Brakes: Everything You Need to Know - Derail Valley Simulator

[@squirrel]

Apologies for the mishap yesterday everyone! Hopefully you'll find this version less "repetitive." Next we'll be covering each of the locomotives in-depth, starting with the changes to the DE2 and the DE6! They'll be coming real soon, so keep an eye out!

[@gamesbychris]

Comment made as a joke. ❤ “Sorry for repeating, here let me repost the video.. 😂” 🥰 Thanks Squirrel!! Thanks for the videos!!

[@svenwielenga7731]

At 3:17 you only said train brake when you are talking about the independent brake. At 18:40 you said that you have pressurized the brake line but you did the opposite😅. But so far much more understandable then yesterday. 👍🏻

[@aaaidan]

I have only watched a couple of squirrel's videos, and I am embarrassed to admit, near the start I had concluded "this guy doesn't know how train brakes work". I thought I knew all there was to know: that train brakes are "fail safe" and braking is released when pressure is applied. I am so glad I stuck it out, because it turned out I was the ignorant one who didn't know! The detail laid out here is exquisite and practically very useful. Thanks for sharing.

[@larsiparsii]

I'm so glad that I wasn't the only one. I was sure that there was some sort of spring APPLYING the brakes when there's no air pressure.

[@legitscoper3259]

As European Train Driver and since this is how Train Brakes work that comply with UIC Rail Vehicle rules, i can confirm, that you explained it correctly.

[@leespiderpod]

Do you come home from work, then play this? 😅

[@legitscoper3259]

@@leespiderpod There cannot be enough train in your day.

[@Clydio]

This update is going to be amazing, and Squirrel has me PUMPED to see these new locos

[@WinXPsp.3]

Punny

[@Duvstep910]

squirrel explaining the braking system reminds me of the incident with the worker leaving the train on a hill with only the service brakes; the pressure eventually bled out and the train rolled away and derailed

[@joshzwies3601]

So an air brake system is like a logic 'NOT gate' where the output in the inverse of the input. When pressure is supplied to the brake pipe the brakes are released, when pressure is released from the brake pipe the aux res applies pressure to the brakes.

[@liftedcj7on44s]

Correct, that is also how Semi trucks operate.

[@catcracker48]

That is how I used to see it also. But if the air bleeds out, I would think the cars would be locked. So why have a handbrake? Aren't the brakes on unless there is pressure from any source supplied to release them?

[@cmdrquillon9398]

​@@catcracker48Over time, the aux res and brake cylinders may leak and lose pressure without the pressure in the main line to top them up from - they have a 1-way valve. Alternatively, in order to "roll" the trucks, the pressure in the aux res and cylinders may be manually released using a mechanical pressure relief valve at one end of the carriage or truck. In either event, this will result in the brakes releasing and the carriage or truck being "unbraked" or rolling free. Handbrakes are effectively an insurance policy against this. Furthermore, in the days before train vacuum (and now air) brakes became a thing, handbrakes would often be used to "pin down" the brakes on some of the trucks in a freight train before descending a steep grade, therefore allowing the driver to maintain control of the consist and prevent a runaway.

[@sobolanul82]

@@liftedcj7on44s I think the air brake in the trucks works inverted. You need pressure to apply the brakes.

[@liftedcj7on44s]

@@sobolanul82 no sir, air pressure releases the brakes

[@jasonpeisley6031]

I have no idea why you have never tried to become a Train Driver in real life!? You're extremely good at explaining how things work in trains perfectly!! Awesome job!!

[@Fusselwurmify]

This has been very useful. A few days ago I left a couple cars from a stalled train on the incline west of HB. Came back minutes later to find them gone, even though I definitely had them left standing with depressurized brake pipe. Now I know how they got away :)

[@volkerklass7741]

This is the best explanation for how train brakes work I've heard so far! Thank you!

[@wolfydude12]

This update is fantastic. Can't wait to get my hands on it.

[@sdsdsdsds7176]

*There is a rule for coupling. First mechanical and then pneumatic. In case when the hand braks isnt active and u connect the air line and then open the air vales. The cars can start move and will cut off the air line again.*

[@dieterkoch8414]

You are so good at explaining things! Feel like I could definitely drive a train after this :) And how good is the level of detail in this game that you can explain it like this... so good

[@OfficialUSKRprogram]

To think that THIS is vanilla derail valley now, the devs have basically looked at what mods people install, and they've made them vanilla, which isn't revolutionary by itself, but historically NO train simulator ever properly simulated brakes ever! Not completely! The fact that you can lock the brakes on a rainy day is revolutionary!! The appeal to me is that you want to have a financial incentive to never have a single accident, but if you have an accident, it'll unfold dramatically and give you a spectacle to watch

[@honeybadger9425]

Very helpful cheers 🥂 I just started derail valley on realistic on Steam Deck. The hardest thing I’ve found is knowing exactly where I am along the track for the next point turn off lol

[@1over137]

I learnt stuff here! I thought they were like some truck brakes and it was just a big spring which you use pressure to "release", not apply. I always questioned this as ... surely that limits your force to that of the spring. Now I know I wasn't wrong, but was wrong :D

[@DieselProductions95]

Squirrel actually still has it wrong. The system works exactly like a on highway truck spring brake chamber. Put it this way. In america when they couple a 200+ car consist. Do u see a man running the length of a train undoing a mechanical handbrake ? Some older quipment doesn't have spring brake Chambers but it is actually law now as if I compressor failed on a train and it lost brake pipe pressure the spring brake Chambers APPLY the brakes to the train. Exactly like a 40 tonne highway truck.

[@awsomegamer8277]

@@DieselProductions95that’s American railway systems European system could differ

[@MrUserasd]

@@DieselProductions95 Thank you, was curious about that

[@samusami4944]

Thank you for good video. I just bought game last evening and started to play it on VR. Great fun and lot of learning. i started to do stuff in realistic career mode which may not be best option as i managed to brake my locomotive twice last evening in shuting work before watching your video of brakes. Cant wait evening that i can continue :)

[@SewerShark]

"This one is the train brake..." Ok, I'm following..."Now, this other one is the train brake"...*flips table*

[@SmackyTheB3AR]

3:15, did you mean independent brake?

[@schuttrostig5729]

Verry good explanations, fully recommended. Thank you for your commitment and work! good job!

[@naerbo19]

If you want to cover everything new, you literally have a week to release it before everyone gets access. This was really helpful and will confuse me in the beginning, but I recon I can get the hang of it soon enough (hopefully with positive bankbalance...). I think it is fair to say that we are looking forward to the train reviews, especially the new ones!

[@mxtt474]

Can't wait for derail valley sim 🎉

[@5995Oblivion]

Interesting, semi-truck air brakes work exactly the opposite. No air pressure means the springs force the brakes ON. You need to supply air pressure from the trucks main tanks to release both the tractor and trailer brakes. I wonder why train brakes are the opposite.

[@KrisDouglas]

Historic working method, as well as having the ability to shunt "loose" without working brakes for maintenance.

[@SocksRocker]

Super excited for this update!

[@ravenstorm1203]

The control of the distributor is achieved by varying the pressure in a second pipe called the brake pipe, which is connected to a brake valve in the drivers cab. Increasing the pressure in the brake pipe causes the brakes to release, while decreasing the pressure causes the brakes to apply. Diagram: Author. This is the article you used; proof.

[@fredpryde8555]

very good information some people will be really grateful for this help

[@anonharingenamn]

I thought air brakes on trains used the air pressure to *release* the brakes, not to apply them. As a fail-safe. Interesting stuff.

[@volkerklass7741]

Well it does, doesn't it? You have to pressurise the brake pipe to set the triple valve to release the pressure from the individual brakes. To achieve that, the pressure in the brake pipe has to be higher than the pressure provided by the auxiliary reservoir. That way you have that fail-safe you describe: Brake pipe loses pressure -> auxiliary reservoir releases it's pressure to the brake.

[@KrisDouglas]

​@@volkerklass7741if there's no air at all in the wagon/ car, the only working brake is the handbrake.

[@Railman1225]

Just something I want to add. The parking brake is more well known and referred to as the handbrake(cause, you know, it's applied by hand). I've only heard the term "parking brake" used for cars, not trains! Just fyi. Edit: Nevermind, you called it by that name soon enough, DOGGONE MY IMPATIENCE

[@Izmael1310]

I would say this was unnecessary because of the small video editing mishap in the original video, but it is also good you replaced it to the 100 % quality as we are used to :)

[@Stuck_Farmer]

I'm looking forward to the release but I can't help thinking that the braking system seems a bit backwards to me. I'd expect the brakes to apply without pressure as they did in DRV Overhaul and as I believe they'd do IRL. I don't know to be honest, it just seems safer to have a depressurised brake cylinder apply the brakes by having the spring apply the brake and the air pressure pushing against a piston to combat the force of the spring. If that makes sense.? Cheers great tutorial as always. TTFN

[@DrewMarold]

Thanks, that was very informative.

[@LHA675]

Cant wait to get Hands on the New Version ❤

[@Beertje21]

good clear explanation

[@JamesCoyle95]

I assumed the brakes were applied via a spring load and the air pressure was used to release the brakes. That way if you don't have any pressure the brakes will be fully on without having to manually put a hand brake on.

[@nbirdie100]

this was essentially discussed in the video, unlike trucks, trains dont have a spring brake, its an air system that uses a mechanically operated handbrake

[@TheJaernvaeg]

Then the max brake force would depend on the spring and the spring would get really big. With this setup you can provide really big brake forces with rather small parts.

[@lovedeepsandhu8502]

On some trains, the handbrake or park brake works that way. A lack of air causes the brakes to apply. All other brakes on trains need air to apply the brake shoe on the wheel

[@tin2001]

I'm so hyped for this update to come out... still haven't bought the game, but I might even pay the full price instead of waiting for the next sale.

[@firefox3187]

Only issue I have is nothing to indicate hand brake on/off/%. Without that huge blue drivers overlay, even just Off On would be fine. As never know if or which cars are on or off.

[@MateusHenrique-bp3qs]

The compressor compress !

[@SpaceDad42]

I wish they had a little more modern and real engines. Love the box cars though.

[@baronnecas2880]

I thought the weather was just cosmetic! I'm excited and nervous for wet tracks 😂

[@KrisDouglas]

Sand is your friend.

[@matthewharding607]

I take it we don't have to worry about retaining valves (as per US Heavy Freight on mountain routes) on the freight car air brake systems?

[@tom95521]

I think air brakes on large truck trailers is just the opposite. The brakes are locked until there is air pressure.

[@nbirdie100]

not the opposite, just these trains dont have a spring brake

[@lordsanityfree]

With no pressure, the brakes are applied by a spring. Pressure into one chamber (red supply line) releases the parking brake. Pressure into the other chamber (blue service line) applies the brakes pneumatically. Yes, the two chambers counteract each other.

[@nbirdie100]

@@lordsanityfree as i said, trains typically have a hand operated parking brake as opposed to a spring brakes as they are infact not lorries, theres pleanty of rail disasters caused by drivers not applying the hand brake because they switched off the engine which stopped compressing air to charge the brake lines

[@Schicksal0]

Can someone explain why I am able to brake the whole train, when I am opening a valve?

[@necrophage12]

Okay so now i understand what each brake does, can anyone tell me *when* to use ind. brake vs train brake?

[@philmaggiacomo]

As I understand it: Independent brake when it's just the loco. Using the independent when there are (moving) cars attached can damage the wheels; the heavier the load, the more damage, as the wheels have to skid for a longer time/distance. Train brake when there are cars coupled. You can use train brake when just the loco, but I think it takes longer to both apply and release.

[@kyle51895]

I always thought that trains would use the same setup as trucks/buses where they’d have a fail safe. Very interesting.

[@awsomegamer8277]

They don’t need one as they can break in 3 different ways and if all else fails they can run the train and set handbrakes

[@ravenstorm1203]

I'm pretty sure they do, as in it loses air pressure to apply brake pressure

[@joshuagibson2184]

So would you use train and independent breaks at the same time or just your independent brakes when hauling

[@bobobubu7850]

I have released all the brakes on the train but I cant move. I have a red blinking above "break pipe". I have to get the locomotive into service, is the breaking system broken?

[@TinkeringJohn]

I wondered why that light was blinking too. Come to find out, I still had the locomotive handbrake on.

[@liftedcj7on44s]

I think this is kinda incorrect, From understanding how air brakes work I think the red needle is for the cars and the black needle is for the locomotive. When there is pressure the brakes are released, when there is no pressure the brakes and locked which is why the red needle had pressure but the black needle didn't because even though the cars were not connected the valve was opened to apply pressure to them and since that line is sealed there isn't a leak with no cars attatched but the locomotive brakes were still locked ie no pressure applied.

[@LiveLNXgaming]

dont breaks also have an overheat mechanic now?

[@TinkeringJohn]

He mis-spoke at 16:22. The cars (hence auxiliary reservoirs) are primed by the main reservoir, not auxiliary reservoir.

[@cat793cdumpy]

Hi Squirrel. Your indepth tutorials are the best by far. I have a question. I just left the steel works with my first job with 185 tons. I have played this game quite a bit in the other setting. Now I only got as far as the learning shop just down the track and the train came to a shuddering stop with no idea what caused this. Engine was in notch 1 and the traction motors were cool and all the brakes were off. I went back and payed the $100 dollar fee and that fixed the broken glass but the locomotive will not move. Any clues as where I stuffed up.

[@MissingLink2626]

So how should you go about breaking in the rain?

[@zekrom6537]

well he slammed the brakes fully, instead probably doing a gradual slow braking aka dont apply it fully

[@dwayne75]

damn, I think i did 2-3 jobs without turning the tap thing on the brake line, no wonder I couldn't slow down and crashed going to harbor lol

[@Quantum39Prime]

3:18 "the train break, and the treain break" xD that is funny :D the first leaver is the independent break for thoes who does not know. we sometimes good safying stuffs xD i do it sometimes myself. repating myself xD

[@nielsleenknegt5839]

Wouldn't the "dynamic brake of a steamloco" be just to slam the reverser/Johnson bar/screwreverse in full reverse and open a bit of regulator? Like they would have done before the implementation of air and vacuum brakes, in the real old days of steam?

[@mikereisswolff4662]

Don't try this in your car.

[@callsignapollo_]

Reversing the johnson while the gear is moving can damage the pistons, it can allow a vacuum to be drawn by the exhaust pipes leading to the stack and suck cinders and ash particles into the cylinders. Old locos had a water brake, which was a separate inlet that would inject boiler water into opposing sides of the cylinder to cushion and slow the movement of the piston and by extension running gear. It wasnt a great system and many locos were upgraded with air brakes once they were widely known about.

[@epicsnake21]

How did you go to third person in the train?

[@admiralmallard7500]

New features should be pretty interesting. Watch alot of vids so far and im def gonna get the game. No idea if it will be on the summer sale though

[@paulnieuwkamp8067]

Do we know if the hand brake is applied on newly spawned train cars? I fear the hand brake is going to make shunting even more annoying than it already is. More often than not the track I have to store cars on is occupied, and I have to shove the offending cars to make space for the new cars.

[@pvt_picklestomp3014]

Per the shorts only one car at either end of a job will have a applied handbrake, they should also spawn with no air making shoving not require air hookup.

[@we1ssbr0t]

I honestly thought the car brakes were (directly) applied by the absence of brake line pressure. Is the reservoir solution only there so cars can be moved without pneumatic power?

[@VanillaWahlberg]

It works the opposite way, absence of pressure will release them.

[@Squant]

@@VanillaWahlberg Naw fam, absence of pressure in the brake cylinders releases the brakes, but the comment you're replying to is talking about the brake line. When that gets depressurized, the aux reservoirs kick in and provide pressure to the cylinders. This is what's confusing everybody. The line and cylinders essentially exist in opposite states. When there's no pressure in the line, the control valves open the aux tanks to provide pressure to the cylinders and apply the brakes. When there is pressure in the line, the control valves dump pressure and the brakes are released.

[@VanillaWahlberg]

@@Squant but the absence of brake pipe pressure is what releases them... I know there's auxillary reservoir tanks and they're filled to a specific pressure. The train in Canada that ran away into a town from the top of the hill explains this. The auxillary pressure holds the brakes momentarily in the tanks but it's mostly used to hold extra pressure I thought. That's what handbrakes exist for in case you need to stay stopped on a grade.

[@rudymanchago]

3:17 Squirrel calls the "independent break" the "train break" . Still not perfect! Must do better 😆

[@sebastianstoica578]

There is still brake overheating to cover.

[@matthewseligman5470]

Not that much to say really. The longer you apply the brake, the hotter it gets, the less effective it becomes (AKA brake fade). Once the brakes are released, they will begin to cool. They take no damage and won't need repairing. You'll simply have to be more conservative with the train brakes and make use of the dynamic brakes (if available).

[@pvt_picklestomp3014]

The time involved will vary depending on duration, force applied, and overall weight. We have no reference for what that entails. There's "not much to say" for wheelslide but was still covered.

[@norliasmith]

Two train brakes, now that can't be right...

[@Erodoehtdtm]

I Swear I watched this yesterday.

[@TowMater603]

What did i do today ?? i learned how to stop a train by a squirrel ! lol

[@erumaaro6060]

3:15 error-alert: you called both brakes "train brake".

[@dxb8086]

3:15 That is the independent brake there, not the train brake. I am sure you knew that. Shit happens. :D

[@willemdakevin1681]

24:18 if you do that for a long enough time, the train will literally get flat tires lol

[@dorkarrijohnson4738]

But how does brakes overheating work?

[@rhendricksonn]

Are we going to have to start from scratch with this update? Or are we carrying over our cash and licenses.

[@alvit123]

3:19 that's the Independent Brake

[@RacoonySkaloonyOfficial]

Kinda sad the closed beta doesn't include the steamers.

[@unblockabl]

Have you remove the last one because i found it really interesting. i don't think it was repetitive

[@windys31]

Is this on meta quest 3.

[@redtoadengineering9226]

You sound like techmoan.

[@sickboy481]

Will it feature the wrong kind of snow or the wrong kind of leaves?

[@Zyo117]

I have to again say, train brakes still aren't failsafe 🙄 reverse the spring in the brake cylinder on the cars, make the spring apply the brake, and the air release the brake. No air=full brakes.

[@KrisDouglas]

That is deliberate on trains

[@Zyo117]

@@KrisDouglas How is the Westinghouse system better than the standard truck air brake system? No air should mean full brakes, regardless of how full the train car's tank is. If the local tank is empty on the car, the brakes don't apply with a brake reduction on the Westinghouse system. The whole system is unintuitive. The brake pipe reduces, and so the air tank on the cars sends air to close the brake cylinders? Nah that's just obviously not safe. The main danger of truck brakes is brake fade if the driver doesn't notice the brakes are applying on the trailer. Which also already happens on trains. The difference is, on a train if no air is getting to one car, that'll mean the whole train behind it locks up and doesn't require manual hand brakes to keep it in place once its stopped just evacuate the air and the springs auto apply.

[@BigRookTrucking19]

Mate, how’s he getting 3rd person view? 😮

[@TheJaernvaeg]

New feature

[@vincentandhimi6990]

If the train has zero pressure it has brakes applied

[@hugoslr]

not if there is no pressure in the auxiliary reservoirs...

[@pootispiker2866]

Incorrect

[@Tyrope]

In Overhauled: Yes. In Simulator: No.

[@vincentandhimi6990]

Soon

[@MacSchaff]

Why don't you turn on the cabin and gauge lights? World be easier to see things.

[@juk-hw5lv]

Honestly, that's pretty disappointing. The triple valve simulation is completely incorrect. You shouldn't be able to gradually release the brakes, and the relationship between the brake cylinder pressure and brake pipe pressure reduction is totally incorrect, the triple valve that gives a full application with BP pressure at 3-4 bars would be an unserviceable piece of junk irl. The brake valve has different notches and its different positions do different things - the first one is the release, then there's cutoff/lap, the graduated application and the emergency position which dumps the BP to atmosphere. In Simulator it seems to be not more complicated than a water faucet. Also, the brake valve handles are animated incorrectly - the emergency position should be the 6 o'clock position, not 3 o clock. I see a significant downgrade from the Zeibach mod in the original DV, which is surprising to say the least, given the fact that he's a member of the dev team now...

[@robinnieuwenhuis4715]

Depends on which kind of brake is simulated, Knorr Bremse (German) can release gradually.

[@ram89572]

There is a balancing act that has to be done. They still need to make the game a game. Don't expect everything to be an accurate 1:1 for real life. As is, this is a hell of a lot more simulation than has been in the game. And there is still the potential for mods to do more.

[@juk-hw5lv]

@@ram89572 My accusation is that even though they said Zeibach is now working for them, the brakes in the game are a significant downgrade in realism compared to his mods. And he will probably not make a version of the mod for the new Simulator because he's already on the pay list.

[@juk-hw5lv]

@@robinnieuwenhuis4715 Which exact type of Knorr's triple valve and driver's brake valve are you talking about? Only electropneumatic brakes as used on some passenger stock and multiple units can be graduated in release. Most braking systems I've seen on Eastern European rolling stock (which this game is representing) are non self-lapping, single pipe type, and these cannot be gradually released. Neither can other types of brakes around the world, like Westinghouse or Matrosov.

[@TheJaernvaeg]

All triple Valves like KE, O, SW, SU, Ch and are self lapped. Also the famous Knorr D2 brake valve works like the brake valve ingame. Knorr 8 ist non self lapping like most indipendent brake valves. Indeed, the self lapped indipendent brake is somewhat unrealistic.

[@freddiepeake5585]

Oh hello

[@skwirils]

day pls play transport fever 2

[@skwirils]

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