Catan Pro Plays Diabolical Strats VS Top USA Players

[@dandydrew]

There were a few key moments of deception used throughout this game and I know it won't be to everyone's liking. As a principle, I encourage collaboration and trust as much as possible. Though collaboration is a two way street - At the start of this game, I was met with a lot of resistance/pushback when speaking with the board. I assumed this was to counter my game in some way, which is fair but then I have to find other avenues to build my position. I would love to know everyone's thoughts on where you draw the line on deception in Catan. I have always said you have to pick your battles and use sparingly. Are there moments where deception is the best tactical move or are you completely against it from a principles standpoint? Appreciate you being here Crew and have a wonderful day!

[@TW19-b5z]

Loved it, no hard feelings by anyone there as far as I can judge and it was clearly mutual deception😂

[@brianvoll]

You straight up lied when you said you would hold and then you made a city. I think the interesting thing is that you are better than a lot of players so even if you lie at times there is still an incentive to play against you and improve that way. Also the 4s at the beginning were lucky.

[@dandydrew]

I am fully aware of the play for the 2nd city and what I said. Given my early position, I felt grabbing an early city was a big boost in potential and grabbing the 2nd city was potentially a winning move. You might not like it but if I think that play significantly improves my chances to win long-term, I will take it. Equally, you could make the case that the board needed to track better and know my hand to realize what I was getting. It wasn’t that difficult to know I had more than 3 wheat in hand and at least 2 ore since the 4 just rolled. Some players get lazy with tracking and I have no problems punishing laziness. My job as a competitor is to make the game as difficult as possible for my competition to win while making my game as smooth as possible. This is what separates the good from the great in competition.

[@alexbabcha]

Drew, I would say just tell them that this game is like poker in some sense, and bluffing and keep attention away from what you really are doing are few of main principles of this game. We play with family board game every Sunday and we all know that we all can say truth or maybe a little deceitful and we know that's part of the game😂 and if someone wins we all laugh how good someone tricked everyone thinking of the real intentions.

[@jadbroz6266]

I don’t think there’s any issue with lying. At the end of the day, if you lie a lot, then people just need to adjust and trust you, specifically, less. Can’t get mad when you trust someone and they stab you in the back, just adjust the long-term strats

[@Metaguy8443]

I usually am not big into deception as a general strategy. But when it's practically 3v1....all is fair in love and war!!!

[@Pivotcreator0]

And what previous actions by Dandy do you think might have made it 3v1 in the first place?

[@TomTheeShield]

@@Pivotcreator0 drew made a deal to start the game to lock the brick out and ice went back on it..... so from the placement they bullied him imo but the city play was tables fault for lazy tracking

[@QYXP]

9:54 watching everyone basically conspire to work against dandy is crazy.

[@MrLitze]

The sheer amount of Drews lies is hilarious

[@dandydrew]

There were 2 notable moments - I had the city trade with Andrew and non-bind on ICE. As a principle, I would recommend to not lie in game BUT there are certain situations where if deception can improve your win chances significantly, then it’s a path worth considering and calculating. You got to pick and choose your battles.

[@elitecpudoc329]

what a game, the lies, the deception, winning play!!

[@callmestark]

danddrewy with the scraps! thats how its done “THE 2!!” GGs

[@ohitsteto]

GG! Very satisfying win 💪🏽💪🏽💪🏽💪🏽

[@thiagoschernikau4769]

What a difficult 4th position to pick, wp Drew.

[@dandydrew]

I really didn’t like my options here. This is a clear case of where you get a setup that has potential and pray variance swings your way early on, which is exactly what happened. I knew an early city solves a lot of my problems in terms of competitive production.

[@thiagoschernikau4769]

@@dandydrew Was about to ask if you went for the best balanced pick or went all in on the variance pick. The variance line provides, at least, a shot to win, which in this case happened. Exemplar game!

[@Xerxsion]

That ending was hilarious 😂

[@tobiasobermayr501]

I thought your setup was really bad and I have no idea how you ever took road. You are a magician!

[@ILoverBabies]

Thoughts on 5 9 3 and 8 12 9? Still in the beginning but the middle is super open.

[@dovhochsztein3845]

When you built the road downward and told them “just getting out of my hand” I was thinking that really your were angling to get the 6-3-12 if they let you. And I thought it was a mistake because they’d take it from you (and I thought putting the road innocuously on the far right of the map in case road network mattered). And then on the last turn I was thinking that you would have actually had the win in hand with just 4 roads without having to pull the VP if you had put the road differently:p

[@haba_15]

The VC dynamic with 4 top players makes for a very different game. Curious about the board, that's a non standard layout (no 11 in the centre) - how did that come about?

[@whjk83921]

I don't understand this board. It doesn't start 5, 2,...

[@emilinochkin9003]

Why not 8-9-12, 4-9-11? You get side-by-side road game with a 3:1 port. And I don't think anyone can really fight road with it. Also coordinated 9s are good here

[@LesiuRamone]

I would personally go for 2/4/6 and 8/12/9 and focus one ore wheat sheep without bricks

[@mangonow6350]

Was there a play at settling at the 6 5? You get better sheep and block whites access to the sheep port. Though maybe it would've made you a worser target, any one got any thoughts bout it. Timestamp is 20:05

[@hehoowa9954]

I'd say the wood is too valuable to not take there. Missing resource and it made the road play live for a long time.

[@LegionaryAssassin2277]

I mean if someone asks info about devs, cards , how close you are to win etc why would you tell the truth they should know it’s not in your incentive to help them

[@dandydrew]

This is the tricky situation because there are a few paths here: 1. I tell them my devs and give up some of my power on the board. 2. I don’t say anything. In most cases, people consider the silence an answer in itself… usually guilty. 3. I evade/deflect answering the question, which again is usually perceived as guilty as well. 4. I mislead or lie to build the position of the board in my favor. The first 3 cases give up my power and position on the board. I understand people don’t like lying about your devs but equally asking someone to tell the table their status and strategy doesn’t make a lot of sense in some situations. You have to take it case by case to understand what move gives you the best long term chance to win the game.

[@jeleger9733]

GG was this played recently?

[@dandydrew]

This was played a few nights ago on stream

[@cognakthkrathk1027]

im a catan pro too, who wouldve thought

[@Cypress77]

RoDawg is rude dawg

[@carterphilippi7124]

642 and then 91011 and run to the wheat port?

[@Housie26]

When is game 2

[@dandydrew]

Hasn’t happened yet. It’s an on-going tournament

[@tobiasobermayr501]

Wow so WPPP!!!

[@alexg8619]

RoDawg chill

[@TomTheeShield]

yeah didn't really like his temperament. kind of just scoffed at anything dandy said

[@-JoMar28-]

Like, comment, watch

[@mattymin10]

man v annoying table

[@Cam101077]

Cmon drew, not a fan of deception, just high quality catan like u always do

[@matthewarant377]

These guys lost the game for themselves lol.

[@Sonadourge]

It seemed so ridiculous when you argued against leaving the middle of the board open to a guy out of fear of them getting longest road when they don't even have brick. I wish someone else would've at least brought it up. It just feels stupid whenever I hear this many lies and I can get doing everything to your advantage but at what point would other people just be like "dandy is full of shit so whenever he says anything never take his word for it and always take the time to critically think about it or even just ignore him", and if they actually fear that a brickless person is gonna take road here from the initial setup then it just makes me really question what it means to be a top player

[@dandydrew]

Or maybe you are missing something. Having the ability to take space and production isn't a trivial thing. It gives a player a lot of opportunity in the long run. Also just because he doesn't produce brick doesn't mean he can't trade, steal, or port for it. There will be an excess amount of brick on this board if you look at Green's wood production. I have played this game enough to know my spots when and where to call out.

[@Sonadourge]

@@dandydrew But that applies to you as well. If it's only 1 person who can get good production in the middle of the map while also connecting I get how that can be very scary for them to be able to go uncontested. In this case there's plenty of wood too which is why it also applies for the trades/steals and what not. It looks like the main difference here is you aren't as interested in contesting the road since your game plan is ows and locking in army over road. I just don't really see it and if I'm missing something crucial then I'd love to know but I know a lot of the time you make up lies and in a case like this game, I find it hard to take your word for it

[@dandydrew]

@@Sonadourge If you are going to dismiss my comment by saying "a lot of the time you make up lies", then it doesn't matter what I say because you clearly are here with your own narrative. There were 2 cases where I applied deception to advance my position. I don't outright lie all the time and I certainly don't come to my comments to mislead my audience. Your depiction is just false. All my comments about Ro's potential were before he placed on the 8912 which I believe was a mistake from him. He should have made a bigger push for the center of the board/ production, which would have been a nice advantage for him. If he was able to take the space in the middle of the board, he had the best long-term claim for road given his ability to connect and pacing. The fact you think this idea is "so ridiculous" and then you claim it feels so stupid to hear this and then you say "dandy is full of shit" tells me you have more of an agenda and motive than coming here with an open mind to learn and understand. Looks pretty petty and bitter on your part.

[@TomTheeShield]

the reason nobody else brought it up is because it was a decent point even if they dont fully agree with it. maybe you should play some more catan games. ive been in countless games where a person who doesnt produce brick ends up with longest road. especially in voice com games where deals can be more readily made. bad vibes and intentions, sad

[@johnnyboy3563]

Think I would have played oreless. 8 9 12, 9 5 3(brick) left.