wasn't the topic I wanted, but little did I know it was the topic I needed.

[@bigfatopinions1338]

Great topic! Glad to see this podcast topic get brought into an actual show!!

[@JPruinc]

Alexander Greene we love workshopping these topics.

[@Jonsoner]

In my campaign, the setting doesn't allow spellcasters to participate in direct warfare. The civilization is currently advancing from low tier to mid tier magic usage (more wizard school, more searching for sorcerers, more magical stuff in general) but warfare hasn't catched up, so to avoid mass casualties in conflicting sides they decided on a system. I took some inspiration on concept of nuclear deterrance, mutually assured destruction and the changes in warfare when artillery ws introduced. Armies must have international observers attached to make sure no magic is used during mass combat (travel, food, terrain modification, most magic that aren't used against the enemy are ok); should any nation use magic in mass combat or sieges, they must deliver said casters if they acted independently; if the nation refuses ALL nearby countries will declare war on them until they either surrender or are exterminated. That's a really summarized version, the real one is filled HUGE holes that could be exploited, I'm planing to slowly make the war escalate as the party raise their level, prestige, fame and gain cooler magic and items so THEY can be the ones that "create" the in world "art of war". When the conflict escalates I plan to make the whole continent erupt in war, kickstarting the magical progress hoping that by the time they're around 20 some part of the world (probably their homebase) should be closer to high magic fantasy. Of course I haven't planned how the hell to do all of this but I guess I'll just trust my players. Worst case scenario, surprise lich kingdom and now they can use all the cool magics in war.

[@DanRaven88]

Hey guys, big fan of all you conceptual talks. They are great inspiration for high level approach to how you can think about the game and that really helps getting into the spirit. I love using your videos as resources and reference material! But sometimes it's difficult to find certain things you have discussed within your videos. If you're open to some constructive suggestions, I have two: Would love it if you could post some of the resources (or links to those resources) that you discuss in your videos in the comments. It would really help to be able to find these things later on! I think you mentioned three things in this video from a mechanical perspective (just to call out an example): 1. 2e Warhammer rules for getting to 'turning points' in a batttle 2. Something by Matt C. about Strongholds? Where can you find that on DMGuild? (I understand if you don't necessarily have permission to post or want to advertise for the IP of others, etc); maybe if you can't post links, just put "Here's what you can search for on DMsGuild if you want to find this" in the description? 3. "Mob Rules from DMG pg 250". etc. I understand maybe you want someone to rewatch your video rather than just being able to read the description and skip to the resources. If that's the case, perhaps you could take a moment to add to the description some timestamps for parts of the video where you discuss "Pre-War skirmish at 2 mins; All out battle at 15 mins; Effect of magic on battles at 21 mins; Some rules you can use at 25 mins" These are not the actual times, of course, but something like that would be a big help to find the details later on. Been a long comment, I know. So if you're still with me, thanks! Keep up the good work :)

[@Wyrmshield]

I second all of these

[@jinnocent6355]

Great episode. I have been waiting for an opportunity to do a large scale battle in my campaign and this has given me some great ideas of how to run it. Thanks for creating such diverse and interesting content.

[@lordofdorknessdm3085]

It's worth noting that 3.5 had the Heroes of Battle supplement specifically designed to facilitate mass combat situations and a protracted open battle between armies. Given that the rules are relatively abstract yet adhere to a d20 system, they should be easy enough to insert/adapt to 5e.

[@andrewknorpp9415]

This with your guy's patron podcast for on the subject means I am prepared for the rebellion in my game.

[@SALdosry]

I needed this for my next campaign, thank you guys

[@UrbanArtifact]

Thanks for coming out. Next Thursday in my final year and a half ongoing game. There will be a huge battle. It's gunna be fun

[@shae98sc2]

Most underrated spell in the context of long battles, especially sieges: Create Food and Water. As stated in the video, the majority of war is mastery of logistics and morale. Get enough mages to cast this spell for an army, and you don't need to worry about supply lines. It's probably not the best to use this as a primary method of supply, but it would certainly supplement an army's reserves if necessary. Of course, this makes magic users that much bigger of a target.

[@danbarth8489]

I set up a Jenga tower that represented morale when we did our first big battle. Anytime the players did something awesome I would take from the tower, not adding the pieces back and discarding them outright. The same applies for when the enemy’s did something impactful to the players. Until the tower fell. Once the tower fell the side who caused it to fall would have their morale broken thus hindering them for the rest of the battle. Was super fun risk reward system that I highly recommend

[@WebDM]

That is a cool idea!!

[@jordanwilliams8994]

Psychic damage is probably the most important kind of damage in a pitched battle. That is the real might of Guts (Berserk) as a soldier. He is terrifying. Yes, he kills a lot of people, but for every person he murders horribly, he sends another ten fleeing or freezes them in their tracks. That thought process gives me "new" and grizzly ideas for "dealing damage" against enemies in battles. Like, do you wanna send in troops to harry their progress along this road, or do you wanna send scouts to set the heads of defeated troops on pikes with their blood soaked banners. Do you wanna push forward against the fortified position, or declare a cease fire so that your opponents can collect their dead, thereby forcing them to come face to face with their fallen comrades while tiring them out, resting your own troops, clearing your future camp of corpses, and insinuating that you might be a merciful captor. Now we become students of the art of war.

[@Rustyuoiman]

I ran a battle of 10 monsters vs 3 players the other day and that felt bad enough. Glad for the insight on more grand scales, Jim and Pruitt!

[@ColonelPanzer]

In regards to the effect of destructive magic on the battlefield, I'm reminded of a quote from fellow dnd youtuber Matt Colville's book, Priest; "it takes men to hold the field". Sure the Wizards can absolutely go ham on the opposing army and may even rout them, but it won't mean anything if you do not have the manpower to hold and defend the land you just took.

[@inkblotCrisis]

Our DM had us go through different phases of a battle through rolls. Logistics phase had us roll for resources, March phase had us roll for battlefield advantage(dependent on resources) Pre-battle phase had us roll for sneaking into the enemy base for sabotage(on bf advantage) and rolling AGAINST sabotage (on normal/disadvantage). Battle phase had us play it like Advance Wars.

[@andrewsauer7734]

Oh boy! I'm about to run my first session with mass combat. Wish I would have seen this earlier. I'll be back to compare notes! Keep up the good work guys. Your videos have been a major help in making my campaign a success!

[@houkou1]

Oh thank god you guys did this. I have been fighting with figuring this out for my campaign as my players have been building up an army. Definitely gonna have to give this a through watch when I have time.

[@notorious.scoundrel]

Now I wanna run a conflict between a lawful orc band and a goblinoid hold. The main hook is that the goblinoids have taken over a town who were aligned with the orcs and now they wanted back, but it belongs to the hold now, so humans and orcs are siding against them.

[@kief453]

For everyone and for my notes : 1) Warhammer fantasy roleplay system 2nd edition (tides of war - system of procedures... to get to a heroic moment); 2) Matt Colville system; 3) DMG mixup system (mobs, average damage with Sly Flourish mob calculator); 4) Don't forget morale; 5) Don't forget different types of units (infantry, cavalry, scouts, ranged, magic casters); 6) Focus on decisive moments to make the PC shine, don't play all the war in initiative;

[@PadraicSmith]

I absolutely loved the idea of a tetsudo and a fireball just crashing against it like a wave over a rock and all the people inside being covered from it. Just marching a band of 20 men into a cascade of fireballs under total protection of their shields. That's so badass.

[@AGrumpyPanda]

When you think about it, a properly-formed tetsudo should really count as full cover, so it makes perfect sense that a fireball or similar wouldn't do anything. However, a lightning bolt or similar ability would still go straight through, and a spell like that might be how you break open those formations. Pathfinder also had rules for fitting the bead of a fireball through tight places, so imagine the morale effect of the enemy having a wizard competent enough to put a fireball *through* a tetsudo*.

[@PadraicSmith]

@@AGrumpyPanda Yeah, it's a really cool thing to like work on rules for as a DM in 5e, just because there isn't really much to work off of other than just logic and base combat rules.

[@AKNeal81]

BazBattles is perfect for inspiration on this topic! Historically accurate and great for showing use of formations in large scale battles.

[@knightghaleon]

I love setting my players against an army to defend against a siege or invading a castle. So the battles take place in different parts of the castle, like fighting in districts. Each one having its own challenges. My players have had to be stealthy after escaping a stronger unit and planning out a better surprise attack to drop a few heavy armor units. They're really good at detecting when I've thrown a tough unit at them that requires some give and take to beat.

[@baltsosser]

Use each player as the 'commander' of the large scale element. They make an attack role against an opposing role on the other side. If they are successful then a percentage dice is applied twice. A portion of the opposing army is then incapacitated through injury or killed as determined by their 'saving throw'. This has worked well in the past for me. A couple of bad throws here can see something that would have been a very even hard fought battle turn into a bad rout quickly. That changed the story and it went down a very different path that wound up being a great time.

[@WizardJim]

That line "Like an adventuring party!" is very telling. What if unit tactics in a fantasy world become based on the natural patterns that adventuring companies fall into? It just becomes standard military procedure that every unit of fighting men needs a certain ratio of healers, magic users, scouts and frontline fighters? If adventurers are the most effective small unit warriors around - and in most games, they will be, considering that town guards are like chaff before the scythe to your typical adventurers - a canny general might decide to adopt their tactics.

[@aurumdeius]

Oh that's an awesome idea you just gave me when you talked about thinking about how many creatures in dnd eat dead bodies. Necrows, Crows who feed on the flesh of the dead, and as they finish the skeleton animates.

[@prkr07]

You guys must be psionicists; I was JUST thinking that I could use some tips on a Dynasty Warriors system I'll be running, and here they are! Many thanks

[@fhuber7507]

Origin of D&D was breaking down to a few individuals out of a mass combat system. Instead of the mass warfare, center attention to just a small squad. Look up the game called "Chainmail" that was popular in the mid 1970's.

[@dragex6582]

My thought when they mentioned that maybe it would be a mix of small groups of well trained groups and mass clumps of armies was that maybe that's how the Elves of Valenar would be, given they normally travel in Warbands. After all, they'd need large groups to fight other large groups, especially in defense, while their Warbands could be the mobile, heavy hitting forces they use.

[@jamestanzer9188]

Squares were adopted as an anti-cavalry defence, but were utterly useless against infantry or artillery. At Waterloo, Wellington's squares repulsed Ney's cavalry with heavy casualties, but suffered when the French captured La Sainte Haye, which allowed artillery to be brought forward and pound the British squares with canister.

[@ryanmcintyre5639]

Honestly the spells that always spring to mind for me when it comes to large scale battles are weather and terrain controlling spells. Like if a mountain kingdom of goliaths is fighting like a human desert kingdom and their opening move is to have sleet storm cast up and down the front line. Suddenly they’re at a huge advantage.

[@Ronn0k]

There is now a 100% chance of Commander Pruitt and General Jim Davis being in my new campaign.

[@WebDM]

Omg yes

[@ViolentFEAR]

Already know: Great stuff as always. Love you guys!

[@JPruinc]

ViolentFEAR love you too

[@PapaBear_Gaming]

The only big battle I've done in an RPG was comprised mostly of a demon having assembled an army of Shadows and attempting to wipe out a large city. They may have lost to the cleric/paladin army over the long haul but they wiped a decent portion of the city, and their intent of sowing mayhem and causing widespread harm over the continent were never truly stopped. A single Shadow escaping means the war continues.

[@WebDM]

Shadows are very tenacious opponents. Spooky!

[@CzarVentus]

This is a really fascinating topic, and as far as I know not many have talked about having large scale battles in dnd. I would love if you guys would go into more detail in another episode, but thats just me I guess

[@bisonhappenstance]

6:20 Watch out for the sneak attack, y'all.

[@adamwelch4336]

This will help me find ideas for D&D pirate ship fights! Spelljammer pirates and what not!

[@WebDM]

Awesome!

[@kentmckernan5719]

You mentioned the impact of wizards casting high level AOE spells against dense formations of soldiers and what effect that would have. What about WW1 trench warfare? Encounters could be trench raids, exploring bombed out villages in no-mans-land, repelling counter attacks, behind enemy lines intelligence gathering. Battles are less dynamic with daily casualty and territory tallies. Campaign could center around a magical arms race locating relics or resources, or foiling the enemies arcane R&D.

[@benjaminodonnell258]

I suspect fireball casting wizards would have the same effect on infantry as artillery did. Infantry had to become more disciplined and flexible so they could change formations rapidly depending on what they were facing - "form line" against artillery (or fireballs), "form square" against cavalry, and endless drills to switch rapidly between the two.

[@bassett_green]

I wonder if you'd be allowed to put a post-it note or tape over the entrance chime sensor when you're filming? The beeping really comes through quite loudly

[@MrJethroha]

In DnD battles, the power of Paladins to turn a situation becomes obvious. The Paladin's smite makes them incredible fighters to start off, but their auras and healing/buffing abilities make them ideal for holding a formation together. I mean fireballs are great, but if you've got an oath of the ancient paladin, then everyone within 10 feet is getting +5 to their dex save and taking half damage from all spells. If you have a whole formation of paladins, then they should be auto succeeding on all saving throws (except that they errata'd that out but oh well).

[@Gokuderakun]

A good touchstone for monster reactions to a battle is the RWBY online series. In RWBY there are monsters called Grimm which attack humans specifically and are attracted to negative emotions. Well when a Great War broke out many villages fell but on the battlefield specifically it was a situation where they had to do temporary cease fires to deal with these giant monsters that are attracted to the battle.

[@luiken3]

This has very much made me want to run an entire campaign circling one war. And the players start at level 1 in the grit of the front line.

[@CJ_esc.artist]

Band of Blades RPG

[@LordSplendid]

In the Battle of 300 Champions, which took place 545 BCE, Sparta and Argos agreed to fight with only 300 men each to settle their dispute. This kind of agreements are extremely rare, as there isn't much to keep either side from deploying the full force if they lose the scaled-down battle. But in a fantasy world you can have an actual god of war that have opinions on how wars are conducted and apply them a somewhat objective manner. "If both sides agree, a battle of champions can be declared to the god of war. A planetar will be sent to upheld the deal". Make the Battle of Champions a ten man deal, and you can have a manageable dnd combat with the PCs to determine the outcome of a war.

[@ZigCopasetic]

Look up the Aztec 'Flower Wars'