5 Ships that Mysteriously Vanished on the Great Lakes

[@BigOldBoats]

Thank you for watching! What's your favorite Great Lakes mystery?

[@pedenharley6266]

Hmm, does “How did the Brits and Americans manage to build huge warships on Lake Ontario in the War of 1812?” count as a Great Lakes mystery question?

[@RF24]

The rouse Simmons Christmas tree ship always sticks in my mind

[@zacharypotvin6579]

Snow Snakes

[@Faded-Tales-PreviouslyHarley]

I just find it interesting that essentially all shipwrecks ended in 1993. The only outlier is one glass bottomed pleasure cruise that sank and killed two. But even that happened in 2000. I wonder why in the past 30 years, there’s only been one wreck which was a pleasure cruise and not even a large ship, when before that there were so many. Did shipping by boat across the lakes stop? Or are there new measures in place to protect them? Just seeing multiple every decade and then hearing no cargo ships sank since 1993, and no other accidents have happened in 23 years. It’s odd to me without knowing why. I’m assuming shipping slowed down and now it’s by plane. But surely some shipping still takes place?

[@Mavisdundundunnnmanston]

Probably the Fitzgerald, because Gordon Lightfoot gets (happily) stuck in my head during any of your great lakes videos. I'm sure you also love the song. Everyone following this channel probably also loves the song.

[@Outdoor_Carnivore]

I love the fact that you cover all ships of the world. It is great learning about the great ocean liners, but it is also refreshing to learn about the lake boats that most of the world knows nothing about.

[@tinypoolmodelshipyard]

Well said 🎉🎉

[@NealBones]

Honey wake up! New Big Old Boats dropped!

[@jamesfracasse8178]

Thanks darling, bring up cereal 🥣 and glass of juice 🥤 for me in bed 🛏️ 1:06

[@cristiancristi9384]

For some weird reason as soon as I opened the KZbin app this morning , youtube sent me a pop-up message to evaluate this comment (???) And to rate it from "horrible" to "excellent".... I rated it as excellent and then they sent me another message to check why "on earth" 😆 I would consider to have this opinion about it.... I checked "it shows appreciation to the video creator" .... Well this is obvious but it baffles my mind why youtube would investigate this comment that has nothing "strange" or "unusual" in it....

[@revived1674]

Babe wake up, another copy and pasted comment

[@mauriceclark4870]

The shop sinkings seem too take all of the crews with them not many survivers. Seems very hazardous occupation to me

[@NealBones]

@Revived Darling go to bed. You just ratioed yourselves

[@Maxharddrive64]

My father was a merchant marine on the great lakes.He wasn't scared of much...but the lakes.. lets say he had A healthy respect.. He'd tell stories about Superior and how regularly in the mornings they'd wake to the bow being completely covered in ice....in AUGUST...

[@dexchex5685]

As someone who grew up on the Great Lakes I love these videos, keep them coming.

[@91_C4_FL]

My favorite vanished ship of the Great Lakes is the SS James C Carruthers. Less than a year old, it was lost in the great storm of 1913 and remains lost to this day. It’s story and the evidence that it potentially got lost and foundered is fascinating.

[@StephenMcmonagle-dv4kf]

which would explain why it wouldnt be claimed when found, they would have to render over the contents to the govt if they wanted to seize it for a ''museum'' or some b.s.

[@0759trainz]

The Great Lakes are fascinating yet terrifying at the same time

[@MarianneKat]

They have great power, and are routinely underestimated.

[@joshfrankem4372]

Great thing usually are

[@kimlersue]

I was raised on lake Michigan..and it is very dark water. I loved learning to swim off the little beach..playing in the sand and .watching the ferry boats. I fell asleep listening to the fog horns and boats talking to each other. As a child it all seemed to safe, warm and homey..and i had zero thought about ships going down. Then one family as lost in the lake. Everyone was out looking for them and happily they were found safe. I looked at the dark water, my play yard, with a new respect..and caution. REST IN PEACE ALL WHO GO DOWN IN SHIPS!

[@chuckzehnder530]

Great job. When I was young, I used to dive shipwrecks in Lakes Superior and Michigan back in the 1960s and 70s. You have done a masterful job of research.

[@jjnich4915]

Good morning fellow boat nerds! Going to watch this one while I stare out at the shores of Lake Huron.

[@lisadolan689]

I’m in cairns in Australia 🇦🇺

[@jjnich4915]

@@lisadolan689 Hello, Lisa. You are across the world from me but we are both here together because of boats! 🇦🇺🇨🇦

[@erbewayne6868]

Just on the harbor dock at Lexington.

[@clarsach29]

Actually I think my favourite Great Lakes ship mystery is that of the SS Edmund Fitzgerald.....the "mystery" being how a modern, well-built ship can sink on the lakes as late as 1975.....the recurring theme with all of these though seems to be the relentless pressure to squeeze just one more cargo trip across the Lakes in, before the ice forms.....and this then coincides with November storms and tragedy.

[@MarianneKat]

The Fitz filled my childhood with anniversaries and new info or hypotheses. Gorden Lightfoot just passed and they rang the bell at the mariner's church in Detroit 28 times...plus one for him. 😢. 'One last run' is a big theme cuz it can mean the difference between a profit or loss year. I just wish they had better weather prediction to be able to make those choices safer.

[@Mavisdundundunnnmanston]

@@MarianneKat one of my favorite sad songs of all time. I've added it to so many spotify playlists. Gonna go listen again.

[@LokiOdinson-fz8ps]

@@MarianneKat barf. Lightfoot only wrote that song to MAKE MONEY.

[@pickeljarsforhillary102]

@@LokiOdinson-fz8ps Feelings dont pay the bills or keep the fridge full.

[@shereesmazik5030]

The relatives of the lost didn’t feel that way . They knew the song would make sure their loved ones were not forgotten.

[@JozefLucifugeKorzeniowski]

the lakes always innately freaked me out. I grew up on a coast, so seeing the lakes that are so vast they look like the ocean just feels unsettling.

[@parsleypalace3272]

Haunting stories, well presented. My heart goes out to all those mariners who were lost. Thanks for remembering them through your video!

[@Stay100chicago]

•

[@thejudgmentalcat]

I swam on Lake Superior in the mid-70's in July and was amazed how cold it was even though temps were in the mid-80's. I can't imagine what a winter storm would feel like. RIP to all victims of the Lakes ❤

[@johncmitchell4941]

I swam in Lake Michigan on a Chicago beach in the '60s in July. The sand burned our bare feet. I got as far out as to waist deep for just a minute or so (brrrr) and spent the rest of the trip sitting on a towel getting a sunburn. btw, all but lake Erie are topographically literal soup bowls. Storms and rogue waves can confound the most seaworthy vessel.

[@mimib8032]

The average surface temp of Superior is about 45 degrees, even mid summer. I made it up to my ankles before noping out.

[@razy7609]

@@johncmitchell4941 By soup bowls do you just mean uniform?

[@johncmitchell4941]

@@razy7609 Yes somewhat uniformly steep as one gets away from shore. Rare exceptions include much of lake Erie, Lake Huron's Saginaw Bay, and some of it's Georgian Bay in Canadian waters. IMO the best boating & sailing lakes anywhere, but ocean-like in their treachery.

[@zacharynorton9796]

September is usually when the water temps are the warmest…the summer sun has been beating down on the lakes but also depends on what the currents are doing as well. I live in Sheboygan right on the coast of Lake Michigan and we don’t go to the beach for swimming until really late in the summer…too damn cold the rest of the year

[@B0BBARKER444]

The Lake, it is said, never give up their dead when the gales of November turn gloomy

[@LokiOdinson-fz8ps]

BARF. Stop bringing up that damn song. little Gordy only wrote it to make money.

[@annbower6278]

​@@LokiOdinson-fz8ps no he didn't to make money. He wanted the 29 men remembered & he DONATED all the money to the 29 families left behind. Your attitude is both disgraceful & disrespectful. Maritime Sailors Cathedral rang the bell for 30 times, 29 for the Fitz crew & the 30th for Gordon Lightfoot because of his death.

[@luckyguy600]

Super! Never enough stories told about the Great lake Ships & sailors.

[@thomashowlett8295]

A very familiar Great Lakes story. A freighter leaves port, an unexpected storm arises, Ship is never seen again.

[@dianewright5575]

It's so hard to understand how/why some of these ships have never been found. Thank You for an excellent presentation of these haunting stories.

[@christinaredepenning2760]

My interest in Lake Superior began a few years ago on a trip to Duluth MN. I went to the lighthouse and learned all about the ships that sank and were left in the lake. I originally thought.. no way.. this is a lake. But I learned to have a little more respect for the Great Lakes. I love learning about history that happened in a state that I’ve grown to love since moving here in 1997! Thank you for all your stories ❤

[@therealtony2009]

I love these great lakes videos! Please do more! I love your channel.

[@Paul-jb1yw]

Being a western New Yorker, I fully understand the dangers of the lakes, the storm last Christmas was curtsey of lake Erie, I got around a foot and half in Niagara Falls, but just under 20 miles to my south in Buffalo they got 5 feet.

[@witeshade]

I swear, at least half the shipwrecks happpen on the "one last voyage of the season"

[@bobberttv8565]

Nothing like waking up to some great lakes story

[@TurboMcAwesome]

What we've learned is to just never take the last trip of the season.

[@DarthAverage]

The lesson here seems to be, if your captain says, "This will be our last run of the season," then get off the ship NOW.

[@thecivilwarguy3674]

HUZZAH MORE GREAT LAKES

[@thechief043]

Since I live in this area, I'm fascinated with these mini-oceans.

[@Here_is_Waldo]

Thanks for this, Bob. Always entertaining and informative.

[@erinhilliard9347]

As someone who grew up on Lake Michigan and spent a decade living near Lake Superior, I’m so glad you’re sharing these stories for future generations.

[@scorpion19142001]

Who's going really going to remember? Rogue Waves on any of the Great Lakes?

[@erinhilliard9347]

@@scorpion19142001 it’s not about first hand accounts. I personally know a merchant mariner. It’s not easy work, but the stories from now and then are exciting. Obviously we’re past having most people alive remember any of these stories, but their accounts live on through this channel bringing their stories of bravery, ingenuity, sacrifice and camaraderie to life so that future generations will know what it took to build this country, put food on the table and build what we have today.🇺🇸🇨🇦

[@sharonsplat]

That was a sweet song for his friends. The sadness, hurt, and love in it are palpable.

[@benlund4906]

This is one of my favorite channels. I love the subject matter! And you have a perfect voice to narrate these stories. Big fan!

[@kitkat914]

I’m in love with your Channel!! Can you do a video about the Marysburgh vortex or like Lake Michigan Triangle? Those are probably the most mysterious areas of the Great Lakes

[@Megabob777]

It's a good day when Bob uploads

[@retroemo9316]

Thank you for giving the length in feet and meters. As someone being used to meter it’s way easier to follow. Looking forward to your next video!

[@lisadolan689]

Agreed

[@KimtheElder]

as someone who can't visualize a multitude of yards OR meters, I tend to like the size of a football field (American football fields) 😅. I am joking, but not joking. very sad state of affairs on my part..... yet, I can parallel park with relative ease 🤷🏻‍♀️

[@MarianneKat]

As an American nurse, I can float between the two relatively well. When we had an Italian exchange student I was always calculating things in my head for him so I thanked my mathy engineer dad for that ability😂. I can parallel park if I must, but many social skills are beyond me. 🤷‍♀️

[@LokiOdinson-fz8ps]

Or you can stop being lazy and do the conversion like everyone else.

[@karissahenry2277]

I'm at a campground in Grand Marais in my tent, while it rains, listening to this videos in the dark 😌😊

[@clarksmith8517]

I used to work on ships like this… Lake Superior is no joke when there’s a bad storm!

[@bernhardbruening7546]

Worked 1955 and 1956 on a Canadian Texaco tanker, Great Lakes and coastal trade . Great Lakes were rougher than Atlantic coast when weather turned.

[@scofab]

A pleasure as always and thanks again.

[@JohnDavies-cn3ro]

Love these stories, made all the more enjoyable by the old movie films which bring them back to life. Am I correct in thinking that both 'Bannockburn' and M&B No 2 have been found since this film was made?

[@AlexGarcia-ew2fv]

I lov listening 2 these stories in bed to fall asleep..they mentally relax me..

[@iamrichrocker]

Keep up the great content and presentation..your subs have been increasing at a good rate..a sign that many of us like good editing and subject matter that catches our attention..

[@Cheezwizzz]

Please do a story on those monstrously creepy Hulett unloading cranes!!

[@WileyCylas]

They look like giant grasshopper legs 🙈🦗

[@scottieeasley4907]

its crazy to see back in the 1905 hydraulic cranes loading the ships lol

[@johnengland8619]

Thanks again for the content, excellent

[@prudencepineapple9448]

Much Kudos to you. It's great to see your channel grow. The P&O line servicing India and the far East like Malaysia, Singapore, Australia etc would be interesting to cover including the 'Straths' from the inter-war period. Beautiful ships. Not many know of P&O as White Star and Cunard seem to dominate peoples minds when British shipping history is mentioned.

[@Gb_cole]

Another fantastic video

[@stevehomeier8368]

Thank you for another fine video! As always I’m impressed with the amount of research you put in. It’s amazing how much actual footage you are able to find as well as the skillful editing in of relevant shots and film

[@porkbud8387]

Thanks for the upload. It's a great video very interesting.

[@wht-rabt-obj]

Born and raised in Michigan my whole life and spent a lot of time in northern Michigan and the Upper Peninsula. Even in the most technically advanced ship from today, I would be nervous to be on Lake Superior in November -December ☠️ Absolutely gorgeous scenery, though ❤

[@micheleshively8557]

Great stories, great job! Love this channel ❤️

[@esterherschkovich6499]

New sub here from the UK 😊

[@BigOldBoats]

Welcome aboard! :)

[@bendoingthing]

I love your videos. You deserve waaaay more subs. Keep it up

[@lorenrogers9269]

I love your informative and relaxed videos. I remember in an older video that you stated that you hated your voice. I thought you should know that both my wife and I chatted about your voice. We both believe your voice is different (from average, in a good way) and exceedingly soothing. Keep up the good work. 👍🏻

[@gayprepperz6862]

I wonder how many ships went down on the Great Lakes while trying to make "just one last run" for the company? The Great Lakes in October (and especially November and her infamous Witch), are notoriously wicked. Profit always seems to be always preferred over prudence. So sad. The companies honor their dead employees, mourn the loss of their money make ship, and collect the insurance money, while the family is lucky to collect the last pay check owed to the employees and their families.

[@annbower6278]

There are 6 thousand shipwrecks on the lake beds from Superior to Ontario.

[@gayprepperz6862]

@@annbower6278 I thought it was more. Nevertheless, that's an astounding figure for inland waters.

[@cattandneil1504]

Loved this video! Subscriber now!

[@BigOldBoats]

Thank you! Welcome aboard!

[@RhiannonSteadman-Kenny]

I'd love to hear about the N V Derbyshire (I think that's what they called it) that's a weird 1, went down with all hands and took ages to find it.

[@chrismitlyng1411]

You should do a video on the Madeira and all of the ships that were lost on the same late November storm on Superior!

[@Duececoupe]

Another excellent video! Keep these coming....and others of course! 👍🏻👌🏻👏🏻🏆🥇

[@SNP-1999]

May all the brave seamen who gave up their lives doing their duties aboard the ships that were lost rest in eternal peace.

[@rtrThanos]

We’re gonna need a bigger boat.

[@Harbinger_of_nurgle]

Mine didn’t vanish but it’s still a weird story, the “caterpillars” are a couple of excavators sitting on the lake bottom in the middle of Lake Erie for some reason.

[@asteroidrules]

Contents of a barge that got buried in the lakebed perhaps? A lot of what sinks in Erie doesn't stop going down when it hits the bottom.

[@pedenharley6266]

Great video! Thank you! And eek, the whaleback design seems awful!!!

[@zacharykelly7434]

They were fairly unique and the story behind them is pretty interesting tbh

[@hesseltjeb]

Great video! Would love to see your take on an SS Rotterdam video!

[@brenkirgaming4586]

Yes another Great Lakes video!

[@ohnoohyeah3205]

I miss my grandparents and their cottage just south of Ludington, MI. ❤ The sand squeaks 😂

[@Faded-Tales-PreviouslyHarley]

Have you ever done a video about terrible sinkings where thousands died due to both an accident but also overcrowding? Doña Paz comes to mind - 4,400 souls and only 26 survivors. Or MV Wilhelm Gustloff, a cruise ship made for 1,900 people but carried 10,000 souls and only 1,200 survived? Or, while I know your name is big old boats, if you wanted a small change for one video, an interesting thing would just be touching on smaller crafts and why the ratio of survivors to souls first on board is so much higher than many large ships. I’m thinking the Duck Boats, and in Lake George, NY the Ethan Allen flipped over with a ship full of 47 seniors, and only 27 + captain survived. Why? Because canopies being added to pleasure cruises are 100% deadly in a flip. Just some ideas if you haven’t done them. If you have or don’t want to - ignore me! I love any video you put out. I’ve just been looking for videos like this, instead of “here is a complete talk about Doña Paz.” Comparisons make it interesting.

[@B0BBARKER444]

You should check out Brick Immorter. He just did a great video on the duck boats recently

[@LokiOdinson-fz8ps]

@@B0BBARKER444 don't check brick immoral. He is in bed with an ambulance chaser and no longer can be seen as anything but a mouth piece for the rich lawyers that are running up prices to pad their bank accounts.

[@Faded-Tales-PreviouslyHarley]

@@B0BBARKER444 love his work! He covered Duck Boats, which are those driving and then boating boats. Most recently was the Ethan Allen incident in Lake George, which is about a 1.5 hours from my house and I was 14 during, so I remember it sort of. (EDIT TO ADD: ) Ethan Allen was just a ship that had moved around so much and never got inspected, the incident was bound to happen. I just tend to follow multiple disaster channels because even if two different air crash pages speak of the same incident, you’ll get a bit more information by watching them both. And honestly, I’d love to see this channel’s take on it. Obviously a one off since they aren’t big or old boats but I think I’d really enjoy him talking about it as it’s just a bit different than Brick Immortal.

[@bigmonmagoomba9634]

Another great job.

[@sagebiddi]

How many of my sibling Michiganders remember how we were taught to memorize the GLs ? ...I always think of my fav old man who was so nice to my family and gave us access to his H..O..M..E..S in Port Huron ,Grosse ille , and Shay Lake ...atvs, pontoons, jet skis , he had it all and was estranged from his family so I think at first he was just lonely but after awhile I think he got overwhelmed by my fam treating him like he was just another uncle or cousin and used to make him dance and shove southern style food in his face and made him drink and play dominoes at the bbqs....I was at school at UofM when I received a call from my bro telling me he had fell down his basement stairs after trying to muscle a big blue office water jug unto his house by himself despite us constantly nagging him to just call the house. ... dammit. Now I'm crying again. Man was I a mess then too. 3 of the next generation of kids from siblings and I all are have his namesake...I love you and I miss you Harold Rinehart McGee Jr....see ya soon you

[@lsrose]

I’m from Kentucky and have never seen the Great Lakes. I’ve watched my share of videos about the lakes and ships lost on them. I’m both fascinated by the storms and mystified by the loss of these ships. My take is that the captains overestimate their ships and underestimate the power of a sudden storm. I cannot fathom a storm on the lakes.

[@juliemanarin4127]

Great vidoe...thank you! I live in Chicago and I know how big these lakes really are.

[@ohnoohyeah3205]

Any Lake St. Clair stories? The ❤ of the Great lakes.

[@henryfoster3212]

I love you videos I love the feeling about staying in a ship's in the past learn about what you think that make them sucked thank you for sharing your Channel with us and I hope your son outgrow thank you🤝🚢

[@OrbitFallenAngel]

I love learning about Shipwrecks that are barely talked about or known in History. Everyone knows about the most famous Shipwreck, The Edmund Fitzgerald.... You do an excellent job of explaining everything in great detail!! Why are these Shipwrecks so unknown? Like don't they matter?? Lots of men who merely wanted to make money working on the Great Lakes dying when their ships go down mysteriously in bad weather... It's really sad to hear about all of these Ghostly Shipwrecks that are all but unknown to the general public....😞 May All of the Men Who Perished When Their Ships Went Down Rest In Peace!! 🙏💙❤

[@Ro6entX]

Weird, thought the SS Marquette was found not long ago

[@jo-annknowles1373]

I love any video about ships on the GL ... my mum is canadian and i visited as a child . Its my dream to move over there and explore the pukasaw trail and other areas . I think my favourite vids of the area are about duluth , so the mataafa would have to be my fav one . . So sad 😞. Makes me so upset . Ty for all your videos mr BOB . And heres to many mofe ❤😊 .

[@cakejuicesprinkles2553]

Such an interesting video! Go Milwaukee💪🏽😎

[@wilurbean]

The straits are no joke. Live there now, but lived on the mouth of the Chesapeake Bay. Straits are far more violent and unpredictable. Storms appear on the horizon all the time, year round, west of the Mackinac Bridge. Even in clear skies in midsummer, clear everywhere, except over the western side of the straits where lightening can be seen over the lake. It's bizarre Every native family on beaver Island is a seaman, almost by definition.

[@jonmajarucon51]

17:12 a body is pretty deteriorated after only a couple of days at sea. When they found Captain Mcleods body after several months they found "slash marks"? Was his body frozen?

[@sirridesalot6652]

Or perhaps hit by a propeller?

[@jonmajarucon51]

@@sirridesalot6652 I never considered that! 🙂

[@chrismarley3536]

Great research, narration, film clips & even the background music. Thanks for sharing. Sounds like the builders of the Titanic a few years after the twin ships @ beginning of your video could've benefitted from this knowledge of inferior material; however, seems like it could've been unheeded even if the advice given & accepted

[@charylliss1721]

Lighthouse legends of the Great Lakes 😊

[@louscannon7493]

It's hard to believe, in this day and age, that any large ship remains lost in the relatively shallow depths of Lake Erie.

[@sagebiddi]

As a 5th gen Michigander and lake lover @NCHUBB PRODZ you remind me of fam elders who have stood around the beach fire and retold and talked about how much Erie is always underestimated and how much man made material is "under the lake" ...lol I even remember my dad and uncles saying stuff like "That damn street light bet not beat you home boy or that gd room better be clean or ima put you under the lake" ....Ah...always nice when one can be threatened by such epic bodies of the H..O..M..E..S

[@sabrinabowen8195]

The Edmund fitzgerald, my dad was born 5 days after it sank and I just like stuff like this.

[@priscillamcclure4272]

Eerie to know how many ships were taken by our great lakes, I put my foot in lk superior it was so cold right at the shore it scared me

[@footballlvnlady]

I live in Wisconsin near Lake Michigan. She can be calm and gorgeous in the summer. In October through December she is a mean old girl.

[@dwayneroberts6616]

It's not just the size of the waves in the great lakes it's the frequency of the waves. They come at you in much shorter wave intervals and you get 3 monster waves one right after the other instead of one at a time.

[@nealk6387]

I’ve lived in Michigan all my life and never knew there were this many large freighters that have never been found.

[@Pstanich]

Great music❤❤

[@joshuamuir7577]

Just wondering, where did you get the black and white footage from that played in the background of you narrating?

[@edensarnelli9373]

The scariest part of all these ghost ships to me are that they just float around the world for a maximum of 30 years with NO ONE finding them, and then they just appear... I feel that it happens with ships a lot. But has it happened with a stable structure like an Oil Rig? Like, just an Oil Rig floating around the water hundreds of Miles away from it's drilling location?

[@joshua-md1ll]

When are you going to investigate the wreck of the Edmond Fitzgerald

[@SNP-1999]

As an Englishman, not only the peculiar names of many Great Lakes merchant vessels seem unusual, the peculiar design of the vessels - with the pilot's house or bridge atop of the bow - came as a surprise to me, never having seen such a design of vessel before, although I live in the second largest port of Europe and have seen countless types of ocean going vessels in my life, also professionally. Can anyone explain the history of such a design and why they seem to be particular to the Great Lakes shipping ?

[@bryanbrennan2827]

The EDMUND FITZGERALD.Start to finish..play Gordon's msusic too pls.. thanx. I m from Avoca, Mich.. B

[@larson0014]

South "man a too" is the pronunciation

[@justsmallstuff4994]

Commenting for the algorithm gods

[@ramonsanchez6903]

The Cyclops or is that a Open Sea Ocean Ship??

[@ohnoohyeah3205]

Was that the Boblo Boat??!!

[@benjohnston2558]

I love how rich kids seemed more likely then to try and make thier own way back then.

[@ramonsanchez6903]

Oh my goodness Deer

[@Lori_Hanna]

The great lakes are the only fresh water tidal lakes on the planet.

[@chendaforest]

Not the only. Technically every lake has tidal variation but it's usually too small to be noticeable. However other fresh water lakes do have observable tides.

[@sloppyfloppy79]

The types of steel is always blamed. There was a cargo ship that broke up not too long ago overseas built with modern steel. The more you look into freighter sinkings, the more you realize there is no mystery to the Edmund Fitzgerald. It broke up just like the rest.

[@chendaforest]

Would any of the bodies of the Clifton's crew have survived in the fresh water ?