Building A Traditional Style Smock Windmill. Could We Really Do That?!

[@joshuabessire9169]

Built a farm, railroad, car, now a windmill. When I go to Ireland I'm only flying Way Out West airlines. Design process more thorough than a Boeing.

[@philleeson7835]

At least Tims doors won't fall off.

[@Manigo1743]

Be prepared to pedal a lot.

[@09conrado]

Tim perhaps you could contact a member from the Dutch Windmill association. Don't know anything about them except that there loads of windmill enthousiasts here that are dying to build more of them

[@PlanetMojo]

I would do it. I watch Colin Furze not because I want to build a secret tunnel, but because it's interesting to watch someone else do it. Same with Kris Harbour, and Way Out West. Sometimes you just gotta do things...

[@RikkiCattermole]

Ah yes, Kris Harbour, who made the 1.5kw waterwheel worth the watch! I'd say if Tim got 1kw on average out of a wind turbine, he'd be doing pretty well for himself!

[@DavidWhiteley-e2s]

A bit of old advice. It dates from my grandfather in the 1920s or 30s. He was using gears to transfer power from a vertical to a horizontal shaft, but could not get it to run smoothly. He called an old millwright in who just counted the teeth on the gears and diagnosed the problem. The numbers of teeth on the two cogs had common factors so the same pairs of teeth made contact repeatedly, leading to rapid uneven wear. Choose cogs with different prime numbers of teeth so that each tooth will touch every other tooth. Have Fun!

[@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299]

Yes, I was told about dog teeth many years ago and it makes complete sense

[@wiltothecollector4420]

Dutchman here, most sail designs that have high torque tend to also have higher speed, examples being the 'fokwiek' of "busselneus" the general rule is a deeper "zeeg" (no idea what the english term would be, it's the shape of the fencework) means higher torque, and a wider fencework and boardwork also makes for higher torque, albeit with lower speed as for a sort of speed regulator, some mills have "zelfzwichting" known as "patent sails" which automatically close and open as the wind gets more or less powerfull, working with a rod going through the windshaft, a more modern "ten haveklep" existst which is made out of one big flap, which opens more like a door, thus automatically working as a brake flap too as for getting the cap into the wind, for a small mill i'd reccomend a tail beam with a whinch which hooks into the balcony, which is the norm in the Netherlands, automatic turning systems do exist, mostly used in germany, these are made out of a tiny, somewhat american looking windmill on the cap with a cog on it, which engages onto a rack rail on top of the tower The brake is mostly the same on all mills, being either a series of wooden blocks or a metal band around the brakewheel, with a hinge point on one side and a weigted beam on the other, the weighted beam can be raised into a hook to release the brake, and is, on it's end, attatched to a chain which is attatched to another beam which hangs outside the cap, with a longer chain coming down to the balcony, making the brake operable from there

[@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299]

Thanks for this - lots to think about, isn't there?!

[@wiltothecollector4420]

@@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299 Absolutely, every single little detail in a traditional windmill had it's purpose for being there

[@s.backer5134]

Hi Tim I really like the idea of a classical windmill. I built one myself two years ago to pump some water in the garden. I was tinkering quiet a bit and tried different designs. I startet small, which gives you little power of course, made the rotor bigger, until it was too heavy. The best solution for me was a very simple mediterranean type of windmill with 8 rods that all had ropes attached to stiffen everything up. The blades were just triangular pieces of fabric that worked as sails. I tried some ways so make the rotor follow the direction of the wind but in the end I decided to just keep it in a fixed position. With the sails the wheel always spins in the same direction, no matter if the wind comes from the front or the back. As my tower was just one pole secured with ropes, it didnt matter if the wheel faced the wind backwards. One big issue is storm protection. I tried some self protecting systems but the by far easiest solution for me was just to unhook the ropes of the sails and wrap the sails around the rods if a storm was forecasted. It was a lot of fun to build and watch it pump water even in a low breeze. I am exited what you will come up with (Check my profile description to get a look)

[@awatt]

I haven't built a windmill but your method using fabric sails would be my go to.

[@howardsportugal]

That sounds like an excellent system! If you have any vids, pix or links I'd love to see them! Cheers from rural Portugal! @HowardsPortugal

[@janis1981]

This guy got a sail bike!!!!

[@roberthatherell967]

for the "tower" could you use decommisioned bulk LPG tanks. I have seen them being offered free. Cut the ends off, stack and weld. leave the end of the upper most tank. A robust, possibly cheap tower that can be easily adapted for fitting for fitting the sails and various shafts etc

[@Chr.U.Cas1622]

Dear inventor Tim. 👍👌👏 Great idea for a new project. Please kindly allow me to suggest something: Sir, how about using a used, sturdy differential (or even a complete axle), driveshafts and gearbox from a lorry for instance. The rotor/sails could be fastened to the brake drum (or, even better, to a disk brake). Car parts aren't sturdy enough, unfortunately Kris Harbour experienced this recently. You could even use the front axle of an all wheel drive truck/lorry. By using the steering gear box, you could bring the rotor to sit in different angles. The drive shaft(s) could be easily used as vertical power transmission. Maybe even with the rubber Hardy disc(s) and the bearing(s). It might be wise to build a smaller windmill with inexpensive used car parts first. With all those relatively easy available parts, almost every mechanical transmission/problem of a windmill can be made/solved. Even a necessary brake. Best regards, luck and health in particular.

[@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299]

thanks - yes, I will think about that..!

[@WayneCarolan]

Hi Tim, you are on to something for sure, cheapest way I see would be lattice towers. A galvanised triangular lattice mast structure ~380mm is common for Metmasts. I used to fit them up in wind farms to fit class one instruments at the height of the middle of blade to verify wind speed. 3 of these towers, 9 lengths (3metre a length, can be bolted together maybe a bit of guyed support and tension between each would work. Keep them around 3 metres apart.

[@IvoTichelaar]

Ooooooh! Better than the pedal car even! I am Dutch and it is hard not to love windmills if you like mechanical things and wood around here. I live close to windmills that are up to 400 years old and essentially unchanged and mostly preserved and functional. It may be a relatively big investment, but likely go pay for itself (but perhaps not in your lifetime...). One early remark: the slight angle of the sails is not because of the taper of the tower. In Dutch windmills, it's 13 degrees regardless of the tower's taper, because it is optimal for performance. Don't ask me why, but it is. The internal mechanics are usually made of wood, mostly. There are many different types of wood preferred for different parts. Some for flexibility, some for load bearing, some for wear resistance etc. But this is when a professional millmaker is building the best and most efficient windmill, to last centuries. I am sure a little oversizing here and there will allow using the relatively ordinary "building pine" as we call it in the Netherlands.

[@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299]

Thanks Ivo. I found a few examples of vertical sails on straight-sided towers, but perhaps not in the Netherlands?

[@davidcoates4852]

I have seen windmills using a differential vehicle axle and brakes where the input shaft became the output shaft and the sales took the place of one wheel, the brake on the other hub was on to send power and when released would effectively allow the sales to spin freely. Applying both brakes would stop rotation of the sales. 🔧👍

[@Guitorgpiano]

Friction based heating using a wind turbine is something that's never crossed my mind! What an interesting use for windpower - some challenges involved with that, mainly how not to catch things on fire!

[@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299]

underwater friction...

[@anotherfreediver3639]

Getting the circular rack on which the cap rotates will possibly be your greatest challenge. You need one ready-made, like the first radio telescopes using naval gun mountings. My first thought would be something from a scrapped crane, as long as it was a ring, and not a wheel with a solid centre. Or indeed a tank turret ring!

[@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299]

Yes, please - send one over : - )

[@HWPcville]

"Where's the fun in that?". I LIKE you way of thinking. I would really like it if you design, build & implement your own vision of a windmill. I know you have the "engineering" capability to design it, the "mechanical" ability to get all the gearing built and the "carpentry" skills to build it. That only leaves financing & desire. I hope you are able to put it all into action as it would make a great video series.

[@andrewreynolds4949]

It might be worth looking at the drive mechanism of “American” style water pump windmills. I believe they work on a simple crank and connecting rod set to transfer the power. It would be less efficient but potentially far easier and cheaper to build.

[@loadzofhobbies4219]

How about building the tower from large diameter concrete silo rings? Would be fast to erect and very steong to absorb vibration.

[@gentlegiants1974]

At one time in my life I pondered this same subject. I had a disused concrete stave silo 35 ft tall and 14 ft diameter on a windy ridge and the plan was to install a steel ring over the top which would serve to distribute the weight evenly over the whole diameter, it would have a 14 ft circular rail on which the entire mechanism would rest and rotate, similar to a sawmill carriage in the round. The axle would be parallel to the ground and the sails would be perpendicular, greatly simplifying the engineering. Really any welded steel structure, can be trussed and engineered to enable a vertical cylindrical shape at the low height you have described, you would not need to taper it structurally, although below the sails you could superficially build out a tapered base to achieve the traditional look. Plan was for 40 ft diameter sail/fan. Low speed high torque geared up to run a big generator. The "upstairs" mechanicals would be minimal, the main gear on the axle engaging the wallower and the tail fan to operate the furling drive, to rotate the head into or out of the wind to maintain a constant speed, along with a braking mechanism similar to a cable operated driveline band brake on a truck. The main drive shaft would extend 35 ft down to floor level to a transmission and the generator and any other mechanicals would be floor level.

[@TMxl-w5t]

Hi Tim. All I can offer, is lots of encouragement, but I do have lots of it .. Cheers 😊😊👍

[@timothyhargreaves8088]

Hi Tim, a VAWT wind turbine would be more efficient than an old fashioned apron windmill, although it wouldn't be as pretty. At what ever windspeed, the VAWT will always spin at the same speed and it doesn't matter from which direction the wind is blowing, meaning you won't have to get up in the middle of the night to brake or tether the sails when it starts blowing too hard. (If you do have to get up in the middle of the night, remember to film it😃)

[@graemewhite5029]

And you might get a lot more "mill" into the space you quoted from the Government guide ?

[@IvoTichelaar]

Dutch windmills were quite reliable and competitive compared to steam powered mills, until the wages of windmill operators became a limiting factor. To get the best out of a traditional windmill, you need a miller to keep an eye on it when it's running, that's right.

[@plainnpretty]

It would be interesting to see what kind of work you could do with it . Thanks

[@patrickmoore8428]

I like your approach. I have a water turbine that I built. Despite a lot of effort to make it reliable it has failed several times. It takes a lot of work to build something that runs 24/7 without failing.

[@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299]

It's just a matter of time before it fails - unless regular maintainance works?

[@Convolutedtubules]

I would love to see your approach to this build. I would be pleased to help make some parts for the project.

[@RunnerPack]

I would skip the romanticism of the sails, and just go with a VAWT made of plastic barrels cut in half on a vertical shaft, held up with a simple triangulated tubing or timber frame, but I am looking forward to seeing what you come up with!

[@davidbrewer7844]

So what happens if the ground where the wind mill is built just happens to have been landscaped to a couple of metres higher than it used to be? that would gain some useful height..... You would still be stuck on sail diameter but higher is better!

[@chrissyfrancis8952]

I live in Amish country Pennsylvania, so I’m used to seeing how things were done without electricity, motors, tractors, etc. Their farms are immaculate too. Picture perfect. We live in the northern end of the Appalachian mountain range(I’ve never lived anywhere that I wasn’t in between 2 ranges) not a lot of wide open fields. But the one thing that sets these farms off is the old fashioned windmills they use to pump water to irrigate the fields. Wind primarily comes West to East here, but some have pivots on top, so it can rotate with the wind. These are just simple frames, made of tubular metal or wood, sheet metal(maybe aluminum blades). You could start simple using scrap wood & metal to build a simple frame. I’d think blades made from bent aluminum would be light & rust resistant. If you could build that over a stream, you could pump water to the gardens as a test run.

[@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299]

You're right - plenty to learn from the Amish. But not irrigation - we have far more rain here than is good for us.. : - )

[@TheInfoworks]

I built a Cretan sail mill back in the eighties, there's a photo in my book. The tower was like a 4 cornered tapered pylon and I used car axle as the windshaft with the diff pointing down to drive the vertical shaft. I welded up the diff gears so that it just a simple angle drive. The whole top was driven into the wind with a fan tail running on a very crude large diameter flat gear wheel. This was a sheet of steel with a hole in the middle and bits of steel flat bar welded on as gear teeth. Simples, cheers

[@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299]

An interesting project, for sure, Andy. But was it useful? That's my main aim - to build something that works well.

[@TheInfoworks]

@@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299 Tim, it was an interesting learner project to wind power. It ran a 2Kw generator for a while but my engineering (at the time) let it down and life moved on, it was 21 ft in diameter and slow reving. Out here on the east coast the wind is quite variable and so using a wind machine to charge energy storage was the only way to get usable power, cheers

[@ChrisShute62]

As others have suggested, a differential with a reclaimed car axle really makes sense. Fit the sails on one half shaft, keeping its wheel studs, brake and bearings. Extend both handbrake cables, with separate levers. When the brake on the free shaft is applied, from below, the driveshaft will spin at ½ speed and twice the torque, which may suit Tim's application best. The universal joints in the driveshaft can correct the inclination of the differential and sails. Using the differential as a clutch will give a soft start to the drive and help prevent sheared bolts and shafts. Of course, it won't stop the sails spinning, unless the sails' shaft brake, on the other shaft, is also applied. If not, then the free sails will spin crazily. Another thought: when you're not using the windmill for mechanical work, why not add a generator to the 'free' halfshaft, with a brake on the main drive below. Then you have a 1:1 drive from the sails, and none of the wind is wasted. To stop the generator, prior to a day of woodchopping, simply connect a kettle to the generator. That way, you could start the day with an extra (free!) cup of tea!🙂 This looks like a great project. Good luck Tim!

[@matthieuchastel595]

6 tips for BLADE DESIGN: (1) I suspect EAZ Wind's "small" wooden blade turbine in NL are close to the most efficient profile for this size of blade Tim. But they probably still turn faster than you would like... (2) The first 6 meters of conventional windturbines could be inspiration since they turn slow (so the tip of the blade don't turn tooo fast) and have been super engineered. However, those 6-first meters shape have a strong structure requirements to be able to hold the rest of the long blade and that probably compete with the efficiency of the shape: a problem you don't have. (3) some of the old wind mills existed is those dimensions and faced the same constrains. I would use the lastest one build as example because they must have had quite similar material, cost and energy constraints that you have now and they had years of trial and error en probably some engineering (without computer simulations though !). The latest builds had flat wings more or less square and some wing-shaped/profilded solid front edges... What I understand is that slow turning makes super precise earodynamic profiles much less important. (4) you could look at planes, gliders or deltaplane paraglider shapes: the faster they want to go, the more narrow (but sometimes longer) the blades to avoid too much drag but keep lift... EngineeringwithRosie channel has very intersting and didactic discussions about blade designs and all the pros and cons and the whys of the blades adds on (like the plane-like tilted tips of the blades) of commercial turbine. (6) look at the 2005 blade design on the old "Noletmolen" www.molendatabase.nl/molens/ten-bruggencate-nr-10172 and the page solar.lowtechmagazine.com/2009/10/history-of-industrial-windmills.html. Not sure you will find opensource of plans but who knows: I find some science article with dimensions but usually its one specific parameter that is studied and not "small" slow turbine... Good luck Tim! ... And start planting a lot of trees to find the tonnes of wood you will need... You need Panoramix's seeds that asterix and Obélix are using in Mission Cleopatra... But there are some druids in Ireland aren't they?

[@laurencemills7046]

Looks like this would be a very interesting project. Will be watching to see how this one develops. 👍

[@walt]

I have no wise words but if you build it I will watch.

[@thedeloachsdoyoutube8377]

Just know that if I was not all the way here in Tennessee, I would be there almost daily to help you. I admire your imagination and know that you give inspiration to the lot of us. Maker 238

[@timeflysintheshop]

Maybe you could find a set of blueprints or plans for the Dutch mills and scale it down to the size you need?

[@anotherfreediver3639]

If you could generate 1kW of power, then you could hook it up to an electrical generator when you're not using it for chopping turnips (etc.), which could charge a battery pack, and heat your house. So you get the fun of a great project, AND some free electricity.

[@RattiDave]

Sounds good to me. I used to live in Holland, Michigan, USA, the largest ex-patriot Dutch community outside of the Netherlands. Also home of the annual Tulip Festival.

[@michiganengineer8621]

Something rather funny, just a few days ago on a Reddit channel I follow (either r/OffGrid or r/SolarDIY) somebody was asking about wooden windmills, and why they aren't "a thing". I had the GREAT pleasure in telling them that yes, wooden windmills do indeed exist and they have for centuries.

[@SimonAmazingClarke]

Rotating the top to keep it into wind is easy. A small windmill at the back 90 degrees to the sails. This rotates with any side wind.

[@egoncasteel]

Why not just take a car diff stand it on end, extend one of the axles, and the universal at the end gives you your tilt back. Takes care of most the mechanics and gives 2 outputs at 90 degrees apart.

[@zinckensteel]

I wonder if it might make sense to add a second set of blades on the other axle, letting them counter-rotate, and take the output from the drive shaft. This could give more power for the same occupied space, perhaps, and certainly should make it more well-balanced.

[@Landrew0]

I can't wait to watch how this is done.

[@johnfreiler6017]

6 Meters diameter, 3 meter radius, means your "sails" will be about two, two and half meters long. Not too shabby and yes, some decent power ought to be available. I'm with you, a modern turbine would be much more efficient and probably easier, but this will be far more fun! And for the man who built that huge flywheel for his charcoal slicer thingee, I have strong hopes for you actually accomplishing it. Good Luck!

[@CulinaireZaken]

Hey Tim, I've started the training for part time millener here in the netherlands. I can send you the books if you want to? Pieter

[@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299]

Thank you Pieter. You might need the books though! I would be interested it you learn anything about optimum sail shape for low speed, high torque? (In this country milliner means someone who makes hats - I wonder if they come from the same origin?)

[@williammcguinness6664]

Milliners come from Milan ​@@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299

[@alangknowles]

Just Miller. English loves exceptions to the general rule. ​@@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299

[@Azamyth]

If you were to pile up stones that high it might be worth designing in some cut outs near the top for pigeons or other rockbirds to nest in

[@sjaakvaag]

Maybe you could put a pto on. Like on a tractor. I don't know how mutch tork and speed you can generate. Then even you can put a hydoulicpump to it. Lots of posebilleties.

[@dennisolsson3119]

I have been wanting to do this for years! But I would personally go electric to easier transfer the power. The rotating thing is not complicated. It is just another windmill perpendicular to the main one that is directly coupled to a cog turning the head. If when the head is perfectly aligned the small mill stops and the big one is at full blast. Maybe scout for turrent cogs and bearings and such from old excavators. I think it would be hard to find for the right price but would be up for the load

[@paulsharpe3794]

Hi Tim how about using a differential from a car for the main bearing you just need to remove and seal one axle and then fix the blades on the weel hub and then the prop shaf can go down to the ground with a mirrored unit to transfer the power out parallel with the ground to run !!!

[@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299]

thanks - yes, I will think about that..!

[@and7barton]

What a super project ! - We'll be watching this closely.

[@conorgraafpietermaritzburg3720]

Perhaps you could pick up a 2nd hand one in Greece 🇬🇷 and crowd-fund it😊

[@peters9929]

A car diff at the top with a set of extended drive shafts to the base. With drive shaft universal joints the diff could be tilted for the blades to attach to . Sounds like a scrap challenge the cheapest wins.

[@bendordoy4815]

That's a brilliant idea tim could use half a Jaguar irs axle assembly the axles Shafts are U joint shafts, so then diff could be mounted straight with the input/prop shaft flange pointing downwards.

[@peters9929]

@@bendordoy4815 or BMW fun to watch him make it as cheap as possible

[@erniecamhan]

The heat generated would mostly come from the lower steel discs as the weight of the higher discs would compress the lower discs more, what if you where to fit compression springs to the assembly so all discs are compressed equally

[@z4zuse]

3:06 windmill “De Valk” (“the Falcon”) in Leiden, the Netherlands

[@Drew_TheRoadLessTraveled]

Have a good look at the Australian outback mechanical pump windmill. minimal effort maximum output.

[@juliancripps1580]

Excellent idea. Perhaps you might contact Robert Murray-Smith a fellow u-tube experimenter. He has looked a lot at all sorts of wind turbines. He would have leads/ designs to get the high torque you are after.

[@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299]

His wife died recently - I think he's taking a break from everything

[@jonathancook4022]

If you do this, it would blow me away, and I’d totally put some money in if you start a crowdfunding project

[@zinckensteel]

How about two sets of counter-rotating blades connected through a salvaged rear differential? The weight would be better balanced on the tower and you wouldn't have to deal with an odd angle for power transmission.

[@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299]

Very interesting idea - thanks. Have you seen any examples? Though surely not counter-rotating? That would remove any drive to the vertical? Perhaps they would interfere with each other too much?

[@andrewchapman2024]

Oh! I like this idea!

[@kevfit4333]

It would be interesting to see this style of windmill spin up a flywheel with some sort of overdrive, and reduction gears at the flywheel end the that can be isolated by a clutch to take the power off. That would incorporate a buffer zone of energy storage.

[@johnwynne-qx6br]

Sounds great and very interesting, ask the government for a grant for your green energy idea that could be replicated across the country/world.

[@farmingfromscratch]

This is a similar project to what I have been thinking about building, this last summer I was able to visit Quainton windmill near Aylesbury, Bucks, they had the thing running, quite an experience! anyway it is a later built type mill it has a governor that opens a louver type sail, to help regulate the speed, I think they might have some stuff online about it, they did have a hand drawn (kinda) to scale drawing of the thing as well. if you have a chance to visit it, it's well worth it, would make a great v!d, only problem is you would have to get over to England! I'm hoping you go ahead with this project! cheers Tim.

[@farmingfromscratch]

If youtube will allow this, here's the link for the mill running: www.quaintonwindmill.org/index_video_2.htm

[@awatt]

​@farmingfromscratch The system I have seen has the louvers operated by a set of levers called a spider linked to a weight that is lifted by the force of the wind. Fascinating mechanism.

[@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299]

Thank you both - yes, I like the fantail design, but there's no detail about it in the video

[@awatt]

@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299 The youtube video titled "tour of upminster windmill " at about 9.40 details the mechanism for controlling the louvers in the sails. Unfortunately it doesn't show or mention the feedback mechanism used to automatically regulate the speed of the sails which is attaching a weight to the chain that drives the ropewheeel. As the force on the louvers increases the weight is lifted which opens the louvers and vice versa. I haven't seen this solution anywhere else and when properly balanced works well.

[@farmingfromscratch]

Hi Tim, it's been a year since I visited the mill and I did buy a drawing of it from their gift shop but I have misplaced it somewhere!! they do have a few pics on that website with the vid, but nothing that shows the mechanisms and how they work. (look on the how it works and restoration tabs for those pics). When I went it was free to visit (just gave them a good donation), they were extremely helpful explaining how everything worked, I'm betting if you contacted somebody from their website they could hook you up with all the info you need. I guess they call louvers - shutters, that might help you find more info on the subject. Thinking about it now, I can't actually remember if the governor (ball type) affected the sails or just did something to the stones themselves, anyway the spider that awatt talks about sits at the center of the sail blades which then acts on the shutters the spider is connected to a shaft that runs through the center of main sail drive shaft after which it can be pushed in or out to open or close the shutters, the design is great for stopping the mill quick, just using a lever or a pull chain etc and you don't have to only rely on the brake. That's about all I can remember sorry, if I still lived local to it, I would have popped by and taken a vid of it for you, but I'm living in the States now! Good luck, hope to see you milling soon!!!!!!!

[@howardsportugal]

A great big rudder behind the sails ought to keep it turned into wind...you could even make adjustable to alter the angle of attack according to windspeed! You've got me looking for the regs here in Portugal!! Cheers! @HowardsPortugal

[@thewunder-lusters9644]

Whoot! New project!!! 🥰

[@bjornjohansson4911]

Dear Tim. You may consider driving a hydraulic pump, that can be utilized in many ways. As for creating heat, you can just "strangle" the pipe area, and collect the heat from the valve. Just an idea, I have had since many years.

[@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299]

Yes but to store that energy wouldn't you need a pressurised tank?

[@bjornjohansson4911]

@@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299 Well, not necessarily. You can store heat in an accumulator tank, soil battery or others. Use the mechanic energy when the wind is advantageus, by a hydraulic motor, or direct from a pulley, gear box or others. Electric power is complicated, but a smaller amount via car alternator and battery, can solve for what is needed in a boat, or so. 😀😀😀

[@paulmoncrieff3979]

Go for it mate… I’m an artist and really enjoy all your projects. I’m sure we will all enjoy the journey

[@KnowArt]

would make for great content and a really fun project! In all other aspects it´s of course not worth it.

[@rjung_ch]

Hi Tim, what friction method are you thinking of using if you'd like to use it as a heat source for the house? Love your ideas. 👍💪✌

[@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299]

I am just designing an experiment - I'll try to make a video of it..

[@rjung_ch]

@@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299 thanks for the feedback Tim.

[@enginecrzy]

Wind powered Air compressors are a fun idea. An Amish Guy ran His whole shop with one... Air powered Bicycles are fun idea too, I watched Some KZbin vids awhile back about these.✌👍

[@egoncasteel]

would go well with the air powered train

[@alexb.6451]

You refer to some traditional Dutch mills. There is the smallest one in the Dutch province Utrecht Molen Polder Buitenweg. It's somewhat different in design but maybe useful for inspiration one man can change the rotor orientation from ground level.

[@gwyneddboom2579]

He’s mentioned the regulations, the sails must be 3 metres off the ground

[@clivelee4279]

You could model it on the one in “ Oh Mr Porter “ that was an Irish windmill .

[@Peter-jo3wt]

If you build it, they will come !!

[@Joseu124]

as you need torque for your applications, 1kw is more than enough. even the big steam tractors only had about 20hp. you can calculate Torque it with the formula (Units in [ ]) P[W]=M[Nm]*n[rpm]*Pi/30. Also the tilt wouldn't be an issue with the old traditional pin wheel gearing. The most important are the bearings on top for the windmill axis

[@mrclaus859]

Thanks for posting

[@ButterflyMatt]

Tim O. West, Windmillador.

[@mr.headcrab31]

Sorry for messaging so late, but i just found something that may be an option, rather than the classic Don Quixote style, Look into a Erasmus Darwin's design. Another KZbinr, "Undecided with Matt Ferrell" did a video recently talking about it and it seems to be a better fit for your needs, being more effecent, no steering gear or manual sail trimming and with less risk of knights errant bothering the sheep. Biggest issue is that it looks more like a grain silo from the outside.

[@spaguettoltd.7933]

This is such a great project

[@timeflysintheshop]

If you want more torque, wouldn't it help to have six or eight blades? Since you are limited in diameter, adding more sail area should yield more power. The water pumping ones I see in Amish country are small in diameter, but have lots of blades.

[@TheDemocrab]

What about taking inspiration from the older steel/iron windmills such as those common around farms in outback Australia? I think it could be worth looking into they're often in very remote places they're as cheap as you can get and often were made or maintained using whatever scrap metal was nearby. The other useful thing is because they're relatively lightweight a simple flat prop on the back of them is enough to ensure they're always orientated optimally without you having to even think about wind direction. They're also durable as heck, I've seen them missing a bunch of the blades and still happily powering whatever they were made to power.

[@flatbrokefrank6482]

Slewing bearings could be one solution, although expensive would easily carry the weight loading of the sails.

[@tiitsaul9036]

A friend of mine restored a good old windmill in Estonia. It's not 100% functional, but it spins and looks great. Go have a look.

[@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299]

It's quite a long way to Estonia from here - I don't think my little car would make it : - )

[@tiitsaul9036]

@@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299 but your little car has pedals ;)

[@Manigo1743]

@@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299 There is water all the way from Ireland to Estonia. You could build a boat. :-)

[@rjung_ch]

@@Manigo1743 maybe his next project?

[@Austriantrainguy]

You could attatch a winch on the side of it that could pull heavy trains up a steep gradient

[@nameless5413]

Just curious - are there any plans for modular size of the sail? i imagine basicaly nicking idea from sailing industry where one would have a pully system to extend or contract some form of cloth to alter power of the system. Certainly it is interesting idea and i do not think making entirely round building is nescesary, probably going to be fine as exa or octagonal shape of some straight wood or something like that. or even better just gather all the loose stone and pile it up on top of ittself that ought to be cheap and give the whole structure fairly robust low down weight (assuming higher portion would be made of lighter wood).

[@adamar4444]

I seen old windmills in my country, and they wasn't towers with rotating tops, they are build out of wood, set on short stone foundation, and you had to rotate the whole building with long leverage. The whole construstion was set on rollers so it wasn't that hard to rotate it. And it makes inside mechanisms easier to make, because everything inside is static, main shaft have a brake, not shaft after gears.

[@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299]

Thank you Adamar - where do live?

[@adamar4444]

@@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299 Poland! I have seen this type of windmills in open-air museums.

[@HYUKLDER1]

Best place to build windmill on your land needs researching. High ground, somewhere where wind is funnelled, etc. Probably some known facts available on how sites for traditional windmills were originally selected.

[@perrydebell1352]

Hello again Tim, My previous post of a few minutes ago, seems to have gone walkabout; perhaps because a link was included? This article might interest you? Real-world tests of small wind turbines in Netherlands and the UK Posted by Gail the Actuary on September 15, 2010 - 10:30am This is a guest post by Kris de Decker. Kris is editor of Low Tech Magazine. Rembrandt and I saw a somewhat similar story in the Dutch version of Low Tech Magazine, and Kris was kind enough to put together this story in English for us.

[@IvoTichelaar]

I was just thinking about posting something from low tech magazine website. Good thinking! 😉

[@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299]

Thanks for this - but I can't find it in the archives. Could you try posting the link again, maybe? Or send email it? rustyironpig @ gmail.com

[@Skorpychan]

My thought is that you don't need to tip the shaft, just stick a universal joint on it so the sails are tilted but the shaft is completely horizontal. Grab one out of a front wheel drive car, maybe?

[@londonnight937]

What an interesting project! I can't wait to see it start!

[@hrxy1]

looking forward to seeing part 2of 100

[@lukafilm]

I didnt get why the top part needs to be angled to be parallel with the slope? Why cant the sails be extened a bit further out and be vertical? Btw. It looks wonderful Tim. Looking forward to watching you build it!!!

[@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299]

I think it's just because the windshaft would be unsupported for more of its length - which is bad because of vibration

[@ferguscosgrave7510]

Interesting thanks

[@locouk]

Another great project!

[@Allan_aka_RocKITEman]

*I ❤️ WINDMILLS*

[@monicareid8858]

Yes, please ☀️

[@conorbrady1839]

Windmill windmill for the land, turn forever hand in hand

[@TJPlaysNow]

I love the idea, it fits with my idea very well! I want to figure a cheap and secure way to build a gravity battery to store the energy. I'm planning on making a video within the next few weeks going over my ideas and how anyone can build it if they have property (and your city allows building sheds without permits, smaller than 120 sqft). I'm working on V4 in fusion now. A great windmill would make the battery even more useful because with some gearing I'm sure storing and using the power of the wind will be very doable and better than whatever other methods I can come up with. Can't wait to see what more you make!

[@Engineer12307]

Thanks

[@TJPlaysNow]

@@Engineer12307 uh your welcome? lol hope you can think of amazing ideas from this

[@Engineer12307]

@@TJPlaysNow Np Trying not to brag but i love design things and i think im a good engineer

[@typxxilps]

Get a LFP battery with 15 kW for cheap. All the research for gravity batteries have not worked out so far and can not compete with LFP battery prices we have right now. We have a podcast from german energy research institutes, an EU excellence cluster, that touches these topics. Lots of conversion losses and huge amounts needed. Eeven for those who own an old bunker and could pump up water 3 or 4 meters with a hugh bassin were not able to get it done cheaper than a LFP battery even though they had the lowest investment with just a few m of pipes a water pump and generator.

[@TJPlaysNow]

@@typxxilps how much is a 40kw lfp battery? With my research I've found a could make a battery that's fairly robust. And even if it's just about the same price it's still better for the environment to use a gravity battery over lithium as the lithium battery needs extensive mining operations, and they go dead after x charges and discharges where a gravity battery would last until the building falls. It's likely they are good, it's just big corporations don't want us to know

[@victoriavickers33]

storing the power as compressed air as someone also mentioned would be good as it would accumulate what ever the wind speed. you already have experience with using compressed air so it would be building on things learned which would be helpful. compressed air can go and do work all over your place either hose or tank. compressed air to heat your home now there is an interesting starter project.

[@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299]

You're right - I'd need a big tank though...

[@logik100.0]

Personally I would go with all electric e.g. Windmill of some type to generator as power is used in more fun ways. Like a sand battery for the heating or store in a battery then you could use the stored power to use anywhere like to power your railway. You can have fun making a fancy frame.

[@BlueEyedColonizer]

Yes.....this or more railways......or both😃

[@stephencresswell4760]

Wind powered train. 👍

[@keninglis7060]

You could build the tower by welding a number of salvaged hot water cylinders together. Diffs should be run in the same direction as in the car - the losses when the wheels are driving the engine are a lot more losses than than when the engine is driving the wheels.

[@plusmanikantanr]

And for energy-storage, why not a higher-elevation retention pond ? and a lower pond as a water reservoir. Also a Ram-Pump installed for a very tall high capacity water-tank(s). Use the water tank to drive a water turbine. Electricity on-demand. Also solar-panels to directly drive a water-pump to help with the water storage. You will use both windmill+solar to push water up-field retention-pond, and ram-pump with gravity to the tall high capacity water-tank(s). Water-turbines I think are upwards of 70% to maybe near-90% efficient ? maybe ? 😀

[@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299]

Unfortunately our land is not suitable for split-level ponds though..

[@bow-tiedengineer4453]

I love the idea of friction heat for a building. What material would you use for the friction brake and wheel? It'd need to either be very cheap or very hard wearing, and it couldn't be flammable because something like wood would scorch. Maybe attach an old brake disk to the shaft, and then pinch it between two bits of scrap metal? all of that could be cheaply replaced at the scrapyard, so it would probably be less expensive than electric or flame heating.

[@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299]

Apparently you don't need anything that touches - just whisking water will heat it to boiling eventually

[@typxxilps]

Will not work out cause friction would mean losses of energy you can hardly harvest and use. Check out modern wind turbines and ask for the cooling system. Have not heard about that there is much to use in a house.

[@bow-tiedengineer4453]

@@typxxilps You do realize that energy lost due to friction becomes heat, right? So, if the goal is to make heat, then the energy losses due to friction are the point. You'd use the energy by just having the hot thing inside, with a gland of some sort where the shaft goes through the wall to keep the warm air in. Friction creates heat, the air absorbs the heat, you've now heated the inside of your house with friction.

[@bow-tiedengineer4453]

@@wayoutwest-workshopstuff6299 huh. I'm not surprised, but I'd never heard of that. I guess you're basically just using fluid resistance rather than rubbing solid thigns together. It'd probably be more efficient with something like a very thick oil, because that would provide more resistance, and thus create heat at a lower speed, further reducing wear on the rest of the system. Maybe get a gallon of steam oil, that stuff is super thick, or maybe even use a bunch of grease, and then use two whisks like one of those kitchen mixers so the thick fluid would be pulled in and folded even if it doesn't flow very well.

[@HugeRademaker]

As far as I know there are about 1200 working wooden windmills in The Netherlands. A lot of them still used for pumping water after heavy rainfall. Surely there's loads of information to obtain there.

[@Allan_aka_RocKITEman]

Just GUESSING here, I would suggest building a MUCH SMALLER scale model to begin with, just to get an idea of how the larger version would go together.

[@mischef18]

Like where you are going with this bro. Does the main part of the tower have to be tapered all the way up or can you get away with only the lower part of it tapered so the blades are vertical. Safe travels. Ken.