Charge Blade's Identity | MHWILDS Beta Discussion

[@Mr.Starlight_gaming]

Man i just picked up this weapon, used buzzsaw for rey dau, had an immaculate amount of fun. Seeing this discussion is like the meme of the dude walking into the living room on fire.

[@greadyknight]

If you wanna use the saed, 100%. The savage axe users are eating good.

[@alexcoffey8804]

I love the buff to savage axe. I wanted it to have more utility. But I DID NOT want it to replace SAED. I try to use both playstyles. I use the axe to create wounds and topple the monster so I can SAED while it's on the ground.

[@greadyknight]

100%. Also the issue with css and wilds savage axe is the ignoring of resource managment. The issue of ib savage axe is the 'detriment' to resource management via phial drain, cant we just get normal phials on savage axe?.

[@niklaspeter2568]

I really hope SAED will be better in the final game. Counter SAED playstyle is what made me fall in love with cb. I don't even mind the extended aed combo. Counter saed itself is still there. What annoys me to no end is that saeds damage output has been nerfed. More work for less payoff? That's just stupid. Something that I felt was really good for SAED and savage axe working together was the alternative way to switch from axe to sword with the guard point at the beginning of the animation in risebreak. That way counter saed can be reliably used in axe mode. Also something that could counteract the current nerf of saed would be to have savage axe either double the phial damage of saed or also half it's phial use. Why should it buff every move other than saed. That way it would also promote a hybrid playstyle where you always want to go savage axe but are also not punished for using saed.

[@greadyknight]

'You shouldnt be punished for using saed while using savage axe' is an excellent way to phrase the issue. If they want a hybrid style then promote the use of both moves.

[@deadwhitedragon9751]

I would love it if saed in savage axe mode used half of your phials but output the full phial damage

[@greadyknight]

Yeah like some kind of phial negation/reduction should apply to overcharged phials -> savage axe -> saed. Boost that synergy.

[@Jsobone]

I like both styles tbh so ill end up using both SAED and Pizza cutter.

[@landshark8794]

I really hope that some of the kit that we are used to is locked behind armor skills. Still a nerf but maybe they want us to build into whatever identity we choose.

[@greadyknight]

@@landshark8794 at this point, i would take that skill tax. Cb is already taxed, itd be the same as before.

[@strongii98]

​@@greadyknight it looks like they're wanting us to be able to build around a playstyle within a weapon as opposed to just straight the weapon. Putting the SAED most accessible behind blocking means if you like it you are basically being told to build guard and make that easier if you want to build physical damage. Then if you like axe you may want to build elemental damage to increase the potency of that. There's similar stuff with bow where it looks like you can build around rapid fire for big elemental damage or using focus+runner for physical pierce damage

[@greadyknight]

@strongii98 that goes back to saed and savage axe builds. Saed ignored attack/crits and savage axe ran them. Element was run with element phial cuz the damage applied to everything that mattered damage wise.

[@TheRealTiburon]

Really hate that they changed this, I loved the SAED spam even if it's not meta, but this new moveset is awful. IG too, not sure why they are removing what makes the game fun 😔 instead of just adding new weapons/weapon sets

[@greadyknight]

Yes! Add moves dont subtract. Ig and lance mains habe been similarly ranting about the changes. I hope the bad changes get addressed.

[@helgenlane]

Why do they force us to play "circular saw" when the weapon is called "charge blade"? For me, the appeal was that you build up the charge to unleash it in one powerful attack, while also having a ton of other options for different situations. It was the most versatile weapon that's like a swiss knife. Yet now it feels like switch axe 2.0

[@greadyknight]

Capcom be like: My way or the high way. Good bye saed. Im just like that kills the weapon's complexity. Giving players a choice between two modes gives them the abiltity to use which one they want and adds a literal second layer to set building. Having it follow savage axe makes the set building braindead cuz it follow standard crit meta with maybe load shells and guard/up and the 1 style gameplay makes charge blade one note.

[@JL-tv3lw]

I made a whole build out of Air Dash spam in Sunbreak. Spinning axe plus the bullet plus hyper armor put out massive DPS, almost meta amounts.

[@greadyknight]

Air dash was a fun sba. I used it for the tall standing monsters to buzzsaq their face for the good dps.

[@mitchgowing2336]

I was really hoping air dash was going to be the animation used for the focus strike in wilds. It just does the first hit and the extended version ie when you hit a wound it goes into the second hit.

[@mankinlouisyip4575]

Imagine if they hard buffed the longsword red gauge combo, and locked helmbreaker behind a special sheathe attack. The longsword community would lose their shit.

[@greadyknight]

Longsword keeps eating good for whatever reason while ig, lance and cb get changed in a way that someone is always unhappy. Im like bruh...please...let us play our weapons without changes to fundamentals.

[@Pflanzenturio]

Thank you for the great video, never thought about the concept of draining each others ressources, but it makes totally sense. This limits the duality and all the other problems follow this (like armour skills)

[@greadyknight]

@@Pflanzenturio its something i noticed after trying to make it work in risebreak. Im like this aint it chief. Then i checked if it got fixed in wilds. It kinda did, but kinda didnt.

[@FGMagala]

@@greadyknight I don't think it'll work very well, since that's the entire point of the sword/axe modes. The issue is that SAED and savage axe are competing for the same resource that sword mode generates. Instead, how about SAED having the same output regardless of the number of phials you have? If you do the same damage from a half phial as a full set, on top of the overcharged phials being saved for after the regular phials are used up, it would encourage the player to use savage axe when possible, but to throw out an SAED before using up all the phials or when the monster is about to run away. Of course, the move would have to change so you don't need to use it as a counter or as a combo ender, but that's a very simple thing to change I would think. Capcom seems to be trying to encourage the use of each weapon's entire toolkit, which is butting heads with players that just want to spam one move over and over, but this would seriously encourage using the whole breadth of charge blade's moves, especially if savage axe's animations include more sparks when chainsawing the monster.

[@greadyknight]

Yeah i agree that the entire moveset should be viable, but nerfing the move/moveset is never the answer. Buff the weaker moves to give us an incentive to use them in conjunction with the stronger moves. I never charged sword until firing pins. I never use axe mode until i was forced to in gu and willingly with savage axe. They can buff stuff in a compelling way, just do more of that.

[@mankinlouisyip4575]

One very rough idea would be to extend the charge and overheat mechanic to axe hits. That way, savage axe will be building up towards phials for shield buff and be encouraged to spend and manage phials, and also the overheat discourages from the chop for 2 minutes play style, which doesn't really care about resource management right now.

[@greadyknight]

@mankinlouisyip4575 phials in general might need a rework. I was on the boat for firing pins making a return cuz it just incentivizes you to riddle the monster with pins, and axe mode to detonate them. Toss in a buff to extend all of your buff durations and boom sns and axe mode use is now balanced.

[@Thatoneguy77559]

To fix the issue of having to do an AED doing the SAED: just change the combo string so for the SAED do:🔺, ⭕️+🔺, ⭕️+🔺, like normal and do:🔺, ⭕️+🔺, ⭕️+🔺,⭕️, to cancel into the AED. As for marrying the to play styles have savage axe function more like condensed spinning slash in which you gain files while in savage axe mode and then discharge the files with the SAED.

[@greadyknight]

The old way allowed us to cancel saed into aed. Revert to the old way and it should be fine. I have other issues with phial regen, but it could work better for wilds since it builds up to the saed instead of the negation preventing you from burning stocked up resources.

[@Thatoneguy77559]

@ Yeah condensed spinning slash wasn’t the best way to change your philes, but if it was players would have another reason not to use sword and shield mode.

[@greadyknight]

@Thatoneguy77559 firing pins is the biggest sns incentive. It should return or be made staple moving forward and i will die on this hill.

[@Thatoneguy77559]

@@greadyknight not mention a lot of the weapon’s mobility, guard points, condensed elemental slash, and general move are all tied to sns mode.

[@sen-bh4uk]

When the second demo comes out we should all fil up the survey again to let them know how we feel. In world or iceborne (cant remember which one) there was a day 1 patch that changed a lot of things, from motion values to straight up some weapon mechanics

[@greadyknight]

I used all 2k characters for that survey to address my grievances for charge blade.

[@Zaney_]

What I really don't like about Wilds savage axe is that's closer to rise's version than iceborne. Needing to hold down the button for extra hits and the extra hitlag just feel more clunky to me. I would've also just preferred if they made doing counter AED to spend phials and do damage outside of downs instead of Just doing the savage axe combos on any opening because nothing else compares to the damage of it.

[@greadyknight]

Personally i like the css style ticks cuz its consistent. It felt really bad when i played world for the first time and saw 1 tick. Im like wait what? But yeah the s/aed being worse than savage axe was kinda the nail in the coffin for me. Assuming minimal changes, i just hope element phial hard carries saed.

[@mitchgowing2336]

I don’t like the sticky style either. Feels way less cool. The way it worked in IB felt like just a swarm of damage. Now it’s just extra, consecutive hits.

[@greadyknight]

@mitchgowing2336 that is fair.

[@mitchgowing2336]

The biggest problem with the savage axe from the beta is that ED 2 is way too powerful and/or AED and follow up are too weak. ED 1, ED 2 combo out damages AED, follow up combo which is nuts. It means it’s better to roll then ED1 instead of block then AED. No point in even blocking anymore at this rate. Power clash is kinda meh also it just takes too long and kinda breaks the flow. I think there will be many skills that incentivize power clash/offset such as the doshu skill. CB should have had an offset. I won’t make any judgements until release because even comparing the gamescom demo to the beta the phial damage of AED and follow up from gamescom did 30x2 and 30x3 respectively while in the beta they were brought down to 17 (all with over charge). This alone turns the tides in favor of an AED counter centric playstyle. The follow up was only doing around 65 damage MV + 10x4 ticks so the phial damage is essentially doubling that in the gamescom version which is an insane amount of phial damage from an exhaust(?) phial Tokuda only knows what elemental going to be looking like.

[@oilyb5135]

What I would like is if you had red phials with the load shells deco you would get 5 normal phials and 5 overcharged in 1 go, oh and SAED from sword mode. That or buff the extra damage from overcharged phials

[@greadyknight]

That would change a lot. Pls load shells, youre our only hope

[@ThePepeu98]

I really like iceborne charge blade. You could use saed or savage axe depending on matchup or playstyle. Rises saed was super fun, and the savage axe had its uniqueness, but i didnt enjoy it a lot, since the savage axe on rise made you stay on axe mode until needing to recharge shield. It made me feel that i was using only half of the weapon, were the sword shield mode was just a step to activation of savage axe. On world, i think it was the perfect middle ground, where you used axe to punish and deal dps on large openings, while sword and shield was helping you setting up those situations. I really hope i dont have to stay ate axe mode all the time, cause at this point, i would just rather play switch axe

[@greadyknight]

@@ThePepeu98 ib savage was better at using both modes, but where it faltered was the math. Most of the time savage was just better. On the flip, rsb was better for the math, but the issue was that you could only bring the playstyle you brought into the hunt. A return to world style cb was necessary but the nerf to saed wasnt.

[@yagami999913]

Devs need to understand that it's ok for weapons to be a little overtuned in a PvE game like MonHun. Look at 4U CB ! Nerfing stuff too much just ends up making the game dull without much of an upside.

[@zawardo5909]

I wish lance had more drill attacks. Lance identity is vanishing pretty quickly with how many weapons are good at countering now

[@greadyknight]

I like lance in gu and rsb. Imo it should double down on that identity where it never stops attacking and bulldozes through every attacks. The charm with lance (for me at least) is that it is fluid and continuous. Many weapons can counter, not every weapon can bulldoze through monster aggression.

[@Madman6884]

I get that they want SAED to not be spammed as hard. And I think there's a middle ground that's better than making it conditional as a counter/AED followup OR just going back to exactly how it was. Just make it so that you still need the charged shield, AND at least one overcharged phial to get the SAED to come out without any of the additional conditions. Might not be a full solution, but that's just my thoughts on a middle ground to keep SEAD playstyle viable without just fully reverting.

[@greadyknight]

Yeah they need to improve saed synergy with savage axe otherwise imma use one move over the other. Tweaks to overcharged phials might be the fix.

[@lewisqb12]

The best part of these discussions is that it wasn’t till world that SAED was even a viable strategy…. Before AED was a better use of phials so personally I love the changes. It goes back to a more original version of the chargeblade while also giving it newer updates and upgrades. Also we have no idea about the skills and gems in the game so until we get that people need to chill😊

[@greadyknight]

Skills and gems only fix so much. Unless something like loadshells ends up being cracked, im basing my critiques off of what is seen. I want to be proven wrong about my hot takes on charge blade. But i 100% disagree with mechanical nerfs cuz its a repeat of what happened in gu. Never again will i tolerate a gu 2.0 or 1.5 (depending on how hard or soft the nerf is).

[@lewisqb12]

@ fair enough, it’s really a matter of opinion at the end of the day. In all honesty I’m more worried about them not nerfing elemental CB. I’m fine with the current setup personally but if they nerf the elemental charge blade imma be sad.

[@greadyknight]

@lewisqb12 element phial is da wae. I will click at capcom if they nerf it. Its the one thimg they got right in fifth fleet: element phial beating impact.

[@kazetsune]

Will pass up on CB this time. I wanted the SnS SAES playstyle, and they killed it.

[@greadyknight]

Ill still play it. Played gu, after 4u. So any nerf lighter than that isnt the end of the world. But man it does suck.

[@Roei18]

​@@greadyknight My main problem is that they even made guard points useless with the introduction of perfect guard

[@greadyknight]

@Roei18 dont get me started on that. Im waiting a bit before ranting about that, but based on the beta the perfect guard is just objectively better to use for power moves and safety.

[@berkcakman8967]

I mean everything they added favors savage axe immensely and hurts SAED severely its sad cause sunbreak has both of them viable they could’ve improved based on that and I hope they gave some more love to SAED again

[@greadyknight]

Savage axe is the favorite child, capcom cant convince me otherwise.

[@LucasTigy2]

but why do people think that you can't just use both? you can SAED with savage axe. i don't know if i like the changes either, especially when other weapons have gotten all that it has in wilds why not use the whole kit instead of just spamming a single move? i guess i feel like i can charge my phials well enough that i don't really need to worry about using them and using the SAED as a finisher seems much more in line with how the move should be used instead of how i see many players using it to drop a big hit on a monster before fainting

[@greadyknight]

the main saving grace is element phial. If the values are just bonkers, then you would have every incentive to buzzsaw amd then saed during the free openins when the monster is down, but based on the impact phial values, 100% savage axe use was just better, leaving very little incentive to saed.

[@raidennc]

Because not only is their a huge buff to the phial economy in Axe mode, but you also can't even access SAED directly outside of guardpoints. Both of those changes have effectively nerfed SAED into the ground, both by subjective comparison AND objective accessibility.

[@LucasTigy2]

@@raidennc you can use SAED just fine as part of a combo too, you don't need a guardpoints

[@greadyknight]

The main issue is If you can get a long enough opening. You need enough time for an aed and saed without getting decked in the face or the mon not move out of range. Waiting for topples is the main way, but that has its own set of problems. It always just safer and more resource efficient to spam buzzsaw chops than using the saed.

[@raidennc]

@@LucasTigy2 I said you can't get to it "directly". Obviously you can still get to it, but the route to get there is longer now. You have to go into an AED first before SAED. That means you have less time and can only access it during significantly smaller openings. This is a significant change.

[@goddy3274]

tbh i like the change.

[@greadyknight]

I like the changes for savage axe. Makes it a lot cleaner to play.

[@Bray-502]

The Beta made me fall in love with savage axe, whereas prior I didn’t use the charge blade at all. Still, my satisfaction with the weapon changes doesn’t blind me to how it might upset other players, especially those who’ve used the weapon longer than I.

[@neurosis51]

If only more people had that mindset, there wouldn't be nearly as much friction in comments sections between vets with valid criticism and newer narcissistic consumers praising everything capcom does. Most people who like a change I'd consider negative would just be like "well I didn't like the weapon before the changes, but now i do, who cares about disillusioned previous weapon mains, I enjoy it now and you should stop complaining about it."

[@greadyknight]

I havent even looked at lance, ig, or swaxe issues but from ive heard, they are having the same kind of discourse charge blades users are having.

[@neurosis51]

@@greadyknight Oh yeah, I play 12 of the weapons (HH and SnS excluded) and I consider SA, IG, and CB to be in my top mains. IG has the wors ediscourse around it, especially with big MH youtubers (like Rurikhan) who also do the whole toxic positivity shtick and don't actually play IG to any proficient degree yet "love it so much".

[@greadyknight]

Yeah i dont really listen to rurikhan unless its gunlance. He dabbles in charge blade but he lowkey plays charge blade like its gunlance. (Not a bad thing, but its just different to how i play it). There is a pot of room for improvement in the betas/demo/ main game so my main hope is that they make the necessary changes for the complaints on every weapon.

[@jamberrycloud]

What are the chances skills on weapons can actually affect the moveset lol, or at least heavily favour spinning axe or SAED. This way it would justify having charge blades as both primary and secondary weapons - one set up for SAED, one set up for savage axe. 😂

[@greadyknight]

Based on previous games, 0 percent. Based on the fact that wilds is mixing up skills and armor sets in general, more than 0 percent. Im kinda just reviewing what we see in game though.

[@zerozone5848]

Mfs who played CB in rise: GLORY TO THE CPP!

[@greadyknight]

Huzzah

[@theycalllmebacon]

Subbed. I feel like they're moving more towards unifying SAED and power axe, which I really like. Here's my unrealistic wishlist for CB in wilds: - Power axe is activated by having sword and shield charged simultaneously. Duration of sword charge increased to better fit. After all, sword + shield = axe, right? Right now sword charge feels like a goofy afterthought, this brings it into standard rotation while also fixing the annoying ways you currently have to get power axe mode. Also why not bring back firing pins while we're at it? - Sword charge now consumes phials similar to shield. Elemental roundslash now charges sword rather than shield. Condensed element slash when performed with 5 overcharged phials will fully charge shield and sword at once. Now with the new shield charge ability introduced in Wilds, this leaves us with one way to charge sword, one way to charge shield, and one way to charge both at once. Sword charge requiring phials is also important for other reasons I'll get into. - In order to end the conflict of phial consumption between SAED and power axe, power axe no longer consumes any phials (including AED) except for SAED. Power axe will also retain the elemental discharge effects of ED1, ED2 and AED regardless of current phial count. This is why sword charge being a prerequisite for power axe and requiring phials is important, this is where the time collecting resources for power axe now goes. I realize the further decoupling of 1 phial = 1 discharge could potentially harm the resource management aspect, but considering you'll still want to have phials ready to go for an SAED opportunity, the playstyle will still largely be kept intact. - Baseline morph slash out of axe mode is the Rise version with the guard point at the beginning. This further harmonizes SAED and power axe by providing an accessible guard point into SAED while in axe mode. - Reintroduce an overhauled energy blade! This ability requires and consumes both sword and shield charge as well as 5 phials. The damage output of this move compared to SAED would be such that energy blade would only be optimal when your sword and shield charges are about to expire anyway, so this doesn't make SAED obsolete. This would be a very satisfying move to pull off to just unload all your stored energy in one big attack. Curious to know what you think. Great Video!

[@greadyknight]

Point 1 - great idea. It lets you use it on command without having to ise the activation moves. CES+ shield charge is the activation Point 2 - i like concelt but its just easier to have ces activate and be a passive. Im a huge fan of firing pins and want it to return. Point 3 - imo the phial regen if reworked properly can promote aavage axe into saed. Could be like 'if you complete the savage axe combo, you regen 5 overcharged phials worth of ticks and then you saed'. infinite phials cant be a thing cuz you never leave axe mode, but regen enough to promote buzzsaw into phial spam. If it only applies to overcharge phials, then you still do the loop in sns, but now you finished the overcharged phial loop in savage axe. Roundslash -> counter morph slash is good, but i doubt it will happen. Energy blade is cool, but im a massive fan of ready stance. It made savage axe really guard centric. The biggest issue with savage axe as a playstyle is that you usually ignore the shield and just roll around. But with ready stance you gain a gp in axe mode.

[@---yn9go]

Personally I think this is a good direction for the cb. I never liked the idea of spamming saed because it's suppose to be your Big Strong Move, your "dumping everything you have accumulated in one attack" so spamming it seems cheap and speedrunny.. A good change you suggested was to up the damage because right now it's still a bit too weak compared to playing really well with the savage axe. Nonetheless I really like that's it's a more difficult and convoluted to access it. Pulling this shit in combat is now as satisfying as it was when I first picked the cb. As for savage axe I guess this is subjective but I don't understand the hate, I am a big fan of those "transforming" trick weapon like the swaxe it's such a cool concept being able to choose a different mode for a different situation and imo we're pretty close to a 50/50 now for casual play. There some not-so-accessible conditions to get to the savage axe, and you still need the s&s mode to replenish your ressources; plus it's safer to use so there's also a risk/reward situation that is really appealing. You talk about "having to choose one or the other" for optimal play but you must take the distribution of skill in consideration. New players will use mostly the safer s&s mode; veteran and super players will use the savage axe; and finally the absolute MAJORITY of player (like 90% really) will dabble with both in a really non-optimal but informed kind of way.. If the game is so easy that you can stay in the "optimal" savage axe mode all the way on ALL monsters of this game then I have bad news for you : you solved MH you can retire now haha I agree that the weapon is not perfect (again I would like more damages on the saed and I don't like that you can target it that well with focus mode) but damn this is such a fun and versatile iteration of the weapon for real this is THE ressource management weapon so much shit to think about, so much decision making.. The overcharged is a great new addition for that too. As for weapon identity I'm really glad that capcom moves things around take some risks (and it's still too mild honestly), this is a new game I want new shit! I want my tools to be different I want to be surprise! please don't make this licence become like call of duty or fifa... I don't remember who said it but "Do you like the licence or do you like the game?" I think that's a great question to ask yourself. To conclude I would like to say that we should calm down on the stats and speedrunning times.. super players will always find ways to abuse the game it's how they find there fun, balancing a game around them should almost never be done. Yes we can do some tweaking if we see some absurd disparity like 5 minutes difference between a savage axe player and a saed player but right now it's pretty it can be adjusted but it's not "killing the weapon" come on. At the end of the day we're here to have fun and do some cool shit right? idk that may be just me Sorry for the long post haha have a good day!

[@greadyknight]

I dont disagree that the hybrid playstyle should exist but synergy between the moveset must exist. Its so close but misses the mark ever so slightly. Saed and savage axe conflict. You get punished for using the saed with savage axe by losing your resources, the (overcharged) phials. If we want a hybrid playstyle then make the saed not do that. Have them complement each other where you want to use buzzsaw into saed as the benchmark for good cb play.

[@zakwancu3]

sunbreak saed is over tuned for element, while impact is what i believe the damage output supposed to be. to be fair i not a fan of saed spam playstyle, it become a gamble if the monster flinches or not to punish you what i found lacking in CB is in the axe moveset, it doesnt have good flowing combo especially the triangle combo, circle combo if far to limiting and also far to risky to maintain. i feel that counter morph axe to sns should be the norm for axe mode it need somekind of safety net. also shield boost should just be axe boost, and just make shield boosted mode as base sns mode. if they want axe mode to be the main attraction they should at least make the journey of using it less tedious and more rewarding. they just need to make axe an appealing mode to use instead of bonking or head with annoying bs. they could made axe mode hit 3 times like rise lance leaping thrust but no, they need to feature bloat on already convoluted system pizza cutter is cool and all, the execution is just unimaginative lots of jank. sunbreak tried to make something of it but, the limited axe moveset makes it unexciting and too tedious to setup from sns form, and too unorthodox to regular Cb user. i rather get good axe mode than pizza cutter, pizza cutter is a band aid for how lacking axe mode is

[@greadyknight]

Rsb buzzsaw was the goo. Smoving, ready stancing and chopping was immaculate and now we are reverted to world/wilds moveset, it feels like the moveset got clipped. (But it was op for sure).

[@zakwancu3]

@@greadyknight sunbreak team knows how to make you feel cool. and chew you face off, while not making it rage inducing most of the time. also if load shell function like gunlance/world just add more phial, that could balance out which playstyle you want. savage axe is just duration based buff that replace sword amp and vise versa. make load shell 2slot skill deco have 3 level would be very interesting

[@vhex61]

It’s called “charged AXE” in Japanese. So there you go for identity. Axe mode.

[@greadyknight]

@@vhex61 'Charge' is just as important as 'axe'. Css and wilds savage axe kinda ignore that charge part once you set up. A cool 2 minutes of not charging and just axing. Saed spends most of its time charging and not axing. Its equally as important as savage axe for that reason. Two parts make a whole. Thats the point of charge blade.

[@vhex61]

@@greadyknight look at switch axe and charge blade as mirror weapons. CB is “charged AXE “ and SA is “charged slasher”. SA deals its damage the most during sword mode (slasher) and CB will be the “axe” mode. They both charge and release during their respective damage mode. SAED is really a nuke released from sword mode in world and you don’t really see much axe action until savage axe in iceborne. If anything, it’s return to form rather than removing.

[@Nodnarb59]

​@@vhex61 you just didn't like SAED and trying to brush over a playstyle many enjoy by saying "actually 🤓"

[@greadyknight]

@vhex61 but the key difference from swaxe and charge blade is that charge blade has 2 ways to charge up and discharge: saed spam and savage axe. Both modes pumped in sns, and dumped in axe, it just differed how much time you spent in each mode. That was compelling. What other weapon has two completely different builds and playstyles before switch skills existed? Also, I dont agree with it being a return to form. Wilds is just if css had no major drawbacks. (Via removing the morphing penalty) at the cost of consistent saed spam. Im of the belief that saed and savage axe should both exist and be equally good.

[@greadyknight]

@Nodnarb59 'um axetually' (had to do the pun)

[@sternritternovad]

There's really no identity Crisis for Charge Blade either Savage Axe, Aed into Saed spam or do both, currently Savage axe has no dedicated activation combo but is locked to 3 activation options, Aed and Saed can be engaged the old fashioned way.The disaster of Rise Chargeblade already showed Capcom that gimping both forms and bolstering them with skills and buffs is pointless, because SAED spamming has less maintenance. Iceborne was more the sweet spot where both were useful but people maintained their preferences, Wilds is just taking the next logical step of making all possible, meta and optimal are completely unimportant to general gameplay.

[@greadyknight]

With cpp, that is true for charge blade. Without, its far from it. You spent most of your time charging and promptly dumping. You spend far more phials than savage. My two cents is that there is nothing lost if saed was kept the same. Cuz worldborne saed spam was underpowered. And wilds copy pasta'd its moveset.

[@sternritternovad]

@greadyknight World SAED stun phials was thee meta streamers in droves were using it to stun monsters into last weak, which got the weapon nerfed. When Iceborne came out SAED stun phials were still thee meta it wasn't till Alatreon came out that people really understood how powerful Savage Axe power element Phials were. This was the closest SAED and Savage Axe have been to being balanced. So the only logical step was to use World/ Iceborne as the template for Wilds Chargeblade.

[@sen-bh4uk]

@@sternritternovad That is straight up not true, savage axe dominated over SAED since day 1 in iceborne (you can check any speedrun)

[@greadyknight]

In base world, yes, in iceborne no.

[@sternritternovad]

@@sen-bh4uk Checked, a ton of Savage Axe gameplay but there's still SAED gameplay as recent as a year ago.

[@yagami999913]

Devs need to understand that it's ok for weapons to be a little overtuned in a PvE game like MonHun. Look at 4U CB ! Nerfing stuff too much just ends up making the game dull without much of an upside.