Sand Cuts: What Are They And What Are They Supposed To Do? L1A1 SLR FN FAL / L2A3 Sterling Mk.4

[@genericpersonx333]

Partly disappointed we didn't get a reference to original British documentation explaining the cuts, but since such papers are almost certainly buried deep in the archives, probably with signage warning about the dangers of leopards, I am not going to cry foul on that! Thanks for the great close-ups of the bolts with some actual filth left on them. Most everyone showing off sand cuts seem to always have them cleaner than museum pieces and often dryer than British wit.

[@BlokeontheRange]

Oh, if I had such documentation I'd have shared it of course!

[@TheWirksworthGunroom]

@@BlokeontheRange Information is probably in the RA archive.

[@alan-sk7ky]

Have a thumb up for warning of Leopard issues ;-)

[@JonathanFergusonRoyalArmouries]

They're not buried THAT deep. I came across some of that stuff researching the EM2. I'd be glad to help Bloke access it 😊

[@andysavill8580]

Sand-cuts on the L1A1 date back to 1956 when a British trials rifle was tested at Fort Benning in the US and showed "considerably improved performance over the FN." The helical ribbed bolt on the Sterling first appeared on an early Patchett prototype in 1943.

[@neilcook4686]

Many MANY years ago on a CCF camp at Warcop, we used SLRs (with Blank Firing Adaptors) on an excercise, & I remember when we had to clean them afterwards, we were baffled by the strange zig-zags. Thank you for the explanation, Bloke 😊

[@Simon_Nonymous]

Drove past Warcop a few months back on the A66 but couldn't really divert to go back down memory lane as I had a caravan in tow

[@pappap3788]

Oh boy, does this bring back memories. The rats tail and those springs in the SMG, the springs were a pain. Back in 1982 during my ACF days, we used H&K .22 conversion kit which we shot at a movie screen, this was for your NI training. That was at Pirbright. Field stripping blindfolded was fun but a nightmare.

[@johngulyas695]

I am completely flummoxed by the fact that not only is the Sterling’s bolt huge, it dwarfs the FAL’s!

[@robbell3217]

what straight blowback does to a mf

[@whelper4231]

Heavy weight helps when you are getting pushed around all day with no support. 😁

[@davidbrennan660]

Sterling 1956 Lazer Gun ...

[@davehopkin9502]

The FAL has tilting bolt which locks the breech closed on the locking shoulder, so at the moment of firing the bolt is locked closed, recoil unlocks the bolt to recycle via the gas system, a Sterling fires from an open bolt so at the moment of firing only the mass of the bolt seals the breech, recoil overcomes that but the mass of the bolt delays it moving backwards long enough for thr chamber pressure to drop. So in short the FAL uses geometry and mechanical advantage to lock and unlock the breech, the Sterling uses mass and inertia to keep the breech sealed.

[@Poverty-Tier]

@@robbell3217more locked breach smg’s!

[@alanlawz]

Loved the SLR it served me very well back in the day but it got heavy real quick on a long TAB.

[@zoiders]

The cuts look like a 2 hour long cleaning session with the armoury handing it back 4 times because of the merest hint of carbon. The same cleaning regime was also why a certain later service rifle was found to be Scotchbrited to death and out of spec when Hk recieved them. Have they issued solvents these days or is it still a competition to scrub the finish off with a wire brush? 12:18

[@BlokeontheRange]

Lolno, still no solvents. Just an instruction not to use abrasives on any parts which have been coated. So you can imagine how little coating is left once John Squaddy has been at it with the Scotchbrite for hour after hour trying to make it look shiny, lol...

[@zoiders]

@@BlokeontheRange SF platoons jetwash the L7s.

[@BlokeontheRange]

Understandably! :D

[@johnfisk811]

Nothing new. They had to ban using the ramrod to burnish musket barrels bright as investigations into burst barrels and reports from the Tower on muskets turned in after their 12 year life showed that they were being rubbed so thin that they burst. Squaddies still did it though. Meanwhile SNCOs were still b*locking the peasantry for their barrels being not shiny enough……. Nothing changes.

[@zoiders]

@@BlokeontheRange You're in your own time now.

[@tsuchinokoz5036]

Thanks for this video, just a couple days ago I went to look up a video on sand cuts and couldn’t find a dedicated one, thanks again!

[@asphaltmemories4597]

Soooo jealous of that Halbek device, still amazing to see it actually work!

[@TDC7594]

Kudos for footage shooting the 'right arm of the free world." Double kudos for doing it wearing Rhodie brushstroke.

[@JacobT-1]

Sweet video. The explosion edit got a laugh out of me.

[@pmgn8444]

I love a good nerd-out. I hope you get the opportunity to do the test. So both Ian and Jordan got 'killed' by 'landmines'. Ouch.

[@levitated-pit]

used both weapons in the early 80s my only stoppage/issue with the SLR happened in a wet pine tree forest, where pine needles jammed it so much i couldnt even cock it. i had to hammer the cocking lever against a tree to free it up enough for a quick field strip! otherwise a super platform. the SMG however did suffer from substandard ammo (bought from india i believe) that when fired lodged inside the barrel. the IA drill was to hol;d the weapon at full stretch and fire another round to unplug it!

[@rule3036]

Issued Radway Green RG 2z 9mm funnily enough was /is a hotter than normal 9mm so that SMG's would function reliably, guess the Indian stuff was not up to that spec. Not good for shooting in Lugers and old 9mm pistols though as was known to wreck them due to higher pressures. Never had any problems in my Walther P1 or issued FN high power though.

[@BlokeontheRange]

Yup, 2z is hot stuff, developed to please the STEN and its particularities.... What I find particularly interesting about the Sterling is that, since it's a commercial product, it's designed to cope with a huge variety of ammo. Mine rather likes Geco 115gn (Hungarian-made, white box). Shoots bang on the sights, and has no vices with it, but it'll function with anything except the Hirtenberger L7A1 hot ammo, which bursts cases (that stuff runs fine in a STEN though).

[@jediknight1294]

Given the israeli's the Dutch, the African guns, the Belgian guns all used them I just assumed they worked and didn't give it much thought so thanks for this. The Sterling is fascinating and they are guns I want to own and love (and currently shoot in airsoft milsim and soon AIPSC rifle comps in the UK because I hate myself).

[@SafetyProMalta]

"Cack" and "Ronseal" in one video....Legendary.

[@5commandomerc]

I'm very familiar with the C1L1... always wondered about those slots milled on the mouse... very interesting. ..I meant C1A1 FN.

[@1982rrose]

Looking forward to the comparison next week😁 . Obviously the L1A1 is superior to the metric, just go back to the 1982 test.

[@marcusott2973]

As far as I know the DS sets were built to fit the Steyr Stg58 kits they were turning into functional firearms. I guess the mm to imperial conversion explains the gap

[@F1lmtwit]

1:16 - congrats on winning that pistol and carbine classic match.

[@kingerikthegreatest.ofall.7860]

I was issued a sterling and a c1a1 ( Canadian FAL) in the Canadian army. I was later issued a c2a1.

[@windsnowandstatic9075]

I do have a love of the UB marked L1 bits.

[@MacDorsai]

Hmm. Maybe I ought to look around for a surplus L1A1 bolt carrier for my metric FAL. Since you are considering interchanging them on the same rifle for testing, that won't affect the headspace. The bolt to bolt carrier interface isn't as important (I assume).

[@BlokeontheRange]

The bolt carrier has no influence on headspace

[@mikethomas5510]

More Iconic duo? Bloke & chap of course🙃

[@petesheppard1709]

This was enlightening! I had thought that the sand cuts were to channel sand and gunk away from bearing surfaces and out the mag well. I was also reminded of when I first really noticed that the supposedly tightly-fitted and jam-prone AR bolt [carrier] only has four small bearing surfaces, which leaves a lot of space for kack to migrate and gather until the rifle could be cleaned. BTW: I challenge your icons with an M1 Garand and M1911. 😉

[@derekp2674]

Nice choice! Also how about a Winchester Model 1873 and a Colt Single Action Army?

[@andrewcappiello5585]

As a seven year U.S. Army vet, I'm genuinely curious as to your definition of what a bearing surface is. The AR/M-16 bolt has seven locking lugs (I've got one on my desk right now).

[@petesheppard1709]

@@andrewcappiello5585 Oops! Busted!!😖 I meant 'bolt carrier'. Thanks for calling that out--corrected

[@flatmoon6359]

A bunch of highly experienced gun designers decided that it's a good idea, so it's probably a really good idea.

[@killzoneisa]

0:01 Abbott and Costello oh wait.

[@tp3521]

Never seen a 1911 with lightning cuts before!

[@TheWirksworthGunroom]

BSA SLR. Shame they only make airguns nowadays but they have started making them in Birmingham again rather than badge engineering Spanish assembled Chinese parts so that is something. Did the L2A? manual specify oiling? STEN was intended to run dry from everything I have seen so far in my research project.

[@BlokeontheRange]

Read a later STEN pamphlet, they went back on that

[@zoiders]

First serious combat use of the STEN was North Africa so yes the pamphlets will have said run it dry - but then again as little oil as possible was the prevailing advice for both the SMLE and the Bren in that particular theatre. I can see that changing for cool temperate though just to stop it rusting.

[@TheWirksworthGunroom]

The trials report by Lt. Col Thornton dated 28 July 1941 refers to the gun needing to be run dry. These trials were carried out by the Small Arms School at Hythe.

[@Punisher9419]

I think it's more just to do with reducing the amount of surface on surface contact reducing friction parts running dry esspecaially. Maybe it channels dirt away as well but I don't know, probably not something easy to proove. I can see the Sterling sand cuts working much better then the L1A1 though.

[@nirfz]

0:02 a matter of view, but The AUG and the Glock? (Both feature in 2 christmas movies even though they say totaly wrong things about the later in the one it prominently features)

[@cedhome7945]

Maybe try non abrasive particles like small plastic granules this way you don't permanently damage your gun ?

[@BlokeontheRange]

Hmmmm, interesting idea - I've got some powder coating powder in some garish colours so that would show up really well if I used bright pink powder!

[@Rhynome]

​@@BlokeontheRangedo you think board chalk or a ground up crayon might also do the job?

[@LuckyLucan]

were to buy the DSarms scope cover in UK/ europe?i find that ITAR blocks import from USA.cheers

[@RicArmstrong]

ITAR shouldnt prohibit a scope mount. Email DS Arms, they're good people.

[@philipsturtivant9385]

Jordan needs to be drilled as I was, if the L SLR fires "one or two more shots, and stops again" you change the gas setting. In theory, one or two clicks. In practice you learn, very quickly, to just clamp it right down. That might be thought of as bad karma if target shooting, but On Her Majesty's Service it was invariably the option of choice 😉

[@WarlordEnthusiast]

Damn I love the L1A1, its such a rugged looking gun. Pure badass.

[@magoid]

The problem with dirt tests is that you have to find a way to make it consistent. that means the exactly same type of material and the quantity you are trying to trow at the poor thing. To give you guys a idea what that looks like, here is a link to how the Brazilian manufacturer Imbel did it: /watch?v=fZRGa4zRbQY

[@alan-sk7ky]

nope, wheelbarrow, folding shovel, 5litres of water and the same patch of Arizona soil/dust/caliche everytime ;-) oh and a foamie ear plug for the muzzle...

[@jon9021]

The good old SMG! That takes me back! Ex QOH (RAC).

[@jamesbromstead4949]

I see sand cuts the same way I saw groin armor... they're either worthless, or worth a million dollars....

[@88porpoise]

Out of curiosity, was the FAL used by Jordan an actual FAL or one rebuilt from a parts kit?

[@jcorbett9620]

I 'think' Bloke did a previous video talking to Ian about FALs and it seems that most if not all the US FALs are made from parts kits. It was hypothesised that's why US owners always have 'issues' with their FALs. Blokes L1A1 is a factory refurbed rifle, not a parts kit rebuild and doesn't appear to suffer from the same issues.

[@88porpoise]

@@jcorbett9620 That is why I was asking. Most US FALs are parts kits and quality will vary heavily with the manufacture of the receiver.

[@BlokeontheRange]

I think that particular rifle is a DS build from a parts kit.

[@yoochoob1858]

Interesting, I always thought they wer mud cuts, but as sand cuts, maybe a dry sand test would be in order, if anyone wants to be that mean to their gun. Also: casually pulls out a lanchester bolt.

[@philipsturtivant9385]

When SLR was acquired by us Brits, we were engaged in the business of exiting Empire and (O BTW) trying not to lose control over the Suez Canal. Easy, then, to understand why sand was the problem, not mud. Maybe.😎

[@wastedangelematis]

"History of weapons and War " Early gang , where U at ???

[@GRAndreas7]

Hello Block, long time viewer here. I moved into Switzêrland this year and I want to get into shooting. Where do you usually go?

[@BlokeontheRange]

Best way into the sport is to find a local club, or otherwise a commercial Schiesskeller near you.

[@GRAndreas7]

@@BlokeontheRange sorry for the delayed response, I will give it a try, thank you!!

[@petesheppard1709]

A quickie sand test might be accomplished with a bag of play or concrete sand and a fan or leaf blower.

[@UesleiSouza-z9c]

Muito bom o seu comentário ❤

[@srobertson4035]

I watched the whole video on Playeur because KZbin's policy on firearms content sucks!

[@paulscountry456]

Brits used the Sterling through at least 86 when I trained with a scorpion crew that had them.

[@BlokeontheRange]

Into the 90's, and even in remf hands in operation desert storm

[@paulscountry456]

@@BlokeontheRange yeah, its a ok platform , I still had a crappy sloppy mismatched Ithaca Remington Rand with a horrible trigger , a 1911 from the 40s in 87.

[@cmck472]

It was 94 before my TA medical unit got the SA80, I carried an SMG in Germany on exercise in '92.

[@paulscountry456]

@@cmck472 I had a 1911 and regardless of what you hear they were horrible, the GI 1911 had horrible sights and the worst trigger imaginable, yeah they sucked, sloppy worn out mismatched used up until 88 at least.

[@knightowl3577]

Cack is a formal English technical term used by British gunsmiths!

[@tomhenry897]

Did the cuts remove enough metal to need new springs?

[@BlokeontheRange]

No

[@3of11]

Name a more iconic duo? M1 and 1911?, baseball and apple pie? Walmart and obesity? 🇺🇸🇺🇸

[@summerleeye588]

m1a1 thompson an us rifle m1. m16 m60 , ak47-akm rpd. ak 74 an pkm

[@jon-paulfilkins7820]

Ah, Yes, the Guns of U.N.I.T. and one day we will face an alien threat that isn't actually bullet proof!😜

[@kevinoliver3083]

Or the Doctor will bother to tell UNIT not to use copper-jacketed bullets.

[@sugarnads]

The mat should be exploded diagram of a hipower then youd have the classic triple.

[@george2113]

Is desert worth fighting over?

[@comentedonakeyboard]

Well it makes a nice exotic Background for the war News.

[@col.mustard1233]

Alot of the malfunctions could be eliminated by not resting on the magazine.

[@BlokeontheRange]

Strangely, I've never had an SLR malfunction while resting it on the magazine...

[@col.mustard1233]

The malfunctions he was having I have seen on many long magazine auto rifles, this is one of the reasons that the military still teaches troops to cradle the handguard.

[@BlokeontheRange]

The British military explicitly teaches to rest the SA-80 on the magazine whenever possible... Jordan's stoppages were due to the rifle being dirty and undergassed.

[@fintrollpgr]

​@@BlokeontheRange He got feed issues while racking the bolt too (@7:25). I would rather go for a bad magazine, as it seems to not be lifting the rounds enough... And based on the summary video "evidence" you can't say anything about potential dirt.

[@andysykes4328]

@@BlokeontheRange It does now, but that was not the practice with the SLR. Although the mag rest method was in the first SA80 pamphlet, many were not taught it as it was considered bad practice by people that had been using SLRS. When switching from SLR to SA80 the first thing I noted was how much higher a prone unsupported position was.

[@spraynpray]

I see Sterling, I click.

[@BashingBambi]

Morecambe and Wise 😊

[@somefool4625]

You smuggled some of Finnish soil! Gib back! 😂

[@MichaelJohnson-tw7dq]

Poor Jordan. Did his remains fill up the sand cuts?

[@mrkeogh]

IIRC the Israelis weren't that impressed with the FALs reliability, even with the sand cuts 🤷🏻‍♂️

[@paulargent1003]

There is a big difference between a British ftr L1A1 & a FAL pieced together by a merican expert ( not referencing Ian ). Why didn't old mate Tweek his gas on the hop that's what it is there for . I really enjoyed your set up at brutality 👍🇭🇲

[@BlokeontheRange]

A very good question I've been asking myself the whole time!!!

[@scottshaw2143]

Batman and Robin.

[@cheesenoodles8316]

Sand, love + hate it. Run the gun wet, drop it in the sand....the worst.

[@sergecashman4822]

I'm actually surprised by how clean both of them are, after supposedly several dozens of rounds in the sand. I'm pretty sure sand cuts do not make any difference. Just more space for shit to get into. It's like Kalashnikov claiming low tolerances on the gun are for the sand and dirt to get into... Right... It still works, who cares...

[@andysavill8580]

In 1956 a British built L1A1 prototype with sand-cuts was test-fired at Fort Benning, it was noted that the L1a1 was noticeably more reliable than the FAL!!

[@titanscerw]

Bodie and Doyle?

[@johnfisk811]

Of course sand cuts are not a solution but only a palliative to delay the moment it grinds to a halt. It is the responsibility of the section commander to make sure his peasants keep their guns clean even in action. Taking it in turns if the tactical situation demands it.

[@vevenaneathna]

3:55 -.-

[@karood-dog3584]

the lad with the "Rhodesian" FAL would have done much better if he actually knew the correct IA drills

[@BlokeontheRange]

Well yes, and if his rifle hadn't been tragically undergassed...

[@ripcut28]

So they weren't for cutting sand after all? I'm a little disappointed.

[@Legitpenguins99]

Britishism of the day, Cack Similar to crap, but British

[@Sman7290]

Ham and eggs

[@swedishchef3895]

Spaghetti and meatballs.

[@sword_of_sanghelios]

you lie about your fn fal becouse in finnish brutalty it had wooden stock now it has plastic one you cant fool me becouse i am genus wheatley core

[@videodistro]

It lets crap in as much as it "let's it out". There no magic that says it goes only one way. The concept is silly.

[@88porpoise]

Except, from what is shown here, it doesn't let crap out, it provides a place for crap to go after it gets in.

[@andysavill8580]

It was proven to work in various trials including one at Fort Benning in the US, when a British Trials L1a1 was tested against a standard FN FAL, notes from trials state that the L1a1 was noticeably more reliable.