Bus Replacements in Melbourne // Always An Adventure!

Rail replacement buses in Melbourne are bad. Really bad. This video is about some specific experiences with the 2022/23 bus replacements on the Hurstbridge line while the line was being partially duplicated beyond Greensborough, and also some observations about how PTV manages these things generally.
Want to help support the channel, get early access to new content and exclusive behind the scenes videos? Join me on Patreon: / taitset
All footage and photographs used in this video are by Martin Bennet (me). The rain overlay graphic in the opening scene is from Vecteezy.com, but I recorded all the rest of the storm imagery and audio.
My voiceover in this video was recorded with the assistance of my brother Cian, who happens to be a sound recordist and musician. Check out his music here: hyperfollow.com/cianbennetmusic
Chapters:
00:00 - This is going to be a lovely day..
00:26 - Hurstbridge gets bused/We are bad at this
01:58 - The bad brochure/Map Making Masterclass
03:17 - The PTV website experience
04:39 - The mystery of the E1 express
05:46 - The trains are confusing too
07:54 - Connections that don't connect and other stories
09:27 - The Journey Planner takes you for a ride
10:20 - That's not fare
11:23 - Finally, some trains
11:51 - Almost the end... MORE BUSES
12:32 - Good buses are good btw/The end
#transport #melbourne #railways #transit

[@Taitset]

By the way, all the internal bus footage I used in this was taken during very quiet periods for easier filming. It was much more typical for buses to be completely full, and usually packed with standees. This video was largely written on my phone while I was squished up the back of one of these buses! What a great time.

[@peterelvery]

Don't most people use Tripview to work out their journey options? In Sydney the repacement bus routes and other details are included there.

[@peterelvery]

BTW is the extra s in buses a Melbourne thing, like Reservor?😅

[@Taitset]

@@peterelvery Third party apps aren't very useful when the data being provided to them is incorrect or incomplete, as it is in these cases.

[@Taitset]

@@peterelvery Haha you've got me there. Looks like it's just how I spell it! From a bit of googling, 'busses' is in many dictionaries as an alternative spelling, but rarely used: www.merriam-webster.com/grammar/plural-of-bus#:~:text=The%20plural%20of%20the%20noun,an%20error%20to%20many%20people.

[@peterelvery]

@@Taitset Yeah. I did think of that. I'm just used to this kind of thing in Tripview. Never really needed to think about the source. Buses replace trains between Penrith and Strathfield Sat 18 Nov 02:00 - Mon 20 Nov 02:00 Bus routes 32T1 Penrith, Blacktown, Parramatta, then Granville and return 39T1 Penrith, express to Strathfield and return 40T1 Penrith, then all stations to Granville and return

[@NewFalconerRecords]

I approached SBS to do a TV series "Great Train Replacement Bus Journeys of the World". They haven't got back to me as yet.

[@drworm5007]

XD. What about "101 layovers you must experience before you die"?

[@gussyt1761]

Following Bradshaw Train Replacement Bus Journey Guide Book too???

[@pnegeoff5385]

You could do a U.K special.

[@geoffreyhansen8543]

That would be interesting! :)

[@liam3284]

It would be *slow* TV

[@CommissionerManu]

The bit roasting their map was AMAZING 😂

[@krissp8712]

Yeah, they might have an official style guide or something, if the main objective of communication was failed, consistency becomes useless!

[@IsuruKusumal]

​@@krissp8712 yeah i think they didnt want to use colors here because the colors are already designated for different lines and they didn't want to confuse commuters with that. Which is fair enough

[@dylanshadowstar9779]

I remember when replacement buses became so frequent, the PTV app gave up and literally deleted the Sunbury line from flinders street

[@LordPhobos6502]

You'll never work at ptv drawing maps like that. It had useful information, and was easily readable.

[@motwist4796]

A part of me dies inside when I realise there’s going to be bus replacements on my journey. This video was very validating. Thankyou!

[@Rheilffordd]

Because one more lane bro 😜 Wow, that is a total mess of an organisation of replacement buses! You were very fair and balanced with your views on bustitution and I sure hope PTV are watching this! During the pandemic, I drove rail replacement buses on Adelaide’s Gawler line for the 18months that line was out of service for electrification. Over time it was great to see the Transport department evolve the bus service such as changing more efficient routes and scheduling, which made the service bearable for the time the railway was out of service for!

[@Taitset]

Good to know Adelaide actually learnt from the experience! It baffles me that Melbourne has taken basically this same approach to bus replacements for so long with little improvement, despite all the huge LXRP shut-downs.

[@liam3284]

When bus replacements are unexpected, they take an hour to show up, even if you are standing beside a depot full of busses.

[@LetsgoMelbourneStorm]

The T3 users in Sydney just love their bus replacements 51 out of 52 weeks a year.😅

[@exploringsydneysrailways]

That line is going to be closed for at least 6 months pretty soon, and I really hope they work out an efficient, useful, and clearly-communicated bus replacement system by then. At minimum they should put GPS trackers on all the buses used for the service so passengers can see where the buses actually are.

[@mackenzietoscan3602]

@@exploringsydneysrailwayswhen their convert the Epping to Chatswood rail link ( the ones at open in 2009) to the metro. Their branded the rail replacement buses and have the newly retired SBS news lady to advertise it. They should do the same

[@peterelvery]

Umm. No. I use it every week and it's only been replacement buses on some weekends and school holidays so far, but the 12 month Bankstown to Sydenham closure will not be fun for those affected.

[@LetsgoMelbourneStorm]

@@peterelvery I’m just joking, but you have to admit it has been closed for long periods at a time (as you mentioned school holidays/occasional weekends) but this has been annoying and very disruptive.

[@LordPhobos6502]

@@exploringsydneysrailways Those busses likely already have gps; most public transport vehicles have some form of vehicle monitoring for fleet management.

[@bigadz0r]

What's even more amusing, I am on one of those PTV survey panels, they are constantly sending examples of maps and distribution schedules, replacement bus time tables ect looking for feedback on how readable and effective they are. So they are actually trying, yet this is still the best they have.

[@oscarpistorius3710]

As someone living a bit further in on the Hurstbridge line, I was happy to avoid most of the outer bus replacement shenanigans, but those few days where the works stretched past my station were annoying as all hell. Not to mention taking connections to pakenham and having it mess that up too. It doesn't help that the PTV app shows bus replacements using the train icon, which just completely baffles me. There's no way to tell anything's amiss without going into the little alerts section, which is often filled with meaningless bullshit about carpark closures in somebody else's station. I will say though, if I had gotten some of those cookies, I might feel differently.

[@Daviesh]

Another Pakenham line viewer here, totally agree with everything in the video. Bustitution should be a fine art in Melbourne, but the connections between bus and train can be baffling. We are about to have 3 weeks of pain, I’ll be avoiding it. I can’t afford to have trip times blow out as it compromises being able to pick up kids on time from after school care.

[@jaewardtattoo]

What grinded my gears was that there was zero accommodations made for bicycles and if I got caught off guard I would have a 90min+ ride to look forward too. It's 2023, Melbourne buses should have bicycle racks on the front by now

[@Taitset]

Agreed, it's a big problem.

[@Ryzi03]

There's a handful of routes that already have bike racks, being the 510, 512, 683, 685, 686 and 687 but considering four of those six are in the Yarra Valley and not the CBD or suburbs, it's not particularly useful for the general commuter. I don't see any reason why the racks can't be more widespread

[@MeppyMan]

Also love when you use the trip planner and it warns you they disruption “may” impact your trip… surely the planner can know one way or the other. Lol. Also communication through visual design is so very important for things like this. It just smacks of bureaucrats being involved.

[@ravipun6714]

man i remember when Frankston, Cranbourne and Pakenham delays from 2018 to 2019

[@harleyhunt6073]

RIP. Absolutely dreadful, jesus the amount of time we lost to the process. Worst of it if you couldn't at least browse your phone due to barely being able to stand without falling in a packed bus.

[@bigmatty50]

Absolutely gold. I live on the Sunbury line, in our case during upgrades, trains running to Sunshine then we had to find out which buses going to which subsequent stations. Some were express and some were all stops. I believe the scheduling were set up by people that don't generally commute.

[@dylanshadowstar9779]

When Sunbury line was closed and Dynon road had construction, it was a nightmare

[@nukichaplin3042]

One of the worst ones for sure

[@jalflight3513]

I've heard that the E1s existance was a specific executive intervention from the Member for Eltham responding to community complaints after one of the early occupations didn't have express service at all (along with the particle resurfacing of the bus interchange at Eltham). Perhaps the E1 was so haphazard because it didn't go through the same PTV process? Regardless of why it definitely should have been integrated better and given they had several months to do it, it's a bit baffling.

[@YukeWeiss]

I will always try and avoid bus replacement like anything. It's a special kind of hell and will do any other route to avoid them, including walking several kilometres. Living on the Lilydale Line which saw over 100 days shutdown in 6 months and will have to do it all again next year, I cannot believe how straight up unpleasant it is.

[@Tom0482-dg3jw]

Bustitutions have been on the Pakenham and Frankston lines for years. Seems like they won't stop anytime soon. When the train services finally get back up and running, after a few days there is always another cluster of disruptions.

[@harleyhunt6073]

Seems to always happen with extreme heat, and with heavy rain. Signal faults most commonly. In recent times on the Frankston line, there have been a few trains break down or getting stranded on the tracks causing disruptions. I had one, first of the morning on a weekday, the train had to stop, everyone was sent off and replacements called, as train has malfunctions going on with it's signage, and all of the communications equipment. Apparently they had to fix the train there, or couldn't keep going, given they couldn't communicate with the control center. It was an Xtrapolis set too, not an old one.

[@andrewrussack8647]

Agreed! Some serious misalignment issues. Nothing worse than just missing your hourly service at Box Hill because the timetable is more important than connection with bustitution bus!! 😱

[@lachlantanseytheii4412]

i love how simple your map is but ptv gotta be ptv and complicate the shit out of everything

[@CattoRayTube]

Your point about free travel attracting people is a good one - during bustitutions on the Frankston line in 2019/early 2020, I would intentionally travel more because I could get to the NGV on the weekend for free! Plus the route those replacements took was pretty good.

[@danielmolino661]

I have had some interesting scenarios on the Pakenham Line. During August there were works between Pakenham and Dandenong and so to avoid any wait time I caught a replacement Vline bus from Nar Nar Goon instead of a metro from Pakenham. This saved me so much time as after just over an hour I was standing on a platform at Southern Cross waiting for a train. I will note that the Vline bus ran express from Pakenham to Southern Cross but there was no way that I would have gotten there that quickly taking the metro replacement bus to Dandenong and then a train. During January this year trains were only running up to Westall and I needed to get to Monash Uni. Instead of doing the replacement bus and usual bus from Clayton or Huntingdale to Monash, I was using buses at Springvale station and then changing onto another bus to get to Monash. Either way I had to take two buses but with the replacements I had no idea when they would arrive compared to the regularly scheduled buses. On the way home one time I caught the two buses to Springvale and surprised some other students in my class who left at the same time but used the replacement buses as I was already there waiting on the platform at Springvale for the next Pakenham train. This shows that in certain scenarios normal buses can be a decent alternative. I often try to look for the best alternative that will get me to my destination in the best time even if it requires me to leave a little earlier.

[@tunalifemedia]

They still haven't got any better. They're shutting down Lilydale and Belgrave over the next 6 weeks and I spent over an hour on the phone to P TV. And went into the station to talk to someone. No one could tell me what was happening with the replacement buses. what time and frequencies they were running. And this was the night it's all shut down. It's so hard for young kids to navigate and get themselves to school. If an adult can't figure it out. So I dove my kids to a bus, I put my kids on a normal bus route which was so backed up, with exta people and extra road traffic. The bus was 30min late by the end of the trip. This was a normal bus route. The whole system is stuffed, And as you said in the video they have had plenty of time to get this right and still have no idea what they're doing. But a big shout out to those poor staff that don't get any information and have to deal with everyone who is confused.

[@stormblessed2673]

Man, the Lilydale/Belgrave 3 month shutdown for Union station this year was brutal.

[@gilbydog7350]

It was really brutal. The buses between Camberwell and Box Hill were a nightmare.

[@therealsammyvee888]

As someone living on the Pakenham line, we get a lot of bus replacements as you can imagine. As I assume with most other people, my family and I can't stand them, me especially as I have a vision impairment and this already makes it more difficult when travelling alone. So you can only guess how hard it can be for me to get around when there are bus replacements. Luckily I don't usually need to travel on the train a lot, and when I do if there's a bus replacement, I'll usually go from another station like Cranbourne or Merinda Park. Otherwise, thankfully my station (Berwick) has been upgraded very recently with a much better and bigger bus interchange which also has permanent rail replacement bus stops, which makes it slightly easier when there's a line shutdown. But I still hate having to catch a bus replacement. Trains are way better than buses, just generally and also because they're cooler and easier to use (no offense bus fans).

[@bradwconnors]

Love this video. There clearly was no major plan in how the level crossing replacements (which cause the vast majority of line shutdowns) was going to roll out, which i guess was partly because it was a vote winner for Labor. I deliberatley live in a place where i have multiple lines and trams to access within a short enough walk so these don't impact me as much but the poor buggers on the Pakenham line cop it bad. I was in Narre Warren when the "original" skyrial was built and at least the sections from Dandenong to Caulfield were basically all done at once. Now people past Dandenong have had to deal with Hallam, Berwick rebuilds running to different completion timelines and now they do Narre Warren (the station in between) with Beaconsfield on the horizon too. Thats rough. I think the Frankston line has had a similar situation with a big chunk done then smaller projects in between. If you want people to move to PT you need to have a reliable service as often as possible, and you need your bus replacments to be efficient and effective to give people confidence that when replacements happen you wont be adding too much time. Melbourne has constantly failed at this.

[@Taitset]

Absolutely, very well said.

[@Daviesh]

Well said, the worst part of that period was when they had the Frankston line out the same time as the Pakenham/Cranbourne lines AND were still doing Monash Freeway roadworks. It feels like there is no coordination on major projects.

[@gerrywawra]

Belgrave/Lilydale earlier this year was an absolute nightmare. So bad I started driving to Glen Waverley. Yet we still get constant weekends and some full weeks with replacements. It’s becoming more efficient to drive

[@gilbydog7350]

It was a nightmare, with buses replacing trains between Box Hill and Camberwell. Often whole trains were cramped onto a single bus at Camberwell, which meant half the passengers had to stand up. You'd arrive at Box Hill on the bus, and would have just missed a train leaving Box Hill which meant an additional 15 - 20 minute wait on top of the slower bus. It was a nightmare for more than 3 months.

[@xaerxohn]

I got an ad for coach replacements on PTV services on this video!!!

[@Taitset]

Haha amazing

[@melbournecrosbie]

"Rant" with suggestions for solutions. How is this even a rant!? Excellent work.

[@Johntrampoline]

Great video! The stupidest bus replacement service I have seen was when they redid the junction at Caulfield during the Glen Huntley level crossing removal and busses replaced Frankston trains between Caulfield and South Yarra but Pakenham and Cranbourne trains continued to run.(even stopping at Malvern during the off peak) It just seems stupid to me because there was no reason why they couldn’t run an altered Pakenham and Cranbourne timetable and have trains stop all stations for a few weeks. The infrastructure is there and the platform lengths are the same for all the stations, plus it would have been a chance to get pictures of HCMTs stoped between Malvern and South Yarra. The only reason I can think they did it was because they already had the buses hired to run between Moorabbin and Caulfield but still I think most people would have much preferred to change to a train at Caulfield.

[@kat.ied.]

Agreed! I was in the same situation. But apparently the HCMTs aren’t permitted to stop at the stations between SY and Caulfield…. apparently haha.

[@Johntrampoline]

I don’t think that’s right because HCMTs do stop at Malvern during the off peak and there is infrastructure that’s been put in place at Hawksburn so that trains can turn around there.

[@kat.ied.]

⁠@@Johntrampolineyes, absolutely agree! This is what I also said in my comment - if you can find it + Martian/Taitset’s reply

[@Johntrampoline]

@@kat.ied.I read you comment and I do agree that maybe 1 or 2 shuttles run by Seimens/Comeng during works would be the perfect solution. Though they would probably only run during the off peak in order to minimise the impact on capacity.

[@Skasaha_]

Another fun fact about the PTV journey planner that happens in normal operation: It seems to mostly ignore the suburban passenger rules for V/Line trains that run parallel to electric lines. Frequently the fastest route between the Sunshine-Sunbury stations and Werribee-Laverton stations is to go all the way into Footscray, and PTV's planner will tell you to get on the V/Line for the Sunshine leg unless the connection timing is coincidentally very poor.

[@oliverwinn9600]

Captured the grievances of the average PTV goer perfectly. The 3 month long works on the Belgrave line was pain. Normally the train runs to Ringwood first, then replacement buses to boxhill. But once there was a fault in between Belgrave and Ringwood, and I had to catch another set of replacements just to get to the main replacements

[@GoldM4official]

So no one is gonna talk about how the buses’s desto board on the thumbnail says ‘Pls Send Help’?

[@ashleighevie]

I definitely agree with these issues, as a very experienced user typically travelling in peak hour on the Lilydale line I'm usually able to to make the most of it, but poor connections really take enthusiasm away

[@darksnakenerdmaster]

I remember once I carried a case of beer all the way to resevoir during a replacement timeframe. Wasn't easy

[@Seiskid]

It seems ridiculous that after enduring all that - you have to go through it all again. Same thing has happened on my line numerous times. And probably everyone else's as well. The close it all down forever to rip out a set of boom gates. Then a year later there's another set further down and they do it all over again. Followed by "essential" maintenance six months later. And another set of boom gates. You wish they could concentrated on on line at a time and do the whole thing from beginning to end. Then there's Vline. For the last ten years Gippsland line feels like its had replacement buses on it as much as running trains.

[@jpecimage]

My favourite experience of a bus replacement was during the LXRP on the Dandenong lines - was sat for about 10 minutes on a bus at a level crossing...that was on the part of the line that the bus was replacing trains on. A close second was a driver taking a 5min nap at a red light, that went green quite a few times before he was awoken by a passenger.

[@CalebsCrossingsYT]

The Hurstbridge Line Cookies and cupcakes are halarious

[@benespection]

In the 1990s the train replacement buses were just as awful, with massive over crowding, a totally random schedule which usually resulted in waiting 30-50 minutes for a bus only to have several arrive all at once, then sit there for 20 minutes even though they were full, and then usually leave with at least one bus mostly empty for some reason. Poor signage, grumpy staff, and certainly no maps, schedules, pamphlets, free coffee, biscuits, cupcakes or show bags. It really does make you appreciate the normal train service though...

[@TransportMan777]

I remember that period on the Dandenong group when trains terminated at Oakleigh or Caulfield every weekend, but at least it was for a good cause, the metro tunnel, which is practically complete now also

[@bryanpearce08]

This kind of brings back nightmares of the Gawler Rail Electrification Project in Adelaide. Partial line closures between 2010 and 2012. Several weeks of partial closures in 2017 for a junction upgrade. There were partial closures in 2020 before a full line closure commenced in December 2022. It was spose to reopen in November 2021 but didnt until June 2022. There werent enough replacement buses so for some of the time they hired coaches to supplement the buses. Then if you had a connecting bus at a train interchange your connecting bus didnt have to wait for the rail replacement bus

[@harleyhunt6073]

I was working through all of the Covid years, and on the frankston line while Carrum, Bonbeach etc were being replaced. Often for me I'd be travelling an additional 90-120 minutes per day. I watched multiple entire TV series, movie franchises and such in the time I was on these replacements. I wish I thought to film and detail the issues with this period. Often I'd catch a replacement bus at Flinders, often at Caulfield, Cheltenham, Mordialloc you'd be required to disembark your bus, walk down the road, and wait for another bus. When lining up, it'd be frequent to be waiting 20-25 minutes, only for the buses to fill, and need to wait ANOTHER 20 minutes for more buses as they couldn't handle the capacity. Infuriatingly when buses did give way to trains at Mordialloc, the connection never allowed anyone to make the train, the VERY FIRST bus of the morning at 4:30am, the train would leave just as the bus was opening doors for us to get off. This was on an empty nepean highway, no traffic to complicate matters. Sometimes on the weekend the next train would be an entire hour later if you missed the connection. Sadly, a person I know was mugged at Mordialloc, while waiting after missing their connection. Besides most of this, stretches of the line, such as between Moorabbin & Mordialloc, would spend large portions winding around various side streets, and meandering through dense school traffic zones full of kids being picked up. I found getting the bus that ran from Cheltenham to Carrum much more effective & direct than using replacement services. Indeed the lack of free service was irritating, trains from Flinders to Mordialloc, then getting a train for 3 more stops, after a good 10+ stops replaced, & inspectors patrolling between Mordialloc & Frankston. I feel for anyone commuting from the Stony Point line to Flinders or beyond during that time.

[@86_beans]

An accurate account of the confusion. When I lived down that way, I used to feel it weird that Sandringham passengers were dumped at Parliament by buses. I mean, the trains don’t even go via the loop but PTV would leave you in the middle of Spring Street just during the disruptions. Then we’d need to make our own way back to Flinders Street.

[@JamesErv]

The dreaded replacement bus... Had to use on a couple of months ago between that took us from Mordialloc and dropped us off at Brighton Beach. Like you say, the driver is doing the best they can so I can forgive this situation but boy did he get us in a pickle. The route he'd been given took us through a road work zone with one lane taken out, leaving only 1 lane operational through a small suburban street. The driver completely disregarded the red light at the start of the road work zone and piled through the one lane that was open until oncoming cars started to appear. A few were able to hop on the curb/pull into driveways until we got to an intersection where car drivers coming the other way (and doing the right thing) were not keen on getting out of the way and diverting their own routes, which lead to a number of drivers being stubborn and demanding the bus move. Physics and the close proximity of concrete barriers dictate that the bus literally could not turn or move out of the area so after almost 30 minutes of slowly creeping through and negotiating with drivers to pull off into driveways or onto other side streets we got through. Still made it to the city just on time for where we were going but it was a horrendous PT experience.

[@Taitset]

I've had some similar ones to that! Ended up with a bus stuck at the end of a one-way street in Macleod a few years ago. I've also been on several where I had to give the driver directions.

[@devilpizza123]

I take the train from Diamond Creek. On the first day of the major shutdown, no buses arrived at Diamond Creek station until about 730am. We assume bus drivers coming down from Hurstbridge didn't know they had to come through the Diamond Creek Station carpark and only stopped on Main Hurstbridge road. There ended up being about 50+ people at around 630am waiting for a bus at the car park when I arrived. PTV was called by about 7 people and no one on there end could help. the staff at the station couldn't get in contact with anyone to guide the bus drivers into the station to pick anyone up and were being verbally abused by passengers. I was contemplating taking the 343 from Diamond Creek to Greensborough and just taking a replacement bus there as I had no idea what was going on. Once the bus did arrive, everyone was demanding the bus go express into the city as some of them had been waiting for over 1.5 hours, with many saying they had missed their appointments or were late for work. However it ended up only running express to Eltham, then Macleod. I ended up working from home whenever I could during the shutdown to avoid the shitshow.

[@pierreinthavong181]

Sweet video, I'm so proud of you!👏👏👏

[@dragonfly_closet]

This was so validating. I work weekends on the packenham line, and it's absolutely still like this. I just straight up gave up working out where the buses are even going this weekend, and will probably just pay an exorbitant amount for an über instead...

[@The_Real_DreamM]

Awesome video. Thanks 👍

[@basspuppy133]

wow new taitset my monday is saved thank u based martin

[@inserthandlehereok]

I once heard an announcement that said "due to a disruption to normal services between North Melbourne and Craigieburn, all Upfield trains will terminate at North Melbourne until further notice" even though the Upfield line was running

[@kat.ied.]

Thanks for the content, as always! Something I want to mention re: replacement buses as someone who travels between South Yarra (SY) and Caufield. Every single time the Frankston trains (which stop at the stations between SY and Caulfield) are not running due to various works, the Cranbourne/Pakenham trains ARE running between SY and Caulfield - however, they of course express right through. It is therefore extremely infuriating, because I KNOW trains actually are running through the stations I need to go to (via the Cranbourne/Pakenham lines on the fancy HCMTs), but instead I’m stuck on a Frankston line replacement bus :( And I know for a fact that the Cranbourne/Pakenham trains CAN stop at these stations between SY and Caulfield, as they used to do so on weekends and still do so whenever there is a random issue. When waiting for replacement buses, the workers would comment on the same thing - as we would be standing at a replacement bus stop, literally watching trains go past the stations we were right near 😅 During these bus replacement times on the Frankston line, I (and many others) end up often catching a Cranbourne/Pakenham train from the city to Caulfield, and then actually backtracking on a bus back towards SY direction - much faster than a bus from the city! Insane stuff. I still don’t understand, and doubt I ever will, why not even one train PER HOUR on the Cranbourne/Pakenham lines can’t stop at the stations between SY and Caufield when they are not being serviced due to the Frankston line being down. I know these lines are some of the busiest in Melbourne, but seems like a fair compromise compared to an excruciating bus ride in peak hour traffic 😢 And in saying all of that, I also know that the Cranbourne and Pakenham lines OFTEN also cop replacement buses at various points on the line - so special shout out to my Cranbourne/Pakenham line comrades, from a Frankston girly ❤😂

[@Taitset]

The issue is that Cranbourne and Pakenham are now 100% operated by HCMT trains, which are not permitted to stop between SY and Caulfiled, as those platforms were never extended to be long enough for them. An easy fix for this would be to just run a different type of train on those days which can stop there - even if it was just a Flinders St-Caulfield shuttle.

[@kat.ied.]

@@Taitset thanks for the reply! But I don’t think this is the case, as the HCMTs do occasionally stop at these stations (was on a train this year that did so, very randomly) since the platforms are long enough. But agreed - a shuttle could work!

[@Taitset]

@@kat.ied. It's certainly the official reason, but probably not actually a physical constraint. There could be other things not directly related to platform length too, like signal sighting etc.

[@kat.ied.]

@@Taitset hmm interesting indeed… would love to see a video on the Frankston line one day! :)

[@PJRayment]

"And I know for a fact that the Cranbourne/Pakenham trains CAN stop at these stations between SY and Caulfield, as they used to do so on weekends and still do so whenever there is a random issue. " Since the HCMT trains have been operating, the Dandenong line trains have never stopped at Hawksburn, Toorak, or Armadale, with the possible exception of emergencies, as they are not allowed to.

[@chameleongirl7537]

My housemate and I came across your channel recently, and have loved every video we've watched. Especially since we now live on the Hurstbridge line! Can't wait to walk the Diamond Creek trail (or at least part of it) thanks to your lovely video.

[@MrPaddywacker]

Great Video once again

[@philipmallis]

Great video, fully agree. As fellow a sufferer of the Hurstbridge Line bustitution, I feel your pain!

[@Hazz22]

NEW TAITSET UPLOADDD 🗣🗣🗣🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥

[@rozaj2002]

agree with everything you've said. clear as mud! however, I've recently seen some new signage at stations showing which days / nights where service will be disrupted

[@31tangovictor]

Without deliberately stoking the good ol' Sydney/Melbourne rivalry, watching this video I couldnt help compare it to how they did the Epping to Chatswood Rail Link metro conversion back in 2018 for 8 months. For all of Transport for NSW's foibles, they actually got smart and planned the continuous 8 month shutdown properly with a dedicated fleet of buses (plus dedicated depot), and a big PR campaign with marshalls on the ground plus flyers that were easy to read (not to mention using good ol Li Lin Chin from SBS to do TV ads announcing the shutdown). It meant that when it started, teething issues aside, there was a standard all stops bus plus other special routes that operated during weekdays only that went further than the boundaries of the railway line to spread out commuters and alleviate the extra travel times during peak hours at least.

[@reubenmorison8149]

On a recent Sydney train replacement bus, they used a majority of coaches as the replacements which had similar comfort to the train. Much better. However on the lilydale line I had to catch two different train replacement buses to get into the city with a 20 minute wait before and between buses, an utter disgrace.

[@jessica23claire]

This is giving me war flashbacks to the 2018 bus replacements to rebuild Rosanna station 😅. So glad I’ve been on the Mernda line this year…

[@drhandle4498]

Melbourne had practice with replacement of trains by buses in 1979 - the first couple of weeks of secondary school for me involved learning to navigate train commuting, and the replacement buses between Greensborough and Macleod. There were no online notices or timetables back then - I was informed that I'd better take a walk to the station to ask for a timetable to work out when I had to leave home. There was no practice commute with a parent - I was told that I could always do a practice run by myself the week before school started, and if I couldn't figure it out, well, trains ran on rails, so I wouldn't get lost, I could just get off at the next stop and come back the other way. Parents seemed to be a bit more relaxed about kids going free range back then. (I feel that this is the point where I should point out that I had to walk to the station every morning in the dark through the snow uphill both ways in my summer uniform...)

[@1mixtercook]

You think this was bad. Try the Lilydale/Belgrave lines from Feb-May this year, it was all hell. The busses where all insanly crouded, everything was just super unclear about what was happening, and I had to go through the sight of a few people getting bus sick which sucked! This was a great video and prety much adresses every reason why I frown when I see the busses replacing trains sign at the station. Each video is always better than the last. Looking forward to the next video! Also by the way on most other lines the station staff don’t give free bus replacement cookies and coffee which is sad.

[@mitazo]

Just another average day in Melbourne's west past 8:30PM

[@dulcinealee3933]

As I tourist visiting to Melbourne - where bus replacement services departed and arrived from in the city was confusing enough!

[@aussietaipan8700]

I'm on the Pakenham/Cranbourne line and we have just been issued with BRT leaflets. Most train outages are from Dandenong to Pak and or Cran so these do not affect me but there are 3 days where the line further towards the city will be impacted. So WFH for me on those days. I feel your pain but we do not get cookies to make us feel better. I do agree that PT should be free during these times.

[@warwickburchell6512]

Well said…..l feel your pain….also on the Hurstbridge line @ Eltham

[@Jent1466]

Yea i have been annoyed with the hurstbridge line closures. Still nothing compares to the over 2 years of full closure of Adelaide’s Gawler train line for electrification . Two years with substitute busses taking sometimes 2 hours to reach the city from Gawler and all the while charging customers full fares.

[@Dick.n.B-RockShow]

This is an all too familiar story for those of us on the Sunbury line. Still ongoing for us and the buses operate differently almost every occupation. It also still irks me that they use maybe two busses every 10 minutes to replace what would otherwise have been a completely packed 6 carriage train every 20 minutes. I'm no mathematician but something seems wrong there 🤔

[@hawkermatty5157]

Not a bus replace train story, but a bus replace tram one instead It was just before Christmas last year and I wanted to go into the CBD and do the usual "ohhh Christmas" things. So we drove and parked at a family member's place in St Kilda and decided to take a tram the rest of the way into the city. We were going route 5/64 along Dandenong road into the CBD. Though, we only got so far before we all got shoved off the tram and into a bus replacement. Except by the looks of it there were at least 3-4 trams full of people already waiting for a bus to come ahead of us, so we waited for quite a few buses before getting crammed into one. We unfortunately missed the timing of the chirstmas maze in docklands because of how long we were waiting for the bus for. Fast forward a bit and we are ready to leave at about 10pm, but missed one of the last trams (or from what all available apps were telling us anyways). Ubers being unreliable later, we bit the bullet and caught the 00:13 Sandringham (the entire point of going to St Kilda was to avoid night trains in the first place) to take us a bit into St Kilda. One lovely cold walk down Dandenong Road with little lighting later, we made it back and somehow survived!

[@kierangio]

It's pretty bad over here in New Zealand too. Eastern Line is closed for a whole year. During weekend they close a section of track between Britomart (CBD terminus for all lines) and Newmarket which serves three other lines. They run a shuttle bus between the two stations which is timetabled to give you 10 minutes to run down and get the train at Newmarket but they didn't factor in the fact that the bus does not take 10 minutes like a train does, it takes 20-25 minutes so you end up having to wait another 15 minutes for the next train.

[@soupwithfork69]

Bus replacements were a contributing factor to me moving out. I work in Dandenong and my parents live in pakenham (5 train stops around 20 minutes) my partner lived near Moorabbin / Hampton both equal distance. It would take me 40 mins- 1hr to get to my partners house from work. Bus replacements would take 1-1.5 hours just to travel 5 stops. There have been bus replacements every 2 months since 2021 on pakenham line 💀💀

[@bettydraper2034]

im on the pakenham line too and oh my god. i live in pakenham and work in berwick and the train ride is only 15 minutes then i walk the rest of the way! its great! but when theres bus replacements the ride is about 50 minutes long but that doesnt include the wait time for the bus...sometimes id wait 10 minutes sometimes id wait for an hour depending on the day. its a nightmare.

[@soupwithfork69]

@@bettydraper2034 yeah I used to go to tafe in Berwick and work in Officer afterwards so it would take me like 45 mins to go to stops 😭😭😭😭

[@SirDragonClaw]

I am feeling this on the Cranbourne line loads lately, all this week its a 3 hour commute each way if I want to go to work...

[@ravakahn]

I live near where the Hurstbridge and Mernda lines meet up. I've only had to catch the out bound Hurstbridge line the one time and my journey was as follows: Train to Heidelberg, express replacement bus from Heidelberg to Greensborough (there was also a stopping all stations bus), then train to Hurstbridge from G.borough. Thankfully Heidelberg to Greensborough is a pretty direct route so the express bus saved me a good 10 minutes, but I also had no idea the trains were being replaced when I arrived at the station that morning, partly because the replacement was happening further up the line.

[@billiam5726]

when i was working near kensington station during bus replacements in 2018 it was quicker to walk from north melbourne (where the busses began) than to wait for a bus. first two days i waited 30+ minutes for a bus to take me to my destination while walking was 25 minutes. was lucky it was the first stop

[@user-vl7kh5wv7s]

This video really hit a spot, I'm on the lilydale line.....

[@nukichaplin3042]

Bus replacement times are extreamly painful and simple awful. You do make a great point in the video on how inconsistent the service is and they still can’t get it right to be decent. The most recent trains replacement in the west was handled very poorly and sadly I my 8 years of having to use public transport in Melbourne I’ve not come across an time where they offered free cookies or coffee for the day. Maybe that’s depended to a particular line? Wish they could just improve the service overall.

[@Taitset]

Yes it's very interesting that lots of people are saying they've never seen the cookies on other lines! Must have been something specific to this project, for some strange reason.

[@jfwfreo]

Brisbane does a good job of rail-replacement buses IMO. Its easy to find where you need to get the rail-replacement bus and all the times I have used it its been easy to figure out which bus you need to board to get where you are going. And they have good signage at stations and good announcements on trains and at stations. Also for some longer-term shutdowns (specifically when certain stations are closed for total rebuilds) they have clear branding for the "StationLink" bus that links from nearby stations to the closed station.

[@SimonS44]

I do totally understand your frustration and it was very interesting to compare your experiences with those over here. But I have to say replacement buses in Germany are almost universally much worse. I'd be glad to have what you have: informational websites longer than just two lines of text, cookies or other info merch, sign posts at the bus/train changeover, I think I spotted a temporary bus stop shelter in your video, at least an attempt at special announcements... unbelievable for me 🥲 But I do hope someone from PTV sees your video and they can improve upon the experience.

[@user-qh9rx5pq7p]

The bit that gets me is the insufficient number of buses for every train it replaces. One or two buses does not fit the same amount of passengers as a 6 carriage train 🤦

[@charleyhew6402]

Back when the pakenham line was down in 2018-2019 you would get off a replacement bus and they would hand out free public transport cards that’s lasted about 15 days and could be used on anything within zone 1

[@gwokymarla]

Its a systemic issue within PTV, not just the replacement busses. Its basically impossible to find a map showing all the bus routes and Im convinced they themselves don't even know where zone 1 and zone 2 are on the bus network.

[@mimidixon6912]

I used to be a rail replacement bus driver. Please go easy on the drivers as many don't know the region very well, coming other part of the city. And let's not forget Passenger Service staff, standing there under the rain, wind and harsh sun, doing their best to help many confused/angry passengers.

[@ChrisCogdon]

Thank you very much for the great videos. Maks me want to move back to Melbourne (from the SF Bay Area) ASAP.

[@Taitset]

No worries, glad you're enjoying them!

[@jarrodgerke6914]

Used to live on the Gippsland line, with frequent bus replacements, now live on the very end of the old south Gippsland line which is all bus since 81’ can say I’m use to the bus

[@birderomurder]

Some time last year on the Mernda line there was an equipment fault so the train terminated at reservoir station. I shit you not me and a crowd of people waited for at least 50 minutes for a bus to arrive, as all the replacements that were showing up had to be put out of order due to overheating in the 35 degree weather. Including my personal favorite which displayed the message “sorry, out of :)”. I had to get on the second working bus since the first was too full, and naturally. Mine had no functioning air conditioning. I want a showbag. Shit ain’t fair.

[@darylcheshire1618]

I got the Dandenong/Cranbourne disruption on my calendar, except they missed the odd day. Sometimes I had to walk about half a km. I wondered if the distances for passengers were carefully worked out on a map to maximise walking distance. I mention getting off at Burnley to board the bus, you go down the subway (underground passage) and walk longer than the platform length and into the carpark. in fairness, I probably couldn’t find any better places to park a bus.

[@mallenwho]

If the "first day morning stuff up delay" was the same as the Union station first day morning stuff up delay, then it's because the driver scheduled for that first service/s were not yet trained (hah) and qualified for the new section of track, so were not allowed to proceed until a trained driver could supervise them. You'd think they'd plan ahead for that first service.!

[@Taitset]

Yes most likely the same issue, there were empty training runs going through but nothing in service until about 5 hours after the first train was supposed to run! These things are absolutely predictable, and most likely the result of poor communication between departments.

[@dylanshadowstar9779]

Another issue, especially if its an unplanned disruption. Bikes, imagine taking your bike on a train to the city in the morning, then later something happens resulting in replacement buses, you're trapped with your bike

[@jonom9583]

The maps for the Belgrave/Lilydale line shut down at the start of 2023 were much better! The express bus from Ringwood was also quicker than the regular train service some days 😅

[@rileycummaudo8612]

As someone who travels on the Gippsland line this always happens to me and it is annoying

[@katepacker1182]

during the lilydale line upgrades this year i had to take the bus on a school trip and my friend who was sitting behind me at the back found a completely destroyed bottle next to the seat.

[@zacharycheuk8431]

I take the Belgrave line very frequently and the many replacements on that line are hell. One evening I was leaving the city pretty late and my bus just didn't show up at all, I waited 2 hours. No other bus turned up.

[@deviousjupiter8606]

i remember getting to school in the city from eltham during these disruptions.. not fun!

[@markmcdonald9260]

Went to City Sunday week ago and on way back on arrival at Greensborough we were told to get off and catch the bus to Eltham. Their was nothing at station when we left or anything on train on way back and i thought they made announcements? Metro is doing a great job seems like communication is a problem between Government and Metro or Metro is not following through, actually who is to blame? Maybe it is the bus companies fault? Having worked in private sector communication is no better their either!! Organisation and communication just don't exist these days and how hard is it... But you continue to get the message our customer service is brillant!!!

[@SandyCrack69]

Many years ago, I used to catch a tram into a regular office job each day. Many days I would see that the same official from what ever the public transport system was called at that time , pass the tram each day near kew junction. It got me thinking how much better our public transport could run if the people who ran it actually had to use it. Can’t help thinking that his would also make the bus replacement system better and more customer friendly. Also can’t help thinking how shambolic un-planned bus replacements services would be at the odd times when trains lines get closed unexpectedly …

[@JackStavris]

As someone who commutes daily on the overly busy and level crossing laden Traralgon and Pakenham line, I’m no stranger to bus replacements lol. Whether it be one of the many skyrail projects, some faulty rail equipment, a trespasser (usually in Dandenong or Springvale), or a police event (again at Dandenong), a bus replacement, cancellation or a delay of some kind is inevitable and happens at least a few times a month. It’s not all bad though, we do get the nice HCMTs on our line so that’s the consolation prize at least.

[@Peter-ev2kr]

I like travelling between Newcastle and Sydney when buses replace trains. It's usually a faster journey. Only one time it took 4hrs due to traffic on freeway 😂😂😂

[@albertytube5547]

One time I was on my way from Clifton Hill to Hurstbridge, then when I got to Heidelberg I realised that the train service was replaced between there and Hurstbridge. So I was like, oh dear, looks like I’m gonna have to take a bus. Now, I take buses everyday to my school and I know a lot of bus routes across Melbourne, so I know bus pretty well. But after looking at the replacement bus map I was like, what the.. How does this work?? I ended up in front of a random restaurant in Thomastown, which is EXACTLY 15.365km from where I need to go, so I’ve really been through this confusion.

[@robvegas9354]

Nothing in Melbourne says it is going to be long day better than the replacement buses signs in the morning. I often wonder where all of these hundreds and hundreds of buses magically appear from on weekdays and weekends to replace the trains.

[@garygeorge7035]

we had the same problem when they were replacing level crossings at werribee made worse half way through closure by the removale of busses so they could be used on lylidale line and no one on ground organising things just left to drivers to go when they pleased half of them got lost .

[@andrewrussack8647]

Once took me three hours in lieu of the normal 50 mins to get home on Friday evening due to bustitution and connections with timetabled trains not waiting for bus arrivals!! Grrr.