Canon RF-S 7.8mm F4 Dual Lens vs iPhone 16: 3D VR180 Spatial Video Showdown

[@bjornlindner637]

Awesome Video. Thanks for that. You mentioned that with davinci Resolve Studio, i‘m able to Export Spatial photos from this dual Lens photos. Can Kimchi give me a hint, where to find the right Export Option?

[@hughhou]

I believe you can just use this to make SBS photo to Spatial Image - kzbin.info/www/bejne/hnu6pKaZjdJ9n6csi=DB3nf0Kni175x7dj

[@mahfah7911]

How can I watch this on Quest 3 in 3d format, KZbin only display 2D!?? Can recorded 3D easily be converted for superb 2D footage and how does it fare to other 4k decent cameras like Sony Alpha etc !? Also, this comparison to 3.6m is highly needed !? Great review like always but more questions arises 👏

[@hughhou]

KZbin VR is a free app on Meta Quest 3 - you download it and play this video (put link in your favorite list and it show up on your KZbin VR app) - then you see full 3D. It is really good using KZbin VR on Quest 3 as it has AV1 and hardware acceleration.

[@mahfah7911]

@@hughhou Hugh some 3d side by side videos do not play on KZbin VR. They don’t even show up on search in 3D section of KZbin. They are uploaded I guess in 2d side by side. So how do I view those side by side ones via KZbin where it’s shows in 3d format? And please comparison to last Canon 3.9mm f/3.5stm with 7.8mm? Which one of the two would you prefer and best settings with scenario of them. 👏 amazing tip of settings in this review. So appreciate them since I can use that settings for various scenes as a newbie after purchasing 3.9 dual eye!

[@DavidSmith-wz2vb]

Just watched in Quest 3, great info - thanks man! I'm surprised by the high quality of the new spatial lens with R7. The differences between the three approaches are VERY clear (and some shots are headache-inducing...). Are you planning to produce more videos with the Canon spatial or with the dual fisheye setups? Which is better in your opinion? They seem like different use cases.

[@hughhou]

Yes the headache including shots are me trying to hammer in the points some people are missing or misleaded by marketing... BTW, it looks even better on Vision Pro as Quest 3 has compression - so the details comparison kinda compressed it out. I think this lens is for people trying to get even better details - but does run into display limitation so really Vision Pro can benefit for its extra sharpness. I will try to use it more in my next production. It is just a pain it is a whole new camera instead of using let us use it on R5C or R5II so it is just a lens...

[@Eightpspi]

Going to watch on my quest 3 on christmas

[@hughhou]

Nice! Merry Christmas!

[@Dvm2003]

How do any of these cameras compare to using software like OWL 3D to do post video conversions? Is the quality better to shoot in 3-D or convert later with a high-quality video source?

[@hughhou]

Oh this is 100000 time better than AI conversation. I love OWL 3D or other AI 3D services - but it won’t compare to reality.

[@Venserql]

Waiting for this video to drop.

[@hughhou]

Nice! It is finally here :).

[@Venserql]

@@hughhou Nice

[@Sai-ll7rv]

hi hugh, any insights on the Canon 8K 360 Camera being released soon? is it still being released? can we expect more news on this at CES 25? :)

[@hughhou]

No news on that front… but now DJI is coming into the game…

[@OdyBeRidin]

Wasnt that Canon 8K a VR180 cam? I ready for it too. The RS5 with lenses is really out of my budget. The Teche VR180 has a great picture quality but I really think its overpriced for a consumer cam

[@Sai-ll7rv]

@OdyBeRidin yeah u r right it is 8k 180 + 4k 360. I am in the same boat waiting for an affordable decent 8k 180. We have waited this long, Let's see if CES has anything.

[@OdyBeRidin]

@@Sai-ll7rv Same here. Long overdue. I think theres a market for one. I mean, somebody was willing to pay $700 for my Insta360 EVO camera on Ebay a few weeks ago and its only a 5.7K.

[@ProtoVisionXR]

Great video as usual Hugh and thanks for putting in the work. I walked away from this even more impressed with the iPhone more than anything else, lens disparity aside. Hopefully it will be improved further in the next model. I would like to see Log at some point. Maybe one of the third party apps can do it.

[@hughhou]

Log on an iPhone 16 Pro Max? Unfortunately - no app can do it and Apple is locking that down. So that is another reason I will go with a professional camera instead of an iPhone. But the iPhone is crazy sharp.

[@ProtoVisionXR]

@ Apparently it’s not Apple locking it down. Spatial Camera’s developer say they may implement it. Makes sense since most third party apps film in HDR and higher resolutions and frame rates.

[@garypranzo9334]

Is it possible to use both the 7.8mm and the 3.9mm in same clip. I know they have different aspect ratios.

[@hughhou]

Yes absolutely. I did not show in this video but yea you can.

[@ocortess]

Great video! Can you share the exports settings you use to upload to YT to watch on the Quest? I thought it would be straight forward. The video uploads, but I only see two separate circles of video in YT.

[@hughhou]

Wait, do you hsee 2 separate circles of my video on YT? If mine look correctly, I will share the whole workflow in my next 2D video - which will be more a tutorial.

[@ocortess]

@@hughhou yours look good! I can see this is VR because even in the desktop or mobile YT shows the "wheel". Mine doesn't show any of that.

[@lucianoalexander]

Hugh, what is the best compression output for 3D VR180 8k 60p (shot with Canon R5C with Canon RF 5.2mm f/2.8 L Dual Fisheye) to work on Apple Vision Pro? Do you use compressor to export it? My workflow is using Canon's EOS VR Utility to correct the vr 180 image, then FCPX for grading or I can also use DaVinci Resolve. I could not find a codec that keeps the highest quality and work in Apple Vision Pro. I tried compressor new export codec MV-HEVC for AVP , but when I airdrop it to AVP goes directly in PHOTOS APP(which doesn't play VR 180) and I couldn't find a way yet to see it in Downloads folder or iCloud folder so I can open it with Moon Player or other VR player App. Do you have any suggestions? Thank you!

[@hughhou]

If you use FCP 11 - the compressor is your best friends. After Compressor output, you DO NOT use Moonplayer or the native photo app to play it as after Compressor or FCP 11, you are follow the official workflow to get MV-HEVC VR180 video, which is what Apple expected. But Apple did not release a native player yet (although is coming with the Blackmagic URSA Cine immersive). So the correct way to play it now is to download our FREE visionOS app Spatial Film here: apps.apple.com/us/app/spatial-film/id6670564820?platform=vision - and airdrop to your Files or Download folder (you can first airdrop in photo alubum and then move the file to Download or Files - or just use iCloud Drive). Then use Spatial Film Load Local feature. Maybe sure pick 180 and play the file, you should see it. Our app is one of the ONLY app on Vision Pro App store that can playback MV-HEVC apple format correctly. Not moonplayers or other emulator (which to playback Meta Quest on Vision Pro with compressed result and lacking hardware acceleration )

[@lucianoalexander]

@@hughhou Thank you for your reply Hugh. I did download your app (SPATIAL FILM) and watched a few videos you shot, on it. But I still have a hard time to find the video after I airdrop it. It goes directly into the Photo up, and doesn't show into my "new downloads" or in "iCloud" tab. Is there a way to copy the video from iPhotos to your spatial app?

[@lucianoalexander]

UPDATE. So I figure it out how to copy it so I can open it in your app SPATIAL FILM. But when it plays its side by side, it doesn't decode it to 180 VR (I did select 180 in options). To shortly explain what I did: Shot the video on R5c 180 dual lens. I imported it in Canon VR Utility and exported to 8k ProRez HQ 4::2:2, then imported in FCPX, applied the LUT, graded it, then export it as it is, in ProRez. Then in Compressor I chosen AVP MV-HEVEC, stereoscopic and in video proprieties under CODEC tab first I left as it is MV-HEVEC but it gave me error when I click export, so I changed to HEVC and it exported it. THATS the file I tried to open in Spatial Film.

[@robinellingsen2805]

I bought this lens and the RF-S fisheye for my R7, if you would make 180° videos as the Apple tv ones, which one would you use? Sorry for this mega noob question

[@hughhou]

The RF-S Fisheye. But R7 only give you 4K. For quality like Apple - you need the Blackmagic URSA Cine Immersive ($30K+). R7 is more for creators. I hope that make sense.

[@robinellingsen2805]

@@hughhou Nice! Thank you! And thanks for the awesome videos

[@rippleguys]

Hi Hugh. Love your vids. I rented the R7 with the Dual Fisheye just to try my hand at creating content for Vision Pro. The native 4K looked "meh" even with fine detail turned on. I upscaled it using Topaz to 8K, and it looked way better. Nothing close to the immersive content Apple creates, but it was passable. From my experience, I would definitely NOT buy this lens if creating content for VP - just not enough resolution. I'm hoping to get my hands on the Blackmagic Cinema stereo camera later this year, because now I have a itch that needs to be scratched. I HAVE to see if I can land the same quality I see in Apple's films.

[@hughhou]

Hi thank you for checking it out. Yes for the new autofocus fisheye. This one pack the pixels in the center so it is a lot better. Give it a try on your Vision Pro by downloading the free video and use my app Spatial Film to watch it (in Apple MV-HEVC). You will see at least the center is close to Apple quality. Again nowhere compared to a $30K camera system - but it is a "budget" solution :)

[@rippleguys]

@@hughhou I watched your Paris film. I really liked it. I wish your pretty host was looking directly at the camera instead of off-axis. Also, what did you shoot that with?

[@rubenlazaro726]

This lens is very interisting for clouse ups when it's requided. It will be an interesting tool. It's posible to use in Canon R5C APS-C mode at least with iris fixed? It will be epic for shoot with an undeewater housing!

[@hughhou]

Unfortunately no. I tried that already and I can not figure out how to really calibrate it correctly - optically there is something going wrong with R5C or R5 II - I will talk to Canon to see what is going wrong. I hope I can figure out next year hehe. More tutorial is coming and I need that solution as well so I am not bring 2 camera to travel.

[@rubenlazaro726]

@@hughhou I hope Canon will fix it. The Canon R5 series would work in APC- Mode. Happy Chritstmass!

[@chrisproudlove1280]

Samsung s23 ultra can it be used for 180 Vr?

[@hughhou]

No I don't think so unfortuntaltey

[@chrisproudlove1280]

@@hughhou bummer!

[@mikemjlove4988]

So it can't capture 180 Apple Immersive, right? Is there any sample video of MV-HEVC Apple Immersive 180 ?

[@hughhou]

Yes it can - but it is just 60 degree FOV in the center and the rest is black. You can download the sample here: www.patreon.com/posts/canon-spatial-vs-118335597 and use our Spatial Film app to watch on your Apple Vision Pro. (PS. our Spatial Film app is one of the few right now can play Apple Immersive 180 local file). So you guess an idea of the FOV reduce. The right format does not mean it is fully immersive just FYI. So you need to watch the sample in your AVP to decide.

[@FFTuk]

Amazingly informative video as always Hugh, but let’s cut to the chase…..how did you get Kimchi to stand so still?! 😂🐕

[@hughhou]

Magic 🪄- He usually stand still when he ready to poop 💩😂

[@FFTuk]

@@hughhou so if he stands still in the kitchen then it’s a problem 🤣👍🏼. Your videos are always well thought out and detailed, I film martial arts mostly in 360 and upload for use in VR headsets. I would love to go with 180 vr of course, but with the canon pocket vr looking like it’s now not coming, any chance we could get a second review of the calf visinse now the firmware update has come? A lot of people felt like they bought a terrible camera based off your review, maybe now an honest review of what it can and can’t do, with comparison footage with canons current vr line up and the insta360 evo? I would love to see that. Have a good Christmas 🎄

[@silvertube52]

The lens would be good for close ups only. Porn VR often gets too close, they should use this lens for close shots.

[@hughhou]

Lol. I can not comment on that one. It is designed for close up for sure.

[@BenjiNotknown]

I have made some spatial samples using pico 4 ultra enterprise, but how do I upload them to quest 3 to view? quest 3 only seems to lock the user into iphone 15 (and up) with meta app to transfer to quest 3. Is there a way to transfer spatial files to quest 3 using usb?

[@hughhou]

Wow, I want to see those sample as well. I don't think pico 4 ultra enterprise is available in US right? I think that is probably the reason. Location blocked? BTW, Pico use a more option codec format of MV-HEVC - so technically is not exactly like Apple - Meta only work with official Apple MV-HEVC. So you need to follow my tutorial to decode them back in 3D SBS and then encode them into official Apple MV-HEVC then you should be able to use Meta Quest to view it.

[@BenjiNotknown]

@@hughhou YEs I see MV-HEVC in the file information after transfering from the pico to my computer, it plays but not as spatial, nor is it spatial effect when i transfer to the quest 3 using usb, it is just 2d video. I will try re-encode, but I do not see a way to transfer the MV-HEVC file to the special quest 3 spatial folder.

[@ARVoiceBattle]

I would like to know too

[@peteostro]

Watched on my AVP, thanks for the download. So is the F4-7 lens 180, or are you just using a mask? Seems odd that the F4-7 video is in a small circle not rectangular like iPhone 16.

[@hughhou]

It is not 180 - it is 60 degree. But it sit correctly in a 180 space without distortion like in iPhone or other traditional 3D camera. So it can be used in 180 video but just force reduce FOV to 60. Like the other new fish lens, it reduce FOV to 140 degree, this literally reduce to 60. So it is in a circle. The iPhone is really just a Spatial Video camera but this lens can be a spatial camera and can be in VR180 format - so more versatile

[@vrgirl4454]

Dude, I am also an AVP developer, my application [NOC NOK], has a very rich 3D content, panoramic video content, can you support it

[@barbertekk]

So… what’s the verdict? Is the original canon vr fisheye still good? Which is the best to use? I feel like the video was not clear in regards to the original fisheye vs the newest “spatial” canon lens

[@hughhou]

This is really show then tell. But the verdict is they are different lens. You need them both to create shots sequence you saw in all Apple Immersive content. The original fisheye is the wide shot (VR180) and this one is the close up 3D shot. If that make sense

[@jlind00]

PLEASE review the new 3D cam from BlackMagic Design asap! $25k but a review from you Hugh could help bring down the cost with sales volume. 🎉❤

[@hughhou]

It is actually $30K :) When it is available I will for sure review it and make ton of tutorials like the Canon series. It is not available anywhere yet and not even Apple has it.

[@mvp_kryptonite]

Ok so looks like this dual lens is a bit of a miss it for the casual user who wants to dip their toe in. I think the earlier 3.9mm is better for my use case

[@hughhou]

Yes. It balance both 3D and VR180 :)

[@TyKix]

Can you use the R5 with the spatial lens in a crop mode? Or will that not work? I only say this as I heard someone managed to do it with a Red in a cropped mode.

[@hughhou]

So far no. It DOES NOT work. Same as RED V-Raptor X or Komodo or R5C. It capture 2 fisheye and you need to calibrate yourself in DaVinci Resolve or Mistika VR. It’s really hard to calibrate even for me so all the benefits of easy to use is gone. Yes, it will capture the image but the quality also no where compare to 4K fine mode as that’s a 7K over sample and R5 just shooting in the center of your Full frame sensor. (Less pixels essentially)

[@Dvm2003]

How does this compare to the kandao obsidian pro?

[@hughhou]

That I have not tried yet

[@Dvm2003]

@@hughhou are many other professionals using this camera? I never really hear much about it on the Internet, but it looks like it could be a solid tool for professionals