Bp Athanasius Schneider: Can Catholics attend SSPX Masses?

[@Estbels]

God bless the SSPX

[@mazikode]

Bishop Schnieder please may you push for this regularisation of the SSPX. It would really help the churdh many people are starved of the Traditional Mass.

[@vennue9958]

he has no authority, only the Pope

[@mazikode]

@@vennue9958 That's true.

[@anthonypereira3272]

Thank you bishop Schneider, may you succeed in resolving this issue. We love the original mass

[@mikaelangel76]

Original was in hebrew not latin.

[@VintageLPs]

@@mikaelangel76 Didn’t Jesus speak Aramaic?

[@mariamartin94]

@@mikaelangel76It’s not about the language, it’s about the liturgy.

[@anthonytan7134]

Bishop Schneider is right on the issue, we can go to their Mass...which was celebrated up till the council ( V2 ), RIP Msgr Lefebvre, will pray that he will be a Saint one day.

[@joseph_mta5840]

not gonna happen. ever. He needs prayers. We don't know he could be in purgatory for all we know. He died outside the Church.

[@anthonytan7134]

@@joseph_mta5840 technically you're right, he was excommunicated but take note also the facts that Pope Benedict XVI lifted excommunication of 4 bishops that Msgr Lefebvre ordained.

[@joseph_mta5840]

@@anthonytan7134 only the bishops still living. you can't take away an excommunication from someone dead.

[@06rkave]

@@joseph_mta5840 St Joan of Arc died excommunicated, and she was. obviously, not outside the Church....

[@anthonytan7134]

@@joseph_mta5840 correct, so if Msgr was still alive, I believe Pope Benedict would also lift his excommunication as well

[@josebastardes]

For everyone here, the short answer is YES, and I highly encourage everyone to do so if they can

[@vennue9958]

you are encouraging schism

[@allietitone9944]

I'm good attending a Mass that's in Communion with Rome with real Catholics. They're not offensive. Schismatics Sedevacantists like the SSPX that even discourage FSSP are. The CFR Friars sing Gregorian Chant and play guitars. Guess they're going to hell.

[@franinator9849]

@@josebastardes And do not fulfill your Sunday obligations. This is where the local Bishop has the authority. Pleas go to him and ask him.

[@josebastardes]

@@franinator9849, actually, all SSPX Masses fulfill your Sunday obligation since these are validly ordained Priests (with power to consecrate), and the Mass is the ancient liturgy (lex orandi, lex credendi) that preserves the celebrant from not consecrating the Eucharist, even if he does not believe in it; as opposed to the Novus ordo, where if the celebrant does not believe in the Eucharist, you eat a wafer.

[@knight3115]

Wrong ​@@franinator9849

[@fload46d]

SSPX founded essentially to preserve the traditional Catholic priesthood in the Latin Rite.

[@oldtimmy9481]

Pope Benedict XVI 2009 Letter to the Bishops "This disciplinary level needs to be distinguished from the doctrinal level. The fact that the Society of Saint Pius X does not possess a canonical status in the Church is not, in the end, based on disciplinary but on doctrinal reasons. As long as the Society does not have a canonical status in the Church, its ministers do not exercise legitimate ministries in the Church. There needs to be a distinction, then, between the disciplinary level, which deals with individuals as such, and the doctrinal level, at which ministry and institution are involved. In order to make this clear once again: until the doctrinal questions are clarified, the Society has no canonical status in the Church, and its ministers - even though they have been freed of the ecclesiastical penalty - do not legitimately exercise any ministry in the Church."....

[@brianbacon5149]

@oldtimmy9481 +JMJ But you're OK with the pope's statements on many path's to heaven and if so how dies that square with your quote from Benedict?

[@birdman1325]

@@brianbacon5149 There are many paths apparently, but just no traditional ones.

[@brianbacon5149]

@@birdman1325 +JMJ Exactly. Dominus vobiscum.

[@St.Augustine4006]

​@@oldtimmy9481well well well. Francis has approved ministry. So....

[@marciecorda5209]

" We know now that BUGNINI was primarily RESPONSIBLE for the CHANGE IN LITURGY, and that he is AN INFAMOUS FREEMASON."( Archbishop Lafebvre)

[@joseph_mta5840]

there's hardly any proof of that and our church history will prove we have had many bad men make decisions in the Church. The Mass was promulgated by Pope St. Paul VI. It's not going anywhere. It's Mass....Jesus is there.

[@davidcatabui2018]

Source? Trust me bro

[@tanz5389]

@@davidcatabui2018 Paul VI Mass is the result of Freemasonry and Protestantism infiltrating the Catholic Church.

[@tahnee4287]

​Dr Taylor Msrshall interview with Fr Charles Murr explains it very clearly on YT

[@davidcatabui2018]

@@tahnee4287 source for calling Bugnini "an infamous freemason"? It better be more credible than Lefebvre said so

[@verneharty9029]

Canada is in bad condition re:TLM. I'm 84 yrs. old, and was brought up with the Latin mass. It hurts bigtime to see what has happened to us since Vatican ll

[@arnoeeuwigheid4499]

Trudeau!!!!👉💩💩💩👈 👎👎👎👎👎👎👎👎👎👎

[@mariankraus4432]

What a wise and lovely bishop is these man....

[@johnchung6777]

Thank you Bishop Shcneider,for your honest input may you be blessed protected guided and filled with great courage patience and graces of God the Holy Trinity AMEN 🙏 🐑🕊️✨🔥

[@arnoeeuwigheid4499]

YES, THESE ARE VALID!! Pope BENEDICT gave his APPROVAL!!

[@mikaelangel76]

When the discussion is about Pope Francis about allowing faithful to attend SSPX, the tone of them change.

[@arnoeeuwigheid4499]

@@mikaelangel76 Because he is a modernist!

[@oldtimmy9481]

Pope Benedict XVI 2009 Letter to the Bishops "This disciplinary level needs to be distinguished from the doctrinal level. The fact that the Society of Saint Pius X does not possess a canonical status in the Church is not, in the end, based on disciplinary but on doctrinal reasons. As long as the Society does not have a canonical status in the Church, its ministers do not exercise legitimate ministries in the Church. There needs to be a distinction, then, between the disciplinary level, which deals with individuals as such, and the doctrinal level, at which ministry and institution are involved. In order to make this clear once again: until the doctrinal questions are clarified, the Society has no canonical status in the Church, and its ministers - even though they have been freed of the ecclesiastical penalty - do not legitimately exercise any ministry in the Church."....

[@mikaelangel76]

@@arnoeeuwigheid4499 I know I know... we guys just repeat same thing.

[@jacksoncastelino04]

SSPX is Priestly order. They celebrate Catholic Mass

[@arnoeeuwigheid4499]

Please, please PRAY for Mgr. Vigano, who DARED to speak out and tell the truth!!! Consequently he had to endure the same treatment as Mgr. Lefèbvre........😢.....

[@gopinathanaugustinemunusam911]

SSPX is the preserver of the truth and treasure of the perennial liturgy.

[@PetiteFleurBleue2009]

Amen 🙏🏻🕊️

[@oldtimmy9481]

Pope Benedict XVI 2009 Letter to the Bishops "This disciplinary level needs to be distinguished from the doctrinal level. The fact that the Society of Saint Pius X does not possess a canonical status in the Church is not, in the end, based on disciplinary but on doctrinal reasons. As long as the Society does not have a canonical status in the Church, its ministers do not exercise legitimate ministries in the Church. There needs to be a distinction, then, between the disciplinary level, which deals with individuals as such, and the doctrinal level, at which ministry and institution are involved. In order to make this clear once again: until the doctrinal questions are clarified, the Society has no canonical status in the Church, and its ministers - even though they have been freed of the ecclesiastical penalty - do not legitimately exercise any ministry in the Church."....

[@richardcorwin1828]

I recently moved into another Diocese that has no Mass or Chapels in my county and they do not have a traveling Priest. The SSPX Seminary is right down the road so I reached out to them and I am visited monthly to Confess and receive Communion. I am very happy and intend to stay with the SSPX. God Bless to all.

[@jasonthomas16]

The answer is simply yes.

[@marciecorda5209]

" They also called me by phone in Melbourne to say;" You are on the list of the bishops for the Eucharistic Congress. We ask you to celebrate Mass with a protestant pastor and a Rabbi." Ay. IMPOSSIBLE. IMPOSIBLE. No, No, No, No. ( Archbishop Lafebvre)

[@anthonytan7134]

Always love his wisdom, RIP Msgr Lefebvre

[@josebastardes]

@@anthonytan7134 God bless him!

[@linakoh4206]

Thank you Bishop Schneider and Father Klimek for bringing this … God bless and protect you 🕊️🌹🌹🌹

[@johnfisher247]

There is no such thing as SSPX Masses. There are validly ordained priests ordained by a validly ordained bishop who was consecrated bishop in a valid episcopal consecration. The SSPX has all this and faculties to hear Confessions and celebrate the Sacrament of Matrimony.

[@icxcnika7358]

So are all Orthodox priests are ordained validly. All their Masses are celebrated illicitly and attending them could be a grave sin

[@commodoresfc]

@@icxcnika7358 respectfully you may want to research this particularly where Pope Francis approved

[@Desertbreeze-f1l]

​@@icxcnika7358I agree

[@icxcnika7358]

@@commodoresfcif they receive faculties at certain instances from the ordinary to witness to marriages then on a case to case basis it can be both valid and licit, but the fact it that the absolute majority of their sacraments are celebrated illicitly and attending their Masses could be a grave sin. They are not in full communion with the pope, and they reject an Ecumenical Council, so you can’t be a Catholic in good standing and be associated with them

[@pippomaneful]

@@icxcnika7358 You are indeed correct. The Vatican clarified that attending SSPX masses does not fulfill the Sunday obligation. Moreover, the SSPX teach wrong doctrine on irreformable topics such as collegiality and therefore attending their chapels can lead faithful to a state of schism.

[@ytujackclough]

Without Abp. Lefebvre, we would not have the Latin Mass today. In my book, he is worthy of canonization.

[@oldtimmy9481]

Really you are stating that a Man Saved God???? SSPX cult of personality. Also The Carmelites were giving the Latin Mass long before the Schism of the SSPX. And We had local Priest here in every diocese in Wisconsin doing it still today. Soo yeah.

[@franinator9849]

@@ytujackclough Christ did not build His Church on individual opinions but on a hierarchy with authority to govern it. He placed this authority in the hands of human being, faillible, yes, human being. If we state we are members of His Church, we need to abide by His decrees.

[@markg1531]

@@oldtimmy9481Nonsense.

[@markg1531]

@@franinator9849Not if he doesn’t follow our Lord Jesus Christ.

[@charlest3016]

@@markg1531 is that for you to decide?

[@anthonypereira3272]

God bless you Bishop. May other bishops have the clarity of mind to refute wrong messages that come from the unexpected. Jesu ich vertraue auf dich,is all we can hope in. Only HE can save us.

[@gduggany]

Thank you Bishop Schneider

[@dorothynicols4228]

Thank you for stating the truth of our faith.🙏

[@harrietl2869]

I'm catholic no one will deny me SSPX MASS

[@vennue9958]

if you're catholic, you can't attend sspx mass bc they are in schism...it's the same as attending the Orthodox church mass

[@oldtimmy9481]

Pope Benedict XVI 2009 Letter to the Bishops "This disciplinary level needs to be distinguished from the doctrinal level. The fact that the Society of Saint Pius X does not possess a canonical status in the Church is not, in the end, based on disciplinary but on doctrinal reasons. As long as the Society does not have a canonical status in the Church, its ministers do not exercise legitimate ministries in the Church. There needs to be a distinction, then, between the disciplinary level, which deals with individuals as such, and the doctrinal level, at which ministry and institution are involved. In order to make this clear once again: until the doctrinal questions are clarified, the Society has no canonical status in the Church, and its ministers - even though they have been freed of the ecclesiastical penalty - do not legitimately exercise any ministry in the Church."....

[@tandcomaha2565]

A Catholic Bishop! A rare thing these days!

[@blackbikerboots123]

I wish that Pope Benedict XVI would have finally come out with a declaration to regularize the SSPX during his pontificate (while continuing to address any outstanding issues), the SSPX is a great asset and blessing to the Church especially in our times and this would have ended any confusion

[@StanislausJoseph2021]

Thank God. Let the truth be proclaimed loud and clear.

[@oldtimmy9481]

Pope Benedict XVI 2009 Letter to the Bishops "This disciplinary level needs to be distinguished from the doctrinal level. The fact that the Society of Saint Pius X does not possess a canonical status in the Church is not, in the end, based on disciplinary but on doctrinal reasons. As long as the Society does not have a canonical status in the Church, its ministers do not exercise legitimate ministries in the Church. There needs to be a distinction, then, between the disciplinary level, which deals with individuals as such, and the doctrinal level, at which ministry and institution are involved. In order to make this clear once again: until the doctrinal questions are clarified, the Society has no canonical status in the Church, and its ministers - even though they have been freed of the ecclesiastical penalty - do not legitimately exercise any ministry in the Church."....

[@StanislausJoseph2021]

@@oldtimmy9481 Oh, that means that the (F)SSPX would have to accept all the errors of the “Church of New Advent” (John Paul II) in order to perform a legitimate ministry in the Catholic Church. Sad and funny at the same time…

[@Victor-wv1pu]

Oremos por todos los sacerdotes, en especial por los confundidos, los tibios, los que ofenden a nuestro Señor y los que han perdido la Fe. Señor perdona nuestras indiferencias y falta de voluntad para amarte y hacer tu voluntad.

[@jennifercuddy5663]

I love the SSPX masses. They feel more like the masses I went to as a child. I like the quiet and calming communion.

[@Jasimp90]

Unrelated to the topic but Bishop Athanasius Schneider has an awesome name. Apologies if I accidentally misspelled his name.

[@marckevinsherst4619]

I have gone to spas mass and confession . It was very nice .

[@dannyharvanek3908]

Question is - is the modern mass valid - only 17 percent of the Latin Mass is present in new modern mass - rubrics - rubrics - rubrics - the purpose of new mass is completely different!!

[@TJBowman-vr1co]

I believe the Old Rite was more of a solemn sacrifice, and the new one more of a celebration.

[@peaceandlove544]

Yes it is because they liturgy of the consacration is still there. But not for long. Then the future Bergoglian mass Will be Zero.

[@dannyharvanek3908]

Work of Human Hands: A Theological Critique of the Mass of Paul VI Book by Anthony Cekada

[@St.Augustine4006]

"They have the buildings we have the faith"

[@richardsaintjohn8391]

Title of this video is ridiculous. Of course their Mass/Sacraments are valid.

[@oldtimmy9481]

Pope Benedict XVI 2009 Letter to the Bishops "This disciplinary level needs to be distinguished from the doctrinal level. The fact that the Society of Saint Pius X does not possess a canonical status in the Church is not, in the end, based on disciplinary but on doctrinal reasons. As long as the Society does not have a canonical status in the Church, its ministers do not exercise legitimate ministries in the Church. There needs to be a distinction, then, between the disciplinary level, which deals with individuals as such, and the doctrinal level, at which ministry and institution are involved. In order to make this clear once again: until the doctrinal questions are clarified, the Society has no canonical status in the Church, and its ministers - even though they have been freed of the ecclesiastical penalty - do not legitimately exercise any ministry in the Church."....

[@Tracy77751]

Yeah...! 🥰🥰🥰

[@georgeknopp3164]

I'm so confused! I have an SSPX church near me but have heard that we can attend the SSPX mass but cannot recieve holy communion. The society is not in schism from the church but the massis illicit. I don't know! I just want to attend the Latin Mass and be in union with the church and the chair of St. Peter, the Pope. I'm very dissatisfied with the Novus Ordo and yearn for the beauty and reverance of the Latin Mass. Please pray for me and my family as I pray for you. In Jesus and Mary. Peace.

[@grifogrifo1067]

Ofc it is valid and totally legitimate

[@oldtimmy9481]

Pope Benedict XVI 2009 Letter to the Bishops "This disciplinary level needs to be distinguished from the doctrinal level. The fact that the Society of Saint Pius X does not possess a canonical status in the Church is not, in the end, based on disciplinary but on doctrinal reasons. As long as the Society does not have a canonical status in the Church, its ministers do not exercise legitimate ministries in the Church. There needs to be a distinction, then, between the disciplinary level, which deals with individuals as such, and the doctrinal level, at which ministry and institution are involved. In order to make this clear once again: until the doctrinal questions are clarified, the Society has no canonical status in the Church, and its ministers - even though they have been freed of the ecclesiastical penalty - do not legitimately exercise any ministry in the Church."....

[@marciecorda5209]

Archbishop Lafebvre celebrated what we always had in the Church for hundreds of years- Catholic traditional Latin Mass- IT IS OBVIOUS. Archbishop WAS NOT SURE if Pope Paul 6 is a real Pope ( there is his voice recording saved where he is surprised about his actions). Tha'ts what he said about New Mass; " But now the new liturgy is more democratic- all around the table. The priest is only the president, and sometimes another man can take the role of the president of the meal. That is the NEW LITURGY."

[@tomburke7941]

Your misrepresentation of vernacular Mass priests is one of the reasons many of us see the SSPX as schismatic. Pride is the root of all evil.

[@marciecorda5209]

@@tomburke7941 I'm not proud. Why would you say that? And I know well that pride is bad.

[@user-ks3qr5fk6m]

For almost 20 years I have been studying Protestantism. The SSPX, St. Lincoln of Hughs Traditional Catholic Church, Old Catholics and other schismatic groups are not in communion, but they are convinced that they are the true believers and true Catholics. There are always an abundance of sheep that are lead astray by these wolves in sheep’s clothing. The followers believe that their leaders are saints. If I had a dollar for every time I hear that Lefebvre is a saint… Saints don’t leave Christ and St. Peter to start their own Church. Saints like Padre Pio, submit to the hierarchy that Christ established and wait patiently on the Lord. Saints obey. By the way, the original mass was in Aramaic, the language of our Lord, not Latin.

[@alisongiunti5859]

Padre Pio even refused to say the Novus Ordo… the Sspx received the glove of padre Pio and his writings and letters were entrusted to the Sspx archives. Read the book the last Mass of Padre Pio.

[@Coworkersofthetruth]

You failed to understand Saint Paul VI

[@jeffm.3575]

Can parishioners from the Conciliar Church go to the SSPX? Better title.

[@paxsemper9714]

This is ❤🎉🎉🎉 answer!

[@javaman8895]

How are there 2 churches? Is the SSPx its own church?

[@joseph_mta5840]

There is one Church. The Catholic Church......the SSPX is not it.

[@SmithsnMoz]

Many Novus Ordo masses are more Protestant than Catholic

[@vince6822]

Yes, all Novus Ordo Parishioners are welcome to come back to the Catholic Church, and practice the Mass of All-Time vs that heinous Protestantized/Paganized Mass.

[@albertusjung4145]

This title is misleading. Surely you mean " licit" instead of valid! There is not, and never has been, a question of their validity.

[@linde2762]

In the abrogation of the canonized Roman Rite Pope Francis is not in communion with his predecessor Pope Benedict XVI who stated (ex cathedra) that it can not be abrogated. So who do we follow Pope I or Pope 2?

[@dominiknycz7912]

One of the last true Bishops. Faithfull catholics are allowed. St. Pius V gave the permission FOREVER and over any decisions against it - in a very solemn and atrict words. Bulla ,,Quo primum tempore". That would be all. And are the Pachamama Pope's and Cardinals Masses valid? What is the status of a man, who publiccly and oficially worschips pagan idols in the Church? Just askeing, I do not wan't an strict answer. God bless!+

[@CharlesThompson5900]

"Quo Primum Tempore" gives all priests to celebrate the Latin Mass. It says nothing of the SSPX. The issue with the SSPX is not that it celebrates the Latin rite, but that in fact it was disobedient to the Church.

[@oldtimmy9481]

Pope Benedict XVI 2009 Letter to the Bishops "This disciplinary level needs to be distinguished from the doctrinal level. The fact that the Society of Saint Pius X does not possess a canonical status in the Church is not, in the end, based on disciplinary but on doctrinal reasons. As long as the Society does not have a canonical status in the Church, its ministers do not exercise legitimate ministries in the Church. There needs to be a distinction, then, between the disciplinary level, which deals with individuals as such, and the doctrinal level, at which ministry and institution are involved. In order to make this clear once again: until the doctrinal questions are clarified, the Society has no canonical status in the Church, and its ministers - even though they have been freed of the ecclesiastical penalty - do not legitimately exercise any ministry in the Church."....

[@alexanderpodgorski5449]

No such thing as "extraordinary form"?

[@beatricec9238]

Technically, no.

[@edukaeshn]

Novus Ordo, missing 2/3 of the Mass, cannot functionally be considered the same.

[@distortedalpaca7565]

I even hate that term.

[@mikaelangel76]

The Mass was for centuries an ordinary rite, and many marthyrs celebrated. Once you take a posture of just one form, then you made your one church of the rite.

[@alexanderpodgorski5449]

@@mikaelangel76 Nope, as Latin church is exceptional, unlike other Churches, it has several rites.

[@rosalindaarquiza4028]

yes people are attending this m sspx mass,

[@aaronmilavec1579]

Let’s examine the public record of Archbishop Vigano relative to the actions of Pope Francis: Accusation #1 by Archbishop Vigano [abbr.=AV]: The so-called “church” of Bergoglio does not hesitate to close churches, arrogating to itself the wicked right to deny God public worship and to deprive the faithful of the grace of the Sacraments through a wretched connivance with civil power. AV, to begin with, refuses to recognize that "Bergoglio" [the pope's family name] has been legitimately elected by the College of Cardinals. His official title is "Pope Francis." AV, consequently, is disrespectful and arrogant in not recognizing the office that he holds in the RCC. #2 AV accuses Pope Francis of "deny[ing] God public worship" and of "depriv[ing] the faithful of the grace of the Sacraments." What AV fails to tell us is that Pope Francis has, after due consultation, closed the churches of Vatican City temporarily in order to prevent further transmission of the coronavirus. Hence, there is neither "arrogance" or "wickedness" involved. On the contrary, it would be "wicked" and "irresponsible" NOT to take prudent measures to safeguard human lives. We are living in the time of a pandemic-a fact that AV wants to avoid. For more details, see www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-italy-rome-churche/rome-catholic-churches-ordered-closed-due-to-coronavirus-unprecedented-in-modern-times-idUSKBN20Z3BU Accusation #3 by AV: Pope Francis "tampers with the sublime and inviolable words of the Prayer which the Lord Himself taught us." AV fails to note that the "sublime and inviolable words" are written in Greek and that the New Testament has two very distinctive versions of the Lord's Prayer. The contemporary Our Father comes from a translation of the longer Greek version found in Matt 6:9-13. #4 AV also fails to tell us that the Church, as a faithful interpreter and transmitter of Christ, needs to create suitable translations into modern languages (e.g. Italian) in order to enable the faithful to pray in words they understand and in words that do not give them wrong ideas. Here are the facts of the case: Pope Francis has risked the wrath of traditionalists by approving a change to the wording of the Lord's Prayer. Instead of saying “lead us not into temptation”, it will say “do not let us fall into temptation”. The new wording was approved by the general assembly of the Episcopal Conference of Italy last month [Jun 6, 2019]. The new wording, it has to be assumed, is in modern Italian, and the changes apply only to the churches of Italy. Pope Francis, in collaboration with biblical and linguistic experts, changed the phrase "lead us not into temptation" to "do not let us fall into temptation," as mentioned in the gospel of Matthew 6:13, because the original translation implies that God induces temptation. The change, officials said, is closer to the original intent of the prayer. All in all, Archbishop Vigano shows himself to be incapable of fairly interpreting Pope Francis. Judging from just these four accusations, the reader can see that Archbishop Vigano clearly has no sympathy for Pope Francis and his prejudice leads him to make judgments that are neither accurate nor just. Great caution, therefore, should be taken by those who depend upon Archbishop Vigano to guide them in these matters. Be prudent. Be watchful. Make an investigation yourself. Don't be caught up in a scheme where "the blind are leading the blind." Jesus, Mary, and Joseph, pray for us, Prof. Aaron Milavec P.S.: At the Last Supper, Jesus said, "Take and eat. . . ." This implies that Jesus handed his disciples the Eucharist. They took it and ate (they chewed it). According to AV, he imagines that Jesus said, "Take this on your tongues while you are kneeling and let the Eucharist dissolve on your tongue without biting it. . . ." AV and his allies say: "The body of Jesus can only be received on the tongue and only from the consecrated hand of a priest. Amen." Such persons know nothing of the history of the Church. They imagine that the rubrics of their youth go all the way back to Jesus. What a mistake! It saddens me that an archbishop of my Church would peddle such nonsense. Receiving communion in the hand was the common practice of the Church in both East and West for the first 800 years of Christianity, and it was certainly considered reverent by the Fathers. In North Africa (including Egypt) the practice is mentioned by Tertullian,[1] Cyprian,[2] Augustine,[3] Cyril of Alexandria,[4] and John Climacus.[5] In Jerusalem, we have the mystagogical catecheses of Cyril of Jerusalem (or perhaps of his successor, John).[6] In Syria (what we now call Turkey and surrounding regions) it is witnessed by Basil the Great,[7] John Chrysostom,[8] Theodore of Mopsuestia,[9] John Damascene[10] and the Council of Constantinople in Trullo (also called the Quinisext council).[11] In East Syria (what we would now call the Middle East) we have evidence from Ephrem the Syrian[12] and Narsai.[13] In the far-flung regions of the empire-Gaul (modern-day France and Spain) we have the witness of Caesarius of Arles[14] and the council of Auxerre,[15] and in England, we have the Venerable Bede.[16] Liturgical evidence from Rome is always sparser than one would like, but Eusebius preserves a mention of communion in the hand in a letter written from Dionysius of Alexandria to Sixtus I, bishop of Rome,[17] and in a letter of Cornelius, bishop of Rome.[18] URL=

[@ransomcoates546]

‘Sauve qui peut’.

[@brucejohnson4462]

Why cant Cdl Burke understand this?

[@Desertbreeze-f1l]

@@brucejohnson4462 Because S.E. Cardinal Burke uses brain and knows theology and history.

[@edukaeshn]

No, that's not it. It's called diabolical disorientation.@@Desertbreeze-f1l

[@franinator9849]

Thank you!

[@chrisarmon1002]

@@Desertbreeze-f1lcompletely false. Remember bishop was asked to go and investigate SSPX. He determines they’re not in schism. Meaning he has a personal insight and investigation. So Cardinal Burke would in fact need to acknowledge this. That’s like saying someone can judge better even tho they don’t have first had experience or investigation.

[@oldtimmy9481]

Pope Benedict XVI 2009 Letter to the Bishops "This disciplinary level needs to be distinguished from the doctrinal level. The fact that the Society of Saint Pius X does not possess a canonical status in the Church is not, in the end, based on disciplinary but on doctrinal reasons. As long as the Society does not have a canonical status in the Church, its ministers do not exercise legitimate ministries in the Church. There needs to be a distinction, then, between the disciplinary level, which deals with individuals as such, and the doctrinal level, at which ministry and institution are involved. In order to make this clear once again: until the doctrinal questions are clarified, the Society has no canonical status in the Church, and its ministers - even though they have been freed of the ecclesiastical penalty - do not legitimately exercise any ministry in the Church."....

[@josevidalfloriach1191]

Es válida la misa de cualquier sacerdote ordenado válidamente.

[@felixroyan6615]

The New Mass is more like a protestant service

[@FrDanielKlimek]

@felixroyan6615 actually No, a Protestant service does not have the Real Presence of Jesus in the Eucharist or the authentic priesthood or a structure of worship that is traced back to ancient writings of the early fathers like St. Justin Martyr writing about the Mass. Therefore, the Novus Ordo is NOTHING like a Protestant service. Nice try, though.

[@johncurry6260]

Canonically irregular but VALID.

[@edukaeshn]

Indeed!

[@DolasJPC]

better ask - Can Catholics attend novus ordo Masses?

[@FrDanielKlimek]

No point in asking the obvious.

[@SmithsnMoz]

"Just because the Church allows it.... DOESN'T MEAN ITS GOOD.' --- FR. FRIAR. FSSP

[@SmithsnMoz]

Yes it does! So does the Orthodox Church Mass

[@peaceandlove544]

Yes. Novus Ordo Mass still has the liturgy to consecrate the Holly Eucharist. But once that is changed as they plan. Go elsewhere.

[@Carolus_B]

​@@peaceandlove544Our Lord's presence at a sacrilegious liturgy makes it worse, not better.

[@paulettelawyer4983]

Bishop said that the pope have permission to say mass only when he celebrates a wedding but not for any other time...then he says that Catholics can go to their masses...seems contradictory. Maybe I'm not understanding it correctly.

[@brianmurphy9570]

Pope Francis gave these concessions so that people would not find themselves in an irregular situation. It by no means legitimizes SSPX ministry, despite what they want to claim.

[@VintageLPs]

I’m with you. Can I attend an SSPX Mass and receive the sacraments or not? It is the only Latin Mass church in the whole state of Montana. We need CLARITY! In one local Novo O. Catholic Church I was the only one kneeling during the Consecration. People were throwing me dirty looks and one woman refused to greet me or shake my hand. In another Novo O. Catholic Church here, a nun and priest told me they couldn’t wait to tear out the Cathedral kneelers. When my husband wanted to become a Catholic, I spoke with a N.O. priest who I knew to be holy and faithful and he warned me not to take my husband to R.C.I.A. classes in any of the four N.O. Catholic Churches here because they wanted women priests, etc. I would give anything to join the local SSPX parish where I could worship in peace after 25 years of this nonsense but no Cardinal, Bishop or Monsignor will CLARIFY if SSPX are truly in good standing.

[@mikaelangel76]

There is no problem to attend their mass in case of a special circuntance, but not in as a regular norm. They are in a irregular position. So, to avoid confusion, avoid to attend.

[@brianwayne3735]

@@VintageLPs the SSPX is in good standing. You have the green light. Pope Pius the V said that the Tridentine mass may never be changed. Archbishop Levebvre simply followed that canon. John Paul II had no right as pope to excommunicate his most faithful bishop. If you need further clarity, I can get you the relevant data in the book, “SSPX: THE DEFENCE by Kennedy Hall”

[@brianwayne3735]

Yes @@paulettelawyer4983 so much confusion. What the bishop is getting at is that Rome is wrong to say “the wedding masses are fine but the others masses are somehow not fine.” So… If the wedding masses are fine( and Rome admits this), then ALL the masses are fine. Is that confusing?

[@chiayuchang6474]

👏

[@VesselofMercy100]

This information is almost all accurate. Except for the part where arch bishop Marcel of the SSPX was totally against sedevecantism. Yes they tettered back and forth. Almost all (not every single one) sedevecantists priests came from the SSPX. You can find inormation from father Cekada (who knew Lefebvre well for years after Vatican 2). Said that for a long time sedevecantists Priests were openly accepted. Then some expelled while others held the position secretly among the SSPX. Current thinkers among the SSPX are back to being kind of conflicted about it. I personally go to an independent TLM with a sedevecantist priest. We had many SSPX priests and laity who came and had no problem with our mass or priests. The priests would come to our mass and just tell us it “was complicated” how the SSPX handled it .

[@oldtimmy9481]

Pope Benedict XVI 2009 Letter to the Bishops "This disciplinary level needs to be distinguished from the doctrinal level. The fact that the Society of Saint Pius X does not possess a canonical status in the Church is not, in the end, based on disciplinary but on doctrinal reasons. As long as the Society does not have a canonical status in the Church, its ministers do not exercise legitimate ministries in the Church. There needs to be a distinction, then, between the disciplinary level, which deals with individuals as such, and the doctrinal level, at which ministry and institution are involved. In order to make this clear once again: until the doctrinal questions are clarified, the Society has no canonical status in the Church, and its ministers - even though they have been freed of the ecclesiastical penalty - do not legitimately exercise any ministry in the Church."....

[@DominiCanis]

Is the novus Ordo a Catholic rite?

[@frederiquecouture3924]

🎉

[@rosalindaarquiza4028]

how do you consider, the priest, and flock people now ?

[@bobyk87]

SSPX is as Catholic as any Catholic can be, the past excommunication was declared invalid a long time ago.

[@ninabailey1852]

So much confusion in the same church..😢

[@ixtoc999]

It´s not the same church. The false churc has gone gay.

[@edukaeshn]

The Ape of the Church is not the same church.

[@josebastardes]

indeed, an elphant in the room, since 1962

[@oglins1954]

Are the new masses valid?

[@FrDanielKlimek]

@@oglins1954 Yes

[@18waywardson]

When the priest has no intention of confecting the sacrament, no. How many clown masses are invalid? Not to mention issues with the matter (the American scandal with the wine Not being appropriate for mass). The bigger question is if it is proper to go to the new Mass. And no it isn't.

[@brianwayne3735]

They are valid (usually) , but they are not legal.

[@josebastardes]

valid yes, legal no (illicit)

[@rosalindaarquiza4028]

until when does this be resolve ?

[@mikaelangel76]

As the way the discussion is going, I doubt it very soon. I see the Ortodox Church are closer to join the Church than SSPX.

[@MichaelSalamone-f2e]

Introibo ad altare Dei

[@augustinep6193]

Good. Thanks.

[@JustaRandomCatholic]

I do love the traditional latin mass and j do want to go to one someday but our holy father pope francis must not crack down on the mass

[@twosuns5835]

I found the TLM in 2016 and burst out in tears during that first Holy Mass that I attended. I was home, I had been searching all of my life whilst attending the novus ordo mass. I would not go back to the novus ordo now. Nothing should have been changed at Vatican II Being a Roman Catholic, our kingdom is not of this world so we should not be changing any of our sacred traditions to fit in with it. God Bless 🙏

[@Hanamy7777]

Are 95% of Catholic Masses since 1964 valid? No. SSPX are some of the few valid Masses out there.

[@FrDanielKlimek]

No, it's probably more than 95%, if the priest isn't doing anything insane like omitting the Eucharistic prayer.

[@oldtimmy9481]

Pope Benedict XVI 2009 Letter to the Bishops "This disciplinary level needs to be distinguished from the doctrinal level. The fact that the Society of Saint Pius X does not possess a canonical status in the Church is not, in the end, based on disciplinary but on doctrinal reasons. As long as the Society does not have a canonical status in the Church, its ministers do not exercise legitimate ministries in the Church. There needs to be a distinction, then, between the disciplinary level, which deals with individuals as such, and the doctrinal level, at which ministry and institution are involved. In order to make this clear once again: until the doctrinal questions are clarified, the Society has no canonical status in the Church, and its ministers - even though they have been freed of the ecclesiastical penalty - do not legitimately exercise any ministry in the Church."....

[@johnarellano8212]

SSPXer here

[@Bouboukenka]

Short answer: even sede masses are valid

[@edukaeshn]

He never said that.

[@Bouboukenka]

@@edukaeshn 😂😂😂 Who said that I said that he said that? Doesn't make it not true

[@edukaeshn]

I just wanted to make that clear is all.@@Bouboukenka

[@heidikrol5594]

It is just all so very confusing!!! Our bishop has said they are in schism, Fr. Chris Alair did a KZbin video and said they are in schism at worst in a irregular union with the church at best. We have some family attending and it’s worry some not knowing the truth. Is praying for the Pope and Bishop really a sign that you are in good standing with the church? Lord help us! 🙏

[@edukaeshn]

Your bishop and Fr. Alar are wrong and committing calumny.

[@franinator9849]

No. Please try to read the book “Unwanted Priest”, very short, for some good info regarding Archbishop Lefèvre. The SSPX Mass may be wonderful, majestic, until the Pope declares it licit, you are not fulfilling your Sunday obligation by attending it. I am a great lover of the Traditional Liturgy and I can understand the attraction. Attend if you want, but go to your regular Parochial Mass to fulfill your obligation.

[@edukaeshn]

Wrong.@@franinator9849

[@toddbyrd9071]

@@franinator9849the PCED has declared SSPX Masses on valid to fulfill your Sunday obligation more than once. If licety is necessary to fulfill your Sunday obligation, every NO Mass said with a priest deliberately departing from the rubrics doesn’t fulfill your obligation, as it is illicit. How many Sunday Masses in the US do you think follow the rubrics of the missal faithfully? Are all of those people not fulfilling their obligation? Also, canon law was written explicitly to take the licety question out of the hands of laity to decide. A Catholic going to a valid Catholic Mass fulfills his obligation. Burdening others with your personal interpretation of the situation is not what we should be doing

[@brianwayne3735]

SSPX is valid and licit. The NOVUS ORDO mass is valid but illicit. Hopefully this clears up some confusion. Fr Hesse and Fr Gruner and Fr Kramer explain this in their video logs here.

[@joelnudalo6820]

Fr. Alar must listen to this. If he says he do extensive research but his research was not enough and very one sided.

[@veronicasveil7808]

Yes I really like Fr Alar and his enthusiasm and his absolute love of the Church - but he’s not always right. Nobody is perfect 100% of the time.

[@jamiesummers9697]

@@veronicasveil7808 ''Desire to foster the healing of the schism with the movement of Mons. Lefebvre" ~ The Holy Father, Pope Francis "Be aware that formal adherence to the schism (of Lefebvre) is a grave offense against God" ~ Saint Pope John Paul II "Hope that the schism of Lefebvre will not be of long duration" ~ Pope Benedict XVI ''[Pope Benedict XVI] did not receive back the bishops of the Society of St. Pius X, but only lifted their excommunication. They are still in schism '' ~ Cardinal George Pell Regarding the SSPX, ''by their schism they have broken away from communion with the Church'' ~ Cardinal Gerhard Müller "Despite the various arguments surrounding the question the fact of the matter is that the SSPX is in schism " ~ Cardinal Raymond Burke

[@jamiesummers9697]

''Desire to foster the healing of the schism with the movement of Mons. Lefebvre" ~ The Holy Father, Pope Francis "Be aware that formal adherence to the schism (of Lefebvre) is a grave offense against God" ~ Saint Pope John Paul II "Hope that the schism of Lefebvre will not be of long duration" ~ Pope Benedict XVI ''[Pope Benedict XVI] did not receive back the bishops of the Society of St. Pius X, but only lifted their excommunication. They are still in schism '' ~ Cardinal George Pell Regarding the SSPX, ''by their schism they have broken away from communion with the Church'' ~ Cardinal Gerhard Müller "Despite the various arguments surrounding the question the fact of the matter is that the SSPX is in schism " ~ Cardinal Raymond Burke

[@JayneKul]

Fr. Alar gave one of the best assements I've ever seen. It was accurate, fair, and balanced.

[@edukaeshn]

Error is rampant among the hierarchy. SSPX never was in schism. @@jamiesummers9697

[@gerardvoinic]

Rather the question is: can Catholics not attend SSPX Masses?

[@Gerry-jr1mp]

The SSPX mass does not fulfil the mass obligation of a Catholic unless there is no other mass accessible to the person. It is considered a schismatic group and is not in Communion with Rome. Try the diocesan Latin mass or FSSP which are in full communion.

[@gerardvoinic]

@@Gerry-jr1mp Says who, you?...

[@joseph_mta5840]

@@gerardvoinic says the Church.

[@gerardvoinic]

@@joseph_mta5840 Bishop Schneider was tasked with investigating the SSPX and said there was nothing wrong with him. Pope Benedict XVI found nothing wrong with them either. Maybe they were not part of the church. Maybe the Church is just you, the barkers on social networks.

[@justineagletemp7529]

Doesn't fulfill Mr Gerard???? So all the saints who celebrated the TLM were in error or are YOU in error????????? I would be very careful if I were you. Whatever you do, just don't die yet!!!!!! You are making people don't like what God likes!!!!!

[@toshibahomeschool5704]

Is it licit to go the novus ordo???

[@vennue9958]

of course as long you don't see any abuses, even though it's not on par with the Latin mass, it is what it is per the directive of the Church....there are Latin masses offered in the Catholic Church, unfortunately, it's not everywhere that you can find it

[@toshibahomeschool5704]

@@vennue9958 "as long you do not see any abuses..." so it depends on me??? No my friend. And that issue of the "abuses" you should know already that everything is possible via "experiment". And that really is permited in the ordinary of the N O M. So nothing is realy an abuse. It is no licit to go NOM. Fr. HESSE had some realy good arguments.

[@jaimeperez2496]

Today clothes are discipline only; that is under the II Vatican council reform. Before, for Trent discipline; were not only discipline were the habit and were mandatory for all clergy; even for seminarians and persons in formation both secular and religious; especially Bishops. But II Vatican council is horrible for some things and for other things is convenient… And that exactly my point…. If he likes the Discipline of Trent (that he very much is free to like) he should abide for that discipline; don’t forget that under that discipline the Pope had to sign sentences of jail time and other beauties of the inquisition; specially for clergy that were rebel… I would like to see if that part he will abide for… For some things II Vatican is evil and for other things Very, Very, Very convenient.

[@marciecorda5209]

Father CEKADA was saying that at the time of Archbishop Lafebvre many of them ( priests around Archbishop were questioning position of Pope, they were almost like sedevacantists not knowing if the Pope seat is stolen or vacant ( empty), is it the same Pope ?

[@BBL_Fam]

the messaging I've heard about sspx is circular at best, contradictory at worst. ABP Schneider here says we can attend their masses if there are no other TLMs in the area. others have said we can attend if there are no other catholic masses around. my archdiocese (one of the largest in the US) says they are in schism so invalid. Schneider says they're not in schism. why is this so confusing???

[@oldtimmy9481]

You're Diocese Bishop has authority over you in his Diocese. No Bishop can override your Bishop acting in his Own Dicoese. Every Diocese Bishops here in Wisconsin has declared them schismatic

[@javieragudelo4983]

Father the only one to pursues the traditional mass is bergoglio, whom is not a pope es the traitor, the judas of this finally times.

[@beatricec9238]

Thank God for Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre and the SSPX. They are 'irregular' only because they are the only priestly society who answers directly to the Pope and not to a Cardinal or Bishop.

[@javaman8895]

That's not true. They are irregular because they answer to no one but themselves.

[@joematties7557]

@@javaman8895 That is not true and even the Pope himself has spoken well of the SSPX. He sees them as true boots on the ground priest.

[@edukaeshn]

Calumny is a sin. @@javaman8895

[@user-ks3qr5fk6m]

For almost 20 years I have been studying Protestantism. The SSPX, St. Lincoln of Hughs Traditional Catholic Church, Old Catholics and other schismatic groups are not in communion, but they are convinced that they are the true believers and true Catholics. There are always an abundance of sheep that are lead astray by these wolves in sheep’s clothing. The followers believe that their leaders are saints. If I had a dollar for every time I hear that Lefebvre is a saint… Saints don’t leave Christ and St. Peter to start their own Church. Saints like Padre Pio, submit to the hierarchy that Christ established and wait patiently on the Lord. Saints obey. By the way, the original mass was in Aramaic, the language of our Lord, not Latin.

[@edukaeshn]

Calumny is a sin. @@user-ks3qr5fk6m

[@michaelspeyrer1264]

7:47 this bishop completely ignores the question of licitness which the SSPX do not have and is required.

[@TinaMitchell-l7j]

Lewis Jose Rodriguez Elizabeth Williams Michael

[@michaelspeyrer1264]

8;42 praying for the bishop and the pope while refusing obedience to them is not obedience .

[@neneviso]

I am sure more valid than Novus Ordus

[@mikaelangel76]

More valid? if your church say so, what do you expect?

[@TraceyClinker-o6b]

Davis Frank Davis Shirley Moore Daniel

[@mikaelangel76]

The question is not can but should. Answer is no.

[@MrJiffitz]

Valid yes. Licit no.

[@michaelspeyrer1264]

5:47 Pope Francis did not give the priests of the SSPX faculties or permission to licitly celebrate the Mass. that must come from the Locla bishop.

[@jamesmartello1]

Validity isn't in question. It was never in question. The Sacraments and Liturgies of the SSPX are 100%. They are not licit. They are not in full Communion. If they were they would not need to be "regularized". One may go, but doing so cannot be a rejection of the Second Vatican Council or the Ordinary Form of the Roman Rite.

[@edukaeshn]

Wrong.

[@oldtimmy9481]

Well, you're almost right. Our Bishop said you cannot go under any circumstances. So ask your Diocese Bishop only he can make that Authoritive call or the Pope... No one Else.

[@TJBowman-vr1co]

I don't get why N.O. is so different. I can get it if it were just translated into whatever local language.

[@edukaeshn]

Watch Mass of the Ages. That will help to clarify the matter.

[@oldtimmy9481]

Because its from the 5th Century and it captures more of the Gospel and involvement of the congregation as well with some Eastern Rites. Trident Mass is a very structural Mass that was needed at the time to combat the Protestant Revolt and abuses in the Liturgy. The Trident Mass was being ABUSED a lot in Europe and America in the 1900s and Peaked in the 1950s. Everyone keeps ignroing how Low Mass on average was 15minutes long in certain parts.

[@TJBowman-vr1co]

@@oldtimmy9481 i like that answer.

[@st.michaelthearchangelorth1055]

Of course it's valid, though perhaps illicit

[@edukaeshn]

Not illicit.

[@st.michaelthearchangelorth1055]

@@edukaeshn if neither the local Ordinary nor the pope give permission, then it is illicit canonically.

[@edukaeshn]

Pope Francis has granted permission. @@st.michaelthearchangelorth1055

[@vennue9958]

@@st.michaelthearchangelorth1055 you mean sspx mass is valid but not licit, of course novus ordo is valid and licit, it's the directive from the Church since it started, even popes have celebrated....don't spread misinfo

[@michaelspeyrer1264]

The validity of the masses has nee been in question THEY DO NOT HAVE LICITY WHICH IS ALSO REQUIRED. Catholics should never attend an illicit mass not permitted by his local bishops unless there is. I other way to fulfill their Sunday obligation.

[@priscillatutuvanu9799]

I am so up set how the Catholic Church has turn out .I really thought I found the latin mass at last only to find out its a SSPX mass 😢Where to go to mass now. They have the railings they say the ROSARY 📿 And the most important thing is to recive jesus Body,and Blood , on the tough.😢😢

[@JoshuaPope-w2f]

don't worry, they are still 100% valid

[@edukaeshn]

Who deceived you into thinking you can't go?

[@user-ks3qr5fk6m]

For almost 20 years I have been studying Protestantism. The SSPX, St. Lincoln of Hughs Traditional Catholic Church, Old Catholics and other schismatic groups are not in communion, but they are convinced that they are the true believers and true Catholics. There are always an abundance of sheep that are lead astray by these wolves in sheep’s clothing. The followers believe that their leaders are saints. If I had a dollar for every time I hear that Lefebvre is a saint… Saints don’t leave Christ and St. Peter to start their own Church. Saints like Padre Pio, submit to the hierarchy that Christ established and wait patiently on the Lord. Saints obey. By the way, the original mass was in Aramaic, the language of our Lord, not Latin.

[@edukaeshn]

Calumny is a sin. @@user-ks3qr5fk6m

[@mpkropf5062]

They don’t believe in the real presence. Catholics were told not to take Communion at SSPX! Sadly how many don’t listen and take it unworthy! They are not in Full Communion with the RCC!!

[@jaimeperez2496]

Hello. The problem is not the validity of the Eucharist. But the other parts of that reality they are as Society. The broken bond with the total reality of the Church. What I find really calling to me is that bishop you have in your channel dresses as a II Vatican bishop and is not dressed and with the proper attire of a Pre Vatican obligatory regalia for the Princes of the Church. So in some cases the II Vatican council is not the best, but to don't use his obligatory regalia. He is not using the kind of cassock he should and other parts of the whole of his appearance are not the one that he should if he really is on favor of pre Vatican tradition.

[@julioc.zuleta8057]

You are confused, the clothes are discipline only, they can vary, no problem there. Liturgy is the very heart of the church, lex orandi, lex credendi, no optional at all, the changes matter.

[@giak7525]

No but rainbow masses are valid 😂😂

[@FrDanielKlimek]

@giak7525 what's a rainbow Mass?

[@giak7525]

@FrDanielKlimek you know what I mean, I can't say anything more or you tube will censor my comment

[@FrDanielKlimek]

@@giak7525 Say more. If KZbin censors your comment, so be it. No big deal.

[@giak7525]

@@FrDanielKlimek In the Novus Ordo there are clown masses, LGBTQ masses, pagan offering masses, half naked people dancing masses and so forth. I've seen priests dressed in Rainbow vestments mocking God. All under the umbrella of the Catholic Church. As you know Christ said the true church of Christ will have the marks of the church, that is One, Holy, Catholic, and apostolic. Well the Novus Ordo lacks all the marks of the true church of Christ. The reason is simple, when you enter a Catholic mass you don't know what you are going to get. So it's not one, not holy, not Catholic and not apostolic because it lost the faith. Example the Novus Ordo teaches that all religions worship God in different ways, this goes against 2000 years of Church teachings and Christ Himself. Archbishop Marcel Levfrebe in my opinion successfully preserved the Catholic Church by preserving the priesthood. Rome has lost faith as Our Lady warned us. We are living in the great Apostasy as prophesied. Know the times we are in. The only way forward is to unite against the modernists in Rome and force them out. No more games, sanctifying grace is no longer being poured out into society. The church of Christ is underground as prophesied.

[@giak7525]

@@FrDanielKlimek you tube censored it . I'll email it to you.

[@rosalindaarquiza4028]

when can vatican enlightened, this NOVUS ORDO clarify the people.

[@rosalindaarquiza4028]

you have different ideas vis a vis the cardinal who relate the" dubia"

[@oldtimmy9481]

Well My Bishop has officially Declared it is Illicit and you will be in grave sin to participate in the SSPX Mass. Since Our Diocese Bishops has Authority over the faithful in his territory. He overrides an opinion by Bishop Schneider.

[@vince6822]

Your Bishop is a self indulging heretic and a fraud whose only formation came after Vatican II. He is also likely a Homosexual given it has been confirmed that 80% of The Clergy are Homosexuals or allow Homosexuality within their Priests.

[@davidcatabui2018]

Schneider's position here, just like the SSPX's, is thoroughly incoherent and self-refuting. If you have to make a case against the legitimate authority of the Pope in order to justify what you're doing, then you are by definition schismatic

[@tanz5389]

To be schismatic, the Church should not be schismatic first. Is it the authentic Catholic Church since Vatican II ? I cannot answer but I have serious doubts.

[@davidcatabui2018]

@@tanz5389 imagine thinking Jesus lied in Matthew 16. That's the position you have to take to even entertain the idea that the Church defected

[@tanz5389]

@@davidcatabui2018 1. The Church has been infiltrated by freemasonry since or before Vatican II. They are responsible for all the modifications. 2. Ultimately, The Church is the Catholic believers 3. A chastisement of the Church for a society of unbelievers is not impossible. 4 Is it the Eclipse of the Church announced by Our Lady ?

[@tanz5389]

@@davidcatabui2018 The tradition of Church was maintained by Marcel Lefebvre. This heritage is at least still alive.

[@davidcatabui2018]

@@tanz5389 ah yes, the perennial tradition of refusal to submit to the Pope going all the way back to the Donatists. Not the tradition of the church but of those who refuse to belong to Her

[@andrejgrebenc5365]

Bishop Schneider you didn't address the situation if the person's in SSPX parish want to celebrate the Ordinary form. Will SSPX parish celebrate the Ordinary mass?? The problem is exclusivism of the SSPX. The same pastoral care should be given to all.

[@DigitalMan1100]

Not sure if I followed your question. SSPX will NOT celebrate Novus Ordus mass.

[@michaelknapp522]

They exist to celebrate the old rites, not the new

[@joematties7557]

@@michaelknapp522 They exist to provide the flock with the spiritual nourishment it needs. Nothing less

[@edukaeshn]

Novus Ordo is scandalous.

[@johnfisher4262]

Not a single SSPX parishioner would ever ask their priest to perform the NO🤣 don’t be ridiculous. The whole point is to get away form the NO.

[@johnchrysostom330]

Left immediately. All rad trads here.

[@edukaeshn]

Do you think seeing yourself as separate from catholics is a sign of christian charity or diabolical disorientation?

[@johnchrysostom330]

​@@edukaeshn The rad-trads are ones separating from the magisterium not me.

[@edukaeshn]

I see you can't answer the question.@@johnchrysostom330

[@FrenchCruller03]

Since you took the time to write a comment, by definition you did not leave immediately.

[@javaman8895]

@FrDanielMaria Please research the topic more. You are enabling further confusion on the matter. Why? Please consider reading Andrew Bartel’s article about why he left the SSPX for starters. There is a recently published book called Altar against altar, that provides a good explanation on what is wrong with communities like the SSPX. I hope you reconsider leaving this video on YT as it only further divides Catholics.

[@FrDanielKlimek]

@javaman8895 Blessings! Allowing the bishop to express his expertise, being an official visitator who worked with the SSPX on behalf of the Vatican, is not "divisive" but useful. As someone who wanted to know more about the topic, he illumined me. No need for the drama. I wish you the best!

[@christopherfeeney1962]

Who should we listen to more, some layman almost a kid named Bartel, OR should we listen to a a BISHOP who is a Theologian and who was OFFICIALLY APPOINTED BY THE HOLY FATHER AS VISITOR GO the Society??? I'm sorry, but, I'm listening to the Official representative of the Pope! Definitely NOT some layman who just doesn't like them.

[@javaman8895]

@@christopherfeeney1962how about listening to the pope. Since pope Paul Vi, all Popes have been consistent in their dealing with the SSPX. Pope Benedict made it clear they don’t have a legitimate ministry. When it comes to bishops, what about what Cardinal Burke has to say? Whose opinion trumps the other?

[@christopherfeeney1962]

@@javaman8895 EXACTLY! And Pope Francis has consistently stated that the SSPX are Catholic and NOT schismatic. In fact, the POPE is the one who gave the SSPX ordinary faculties. So, you are ABSOLUTELY RIGHT! So, I will listen to 1.) the POPE HIMSELF and 2.) Bishop Schneider, who two Popes in a row -Benedict and Francis - officially appointed AS THE REPRESENTATIVE OF THE POPE to the SSPX.

[@jamiesummers9697]

@@FrDanielKlimek ''Desire to foster the healing of the schism with the movement of Mons. Lefebvre" ~ The Holy Father, Pope Francis "Be aware that formal adherence to the schism (of Lefebvre) is a grave offense against God" ~ Saint Pope John Paul II "Hope that the schism of Lefebvre will not be of long duration" ~ Pope Benedict XVI ''[Pope Benedict XVI] did not receive back the bishops of the Society of St. Pius X, but only lifted their excommunication. They are still in schism '' ~ Cardinal George Pell Regarding the SSPX, ''by their schism they have broken away from communion with the Church'' ~ Cardinal Gerhard Müller "Despite the various arguments surrounding the question the fact of the matter is that the SSPX is in schism " ~ Cardinal Raymond Burke

[@stevecalovich3682]

Schneider is not a Catholic. No one can hang out in the Novus Ordo false church and expect to keep the Catholic Faith. I am Schneider the One Man Church? No.

[@michaelthrone]

Thanks for the belly laugh, and good luck starting Junior High.

[@stevecalovich3682]

@@michaelthrone May Jorge Bergolio, Street Communist, appoint you Director of the Pachamamma Youth Choir.

[@michaelthrone]

@@stevecalovich3682 My mistake. Good luck in the 4th grade.

[@stevecalovich3682]

@@michaelthrone I offer you a minute with John Paul II. Consider how the crooked Vatican Bank gave JP2 $ Millions to install an Olympic Pool. And how JP2 liked to swim completely naked and how a journalist managed to take pictures of him naked. Then God weighed in by giving JP2 MS. The End.

[@edukaeshn]

Calumny is a sin. ​@@stevecalovich3682

[@rachelkingsley668]

Valid but illicit

[@edukaeshn]

Not illicit