Can WoW be Saved?

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[@crazydabu]

I like this style of verbal video essay from you Xar. Keep it up.

[@moe504]

Our generation's Asmongold FeelsStrongMan

[@LimpRichard]

I've seen bread mold that can make a more coherent point. You have got to be kidding me

[@user-eb6gr1ux6w]

​@LimpRichard u must be a hate watcher gotta say your more important then ppl who watch on a daily u know they right lol you to stupid to know that I bet it's OK I'll tell ya so maybe u won't hate watch no more

[@user-eb6gr1ux6w]

​@@LimpRichardthen don't watch bud

[@user-eb6gr1ux6w]

​@@LimpRichardsucks for u

[@Evisci]

Refreshing to watch a streamer actually critically think about the topic in question and deliver their opinion in a cool unbiased way. Liked this one.

critically think??? he talks in a circle for 15 minutes

[@DTWD16]

every one of his videos, too LOL

@@DTWD16 critically think ROFL they all parrot the same messages

[@Feverdream7777]

I'm 48, been playing since vanilla. Used to be a 1850 arena player, did all the normals and LFR, never heroic guild.... I can't do any of that anymore. Got young kids, can only play a couple hours max at a time. So, I enjoy the WQs, Follower Dungeons, and some gathering. I'm enjoying Dragon Flight, I'm excited about some of the new systems. I wish we could get housing, but I'll never be able to Mythic Plus key, nor Heroic raid or push Arena rating .. I'm okay with it. Blizzard seems to know that players like me are limited in the full extent of our accomplishments.... it's still my favorite game/style of game.

[@dmitrjK]

I am 38 years old, and I could say the same! Just a few years ago, I was doing arena, heroic, and even Mythic+, but now I don’t need it anymore, since Legion. However, for me, it doesn’t mean that the game became worse. You can’t do the same things for 20 years! Nowadays, I still enjoy the game. I enjoyed BFA, all seasons of Shadowlands, and DF with all their errors. This game is a real universe! For a while, I enjoyed Classic again and Hardcore, and now SOD, but after…I always go back to retail because it’s a completely self-contained and multifaceted game.

[@7starmantis7]

agreed, I'm in my 40s played since Vanilla, stopped playing at the end of Wotlk, and came back in Dragonflight. I was surprised the game was still alive and well after all those years. I can't do Endgame and I'm ok with not being able to do that. I'm appreciative that they even made content in Dragonflight that doesn't require countless hours and grinding. Then when i want a change of pace i play classic. For me there's sooooo much this game has to offer and i never feel bored. I feel the people who are complaining "the world is ending " are the min-max,parse, have to be top DPS,have to have best gear, and have all the time in the world to play. I think WoW devs are sending WoW in a good direction.

[@pupsymus]

My hats off to you and the 2 other gentleman who responded. I'm a bit younger and I have the time to put into the game to do the more time invested things. We need players like you to make the world full, to play with alts with ( no disrespect, just how it is ). Some of my favorite keys have been "chill dad weekly" or something where I'd join just to help guys even tho I don't need the key. WoW offers content for everyone if you care to look into it and I'm happy to have you guys around. If you meet elitists and toxics please ignore them, there's rotten apples in all spheres of life. Thank you for making the community what it is.

[@lustach8378]

i am 23 years old, passed 2 wars. pls dont create new humans if u need to spend 8hours at work or u are an almostsapiens, thanks, bad luck

[@arthurlul]

the unfortunate fact is that mmo's arent for you.

[@zoenna]

Garrosh said it best: "Times change" - SoD was a breath of fresh air, and I'm still enjoying it. Retail has morphed into something that I can't recognize anymore and don't like anymore. Lucky for us there are so many versions of this great game to pick and choose from.

[@dmitrjK]

Maybe that’s your filing towards the retail because you’ve spent a lot of time to play it in the past? As well known, even the most delicious dish if you will eat everyday - After a while, you won't like it.

[@Akito0110]

I wish I could get int SoD, classic, HC etc. I just can't. I like retail because it's changed but also.. it hasn't in a way and that's what keeps me from loving it how I once did. I tried so hard to get into SoD and I appreciate the detail/effort put into it. Just still not for me; love that others are enjoying it though. I hope retail has a 'change' like Classic has. Or else it may be the last expansion I play and I've been at it since Vanilla 😩

[@KM-hm1dr]

What’s SoD

[@AverageYTer]

Season of Discovery is working for me, but I can tell it won’t forever. It’s the perfect balance between simple and difficult right now. However, at the rate they are adding quality of life improvements and implementing runes, it will eventually become what I hate about retail.

[@Jekkel-]

XD yeah I love this. This is like RuneScape. ‘Ahhh changes ahhh games not staying the same ahhh changes not even the same ahhh it’s too much for it to be different ahhhhhhhhh dead game cuz of my opinions ahhhhhhhhhh’ sir you’re wrong and have the same general sense of ‘burn out’ as most casuals in life. Learn to adapt to changes the same way you do with cars or computers or your income that way you’re not stuck in a ‘it changed it’s bad/can’t be done’ mindset. I can already smell you’re like a 2k io player and assume that’s ’a lot’ of game play. Stinky butt

[@ducris]

tldr , MMOs gonna do a come back when mmo generation gets to retirment age

[@charlayned]

Some of us started playing at that age. I started in 2008, I was 51, my very first video game that wasn't Zork or Solitaire. I'm now 67 and playing daily and loving it. And I know a lot of people in their 60s who are playing now, we have time.

[@Xaryu]

could be true

[@Nepherenthan]

I think sooner, if we look at the advancement of AI, im pretty sure there will be alot of people without a job soonish.

[@ducris]

@@Nepherenthan or more countries go in a bad recession and we gonna farm gold like people in Venezuela in wow for a living

[@subaruuuu1]

Back when we were young we had all the time in the world to waste, but then life happens and we have to abandon the game, but as we get older, all that free time comes back because our lives have been taken care of.

[@bigboyhooga2776]

New cut looks clean

[@blswebmaster]

Was looking for this comment. lol

[@user-eb6gr1ux6w]

​@blswebmaster why not be the one to make it lol

[@Deadlywhite]

I like hes hair long tbh hah

[@Clemedo]

Both looks good. But i like long

[@chadcrow7611]

Hey ladies, he's married with kids.

[@J1mmy]

I think another point to consider is the overall style of WoW as an MMO - Probably not directly correlated, but food for thought; coming from Old School Runescape, there is content to grind on a 2nd monitor once every five minutes, and content to grind full-focus for a couple hours that have taken dozens of hours of preparation for. When I got around to trying WoW, my hands are on mouse and keyboard, attention full front, all my focus is on what's going on no matter the content. I can't do any content that's more relaxed or casual, it's all full engagement (unless you're waiting for friends to show up to a dungeon or at the auction house). With OSRS, the reason it has seen growth recently is because it gives you options of respecting your time, and it's a super unique thing to the game as an MMO. I think MMOs that give more 'active downtime' gameplay/options are more likely to succeed with our generation.

[@andrecardoso6941]

That’s the direction MMOs had to take. People nowadays don’t want to spend hours and hours grinding and farming when you can play a game where you can just log in and play.

[@lifescaption]

Yea, if that's going to be there it needs to be 100% optional. It feels really bad that I have to stop what I'm doing, because the 'next part' isn't going to be available until next week, or what ever artificial limiter is in place when at best playing a few hours a day.

[@Libertum]

tbh there are many activities in WoW You can "half-afk" too, like certain mount farms or world events

[@dmitrjK]

@@andrecardoso6941you’re right, but those players don’t stay for a long time in the game. MMO it’s a bit different genre: The longer the wait, the sweeter the victory ✌️

[@jackalo34]

@@Libertum I think the difference is that theres a much more limited number of those half afk activities in Wow that tend to be pretty niche whereas theres a ton of them in OSRS.

[@charlayned]

Sorry this is a bit long, but I wanted to discuss this one. Boomer (for real) here. Started at age 51 in BC, now 67 and still playing daily. There's a pretty good size group of that age playing and we are loving it still. We have time to do it. I like the fact that the SoD and Classic are great for those who like that. I'm into retail. And I tried the new Plunderstorm, not my cup of tea. I'm hoping the rewards will eventually show up on the Trading Post. I wish that Blizz would add some of my generation to the council discussion. We have a bit of a different take on it. I need my add-ons, making it easier to do some things. I don't know if I would like 40 man, I really don't raid due to the speeds. I'm LOVING follower dungeons. I play for the story, for the lore and seeing how this goes together. Not everyone's interested in that aspect. It's why I follow Bellular, Accolon, Nobbel87, and Pyromancer. It's just my style. I know it's not for everyone, some like M+, Raids, and such and only do that. I think Blizzard is big enough to do both. And more. I think that new patch might make its way into an all-the-time thing and I think trying those new things is good for the continuation of the brand. I think there's too much acrimony in gaming, people want everyone to do the same thing, It's like back in my day (gawds, I sound old with that). I graduated high school in 1975, the height of the bell bottom, hip huggers with wide belts era. If you were wearing corduroy straight legs, you were weird. You don't like rock, you're into country, you're weird (and I was in the Texas panhandle, where country is still big). It's the same now. You don't like Classic, you're weird. You don't like the Plunderstorm, you're absolutely weird. You don't understand how much fun it is. WoW is big enough to have PvE and PvP fans and the games still work. We don't all have to be doing the same thing, that's the beauty of WoW. I don't think it's broken, they're trying new things to get more players and that's awesome, the business side of Blizzard has a responsibility to keep the lights on so the computers work and people can make a living being there. So we get new things tried, we get revised older things to make them new, some things work, some don't, and they reset and start again. I'm excited for the next three expansions, I've bought my World Within already. WoW doesn't need saving, it needs new things to go along with the stuff they've built. I have some ideas on that and I'm seeing some of those being built in, like rebuilding of some areas, making it where you need to go back to the older areas to do things. The biggest thing I would love to see is story around the world, reasons to quest in Redridge or Stonetalon Mountains. Use what we have, find a way to get it back to the entire map. Those are things I would love, and I'll probably play until they have to put my Razor Tartarus Pro into my casket.

[@AChopstix]

Replying to your last paragaph - looks like that's what we're getting in the Midnight expansion it says "Return to the old world to banish forces of dark" - sounds like it will be invaded by the void

[@Akito0110]

Good post friend

[@TuorUlmondil]

It’s been a while since I’ve seen a “Hey guys, Xaryu here” chat type video. Loved the topic of this one. It’s definitely a situation with no easy answers.

[@jay-rgroup]

This is a very interesting, plausible take. I think linking expectations about the game, the nature of the player base and the average modern video game consumer is a key point which sums up the issue beautifully

[@Themplow]

This is an incredible video honestly, it summarizes a lot of my internal thoughts about the MMO genre as a whole. I'm in a slightly unique position in this debate, I'm an early 20s guy who grew up playing TBC and Wrath on private servers having fun with my friends. When SoD came around I got back into WoW after probably more than a decade, and it's my first time going through the real, legit leveling journey. I can genuinely say it's some of the most fun I've had with videogames in a really long time. I tried getting some of my friends to join me, but soon realized that that was probably never going to happen. Even people my age don't really want to spend even a couple hours a day leveling/raiding/whatever, we have college or uni or even jobs too, so when my friends come home the last thing they want is to have to log in and gather herbs, go mining, level professions or anything of that sort, because it feels like a chore. For me, what makes me play the game, is the love I've had for it ever since I first logged onto a private server back in the TBC days, when I could barely speak english and had no idea what I was supposed to be doing. For others my age, who never played WoW before, it's simply too much of a grind just to get into, on top of all the grinding that acutally needs to be done in the game. It has been like this for years, and that is why I totally agree with the point of the genre itself kinda dying, rather than just WoW dying. I had high hopes for the planned Riot MMO, but that has seemingly been delayed and we won't be getting any updates on the progress as the devs have stated that they are going to be "going dark" for a while. I think if there is a company that can bring the MMO genre to the masses again, it is Riot, whether that is good or bad is to be seen. The biggest problem will now be, at least for a generation or two, how to redefine the MMO progression structure to make sure the reward system is rewarding enough for players who either don't want to or simply can't put in the time to grind out gear and progression in general. This is honeslty kind of a pointless ramble with no real point, I just wanted to share my point of view as a relatively young WoW player who recently tried to get his friends to try out WoW. All I can say is that I dream of a day where me and my irl friends log on to an MMO and go explore the world together, as I once did with my childhood friends back then.

[@Julez3133]

if im being honest from 1990-2010 the era of kids and ppl living life were very social, early 2000's culture was very people oriented, you had fun together. Ppl were more into forming connections than pure ambitions. when a game came out that basically encouraged that from 2004-2008 ppl were sooo more interested in the social aspects of wow. WoW was essentially a massive chatroom with fun things to do together. Like a playground essentially. A theme park. So its no coincidence that around 2008 when smartphones and social media and youtube and guides and the internet started becoming more than just a cool new thing ppl started being much more goal oriented, the need to social connection became weaker.

[@Tyscrat]

100% man, you nailed it. Its like the social aspect of the entire world has fallen off.

[@seagullphilosopher2173]

Yep this is why MMOs will never be popular again. Prinarily because socialising online is not a novelty in the same way and there are numerous more convenient outlets for these activities. Therefore people don't want to jusy idle away in game anymore because they aren't there to socialise as a main activity, they are in game to do some specific thing. Some culture is cyclical as mentioned but it never returns in the exact same form. It is always pastiche and engaged with the contemporary culture. Look at classic wow, it isn't anything like the original release primarily because the people populating it are different in 2019+

[@seagullphilosopher2173]

What's very strange though is that as the player base aged the content and stories in game got even more juvenile and childish. From the super hero graphics to the terrible writing. A strange paradox, surely they should aim at their target audience. Otherwise retail feels embarrassing to play as an adult.

[@mccGoNZooo]

WoW itself was a departure down the road of de-socializing MMOs. Games like Ultima Online, EverQuest, etc., were much more about the social factor because it was way more novel when they were at their most relevant. WoW was pivotal in making MMOs less social. I don't think there was ever going to be a world where WoW was successful and MMOs were becoming more social. For better or worse WoW set a standard for MMOs because of all of the non-MMO players it drew in and molded what they think a MMO is. That mold is very different from what MMOs were before WoW and I think ironically the mold as it existed before WoW was more like what a lot of WoW players hold up as the ideal nowadays.

[@user-yt5tv6tg7r]

Perfectly said. Dedicating time to WoW as one's life changes is the point. Bru you nailed that so hard. Things change

[@user-yt5tv6tg7r]

You can't dedicate 2 months of your life to get a character geared for example

[@perkulant4629]

It's so true. I play 4 hours a week m+ these days. My mate and i get 4-8 dungeons in every sunday this way. with pug dps. All the time we have now hehe.

[@maxpowers4436]

@@user-yt5tv6tg7rYou cant dedicate 2 months in a row but you can dedicate 2 months of total time. Came back for season 3 and easily geared myself to 470+ by doing pug m+ and pug raids.... Whats so fkn hard I basically play a few hours a week max. Full time job full time life i play less than im at the gym probably I just play over weeks its really not that hard. Season isnt even finished yet but im happy what ive done got curve all the usual shit time to have a break till S4. People are way to all or nothing the only way I still manage to enjoy things while getting older is to actually dedicate time to play even if short and stick to it. Ditching artificial FOMO helps as well.

[@dmasiodnmiod]

then why so many millions of players did that in 2019 Classic?@@user-yt5tv6tg7r

[@jayshah8684]

Hit the nail on the head with this one.

[@johnny_eason_iii]

👏👏👏👏👏👏🙌🏼🙌🏼🙌🏼🙌🏼💯💯💯💯💯

[@shenaneganz2762]

Great video man, lots of points hit home with me born in the 90s and growing up playing WoW. Basically being an adult and not having the time I once had to play. Glad you made this video and gave a well thought out take on the idea in general.

[@Aeztor.]

As a PvP'er I would love for retail open world to be like Season of Discovery while still having instanced PvP to get my PvP and reward demands met. But the issue clearly is as you describe it, people want different things and we can't cater one version of WoW to everyone

[@viberaider6852]

I do kind of miss the tol barad open world style of PvP, southern MoP. I slacked on ashran but people did enjoy it who actually engaged in it.

[@HiCellDaddy]

Exactly. Xaryus take single handedly made me feel for the devs. For the first time ever

[@monkeyjames9285]

I miss old bgs miss go in alterac valley see people trying bolt final boss 2 faction beat sh out one other cap sh to me that bg yes suck graveyard camp think just part experience kinda why like bg like wintergrasp force people to actually fight with faction to me big fights always fun. Open world stuff at my experience know not every one but going my just get ganged upon if do get help eventually me my friends out number we just log off. I enjoy pvp but certain level can start hating on pvp world quest retail as example especially grind mobs kill boss.

[@monkeyjames9285]

Also fact that old days someone more geared smart knew doing could unalive ya dam near anyone now days if someone just 10 I level above in retail might as well open cheek accept Sand paper weapon or magic. Even more skill player just doesn't work like use to if do beat them class close prob get nerf from personal don't like that. Also might hate for this Feck you arena players y'all to dam sweety and always new maps meanwhile not got any bgs any kind top. My head since azerite bg. Like see 2 bgs one for normal ain't limited time bg and epic bg

[@BSwitchGTG]

You’ve got good takes Xar. This was a delight to watch, and obviously big agreement here. Sometimes magic can’t be rebottled. Classic was better than Vanilla for me on many levels, but the nostalgimagic of TBC, Wrath, and even Cata just weren’t there the same as they used to be. Generations and circumstances change - it just happens. Not good or bad, just happens.

[@franborrero]

Love this kind of vid Xar!

[@ignaciosaenz6352]

You’re an articulate lad, should probably do more of these vods!

[@Iamb0redn0w]

A sunday video this day is blessed lets go

[@Bottlecap0]

PTL brother

[@RceeTwothreenine]

I think the whole idea of catering to a specific audience should be thrown out the window. If you make a good game, people will play it. Plunderstorm is a perfect example of this. You see people screeching on the forums about how "nobody asked for this" and that's literally the point! Nobody asked for Plunderstorm but it's amazing. Look how many people are playing it and loving it - and this is just the first iteration of it. Obviously modern Blizzard is not the same company that made the revolutionary, genre defining games (SC, WC3, D2, vanilla WoW) but I still believe that they are capable of making great games if they can get out of their own way. Regarding WoW specifically, Dragonflight has been an incredible expansion. Tons of content, it respects your time, there are no convoluted systems, and in my view it's been a huge step in the right direction for the game as a whole. There are some cases of things needing to be fixed, adjusted, looked at, etc. such as the insane difficulty of mythic raiding and the inaccessibility of getting into arena. Asmon's idea of generally reducing complexity by getting rid of addons and pruning abilities would go a long way towards solve these problems. But by and large the game is definitely on an upward trajectory right now. Like I said originally, if the game is good, people will play it and continue to play it. Dragonflight's retention being better than at any point in modern WoW's history demonstrates this.

[@cenciqt6045]

the game mode is fun indeed. But I am interested to see the participation once everyone hits renown 40

[@therealkylekelly]

so if you don’t cater to a specific audience then who determines what makes a game “good”?

[@CL-jq1xs]

Pretty sure there's plenty of "we didn't ask for this" comment for Plunderstorm. Heck look no further than Plunderstorm video itself....

[@theelectricant98]

By the way you handle this video style so well and I love hearing you work through your thoughts on these conundrums

[@jaman198]

Good quality content man! This is the type of stuff I look forward to seeing!

[@Darkdeaths994]

Honestly, I think this makes sense. I would hope that after seeing Plunderstorm, the Wow Dev team could consider more unique and creative ideas or even possibly evolving pass WoW and creating something similar to its roots. Plunderstorm created that fast queue up system that could of been incorporated into the game as another battleground but it looks like the devs put some thought into how to incorporate the mode. I think them trying something new by just creating its own "server" where you can just get in the game and have fun was great for the mode since most games they bring out by themselves tend to either have a difficulty getting people to install another game or it gets rating bombed. This "server" mode was a great way to protect it from immediate hate. I think if they were to do more of this they could offer it at least a free to play mode rather than keeping it subscription based. I personally will be playing Cata Classic and hopefully MoP classic when they release but in the meantime I hope they continue to create more interesting games/ideas. Otherwise, I'll just find something else to play when I get bored of the wow grind.

[@kerrghan]

Sadly, I agree... I'm like in between those generations, being from 2002 I love WoW but none of my friends wanna play, but I don't think it's necessarily the MMO genre that's the problem. I think it's more the fact that we have to pay a monthly (or half-yearly) sub... People are no longer willing to pay that

[@dmitrjK]

If none of your friend doesn’t like to share this passion with you, why you should follow them? You shouldn’t follow interest of your friends or f they don’t do the same…find a new friends and enjoy together.

[@anthonysanchez9204]

Xar this was a great video, very insightful and you put a perspective into play that isn’t out there much.

[@DrTrash916]

Took days off at the start of SOD with my older brother and it felt like we were kids again. Both went back to work and haven't played the second phase. 100% agree an MMO RPG is another beast when it comes time dedication. I have wanted something new in the IP for a decade. Great vid Xaryu.

[@MatthewB-Kornafel-xv6oi]

Im living it up as a priest right now. Healing the fuck out the alliance daily

[@blswebmaster]

My man!

[@ianw7966]

Ali is straight garbage

[@DrBrainrape]

Why you ain’t never healed me bruv?

[@breadmanfun]

I feel like retail is in a great place in a certain aspect. Speaking about arena specifically, in wrath it can take up to 2 months to get your 5 pieces of arena set with the arena point system if you’re an average or below average player. In retail you get full BiS set everything within a few days if you grind, and a week if you take it slow. And I think the goal everyone would prefer is just being on an even playing field when it comes to competing. And retail accomplishes that.

[@nikolayangelov7763]

That's the main problem. You outlined it perfectly - Retail is too easy, and if you're a casual player, you should not have the ability to receive BIS gear. Hence why sod is so popular. Hence why Wrath Arena was best. Casuals want BIS gear - and in turn that ruins the game.

[@daverobert5018]

​@nikolayangelov7763 so only hardcore players should have access to the bis gear? This is a really dumb take

[@nikolayangelov7763]

@@daverobert5018 that’s how it always was, how it always should be. If you’re trash at the game, cannot expect a participation medal. This generation and their victim mentality wants all the perks without any of the work.

[@nikolayangelov7763]

@@daverobert5018 let’s start giving rank 1 titles to any noob that queues 1 arena match while we’re at it.

[@necrobale]

​ @nikolayangelov7763 So disingenuous. Retail PvP is one of the most inaccessible PvP games out there, especially for an MMO. Yeah you can get full gear a month into the patch but people don't push rating in arenas for gear they push for cosmetics. Cosmetics that 90% of the playerbase will never see. If you like gear being locked behind rating then go play wotlk classic with the 10 other people queueing. SoD is an awful example btw. You can be quadriplegic and have BiS gear. PvP is a joke and raids are free loot piñatas.

[@fmj5130]

enjoy these sit down videos - a podcast would be super cool even if its something monthly.

[@qwerob]

Yep. Agree. My all time high was TBC with a glad title during school days. Played wow on and off afterwards but never got the same amount of possible time I could spend to the game to reach the same level of excitement or success. Now a father of a 2 year old and only play wrath on a private server with a nice and friendly community. RPGs were always my favorite genre (Gothic!) and having the possibility to enjoy these worlds with other real players really got me. I love MMOs. Hope there will be a future for this genre!

[@RR-bn5wo]

Your haircut is looking fire af dude

[@theelectricant98]

True hes looking like young stalin

[@classicsgaming]

You’ve hit the nail on the head. WoW’s “problems” are not game related but sociological ones. I’d like to see stuff like guild or family pricing. I think there’s a huge untapped audience of parents that would love to play with their kids but suddenly turning your sub to $30 or $45 or $60 a month to keep folks playing is crazy and destroys the value per cost that WoW and subscription MMOs offer. Also the game really needs to do a lot more to make guilding up easier and more importantly getting you into active guilds that are doing the stuff you want to do.

[@kylesmith987]

I would say yes and no on this. There are absolutely some problems that are not in blizzards control but there are absolutely some problems that are entirely game related. Not saying blizzard isn't trying to fix them or that they even have a fix but i don't think its fair to also disregard some of these problems as "not game related".

[@classicsgaming]

@@kylesmith987 Blizz can absolutely torch their game either through completely batshit lore content - Shadowlands - or through poor gameplay. At the moment though the lore is fairly stable, they are doing a good job of setting up the "worldsoul" saga, and gameplay in Retail is some of the best it has been for a long time. They can absolutely make improvements and trim some button bloat, but for the most part each class feels unique and plays well. Meanwhile, classic is just classic. No major balance changes or anything. It has a lot of nostalgia and it's slow. Slow games make good games for streamers since it's easier to interact with chat. Either way, the problems of outside the game that they can address through more gameplay modes, different monetization and marketing currently trump the problems of like "what's meta for PvP and M+?" or "Why did SoD get 3 patches while Retail hasn't gotten 1 in some months?"

[@AzarelVincy]

Guild is an old concept as far as retail is concerned. SoD is already trying to put guild health its its condidration for content development. Wow$$ will probably just get pricier not the opposite.

[@classicsgaming]

@@AzarelVincy guild's are not an old concept. Having a structured team to do activities with improves game longevity and retention. Finding a guild that matches with your skill level and progress can be quite difficult though. The guild finder itself is full of dead guilds with tons of inactive players. If it instead listed things like how many dungeons had been cleared as guild groups in the past 3 weeks along with number of raid bosses or PvP matches completed in guild groups in the same time frame along with at what hours it would be far more helpful. They've been pretty clear that they'll be keeping the monthly sub the same, but my point remains. Allowing a discount for group pricing would allow things like families to play together with less financial stress.

[@SeeTee24]

Great video! You hit the nail on the head. I remember 90 percent of my guild during 2008-2009 Wrath were in high school, college, or unemployed because of the great recession. 24/7 Wow. Glory days

[@ElDiavolito]

I do agree with a lot of what you're saying. I think a lot of us are just stuck in the past and want to recapture the first feeling we had experiencing a vast open world with seemingly infinite possibilities. That whole idea was foreign to us and really blew our minds back then and that's not something we can ever get back. We simply know too much. The game might not be perfect but it definitely isn't the main issue in my opinion, It's us. When classic came out again in 2019, it was everything we wanted and dreamed of, or was it? How quickly did it turn into SM mindless farming and mages boosting? The community itself don't know what it wants. They scream and cry for something but then when they get it, they go out of their way to skip it. New people are hard to attract to WoW. The game itself doesn't look good from a surface level. The models aren't modern enough to be something you think about playing in 2024. I know that "graphics aren't everything" but I do feel like that's just something that OG MMO players think and newer audience does actually care about it a lot. Another big issue with MMOs is the idea of "End game" and how content is locked until you're max level which makes it feel like it's something you need to rush to. You have no reason to be excited to reach a new zone because it's just the same as the last one with different NPCs. There's nothing going on in the world to make you want to stay in it even if you're not max level yet.

[@ammertos1517]

I usually don't watch your content because I hate PVP but I always watch your non-PVP related content and really enjoy it. You usually say the same things as I would and I was 32 when the game was released (and are playing since).

[@TheMordgan]

Spot on. The audience is not the same as it was. Kids nowadays have the attention span of a goldfish, they need imediate dopamine.

[@veppy4952]

And the adults (kids back in vanilla > wrath) need everything to feel like it isnt a waste of time or obligated. They want shit easy and accessible without much effort since they cant dedicate that much time like they used to. Thats why people like asmon want the game completely dumbed down and changed now that he isnt a hardcore neckbeard.

[@Endless10ppp]

You are spot on :D

[@camvalence]

Inversely, should work weeks worth of hours be required for minimal item level upgrades above 480? Is key spamming enjoyable to anyone? Then we can talk about pvp .. lol

[@viberaider6852]

​@@camvalenceit's actually fairly easy to get good gear in retail atm, also not every one needs to be 480+ unless your pushing 20+s or mythic raid which is a smaller amount of the player base

[@NoDFX_]

People nowadays love delayed gratification, It's just they are learning a trade, a new language, new skills in life, etc. Playing a video game is supposed to be fun/to escape, not to be a life goal to strive for. LOL

[@Pavidota]

Jagex figured this shit out so many years ago with runescape, they took the 2007 version of the game, 15 year old assets and turned it into a game with 5x as many players as their version of retail

[@goransuvacarev2919]

Great change with the tumbnail, this feels much more organic. Keep it up ❤️

[@fightnight14]

I just started Dragonflight the other day and was initially ecstatic to try it. But after finishing the campaign and getting to 70 man I’m already exhausted. I may have rushed the content but it felt like a chore and flying around just kills all the MMO fun IMO. I had a friend who just played WoW Classic Era recently and loved it, I joined him in a PVP realm and it’s honestly the best WOW experience we’ve ever had. The progression feels rewarding and it doesn’t feel like you are rushing to get things done. WoW should hit a big reset and an overhaul. Like bring everything back where it’s used to be. Make a new World.

[@futuramaiscool92]

i am 12 and what is this

[@CSPRfilms]

😂

[@xXHarlek1NXx]

im playing SoD and most people complain about "lack of endgame content" and im like what the hell are you talking about? during the day i sometimes log in for event, but i also have to work, do stuff around the house, spend some time with family and then at night ill grab a beer and stay up till 4-5am because i have to do the raid, i have to farm gold, skill crafting, i have to get honor for rank ups, i have to farm PvP reputation...i feel like i have to do so many things i have no time for (also funny when i have like 2 hours of time to play and decide to do some BGs, end up just sitting in the city waiting in the que for 45 minutes)

[@enso.nauvoox]

Hey Xaryu, I don’t usually comment on videos, but thumbs up for this video mate! It creates depth, give things to think about, it clarifies certain aspects and brings authenticity for you as a content creator. Keep it up! 💪🏼

[@tristinbulko6786]

We would have to delete dracthyr

[@Kenji-117]

Facts

[@VexLooter]

Vulperas and Pandaren first please.

[@NostraDavid2]

Delete the Spacegoats as well, with their Windchime Overlords too.

[@curcicreations]

I fkin love dracthyr its my main and very well designed class very complex and rewarding.. stop hating on stuff you are not interested in people are having fun. You can always spend your time playing classic and no one would care.

[@VexLooter]

@@curcicreations I don't play classic, but I despise that monstrosity you call a "race".

[@Monstrosity9000]

I'm a college senior, started playing WoW in 2010ish, and honestly I love retail, Lich King, and SoD right now. I think the game itself is in a good state and I've been happy with the dev and media teams. I think one of the game's main struggles is that everybody leaves after the new raid has been out long enough for guilds to clear on heroic. And that's because the player base is largely millennials who can only play the game with a completionist mindset - they just don't have the time to love the game like they used to. I am hopeful that War Within brings somewhat of a mindset change which could make the game more of a priority for those people. I think a ton of people think of retail as an entirely foreign and diseased entity from the WoW they love just because they hated BfA and Shadowlands, but Dragonflight has really been a fantastic expansion in contrast to those, and if War Within is just as good, maybe people will think WoW is "good" or "healthy" again.

[@BlazingWolfTV]

Finding a chest while leveling, by pulling one mob at a time. Finding that one greenie that actually is an upgrade.. i want that.

[@Gorgok19]

For me and my friends, retail wow has too many button bloat and too many skill proving bonus to the next skill used (Preservation Evoker for example : Verdent Embrace increase the next dream breath by 40%, then you use echo to double the next healing spell, then you use Dream Breath)... Meanwhile I have 11 healing skills, 1 Interrupt, 3 CC, 4 defensive, 2 movement spell, 4 cooldown. And druid is the same and even more because you have your shapeshift form having different spells. I feel like I'm playing a game of chest trying to decide what's my next move instead of just enjoying playing wow. DH is in a nice spot button wise IMO, not more then that.

[@shaun2686]

Some of us enjoy the difficulty. Like DH,BM hunter and Evoker (Dev & Aug) is incredibly boring for me because it's so easy.

[@tommycarr1513]

Anyone else notice in game names have changed? Everyone these days have meme names and back in the day everyone had fantasy character names. At least more so.

[@hunterrpl]

it's just that kids think they're funny and edgy

[@Jarikraider]

Could somewhat be influenced by the lack of names still available.

[@tommycarr1513]

@@Jarikraider this is true

[@maxpowers4436]

No not really Shamans have been naming themselves Oprahwindfury for decades now

[@Stefansky2]

You're probably the only one or ONE OF not many, not only streamers, but WoW players, that took his own time to think about how to make the game we love better and more accessible/appealing to new audience. Very well done, and I agree with you all along that.

[@MrNightfate]

The thing is our 90's Gen grew with warcraft, the history behind it

[@IchWillDie]

also to add I think alot of wow players have come to the realisation of finished the game ; meaning they dont crave new reward structures as these new rewards are just reskins of old or a new color similar armor ; meaning new rewards doesnt feel new ; armor is armor ; mounts is mounts ; the next achivement complete is the new patch so the individual only has so much to do ; your character is basically just a bank of security.

[@sengelhard2982]

Yeah that's a huge thing as well. You can only unlock anything meaningful once, and after that it loses its luster. This even applies in Classic. In general I would say leveling Classic 1-60 is some of the most rewarding stuff with essential unlocks for your class, riding, and so on, then in BC flying, but after that it's not like there are huge things left to gain other than higher stats. I was focussed and proud of myself when I managed to unlock flying in BFA, but I only ended up using it once or twice before it was unlocked for everyone. I spent weeks farming the different alpaca mounts and used them for maybe half a week total. I think for many people the grind itself is more important than whatever reward they gain

[@phnx_tom5400]

I was born in 2004 and started playing WoW around Legion and I'm up to this day the only WoW player in my social Environment around my age. I think the main reason why WoW doesn't get many new players is that there is still no console port. All my friends just play on PS4/PS5's and don't care if something is published for PC if there is nothing for playstation players. The Price of a console/playing with a controller from your couch instead of sitting all day at your desk are just huge pros

[@KingMidgardsormr]

You're only 19 or 20? Homie you need to find a different server. My entire guild is between the ages of 18 and 25

[@Fubble123]

I disagree. I dont like the idea of catering for a specific group. Blizzard should just make a game that THEY think is great. Game developer are artists. Which artist got famous because he catered to the audience? No, they just draw the picture that THEY think is great. I want new creative ideas from creative people. I dont want to be aware of the hamsterwheel im running in. I just want to get thrown into a world where i can figure things out. This is the definition of fun.

[@Michael-pf1in]

Larian enters the chat

[@tevani1]

I mean, that is how we got Diablo and Warcraft and more back then, because they were just gamers themselves that made games they wanted to play. Idk how Blackthorn came to be, but it exists too lol

[@TheHarlequinCrest]

I agree with you. However, the thing is it’s not about what you like or not lol. You were more able to be creative 20 years ago when online games were barely anything. But competence is getting bigger and bigger over time and more brands and companies come out (especially in videogames). Blizzard is at the end of the day one more big company that we all know has fallen off through the last years… hence they proritize survival and money over art… if they need to cater to a wider audience they will no matter what. And I don’t blame them though

[@cowpunch122]

It's not about the destination, it's about the journey.

[@simon-xz4xg]

Actully the best analysis about WoW ive seen in years. I also liked how you managed to coock this thing down to 15 minutes. Good job. Also I love how you talk about generational preferences, we as consumers must understand that its difficult to attract different target groups which is what blizzard is finally trying to do with different versions of wow.

[@Cyoor]

As an old person. I feel that its something that you are missing here. Not enough time + wanting to have delayed gratification and a feeling of working towards something does not have to be in conflict with each other. If the game release cycle is slow enough that everyone have the chance to play slowly and eventually reach their personal goals, they can still play the game even if its just for 2-4 hours a week. The largest thing that killed retail for me was the endless cycle of making what you have tried to achieve being obsolete with fast tracking and catchup mechanics. A better way to handle things would be to make people having to go through every step of the way with less catchup mechanics and actually enjoy the ride and be able to achieve what they have as their goal even if they might not be on the latest content currently. I remember in vanilla, it was SUPER few people that got to Naxx (even clearing AQ was rare), but people enjoyed the game anyway. They didnt need to be at the absolute endgame for things to be fun. They could still focus on leveling, doing dungeons and then maybe step in to MC/BWL with their slow guild. A customer who plays 2-4 hours a week still pays for the product and is still contributing to the playerbase. A player will not be happy with and play a game if he feels that their goals will never be in range because the goalpost always moves and you get catchup mechanics thrown your way instead of that feeling of actually succeeding with something on your own. (Even if it took you 3 times as long as someone else)

[@YamTheGoblin]

I had never heard of generational interests before, thank you for helping us improve 1% more 🖤

[@Braunschweiger89]

man im glad you made this video. i started playing vanilla wow when i was in high school and played mists of pandaria, then basically life hit me and decided to stop. Came back for warlords of draenor and legion but just didnt hit me like it was before. Wow consumed around 10,000ish hours of my life and I had a lot of fun but it just became another job that I had no time for. life is busy... and unfortunately theres no chance I can compete in a game like this that requires substantial time commitment. glad to know Im not the only one.

[@tm87887]

some of the first memories i have are watching my dad play world of warcraft, while my twin brother and i would beg to have a turn. we were only 6 at the time! cant believe im 23 this year… i would love to see WoW make a comeback.

[@HazMattyGaming]

I don’t play wow anymore because of gate keeping and toxicity. I also don’t like all the addons you need to keep up with everyone. I’m 38, married with 2 kids, work and school full time, coach my kids in baseball and I still don’t mind the MMO grind 🤷‍♂️

[@ziggs123]

You like easy content to mindlessly grind? Try out Lost Ark

[@HazMattyGaming]

@@ziggs123 I actually put 600 or so hours into Lost Ark. I don’t mind a grind but that’s a little much for my taste lol. Plus there is gatekeeping in that game as well.

[@ziggs123]

@@HazMattyGaming true 🤣

[@Maos001]

When WoW was first released it was all about exploring a new world on our PCs That is all lost because this world is now been with us for years, adding new content and areas is not the same. The magic has long gone. Unfortunately the team that created that magical world are long gone as well.

[@maxpowers4436]

So then you make the game about something else.... I mean your agument makes sense sort of. It implies a game can only be fun in one way? Or for one reason.

[@jaded-harper]

idk m8 I'm sure a lot feel the opposite lol. the more stuff they add to a world I care about the more invested I become. I mean you're first memories of the game are always gonna be the fondest but that doesn't mean the magic just disappears imo. unless u just dont like the game anymore ofc

[@suminshizzles6951]

Hell no. When WoW was first released you were made to peck at a button and disrespected like you were some pavlovian dog skinner box experiment patient. They employed psychologists to develope technique's to entrap you and make the game addictive. Rather than making a game they made systems and a had dopamine reward system in place to make the game addictive. THis is abusive in nature.

[@JoshuaFlexman]

I like your prespective...You try to see things from all angles. Solid, best of luck man

[@thomask5415]

Fair spot Xar. I am into SOD rn mainly BCS of the slower pace of classic with slightly more new stuff like runes, low lvl raid etc. I don't have enough time to play pure classic and retail game pace is high for me. After playing M+ (and I was doing it in the evening) I had problems with sleep probably BCS of overstimulation of the game's high speed. I wish they add some elements like dual spec to SOD - It would make my life in the game much easier!

[@ichputzhiernur2829]

Simpel: bring Legacy Servers. 1 for Classic 1 for bc 1 for wotlk 1 for retail (The war within) end let it end with it. So that the people can decide where they Wanna play. After that WOW 1.0 FINISHED!!! And then, bring wow 2.0! Different time period. New engine. New environment and so on. A complete new game on a current quality of mmorpg games. That would be my dream!

[@shaggydooby9386]

I like your idea it needs to be like runescape

[@shaggydooby9386]

Sure runescape went down a path of failure but I mean it is still around and you can still log in to your old accounts and character

[@hieloz]

Great idea

[@gabrieldecastro5030]

Yeah, but wow 2.0 will be more like classic or retail? I mean, it failed with retail so..

[@quickschweezy]

At that point just play another game? there are still a million players that enjoy this game. WoW 2.0 is literally 99% sure to kill the game for the playerbase

[@Jarikraider]

10 abilities is still too few. I could imagine at least 15-20 working.

[@holyrs1575]

yeah you have demon hunter , evoker that play like that

[@lkstrongkl]

Reworking World of Warcraft: A Balanced Approach In light of the evolving gaming landscape, I propose a reimagined game mode for WoW that caters to both casual and dedicated players. Let’s call it “WoW: Equilibrium.” Here are the key features: 1. Heroic Mode Selection: Introduce a separate game mode where players choose classes and factions akin to how heroes are picked in MOBA games. These characters would have standardized “gear” stats, ensuring a level playing field for everyone, similar to MOBA heroes. The focus shifts from gear to talents, allowing players to shape their playstyle without the need for endless grinding. 2. Instant Access to Endgame Content: In WoW: Equilibrium, players can queue for battlegrounds, arenas, and raid groups right away. No more leveling up, gear farming, or endless grinding-just dive into the action. This respects players’ time and allows them to enjoy the game without compromising their real-life commitments. 3. Parallel Gamestate: For those who relish the grind and immersive experience, the “current” gamestate remains available. Traditional WoW enthusiasts can continue their journey, exploring the vast world, leveling up, and collecting gear. WoW: Equilibrium coexists alongside the existing game, offering choice without disrupting the community. 4. Subscription-Free Model: Let’s bid farewell to subscriptions. Instead, sell the base game and perhaps cosmetics. Players pay once, and the game is theirs to explore without recurring fees. Cosmetics (skins, mounts, pets) can provide additional revenue without affecting gameplay balance. In summary, WoW: Equilibrium bridges the gap between life’s demands and gaming passion. It’s time to embrace a flexible approach that accommodates all of the player base. P.S.: This was written by chat GPT, I gave it the following prompt: "I believe WoW should be reworked in the following way: They should make available a completely separate game mode in which you would chose classes and factions in the same way people pick heroes in MOBA games nowadays. Those characters would have standard "gear" stats that are equal for everyone just like MOBA heroes do and you would only be able to shape your playstyle through talents. You could queue in battlegrounds and arenas, get into raid groups, play the endgame and do everything the game offers completely without ever having to level up, gear and grind forever. In this way time would be respected and people would've been able to play without having to compromise their life to the game. And since we have the people that like grinding and living the game, we could also have the "current" gamestate available for those who chose to follow that path. Maybe something like that. I quit wow in 2017 because I work 10+ hours a day and have a family now. This would make the game playable for me again and more feasible for millions of people. And also, subscriptions sucks. Get rid of it. Sell the game and maybe cosmetics and that's all. Please text proof the above statement"

[@HarveyMeadowlark]

I stopped playing about 4 years ago and just recently returned because I was in a serious accident and have been unable to work for several months. I’ve really enjoyed playing again but it’s just as you said, once I am fully healed and I return to work, I just won’t have the time to play. Excellent point Xar

[@Joekary5]

It still makes Blizzard a butt load of money so I don't see it "dying" any time soon

[@Noriaela]

WoW's current player account is around 7M. It aint going anywhere tbh

[@jasoncb7]

@@NoriaelaReally that high? In my mind it was 4m and below.

[@calisto2735]

@@Noriaela WTF?! What are you basing that on? Don't get me wrong, still mostly love the game and wish it really is in such a good state... But last time we had anything close to plausible numbers it was about 2mil active accounts. PS: on mmo-population, it shows 1.3mil daily players. It's not all active accounts, of course and it's not specified if it's over all WoW iterations, but it's very far from 7 mil.

[@arthur-ny5rf]

@calisto2735 blizz was at gdc and showed a graph of active subs over the years and currently they stabalized to a healthy 7m active subscriptions. You can see the poc for yourself on the wow subreddit.

[@RceeTwothreenine]

@@calisto2735 the 7 mil subscriber number was revealed in a presentation Blizzard did at the GDC (game developer conference) a couple days ago, so that's the official count.

[@martinharutyunyan7322]

The thing is, not only players have changed. Blizzard was once for people who play games; now, they're a company focused on earning more money.

[@MissMarvel_]

This unrealistic cynicism is exhausting. You know the people developing the game are gamers who love WoW and want WoW to be fun, right? You know that stockholders don't make game development choices ever, yeah? Bobby Kotick doesn't know what an arena is and he doesn't know what a Great Vault is. Seriously, use your brain. All companies strive to make money so they can keep going and expand, but you're imagining developers as men in suits when they're goofy kid-at-heart nerds who bring their dogs to work.

[@JDMJesseee]

​@MissMarvel_ Wrong. Look at Diablo 4. The devs who designed the game and some of the way the game would function did not even play that game. They had no idea are only on the team as they obviously needed a job. I have played Wow since WoTLK and quit S2 Dragon Flight. Blizzard lost its reputation and integrity a long time ago. It will never return to the former games with dedication for the loyal fans Vanilla - MoP. These days I just log into Fortnite with my kid. No monthtly sub No expansion purchases No LFG/LFR No attempting to coordinate with RL friends No grinding to get gold Just log on and play. Getting older means less time.

[@MissMarvel_]

@JDMJesseee I ain't reading all that. Happy for you though, or sorry that happened.

[@JDMJesseee]

@@MissMarvel_ typical woke cat ear weirdo response

[@MissMarvel_]

@@JDMJesseee it's not only easily observable but it's something xaryu would agree with lmfao

[@zanetti8142]

Xar is not only the best streamer around, he is also such a smart guy. Every time he speak, I just cant stop listening.

[@kodysullivan7582]

You got me! I’ll do a write up. I think an enormous component that prevents MMOs from (re)gaining and maintaining higher concurrent players is that the most popular MMOs haven’t been optimized on every major gaming platform yet. To sum up my idea with a simile: it’s like if artists only put their music on Spotify (or rather, a less popular platform like Bandcamp, representing PC owners) just because it’s their preferred listening platform for XYZ reasons. Those artists would miss out on so much potential listener reach, no matter how amazing their songs are. I’m not saying MMO’s should go mobile ofc, but it’s hard to imagine a scenario where optimizing WoW, Guild Wars 2, Lost Ark, etc. for the newest Xbox and PlayStation wouldn’t be exponentially beneficial for these game companies in every single way. Undeniably, the games would have to be designed and implemented by developers with peak levels of finesse and innovation, but I feel like that’s simply what this industry needs to get off its back foot right now - an expansion(lol,) or evolution rather, that can deliver that exciting MMO gameplay experience we all have known and loved to consoles. Hell yeah I’m trying to run Deadmines and Naxx on this 60” TV in my living room !!!!

[@shroomer3867]

Hey, just throwing in my opinion as a zoomer: I'm technically older than WoW for a few months (the MMO, not the RTS games before them) and considered a zoomer. My very first experience with WoW was at Mists of Pandaria, and I really liked the game up until Legion, got through Warlords of Draenor with a bit of a sour taste but as a kid I thought garrisons were cool since I didn't understand that the meta was to stay all day in them. Came back to Legion when it was discounted and had a blast there, thankfully avoided the period of BFA and Shadowlands. Anyway, here's my take on it, personally as someone who is starting to grow in life and get stuff done like driving license, english certificates, making my own CV for the first time and looking for entry level positions/internships, etc. I can say that I am not going to go back to WoW any time soon, maybe I would try WoW Cataclysm Classic because I missed it back in the day during summer or a free period, but otherwise, it just felt too addicting for me and I can't stand throwing my life away at a video-game when I finally am grasping my future life. Now don't get me wrong, I'm not one of those people who just "grind" away until exhaustion, I do think that a few hours in the day dedicated to watching KZbin or playing videogames are a must in order to not burn yourself out, but WoW is just a huge timesink that allures you and attracts you so easily that I wouldn't even want to touch it with a footpole for the first few months when I'm getting my foot down the job market, you know. *TL:DR; As a Zoomer I would love to play the new expansions, but it would be careless for me to do so due to, you know, real life and first time being an adult.*

[@seantheww]

bro looks like he's gonna ask me for my homework

[@lantern214]

You hit the nail on the head. I don't have time for WoW like I did when I was younger. Retail is demanding, and Sod for the most part is a "jump and and out" type of game. Lately FF14 has taken some of my time. They have tons of casual content, and some medium level stuff if you want a bit more. If you have time to commit, they have Savage and Ultimate's to sink you teeth in, and I don't have to farm hours upon hours to acquire gear. Just craft or buy the basic set and tackle the latest/ previous content since it's sync'd.

[@zmcnabb]

At GDC the warcraft director John (forgot his last name) revealed a presentation that showed when classic came out wow hit 8.5 million subs again, and I believe we're at 6 million right now at the tail end of that presentation which is insane to me. As a lifelong wow player who has never unsubbed since 2006 I would have imagined we were only at a million or two max honestly.

[@WhatIfTheories]

WoW isn't fixable or playable for a new or returning player. So their audience is lost. There needs to be a hard reset. WoW 2. I would be interested in War Within and this 3 saga series if it was a new game and actually starting over. Removing all the bloat of previous expansions zones, races, classes, everything. PoE is doing this very thing by having PoE 2. PoE suffers the same problem that WoW does it's a 10+ year old game that has too much convoluted bloat so it can't gain new players. PoE 2 will change that. They really need to do WoW 2!! I feel that any game especially MMO's have about 2-3 expansions before they reach a critical mass and have to start over yet here we are with WoW just adding more ontop of what is already too much which will NEVER work. So I can't touch WoW ever again and it's being handled the wrong way. Just be bold!! Do WoW 2 and actually fix the problems!! If GGG (a small company) can do it with PoE so can Blizzard with infinite resources and money.

[@thesithorder1060]

This!! I do dabble in SoD cause it's easy to digest for now to give me my WoW fix. I hear people say PoE is amazing but you just can't start playing that game it's a mess because of how much is in it and why I look forward too PoE 2 because they are a good company. I want a great game to play and would love to play WoW but they aren't giving us a game to play and really would love for WoW 2 to happen, it's time.

[@WhatIfTheories]

@@thesithorder1060 Yea I just can't do it. I love WoW and met real life best friends in WoW. It was an amazing time and experience but it's an absolute complete mess and not playable anymore. It just has to start over. If War Within started the saga over and you have 5 classes and went at it again it would be soooo hype! WoW 2 would be the biggest thing in MMO history and they missed the opportunity here. My friends all quit and we are waiting. Blizzard just isn't listening and doesn't take chances anymore. Which is why WoW and their games are losing. Blizzard should be innovating the industry instead of being a has been and just pushing out games living off their nostalgia and name. Other gaming companies are doing it better and why I been playing LE. It's refreshing to see small companies with passion make better games.

[@macarebe]

You dont play the game and doom post about it. Dragonflight is really fun, and your laziness of not wanting to learn it doesnt make it a bad game. 7 million active subs. You can learn everything new in 2 weeks and get back on track. "WoW isn't fixable or playable for a new or returning player." What a joke of a statement. Ex-WoW doomers like you are horrible for the community and I am glad people that actually play the game dont care at all for your opinion.

[@kaiserstritz136]

That would be shitty and boring. Nope

[@Bonks332]

WoW 2. Make WoW 2.

[@taylorshin]

This should have happened with Cata… 2011

[@Bonks332]

@@taylorshin completely agree. But I will say if there's ever a time to consider it for the way it's going I think it should be thrown around lol

[@christianl.1590]

I think another reason that the generation that loves MMO's loves them is because its a natural extension of the type of entertainment/play we had when we were younger. We all grew up with books and movies and TV shows of stories and sagas of adventure. As kids we used our imagination to be a hero with stick swords and magic while playing outside, that kind of thing. When we got the chance to actually make a character and play that out in a giant universe, it was such a natural extension of what we liked that that whole group of people (90's kids and older) LOVED it. I don't think the generation today was raised on that same style of entertainment and imagination that make MMO's appealing to them.

[@TheAlienwhisperer]

This is something I was saying for a long time, and it is fascinating how so many people still dont understand this. Well said Xaryu, we need more content creators like you!

[@zxbc1]

Everything dies, so will WoW. And it's lived a long prosperous life, its time has come.

[@THEROTTINGDOG]

Still has millions of subs that play retail. These fucks that have played it for 20 years have become jaded and have convinced everyone that it's dying. It's art direction sucks and it's shift to diversity and inclusion has killed its story telling, bur its not going anywhere. It's still a huge cash cow for blizzard.

[@kristophersouza8104]

lol, people have been saying this for over 10 years. I’m having more fun in WoW now than I ever have before, and I was there for beta.

[@THEROTTINGDOG]

​@@kristophersouza8104 They play the game for 20k hours and then complain about how boring it is.

[@johnaldjensen4617]

lil bro didnt get the memo, the numbers are there, it's far from dead.

[@nonamenoname9079]

From wows ashes, ashes of creation will rise

[@bLittlegato]

Is WoW sinking ? Actual WoW got arond 7M+ subscribers wich is more than the 5.5M that we had mi-Legion. No legendary farm, no artifact weapon farm, can get many alts & gear them without feeling late, Dragonriding is amazing and the proffessions system is the best ever, i only see improvements comparing to other expansions, had more fun in DF than every expansion since Cata and i hope they will keep this path

[@ziggs123]

Exactly

[@turionb1408]

if wow is sinken then 90% of he other mmos are dead xD

[@JDMJesseee]

Seen the level of bots!! Half the current subscription base would be bots

[@Rebackful]

At Legion you had only 1 addon.. now you can play 6 or more different version of WoW (Wotlk, BC, Classic HC, Retail, SoD...), thats the reason why WoW have more subscribers. If you can play only Dragonflight I think it would be only around 3-4M.

[@ZOMBIEo07]

@@Rebackful Nah Dragonflight alone is like 1,5M - 2M.

[@Grodoo]

One of the reasons mmos were such a success in mid 00’s what because of the hype of fantasy in general and the evolution from mainly being in book form transitioning to film and game. If you read lotr or Harry Potter or whatever fantasy, how much did you just wish to be in that world? Wow took you to that world literally. How many other venues did that for us back then? It was truly amazing 15 years later and that marked is fully saturated and as you say things change. Btw, well spoken, Xar!

[@Tmcbride428]

Another point to bring up for the disinterest in wow is the fact that the internet has evolved. How it exists now, is not what we experienced(late 20s to 40s). We would get home from school, watch tv, see these wow commercials, get pumped because all we new was single player offline rpgs. Now, all of our friends are playing this revolutionary game at the same time...together. It's crazy. I've come to the conclusion, that is the generational gap the you brought up. We experienced little to no internet growing up....to what we have now. It's actually nuts. The thing with wow is, you would go to school and talk about wow and have lan parties and shit with your buddies, go home and play after school. It was all the rage. Again, all we had was basic level single player games/tv. Think about telling a person about wow that has only experienced tv and little to no internet. How mind-blowing that would be? That was us. Those times are gone man...unfortunately. It was a bonding experience that few got to enjoy and appreciate. I'm just glad I got to take part in it. From one dude getting too old to game as much anymore to another...For the Alliance.

[@adverbs626]

doesnt need saving, more subs than in a long time. game is fine. playerbase is shit.

[@ootsie194]

Don't be so ignorant. There are a SIGNIFICANT number of players (myself included) that would wholeheartedly disagree with you

[@turionb1408]

@@ootsie194and millions that would disagree with you.. xD so yeah everyone their own

[@ootsie194]

@@turionb1408 I'm not the one making claims like "the game is fine" though am I

[@EvanInsomniak]

You are so right, i wish i had the time to paly as i did, i loved gaming, it gave me a sense of peace. Time is just against us, being a content creator is the life for a gamer. MmoRpgs will nowadays always have a weird state, super glad to see your input i hope it sheds alot of light on what's going on.

[@NomdeguerreWarcraft]

This is a GREAT take from Xar and it has made me feel very VERY old. I remember playing this game on the family computer in the living room... maybe there aren't many of us left. Are we the boomers now?

[@dimitrisionas9566]

Well explained! You brought up a lot of good points, history, real life, ext. I feel like a lot of content creators are catering to what people want to hear instead of telling them the truth.

[@cobra7282]

The reward structure of vanilla is actually more conducive to a young audience than retail IMO. Retail is all about leveling as fast as possible and getting your toon geared out as much as possible. This means it feels like it takes forever to get "rewarded". However, when the reward is anything that strengthens your character as you progress through the world than suddenly things like leveling up, training new abilities, getting a gear upgrade, etc. start to all feel like legitimate rewards.

[@mahatmaandi2347]

Such a good video! Right on point, glad someone with a bigger voice talks about it. And I am too hoping that MMOs will be cool again ;)

[@michaelambados8488]

You can't attract a crowd that wasn't there from the beginning.

[@Curlybrosfitness123]

This was a great video! When thinking about what would make retail wow more fun to me, my first thought is to expand on the solo content and AI dungeons because I believe that it would make it more like the games I loved playing when I was a teenager…like Skyrim, Assasins creed and such. If wow was closer to those games (which retail does seem like it’s kinda trending that direction) it would fulfill my interest…BUT probably not the same interest at people in their 30’s,40’s and teens. So it’s an interesting thing to think about!

[@AzarelVincy]

Great take. The issue however is sod/classic has all the delayed gratification but is easier to access due to it simplicity. Whereare retail has has tons of convoluted system to discourage the instant gratification crowd. I wish blizard would just accept clear audiences and make retail even more accesible. The upcoming hero talents looks like more convoluted mess to deter new players coming to the game.

[@tick095]

Nice vid. I think WoW's problem is neither the instant gratification of youngsters, nor the lack of a free time of oldsters. It's FOMO. If you miss a raid in current season, you'll nether be able to experience it again 'as it was then'. Legacy Servers showed that you cannot really get back that feeling of a new content by reusing an old content. So, Blizzard played on your nostalgia, fine. But a massive part of the content cannot be played through as intended. Chromie Time and Timewalking just prove my point, they feels different comparing to the 'original' expansion. And many, many raids of old expantions you cannot play to their original format no matter what. If Blizzard managed to solve this problem, getting rid of FOMO and planned obsolescence of content, they would get both 40s and 20s generations, bc everyone would be moving with their own speed through all the content.

[@user-mk3oz2cg1u]

You hit the nail on the head. Been playing sense vanilla and I have a career/family and kids now. I’ve still been playing this entire time all versions when I can. I’m here for long run but my time isn’t anymore

[@haziiyama6904]

Agree with all your points and I have some additional thoughts on it. I've played since Vanilla on & off. I'm 27 now with various forms of adulting to do, so my free time is way more valuable as you said. So when I get in from work on an evening I don't wanna grind a game I can't keep up with. I still like to play games with a fairly competetive mindset. So in my head (right or wrong), to have fun in current WoW I wanna be mythic raiding & pushing keys, doing difficult content. To do this I have to endlessly grind to min max & keep with the curve. So I literally can't play or do anything else on an evening.

[@chrisfaricy4089]

I like this style of content Xar. I like hearing the thoughts from pros and veterans about the state of the game. its also extremely refreshing to hear a realistic position rather than the doomsayer perspective we've seen for the past few years. your positivity keeps the game alive.

[@wigggel]

Xar making me realize how old I am for 15 minutes straight is a great wake up call.

[@trevormacclellan1015]

Out of all the takes I’ve heard on this, xar’s makes the most sense to me.

[@odyknight]

Well said Xar my man. You hit the nail on the head. I enjoy playing a version that resembles the original game, and know that i'm not elite because of time and that works.

[@hydr0549]

I agree with most of what Xar says here as a WoW player born in 07. I found it interesting when my friend of the same age was grinding D4 last summer because his dad bought the game for himself. Although he has now gone back to games like Fortnite and Valorant, I think that if Blizzard could get some of these kids hooked on MMOs, the genre could return.