Can we fix a high voltage igniter?

[@mnotgninnep]

I love how you fixed it by breaking it further! 😂

[@paulmurgatroyd6372]

Seems all you have to do is remove the broken bits. No broken parts = fixed!

[@qwertykeyboard5901]

I can't argue with results though!

[@Nandru85]

The tronics fix methid

[@Flying0Dismount]

It's simple boolean logic: break it once = broken, break it twice = not broken... Corollaries include: "two wrongs make a right" and "two rights make a left"....

[@tbelding]

@@Flying0Dismount It's "Three rights make a left." Two rights means you're going home.

[@jasonkuehl639]

Even though Clive warned us, I still almost threw my tablet across the room at the high-frequency sound. I'm quite glad I wasn't wearing headphones and the volume was low! I wish other youtube channels would warn us about strobing and high-frequency sounds, one of the many reasons this is a favorite channel. 🙂

[@Mike-H_UK]

I think that Clive should issue a trigger warning on everything that he does. He is bound to trigger something and should, therefore, veer on the side of caution.

[@atdzsny]

It was a pleasant sound. Like listening a ZX Spectrum program from tape. 8:47

[@jasonkuehl639]

@@Mike-H_UK I partially agree, but my fear is with trigger warnings being repeated too often, they may be ignored. I think he's found a good balance between trigger warnings of the worst potential offenders, and having too many. But, pretty much anything can be a trigger to someone, and certainly don't need anyone to suffer needlessly. It's a difficult balance to achieve.

[@jasonkuehl639]

@@atdzsny unfortunately, I don't share your opinion. I don't know where my cut-off is on higher pitched sounds, but at a certain point, they become very painful to me. So badly, I couldn't complete audiometric testing at work. After 15 years of annual testing, they were kind enough to allow me to proclaim total deafness at frequencies above 2.5K to avoid "undue stress". Sadly, I can hear ultrasonic atomizer discs, and at a certain point, can't be in a room with them running.

[@chitlitlah]

I hardly even noticed it. I'm not sure if it's my equalizer settings and the frequency response of my speakers (they don't have a lot of treble) or if it's my bad hearing, but it wasn't very unpleasant to me.

[@BuyitFixit]

Great Work Clive! It's always funny how one small component can stop an entire device from working.

[@greenaum]

Look up "Muntzing". Earl "Madman" Muntz made a ton of money selling TV sets cheap, in the 1950s. He missed out some of the parts, like the sensitive input RF amplifier, creating a TV that wouldn't work with weak signals out in the countryside, but for people in the city where the transmitters were nearby, it was fine. So he sold his sets to city people, cut price cos it didn't have components they didn't need anyway. Actual "Muntzing", though... he'd go round the labs when his engineers were working, and pull out a component from a working set. If it still worked, it could obviously do without that component. Muntzing! He wasn't just the idiot he made himself out to be in his ads (although the "crazy man selling things JUST TOO CHEAP cos he's CRAZY!" is still a popular thing in the USA), he was actually a skilled and educated electronic engineer. It's an imaginative technique, and, really, you can't fault it. The proof is in front of you, if it works without X, why put in X? Simple and ingenious!

[@robpeabo509]

Great diagnosis Clive. You identified a couple of areas that could cause the issue, with one being the most likely - and you were correct! Well done.

[@TopEndSpoonie]

Great work fixing it “live”. Love your work.

[@offdagrid877]

Andy would have been proud of you Clive. You popped it!

[@ataraxiauk]

Love it! Breaking it until it is fixed as opposed to the old IT adage of fixing it until it's broken!

[@RomanoPRODUCTION]

07:43 crispy. A round of Applauses for BigClive featuring the chop chop fixing technique approved in Asia. Thank you Bigclive, watch you soon :)

[@gregorythomas333]

I was only able to watch part of the live stream and evidently missed this part...thank you for going over it again!

[@simonneep8413]

The high frequency noise sounds remarkably similar to the initial tones on a ZX spectrum tape. Either that or my memory's faded in the last 35 years :)

[@atdzsny]

Yeah, the frequency may not match, but it was very similar to the fixed frequency pilot square wave followed by the short sync pulses and header data (program name, length, etc). 8:47

[@SirBoden]

Plasma igniters, beautiful and scary simultaneously. Oddly fascinating. Much love for you and everyone. ☯️🙏

[@agenericaccount3935]

Superb. Nice to see a repair. Change of scenery from the usual teardown.

[@whitesapphire5865]

My God, Clive, you soon nipped that in the MOSFETs! Different tack, I know, but some years back I had a general coverage radio receiver which boasted MOSFETs in its circuitry. All was well for a year or two, but then one night it wouldn't do anything beyond light up the dial lamps. After a bit of fruitless endeavour, I sought out some assistance with this thing. It turned out that it didn't need much in the way of a static charge on the aerial to destroy one of the MOSFETs. Once replaced, all was well again. But I made sure the aerial was grounded from then on, and as added protection, I would disconnect the aerial when not in use. I was intrigued to notice that on a foggy night with just enough air movement, there was a hefty spark which jumped at regular intervals from the centre pin, to the outer ring of the PL259 plug - a gap of about a quarter of an inch. There was the smoking gun. The bandit who shot the MOSFET. I wasn't tempted to stick my finger on the end of that plug, just in case! But surely, there can't have been such a massive charge on the aerial? However, it was enough to fry the MOSFET.

[@SeanBZA]

Those LED lamps with built in batteries flicker in a thunderstorm when the mains fails, and they are lit, as the induced voltage in the mains wiring is enough to trigger them to think the mains is back on.

[@tyronenelson9124]

The LTH charge controller chip's output signal normally connects to an LED, because this is a high voltage, high frequency device the signal coming from the charge chip is used to disable the function of the device while charging just to protect the charger as that is also a high frequency device so any voltage difference on the ground line can be lethal and also the fact that you can charge this device from sensitive devices like a PC, a laptop or even a TV.

[@McTroyd]

Having been burned by cooked FETs enough, I don't blame you for immediately taking the snips to it on suspicion. Anyone else who might want to avoid destroying a possibly good component, use a meter to check for continuity, or resistance. If the component reads as a dead short on all the pins, then either that component is bad, or something very near it has gone bad.

[@AMDRADEONRUBY]

Really interesting thanks Clive I love ignitor things

[@craignehring]

The man the myth THE Legend Largish Clive does it again

[@carwynvan]

Even with the warning I was not expecting that noise!

[@PghFlip]

Sounds like a good addition to the woofler (as in integrated in the print as a holder)

[@halbvoll1]

Fantastic job, thanks for the great explanation

[@Tims_Projects]

Great job, you make it look easy 🤗

[@AThreeDogNight]

Interesting, cause prior to opening my first thought was the cap that wasn't added. Nice job.

[@ehsnils]

Since there's no need for a linear behavior but instead a sharp switching between on and off the NPN/PNP connection that's in the picture makes sense to me. This way the NPN is fully turned off when the PNP is turned on and the other way around. This is way more advanced than the piezoelectric igniters that used to be the norm.

[@foxhazhax4845]

Now I'm anxiously awaiting your next upload 😸

[@KrisisVal]

That circuit just screams "thrown together from random circuits". I like how they put a gate leak resistor on that mosfet even tho there's already a resistor divider there that does effectively the same thing.

[@johnpossum556]

Amaze-balls! That's the first time I have seen a circuit work by getting a part removed.

[@FireballXL55]

The 2 transistors are basically 2 emitter followers one for each edge of the waveform.

[@mikethedigitaldoctorjarvis]

Clive...the Bob Ross of electronics ! 😊

[@ernstoud]

Hair not on the head but below it 😂.

[@mikethedigitaldoctorjarvis]

@@ernstoud 🤣

[@Quickened1]

That is a cool lighter man! Looks like some sort of tazer from the future! lol

[@bigclivedotcom]

It's very sci-fi.

[@alunjones3860]

Good job. Note if the NPN and PNP were swapped, they'd both conduct and blow up, as the current would flow through the PNP's base, to the NPN's base, with nothing to limit it. The pull-down resistor ensures both transistors turn off the the MCU's output goes high impedance.

[@UpLateGeek]

RSVP headphone users' ears if they weren't expecting the noise to be so loud. Thankfully I wasn't wearing headphones, but it still surprised me. And it is a little late, so I'm sure my neighbour would be glad that unlike usual I wasn't listening at increased volume for the full Big Clive effect.

[@Peter_A1466]

I wonder if it was short through te gate? That definitely would have put voltage on the voltage divider before the LTH07.

[@stevenspmd]

Geeez, You cant just have nice toys without breaking them! lol .. it does kind of looks like something from Buck Rogers though.

[@bigclivedotcom]

I may quite possibly have pointed it at random things and made space-gun noises.

[@coondogtheman]

I have maybe three of those as seen on TV zippo style arc lighters and they all have failed. No charge no arc. Curious if the Mosfets in them have failed and maybe I can bypass them. May even check the runtime of one of these to failure if battery life wasn't an issue. Might steal the battery out of one of them to fix a small MP3 player that has a dying battery.

[@ultraproject2619]

The charge detect mosfet will drop voltage between gate-source, so the output to the uproc will be about 3v, its possible that the pushbutton input on the uproc is an analogue input that detects the difference in voltage between the charge input being connected and the button being pressed, so it can detect whether its connected to a charger or your pressing the btton to light the stove for a brew.

[@mattmoreira210]

5:37 a _classic_ circuit. It's probably the simplest and most reliable it gets for a MOSFET gate driver.

[@lostjohnny9000]

You are a genius sir.

[@keithking1985]

Nice one Clive 👍

[@Aco747lyte]

Well done, great stuff fixing this high voltage igniter! You are very skilled and I have huge admiration for you. All the very best and keep on trucking! 😉

[@richardbriansmith8562]

Awesome Video big clive

[@muf1772]

I wonder if you could use the circuit of these to drive those electric mosquito swatters. I've done 9 volt battery mods to those to supercharge them, but this looks even better, seeing that it can bridge a gap with an arc.

[@bertjesklotepino]

there are much easier ways to drive those electric mosquite swatters with much more UMPF to it. Supercharging them basically. But, when you go baloney, they might be dangerous to actually touch. :)

[@paulmeynell8866]

Another great video thanks

[@fredflintstone1]

Nice fix

[@englishrupe01]

A pretty brutal way to sniff ozone. Thanks, Clive.

[@SW-ci9zv]

Really enjoy and admire bigclive that repairs / delves into all sorts of gadgets. His skills are remarkable, along with his detailed explanations of how the "thing" works. Just wondering if he has delved into the aspect of "street lighting" that a certain Mr Steele has been going on about. It would be useful for that area to be covered / presented to Mr Steele. Any thoughts / comments about that. Note that I have not mentioned key words just in case!!!

[@bigclivedotcom]

I've mentioned him in the past, but not identified him, as I have no desire to drive traffic to his channel. His idiotic conspiracy videos have put the safety of electrical workers at risk.

[@SW-ci9zv]

@@bigclivedotcom Thanks for taking the time to respond. Going through a streetlight / lamp set up in the fullness of the way you do then your video might provide really good "evidence" of his false claims. I have already questioned his 400 V capacitor (why is that there?) claim but did not get a reply from him. I stated 400V capacitor there because, r.m.s /peak, 3 phase + nearest available value / extra allowance for safety etc It is JUST the TRUTH that I am after.

[@robbieaussievic]

.... I have identified the close-up sound of the ignighter to the mike. It is the space ship descending to land at the beginning of 'The day the Earth stood still'. Klaatu, Barada, nikto.

[@BradTech.]

Hurraaayyyyy!!! 🙌 10:24 I've broken many 🤦‍♂️

[@maxinlux6570]

Showing my age here, but when I was a much younger lad visiting my grandparents in Italy, my grandmother and great aunt had such things which plugged straignt into the mains to light gas kitchen stoves (a bit like a smaller one of these magic wand things, totally different intended usage). They crackled and vibrated most alarmingly, used to terrify and fascinate me in equal measure. None of this "circuitry" rubbish, just good ol' fashioned mains voltage, women were real men back in those days!

[@bigclivedotcom]

I made a video about one of those from Russia.

[@deepinthought469]

10:25 "...prone to damage from electrostatic discharge... ", so... USB plugin zap? The cap below the switch and FET would be a direct short for a plugin changing voltage zap... (Please) Correct me if I'm wrong...

[@4dirt2racer0]

around 6:15 +/-.. u said the cap across the output's possibly to protect the coil, i should probably b keeping my mouth shut im metal fab n mechanic not electronics engineer lol but would the cap across that output make the spark more energetic?

[@bigclivedotcom]

It could be used for resonance, but is mostly likely designed to clip a flyback voltage spike.

[@tntuof]

The "high frequency noise" was straight from 60s sci-fi 😅

[@Moon___man]

have you ever taken a look at those "powerline adapters" or whatever theyre called, that basically give you a wired Ethernet connection through your houses existing circuitry?

[@bigclivedotcom]

I've never actually made a video about those.

[@mallow173]

Another very interesting vid sir!! can you explain what the purpose of a mosfet is? I'm a bit slow.

[@frogz]

Whoa cool zappy stick thing

[@frogz]

And it's still a drawing with all of those colored pads you used to trace the circuit

[@Leroys_Stuff]

Do you ever sleep big guy lol arc igniters or shock your buddy devices are fun great video as always

[@teamidris]

Clive puts the sparkler by the microphone and hear Kirk say “one to beam up” :o) Or maybe it is an incoming clingon ship?

[@DeltaCmndrElite]

It's a lighter, honest officer

[@pmpwiz]

I have/had a few cigarette lighters (much smaller than Clive's monster) that work on the same principle. When new they work great, but I found the lifespan of the electrodes is VERY short. Within a week of regular use, the electrodes burn off and the gap becomes too large to enable the spark. Also discovered that you don't get a shock if you stick your finger in between - but you do get a pretty quick and nasty BURN! Fortunately, it wasn't my finger 😂

[@piconano]

So they are driving the base of two BJT without any base resistor, from a single MCU's push-pull output pin? I guess there will be a lot of cool-down period between each use! lol Did you put a scope on FET's gate it to see the coil driving frequency? It sounded like 800Hz to my ears.

[@andrewpowellnz]

Nice high frequency noise Clive LOL

[@heyarno]

Nice I bought one out of curiosity. Then it failed when I tried to melt glass. The thing became very hot inside. I'll attempt to salvage it as strong pulse driver for a neon indicator.

[@snakezdewiggle6084]

Whoofle me this Batman. What a bizarre circuit ! Is there not a transformer in the ceramic block ? ;)

[@matlock-seastrom]

Yeah, there is. If you look at his schematic there is a transformer symbol in the top right corner. These circuits are pretty fun to play with, I a few of the DIY kits from AliExpress/eBay that I have found interesting ways to misuse😅.

[@snakezdewiggle6084]

Oh yeah, can't believe I missed that... Clive even mentions a "penny capacitor". 👍 ;)

[@DoctorX17]

Zap zap fixed, good job

[@yesyes_uk]

It seems to me that this empty position parallel to the coil might be for a back-EMF diode, rather than a capacitor.

[@wherami]

Thanks!

[@VarionJimmy]

I wouldn’t mind more repair videos. Just a hint.. ☺️💡

[@johnsenchak1428]

It needed some type of zener clamp on the gate of the MOSFET

[@d.t.4523]

Have you been able to test it on one of your neighbors yet? Good luck! 👍

[@twocvbloke]

High voltage and sensitive components, a great combination... :P

[@MrRoan00]

Was waiting for the moment were it would "interact" with your skin! ;) But i suppose thats high enough frequency to avoid getting shocked, and just leaving a burn mark!

[@bigclivedotcom]

An experiment with an earlier type did give a notable shock.

[@binarypower]

perfect video for those handfetishists out there

[@johnkey1682]

🔥

[@ranke]

I appreciate your videos, but trying to fix an electrical igniter for that exists an "analog" alternative (piezodriven) feels to me like doing things overcomplicated. sorry if this is misunderstandable english is not my first language. anyway, I always get good inspiration form your approach and explanations.

[@alexdelara9858]

Speaking of mosfets being easily damaged... true... I once "fixed" and desktop phone set simply by removing one of them lol... we never figured out if it made any difference but the phone worked again, for many more years.

[@curtishoffmann6956]

"We can fix it. We can make it faster, stronger, lighter. We'll call it the '$6 million dollar igniter'."

[@Purple431]

I thought it was a 555 timer based circuit but it's not. The chip and mosfet looked familiar. I'm not sure if you can get smd 555 timers.

[@bigclivedotcom]

You can. But not as versatile as a microcontroller.

[@classicgamr]

Why didn't you replace the fet?

[@bigclivedotcom]

It was just for the ability to charge while switched off, so rather than risk it failing again I omitted it.

[@ralphj4012]

@@bigclivedotcom That's confused me (no change there), wouldn't the battery charge anyway, because charging is controlled by the LTH07?

[@bigclivedotcom]

@@ralphj4012 The processor thought the charger was plugged in due to backfeed through the failed MOSFET.

[@ralphj4012]

@@bigclivedotcom Thanks, though isn't the battery disconnected and an external supply is being fed in (at 0:44), so the charger is effectively plugged in, or you are feeding power in on the output side of the LTH07?. Please don't waste your life answering my queries / confusion

[@fredfred2363]

Clive when are you going to get a binocular camera microscope so you can solder those tiny SMDs, with us watching? And you can test under there. And you can watch what happens to LED bond wires when the LEDs get stressed. And so many other things...

[@rhodexa]

Typical, just remove the parts and it starts working again. Also, I loved the arc sound, gives weird old radio signals vibes

[@t1d100]

Nice job of finding the fault.

[@mattm837]

Loved the video! Could you teardown a digital pregnancy test? I'd love to find out how they work

[@deepinthought469]

10:57 "but now it is fixed"; sometimes fixed is better than new...

[@peterhancox6962]

i sent you one of these from Holland i know live here in UK

[@brianterrill9587]

The Plasma Channel built a Plasma Jet that moved quite a lot of air.

[@CAESARbonds]

I know those without battery, they have a button with several clicks, with a piezo igniter. No chips or electronics, that will go bat in the worst moment. The suprising thing was that the crystal can be clicked several times unliek in a lighter.

[@user-mo5hz9kp6y]

I'm wondering if that transistor is a deliberate built in fault.

[@bigclivedotcom]

I think they just didn't think things through fully.

[@ncooper8438]

The 'broken' igniter might have thin enough and long enough electrodes to poke through the ceramic radients on my gas fire to light it (most igniters are too chunky), can it be purchased on ebay pls?

[@bigclivedotcom]

You can probably find the correct one on spares websites.

[@TheGhungFu]

Maybe someone could invent flint and steel? Oh, Wait........ Did I hear we are drowning under an over-abundance of complexity?

[@paulabraham2550]

MOSFETs are a lot more resilient than they were 40 odd years ago, though. Just touching them would blow them up. Or perhaps it's me, and I don't quite have the same spark I did then.

[@bigclivedotcom]

They do seem more resilient now.

[@greenaum]

Bugger, sorry I missed that stream. My cigarette lighters (both of them) use the same arc, a little purple high-frequency-looking thing, ignites a rollup well. The other type of high-voltage Chinese rubbish-toy gives off less sparks, but meatier ones, white, powerful looking, nasty! But only a couple, to a few, times a second, depending on electrode distance. I imagine it's either charging a capacitor, or it's ionising the air til it breaks down, hence the "SNAP-SNAP-SNAP" rather than "bzzzzzz". If it were a voltage multiplier, that would imply capacitors, though not necessarily big ones. Anyone else got one of these and played with it? The black cylinder with 4 wires, works off 4V - 6V, wire it up and go. Works nicely off an 18650 but seems to flatten it in 2 minutes flat. Must be a lot of amps going into those volts. Creates a right whiff of ozone too! You can almost see the air getting clearer, and get a real refreshing noseful. I'll probably get nose cancer but it's still refreshing.

[@NeatNit]

If I read the description right, it's now broken again and not worthwhile to fix anymore? Clive fixeth, and Clive breaketh away...

[@Quickened1]

He said it would need a new transformer, not that he wouldn't fix it. So who knows, he might have a spare or two...

[@bigclivedotcom]

Yeah. The transformer has arced internally. I could replace it.

[@NeatNit]

@Pp Ss Sure, but it's much more trouble than just snipping off a component as done in this video. All in all though I really just wanted to say the last line in the comment :P

[@markwalsh8411]

So does it give a nice shock or burn when you touch the terminals

[@bigclivedotcom]

It will burn, but less likely to shock.

[@ghlscitel6714]

Can it be pimped to make a tiny taser with it?

[@bigclivedotcom]

It might be viable with a short voltage multiplier added.

[@teardowndan5364]

I'm not seeing why this circuit would refuse to work with the blown FET passing 5V from gate to drain/source in parallel with the switch apart from the MCU crashing shortly after turning on the LED due to the unexpected input voltage.

[@SeanBZA]

As pointed out in another comment the microcontroller disables the spark function when it is being charged, so as not to either destroy the charge source if it is a computer, or break down insulation if it is a plug in USB charger, as otherwise the output voltage is high enough to do so in both cases. In the computer sharp power supply spikes will destroy chips, and for the charger the Y interference capacitors, and the transformer, are only rated (on real ones, dodgy and super dodgy ones much lower) to 1kV DC isolation, and break down around the 2kV region. The arc is more than 5kV there, well past that, and going to destroy the devices.

[@kipling1957]

Isn't that a self-defense weapon, AKA a cattle stunner?

[@bigclivedotcom]

No. It wouldn't give a strong shock.

[@PowerScissor]

We just call them plasma lighters or plasma ignitors over here because it sounds much cooler.

[@ElTelBaby]

I can C this being used as a short burst mini Tazar...

[@phonotical]

That beep, sounded just like a vt clock

[@charlesgarrett8063]

I have ~500 of the circuits for these (slightly different) from a project years ago. If anyone wants some or has some suggestions on how to make use of them, that'd be great. 3.7 V to 15 kV.

[@matlock-seastrom]

That's pretty cool. There's always eBay. lots of people on there, myself included, who scrounge around looking for random stuff to tinker with.

[@pmpwiz]

They make cigarette lighters from them. I still have a couple that work.

[@robinbrowne5419]

Weekly Meeting at the Chinese Assembly Factory. Quality Control Manager: This product does not work properly and is potentially dangerous to human life. Assembly Line Manager: Oh no. We made 10 million of them. Factory Manager: Hmm.. You should have told me sooner.. But that's ok. We'll sell them at Poundland and Dollarama before the Big Boss finds out.