C3 - First Impression [Programming Languages Episode 31]

[@christofferlerno2633]

Thank you for taking a look at C3 Mike, for the `v1.dot(v2)` the reason it didn't work was that it wasn't defined on integer vectors. I've since added that, but if you wondered why that didn't work, that was the reason. If you had defined say `float[] v1` it would have worked fine. The last thing you got stuck on was iterating over the `membersof`, that's because it returns an untyped list that you're only able to iterate over during compile time. So if you would have used `$foreach` (compile time foreach) it would have worked fine. I think the error message was pretty bad though, and it will be improved in 0.6.1 It was great feedback seeing someone speedrun through the language just using the docs. Thank you again for that.

[@MikeShah]

Cheers, Christoffer, thanks for developing a great language! I just saw 0.6.1 is getting ready -- do you want to come on the channel and tell us your programming story and a bit more about C3? Shoot me an e-mail or message on twitter if you're interested!

[@GaryChike]

Yes, thank you so much for C3 Christoffer! 🚀🚀🚀

[@vncstudio]

C3 looks great and in the spirit of C!

[@eduardabramovich1216]

I wish you created a series on C3 similar to c by example or something like that. It looks really great.

[@MikeShah]

Cheers! C3 really is a nice language :)

[@_slier]

finally, someone gave C3 attention its deserved.. what a god damn beautiful language.. this language should be more popular than Zig. i find it funny for C3 that is relatively new and have small community have a better website and documentation / tutorial on how to use their language in a productive way.. unlike zig

[@MikeShah]

Cheers, it was fun to look at C3

[@GaryChike]

I much prefer C3 to Zig.

[@Dmytro-Tsymbaliuk]

Zig has huge feature - own std library with cross-compilation

[@_slier]

@@Dmytro-Tsymbaliuk cross compilation is using llvm.. nothing new. c3 also can do that

[@kcvinu]

Well done, Mike! You've brought a lot of attention to C3. Thank you so much!

[@MikeShah]

Cheers!

[@axthd]

I wish C3 will be the next systems programming language.

[@MikeShah]

Time will tell!

[@twenty-fifth420]

50:40 Unrelated, but I was doing some file cleanup because I found out D module system doesn't play well with file snake_cased. (my python and ruby loving heart did die a little). But in hindsight, I do prefer the explicit naming conventions. Also, I can't believe C3 is further along in development then V! Now that is impressive! I have both to play with now, but I love this idea of a bit more restricted languages interfacing closely with C but with modern sensibilities. And I am glad modules are in C++ too.

[@MikeShah]

I was actually quite impressed with how far along C3 is -- with some more documentation and references tutorials, could be a very nice ecosystem!

[@GaryChike]

The incredibly talented programmer 'Tsoding' recently completed two videos on C3 - one entitled "Programming in C3 to Annoy Zig Programmers!"

[@MikeShah]

Indeed, I saw this on Twitter -- I haven't seen the videos yet though.

[@salim444]

c, c#, c3 and c4 (carbon). Programmers are drawining in a sea of c's

[@MikeShah]

C2, C0, Cyclone, Safe-C, there are many, many more variations :)

[@eduardabramovich1216]

Mike, between C3 and Odin, which one you like the best and why?

[@MikeShah]

I haven't used either in a proper project to give a great answer -- C3 probably is a bit more familiar syntactically, Odin is much further along in development (and has some high powered projects by JangaFX) using it. Either could be a viable alternative to C. I like the SIMD support for both languages -- both could be great for graphics/multimedia development. I think if you asked Bill and Christoffer, they'd probably just tell you to try both and see which you like best :)

[@twenty-fifth420]

Careful Mike, I think this language is explos- **BLOWS UP**

[@MikeShah]

@@twenty-fifth420 🤣

[@SimGunther]

@@twenty-fifth420 That would've been a different language which is C4. Nice try :)

[@GaryChike]

@@SimGunther LOL

[@DarenC]

5 minutes in, but lack of dark mode is hurting my eyes 😭😭

[@MikeShah]

Sorry about that -- one reason I do keep my terminal dark is to help ease on the eyes. I think everyone has different preferences on this though.

[@DarenC]

@@MikeShah to be fair, it was made worse because I was watching at 11pm or so in the dark. I'll give it another go in daylight and I expect it'll be better =)

[@MikeShah]

@@DarenC Many of us have been known to code late into the night 😁

[@ZehMatt]

Looks like an interesting language there are however a few things that I don't like, new_init() and free(), that is one of those typical things you can quite easily forget and to me that is just boilerplate code. Also memory management in general, having to call free is just annoying, there should be a way to specify lifetime or a concept like unique_ptr/shared_ptr, we really shouldn't have to deal with this.

[@MikeShah]

Indeed, will just have to create your own managed pointers 🙂Here's a quick blog I found on doing such a thing in Raw C -- might actually be a fun experiment to try snai.pe/posts/c-smart-pointers

[@bsdooby]

Would have loved to watch the live session (missed it)….😢

[@MikeShah]

There will be more 😃Eventually I'll either announce well ahead of time, or otherwise find a regular time to stream. Need to figure out what I can commit to at least for some duration.

[@MrNoface0]

Could you make a video about C++ modules and how to code: import std; ? :)

[@MikeShah]

Eventually that will indeed be in the C++ playlist :)

[@MrNoface0]

@@MikeShah sweet! Your videos are so good and helpful, I always try your videos first for C++ guidance

[@MikeShah]

@@MrNoface0 Cheers, thank you for the kind words!

[@Onyx-it8gk]

Greetings, Mike! I'm sure you get a ton of requests and possibly cover them all, but I was wondering if you'd consider covering the Zig build system and compiler for C/C++.

[@MikeShah]

Thanks for the greetings! I'd have to learn more about how Zig interops with C. I definitely have planned in my D series interop with C libraries and the importC compiler which may be similar. Time will tell if I dive more into other languages 🙂

[@Onyx-it8gk]

@@MikeShah Well what I'm referring to is not actually a C interop. Rather, the Zig toolchain can be used as a build system and compiler for C/C++. It contains its own C libraries to build from, rather than relying on the OS libraries. It allows you to build C/C++ cross-platform and cross-architecture.

[@MikeShah]

@@Onyx-it8gk interesting -- is that so long as they have the llvm toolchain? I thought they might replace that so things might be changing or in progress of that direction

[@Onyx-it8gk]

@@MikeShah I'm not exactly sure, because I do know they want to eventually bootstrap the backend with Zig. I would assume they want to keep that feature, but you would certainly know more than I about the technical implementation. It's referred to as Zig cc and Zig c++.

[@MikeShah]

@@Onyx-it8gk hmm, I'll look into it -- perhaps I can reach out to some Zig folks and find out more

[@smaplessmap5355]

Why is it not popular? Is it use srsly anywhere?

[@MikeShah]

C3 as I understand is still under active development. There may be projects using C3, but have not otherwise disclosed -- sometimes it's a competitive advantage not to give away your toolstack for companies.

[@smaplessmap5355]

@@MikeShah thx

[@immalkah]

Congrats on 20k, thanks for the great tutorials.

[@MikeShah]

Cheers!

[@guilherme5094]

👍!

[@MikeShah]

Cheers!