Biscuit Battle: Franklin vs Goldee's vs TMG

[@yeshuaiscomin]

Shoutout to Mad Scientist for the best BBQ music on KZbin

[@XxsteamerxX]

DAAAAANGG!!!!I just missed you! I moved out West a year ago from the Detroit area. My son got married 10/21 and I was in town for that on the 19th. I could have come out. Also my nieces have a pop-up coffee bar that may have been there. So mad I missed you. I would definitely have drooped by for some great brisket. Next time, Gadget... Next time!

[@obaits3225]

Killing me that I missed you in Michigan! Your information and knowledge has been invaluable

[@copper4eva]

Franklin pit is especially impressive given that it is cooking wide open with no damper on the smoke stack. Usually that means a lot of aggressive airflow (which it probably is producing a lot of air flow) that causes the hot spots to be more aggressive. I think the franklin pit is a really genius design, with the water pan shelf that creates a pressure vacuum to pull all the hot air up and in to.

[@mbed0123]

Many thanks, Jeremy. So many! You've given me the confidence to move forward with my smoking. Did my first brisket (19.57lbs! Un-trimmed) a month ago and followed your guidance to a "T" I ended up with a nine-hour unwrapped and an additional four hours wrapped on the smoker! Then a fourteen-hour rest period in the oven at a hundred and fifty degrees. Just simply put "bang on fantastic" all around! Used hickory log and a lump charcoal mix throughout. Thanks again for the trade secrets!!

[@johnmcleanjr.1468]

Very good results and information. I love the test.

[@pjredrock13]

Ordered my goldees yesterday. Can’t wait to see the videos so I can get more info on how to cook on it

[@christopherjacob6209]

How has it worked out for you?

[@yenzen9112]

Would have liked to have seen more discussion in this vid about the baffle setups that these pits had. That is a big factor in how the heat is distributed through the chamber.

[@ourlifeinwyoming4654]

Smoked biscuits! Yum - what'd you use, tallow, Lawry's, etc.? LOL! Been waiting for this episode!

[@MadScientistBBQ]

Hahaha these were not eaten

[@ourlifeinwyoming4654]

For sure! Great video! @@MadScientistBBQ

[@chilled002]

Perfect test to be honest.. it's like putting a vehicle in a wind tunnel. Never really thought of this but its a perfect test to figure out what your offset does.

[@jroper04]

Just wanted to say thanks for your videos. Very informative and helped me choose my next offset. Getting the workhorse 1975.

[@MadScientistBBQ]

That’s a great pit!

[@d1ppaz]

What made you choose the Workhorse 1975 over the Franklin ? I’m trying to decide between the two

[@lyleswavel320]

Just needs some cheese, brisket & eggs to put on those biscuits

[@M4ttNet]

Great comparison. Your videos on these cookers are so useful. It's very hard to fine useful comparisons for al of these things and it's not like you can just go to the store and test things like these. Really enjoying my Workhorse 1975. Was a toss up between it and the Fat Stack, but at the price the 1975 won out.

[@farrisfcs39]

So what would happen if you just made the Franklin Pit Larger to match the TMG or if the TMG pit with that style shelf/baffle in it would be the same results. Those are the biscuits that got burned. 40 percent of the bottom grate on the Franklin is gone because of it. Also you can pull that fire back closer to the door on the TMG. It seemed like in the video it was in there a bit. I think playing with the fire management and running actual BBQ temps you will see a big difference in the Volunteer.

[@jerrychastain8567]

That makes good sense to me.

[@tmgpits]

We agree. It’s not rocket science!!!

[@Ryansbbqnbrew]

You can get a blue smoke smoker for $1700 which is a sister company of big Phil’s smoker which is very similar to all of those and 3/8. Love all the pits and would love to have them but my budget was blue smoke and love it!! Great video been a follower since the old country smoker days. 🍻

[@catfishman9516]

Nice work! You even got your brother starting a bbq business 😂

[@MadScientistBBQ]

It only took a decade 😂

[@KNIronworks]

I’m going to have to try this. Good video!

[@chrishabgood8900]

now we need a hell of a lot of butter and go to town!!!

[@MadScientistBBQ]

Haha some of them would have been tasty I think

[@epickleuva]

Why is there a water pan in the Goldees pit? Massive heat sink. The Volunteer needs to be run with the stack half closed first few hours. Door cracked. Small fire. Runs like a dream.

[@SocalReloader]

Maybe because he's trying to sell Goldees pits...

[@epickleuva]

@@SocalReloader you nailed it

[@debo98433]

Every test or cook that I’ve seen you do on that Franklin has been impressive. If I can ever convince my wife of the benefits from buying a cooker for $5000, I’d like to get one of those.

[@GovG33k]

2:35 The adult jack-in-the-box! 😂

[@jerrychastain8567]

I couldn’t help but notice the water pan baffle on the Goldees pit…would the pan not being there have changed the 14.28% ? Nice video and very informative. 😁

[@ryanb4481]

Yes. The water pan appeared to do very little to deflect the heat on the two biscuits behind it. It essentially just took the place of another biscuit which would have been burnt as well. So without water pan would be 20%.

[@bobbyd_cg]

You need to see if you can get a test done with a Lone Star Grillz Texas Edition. I’m really intrigued by them, but can’t find any videos with them.

[@rok4220]

See you Saturday, tix purchased already

[@ronherman6033]

are you still getting a Workhorse 1975 as not heard it mentioned or that it was delivered yet? Whats the story after giving it such good reviews in your comparison last year?

[@kyler.7794]

He said he has one in the video… he said his brother is using it

[@sydleyrobertsonjr.3315]

I would also like to see an LSG Texas Edition review.

[@THutch556]

So much can dictate a biscuit test. Totally bias IMO. Where you position your fire in the firebox, wether it’s closer to the door versus Cook chamber will make a difference, if testing with heat from a larger coal bed, versus open flames will also make a difference, obviously how you run your stack damper makes a huge difference. With the TMG drawing as hard as it can with a wide open stack, of course it pulled harder and cooked more on one side. Heat was rushing through. Adding a water pan to the goldees pit right in the hot spot, (reducing the burned percentage) and then also closing down the damper to even out the Cook chamber. (Slowing down convection) Yeah Totally fair! Lol. Run that test again on that pit with no water pan and stack open, the same way the TMG was set up and your percentage is gonna be way different. For anyone who’s never done a biscuit test, once you learn your pit, you can make a biscuit test look as good as you want or as bad as you want.

[@tmgpits]

Well said!!!

[@youwould2779]

This should be pinned. Well said.

[@Zokfend]

Very interesting comparison. Thanks!!

[@kyleanderson3323]

Why didn't you include the fat stack?

[@ivanibarra6574]

No workhorse thrown in the mix?

[@dansteiner9393]

Would love to see how this compares to the 1975. Is the Goldee's really better?

[@DJLabradors]

Hey will you be coming back to Michigan again soon.? We are 2 hours away and would love to come see you but this week is slammed! Hope you come back to MI and do another demo!

[@MrFreezeMovie]

What about the glaring omission of the Fatstack 120?

[@ryanb4481]

Why review a product that virtually no one has nor will ever get? The company has barely delivered any of their backyard smokers and are now apparently out of money and materials.

[@Jz-my8gc]

Jeremy won't talk about the fatstack

[@adamthrasher9088]

Franklin vs goldees vs milspec brisket test please 🙏

[@monami1359]

Thanks for the video. Would be great to see the Fatstack, too.

[@MadScientistBBQ]

I gave mine away in the spring to a friend who had to cancel his fatstack order so unfortunately I can’t use it anymore

[@1dhenke]

Per your vid post today, it would be great if your travel to Texas is to hopefully help Fatstack's issue @@MadScientistBBQ

[@Jz-my8gc]

Lol i ordered a fatstack over a year ago because you promoted how great it was. Ask me how that worked out. Oh boy, i still havent gotten my pit nor will i ever! Over $5,000 fatstack took from me. Im glad you are now promoting better pits 😂

[@Spectre_N7]

How dod it end up no pit and no money?

[@frankandbeansbbq]

I almost did the same thing. Glad I didn't, I ordered a Fridge 48 from @tmgpits instead.

[@peterbrushett7554]

Would’ve liked to see how a reverse flow would have compared to the three regular flow.

[@alvinsmith8250]

I wish Lone Star Grillz could have been in this test.

[@powerblaster9001]

I’m torn between the Franklin pit and the Goldees pit, yes they are expensive but I am not able to have a pit built easily. Would love to see some sort of comparison with fire management between the two for a longer cook (and other pits in the mix, why not!)

[@joseluismendoza9916]

Franklin will not disappoint, if can be afforded. I saved my allowance for 2 1/2 years. I also don't invite more folks that can fit in my pool, so size is not an issue. I can easily feed 30 folks.

[@powerblaster9001]

@@joseluismendoza9916thanks for the reply, I’m thinking along these lines as well. I don’t know if I’d ever take advantage of the full capacity of the goldees!

[@juanalmanza3143]

What are your thoughts on lone star grillz smokers?

[@wpherigo1]

Great approach! Have you considered doing tests on average person smokers (well under $1000)?

[@Michael_Green5]

i would honestly like to see more biscuits on the goldee's and franklin pits because going back and seeing jirby's video, the goldee's pit has an insanely small hot spot compared to the rest of the smoker that i dont think was showcased as well here

[@cwins91]

I think he showcased Goldee's perfectly, especially running all on the higher side of temps and relatively the same degrees F. And he provided the percentage of fail to success ratio. TMG being 62.5%, Franklin being 80%, and Goldee's being 85.7% success.. Meaning Goldee's came in 1st, Franklin 2nd and TMG 3rd.

[@jacobflores8666]

@@cwins91 Sure, the Goldee's pit came in first for this test quantitatively but the Franklin pit had better qualitative results. The biscuits in the hot spot of the Goldee's pit burnt to a crisp but only the edge of the biscuits in the hot spot facing the firebox of the Franklin pit got crisped up. The results would be would worse for the Goldee's pit if biscuits were in the water pan's place.

[@cwins91]

@@jacobflores8666 completely agree, I was gearing my comment towards the original comment not being happy with "how goldee's" was presented though.

[@bobnewhart4318]

Any inside news on whether they're going to start making the Goldees with the collapsible stack soon?

[@tstanley01]

I want to see the Lone Star Grillz biscuit test. The one they did on their own looks like they were cooked perfectly...

[@felipemata2960]

Yea the LSG texas edition. I love the way that pit is designed

[@XxsteamerxX]

@@felipemata2960 That's the one I wanted. I ended up with the 20x36 that I happened to get on Offerup from a guy that only basically did a burn in and one brisket. I saved like $900.00 on it. Problem is I haven't dialed it in yet with a biscuit test. My first brisket was slightly dried out and overcooked. But I absolutely love the huge firebox on it.

[@dmmultimediamx]

A time lapse with a thermal camera could be a good guide and comparison with the mass method

[@michaelcoughlin8238]

I want to see this on a reverse flow. Top and bottom rack. There have been some KZbin videos saying it's too hot underneath, but they ran their cookers high as if it was a direct flow. If you run it like a reverse flow, I think you'll be surprised at no hot spots and complete use of cooking surface.

[@frankandbeansbbq]

If I remember correctly I think @tmgpits has a video of a biscuit test on the Fridge. I don't remember where I saw it though..

[@AbbyMom100]

I have to ask. Did you leave in the tuning plates for the Old Country Pit you have? Did you adjust them further, take them out?

[@danjennings5068]

I'm not surprised that the goldees has a blowtorch down the center. That pipe joining a flat plate isn't great for airflow. Aaron talked a lot about smooth transitions for airflow in his designing a pit video. If it belled out and encouraged the hot air to spread out across the right wall it'd have a lot more BBQing space. That said, it can be handy to have a hot spot like that if you're wanting to hot/fast something while your low/slow cooks on the other end.

[@camblinmartin3226]

How do these compare to your Fat Stak?

[@skr1b]

What about the Mill scale? Wouldn't that have been an important one to test?

[@traumavfl6629]

Surprised to see the Mad Scientist throwing the scientific method to the wind. My understanding on fluid and thermodynamics is limited, but with both ends open on the stack and fire door, it would seem that you would have very different flow, especially with one having a water pan. Apples to oranges comparison, despite what the manufacturer says is preferred

[@brahtrumpwonbigly7309]

The scentific method was applied here. The question was not which one was the most evenly heated when set up the exact same as all the others The question was which one was capable of the most even heating, period. That does not automatically mean they will have the exact same setup under any circumstances. Is a prius faster than a Hellcat? It's an apples to oranges comparison, but the question was not how fast can they go with a specific number of cylinders, or noth being hybrids or whatever else you could come up with. The question was which was faster. Using manufacturer recommendations specific to either vehicle would absolutely be appropriate there. The real answer is that you'd have to test them all in a myriad of setups before determining what their true potential was, as they are all different in different ways.

[@XxsteamerxX]

@@brahtrumpwonbigly7309 Test parameters would include: Ease of adjustment, degrees of fine tuning, level of symmetry that could be achieved

[@bentleyfatheree1616]

The more I cook with my LSG the more I appreciate the baffle plate it has to distribute the heat on the bottom rack. .

[@tpharo34]

When you get to your brothers do the test; I have a 1975t I am waiting on. Come to San Antonio I ll be there 👍

[@QuinebaugOutdoors]

New subscriber here, if you're able to get in contact with some hunters do you think you'd be able to do a few videos on some smoked venison?

[@kristianstevens906]

Would be cool to try on my Outlaw Patio. It's certainly a different design of offset.

[@silveraven1]

Thanks Jeremy. I wish you would do a video like this on your whole line of smokers. As I have the Cheyenne and she’s pretty touchy to run. However, never tried closing the damper down. I have very little usable space on the smoker with that hotspot that is present on the larger smokers

[@richardwelterii7311]

I use a Cheyenne as well. I found that if you take the grate in the firebox out, it's a little easier to run. I bank a log on the back side of the coal bed and then put one on top, perpendicular to it. I also use 8" wood splits.

[@silveraven1]

@@richardwelterii7311 Thanks, I’ll giver a try. Have you ever tried removing the diffuser plate in the pit?

[@ericgtz66]

When you doing lonestar grillz?!?

[@debo98433]

Also, on the Franklin, is there any way a heat deflector by the fire box would help to diffuse some of that heat there and give you a little more usable space?

[@tinstaaflh3042]

Make smoked bread pudding and biscuits and gravy with all those biscuits

[@michaelduncan2759]

Damn was hoping for the Primitive Pits smoker to be involved in this.😞 My apologies if you already have, and I missed it.

[@dabigeasybbq]

Jirby posted reaction to the biscuit challenge

[@garycaouette4778]

The Goldees had a water pan for a heat sink at the firebox entrance. Did the other two? I didn’t see it on those.

[@MadScientistBBQ]

Neither of the other two did. The goldees pit is meant to have a water pan in that location

[@garycaouette4778]

@@MadScientistBBQ I thought the Franklin came with a water pan and specific location shelf above the cook chamber opening. Ok.

[@HectorGarcia-nm1pd]

Great test. BUT !!! $$$$ for a small PIT is crazy!!!🤔 Once again Great job on that test👍

[@XxsteamerxX]

Agreed, but disagree. At this level, you are either looking at a high personal interest in achieving the finest home smoking possible, or its looked upon as a lifetime purchase. Like a straight razor (which I also use), these could be passed down for a couple generations if properly cared for.

[@chrisneuman550]

The price of beef is getting so high that they invented bbq biscuit competitions...😂

[@NuarStanger]

Dang... i really hoped to see the workhorse in there.

[@dabigeasybbq]

Great test to find the hot zones on a grill and get to know your grill.. I have seen some people talk about budgets, so a good comparison would be the cheapest offset cook off.. I think an entry level comparison would be good to get the bbq juices flowing and show people you can do quality bbq within their budget. We all started somewhere based on our budget and progressed to bigger and expensive bbq smokers.

[@bjenksesq]

I thought we were going to get some biscuits wrapped in tallow

[@MadScientistBBQ]

Haha sounds tasty but didn’t do any of that for this test

[@Keith80027]

Thanks for pointing out why you need to cook biscuits to find out how your pit works.

[@dong8307]

Need to include the Millscale 94.

[@jrowlands84]

have you ever done this test with a Traeger grill?

[@bobnewhart4318]

Your biscuit test with the volunteer Offset Smoker was spot-on you followed the directions on the biscuit container and you followed the grill manufacturer's directions on how to run the volunteer and in the end the volunteer toasted the biscuits. People just seem to get upset when Real World test gets ran on their equipment and it exposes their short comings. None of the other grills were charred as badly as the volunteer at around the same temps so the volunteer was the issue not the experimenter. Keep go the good work

[@sleepyjohn2695]

1:59 the science teacher comes out:))))) Hold your pants nerds:)))))

[@kdranchaz3240]

Great information. Liking the Golden’s pit. Wonder why they didn’t position the opening above the great level to eliminate that hot spot? Perhaps it would hinder air flow??

[@MadScientistBBQ]

It might. I dunno exactly. Maybe it was to avoid a big dead spot on that side of the grate

[@jameslam1759]

I thought he said it was just for the symmetry and aesthetic with the stack exit.

[@ern92983]

Why does the goodee pit have a water pan and the others don’t?

[@chrishabgood8900]

it would be good to the workhorse pits as they are designed to.keep even heat all the way through.

[@MadScientistBBQ]

Would have loved to but didn’t have it at home

[@smokescouts]

Here’s the 1975 biscuit test I did: kzbin.info/www/bejne/f4DWho1md9p7rMUsi=5B66G6yDIVmZI7_i

[@pulith5220]

What happens when u open the stack does the tempreture increase or reduce.

[@randykeech3557]

I wonder how they would turn out on a reverse smoke

[@K.O240]

I wonder if the Goldee's pit could eliminate the hotspot by installing that elbow a bit higher on the cook chamber instead of right at grate level?

[@MadScientistBBQ]

I think you’re probably right

[@frank_osuna]

​@@MadScientistBBQdoes the baffle plate inside the elbow not split the heat properly?

[@TheOriginalFaxon]

I have a thin walled vertical offset from Amazon that was made in China, it cooks fairly evenly from side to side but the temps are higher the higher up you go in the smoke box. I've used temp probes and a couple dozen cooks now to dial in how it cooks at various temps, but I do wonder what would happen if I pushed the heat up enough to cook biscuits and did this test. I have trouble getting my smoker to that temp without flames literally licking into the smoke box from the fire box, so I'm betting it would be rather informative. I wonder if there is a version of this test I can do though at my normal smoking temperatures.

[@dabigeasybbq]

biscuit test at 225F should take about at least 20.5 minutes depending on your elevation to cook biscuits. I always do biscuits on the grill. You made me think and Jeremy should have ran all the offsets at same temperature

[@kevinwill8542]

great vid

[@hakanduranl]

there are many german companys building awesome offset bbqs for much cheaper .. dont know how much the shipping is to us but in europe costs not so much

[@brendan3081]

Would have loved to see the country brazos get tested. Every time youve talked about it that one seems to me to be the best bang for your buck without being to difficult to learn

[@Pitmaster_GoldenShellback]

Don't want to hijack his thread, but I have a video of doing a biscuit test on my Brazos here kzbin.info/www/bejne/n4mZgIRqbJ2VjMk&ab_channel=Pitmaster_GoldenShellback

[@tuaesam]

Would love to see Mill Scale, Fat Stack and Shirley Fabrication added to the list.

[@barnee27]

Might want to take a look at what’s happening with Fat Stack right now. Sounds like a ton of people are going to be pretty screwed after paying in full on pits that won’t ever be produced. I don’t think Jeremy did anything wrong willfully but a lot of people listen to his opinions and probably shouldn’t just take his word for it on anything related to a business aside from the product itself. I really hope he’ll be more careful about getting involved with/promoting companies moving forward as his channel (and influence) continues to grow.

[@67buick]

Just wanted to throw a rib method I developed for drum smokers (or any vertical charcoal really) in case you still had that pit barrel cooker and maybe wanted to do some comparisons. Season with lowrys and pepper. Hang ribs in smoker at about 275 for 3-4 hours until color and tenderness are where you want them (they can be slightly right at this point, but should be close to where you want them) Wrap in foil with butter and sauce of your choice (I use a modified Franklin expresso style sauce personally) and rest in cambro for at least an hour. It’s pretty central Texas inspired but in a charcoal cooker. Would be cool to see it compared to real central Texas on an offset side by side.

[@dabigeasybbq]

Snow's bbq in Lexington, Texas cooks ribs over charcoal, and so does Kreuz Market in Lockhart, Texas to name a few. Also, in Memphis Charlie Vergos' Rendezvous bbq does ribs over charcoal.

[@67buick]

@@dabigeasybbq pretty sure snows and kreuz both cook over coals, not charcoal. Almost everyone in the Carolina’s and Tennessee cook that way too, so I’d guess that place in Memphis does. I’ve never been in the Memphis area so I don’t know it. Most back yard cooks aren’t gonna burn down splits into coals to feed a block pit (tho some do obviously). Im talking about cooking on vertical charcoal cookers like uds, Weber smoker mountains with rib hangers etc. They’re both direct heat methods with the same goal, render fat to fall into the fire and create a different flavor in the smoke. When I say central Texas method I mean what is widely considered that today. Of course there used to be a lot more direct heat block pits in Texas, but it’s not seen as much anymore there.

[@dabigeasybbq]

@@67buick my mistake- they do use coals from burn barrel, and I know Rendezous uses charcoal. My comparison should have been that ribs on offset do not compare to ribs cooked over charcoal, lump, or coals which are better.

[@justinklossen8734]

Jeremy, you need to get a chud pit in the mix!

[@johnruplinger2449]

Chud's offsets are not currently for sale. Just the Chud Table, which Jeremy has and the Chud Boxes

[@nhuttran8492]

How is the Fatstacks’s 120 compared to these smoker?

[@barnee27]

They’re about to fold and leave a lot of people out of $4k or more with no pit to show for it.

[@tpack670]

Rocket scientist, not rocket surgeon. I do the same thing. LOL. Great information.

[@dochaze1]

Did you miss the W impression with that? It’s been awhile since we’ve seen that.

[@joes6336]

Where is the smoked sausage and gravy for after this test . A man has to eat after all that work. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@gregwinters3123]

Is this a new Franklin? Wasn’t one given away? Anyway, great test!

[@philmaro84]

Where is that workhorse pit?

[@barbruhque]

I did this test a couple of weeks ago on my Outlaw Patio Smoker and the results of it blow these three away. Check one out sometime, Jeremy!

[@Eman101que]

I see you haven't done a video with Lone Star Grillz Texas Edition. I guarantee that's the best smoker!!

[@kevo9470]

couldnt you easily add a heat shield to those hot spots on the grate?

[@lyleswavel320]

Goldees surprised me, maybe pipe coming into cook chamber needs to be width of smoker instead of a 8 inch pipe

[@jamesjoung2793]

The easiest way to explain heat vs temp is to compare a bathtub full of hot water vs a candle. The flame of the candle is much hotter, but the bathtub full of water has much more heat/thermal mass.

[@barbersque]

Why was there a water pan in front of the opening into the cooking chamber for the Goldees pit? Don’t think you got an accurate reading.

[@jerryspringer4953]

I liked the bacon test Bradly did on his pit.

[@MadScientistBBQ]

A tasty test indeed

[@long_and_longer]

It would've been interesting to see this test done using on a Smoke Stack smoker as well.

[@MadScientistBBQ]

I don’t think I have heard of those

[@BigChuck525]

Smoke Stack or Fat Stack?

[@long_and_longer]

@@MadScientistBBQ Fat Stacks

[@DumbCarGuy]

So biscuits, brisket and gravy for dinner tonight?

[@Kevin_747]

Do you have any public events planned in the Louisville area?