Britain's Weird Vietnam War (Documentary)

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Fall 1945: the Second World War is over, but there is fresh fighting in Vietnam. Now, former enemies become allies as British-Indian troops, French Commandoes, and surrendered Japanese soldiers join in a rag-tag alliance against Ho Chi Minh’s Communists in Saigon. The outcome will shape Vietnam’s future for decades to come, in Great Britain’s weird Vietnam War.
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David Garfinkle, Raymond Martin, Konstantin Bredyuk, Lisa Anderson, Brad Durbin, Jeremy K Jones, Murray Godfrey, John Ozment, Stephen Parker, Mavrides, Kristina Colburn, Stefan Jackowski, Cardboard, William Kincade, William Wallace, Daniel L Garza, Chris Daley, Malcolm Swan, Christoph Wolf, Simen Røste, Jim F Barlow, Taylor Allen, Adam Smith, James Giliberto, Albert B. Knapp MD, Tobias Wildenblanck, Richard L Benkin, Marco Kuhnert, Matt Barnes, Ramon Rijkhoek, Jan, Scott Deederly, gsporie, Kekoa, Bruce G. Hearns, Hans Broberg, Fogeltje
» SOURCES
Lawrence, Mark Atwood, The Vietnam War: A Concise International History, (Oxford : Oxford University Press, 2008)
Lawrence, Mark Atwood and Logevall, Fredrik (eds.), The First Vietnam War: Colonial Conflict and Cold War Crisis, (Cambridge, MA : Harvard University Press, 2007)
Lawrence, Mark Atwood, “Forging the “Great Combination”: Britain and the Indochina Problem, 1945-1950" in Lawrence, Mark Atwood and Logevall, Fredrik (eds.), The First Vietnam War: Colonial Conflict and Cold War Crisis, (Cambridge, MA : Harvard University Press, 2007)
Marr, David G. Vietnam: State, War, and Revolution (1945-1946), (Berkeley, CA : University of California Press, 2013)
Patti, Archimedes, “Transcript of the Operational Priority Communication from Strategic Services Officer Archimedes Patti” (1945)
Prenderghast, Gerald, Britain and the Wars in Vietnam: The Supply of Troops, Arms and Intelligence, 1945-1975, (Jefferson, NC : McFarland & Company, Inc., Publishers, 2015)
Ruane, Kevin (ed.), The Vietnam Wars, (Manchester : Manchester University Press, 2000)
Tachikawa Kyoichi, "Indoshina zanryu Nippon hei no kenkyu" [A Study of Japanese Deserters in French Indochina], Senshi Kenkyu Nenpo [Military History Annual], No. 5 (2002)
»CREDITS
Presented by: Jesse Alexander
Written by: Mark Newton, Jesse Alexander
Director: Toni Steller
Editing: Toni Steller
Motion Design: Toni Steller
Mixing, Mastering & Sound Design: above-zero.com
Research by: Mark Newton, Avery Morrow
Fact checking: Florian Wittig
Executive Producer: Florian Wittig
Channel Design: Simon Buckmaster
Contains licensed material by getty images, AP and Reuters
Maps: MapTiler/OpenStreetMap Contributors & GEOlayers3
Music Library: Epidemic Sound
All rights reserved - Real Time History GmbH 2024

[@realtimehistory]

Nebula with 40% off annual subscription with my link: go.nebula.tv/realtimehistory Watch Red Atoms on Nebula: nebula.tv/redatoms

[@MisterNi]

Way to keep yourself irrelevant with that last line. 😄

[@m.a.4500]

Background music is too loud and distracting.

[@Chriskyleisarat]

Next episode suggestions: Britain’s Vietnam war II: emergency in Malaya, the Netherlands’ Vietnam war: The Indonesian national revolution

[@patavinity1262]

I guess if either of those wars had taken place in Vietnam those suggestions might make sense.

[@Chriskyleisarat]

@@patavinity1262 well even if those wars didn’t take place in Vietnam, it still makes sense because it takes place in the same type of environment and it’s the same type of warfare

[@nemo6686]

@@Chriskyleisarat By that logic you could also say Vietnam was America's Indonesia, and Indonesia was the Netherlands' Malaya - why default to Vietnam for jungle guerrilla warfare?

[@SEAZNDragon]

The Malayan Emergency is often called Britain’s Vietnam as they were fighting a Communist insurgency in Southeast Asia. It’s also considered one of the most successful counter insurgency wars as the Malayan Communist Party was defeated on all counts.

[@ShubhamMishrabro]

Vietnam war means where a huge country is stopped by guerrilla warfare. Only few countries have overcome it ​@@patavinity1262

[@equalopportunityoffender1816]

This is one of those instances of history being stranger than fiction

[@realtimehistory]

agreed

[@superbananas7792]

Well it's not too strange.

[@williamwilson2270]

It is nothing more than French and English Colonialism forced through vile violence, corruption and criminal acts against the Vietnam citizens who were beaten, murdered and imprisoned simply for demanding their own country back after the Japanese then English Colonial greed and enslavement. It is the defeat of the French despite the English and post war Japanese alliances with unwilling Indian and Ghurka troops to help passing the nationalist Vietnim bands fighting this illegal and cruel despotic European control of the Vietnamese people. Even those Scots within the British contingent were unwilling to be involved in this post war butchery in Vietnam and Cambonian nations to maintain the same greedy corruption of the French and English that England's elitist and vile Wealthy and powerful also had maintained within Scotland and the Indian Continent. Scotland today is treated as no more than a Colonial vassal nation under English plundering misrule. India and Pakistan are free today and Vietnam has become a communist state with few modern or Civillian freedoms under the absolute communist rule it does not deserve any more than Scotland deserves English greed and London based misrule. Our world is messed up and will only improve if there is an end to English, French and other foreign Colonial controls, while communism is and remains a false form of progressive government misrule. Karl Marx and Engel birthed a Monster long ago that while they attempted to create universal freedoms, they miscarried a cruel and elitist power base no better than Capitalism as a parasitic form of civil control that simply does not work anywhere. Are the Chinese, Vietnamese, Cambodian or Cuban peoples for instance Happy citizens of their nations?

[@albetrosxcore3028]

​@@superbananas7792 It was for the time. Kinda

[@Bans94]

And they said The Avengers was the most ambitious cross over of all time 😏

[@InfamousMax]

OUTSTANDING! 👏👏👏

[@balabanasireti]

Use some new jokes 😢

[@briantonkin7737]

The battle of Castle Itter, still takes the historical cake

[@orange8420]

buddy never heard of nigerian civil war

[@briantonkin7737]

@@orange8420 tbf, anything in Nigeria takes a "justice league unlimited" level of participation

[@RoboticDragon]

Going from friends to enemies, and enemies to friends. Fighting for oppressors to oppress others, while they oppress you at home. Wild.

[@gringogreen4719]

John F Kennedy was actually in Saigon after Dien Bien Phu and could hear the French retreat back to Saigon by the Viet Minh and he thought even then that the US should not oppose the Northern Vietnamese and that South Vietnam was pretty corrupt.

[@James-kv6kb]

Nothing new the Americans set the Germans up with all the military equipment then changed sides in World War I

[@nledaig]

Uk was an imperial exploiter and they had a shared interest with the Frog-eaters and Sons-of-Nippon in keeping people like the Vietnamese down

[@GoochWareTravelsteadOfficial]

Fascinating, I had no idea about our involvement in Vietnam! And they call Korea, "the forgotten war".

[@wotwot6868]

And it is your responsibility to let this be known.. your own education system hides this. And your nation also created education system in colonized territory to hide this.

[@WanderlustZero]

'Vietnam? Completed it m8'

[@iainsanders4775]

Gracey must have been accused of 'partiality', not impartiality.

[@garypulliam3421]

Came here to say this.

[@richardhart9204]

@@garypulliam3421 I suspect the narrator and producers of this channel are not native-English speakers.

[@stpancraschapel2136]

@@richardhart9204nor overly troubled by conventional historical accounts.

[@1112viggo]

@@richardhart9204 Well, if the mistake stands alone id assume it was just a slip of the tongue that no one in the production picked up on. I mean even the Bible have typos, think how many people must have looked that over before release and never noticed. The brain has a weird way of just automatically correcting small mistakes in speech and writing without you being consciously aware of it.

[@robertridley-fj8zz]

Also, in the thumbnail "Operation Masterdom"?

[@waterishdrake8693]

It should be illegal to prevent a letter like that from getting to the president

[@jurgschupbach3059]

Siam is Secure

[@WaterShowsProd]

Indeed, but that was because The Ambassador sided with Pridi Bhanomyong rather than with Phibul Songkhram, and proposed support of Pridi's Seri Thai operaion to disrupt Japanese activity and aid in the push to drive them out of Southeast Asia. The declartion of war may not have been officially delivered, but the fact that a declaration had been sent I don't believe was kept secret from The President. @@jurgschupbach3059

[@markgarrett3647]

Thankfully comrade Ho didn't even get a chance to deceive Truman with empty leftist rhetoric.

[@rich453]

No, it needed to be read by Truman, Ho cited the US Declaration of Independence when he declared Vietnamese independence.

[@recoil53]

Ho Chi Mihn and Mao both wanted to work with America. The whole Cold War could have been fought much more cheaply if pragmatism reigned.

[@quano5409]

Real Time History is the very first channel ever talked about this particular period of the Indochina/Vietnam Wars. Thank you for giving us a glimpse into this incredibly chaotic era, which continued well into the 50s until the consolidation of power under Diệm.

[@DarrenMarsh-kx8hd]

The History Chap released a video on this ages ago.

[@quano5409]

@@DarrenMarsh-kx8hd awesome, another channel to binge. Seems to be British-centric I see, which I have limited knowledge about unfortunately.

[@DarrenMarsh-kx8hd]

@quano5409 he's quite entertaining, I cannot believe how little was taught in school after listening to him.

[@quano5409]

@@DarrenMarsh-kx8hd his video on the Malayan Emergency is quite entertaining. Truly a stark contrast to the situation back then in Vietnam.

[@DarrenMarsh-kx8hd]

@quano5409 his whole series on the Sudan Wars are worth watching, very informative.

[@rabihrac]

Thank you very much Jesse and crew for this very informative and unknown first episode of the long series of colonial wars in Vietnam that ended in 1975 only. Keep up the great work, Real Time History!

[@jessealexander2695]

Merci!

[@phann860]

In 1975 South Vietnam was abandoned by the US and the South was subjugated by the North

[@nledaig]

@@phann860 Liberated. From two groups of foreign gangs. First the French and then the Yanks. Thanks to liberated Vietnam the Pol Pot gang were turfed out of power in Cambodia.

[@cmdrhatchy9611]

My father served in the British Army in Malaya, some coverage of that conflict would be appreciated.

[@lamnaa]

Oh yeah it's all coming together.

[@indianajones4321]

Everyone’s gotta do something in Vietnam, you should cover the Sino-Vietnamese War

[@realtimehistory]

we already started covering it and will continue this year

[@Albert-Arthur-Wison225]

Oh ! Marvellous ! I’ve never been able to come across a decent video on it, to my chagrin…

[@SpeedyBlueBiker1]

Which one? They have had a quite a few over the centuries.

[@James-kv6kb]

Australia never gets a mention where the ones forgotten when it comes to that war

[@indianajones4321]

@@James-kv6kb as was the rest of SEATO

[@Sociologist66]

Thank you for sharing this excellent video with all of us, Jesse.

[@dionbryant330]

It's very nice to learn something completely new to me. Thankyou 👍

[@mike6252]

This is one of the most confusing times for me personally when learning about the buildup to the first Indochina war. Thank you for such a highly visual and thorough video explaining this crucial moment in history!

[@007JHS]

Great explanation of postwar Vietnam and the origins of the Vietnam war of the 60s and 70s

[@stephenarnold5981]

Interesting watching your take on this moment in History.

[@alancranford3398]

So THAT is what British forces did in Vietnam in 1945--and why Britain stayed clear of the place afterwards. Thanks, Jesse, you taught me something new today.

[@davidelkins3229]

The SAS was involved in another war in the 60`s. Brits were busy doing something else.

[@Anglo_Saxon1]

My thoughts exactly mate

[@vinhlong7347]

Ho Chi Minh negotiated and accepted many policies beneficial to France so that France could replace the British and Kuomintang troops to monopolize Vietnam. Fighting three enemies at once was too difficult for Vietminh at that time

[@alancranford3398]

@@vinhlong7347 That is an example of "choose your enemies wisely." The later invasion by China was an example of "choose your friends more carefully."

[@vinhlong7347]

@@alancranford3398 I can see that China will attack Vietnam if Vietnam won the Vietnam War anyway. By winning the Vietnam War, Vietnam will no longer depends on China and China will lost a buffer zone. But back to the 1950s, Communist China was the only hope for Vietnam to expel foreign forces out of its territory. Just like the way Vietnam choose to support the Khmer Rouge despite Khmer Rouge have heavy anti-Vietnam sentiment, because no one could gather much people against USA in Cambodia at that time.

[@bigsarge2085]

Fascinating.

[@Sociologist66]

An excellent video... Congratulations!!!

[@ET-mr4iu]

Great information, so little is covered of this period in anglophone circles. I learned alot.

[@James-kv6kb]

Yes most of what we hear is the American version which leaves out everyone else involved

[@brianmcevoy1990]

How different would the world be if FDR lived only a few more years?

[@Error_404-F.cks_Not_Found]

Very, we may have avoided the Cold War. At least to the extreme that it started out as

[@robertreilly4946]

Or if he'd kept Henry Wallace as VP instead of that Kansas City hat salesman?

[@rich453]

Yes, the Viet Minh were saving downed US pilots

[@Error_404-F.cks_Not_Found]

@@robertreilly4946 tie salesman. lol

[@dulls8475]

@@rich453 So how did that work out for you 20 years later?

[@nickdarr7328]

If we would have supported Ho Chi Minh I'm betting vietnamese soldiers would have been a significant presence in the Korean war. maybe to the point of defeating the north and China. At the very least Vietnam would have been a significant buffer against China. Don't forget Vietnam fought China to a stalemate in 1979. Heck Vietnam overthrew the communist dictator Pol Pot and the Khmer Rouge. That makes Vietnam more successful at fighting communism in Indochina than anyone in the West

[@MysticChronicles712]

The first episode of the lengthy colonial warfare in Vietnam, which concluded in 1975, was incredibly educational and unknown; I'm very grateful to Jesse and the crew for that. The team at Real Time History is doing an excellent job.

[@welcometonebalia]

Thank you.

[@montrous3965]

Is there ever gonna be a part 2 to the Chinese civil war video?

[@realtimehistory]

there will be more Sino-Japanese War videos soon after our pearl harbor episode from December, and then ultimately the conclusion of the Chinese Civil War

[@jeanlucdelorme6482]

Bonjour je suis français et je ne connaissais pas ces faits un grand merci a vous Big up

[@xc8487]

The entire Indochina-vietnam war could've been avoided had the US told the French to accept Vietnamese independence.

[@James-kv6kb]

I wonder what the world would have been like without the Americans . World War I wouldn't have happened for starters

[@buinghiathuan4595]

Make a sino Vietnam 1979 war please

[@joecastle9993]

The key was using the Japanese troops. Those guys were tough MF used to fighting in the jungle and the cities. Having Gurkha and Indian troops fighting for you helped a lot too

[@rich453]

The killing of A. Peter Dewey is a tragic event, I read he may not have had an American flag on his jeep and spoke French to those that blocked the road. Captain Herbert Bluechel's account of the shooting sheds more light on the incident. I question whether Gracey wanted to restore French control, the situation was chaotic and there are some additional sources on this topic. The US ignored OOS advice and a 30 year war could have been avoided. Thanks for bringing this to KZbin.

[@kiwigaming1605]

This was an awesome documentary as usual! Here are some suggestions: Burma Campaign Malayan Emergency Korean War Suez Crisis Borneo Confrontation Gulf War Great work as usual!

[@realtimehistory]

3 of these are on our list for 2024, more for 2025

[@Poznan__]

At a first glance I was thinking that this video is about Malayan Emergency, a vietnam-like war fought by British

[@maynardcapellan1969]

WW II Prominent Filipino Quisling's..

[@MrKarl0077]

What ALWAYS amazes me is how little weight is given to the establishment of Red China in the Korean and Vietnam Wars. If the Nationalists under Chiang Kai-Chek win the Communists in those wars have no sponsor to offer refuge and assistance and they most likely are defeated like the Communists in Maylaya.

[@ShubhamMishrabro]

Correct. Usa and allies really underestimated red army

[@clauderains1534]

The majority of the population did not support the communist in Malaysia. Add to the distance between Malaysia and China. The biggest reason was unlike the French and the Dutch the British were willing to negotiate independence

[@mebsrea]

True most likely for Vietnam, but less certain for Korea. Unlike Vietnam, North Korea shared a border with the USSR, so Stalin could have easily continued to supply the North.

[@rider660r]

​@@mebsreaA 20 mile border +/- a mile or two......... Battleships could cover that territory let alone bombers,etc. You don't think it wouldn't have been a problem to stop any Russian supplies reaching NK? What about NK being almost completely wiped out as to why China stepped in. If the US would have helped Chiang Kai-Shek to win their war,there wouldn't have been as many problems as there was or still are today. Even if Truman would have answered and maybe accepted Ho Chi Minh's request there wouldn't have been a Indochina/Vietnam War and likely no war in Laos and Cambodia either. All the blood is on Truman,a poor excuse of a leader not far from the equally incompetent fool the US has now.

[@johnzimmermann5083]

You need to read "Why Vietnam Prelude to America's Albatross" by Archimedes LA Patti and "Embers of War " by Fredrik Logevall

[@arttoegemann]

Patti and Eisenhower recognized the overwhelming popularity of Ho Chi Minh, that he would have won the reunification election to be held in 1956. That election was fatally obstructed. Mandate for Change

[@peterlee6391]

A little known fun fact: Several Japanese also joined the Vietmin, known as the "New Vietnamese" by the Vietmin forces, and they would serve to train Vietnam's 1st modern military academy.

[@James-kv6kb]

A lot of people don't realise that the Australians went in before the Americans in the 60s version of the war doing all the training

[@philipnorris6542]

At the going down of the Sun and in the morning we will remember them.

[@SalvadorsChannel]

It’s like that episode of rebels where the clones team up with the droids

[@Anglo_Saxon1]

My thoughts exactly mate 😉

[@andyf4292]

mark Felton has an interesting video on the subject

[@amotaba]

Like! Do you intend to make a doc about the German (and Soviet) invasion of Poland in 1939?

[@realtimehistory]

yes. on our list for next year

[@puzzled012]

Soviet invasion? into teritories occupied by Poland for some 18 years? so the push of Axis troops from Russia could be called invasion of German lebensraum by Soviets?

[@tuancao2002]

My grandpa was a French educated Vietminh but my dad fought for South Vietnam with the Americans…my son and I are Americans

[@angkhoanguyen6114]

Went from hero to traitor, how tragic.

[@tuancao2002]

Both my grandpa and dad sacrificed their blood and fought for their countries. Tell me what have your family done for Vietnam before you opened loud mouth Khoa6114?

[@tuancao2002]

I guess my grandpa shouldn’t have protect your grandparents in the north as a soldier and let them died or robbed

[@angkhoanguyen6114]

@@tuancao2002 My entire and family served Vietnam for generations and continue to do so, unlike you we sided with the real heroes.

[@T-OJ]

What a missed opportunity for the west! Thanks for posting!

[@Masada1911]

Oh yeah. It’s all coming together.

[@Masada1911]

@@mcs699 to be perfectly honest, I don’t even know it myself. I just saw a couple of people comment it and I thought it was funny.

[@Sociologist66]

Greetings from Lima, capital of Peru, in South America.

[@FussballTed]

Where are ya'll located in Berlin? Next time I am back home I'd like to visit...

[@ashleysmith3106]

A mate of mine who passed away recently was flying Sabre Jets for the Royal Australian Air Force during the Vietnam War. He never got over the anger of having to carefully avoid British Flagged Merchant ships when attacking shipping in harbours in North Vietnam !

[@Nttmf]

Well, he shouldn’t be attacking British ships. Surely he would have a target that was specific.

[@dulls8475]

Sounds like BS to me....vote for the republic did you?

[@toptohyekoms]

Who's that Dewey guy? Is he related to admiral Dewey of the Spanish American war late 1800s.?

[@catmonarchist8920]

Indian troops being used while the British were giving India independence to reoccupy Indochina for a different colonial power? Wild ride.

[@sydhendrix4853]

Everyone tickle the algorithm by leaving a comment and a like on every vid. These guys deserve jt

[@Richard-pe4cx]

as a brit i had no idea we payed such a large part in vietnam things could have been so different with the benefit of hindsight of course i have heard from other sources that the french behaved very badly an understatement this would have unified opposition to any external force occupying vietnam so when the US came the rest is a painful history for all

[@Nttmf]

And they get their arses kicked agian in 55

[@James-kv6kb]

My understanding was the Americans refused to listen to the Australians who knew about the jungle resulting in such high casualties

[@avanticurecanti9998]

I dare say, the cheeky buggers are hiding in the trees.

[@UncleJoeLITE]

7:30 They accused him of 'partiality' guys.

[@artistalexanderrobbie]

Best narrator in the game

[@jafo766]

CHARLIE DON'T CRICKET !

[@jacktheripoff1888]

"If I say it's safe to play cricket on this beach, it's bloody well safe to play cricket on this beach !"

[@stephengarrett8076]

The french did quite well early on as already mentiond they used German ss who fled to sweeden and thus into Vietnam conflict via the foreign legion hence 30mm guns driving through villages? Because of their success the Vietnam government found out who these French foreign legion soldiers were and went to the European parliament as it was at the time saying the use of war criminals as mercenaries was unacceptable, this was agreed and the German units within the legion were disbanded.

[@WanderlustZero]

TL:DW: Bloody MacArthur again

[@jamesvandemark2086]

So, the Brits poured fuel on the fire.......

[@mattwordsworth9825]

Nope. The Brits tried to stop a future conflict from happening.

[@TheIceman567]

@@mattwordsworth9825 how? Your job was to baby sit. By the time you left the VC weren’t defeated.

[@angkhoanguyen6114]

​​@@mattwordsworth9825too bad that future still happened, therefore their presence are not welcomed

[@jamesvandemark2086]

@@mattwordsworth9825 A tough call to make, either way!

[@nguyenho5859]

I'm pretty sure it should be boiling oil not water 1:44

[@Phanngochanh73]

Thương cho dân tộc tôi 2000 năm chiến đấu để được tự do . Việt Nam Muôn Năm !!!!!

[@liamchappell3404]

Great video and content but the audio is awfully heavy Bass and you talk really fast and switch subjects it’s really hard to follow

[@jessealexander2695]

You can slow the video down to 0.75 speed in the video settings, just click the settings button in the lower right hand corner of the video.

[@Bigdicus]

Man vietnams only hobby there for a while was fighting a war with the worlds superpowers

[@WaterShowsProd]

They'd been doing it for centuries. They repelled The Mongols, Fought China a number of times, and as a local superpower: after Siam conquered Cambodia and Laos they pushed through into Vietnam, only to be driven back until a treaty was agreed to giving them joint suzerainty over Cambodia. Messing with Vietnam is never a wise move. (Incidentally Burma also repelled The Mongols and an invasion from China. The Mongols were not at all accustomed to fighting in tropical terrain, but Vietnam and Burma also had powerful armies and brilliant commanders.)

[@flyinghigh2724]

the British kicked there arses@@WaterShowsProd

[@WaterShowsProd]

With 3 other armies joining them, at a point when Vietnam was the most disorganised and flat-on-its-back that it's ever been.@@flyinghigh2724

[@vuduynghia1995]

We just wanna be friend. But they don’t. Sooo

[@angkhoanguyen6114]

​@@flyinghigh2724because the Viet Minh are laying low, the French are the true enemy. If Viet Minh used all of theie strength, the British still can be defeated like the French.

[@gandydancer9710]

7:15 "...accuse Gracey of impartiality." Not so much. Jesse Alexander (not to be confused with the American producer of the same name) has British roots, but his English fails him here.

[@kyletulloch9625]

Keeps stopping 6 times stopping in 40 second's. Others haven't.

[@dzungtran314]

Thanks! They don’t teach us much about this period at school in Vietnam. I love how you cover the Brit Indians and Japanese troops feelings. The lack of vision/local knowledge and diplomacy by both Paris and Washington led to them fighting the Viet Minh, a pro western faction. The French barbaric actions forced Ho to radicalize (i.e shifting from central left to full left). In turn, this communism shift led to American intervention later on, creating back to back wars from 1945-1975. Had the US support Viet Minh, they would have an anti China bastion immediately in 1945 - as we see nowaday. For that, I rate Truman very low on foreign policy.

[@user-uy2mz4hd2r]

I remeber this being glossed over in school since the british entered and left vietnam in a rather swift manner and at the same time uncle ho was focusing the country's attention on the french and chinese forces

[@Mence1809]

tbh if Vietnam falls under the British rules then they would be even more developed now. But that also mean that the French will be weakened even further. In the end the Vietnamese had to fight two wars just to get the North and the South to be united. Despite all of that hardship, they still thrive. On the other hand, the North and South Korean is so divided that it would took them hundred of years from now to be fully integrated with each other should they be unified now.

[@jerryle379]

​@@Mence1809? How Vietnam under British rule will be more developed lol ?😂

[@ShubhamMishrabro]

I don't know if he talking about colonialism type controlling. But British system is different from other countries. They allow natives to have own government own system and economy . This leads to the colonial country not entirely dependent on the coloniser. That's is why British colonies are seen as better performing countries. @@jerryle379

[@markgarrett3647]

Ho Chi Minh is literally a trained agent of the Communist International. Why would a non-Communist trust him?

[@Livelaughandlaughmore]

9:59 Leclerc LECLERC LEEECLERRRCC LERCLERCDAIDIGBSBSOCID

[@jefesalsero]

A new French film features the story of a group of Legionnaires on a journey to escape from northern Vietnam to China following Japan's victorious (and infamous) March 1945 coup ("Operation Bright Mood") against Vichy forces in French Indochina: kzbin.info/www/bejne/l3bbZqGufLaoi5Isi=C99F5c4a5OjCAod4

[@zainmudassir2964]

Hope you talk about Indonesia massacres of 1965 backed by CIA. Important part of Cold war now completely forgotten

[@stpancraschapel2136]

Bit of an uneven account, to put it politely.

[@James-kv6kb]

What do you expect he is American

[@rrobb9853]

I don't think we (Brits) were less repressive than the French. We were perhaps more efficiently repressive. I read of an incident where some French civilians had been killed before British soldiers could reach them. In response, the Ghurkas burned down every house in the area, killed all livestock, etc. That is, they were battle-hardened and not expecting to lose, or be beaten by the VC. They also cleared areas and kept them clear. The biggest issue for France and later the US was that they did Search and Destroy attacks in an area and then withdrew, allowing the VC and VM to move back in. That is an over simplification but true as a gross cause of defeat.

[@JFDA5458]

I think the British, with their experience of pacification and counter guerrilla war in other areas would have made a far better job of dealing with this then the French could ever hope to.

[@thanhhoangnguyen4754]

​@@JFDA5458 Well the only problem is that it not British colony and they by the time fighting started they already accepted the reality they couldn't hold the colony anymore. Even if they fight and win another costly war plus not to mention creating other former colony of them will cauae another problem.

[@user-uy2mz4hd2r]

Whatever the case was, ho chi minh also actively tried to minimize any hostile acts against british and chinese troops since he knew they were (mostly) there to disarm the japanese and the real threat was the returning french

[@DirtyMikeandTheBoys69]

​@JFDA5458, you forget that Britian's success in counter insurgency elsewhere was predicated on the fact that the small-scale, low intensity conflicts she found herself in were primarily in Anglo-sphere nations, such as Malaya, where she enjoyed a strong, pro-British population and government, against a very small, inadequately equipped Communist foe in a country with no physical border shared with China, where arms and fighters could pour through, unlike Vietnam. In Malaysia, the Commonwealth, supported by over 250,000 Malayans, faced off against less than 9,000 poorly equipped communists. They had small arms only. In Vietnam, the US and French faced an actual military alongside insurgents, equipped with tanks, aircraft, artillery, missiles, etc.

[@JFDA5458]

@@thanhhoangnguyen4754 It appears that it was less to do with helping the French reclaim a former colony and more to do with preventing communism from taking hold in that part of SE Asia.

[@elverdavin365]

I was astonish by the fact that the British defeated Viet Minh in those 2 years (1945-1946) using guerilla warfare and jungle skill patrol with the help of Japanese. Its was disasterous when the British left Vietnam. They could win the war in the region if they stay much longer and gain the population support to fight against Communism.

[@williestreiff9314]

I sence sarcasm 😅😅😅

[@elverdavin365]

@@williestreiff9314 Its true that the British eventually defeated and make the Vietnamese Communist on the run. British conduct a number of patrol with French and Japanese for 2 years in the region that led Viet Minh to scattered across Vietnam. About 40 British Servicemen died and 2700 Viet Minh died in those 2 years and nearly lost. Watch the documentary by Mark Felton Production about 'British In Vietnam War' in KZbin.

[@williestreiff9314]

Fair enough, at least they didn't get bogged down in ten years of combat,,it is a little wild how that little country made such big waves

[@elverdavin365]

@@williestreiff9314 Yeah, imagine that the Vietnamese can defeated the U.S and its allies, French and Chinese but lost to British and Japanese. From my prespective, i could see that the U.S lack of jungle training and could not gain the population support for winning in Vietnam in those 10 years. While the British and Japanese work together with the population to fight the Communist insurgent.

[@williestreiff9314]

Agreed,,, although I believe,,as vicious as it was they were close to surrender from B52 bombing raids, that's not just my opinion ,,yes the war sucked, I feel nonetheless we pulled out to early and left the south to the wolves

[@kidmohair8151]

so. you folks at Real Time History are "a pretty unruly band of cutthroats" are you?

[@realtimehistory]

🏴‍☠

[@Uncle_Roadkill]

This does not seem to be me This definitely does not seem to be me I do not happen to be a worthy heir to my families' wealth

[@clivecartey]

The "rag tag", "weird" British .......did rather better than the "...greatest nation on earth.." etc, etc. (By the way, Mc Arthur once again demonstrated his 'outstanding' ego which culminated in the Korean War pushing for a nuclear supported US invasion of China from the North Korean border ).

[@colinb5415]

Ho Chi Mihn was not a Communist! Even the Russians admitted that. He was a nationalist. He sought help from wherever he could get it. If the French had negotiated a transition of power then all the slaughter of Vietnam would never have happened.

[@rexracernj7696]

He may have been a nationalist but ALSO a Communist. Don't forget, while in Paris he had been a co-founder of the FRENCH Communist Party also.

[@vinhlong7347]

@@rexracernj7696but his ideals did not focus on the issue of class struggle. Ho Chi Minh was under house arrest by Stalin when he was in Soviet Union for four years from 1932 to 1936 due to suspicions about his nationalist ideology.

[@rossbryan6102]

JUNE , 1964, OUT OF BASIC AND 2 WEEKS LEAVE AT HOME, MY DAD TOLD ME, “IF THEY REALLY WANTED TO STOP THE PROBLEMS IN VIETNAM, ALL THEY HAVE TO DO, IS SEND A BUNCH OF GREEN BERETS IN, AND THEY WOULD GET IT DONE IN 6 MONTHS!” THAT DIDNT WORK, AND I MANAGED STAY OUT OF THERE!

[@dulls8475]

Yet another American failing to understand how to win a guerrilla war...

[@dennisguild4052]

Dewey being made non grata means not counted on,non existence

[@jameswebb4593]

I have noticed with this channel a rather nuanced anti British sentiment . But here is a reminder to all of those too young to know the truth. The peoples of Malaya , Singapore , Sarawak today give thanks to the British for fighting the communists . That also applies to other parts of the world where British put their lives on the line in the name of democracy. Strangely that sentiment is rarely if ever expressed towards the French or Americans.

[@dulls8475]

I agree. In fact it is a left wing revisionist nuance.

[@Ace-990]

Communists weren't in power during this though? They were just helping the french get back control while they were rounding up the japanese troops.

[@MartinReiter143]

Depending on who you asked, they might also give thanks that the Brits are gone.

[@benwilson6145]

@@MartinReiter143 The British left voluntary after establishing a government and ensuring that the country was lawful. Not like the French and Americans who favoured war and had to be booted out.

[@koala6016]

@dulls. I disagree, reckoning it as pretty accurate. But maybe that doesn't suit your right wing biad.

[@Luke_Sandy_High_Ground]

Extremely common British W

[@TheIceman567]

How’s it common?

[@TheIceman567]

How is it common?

[@Luke_Sandy_High_Ground]

@@TheIceman567 what do you mean

[@TheIceman567]

@@Luke_Sandy_High_Ground How is it common? It's pretty self explanatory.

[@angkhoanguyen6114]

W low because Viet Minh had no intention of fighting the British, only the French.

[@andyf4292]

so the US arms and trains insurgents, and later on has to fight them? sounds familiar... is this a strategy?

[@James-kv6kb]

In World War I they sold to the Germans then sold to the British when The War started . In Afghanistan they taught them how to grow heroin so that they can buy arms off the Americans to defend against the Russians then invaded Afghanistan

[@griffhenshaw5631]

That period when the British were involved was actually a very successful versus when it became just the French or then the Americans. Yes they use the Japanese but it functioned successfully in a sense. I'm not saying it's right or wrong I'm just saying effectiveness

[@James-kv6kb]

Really annoys me people say the Americans as if they were the only ones there at that time period. No one mentions the Australians who went in before the Americans

[@marvwatkins7029]

A white tee shirt with a sports jacket or suit coat just looks bad and makes the wearer look incredibly lazy. Now if it were a black tee shirt, that would look fashionable.)

[@rickwong9049]

Vietnam War but with tea and biscuit.

[@angloaust1575]

Many japanese joined the viet minh after 1945 also german Foreign legionaires!

[@oddballsok]

Nope… it was German (Dutch French Flemish danish) waffen ss that joined French foreign legion and Dutch army to fight communists in Vietnam and DEI… you were confused.

[@angloaust1575]

Ho chi minh adopted one of the germans who deserted from foreign legion!

[@vinhlong7347]

@@oddballsok there were several German did actually served for the Vietminh during the war, they were called "New Vietnamese people" by the Vietminh

[@polokobealbertobligar1706]

I didn't know Japan switched sides😂

[@ronaldgrove3283]

Japan and the Japanese Emperor surrenders to the Allies, so does their armies ? Japanese soldiers surrendering to British troops in Southern Vietnam acknowledge them as their captives ? Under British direction uses armed troops to help Britain maintain law and order ?

[@James-kv6kb]

The Americans did it in World War I armed the Germans and then change sides . It does happen

[@tommyjackowksi5774]

Somebody get Ho chi min a cheeseburger dawg looks hungry

[@decimated550]

That's how those little skinny wiry guys were able to move so fast. The only weighed a buck 10 and didn't need to eat much. Just a bowl of rice a day. Our American soldiers on the other hand needed restaurants, rear area, super bases, prostitutes, and ice cream factories. We were too expensive to inefficient to beat them in there front yard

[@huyquang6308]

😂😂😂 hôm nay Việt Nam 🇻🇳kỷ niệm 49 năm ngày giải phóng 30/04/1975& 30/04/2024 Việt Nam mãi mãi trường tồn

[@deansanders5926]

Think you will find Gracy wanted out of the area. He told all the thing was wrong. He did not want to support France going back in. He said poplar support was there for independence. He was right. Also the reason why British forces were better at fighting is because they were. We had Malaya later and proved the point which sadly US and France failed to copy.

[@patrickporter1864]

The british fought Chinese guerrill in malaya not Malayian. A different situation.

[@edthebumblingfool]

chinese malayans almost identical, the british just had a political system that didnt breed the same resentment and urge to rebel. if in doubt ask a canadian about it.@@patrickporter1864

[@benwilson6145]

@@patrickporter1864 Just perhaps you will learn in Vietnam and Malaysia that they were fighting Communists supported by the Soviets and Red Chinese!. The British in Borneo also fought and defeated an invasion by the Indonesians

[@user-ry6hd4kx1j]

My Father was an OSS Trained SACO Observer who delivered two Barge Loads of Captured/ Surrendered Japanese Weapons and some American Small Arms to ANYONE in French Indo China who wanted to kick the French Colonists OUT. Our Navy Intelligence was Pro- Vietminh. ( Also Anti - MacArthur. Dad admired the moves of a Japanese Kempatai Man who was directing Traffic in Saigon. He wore White Cotton Gloves and spun around sharply directing the mayhem .

[@dulls8475]

What a great ally you were to the French and British. No doubt those same weapons were used to kill your own soldiers later. We have now had 70 odd years of disastrous US foreign policy.

[@edthebumblingfool]

so he started the vietnam war rather than my grandfather who tried to stop it in 45, which court sould I sue you in?

[@user-ry6hd4kx1j]

@@edthebumblingfool Take it up with the Navy Bub. His Admiral’s didn’t like the French Colonial Government , nor DeGualle , nor did they like the Army and MacArthur.

[@littleowlbooks8514]

Impartiality or lack of impartiality( 7.25)

[@toekneekerching9543]

Wow, i had no idea the Americans armed the Viet-minh ... not surprised though. Standard American short sightedness and they Cleary didnt learn any lessons... Cough mujahideen cough

[@TheIceman567]

The USA only armed them once Japan took over indochina and once the war was over stopped. Btw Britain also armed the mujahideen nor did they ever use any of these weapons after the Soviet afghan war. 😂🙄

[@jerryle379]

Lol VietMinh was a us allied until Us betray them and supported the frenchie 😂 compare VietMinh to taliban show you serious lack of knowledge

[@TheIceman567]

@@jerryle379 huh the video states the us on suppler them to fight the Japanese at wars e d the aid stopped

[@jerryle379]

@@TheIceman567 aids and training and any sort of relation was cut cause french threat the American if they doesn't support french recolonize they old colony they will flip to the Soviet side.

[@James-kv6kb]

They started World War 1 buy selling equipment to the Germans and then changing sides they've been doing it for a long time

[@garypulliam3421]

7:21 You mean "partiality" NOT "impartiality"

[@joellewis7168]

Oh, come on, man.

[@iftyislam6761]

USA trained VK -> Lost to VK USA Trained Taliban -> Lost to Taliban

[@jamesdreads7828]

Oh coming all yeah together it's.

[@carrickrichards2457]

The Allied 14th Army moved into post war occupation and police action across South East Asia. Bandits were active in the post war chaos. The US complicated maters with their agressively anticolonialist global policy. More to assume the influence lost by bankrupt European powers, than anticolonialist ideology. Indian and British Regiments archives details many years of post war 'police' work. The Gurkhas were in south Vietman until after Indian independance, initially with armed Japanese units under their command.

[@waterishdrake8693]

The US dropped the ball

[@charlieross-BRM]

They kicked the ball into the stands.

[@DirtyMikeandTheBoys69]

How so? Britian only succeeded in removing the Viet Mihn from Saigon. They left having failed to actually defeat them outright, leaving France to deal with them. If anyone dropped the ball, it would be Britiain.

[@decimated550]

The military industrial complexes that fed these wars there material did not lose, instead they won big time

[@bigenglishmonkey]

@@DirtyMikeandTheBoys69 thats if you want to change history to make defeating the viet mihn one of the actual objectives. as said in the video their objectives were achieved, meaning britain did what it came to do. it was america that armed them, america that gave them the time to organise at all, and america who ignored britains advice on jungle warfare, which is why britain wasn't in the vietnam war.

[@britishpatriot7386]

​@@DirtyMikeandTheBoys69😭😭😭 please stop, get some help.

[@merlinwizard1000]

12th, 15 March 2024

[@Zorglub1966]

2:53 Nerd nitpicking : the picture is anachronistic. No MAT 49 submachine gun in Indochina at this time, neither those uniforms.😀

[@realtimehistory]

the metadata in the archives for North Vietnamese footage is all over the place. the photo supposedly shows Viet Minh during the independence proclamation. doesn't help that they staged these scenes later on too.

[@jerryle379]

​@@realtimehistory2:53 that photo was taken at VietMinh troop return to Hanoi in 1954 , not sure where you get this pic and who label it so ? I'm dang sure it ain't any vietnamese source label it so . Most of the 1945 independence speech pictures are quite bad quality and rare and we didn't stage photo or mislabel any photo of that day.

[@andyf4292]

difference with the British adventures in indochina , malaya and Borneo.... we won